Live on Sky News. This is Sharry.
Good Evening. Well in breaking news. Just moments ago, black smoke came out of the Sistine Chapel. You can see live vision on your screen now. Now black smoke means the cardinals in conclave have not elected a pope. This is the third vote in two days where a pope has not been elected. We'll take you live to the Vatican with our reporter Stouts Butler for the breaking news and what this means. Shortly. Also coming up in the show, Jacinta Nampa jimper Price has defected to the Liberal Party.
I'll tell you why she should be Australia's next Liberal Prime Minister. Plus we'll get reaction to her move from National Senator Matt Canavan in a moment, and former Labor senator and hero Nova Paris would join me live to celebrate the end of Adam Band's political career. Today he finally conceded and now he exits stage. Left Nova Paris up soon. Plus how disunity is already consuming the Albanezy government just five days after their landslide win. Mark Drafers
and Ed Husick are set to be dumped. I'll bring you Paul Keating's comments about this shortly, but first tonight to the good news. Well, we've been speaking on the show this week about how just Center Namba Jimpa Price needs to move to the Liberal Party and into a Lower House seat to position herself for a future run at the leadership, and today Jacinta announced her intention to join the Liberal Party.
It is a decision that I've thought a lot about, and firstly, I guess I've always felt like the Liberal Party room is my natural home. Given you know, the Liberal Party is the Freedom Party, the party of responsibility. Now, given the current circum stances, I think now more than ever, when it's strong people within the Liberal Party, we need to be able to rebuild.
Now, I can tell you that it's most likely Center Price will be the deputy leader with Angus Taylor as the leader. But I can also tell you that she hasn't ruled anything out when it comes to the leadership. She hasn't ruled out running as leader. Now, the Liberal Party convention is that you can't lead the party from the Senate or from the Northern Territory for that matter, but it's not a hard and fast rule. An opposition leader could sit in the Senate, but a prime minister
must sit in the lower House. So if Jacenter was opposition leader from the Senate, she then need to run for a seat at the next election or in a by election if one came up. But even Jacenter's biggest backers in the Liberal Party, and I've spoken to some of them today, well their view is that she isn't quite ready yet to be leader and that she should run for the deputy leader position now and build her experience.
The leadership candidates as we speak are still Angus Taylor and Susan Lee, and it's understood Jacinta would be on a ticket with Angus and she's quite happy to be his deputy now. One argument that's running against Angus Taylor as leader is that he opposed Labour's tax cuts. As you know, that was a suicidal decision for the coalition.
Well I've been told that it was actually a decision taken by Peter Dutton and Susan Lay in the afternoon of budget lockup, and Angus Taylor, I'm told, actually argued against it in that internal meeting but ultimately had to accept their decision and then publicly argue the case. But back to Jacinta. So she will at this point most likely be Angus Taylor's deputy. But if she performs well, and I'm sure she will, there's the option to move her to a Lower House seat and from that position
she could run for the leadership of the Liberal Party. Now, in my view, Giacenta would be a visionary choice as Liberal leader. She would truly be modernizing the party and who wouldn't get behind her? And it would beat the Labor Party at their own game. Labor would have a white old man in Anthony Albanezi running against a young female an indigenous Leadercina brings excitement and energy to the Liberal Party. If elected by Australians, Jacenta would be Australia's
first Indigenous Prime minister. It would neutralize a lot of the concerns about the coalition. Labour couldn't run their typical scare campaign claiming the Liberal Party has a problem with women or that it's out of touch. Now everyone Acceptsenta Nabajimpa Price is a once in a generation political talent. It's a point Alexander Downer, a former Foreign minister, made on Chris Kenny earlier this evening.
She's fearless. She absolutely goes out and makes her arguments unapologetically and with great determination. I think she's one of the most important center right politicians in Australia of her generation. And the fact that she could end up by being the dignity leader of the Liberal Party, which on the basis of the media is a possibility, is a very very good sign for the Liberal Party.
And I'll tell you what, there would be a lot of media commentators endorsing Jacinta as leader. Ray Hadley already did it on this show earlier this week. I think the perfect combination would be Jacinta as leader and James Patterson as a deputy. He has in depth experience in national security and defense portfolios. He's got extremely strong policy substance,
he has young children. He's in the Senate, so he doesn't have an interest in running for the leadership or moving to a House of Representative seat, and just Center and James are good friends. You can see a picture the Senator James Patterson posted today on his social media page. And Patterson was among those who helped convince you Center to move to the Liberal Party, along with Tony Abbott
and Claire Chandler. Now. In her interview with Peter Kredline earlier this evening, just Enterprise said that she's not limiting herself when it comes to leadership ambitions.
I will not put any limitations on myself and ultimately, again I guess I've always been led by the Australian people and will continue to do so.
And Justina's personal story of overcoming adversity is simply incredible. She told it in her book last year, Courage, to detail her struggles and her life of hardship. She embodies aspiration. She's the quintessential Australian, proud of our country and proud of what we can achieve collectively. And she's already proven to the country that she's a terrific campaigner and a tough politician. Her stance during the Voice was one of
the reasons voters went against Albanese's proposition. So it's terrific that she's moving to the Liberal Party. But my message to Jacinta tonight is don't run as deputy, run as leader. The Liberal Party has been crushed, decimated and it doesn't need more of the same. It needs total renewal with fresh ideas and a fresh face and there's no better
person to do that than Jacinta Nampajim for price. Now to more good news today, Adam Bant finally conceded he had lost his seat of Melbourne, although it was a rather odd concession speech that accepted no responsibility for his extremist politics that led to his defeat. Instead, he blamed the Liberals and One Nation for daring to preference the
Labor Party. I mean, it's incredible that bound has suffered around a nine percent swing against him on a two party preferred basis, and he still refuses to acknowledge that the reason he lost was because of his own divisive brand of politics. He represented hatred, racism, division and anger, everything that Australians reject. At a time when Jewish Australians were being vilified, he jumped on board and made false accusations of a genocide in Gaza and encouraged the Pylon
against Israel. And he continued with some of those offensive messages today and.
Also particularly thank everyone who had the courage to speak up against the invasion of Gaza and spoke out for peace in Palestine. And I think as we see events continue to unfold and continue to unfold, in the most tragic way. This is a massive moment of humanity and we have been really proud, and I've been really proud to continue to push for a just and lasting peace for the people of Palestine and Israel, which is going to be based on an end to the invasion and an end to the occupation.
And that right there was the problem under Bounced leadership. The Greens weren't an environmental party that cared about trees, koalas or forests. He was fighting for Gaza controlled by the terror group a muss. It wasn't fighting for Australians and certainly not for Jewish Australians. And Peter Darton was under no illusions about why Adam Bant lost writing on social media. No spin by Adam Bant can change the reality that he and other Green members lost their seats
because of their appalling treatment of the Jewish community. Australians were rightly disgusted at their behavior. We were proud to preference the Greens last, helping to ensure Adam Bant's loss, and that's one victory. Dunnan can certainly be proud of preferencing the Greens last, and I hope this is a tradition the Liberals continue to ensure an anti Semitic party
has no place in Australia's House of Representatives. Albinizi as well, is happy to see the backer Green's leader Adam Bant, although the Greens are upset that Albaneze has gloated over their demise, with Max Chandler Mather complaining that Albanezi was too unkind. He wrote on x I feel like the PM launching into another attack on someone who isn't even in Parliament rather than celebrating a historic win. Proves my point, which is this is how the political class treats people
who fight for renters and real change. And he said compare this to his kind words for Dutton. But the point is when you're part of an extremist and racist party, you can't expect anyone to mourn you or be upset when you're gone. And Ben Fordham today described him as a sore loser.
Anthony Alberanezi is right.
Max Chandler May though, was tough as nails one minute and running off to mum the next.
And there are also some Greens influencers who are so out of touch with reality that they're claiming the Greens actually did well.
For all the freaky little widos on the internet saying that people are leaving the Greens in high numbers, that just simply isn't true. As we can see here, the Greens have secured the highest ever vote in history.
Okay, I'm not.
Even mad about Adam losing his seat, and I'm pretty sure Adam's not even mad about it either. I think out of this whole situation, it was really good to keep Thatt now and what we actually did see is an increase in primary votes for the Greens.
I'm seeing so many insane headlines like Greens crash out and like dismal results for Greens and step back, look at the big picture. Oh my god, even just with the Senate, like we have come so far this vote.
No, like you have not come so far. Instead of listening to those influencers who have lost touch with reality, the message for the Greens should be that they need to drop their extremist and anti Semitic positions and this should be a lesson for all in the Parliament. Now, it hasn't even been a week since Labour's shock landslide when and already they're fighting over the spoils of office. It seems unity was just skin deep. There's a push now to dump Attorney General Mark Dreyfus from cabinet ed
Husick two. A Labour source told the Australians Greg Brown today that Drefus is fighting back against the attempts to remove him. Now right wing faction bosses and this includes the Deputy Prime Minister Richard Miles, a keen to replace Drefus with another Victorian Right MP and if Drafus is truly furious about this, if he is dumped, he could even quit parliament and cause the by election in his
Victorian seat of Isaacs now Albanize. He also wants to add another politician from his Socialist Left action to his government, which as you know, is itself a radical left proposition. And then the New South Wales right of the Labor Party is under pressure to dump one cabinet spot. So this would mean that a high profile figure would lose their job and those who could be demoted include Chris Bowen,
ed Husick, Tony Burke or Jason Claire. And the reports are tonight that ed Husick is most likely to be dumped, and Husick has been critical of Albanezi personally, and he certainly isn't seen as a loyal figure towards the Prime minister. But this is quite the surprise because many Labour figures assumed that ed Husick would be promoted in this second term along with paramatt A and P Andrew Charlton. And you've got to say he's the most overqualified backbencher in
Australian political history. Victorian Right and P Sam Ray and Daniel Malino might be elevated to cabinet along with Tim Ayres or Jess Walsh from the Left faction. Now what you need to understand is there will be noses out of joint and so you can expect disgruntled politicians to cause some trouble for the Prime minister. This at least will keep him on his toes. For all of us, it'll be fun to watch. But Albinizi is trying to
keep a lid on all this in fighting. He claims his party room is operating with humility and solidarity, and that's quite funny because there's an intense level of squabbling over cabinet positions that is simply astounding. Just five days after one of the great election victories for the Labor Party. Alberiziosa today said he was set to speak with King Charles. He's planning a trip as well to Washington next month
to meet with Donald Trump. The US President was waiting for the outcome of this election before investing any more time in Albanizi or even bothering to set up a phone call with him, and despite claiming he'd never heard of Peter Dutton. Albanese's winners certainly not the outcome Trump would have been hoping for, but the chaos of the trade tariffs is partly to blame for the size of the coalition's defeat, given Labour successfully linked Dutton to Trump
in the campaign. Now, Albanesi will also go to the g seventh summit in Canada and Indonesia next week to meet with Proboo Subianto. Albanizi did this in his first term as well. You'll recall he spent much of that first year overseas, disconnected from Australia, and it's when his popularity was the highest when he was out of sight.
And in reality, you've got to say, if Australia can be an albow free zone as much as possible, I'm all for it, all right, Let's cross live to the Vatican now, where black smoke came out of the Sistine Chapel just moments before, indicating the cardinals failed to secure a new pope. But this is only the conclave's third round of voting, and it is normal to have not elected a pope at this stage. In fact, it once took nearly three years. Let's go live to Sky News
reporter Stas Butlers. Stas, thanks so much for joining us. So this is disappointing. We all had our eyes glued on that chimney to see if white smoke would come out. What's been the reaction from the crowd waiting.
Well, there was a huge cry that went up for the tens of thousands of people who've gathered here in Saint Peter's Square, all eyes glued on a tiny chimney. This's just out of view over my right shoulder here to the right of the Basilica as you look at it, the roof of the Sistine Chapel where that black smoke
emerged about half an hour ago. We weren't you know, as you said, it would be quite an early vote for them to for the cardinals one hundred and thirty three of them gathered in the Sistine Chapel to reach a two thirds majority needed to elect a pope at this stage. But that said, the last two conclaves finished on the second day, so it's not out of the realm of possibility that we could have a pope here
by this evening. And I think that when this evening comes around and we have the next two voting this afternoon, there's going to be even more people gathered here as people get off work.
Stats are we're hearing any more? Have there been any leaks perhaps about who the leading contenders are?
Well, I mean, the nature of conclave is certainly the designed to prevent against any of those kinds of leagues. They've combed the Sistine Chapel, they've checked it for bugs. There's mechanism in place to stop electromagnetic signals, to stop any kind of radio signals. They really really the intent is to cut off cardinals completely from the outside world, not only them, but also the people, the necessary staff we were looking after them, cooks, cleaners and so on.
They've also been sworn to secrecy, So no sign in the past few days about who those front runners might be. There's a lot of speculation before the conclave began. The two front runners frequently named by everyone, the Vatican Scutory of State at Pietro paroline who's seen as a kind of steady hand an Italian diplomat. The other a man known as the Asian Francis, the Filipino Louis Antonio Tagli,
former Archbishop of Manila. But there's a saying here in Rome, he who enters conclave as a pope, meaning as a front runner, leaves a cardinal. And there've been certainly a lot of surprises in the past, so don't be a surprised at all of the person who walks out on that central balcony behind me on Speter Basilica is someone who we weren't expecting at all.
Indeed, all right, Stash really appreciate that update from us live in the Vatican City. All right, let's bringing now Liberal leader in Wa Basil zemplus the National Senator Matt Canavan our regular Thursday panel. Great to see you both. Matt, I want to get your reaction first, you as delighted as I am. Just Enterprise has defected to the Liberal Party and might now be in a leadership position.
Well, I think you might need to cool your jets on that, Shari. And look, it's very sad because I think Justin's done enormous damage to her reputation. I've had enormous being inundated with feedback from people from the Northern Territory, very upset. She hasn't spoken to members up there who elected her, hasn't spoken to the party, hasn't spoken to her colleagues in Canberra about this.
And keep in mind, everybody, when you get into parliament, Shari, you don't do it on your own. Just said.
It's very talented, but you do it with a team of people that support you but take you through the hard times. And she hasn't even had the decency to speak to those people in the Northern Territory. It was only a week ago she was elected as a member as a senator.
She's actually not yet elected.
I haven't finished counting, but she's going to be elected as a senator sitting in the National's Party and that's what she stood at the election for. And I don't know, Shari, how you can go to the people one week and say I'm going to represent this party in the Nation's Deparliament and then the very next week turn around, so I actually I've changed my mind going to go a different side. It's like changing teams on the football field
after the whistle has blown. It's not the sort of behavior I think Austrains appreciate, and it's just sort of the kind of thing that Lydia Thorpe did. How is what your center's doing any different from what Lydia did?
You know, it's serious and Lydia.
Lydia at least had a policy disagreement with the Greens that your center's left. In this case, she's left our party, left her colleagues, left the people that supported her, and put a great cost to the people that did that over many years. It's not particularly not sort of behavior you should be proud of.
That's an extraordinary spray there, Matt Canavan. I mean, Jacinta couldn't possibly none of us have. But she couldn't have foreseen the fact that Dutton would lose his seat, the fact that the Liberal leadership would be vacant, the fact that the Liberals would have bottomed out as badly as they did, only thirty nine or forty seats. So it's because of these politicalart.
She's doing this for her ambition. She's doing this for her.
People second died of it the rubbish, right, She's doing it for her ambition, and good luck to her. Good luck to her. But people are sick and tired of that. I mean that the focus now after a loss like this, Shari needs to be on the Austraian people, not on the Australian politician.
Well, did you say she's doing this?
She's going to run for a party that she hasn't even not even a member of yet, she's not even a member of.
Yet she's going to run for the leader of that party.
I mean, how about we just take a take a chill pill here and think about what is best for the Australian people after a loss like this.
And don't you think it's best for the Australian people to have someone like just Center Price as either leader or deputy leader of the opposition. There needs to be a strong opposition. Isn't she more talented than virtually any other figure in the Liberal Party in the Lower House?
No, I wouldn't.
I mean there's great people in Liberal Party, Shari. I think that's that's that's pretty unkind to many of the people there just said it's great, like she's she's I've got great respect for her, got great respect for lots of the people though that I work with across the Liberal National parties or political parties.
And there's nothing wrong with ambition by the way back then, but there's nothing wrong with ambition.
Yeah, sure, I'm not.
But but Shari, the problem here is is how she's done this. She's done damage to her own reputation with the colleagues, damaged to her reputation with the people it worked for her. How does this help her or the country? I mean, I do think In fact, Shari, just days ago I encouraged just Senter to think about running for leadership positions in the Nationals Party because I still thought she was in our party group. She's got enormous potential.
Sky's the limit. But this is not the way. This is not leadership type of behavior to treat other people like this, and that's going to hurt her.
I think in the longer term it's very sad.
Let's bring basilin. What do you think of this argument here? Do you think you Centerprice was right to move to the Liberal Party to be in a leadership position.
Well.
I can hear the disappointment in Matten's voice, and I understand that, and I accept the National's position on this, and it would appear as though they didn't expect this or couldn't see this coming, So that element of surprise has clearly caught them out. I also understand people propelling themselves forward if opportunity presents, and that appears to be
what has happened here. And she obviously feels that her political fortunes and therefore quite possibly the fortunes of her followers and her people, are best served by her being a member of the Liberal Party in the parliamentary team. Can I just say this too a lot of people around the country.
Why didn't she say that last week?
Why does she have the guts to say and the people last week before?
I couldn't have known last week that Dutan was no longer going to be a leader.
See come downs.
This is not because of that, the Shari, This is not because of that. It's not because of that. Don't treat people a bit more respect. This has been on the cards for a while. We've all heard the speculation, and she feels like this is the best opportunity to run for a leadership position right now.
Fair enough, good luck to her.
I mean I would say, Shari, I think she's got enormous talent. As I said, enormous talent. But some questions have to be asked here. How come the LMP went back sorry the CLP, this country Liberal Party went backwar eleven percent In just sent his hometown of Alice Springs with all of the crime that's there. I mean, if you said it can't win Alice Springs, how is she going to win over Australia. I mean that I think
she got Annomo. She's got enormous talent, but but you know you've got it your first job in politics, win your local area, when your street, when you back out, everyone does that, we win government and so I just don't quite. I think, you know, I think people are doing it. It has been badly advised here. I'm really it's not the right step to take right now for her. And look, we'll see how it turns out.
Basil, what do you think? Don't you think you know, modernizing the Liberal Party having a chance of beating Labor you do just need a completely fresh face, someone like just into nambijinpur Price, who is not only a female, but but indigenous as well. Who embodies aspiration, who's got the most incredible journey, who stood up against the voice that showed a lot of courage. What do you think?
I accept a lot of what Matt is saying. And again I understand the nationals disappointment with this, and particularly if they didn't see it coming.
I get that.
I think opportunity has presented, and I think the opportunity has presented because of the leadership vacuum that now has presented itself. And so with that opportunity there, just in Senator Price has decided all right, the doors opened. This is unorthodox, it is unusual, It's not what anyone's expecting. But I can see the best opportunity, Yes for me, but maybe for her. That also means for the issues
and the things that matter most to her. And I'll just say this, I accept that in Senator Price's case, because of the very unique circumstances of the area that she represents, she may well be less popular there because of the complexity of that situation than she is in the broader massive crime just because and I accept that crime, I send that, I accept that, but that issue is not.
The rest of the country's is Huey and the way she performed during the referendum, we know this won her a lot of fans, a lot of followers, and a lot of friends. And she may well be saying, Okay, doors opened, I'm going through it, so gamble and I understand the disappointment, but that's what politics is about. Sometimes the chance comes, it presents you go for it or you don't. She's going for it.
Matt, Can I say something else? I mean, we all know a lot of politicians, and there are those politicians that you meet them and you just think all they care about is their ego and their own ambition. And then you meet others and you do get the very strong sense that they're in politics to try and make a difference in our nation. You might not agree with their vision, but you can see they're doing it for the right reasons. And to me, Jacinta strikes me as
exactly that sort of politician. She's in it for the right reasons. She's had such a long journey to get to this point, and wouldn't having her in a leadership position, even if it's not your part. I understand you disappointed about that, but wouldn't that be the best outcome for the coalition?
Well a week ago I would have agreed with you, Shari. But as I said earlier, why couldn't she go and speak to the members that have fought so hard for her to be in parliament, many of whom were supporting her because they support the Nationals Party. I mean, just a week ago Jacenta was using National's Party funds to be elected, and this week has walked away from that party that helped her despite all of that support, and without any sort of conversation. I mean, I do draw
a contrast here. Look, this happens. It happens from time to time. Has been people to switch parties within the coalision, but there is usually a process that's gone through. And the last time it has happened in McFarlane wanted to join the Nationals Party. He actually went back to his local branch into Womba.
I was there.
I was there at the meeting, a very heated meeting, but he put his fate in their hands.
It was up to them to decide which way he went.
He didn't end up actually winning that one, but he lost at the EXECUSI for the l MP, so he went through a two stage process, but he went to both the party members and the party executive, and he suffered the fate that they decided.
I'm not sure why. I just sim I couldn't have done this here. There's no rush right now.
I mean, well, there's a party were a meeting on at.
Least got three years.
Well, okay, party, So and she does want to run in a leadership position quite quite clearly.
What about all those members? Shary? What about all those people?
I'm speaking for them to a camera, but they hand out. I found I found I found out about this was scrutineering. I was scrutineering for a liberal candidate here l and p but Liberal Party in candidate Tory, young, great guy.
I was trying to.
Help him and and and there's all those other volunteers there doing that. They don't get the accolades, but they see then the people they support do this, and it's like, well, why did I get a state?
Why didn't I question matter?
I get the disappointment. Do you think the people of the Northern Territory who she represents? Do you think the people of the Northern Territories a conservative? Do you think the people of the Northern Territory care whether she goes to Canberra as a GNAT or as a LIB. I wonder whether they would the people that she represents, and I wonder whether they.
The party members they can better about them. I mean, do you and I accept that?
And I accept that Nationals accept that National's disappointment.
I absolutely get that.
But the people that she represents, the constituents of the Northern Territory, their issues, their problems, their challenges, can just expin prosecute the arguments for those people as a LIB.
And that's what she's weighed up and decided.
She thinks that it comes greater opportunity, and I wouldn't. Wouldn't I'm happy to put I'm happy to put the Nationals party record right now against the Liberls, if you want to go that far. But the situation here, just to explain, is when you're elected a senator, you're actually not really elected by the people, and not only the people, you're elected by your party to represent.
That. Accept that and then to understand that. And our just center is very popular and well known.
But before that she was on the ticket just like me, as a party representative, and so party members here but again in a week we could say then they've been disinfrancised.
But also, Matt, that the client in the vote that you spoke about, well, we could also then use the same logic to say that's not Senator Price's fault.
Is it?
Good point?
Well, it is her.
I mean, look, I don't want to be egotistical here, right, but I spend eighty percent of my time trying to win central Queensland.
Right.
I'm based in Rockhampton, and now at the election we've got a one percent swing away from us in Central queens and Capricornia, and where I live, that's pretty good. We had a six percent swing first in Flynn, the seat below me with Colin Boyce tours. So I spend my time doing that and I'm on the back.
Bet, we're nearly out of time. We're out of time, and I just want to quickly basel ask you about the new WA seat of Bullwinkle and where this is up to.
Yes, at the close of counting only about half an hour ago, the Labour candidate three hundred and thirty three votes in front, still too close to call, and the Libs certainly not conceding for Matt Moran It is getting more difficult as this small margin increases ever so slightly, but it is not over yet. Three hundred and thirty three votes at the close of counting tonight, with more counting still to come.
Yeah, all right, and as we speak, Bradfield and cup Young are also too close to call. Like, I really don't understand why the AEC is taking so long to count this week unless there are those postals that haven't arrived yet. All right, Basil zamplus Matt Canavan, good debate. I'm sure just Enterprices watching Matt. You'll be getting your text messages from just into no doubt we'll see send a messages.
I've told her what I was going to say, see.
You guys next week. So to come. Parliament House has been cleared of its worst anti Israel voice. Novi Peris is in the mood to celebrate. You'll join me soon. Plus Paul Keating reacts to the ruthless decision to dump Mark Dreyfus and Ed Husick. We'll talk about that after this quick break. Welcome back. Well, Paul Keating has come out tonight to react to the ruthless decision to dump
Mark Dreyfus and ed Husick. The finn Review reports that Keating said that while the Prime Minister has recently made captain calls in a number of otherwise rules based pre selection ballots, his non intervention in respect of a new South Wales minister on this occasion is in effect an endorsement of a representative of another state group, in this case the Victorian right faction led by Richard Martz. He
says typically Keating esque spray. It's a faction demonstrably devoid of creativity and capacity, and you wouldn't disagree with him there joining me in our Institute of Public Affairs chief economist Adam Crichton, Adam legendary former Labor Prime Minister Paul Keating, Well, what do you think of him reaction to this news that it looks like Mark Dreyfus and ed Husick quite strangely, perhaps you know the first Muslim MP, I'm the most senior Jewish minister will be dump from cabinet.
Yeah, well, certainly I was rather surprised that Keating intervened. Actually, this is the way as I understand it, the Labor Party has worked for a very long time. The factions are very powerful both nationally and within the States, and there's been a minor earthquake since the election. You've got this huge influx of new Labor MPs. The left faction, as I understand it, is now more powerful. It's going
to have fifteen spots in cabinet rather than fourteen. And basically the net impact of all this is that ed Husick is going to go and Mark Drefus is going to go. And I understand it. The Prime Minister could have intervened if he liked, but you can only do that so many times. You know, the labor leader is not as powerful as a liberal leader is within their own party, of you know, because of the power of
the various factions. But you know, the more interesting you viewers and for the general public.
Is what no continue.
Well, just that you know the achievements of Mark Dreyfus. I mean, I'm sure your viewers would not think he's been a fantastic champion of the Jewish people. And you know, I struggle to think of something that ed Husick has achieved, as you know, as the Minister for Innovation. So I don't think they're really great losses. And I think this
is just kind of inside the Beltway stuff. It's just a question of who's getting five hundred thousand dollars a year, who's getting three hundred thousand dollars a year, those sorts of questions, how many staff to people have? You know, this obviously matters in camera, but I think broadly and more broadly, it doesn't really matter.
Just a couple of points in response to that. I mean, the Prime Minister at this point in time has more authority than he's ever had. You know, if he wanted to back in Dreyfus or ed Husick, he could definitely do. So we know his relationship with ed Husick isn't good, and just on the point about dref isn't And perhaps I should have spoken about it before now because people might be oneing. Look, he was the most senior Jewish
minister in the Labor government. It is my strong understanding that he did defend Israel inside cabinet meetings when others like Tony Burke and Penny Wong were, you know, moving to hostile positions on Israel. He did defend it. He did. But you'll recall he came to our Sky News anti Semitism summit. I organized that summit. He came and he spoke, and in his final comment he accused us of covering the issue for ratings. I mean, you know, that couldn't
be further from the truth, and it's the reverse. In fact, not everyone wants to sit and listen to us speak about anti Semitism the whole time. But that was his accusation. He was booed by the Jewish community in that synagogue and it wasn't, you know, our audience, it was the synagogue's audience. So he has been an incredible disappointment. He preferenced the Green Second, that was a massive betrayal. Josh Burns didn't do that. Josh Burns was re elected very
strongly in McNamara. So there's all of that. But you know, this isn't the first time just say that A's intervened in federal politics. I mean, he thinks our personal income tax rates are too high. Neither of us would disagree on that. But you know, why won't the government listen here's the great economic reformer. Why won't the Abenezy government listen to him, Adam when it comes to personal income tax rates? Yeah?
Well, sadly, the Labor Party used to be a great party of reform, but it seems to have turned its back on that, and I do wish it would listen to Paul Keating in that regard. I mean, he's repeatedly said in recent years that the top marginal income tax rate should not be higher than forty percent. He says, if it's any higher than that, it is confiscatory, And
of course in Australia it's forty seven percent. And the most frustrating thing we hear from the labor parties sometimes is they like to compare Australia and our income tax rates to small European countries on the other side of the world. Who sure, they have extremely high income tax rates compared to Australia, but they're also in your and they're on the other side of the world. We're competing with all these Asian countries. They have much much lower,
much much lower income tax rates than us. Indeed, you know, China's top marginal tax rate is lower than Australia's. I mean, isn't that just just absurd? I mean, There's is forty five percent, ours is forty seven percent, and both of them cut in roughly at the same.
Level of income.
So you know, we're always talking about you know, so called communist China. Well, you know what does that say about us? So I do hope in this new government we may see some flickers of tax reform. I think the Labor Party's tax policies going into election, quite aside from its superinnuation tax policy, were not terrible. It did cut it's has promised to cut the lowest marginal rate of tax.
That's something.
Sure, it was piddling, but it is something. And I thought the standard income tax deduction of one thousand dollars was you know, was pretty good too. So look, it's a very low bar in Australia for reform. But you know, we have to be optimistic because there's nothing else we can do at this point.
Well, well we can be pessimistic. That is the alternative. I've been feeling a bit pessimistic lately, trying to lift myself out of it. Adam Krachten, great to see you coming up. The alliance between Russia and China is growing, with Shishiping the main guest at Putin's victory parade. We'll talk about that shortly. Plus it's hard to find someone more pleased than I am that Adam Banunt is out of Parliament, but Nova Paris might just be that person.
She'll be on after this quick break. All right, welcome back. Well let's bring you now former Labor Senator Nova Paris in Darwin. Nova, great to see you on the show again. Look, if you're in Sydney, we'd be probably popping the champagne together. What's your reaction to the end of Adam Banund's political career.
I was up every morning thinking to myself when are they going to update the AEC and watching the swing going against Adam, and I was thinking, when is it finally going to happen?
And sure enough it happened and there's been a lot of jubilation actually, so you know, I was.
Part of a grassroots movement called Better Australia and we targeted key seats across Australia where there were the Teals and the Green candidates, and we were a grassroots movement where we wanted one of the major parties to be elected and to be able to govern outright and not rely on these radicals for power and for the betterment of this country. In the stability of this country as well.
And that is I suppose one of the positives from this election outcome. Were you disappointed that in the vast majority of cases Labor did preference the Greens? Second, was that a disappointment for you?
Look, as you know, I'm well out of politics.
I've been out since twenty sixteen, and you know, I've been on your show a couple of times and I've been very vocal about a number of things with regards to to labor making decisions, especially around you know, the protection of Jewish Australians and the rise of anti Semitism.
So I guess this is what democracy is all about.
You can say yes and now about certain things, but I guess for a labor perspective, you know, it's one thing to say that, but Labor has come off quite victorious. Is probably one of the most successful victories in political history. I think they're moving up to ninety one seats now,
which is a huge win for Labor. But I think the great thing about this now is Anthony Albanizi and his cabinet has a mandate to deliver hopefully on all the promises, but also bring stability back in Australia and actually to stamp out the hate that we see weekly Shahi on you know, the footpaths of this beautiful country, which is you know, turning pear shape and not well on the international scene as well.
I assume that you're referring to the pro Palestinian protests. But nover, we haven't any willingness by labor, by the likes of Tony Burke, who's the Multicultural Affairs Minister, or by any others to stamp out that behavior. So I mean, do you think they are going to start now?
Well, I hope so.
You know, in my opinion, you look at the seats of Tony Burke, Chris Bowen and Jason Clair, who all held seats in the western Sydney areas where we see, you know, a lot of the vicious and the violent hatred, you know, upon the Jewish community and the chanting of free Palestine.
You know, you and I both know what that means.
It's mean the erasure of the Jewish people in their own homeland, which the Jewish people have had an unbroken connection for four thousand years. And you know what I do like and love about Chris Minz who's been very strong and staunched on this and I think his leadership is incredible, And I hope now that Labor federally can take a leaf out of his you know, from him and to.
Say well, this is what leadership looks like, and he's not scared.
To say it.
And the fact that he also.
Has experience in the Middle East and has been there himself to Israel speaks from a personal connection. So you know, I can't see Labor just being another term.
They could possibly be there for two terms.
And I think that Anthony Alberanzi needs to draw a line in the sand and you know, look after Israel, the only democracy in the Middle East, and also acknowledge this significant amount of contribution that the Jewish people have made to this country.
No, but I also want to ask you about just sent her naw Bajimba price. You know, you came up against her. You are on opposing sides of the voice debate. She's now indicated that she's going to run for a leadership position, most likely deputy leader of the Liberal Party. Do you think she'd be a good leader of our country?
Well, this is the thing and I found when I was in parliament up here and little on Northern Territory.
We have two members of the House.
Of Reps and two senators and we used to complain every single year that the Northern Territory would get less than two percent infrastructure budget because in New South Wales, what do you have some forty eight seats.
And that's the focal point.
Of really and truly where a lot of money does go into with the development of this country. And we up here in the Northern Territory get sick and tired of saying, well, yes we want to be the food bowl to Asia, and yes we are the gateway to Asia, but the money doesn't stem this way. So I sort of find having a member from the Northern Territory down there speaking about views right across the country.
I mean, it's you.
You have to also broad in you know, I guess not only just your knowledge beyond the Northern Territory, but from a viewpoint of foreign policy, environment or the.
Wouldn't be apart from the Northern Territory. And I've got to go so that just very quickly. Wouldn't it be incredible to have an Indigenous Australian in such a high leadership position.
Well, I think any Indigenous person that can go forward on their own merits, but I think as an Indigenous person, you know, Jacinta hasn't been the kindest to us as.
First nations people.
And I say that more broadly and just by reading the room on how Aboriginal people you know, feel about Jacina, and I for one know that I was incredibly disappointed on how she you know, derailed the Voice to Parliament. It was something that should have unified the country, not divided us.
And and you know, for me, I still.
Feel this country is broken because we, as the first Australians, the DNA of this country aren't on.
The nation's birth certificate.
And if she wants to put her hand up and go forward, good luck to her.
All right, Noviparis, really appreciate your time. Sorry to cut you off with it out of time. All right, after the break, we'll talk about Russia and China. We're back in a moment. Joining me now is Australian Strategic Policy Institute senior analyst Malcolm Davis. Malcolm, good to see you. The Chinese President has just arrived in Moscow for a four day visit. What can we expect, Well, look.
The Chinese President is in Moscow for the Victory Day celebrations on May ninth, which is celebrating the victory of the Red Army against Nazi Germany and the Second World War.
I think that what you will see is a summit between she and Putin to discuss the Axis of authoritarian States which were formed was formed essentially literally a day or so before Putin launched his invasion of Ukraine in twenty twenty two, So I hardly think that she didn't have any advance warning about that invasion, and I think what you will see is discussions between she and Putain on how that Axis of authoritarian states can carry the
fight against the Western democracies in a more intense way and basically challenge liberal democracy as a system of governance across the planet.
The Prime minister, our prime minister has confirmed he is going to meet He's going to travel to Indonesia next week meeting with President Proboo Sibianto. How important is this relationship to Australia. What do you think they're going to discuss. Is it more of a photo opportunity or will there be anything of substance.
Look, we should have a substantive discussion because during the election campaign, one of the key issues was concerns about Indonesia climbing into the embrace of Russia, with Russia seeking to potentially base bombers out of Biac Island. I think if ALBANIZEI does not bring that up, is he does not discuss with Indonesia trying to avoid Indonesia drifting into the embrace not only of Russia but also China, then it would be a missed opportunity. We cannot allow that situation to emerge.
So in addition to.
Trade and join investment in resources and those sort of things, defense and security has to be on that agenda.
And I'm sure there'll be a lot of questions from the media about whether he does seek assurances from Indonesia that they won't be allowing Russia to base any sort of military equipment there at all. We're just about out of time. But also noting that albanize is going to travel to Washington next month to meet with Trump, how do you think that's going to go? Twenty seconds?
Twenty seconds.
Hopefully it goes well, but discussing anything with Trump is uncertain. Trump probably will want better trade relations with Australia, but at a beneficial welcome to the US, So we have to be prepared to bargain hard and that's not going to be easy, all.
Right, Thank you so much, Malcolm Davis. Right, that's all we've got time for today. Thank you so much for your company this week. I'll see you on Monday at eight o'clock. And right now, here's Paul Murray.