Sharri | 7 May

Live on Sky News.

This is Sharry Good evening. Welcome man.

Let the celebrations begin as Anti Israel Green's leader Adam band is punished by voters and looks set to lose his seat.

Well my thoughts on this in a moment.

Also tonight, the letter Nick mackenzie sent a key witness in the Ben Robert Smith trial saying she was causing him anxiety. The ninebod have still not broken their silence on seven hundred thousand dollars in hush money. Cheng Lei, for the first time is telling the full story of her incarceration.

She'll join me live tonight on the show.

Israel reportedly approves plans to seize the terror controlled Gaza Strip. Deputy Foreign Affairs Minister Sharen Haskell will be here with an exclusive interview later and we'll cross live to the Vatican the moment we hear news about the vote for the next quote. But first, well, let's start the show

In this country.

And now, if Sky News chief election analyst Tom Connell is right, Adam Bant has lost his job. Here was Tom making that decision desk call this afternoon.

What would he need in the remaining absent votes to be able to win sixty three percent? That is just far too high in our performance from everything else that has happened in this election. So we're assuming lots of positives for ban from here and he still would need sixty three percent. So given that I know there's plenty of vote left, we are now saying a Labour Party will pick up the seed of Melbourne and Adam Bant, the Green's leader, will lose the seat of Melbourne.

And to that, I say bye Bye Bant, goodbye to your divisive brand of politics. To the fact that while your fellow Australians Jews were being harassed, targeted, doxed and threatened, while our community had our property vandalized and firebombed, while we were living in daily fear, you continued to antagonize us. You supported a boycott, divestment and sanctions movement against Israel.

It's calling for an end to the invasion of Gaza, putting sanctions on this extreme war cabinet of Benjamin Etna who that is subject to orders to stop genocide, ending the military trade with Israel, and expelling the Israeli ambassador. We want to see an end to the invasion of Gaza and an end to the occupation. Children are now dying because they can't get enough to eat or drink as part of a human engineered famine, human engineered by

And now he's been voted out, and so for this reason tonight we do have a reason to smile. Australians have rejected the antagonism by the Greens leader of our community, because that is what the Greens Party came to stand for. It was a pro Palestinian party, not an environmental one. Now, news of Bound's departure was celebrated by Pauline Hanson this afternoon, just.

Quietly between you and I.

I was getting ready to come on your program when I heard the news, and I couldn't help it.

I did a dance around the house with my brather and nickers, and I had to have a gin and tonic.

So I am so excited.

That's the best news I've heard.

I'm sure she wasn't the only one dancing around in her Undy's celebrating when the news came through. Or the nightly front page sums it up well by saying from the Yarra to the seer and rich. I also put it well on this program last night when he said there would be many a dry eye to see band leave parliament.

And I'll tell you what the driest of all is right here.

So let's toast there's one piece of good news, and let's say good riddance to bad rubbish. Now, in other good news, tell Zoe Daniel is officially out of the parliament with Liberal Tim Wilson today reclaiming the seat of Goldstein.

I'm very proud, genuinely, very proud to say that we are pleased to accept that we have won the seat of Goldstein back for the Liberal Code.

Well, quite strangely, Zoey Daniel put out a post refusing to concede. She said, while the media has called the result in Goldstein, I will wait for further counting out of respect for my scrutineers and the democratic process. Although she didn't have a problem waiting on Saturday night when she began her victory celebration, and now she can dance off into the sunset.

He can't see enough of that clip.

And now Tim Wilson isn't ruling out a tilt at the leadership. Are the leading contenders emerging as Susan Lay and Angus Taylor. Fellow moderate Jason Felinsky has backed Tim Wilson in as a leadership contender as members argue over whether the Liberal Party should be more conservative or centrist.

He is the first and only person in Australian political history to win a seatback from an Independent to win a seatback from an Independent at the next election. What he has managed to do is incredibly significant. He represents the people whose votes we need to get back.

Should he and will he run full leader?

Well, I don't want to spoil it. I hope he does, but I'll be churning in at eleven to find out.

Amazing Liberal leadership.

Do you have any aspirations for it out?

Well today I had aspirations for one thing, and it was to have the great privilege and service to be the member for Goldstein again.

And of course we have lived out that promise.

And of course what Jason Vielinski said wasn't quite true there because Dave Sharma did win the seat of Wentworth from Independent Karen Phelps and then Sharma lost it to Allegraspender and Dave Sharma's going to be on the show tonight.

By the way. Now there's also a view that.

Just sent a number Jim for Price needs to find a way to move to the Lower House to be in a position to run for the leadership. And Ray Hadley said here last night that she's clearly the most talented with a strong ability to connect with voters.

I think the next Liberal National Party Prime Minister is not in the Lower House at the moment. They're not in the Lower House, but they are certainly in the Senate, but they've got to make their way to the lower House to be elevated.

To that position. Just enterprise this.

Well, she knows.

I love her.

I really think she's a great Australian and I really think that we need someone to stand up and take us forward, and she'd be the person if she could get to the Lower House that could do it.

One things for shod It's going to be a long period in the wilderness for the Liberal Party. But til Zoe Daniel wasn't the only Teale who celebrated prematurely. Minnick Ryan and Nicolette Buell's seats are also now in doubt, with counting ongoing, and in total, they're still around a dozen or so seats that the Australian Electoral Commissions say are too close to call now. In Bradfield, Liberal Giselle Capterian is a head of Nicolette Buell by about two

I think this is extraordinary.

While Ryan has only about thirty four percent of the primary vote, but then of course she's receiving preferences from Labor, Greens and the other parties. Now in the new Wa seat of Bullwinkle, Labour's Trish Cook is ninety votes ahead of Liberal candidate Matt Morin. Other undecided seats include Bendigo being in the Act and Fremantle. The seat of Ryan

Had to cut her off.

This is a woman nineclaimed had been a victim of domestic violence, and they pressed her to testify for them against Robert Smith. Now, in a formal letter that we've obtained, Mackenzie said he wasn't trying a victim blame, but said that her trauma had caused him anxiety. He wrote, I also want to explain why I no longer have contact with you due to the deep distress you suffered. You contacted me very often for a long time. I saw it as my job to try to manage your stress and trauma.

It was very challenging.

There were times I was so worried I notified your husband of concerns you might self harm. In time, I began to seek help about how to manage dealing with a victim survivor.

I'm not blaming you for a moment.

I'm just explaining that it began to take a significant toll on me. And Mackenzie said that his employers had instructed him to stop any contact with the woman, who nine had pressured to give testimony against Robert Smith.

He wrote, prior.

To our last contact, I had a meeting with my senior bosses. I was instructed to cease contact. This is the reason why I ceased contact. I'm not justifying it. I'm just explaining.

Now.

In her unfiled statement of claim, the woman said that she told Nick mackenzie in a phone conversation in September twenty eighteen that she didn't want to be a witness in the defamation proceeding. She sought assurances, which she says Mackenzie gave that none of the materials she'd previously provided

Saying I am Fairfax.

After much convincing, eventually the woman did provide a written statement for use in the proceedings after her identity was suppressed. But by April twenty nineteen, the woman says that she was having suicidal thoughts as a result of her involvement in the defamation proceeding. She was suffering severe psychological distress

Just a month after the payment was made.

The Nine board remains under pressure now over who authorized this hush money.

So far, the chair of the nation's biggest media company, Nine Entertainments, Catherine Whize, continues to dodge the media.

Did you sign off on the seven one hundred thousand hush money payments?

And it's clear now silence is nine strategy Today. We asked every Nine board member a series of key questions. Were you aware that Nine intended to make a seven hundred thousand dollar payment to prevent a key witness from going public with allegations against Nick Mackenzie in the Ben Robert Smith defamation case. Without reply, Have you signed off on or been made aware of any similar payments made to silence individuals connected to the Ben Robert Smith proceedings? Again? Nothing?

The nine board down company have also declined to answer our questions this week, and in an act of gross hypocrisy for a media company, nine is using bullish legal threats to try to shut down reporting from other media outlets.

Great to see you both.

Michael, I want to turn to the outcome of Goldstein, and it seems in Melbourne with Adam Bannt these are important victories.

Important and stunning. Quite frankly, I cannot tell you how much admiration people have for Wilson having one vack Goldstein. I mean that guy has apart from all the other qual is the courage Tim Wilson showed is jobs making. It's breathtaking and I wish him well for a longer distinguished career in Parliament to add to his distinguished career already. He'll make a great contribution. And you saw how good he is today that interview. As for Adam bant Shhi, what can we say? There is a God for all

Yeah, well, good to hear that. I wouldn't have expected anything else.

I mean, Steve Price, you know, it wasn't that long ago, maybe five or six years ago, when I used to have Sarah Hanson, young on Guy and us as a guest on a panel. But there's no way we would have any of the Greens on now, unless it's to point out how ludicrous they are because all of them hold this out to Israel position. I mean they used to be an environmental party, Steve.

They need to get back to that.

Well, that's the point, Jarry, and I endorse everything Michael just said. The Greens have become a hard left socialist activist party. That they sponsored all of those pro Palestinian marches that went on week after week after week in Melbourne.

They're still held from time to time.

And Adam Bant, I mean the smug look on his face, the fact that he always thought he was the smartest bloke in the room and he knew exactly where he should take The Greens Party of Australia. Who has destroyed it because it's not the party Bob Brown started. It's not the party that saved the Franklin. It's not the party that cares about trees. It's a party that managed to endorse, incredibly, horribly the worst outbreak of Andy Symmitism

Although don't forget Alban easy when on Abby Chatfield's program with podcasts as well, for anyone at home, he doesn't know who she is, you're not missing anything. But she's a podcaster who famously said she wouldn't have any Zionists on her show. But on TikTok and social media she was heavily endorsing the Greens. And actually there was even a funny clip today where she refused to concede that

Share Well, she probably can't.

Add up exactly. They need math letters as well.

I'm going to say, Sharry, we also should remember this about Bant. This fellow band was an admirer of Leon Trotsky when he was at university. So to accept and endorse Steve's point, this is not an environmental party is this is an extremist cult these days, And let's not forget Ban. Let's not forget that. Forget that band described Albanesi as a war criminal. I mean he said, Albanesi, the Labor government is complicit in genocide, right, Genocide's a

Indeed, and I just loved Pauline Hanson's comment that she was in her Brian nickers running round having a gen and tonic. Everyone's salarrating when they heard the news. Everyone who watches s Guy news. In any case, Michael, I just wanted to stick with you for a second. Ask who you think would be a good leader for the Liberal Party?

Now?

Do you are you of the viewer needs to go in a conservative direction, a moderate direction? Are there any centrist leaders at all?

So I'll leave the leadership to my friends in the Parliamentary Party. But the answer is this, I look at it very simply. I accept that John how definition of where the Liberal Party should be in general terms, it's a center right party. It's a broad church, that's what it is. It's not center and it's not right. It's a combination of the both. And how has explained that a thousand times, and he is the oracle, and I completely agree with him, and he proved that that model

Very hard when people are being offered to have twenty percent of the hex debt paid off, though very hard to say to those young voters, I don't vote for that. Instead, vote for fiscal responsibility. I completely agree with you that our budget needs apower. I'm just saying it's a hard

On thousand percent.

I mean, I wrote a column in the Heraldson a couple of weeks ago bemoaning the fact that the lack of leadership in Australian politics. I mean, where are other leaders? And I did use a couple of labor premiers by the way, as an example of people who do have some charisma, and that's Malanaskis in South Australia and Men's in New South Wales. I'm not sure where the Liberal with that sort of charisma is. I mean, we saw raw emotion from Tim Wilson today and a dear friend

Of charisma as well.

You know, they've got to maybe just put in an angus Taylor, let him flounder around for a couple of years and then replace him with a couple of younger leaders that can show the new way for people to go, because they've got to get young people back voting for them. That's why they've hollowed out the cities because young people have just walked away from them and the heck's bribe by labor I reckon it was brilliant policy because it worked for them.

Yeah, shocking policy, but brilliant politics. Absolutely.

It was a bribe and it worked correct and that's why the Prime Minister said it was his first order of business. I mean, they just bought the young vote anyway, all right, Michael Kroegers, see price, great to see you. Let's turn to the Vatican, where the first round of voting for the new pope is set to begin tonight. The meeting of all the cardinals is known as the Conclave, where secrecy is so highly regarded that all mobile phone signals have been deactivated in the Vatican. Stas Butler joins

So told us through what the process is, what will happen tonight.

What we've just seen happen in the square is a solemn mass pro elegenda romano quantifija, a special mass that was given behind me in Saint Peter's Basilica, led by Cardinal Giovanni Battista Ray. This is the first step in that longer process to conclave. In his speech, you know, warning urging the cardinals this is a choice of exceptional importance and that personal convict considerations must be set aside.

All right, So you say, we don't know how long that one will last, So can you give us a rough idea of when we will know who the new pope is and also tell us who the contenders are?

Right?

Well, so I mean as I said that two thirds majority. It really depends on, you know, what kind of unity we're seeing in the car among the cars right now. A lot of them have spoken to media saying that they do want a short conclave. They have an interest in that happening to prevent you know, us on the outside looking at what's happening and saying, well, look, they haven't voted for a pope in let's say, five six days. That shows that there's clearly an amount of disunity. So

All right, Staf, thank you very much for that update.

Now steal to Karma is the race for the next Liberal leader turns bidter. I'll speak with Senator Dave Sharma about the direction the party should take, and cheng LEI will join me live. So she tells the story of her incarceration for the first time.

It is extraordinary. You don't want to miss it. That's after this quick break. Well, we all.

Followed cheng Le's plight when she was wrongfully imprisoned in China, accused of trumped up charges of espionage and stealing state secrets. And on this program we begged the Australian government and Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews when he went to China to secure her release. In those dark days when cheng Lei was separated from her children and we wondered if she'd ever be able to hug them again, if she'd ever

She was the feace of the network and suddenly she's gone.

China has arrested an Australian journalist working in Beijing.

One day she was there.

Next day she vanished.

They raided my apartment while I sat in.

The living room.

This is where I spent six months thinking, Oh, isn't it We're going to get out.

You don't know you'll ever see your firmly again.

Most of all, I miss my.

Children's as close to wanting to die as I ever got.

Then there was Australia's response to COVID that led to a very rapid deterioration of the bilateral relationship.

I think the reason that Lane was taken as a political prisoner was China sending a message that there was things that are off limits.

They wanted to bully Australia. Australia Ali, I.

Thought spies or secrets were all very far from me.

This is massively cruel, an unfair treatment of an Austrolian rock of hope.

Thank you yours is so hungry for any connection to the outside world.

Every single letter I wrote, I made sure that I signed off looking forward to seeing you.

Those looters.

Made me think I still had some things left that I wasn't a bad person.

I am loved and remembered.

Jung Lay My story premier's Tuesday, June three on Sky.

New Use.

And not only would chang Lay be presenting her own Sky News documentary, she's also releasing her new book, chang Lay, a Memoir of Freedom, and you can pre order that, which I highly suggest you.

Do right now from HarperCollins.

And I'm pleased to say chang Lay joins us here in studio now. Chang Lay, that is such a powerful and traumatic documentary that hugest Congratulationsks.

For doing it. And it must have been so difficult to relive, you know, the worst part of your life. I was shocked at just how horrendous the conditions in residential surveillance were. Can you tell us a bit about that.

I think most people are pretty familiar with the idea of solitary confinement or even dungeons where you're starved.

Or you're cold.

But this RSDL residential surveillance at a designated life occasion, in some ways it's far worse. You can't complain that they staffed me, or you know that I was not clothed, but they had two people stuck to me at all times, every minute of the day, I mean much closer than we're sitting now, Sharry and just looking at me. And that's very unnerving.

And you couldn't move.

You couldn't even move scratch your cheap of permission to your legs, no, no, not cross my angles. I had to sit straight for thirteen hours a day, except for a few ten minute breaks in which I had to walk in between them, with about one meter in between these two guards about one and a half meters, so that has constituted this so called exercise. And I was utterly isolated.

And it's just the.

Way on twenty four hours a day. They watched you, even when you went to the bathroom.

Yes, and I.

Felt sorry for them, It says you mean for them as it was for me.

I mean, the worst would have been.

You know, as a mother, I can't imagine being away from my children for three years and the worry that you must have had that they would never know when or even if you were coming home.

Well, as a single mom, they were we were just so close together. I would take them to all their favorite activities. I would take them on work trips with me during the school holidays, and I'll read to them before bed. And then I didn't get to see them for almost four years. And to be honest, to survive, I had to force myself to not think of them. And it's only days like their birthdays that I would give myself the permission, because otherwise, how many tons of tears can you bear to shed?

You couldn't have coped, You couldn't have coped mentally.

Yeah, I mean, it's literally considered torture, this of isolation that you were in, having no contact with the outside world.

And this is the funny thing. If you talk to some Chinese people, they'll say Oh, that's nothing. You know, we had it worse during the Culture Revolution, because that's the fact they have different standards of humanity. Whereas if you speak to an Australian, Canadian, American, they would say, wow, that's barbaric. Even if I was a murderer, I should be allowed some contact with my kids or other family.

But that's not the way.

I guess. It's just a harsher way of looking at the world and looking at life.

Have you spoken to them since about you know, how they coped with the fact that you just suddenly disappeared and there was a time where no one knew what had happened to you.

They won't actually go through some of the specifics of how they coped, but I can see the scar like how viercely independent my daughter is, and how sometimes my son.

Still reverts to that age he was eight when we were cruelly separated, and how he would think about mum only before bedtime and be so scared that he'd never seen mom again, and just all the lost times in the park.

You can never get that back.

No, they're child no, no, yeah, And that's just part.

Of being a human port human point, and that's right.

You were, in a sense a victim of the hostile diplomatic relations between Australia and China.

Is that you know, you.

Can't separate the fact that there was this rift going on from how you retreat.

It or surveillance on me started and other Australians just a few three days after the when our former Foreign minister called for that investigation into the source of COVID, and on the same day China arrested the Australian, formerly Australian educated man in charge of cleaning up Wuhan and that he was the police deputy police chief at the time.

I remember at the time because I was researching the origins of COVID nineteen and I was writing about the doctors and the whistleblowers who were also put in residential surveillance and residential detention. And until I watched your documentary this afternoon, I had no idea how bad those conditions were.

One thing even commemorating doctor when leam the most famous whistleblower is not allowed in China. If your a media organization and you do that, you have your website blocked, you have demerit points, you'll you'll lose your license.

And just to remind everyone at home, he was the whistleblower who tried to alert the world that there was this new coronavirus.

Now and it died because of it.

One of the things that made us all so angry was Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews went to China, you know, the first Australian leader to go there, and defact gave him talking points to raise your case and he never did.

How does that make you feel?

I am pretty beyond anger. But that does make me angry in the way that I am moved by all the countless Australians and many of them strangers who spoke up for me, including you, including so many of my media peers and other politicians who just called out what was wrong. But I think perhaps mister Andrews was more worried about his business opportunities after politics.

I think you're right there, because there's no either excuse for it at all. I just want to end by how you are now using this traumatic experience to try and help other Australians who are in a similar situation. And I understand there are eleven other Australians who are wrongfully imprisoned around the world. Can you tell us about your advocacy work that you're doing now well.

I am part of the organization a Wider Australians Against Wrong For and Arbitrary Detention Alliance and that's spearheaded by Kylie Moore Gilbert and also Sean Tnell, my ex con friends, and we tried to raise awareness and we testified at the Senate inquiry about what more can be done to help the detainees and their families. And it might seem like it's only a few people, but what matters is the principle that you do not arrest an individual to

I don't think it seems small at all.

I think it's shocking that you know, there's not more the Australian government can do. Seeing as the Prime Minister now has such a good relationship with China, they should be doing more, I think to secure the relation, and hopefully they hopefully they will.

I don't know if you call it a good relationship. I think there's fear and coercion involved, given what happened last time. So I hope we can appreciate all that's good and positive about China, including our trading relationship, but also be constantly alert to the torture and the repression that goes on in dark corners.

Yeah. Absolutely, Cheng Lay. I can't you know. I can't tell you how much I admire you, how I think you're so incredibly courageous. I don't know how you got through those three years.

I truly don't, and I'm so pleased just sitting here now, and I have to say I watched the documentary this afternoon.

Everyone needs to see.

It is one of the best documentaries Sky has done, and it'll be broadcast on Sky News seven. Thirty pm on the third of June, and of course I highly recommend you pre order chang Lay a Memoir of Freedom from HarperCollins.

I'm certainly going to be ordering that. Thank you so much, Jangway, Thanks so much, Shery.

Now still to come the truth behind Israel's plans for Gaza. Sharan Haskell would join me for an exclusive interview plus Dave Sharma after this quick break. Welcome back, and let's bring in our Liberal Senator Dave Sharma. Dave, but you've been scrutineering all day in Bradfield. Can you give us an update on how this seat is looking?

Well?

The contest is still very tight Cherry, but Gizelle capturing the Liberal candidates two hundred and fifteen votes ahead. She seems to be winning the postal botes about fifty eight percent to forty two percent. There's still some more postal boats to be counted, so look, it's it's too early,

We've of course seen the good news with Tim Wilson beating Zoe Daniel in Goldstein. Do you think it's it's looking like Amelia Haemer might do the same thing as well in Kuyong.

Look at that's certainly my hope. Having had a look at the numbers. Now I haven't been involved in that count, but having a look at the numbers, the way the postal boats are breaking, how many more postal votes are still to count. She's certainly narrowed the gap significantly since the weekend, which is what we always expected would happen.

Over the line.

It's amazing because on a lecture night the Liberals were ridiculed for saying, oh, we've got to wait for you know, the pre poll and the postal But now it looks like a lot of those TiAl seats that you know, were declared victory for the Teals are now at least in doubt.

Look very true. So obviously, you know Goldstein has been won by the Liberals, that's clean. Ow cur Young is very close. It looks like Bradfield has been held by the Liberals. So I think, you know, amongst a very poor night and a lot of tragic results for many of my colleagues liberal candidates, these are a couple of couple of bright spots for us.

I've got to ask you about who you think would be the best leader for the Liberal Party. This is something you will have a vote in. Are you putting your support behind one of the candidates?

Look, I'm at the moment, I'm open to all candidates. I'm not going to declare my support unfortunately, not to you tonight, show it behind any particular one, but whoever it is, and you know, I have a high respect for all the candidates to put their names forward. Whoever it is, I think really needs to be prepared to grapple with the immensity of a scale of the challenges

I was speaking.

I mentioned a bit and the show how you did defeat an independent in Karen Philips in Wentworth and then you lost to Independent Alagors Spender. Do you think this is going to continue to be a battle in some of these traditionally blue ribbon seats or do you think there is a pathway that they can return to the Liberal Party And if so, what is it?

Well, I think you know Tim Wilson's result to Zelle Capterian's result has not known yet. Amerely a Hamer's close contest. I think shows that there is a pathway back. The tales of climates are hundred ran a number of very well funded candidates in other seats as well, like one and Dan Ten's said, but you know also the first and on the Gold Coast, number of places around the country, none of them have success And look, we need to do a lot more to win back voters in those areas.

Tim Wilson also said when he gave his press conference today that he still believes nuclear energy needs to be part of Australia's future. This is despite the Scare campaign that labor Ron, which would have damaged the coalition.

What's your view on this, Well.

Say, look, I think all the policies we took to the election will rightly be reviewed and reassessed, so you know, I think everything is up for discussion and debate. Personally, I had no problem with nuclear energy. I think it's a good idea. But you know, the most potent element of the Scare campaign was not the technology. It was the cost and the fact that the government would be building,

Foreign Minister Pennywong just finally has said that she doesn't plan to retire this term. There have been rumors some were hopeful that those rumors were true. You know, this is going to be very difficult to have her in the job. We should realistically expect that she's going to try move towards recognition of Palestine Palestine this term, don't you.

Think, well?

I think, look, this is the area where she's been most at it. It was Foreign Minister, despite I think only having traveled to the region once, she's has a lot of strong opinions and her caucus does as well, and her party membership about the role Australia should play or the side we should support, if you like, in the Middle East conflict. I think we will need to watch this very both closely. You know, we and the Liberals

Indeed, all right, Dave Sharma, thank you very much for joining us tonight after the break.

Who will speak about the future of the Gaza Strip?

That's next? All right?

Joining me now is Israel's Deputy Foreign Affairs Minister Sharan Haschool Sharin. We've only got thirty seconds because there were tech issues from your end. Tell us what the plans are for the for the Gazza Strip.

What is Israel doing? You're moving in there.

We want to bring our hostages back. We know that with the last two ceasefires only military pressure persuaded Ramas to go into a ceasefire to return them back home, and so what we're doing now is advancing. We want to destroy Commas capability and we want to bring them home as quickly and as safety as possible.

So this isn't about seizing control of the Gaza Strip as has been reported.

No.

Look, the way to destroy Ramas is very difficult. We have tried now for almost a year uh specific operation. So having presents and then going to specific operation in the Gaza strip. This is not in the and the way I was actually effective for that.

We're out of Sorry, I'll take issue setting you up. I really hope we can get you back on tomorrow because I want to have this conversation on this interview.

All right, not a problem. I'll be back at eight o'clock tomorrow. And here's Paul Murray.