Live on Sky News. This is Sharry.
Good Evening. Welcome to the show.
Tonight a major sit down interview with former British Prime Minister Boris Johnson. He opens up about Donald Trump. He also reveals his final conversation with the Queen, just two days before she passed away. He speaks about the wave of anti Semitism globally and reveals the truth about exactly.
How many children he has.
He says he's had many kids because we're in a demographic deficit.
Well that's his excuse.
He also talks about his secret mission to stop Prince Harry from leaving the UK.
I failed to avert megsit, I take it, but I did deliver Brexit.
He's got strong ideas, he's entertaining and very funny. That major interview coming up. But first to the US election. We're just days away from this his election, and the result matters here in Australia arguably just as much.
As who our own prime minister is.
American leadership is critical to the inflation fight and cost of living, to national security, support for Israel, dealing with the threat of China and Orcus. We don't have a vote, but it matters and here's how the polls are looking. Trump is ahead in all but two of the battleground states. According to Real Clear polling. Trump's ahead in Arizona, Nevada, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, and Georgia, while Cormala is ahead in Wisconsin
and Michigan. The New York Times reports that never before in modern presidential campaigns have so many states been so tight this close to election date, And now that Trump appears to be edging ahead in the polls.
The campaign is getting uglier. The New York.
Times reports top Democratic top Democratic strategists are increasingly hopeful that the campaign's attempts to cast former President Donald J. Trump as a fascist will carry Miss Harris to a narrow triumph. So this is a very deliberate decision to go negative and go nasty, a deliberate strategy to paint Trump as a dictator. This is what's happening behind the scenes in the Harris camp. But publicly, Kamala is pledging
unity for all Americans. But Joe Biden let the truth out this week when he called Trump supporters garbage.
Only garbage I see floating down there is his orders.
Seizing on the comments Trump today turned up in a garbage truck in the swing state of Wisconsin.
That's like deplorable Ville.
This is the deplorable b.
Hillary, and I think this is worse.
Actually, you can't lead America if you don't love Americans.
It's true.
You can't be president if you hate the American people, which I believe they do.
Such a strong line there from Donald Trump, and you could be forgiven for thinking that. Well, perhaps Joe Biden doesn't want Kamala to win, and who could blame him? He was falced out of the race to the Oval office. Nancy Pelosi and Barack Obama made it clear that he had to go.
They were the ones.
With the real power, not Potus. And in the crucial final days, well Biden certainly not helping Kamala's chance of winning. She's trying to portray a picture of unity. She claims that Trump wants to put Democrats in jail, and she insists that she'll do the opposite, that she'll give Republickins a seat at the table.
Unlike Donald Trump. I don't believe people who disagree with me are the enemy. He wants to put them in jail, I'll give them a seat at the table.
Yeah, but the only political prisoners in America have been Trump supporters. Former Trump trade advisor Pete Navarro has been jailed, so is former Trump strategist Steve Bannon, and he just got out yesterday, just in time to energize his base in the week before polling day.
And Nancy Pelosi thought a federal prison was going to break me, well, it empowered me.
The Democrats also bought, brought civil and criminal cases against Trump to try and stop him from becoming president.
They wanted him in.
The jail house, not the White House. Even Biden has said Trump should be locked up. Yet another home truth that slipped out.
I said this five years ago. You'd like me up, We're gonna like him up.
The Democrats accused Trump of subverting democracy, but isn't trying to throw a candidate in jail precisely the same thing. As president For four years, Trump didn't imprison his appointments. Boris Johnson's view, and I spoke to him a bit earlier. He said that this is all very deliberate.
My impression of them is that they were essentially trying to deprive the people of the opportunity of voting on Donald Trump. And it was a kind of lawfare designed to take out a candidate.
That interview coming up on the show, and Boris Johnson also shares his view on how Trump would handle the dictators who are collaborating and conspiring to weaken the West. We're not living in a time of peace. Israel fighting for its survival. Social cohesion in Western societies is breaking down. Russia still on the attack against Ukraine and China preparing for war. Inflation meanwhile, remains a global problem. But with so much at stake, the.
Next leader of the free world matters.
In fact, you could argue there's rarely been a time in history when leadership is of such critical importance. Our enemies are emboldened and we need strength to stop their advance. Okay, My major interview with Boris Johnson coming up a bit later in the show after the break. He speaks about Donald Trump, his final conversation with the Queen just two
days before she passes away. He tells me what she says, why Emmanuel Macron doesn't like his dog, exactly how many children he has, and he also condemns the waive of anti Semitism sweeping the globe.
That's coming up But now let's.
Bring in National Senator Matt Canavan and Sky News host Steve Price.
Great to see you both.
Steve, do you think those Biden comments basically calling half of American's garbage could move votes in Trump's direction?
You'd have to think if anyone was undecided, that would I mean, it was the Hillary Clinton moment, wasn't it. And you can imagine being in the back office of Kamala Harris's campaign and they've got the television on in the corner and they see Joe Biden come out with that stuff and called Trump supporters garbage.
I mean, it's just no.
Wonder she's hidden him away and didn't want him on the campaign trail at all. And Donald Trump, to his credit, he goes and hires a garbage truck some made of his, puts a sticker on it saying Donald Trump's garbo truck. He puts on a high vi his vest, and he's just a genius at doing those sorts of things.
Yeah, and there does seem to be more reporting of frosty relations between the Harris campaign and the Biden team. Matt Canavan, you follow us politics very closely. I want to get your sense of how this election is headed, and whether you think those comments from Biden could make much of a difference in these final days, Well, I think.
Trump was already ahead. That's definitely what the prediction markets, the betting markets think. He's never polled anywhere like where he is at the moment. He's leading in most swing states on the pole of polls if you like, He's never been there. Even when he won in sixteen, he was behind by quite a distance to Hillary Clinton. So you would think everything is going his way. And as Steve said, this is just unbelievably poor timing for the
Harris campaign. Not only the remarks themselves will have an impact and help Trump get his base out, get his vote out, they also happened at the same time that Kamala Harris was doing her perhaps largest speech to go for the campaign and the Washington lips there, and it was a big set piece, and that's been all swamped by both Biden's comments and then Trump's remarkable ability to
capture the news cycle. I did just want to point out, though, Sharhi, that you know, I'm a little miffed he has ripped off my stick of wearing high vis I think this election tactic.
But I'm happy for him, happy.
Sure about that.
I feel like every second politician is wearing high viz Matt Canavanjelsic start, Matt, I just want to do a quick follow up question with you. I mean, I've interviewed Steve Bannon a couple of times before, I've been on his show many more times, so of you, He's just got out of prison less than a week.
Before polding Day.
What do you think the impact is going to be now of you know, this high profile figure literally jailed for contempt for not, you know, betraying Donald Trump.
But how do you think this is going to play out?
Look, it's probably not going to have a big impact on the overall race because most Americans, I'm sure, are pretty busy with their own lives to know who is or follow closely Steve Bannon. It probably has a little bit of impact on the margins. He's got a very
big following among the base, so to speak. Now all of his viewers probably already of course voting for Trump, but he's released will perhaps motivate them to get more of their friends and colleagues to the polls, who are probably more likely to vote Republicans.
So it probably helps a little bit.
And look, it also of course undermines the rhetoric from the Democrats that somehow Donald Trump represents a unique risk to democratic norms. I think they call them democratic norms in America when the only people that have been really locked up for their political views or activities in recent
years have been done so by democratic administrations. I think it was a travesty of justice that Steve Bannon was jailed by what was a kangaroo court of a congressional commit He had no representatives from the Senate leader, sorry, the House leadership of the Republicans, and they charged him with a contempt and put him away for four months just during the campaign too.
Agree, Agree?
Extraordinary who was locked up for four months? All right, let's look at the Quantus Albanizi upgrade scandal. Now he's been in hiding for the second day in a row. I reported last night that the former Group Executive for Government and International Affairs at Quantas, Andrew Parker, often handled Albanesi's flight upgrades. I also told you last night about their close personal relationship, where Albanezi attended Andrew Parker's housewarming party.
I said there was even a plaque to that effect. Well, let's have a look at that.
Now.
I can show you that tonight. There you go.
The address was at the top of it. We've blurnt it out, blurted out for privacy reasons.
That says there.
And if we can show you the close up again, officially opened by Anthony Alberanzi, and it says also Gladys Very Jicklian. It has Verry Jicklian's name there too, But I understand them A new Sofales premier has been friends with Andrew Parker since even their teenage years.
A long time.
But when Albanzi was opposition leader, bizarrely opening the private home of the man who was the government relations advisor for Quantas who then went on to become their group executive for sustainability, Sam made and today has backed up my reporting. She's quoted a Quantus insider saying that alban Ezi's denials were bs and that Andrew Parker used to get calls from labor staffers about upgrades. Of course, we're not suggesting Andrew Parker has done anything wrong.
He hasn't. This is all in alban easy. I'm also you're just going to quickly bring you before I go to you.
Steve Price, a Quantus insider familiar with these matters, has said to me about Alban Easy, he's digging a grave on this.
He's digging a grave on this.
So, Steve Price, alber Ezi issuing blanket denials to select media outlets.
No public conferences. Where do you think this goes? Now?
Well, it shouldn't have lasted six days. And if he lets it keep going, he's in real trouble. I mean a couple of simple things here. When he was Transport minister under rud Gillard, and then in opposition and Opposition leader,
and then he ended up as Prime minister. If you're sitting in a airport and you bought yourself an economy ticket and you're traveling with your family, and you get to the airport and you get to the check in gate, or you get to the lounge and someone says, can mister Albin Easy come to the front counterplease, and you're upgraded? Don't you think to yourself? And I'd be interested in what Matt thinks of this. I'm the Transport minister. Should
I really be taking this? Given the position I hold and the influence I could have on aviation policy in the country.
That's simple.
The other simple point I would make, and I've been upgraded by contus in the past. Most recently I've had to use frequent flyerpoints, but maybe twenty years ago I would have had a couple of upgraded flights unprompted.
You remember them.
I mean I remember a flight where I was upgraded on the way to Ireland because I was covering the capture of drug baron Robert Trimboli and I got plumped in first class by Quantas. The reason I remember it the bloke sitting next to me was Angus Young from ac DC.
I thought all my Christmas had come at once.
I'll never forget that flight for the rest of my life. So you can't just go, oh, well, I can't remember.
It's probably the only time you've ever been upgraded to first class, so of course you'd remember it. But if it's twenty two upgrades or more like Albo's had, you know, maybe it's not so special. Matt Canavan, there's now leagues against your colleague, Bridget Mackenzie. This is perhaps to try and stop a Senate inquiry from happening, because it would open up once again. You know the possibility that Alan Joyce would be.
Recalled, well, no doubt.
I mean the issue here is that the problems hasn't been able to answer simple questions about his own actions, so he straight away went to singing Martin others, including the author of his book. He incorrectly said he hadn't disclosed matters. Now they're going after, of course, coalition colleagues. There's no allegation here against my colleague though that Senam McKenzie in any way solicited gifts in a way that Anthony Albenizi did as Minister for Transport.
That is the key issue here.
And he still hasn't given a definitive answer about whether he or any of his staff ever had contact with Quantas about that, these denials are not really believable.
All right, Matt Canavan, Steve Price, thank you both very much. Now, my big interview with Boris Johnson coming up after the break. But now let's cross to one of the key battleground states in the United States, Pennsylvania, with our Washington correspondent, Analise Nielsen.
I spoke with her a little earlier. Annalise, thank you so much for your time.
Donald Trump has just announced he's suing over voter suppression.
Can you tell us more about this.
Suing?
And one the judges just made the ruling a short time ago. Essentially, the issue they were talking was voters who were in line in Bucks County.
For early voting.
So how it happens here in Pennsylvania, And remember in America, it's different in every state the rules around voting, and each county local level gets to set how those rules are administered. So in Bucks County they found that they had enormous numbers of people lining up to cast.
Their early ballots.
How it happens here is you line up, you get your mail ballot, the same one that would be mailed.
Out to you.
But many Pennsylvanians have been saying they haven't been receiving their mail in ballots, they've been getting lost in the mail. So they go line up, get handed a ballot, they can fill it in on the spot, hand it back to them, and their ballots cast early.
So what happened was they had so many people.
On line, the local officials early in the afternoon said that's it, you're done, go home. And people in line had the right to be there until five PM and anyone in line at five pm, no matter how far away it was, even if it took hours to get them through, if you're in line by five pm, you should have the right to vote. And so this is what the Trump campaign sued over and one a judger said, yes, these voters were disenfranchised when we kicked them out of line.
So now they have additional.
Days throughout the week to go do this early voting ahead of voting next week on Tuesday in person, which is the last chance for people to vote here in Pennsylvania.
We've seen Joe Biden's garbage comment where he basically called half of America, all of the Trump supporters garbage. Kamala Harris now trying to distance herself from this.
Will this hurt her campaign?
Do you think in a similar way to Hillary Clinton's basket of deplorable comment really damaged hers.
Well, Look, one of the things that we're looking at here is the fact it's happened late in the game. We're only six days out from the presidential election here, so many Americans have already cast their ballots. About a third the last time I looked of people who are likely to vote have cast their ballot. But the issue is they have been putting forward this idea that they are the party that's going to bring people together and
it's Donald Trump who's divisive. So when you have Kamala Harris in this iconic rally outside the White House trying to draw the comparison to January sixth, at the same time, you have Joe Biden inside just calling Donald Trump's supporters garbage and then trying to walk it back through the press office. People pick up on that, and we've heard from that, We've heard that from people on the ground
here in Pennsylvania today. This is one of the critical battleground states for both campaigns to try to win the electoral College vote. So yes, it will absolutely cut through. And what the real issue is that I think hasn't been emphasized enough in all this is the fact that this is the problem the Harris campaign has had from the get go, where they're trying to separate themselves from Biden.
He's been leaving days open.
According to Axios, and they've been leaving him hanging because they don't want him on the campaign trail with him, he's seen as the live ability and he's left to his own devices like this, and it does cause these issues fractures because people realize that she's been working with him for four years and they realize that he's got issues with his cognitive abilities.
At the moment, his memory.
And it is that just absolute juxtaposition that we're seeing we have this new start and at the same time we've got Joe Biden still in this position doing these things when people know there's a problem.
Annalie's you know, we're just days out, as you said, six days to go. Can you take us through where the poles are at the moment, especially in those seven battleground swing states.
Look, this is one of the really fascinating things with the poles.
At the moment, they're just neck and neck. We're just seeing fifty to fifty splits. We're seeing poles will come out with a few points here and there.
For either campaign.
It looks like Donald Trump's pulling ahead, but we're still within the margin of error.
And I can tell you from having been on the.
Ground for the last five weeks almost talking to people in battleground states, the polls are exactly what we're seeing on the ground. People aren't enthusiastic either way. People are feeling very downtrodden about the whole thing, and I think that's really interesting when we compare it to twenty twenty, when there was so much friction, people were feeling passionate.
We've had anecdotes from across the country of people not having as many signs stolen out of their yards, of bartenders telling us they don't have to break up as many political fights as they used to because people aren't feeling overwhelmed about either candidate. But what we also compare that to is the early voting. We are breaking records across the country. Georgia alone is such a huge indicator, and what we saw in Pennsylvania as well is the number of people who've been voting early.
It's drastically.
There's a drastic uptick for Republicans, and that is a huge change from twenty twenty, when they were told stay home, don't go to the polls early, do it one day in person, otherwise you can't trust it. Now they're being told, do whatever it takes to get your voting early.
We'll have the other later. And it looks like it's working for the Republicans all right.
Analys Nielsen really appreciate your time joining us from the ground in Pennsylvania. Coming up after the break, Boris Johnson's take on Donald Trump, his final conversation with the Queen, why Emmanuel mccron hates his dog, and the reason he felt it was his duty to have so many children. That's right after this quick break, welcome back. Well, he's one of the most colorful and controversial public figures of our time. Brilliant intellectual, Oxford educated and orator, but he's
also wildly funny and entertaining. Former British PM Boris Johnson rose to fame globally backing Brexit, but his time in office was often controversial. He'll open up about all of this when he visits Sydney and Melbourne in December, and I spoke with him ahead of his Australian tour a little earlier today.
Boris Johnson, so great to see you. Thank you for your time.
It's an absolute pleasure to be with you.
Look, it's less than a week to go until the US election. Donald Trump famously asked to raise a may in front of the cameras. Why you weren't Prime Minister at the time. Would you like to see Donald Trump return to the presidency.
Well listening, it's very very sweet of you to have me on your show, and it's why we'll be here. But as I explained in my book Unleashed, which I will be relentlessly plugging when I get over to Australia in the early part of December, the job of the UK Prime Minister is to be friendly with whoever is the president of the United States. But you will also discover in Unleashed some paradoxical and interesting things about what
Donald Trump was like to work with. And it kind of goes against a lot of the negative stuff that you sometimes hear about Donald Trump, because my experiences of him as Foreign Secretary, when I was Foreign Secretary and then when I was Prime Minister was actually he did some stuff that was bold and decisive and that really
made the world feel safer. And a couple of things i'll cite and there they're all in the in the book, But the way he punished Basha rah Sad for using chemical weapons against his own people, the way he was really tough with Iran with customs. Solimani, the head of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard, coulds fortunate he more is vaporized. The guy there was only his signet ring left. And then you know, people talk a lot about about Donald Trump and is he going to be soft on Putin?
Has he got this kind of strange thing that's going on in the Republican Party where they kind of have a fanboy you know thing about Putin which I personally don't share at all.
I don't think.
And you look at what Trump actually did on the Russian file when he was president from twenty sixteen to twenty twenty. You know that two things I would single out that were incredibly important. He decided after we had the terrible poisonings in Salisbury, Trump massively surprised on the upside and the United States expelled sixty Russian diplomats, which was the biggest expulsion since the bigger than any I
think that had happened even in the Cold War. And that was Donald Trump who did that kicked out put Inspired. And number two, you know a lot of people talk about Trump and Ukraine, is you're going to be solid, what's going to happen? I just remind you what he actually did when he was president. Unlike and it's all in unleashed. You will read it and I'll be talking about it on Boris Unleashed dot com.
When I get to Australia.
What he actually did was to give the Ukrainians lethal weaponry, which the Democrats had not done when they were in office. And Donald Trump actually gave the Ukrainians the shoulder launched javelin anti tank weapons, which was so important in that battle for kievn in the spring of twenty twenty two.
So all I can say, you know, people, and you know, it's not the job of UK prime ministers to get involved in or UK politicians to get involved in American elections any more than we would get involved in Australian elections.
You know.
It's just we're great, you know, friendly democracies. It's not how we do things. But I would just say, you know, chapter and verse in here, there's some pretty surprising and paradoxical things about you know, what people say about Trump and what he actually did when when he was in office, and I'm content and I'm optimistic to judge him on.
The basis of what he did. That doesn't mean that, you know, I didn't have a very high.
Regard for Joe Biden as well a good relationship with Kamala Harris and Biden's been very strong on Ukraine in particular.
But you know, look at the.
Record, Boris, do you think there's been an unfair campaign to try put Donald Trump in jail so that he can't be president again?
I think it was a Look, I mean, you know, the.
Various legal cases have wound their weary way before the courts, and my impression of them is that they were essentially trying to deprive the people of the opportunity of voting on Donald Trump. And it was a kind of lawfair
designed to take out a candidate. And now you know, again, you know, shoot me if you think this is this is too too optimism, But it was they were trying to take out a candidate that a lot of people don't like, think is has you know, they don't like his style, don't like the things he does, and think the things he says, and like I kind of I kind of get all that, but I think it backfired. And you know whatever, I disagreed very much with what happened on January the sixth.
That was absolutely terrible.
On the other hand, look at what is happening now, and as.
We talk, we're early days.
Away from an election in the United States where Donald Trump is out competing for every vote that he can get. He's trying to win another term in office, as is Kamela Harris trying to win the presidency. And they're both trying by purely democratic means to secure popular support.
And here's the incredible thing. We don't know.
Neither of us knows. I nobody knows, not even I'm here in New York. But nobody knows who is going to win that election. That that is a fantastic thing. Because there are countries, big and important countries in this world. Powerful country is where that is not true, where the outcome of so called democratic elections are well known in advanced Look at Russia, look at China.
You were with the Queen two days before she sadly passed away. You saw the Queen for an hour most weeks. You talk in the book about pouring your heart out. You describe it as free psychotherapy. What was the best advice she ever gave you?
The convention is, of course, you can't really talk about.
A lot of the conversations you have with the Queen.
You can't certainly can't talk about any political conversations.
That you have with her.
But I think without breaking my privy cancel if I can, well, I can say what she said in her last conversation with me, which was two days before she died, and she was absolutely brilliant.
She maintained her total grip on world affairs. And you know, she'd seen every.
US Prime minister since Eisenhower, she'd sorry US president since Eisenhower. She'd she met every French president from charld de girl to to Macron, every Chinese Zena since since mal and she knew everything.
What did she say?
She said, she said, a great thing in life is is not to be is not to be bitter. Because she in the last conversation, I was sort of saying, well, you know, because you know, one of the reasons I'm giving this interview to you now is I was untimely removed from my job. And you know, one of the points I'm making unleash is a great, great shame, because I think we would have won the won the twenty
twenty four election if that hadn't happened. But you know, she was saying to me, well, you know, it's very important in life not to be bitter, and she was saying that it was good that I didn't seem to be at all bitter, and I wasn't and I'm not. So she said, don't be bitter point number one good advice to all politicians. Don't be better, don't be actuated by by bitterness. But she also said something quite interesting. I don't know whether do you have a phobia of
magpies in Australia? Does anybody have a phobia? Do you have a phobia of magpies?
I've seen magpie season in September and they do swoop and you see cyclists, particularly in the National Capital camera cycling round with you know, buckets and funny things on their head to avoid the swooping magpies.
Yes, really, Okay, Well, so there's a say in England one for sorry, too for joy, three for a girl, four for a boy. Right, so if you see a single magpie, it's bad luck. And I there lots of people who I know who have this phobia of single magpies. And I mentioned this to her Majesty, her Late Majesty, the Queen, and she said she had exactly the same thing, but she had.
A cure for it, She had a spell, she had a way.
Of dealing with it, and it was when she saw a solitary magpie, she would say, good morning, mister magpie. Today is the thirtieth of October twenty twenty four or whatever it is today.
I think it is twenty hundred four.
And that does it, and then your single magpie problem is gone.
The magpie conversation came up in your final ever conversation with the Queen two days before she passed away. Boris Johnson, you are quite hilarious. I understand that the Royal family tried to get you personally to persuade Prince Harry to stay in the UK and not move to the United States.
They asked you to give him a manly pep talk. How did that go down?
I honestly can't remember the genesis of this idea, and I think it may have been my own sheer pomposity that made me think that I could persuade because I like Harry and I like Meghan too, And when I was Foreign Secretary, I did a great event with them about educating young women and girls around around the world, because there's a catastrophe of the disparity between male and female education in some countries is appalling and could fix so many problems in the world if you could fix
that anyway.
Harry and Meghan came and they were they were.
Brilliant, and I tried to persuade him not to go to California and it was pathetic. I wouldn't. I failed to avert Mexit. I took it, but I did deliver Brexit and I'm I'm very proud of that. And if you want to discover why Brexit worked, and I know it's still controversial lots of people yet.
If you want to discover why.
Brexit work, rely Unleashed and and please come to some of the Boris Unleashed dot com events that are that are taking place in Australia in early in early early December.
Okay, don't go anywhere. The rest of my interview with Boris Johnson is up next.
After the break.
He's going to speak about keeping orcus A sacred from Emmanuel Macron, the waiver of anti Semitism, swaping the globe, and what regrets about the COVID lockdowns. As you can see, he's quite indiscreet. Also, he talks about why he has.
So many children. Don't miss it. Just a quick break. Welcome back.
I'm gonna return to Albaneze's Quantus scandal a bit later. But now here's Boris Johnson speaking about why he has so many children, his regrets about the pandemic and anti Semitism. I want to cover a few areas, so I just want to take you to the setting up of ORCUS, very important initiative that's to your credit and to Scott Morrison's Before your meeting with Joe Biden to get him over the line on ORCUS, you and Scott Morrison made the decision not to tell Emmanuel mccron about it.
You didn't trust him.
Well, it wasn't quite like that.
The trouble was, if you remember, everybody I hope in Australia knows this the background of this. This is a very important initiative because from my point of view, it was a way that the UK and the United States could support Australia and to build a coalition of freedom loving democracies that share our values and trust each other. So implicitly and so intimately. They were willing to share very very secret details of nuclear technology and other technologies.
And that's what Aucus is all about. It's all about the submarines.
And so the problem was as everybody knows that the deal had been done between Australia and the French for the French to supply some diesel submarines and these were frankly too noisy. They went, they went suitable for Australia's purposes, and they needed some vessels, some boats that were quieter,
and they wanted nuclear propulsion. They came to us, and look, I mean, in order to give the technology to Australia, the UK clearly had to get the acquiescence of the United States, because the technology ultimately comes from from the US, and the US is very vigilant in guarding those secrets. And so before we could go ahead and do the Orcrest deal, and before we could before before Australia could let Emmanuel Macron down, we had to make sure that
we had our ducks in a row. We had to make sure that the the Joe Biden, the President of the United States, was willing to share that technology not
just with the UK, but also with Australia. So that you're quite right, that meant there was a period in which we were very worried that the deal would get out and Emmanuel would be furious, and a lot of a lot of paint would come off, the plaster would come off the ceiling in the in the palace, and he would, you know, he would do de de la pousset, as we say in French.
And and you know, and.
So there was so as I say, I should have mentioned it, I say in this, in this this book unleashed.
The there was a period.
Well you were.
Worried he try and kill off the deal before it was done, That's what you say in the book. And that he didn't like your dog either, Emmanuel macran.
Well, I, well, I don't know he was he my dog unfortunately barked during a very during a very moment of of sort of Anglo French solemn.
Ceremony.
I offered a manual, my doctor hold but he he mysteriously declined the honor.
Of holding Dylan. But look, I mean, I don't want to trivialize this.
You know, the relationships between France and the UK, as with France and with the UK and Australia are incredibly strong. And actually there were many many things where Emmanuel and I agreed.
But the problem with Orcus was it was really you.
It was for Scott, It was for Australia to let a Manuel down.
It wasn't my secret to share with him. As it were.
It was something that Australia, you know, needed to sort out. But I couldn't see any other way of organizing it. So we had a slightly peculiar summit.
Baris Johnson, you know you were widely loved, You had wide popular support in Britain after Brexit, but during the COVID pandemic you were widely criticized, not just for party Gate. If you had your time again, would you still have the full lockdowns, the bands on children going to school's even playground, and the vaccine mandates.
It's such a brilliant question, and I guess everybody in Australia asks them.
We all ask ourselves that now.
But you know, and a lot of people now with hindsight, say your locked down was wrong.
Not I go through a lot of the arguments.
I try to look at the evidence in unleashed and to discuss it all. But you've really got to ask yourself, what would we do if we had another one and we will get another one, and what will we do if this time the most vulnerable people weren't people who were in their agies. But what if it was school kids, you know, what would we really do to try to stop transmission?
And it is incredibly difficult.
I think that it's very easy to say that lockdown was overdone and a mistake and that we should have done something else, But that is not how it felt
at the time. But what I am particularly proud of, and really Brexit did help deliver this is that the UK had the fastest vaccine rollout of any European country, and that was at least partly largely because we had come out of the European Union's institutions and we licensed those vaccines ASTROZENEKA, FISO the rest of them four or five weeks maybe more before the twenty seven EU countries, and so that meant that by March twenty twenty one,
we were way, way, way out in front. And indeed, as you will discover in this book, it was the cause of considerable frustration on the part of our European friends. But there are many things I would do I would do differently, but I think that that vaccine roll out was certainly one of the things I'm proud to stop. And no doubt at all Brexit, for all its critics, Brexit helped deliberate Brexit. My friends saved lives and people may dispute that, but read this book and you'll see why.
You went to Israel.
After October seven with Scott Morrison in a solidarity visit in London. We saw tens of thousands of people take to the streets pro Palestinian marches that began before Israel's response had even started. There's been violence and aggression on the streets. Baris what's gone wrong here? Is this partly an immigration failure as some have suggested.
No, Look, it's a terrible thing, which is that I was very proud to go with Scott to Israel to.
See what had happened.
And look, the trouble is that in all our societies, whether it's Australia, whether it's the UK, whether it's the United States of America, there is a virus of anti Semitism, the spores of which lurk beneath the floorboards.
And it comes out.
And you know, as soon as remember what happened on October the seventh, twelve hundred people were massacre tortured an appalling innocent Jewish people. And what I find amazing now is that people can't focus on the reality that Israel is legitimately trying to prevent that type of massacre from happening again.
And the people that.
Did it, whether her mass or other, they they want to eradicate Israel entirely, and not just Israel, but every Jewish person in the world. And frankly, any democratic leader is entitled to try to protect his or her country from that that sort of madness. And so yeah, look, I'm firmly with Israel in their in their right to self protection. And you know, I wish everybody had had a bit more moral clarity about this, and I.
Agree with you completely.
It was weird to see demonstrations the day after that massacre effectively in favor.
Of her act.
It's been absolutely terrible the world over, including in Australia, as you'll see when you get here.
In a couple of months time.
But Boris Johnson, we've covered a lot of ground, was foreign policy politics.
I want to ask you a.
Final personal question, though, there is a great mystery about you, something so simple.
How many children do you have.
Till? It's eight? Eight? So far?
Yeah, so far, So there still might be others on the horizon.
I didn't say that it's just eight eight eight, which you know. What I would say about that is I've been wrapped up. My handles are telling my going to shut up. But I'll tell you we do face a demograph, a demographic deficit in in the UK and many other western countries as well. So I feel that, in spite of the carbon footprint that I'm undoubtedly generating, I think it's a it's a perfectly defensible thing to do.
Boris Johnson, thank you very much for your I'm great to.
Speak with you, real pleasure, lovely to talk to you. Thank you very much and look forward to seeing you in a few weeks time.
And as Boris Johnson just mentioned, he'll be in Australia shortly. If you want to see more of him, head to Boris Unleashed dot com. You can book tickets for his Sydney event on Friday the sixth of December and in Melbourne on Saturday the seventh of December. That's it, Boris Unleashed dot com.
I like that line about a demographic deficit.
All right, still to come pro Palestinian protesters no bounds, nearly ruining a packed out concert for a sold out show, not the time and place, plus it's all a bit deja vous, fatanya plebisec and we'll return to the Quantus.
Scandal that with my panel next.
Okay, let's bring you now News dot Com Deputy editor Liz Burke and The Australians Associate editor Graham. Lloyd, Liz Graham, great to see you both. Look, let's return to the biggest political story of the week, the Quantus scandal. The Prime Minister has been refusing all interview requests, no press conferences now.
For two days.
He didn't want to take questions because the last time he did he got into a muddle, saying he called some number for upgrades. Liz, your team has been covering this story in a major way.
Are Australians angry.
About the idea of their prime minister getting twenty two upgrades during a cost of living crisis?
That's definitely what our readers are telling us.
They're angry about the perks themselves, and they also seem to be quite angry about the messaging. It's really difficult to ascertain whether Albo is issuing denials or justifications, and I think part of that is that you know that lack of willingness to engage, particularly over the last couple of days. What we do know is that Australians are really engaged on this issue. One in two Ozzie's reads
News dot com dot Au. So I think what our readers are engaging in it is a really good because you're a really good idea of what people are actually interested in. And since this story emerged, Sam Maidan's exclusives on these upgrades have been among the top stories every day all week. So that gives you a really good idea of just how engaged people are.
So I found it astounding.
Today when it was reported that Albo had been telling colleagues in private that, you know, he was dismissing this issue as a media concoction, that it was something that was going.
To blow over.
What our readers are telling us is that it's something that readers are absolutely engaged on and they're pretty angry about.
Yeah, because the perception is starting to cement that he likes a freebee, that he likes the life of luxury, that he doesn't understand how tough Australians are doing it. But Graham, the bottom line is Albert Easy took upgrades worth tens of thousands of dollars from Quantus when he had oversight of the airline industry.
It's a conflict of interest.
It's completely fraught the whole issue, and it cuts through in a way that a few other issues do because look, honestly, everybody would like to sit up the front of the plane. And this is the problem for mister ALBINIZI is that he's indulged in this at a time when it presents a conflict of interest, which raises the question what was Quantus expecting from its policy to upgrade politicians, what oversight was there on that, and was there an ethical consideration at all?
M all right, let's have a look at Melbourne now, because pro Palestinian protesters have tried to hijack a concert. You're going to have to forgive me. I don't know the name of this person radio Heads. I'm not a music person. Is it Tom York? Tom York?
Okay, let's have a look what happened stage, I say what you want to say.
Don't stand there, money, charl and everyone come there and say it. Everybody's name. Well, let's say a sidez Oh.
I don't know Tom yok, but I like him a lot. Liz The truth is Australians are just so sick of this. People paid a lot of money to go see an artist they have to deal with something that they probably don't agree with being shoved in their face.
Yeah, absolutely, you're right. People paid a lot of money. I think the minimum prices of these tickets were about one hundred and twenty bucks to be within shouting distance of the artist, you know, like which you would assume that the person who was able to grab his attention would be this person who came to protests probably paid around two hundred dollars to do that and to ruin everyone else's night.
I actually find it really.
Sad that people come to events like this and try and get this kind of reaction and try to engage with this. I think anyone who engages with this conflict knows that, you know, you're just constantly bombarded with misery and with devastation. The people who are making these protests are often the same people who you know, claim to
stand for peace. So I actually find it really sad that they, you know, also are then trying to deny people of ninety minutes that's how long the show went for of peace, and you know, to enjoy something beautiful.
Yeah, one hundred percent, Graham. There's a time and a place. You know, we don't all have to agree. People have a right to protest, but stop ruining plays and concerts please.
Try.
And the thing about art shari is it supposed to transcend politics. It's supposed to be something that can allow people to retreat into themselves and inspect the world protesting and calling out it's just this is the work of Bulgarians.
Yeah.
Indeed, okay, very quickly before we go, Liz thirty seconds the Queensland Premier. New Queensland Premier David Chris Fully, he's now delivering on his adult crime for adult time. So this is where youths are given adult penalties. This has got to be very popular in Queensland.
Yeah, it's been massively popular.
It was a big cornerstone of the obviously very successful Queensland election campaign. And so Christo fully now believes that he has a mandate to enforce these laws. He's fast tracking them to get them in in time for Christmas. It means that rather than you know, six weeks of being before parliamentary committees, they'll only be scrutinized for one week, and for something that probably every expert and interested party in Queensland has already weighed in on.
That seems like the right thing to do.
Yeah right, Liz Burke, Graheme Lloyd. Great to see you both and that's all we've got time for tonight. I'll see you on Monday. It's going to be a big week of US election coverage.
Don't miss it. Here's kayleb Bond