Live on Sky News.
This is Sharry.
Good Evening and welcome to the program.
I'm Danikiti Giorgio filling in this evening for Sharry markson coming up on the program. The father who broke down on National TV over the housing crisis camps outside the PM's cliff top mansion. Everyone deserves a home, albow is what he's saying.
Got to say.
It's hard to argue with that. The climate wars are back done in an elbow. Pressed on whether climate change has triggered recent natural disasters?
Is this what voters seriously care about right now?
The negative gearing stoush that's dominated the day's headlines.
Can't wrap your head around what all the fuss is about?
Will walk you through it, Plus will go live to the UK where JK. Rowling is celebrating after a landmark UK Court decision said a woman is someone born biologically female. But first tonight, voters in this election are more disillusioned than ever now. The election campaign is about to enter alull over the Easter long weekend, followed by Anzac Day next week, which leaves about eight days until election day.
At the end of all that, and what does it mean?
Well, voters are largely tuned out because they're on holidays, and you mix that in with pre polling opening on Tuesday, and it doesn't really leave a lot of time to convince undecided voters, and the polls show there are a.
Lot of them.
But the question remains, does the average voter right now care or even know about the policies on the table from the major parties now? The latest polls show that Labor is headed for a minority, which is obviously a disaster for this country. But I think there's a real messaging problem this election campaign and from both sides, because voters don't like Albo, but.
They don't seem to know enough about Dutton either. Still, and the.
Easter long weekend is bad timing for the opposition already on the back foot, and Peter Dunnan issued this plea to voters today.
I hope that over Easter people are able to have a conversation parents, to grandparents and to grandchildren about what the next three years will look like. If mister Elbanezi and mister Bant are elected, it will be a sliding doors moment for our country, an end to negative gearing, higher taxes, higher spending, higher interest rates, the reality of the last three years and how hard it's been and it doesn't need.
To be like this.
And absolutely he's right because labor has left us broke and backwards in the last three years. But compare this to Anthony alb and Easy today whose glass jaw was well, it was on full display yet again as his lies were exposed.
Do you pull out meeting the greens demands on negative gearing if you have to.
Negotiate it, I reel out negotiating with the Greens. That's even further for you. I have responded that lots of times.
Again we get answer.
We have our housing policy that we are taking forward the Greens. I am not negotiating with the Greens. We make it very clear. And what's more, the Greens have said the one negotiable, theat non negotiable thing that they have, by the way, is that they want to support Peter Dutton.
Yeah.
And this is the issue with this Prime Minister because he gets testy and angry when asked questions that he simply doesn't like.
Of course he doesn't want to talk about the.
Greens because he knows he needs them. There are about fourteen seats in this election that are still too close to call, and I think it says a lot about where he's at because there's only one topic that we know he's comfortable.
With, Peter Dutton.
Peter Dunt, Peter Dutton, Peter Dutton, Peter Dutton.
Yeah, it is always about Peter Dutton, isn't it. He's so obsessed with Peter Dutton or everything else that really actually has nothing to do with the cost of living crisis, not housing, not bringing power bills down by two hundred and seventy five dollars, not immigration, not security, not defense, not anti semitism, and overall I did think that Peter Dutton was the stronger performer in the leader's debate last night.
He was fired up, he was on message, he caught elbow on the hop for his lies, and was straight to the point on the cost of living crisis.
But there were no knockout blows.
And this is the problem right now in this campaign because quite frankly, the campaign is boring, it is dull, and it's been largely unengaging for undecided voters and is reflecting in the polls. Swing and soft voters are the
cohort who decide elections. And this time around there are more of that group than ever before, and Labour's support remains much softer than the coalitions more than half of its voters, so fifty seven percent say they were only soft or leaning toward Labor, compared to thirty eight percent of the Liberal and National Party's vote. So it really
makes interpreting the poll numbers more difficult. But that is the cohort that Peter Dutton must now convince because these are the voters that can indeed be persuaded.
And the question is what messages from the leaders.
Are actually sticking and how many people actually know what is on offer. Last night's debate on the Public Broadcaster unfortunately largely focused on overseas issues, and the media today chose to focus on negative gearing. Now Alberizi is so confused on this he couldn't give a straight answer to the question about whether he modeled to scrap negative gearing,
and obviously it's important that his lies are exposed. But the reality is is that mum and dad, who are struggling at home to put food on the table, I would say probably could not give a rats.
About negative gearing right now.
It is not the story and This was, in my view, the key takeaway from that debate which should worry us all. When Anthony Alberzi was asked multiple times when he would bring power bills.
Down, When will we see our power bills come down?
They are well, what we know is that renewables are the cheapest form of power, not because of what we say, but because of what the Australian Energy Market operator says when the bills come down, and what the market is delivering. See, Peter has to have government, state, taxpayer funded. We stick with your taxpayer funded, taxpayer funded proposals. What we're dealing with here. During the former government, twenty four out of twenty eight coal fire power stations announce their closure. We
need to get supply and certain in energy security. We can't wait till the twenty forties a nuclear.
Just stick with your plan, mister Albinezy, When will the bills come down under our plan?
We know that renewables are the cheapest form of power and that is why we are doing that, rolling it out, including through gas. Peter Ray's gas gas is now thirteen dollars, was thirty dollars. And when we catch cheap when we kind off thirteen is cheaper than thirty.
When do we see the bills come down?
How many more times do you need to be asked?
And the answer, oh, thirteen is cheaper than thirty, Well, how about two hundred and seventy five dollars? Prime Minister? How many times does he need to deflect and dodge? What is the question of the election? And this just shows Albow seriously has no idea about the cost of living crisis, has no idea how to bring power bills down, and has no plans to keep the lights on in this country and clearly is dead set on plunging us
into darkness through this renewables only fantasy. Three years ago Albow pledged ninety seven times to bring our power bills down by two hundred and seventy five dollars.
We haven't had that relief.
Instead, power bills have risen by thirteen hundred dollars and the Energy market Operator says bills will rise by nine percent from July. And that should be enough to make Albo a one term. That should have been the focus today and this is the message the Coalition needs to keep hammering. But as I said, the messaging fills off in this campaign. Voters are disengaged and both sides are
struggling big time with their primary vote. Now, look, I've got to say, I think it's got a lot to do with the largely controlled settings in which we are seeing these leaders in these debates, which are tightly controlled, the type press conferences in certain areas long gone. Are these days, for example, when you actually see their leaders, they're out and about, out in the real world. You can't miss these sorts of opportunities when they're out and about,
and that's how you engage with the real voters. That's how you meet the people, that is how you gauge the sentiment, and that is how you put your election commitments on the front page of the papers. But now they're trying to avoid any bad moments and not to mention the heightened security. It's all very fake in control right now, and it's certainly not going to win over
the undercided voter in what is a boring campaign. And to those who are already confused by the major parties, do voters care about the policies or they're easter break right now?
And I think we know the answer.
Joining us now is Sky News contributor Gary Hardgrave and.
WA opposition leader Basil Zemplus. Great to have you.
Both on the show tonight. Thank you so much for joining me.
Gary.
Look, as I just said, there is a massive soft vote right now, one that we haven't seen in many, many elections in recent memory. There are a lot of undecided voters. Can Peter Dutton get them on side with really not a lot of time to go because of the public holidays we've got coming up, Deniga.
The shocking thing is that one in five voters walk into a polling booth on a polling day, pick up the pencil and say, I don't quite know. So you know, there's nothing unusual in this. I've been through multiple federal election campaigns over since I was fourteen, so over the last fifty years, and these things are getting drawn out and tedious in the minds of good people like you, and understandably so. But a lot of people still don't
make their mind up until the last minute. Look, this weekend is important for millions, in fact, billions of people around the world. This is the weekend of the resurrection. This is what people want to talk about this weekend. So I'm praying for a political resurrection as well for the Liberal Party campaign, because we have to have people look very closely at the one question, and that is are you better off than you were three years ago?
Simple answer, no. You talk about the two hundred and seventy five dollars off your bill, that's each power bill. I don't know what it's like where you are, but where I am in Queensland quarterly bills. So there's been a dozen of them that I haven't had any relief on. As you say, the price has gone up, I am not. No one is better off than they were three years ago. And the Prime Minister's oblivious to this. It's double talk,
it's spin, it's controlled, it's rubbish. And Peter Dunn't is not Albow that is actually the biggest thing going for him in the minds of a hell of a lot of people. Albo's got to go. We'll just see what happens whether the miracle of Easter transposes into the political world.
Well, hopefully for that resurrection. As you just said, you're right. And the problem is is that voters don't like Albo. He is lied one too many times. But on the other end, they don't really know a lot about Peter dunn't either, and.
Basil, this is why it's reflecting in the polling.
Why do you think that parties are struggling so much with their primary votes and why is that soft vote so big this time?
Yeah, hard to know him for sure, but clearly there is a level of disengagement. And I do agree with you the stop start natured of this campaign. Firstly the natural disaster that put a stop and put a stop to the first start, and then clearly this long weekend and then the ANZAC day long weekend, it hasn't been particularly useful for people to get their momentum up. There is no doubt that the fuel saving has been the one big announcement, if you like, from the Liberal and
coalition that has made a difference and has resonated. And so I wonder over the eight days that remain, might Peter Dutton go to another measure like that or might he have something like that ready to pull out because it is going to take something like that, There's no doubt the coalition.
Of the underdogs.
I agree, and I really like Peter Dutton's messaging on that today he said very firmly in his press conference he said we're.
Going to save you money. And with the money that we're going to save.
You, you can go out and you can put it towards your groceries. And I just thought that that was a really, really smart line. We need to hear more of that short, simple and smart messaging.
But look, let's move on.
Because a Sydney dad of three kids who recently broke down on Q and A about the dire state of cost of living and housing, well, he's decided to camp outside Albow Mansion and have a look at this.
I'm here at Elbows four and a half a million dollar mansion just during down his one hundred million dollar road. We're here on behalf of three and a half a million other Australians who are struggling, who are in poverty, facing homelessness. All we want is to be heard. All we want is for the politicians to listen to us.
Everybody deserves a home Albow. If you're watching this, if you could go to cost of Living Casualties dot com dot au and just tell us your story, we'd love to hear it, and we'd love to pass it on to some of those politicians and just let them know how we're really struggling. And I just hope that we can make this country a better place to live.
And on Q and A last month, when he broke down about his situation, have a look at these we've got.
Nowhere to go.
My family's already been forced out of Sydney for the same reasons. I want to know, is the government going to cut immigration to match housing availability or are we just going to keep going until every regular working Australian is homeless.
You're former treasure Gary, what does it take for Anthony Arbernezi to actually answer this question? Because nobody ever voted for a big Australia, Yet here we are a big Australia. More than one million migrants have come into this country and you've got genuine people out there like this man who want to know how he's going to get himself into housing.
It's a question he must answer.
And he's right because that's what Peter Dutton said. Let's actually bring in the migrants to match the housing we've got available, not try and play catch up. One point eight million people are forecast to come to Australia the next three years if Albow and the Greens are returned. Simple as that one point eight million people. Now, I'm all for migration, but we've got a planet in a way that we don't create resentment amongst those of us who've been here for a longer period of time. And
that's the problem to niaque. For what purpose is our migration? Are we going to bring in the trade skills? We need to build the houses before we bring in the people who are going to live in the houses. These are questions the Prime Minister doesn't want to answer. I mean equally, you know, I don't believe at Elbows million dollar mansion that this chappy is outside of and good on him for doing that. I don't believe he's going
to get a wind turbine there. And yet people all along the Morton Bay coastline, in and around southeast Queensland, all along central Queensland, in and around the Darling Downs are putting up with these dreadful industrialized wind turbines twenty five million dollars a unit, ripping down trees, killing Kohala is displacing them all for this renewable rubbish which is going to produce about a half of one percent of electricity for Queensland. This governor has lost its way. It's
on the wrong track. It's pretty simple.
Yeah, it's pretty simple. It is.
When you've got people like this who are forced to camp out basil outside of the mansion, you know, it's a pretty major indictment on the state.
Of our times.
Well it is, and it's an indictment on Labour's housing policy, which clearly has not delivered the new homes that it said it would. On the messaging like that and the amp out and the big sign out the front, I'm not doubting the authenticity of it. There's certainly great sympathy I think from people right around Australia for anybody who finds themselves in that situation. I'm not certain though, if it has a major impact on either.
Of our political leaders.
And I think those things, although well intentioned, as I say, probably very genuine, I'm not sure that they make their mark in terms of what they're trying to achieve. There is a mechanical failure with our housing policy.
That's what needs to be fixed.
And although that brings some attention to the issue, I wonder whether it really penetrates.
Yeah, that's certainly a fair comment.
Let's talk about Peter Dutton's this eleventh hour pledge he's made and aspiration to tackle that dreaded bracket creep will obviously universally resent.
Here is what he told the Australian newspaper.
I want to see us move as quickly as we can as a country to changes around personal income tax, including indexation. It would be an aspiration of it government to achieve that because it provides equity in the tax system and it's costly to do so. Some of the figures are well over ten billion dollars a year in terms of the cost of the budget for that measure, and it's not realistic to be able to.
Commit to that now.
Gary, I think this is a really bold policy. It's about time we had some big vision policy on the table. But I guess the other thing is is that is it too little too late? I mean, why not say this at the start of the campaign? Why say it halfway through? Because this election is coming up very quickly on May third?
What's the strategy here?
And voting starts Tuesday for a lot of people and can't come soon enough for plenty of others.
Look, this is what we did and how it is.
We paid down Labour's debt. We reminisce now about the ninety three billion dollar debt that we inherited in nineteen ninety six, So if it was only that small now and then we got on to structural reform. Peter Dutton's experience in this he was in the ministry working with Peter Costello. A lot of this structural reform around the tax system, bringing down the absolute amount of tax we're paying is really critical. Yes, the GSD came in, but personal income tax then gives you the choice to spend
it as you see fit. You pay tax on that consumption and that system. No one is complaining about that anymore, and nor should they, because this actually rewards effort. We should be earning and keeping more of our money. If we want to work harder, work longer, then we should be able to keep more of that money. And that's the sort of stuff that that that's talking about. And I think a lot of people will say, how bloody Loujah I reckon?
Really, well, well, we've needed a conversation like this. We yet to have one. Basil, do you think that this will resonate with voters?
I think it will. It's been a sort of a cautious and measured approach, hasn't it. Peter Dutton's messaging around this has been we've got a fixed labors mess First, we've got to restore the budget. Once we've got the budget restored, then we will certainly have a look at bracket creep because it's holding back entrepreneur it's holding back productivity.
So I think it's been smart baby steps, get the basics fixed and then move to it, but still acknowledging that there is some ambition in what they want to do. So smart. I think it will resonate. Will it resonate with enough? That's going to be the question.
Yeah, and especially as you said, with pre poll opening on Tuesday.
Now, look, let's talk about the Teals.
Obviously, the Liberals are going back after those traditionally blue ribbon seats that they lost to the Seals, back to the Teals back in twenty twenty two. But nine newspapers today revealed that voters are being targeted by so called push pole calls being conducted by Climate two hundred.
Imagine getting that one.
Here's one spooking Zoey Daniels and Goldstein have a listen.
Since being elected your independent member, Zoe Daniel has advocated.
For long term economic reform.
Protecting the environment, for teacher generations, and for me to be more compassion and integrity in politics. It's about Zoe Daniel. If a federal election was held today, who would receive your first preference vote?
Gary, I would have to hang up the phone.
If I answered and that was on the other end of the line, I'd hang up. But you know, last time I checked, that's not what a pole typically sounds like.
Look, yeah, and I get polder like anybody else, I guess from time to time. Look, this is the American style politics that Anthony Albert Easy claims the Liberals are bringing to Australia. In fact, it's the Labor Party Left and the pseudo Greens, including the Greens. I mean the Teals are Greens in fancy clothing. These people are working as a Troyka Labor, the Teals and the Greens, anything to stop Peter Dutton and to change of the track
Australia is on. So they're bringing these American style approaches to this sort of stuff, and I think a lot of people are over it. You know, they just actually want strong advocates for their area in the Parliament. Wouldn't it be great if we had one hundred and fifty of them in the House of Reps. That's what we would like. And I don't think they need to be
as tricky as they're trying to be. But they're well cashed up and there's a lot of money floating in from I think overseas into a lot of this as well.
Yeah, and also, Basil.
The call also asks if the constituent would be more likely to give their vote to the coalition if the L and P distance itself from this.
Take a listen.
To what extent do you agree or disagree with the following statement. I would be more likely to vote for the Liberal Party if a distance itself from the National Party and the extreme agenda of its MPs like Barnaby Joyce and Matt Cannavan who are posed taking action on climate change and want to roll back abortion rates.
Please, seriously, Basil, correspond to that.
Well, I leave in one of those seats. I live in the federal electorate of Curtain. Tom White is taking on Kate Cheney, so I see it play out in my letterbox every day. Tom White, by his own admissions, is in a real battle. It's very very close, no guarantee which way it will go. Both could win the seat of Curtin. What I will say is the independence the Teals. They claim that one of their monikers is
doing politics differently. In fact, I think they just do politics the way that it's done really well in lots of places around the world. But you could argue they do it better than the major parties in terms of all of the tricks, all of the tactics and all of the sorts of things that we've just heard over the last few minutes. So they don't really do it differently. They know how to play the game and they probably play it just about as well as anyone. I will
say this, I think their nimbleness. I think the fact that they are operating largely as individuals but still with that coalition of finances behind them enables them to do these things just about as well as anybody.
Yeah, I think you're absolutely spot on on that. Basil zemplus Gary Hargrave. Nice to speak to you both. Thank you so much for jeving me on the Happy East.
Thank you haabe well.
Albansi or Dutton, who won last night's leader's debate on the ABC. Both had moments of victory and defeat. But for me, as I said earlier, the real crux of the debate was energy, and I think that that should have been the focus today from the media, but it wasn't.
And that's fine. Negative gearing is important. But here was Anthony Alberanesi's ducking and weaving, and I want to play it again because it's the.
Same nothing to see here style response to what is a pretty straightforward question, when will power bills start to fall?
Our plan? We know that renewables are the cheapest form of power and that is why we are doing that, rolling it out, including through gas Peter Rat's gas. Gas is now thirteen dollars. It was thirty dollars and when we came when we came off, thirteen is cheaper than.
When do we see the bills come down?
Well, what we need to do is to roll out renewable to make sure there's energy security, make sure it's backed up by batteries, by hydro and by gas.
Joiny now is National Senator Matt Canavan. Good to see you, Matt, Thank you so much for joining me. Look here we go again and again OLBO fails to prosecute the case for his fanciful renewables only fantasy.
And who is he kidding here?
How many more times can he lie about the fact that our bills have gone in the other direction?
Well, look, I think the Australian people have realized that that they can't trust the word of Anthony Albanezi. He did promise almost one hundred times to cut your power bills by two hundred and seventy five dollars in his first term, and now he won't even say whether your bills are going to go up, down or sideways. Obviously, given his promises three years ago, and given him saying that renewables are the cheapest form ofst power, the question must be asked is why won't he be able to
say they go down? I mean, if renewable energy is so cheap, why can't he commit that by building more of it as he wants to, your power bills will go down.
And this.
Conundrum at the center of Anthony Alberanze's re election campaign really goes to the heart of what his government has been struggling the last few years. As you say, I think cost of living energy, it's the only game in town. That's what everybody basically talks to you on the street. Whether I'm here in long Reach in Western Queensland people talk about that, or in even inner city seats in Brisbane and Sydney they talk about the cost of living.
Everybody in this country is struggling because this government has failed to deliver on their promises, fail to deliver lower energy prices, and those high energy costs are flowing through to the cost of everything, including ultimately our interest rates because we don't if we don't look after inflation, interest rates go up to Yeah.
Absolutely, it is the conversation of the election campaign. You know, We've got reporters out there every day asking what are you most concerned about, and it's always cost of living and it's always power bills when they are the key issues of this campaign that the messaging needs to be there, Matt. The Opposition was forced to apologize last night over this Russian base saga.
Here is what he said.
You said the Indonesian president had publicly announced this Russian request when he had not, So was that a mistake. It was a mistake and I'm happy to a bit what we got from the Indonesian authorities in the reports and the Prime Minister commited on these reports yesterday as well was that the sources inside the Proboo government confirmed that that was the case.
Look, I still think that Peter Dutton was right to be strong on this from the beginning. I mean, if there is indeed a threat to our national security, then we need to be able to respond accordingly. But what is your thoughts on how Peter Dutton dealt with those developments.
Well, Peter can accept the truth and there are a lot of reports going around. Some of those reports proved to be mistaken yesterday. But what is much worse is the minimization of the risk of this country of the current government in their attempt to throw shade at the opposition leader. I mean, what we do know here is that Russian and Indonesia have been going growing close together.
It seems strange to me that the Prime Minister sorry hasn't been able to admit that while Indonesia just a couple of months ago joined the Bricks Coalition that's the Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa coalition, which is generally seen to be aligned against US interests, a month later, we now have these reports or we have reports that a month later, Russia was asking to base military aircraft just at fourteen
hundred klmeters north of Darwin. And so clearly there are some issues here developing or to our north and the bigger issue for our countries. It doesn't seem it's hard to see how the Albanezi governments in any way responded to that high threat. They or changed geo political environment. They've cut defense spending, they haven't proceeded with the purchase of joint strike fighter aircraft, and they've actually sat by idly and let Indonesia steal our major, key critical minerals issues.
And another promise that Anthony Albernezi has made on top of his broken promise and energy, was to kick start critical minerals in this country. Well, under his watch, we've lost our entire nickel industry, one of the key critical
minerals in electric car batteries, lots of other technologies. We've lost almost our whole nickel industry because we've been sitting back while Indonesia builds coal fired powerstations with Chinese finance, and Anthony Alberanzi consigns our industry or handcuffs them to a green agenda, which increases their costs and we've lost the market share, lost three thousand jobs in our country. That should be the focus of the government. That to me is a much bigger issue this sasaga this week.
It's not what whoever says here and there over twenty four hours. It's how we respond to this changed year political environment over the years ahead. And I don't think the current government has proven that it's got a strong hand, a strong focus on that for the security of our nation.
No, I completely agree with you.
I mean, look what happened when the Chinese warships were conducting live fire drills off the co of our country. You know, a couple of weeks ago, there was this strange back and forth between Pennywong, Richard Marles and Anthony Abernezi, and nobody actually knew what was going on.
When it's a.
Matter of national security, it's the same old saga each time. Matt Canavan, good to catch up with you. Thank you so much for joining me on the show this evening. We'll stay with us after the break. I'm packing today's negative gearing, stoush, the hurling of insults, somatic word games.
What is the world all about?
Stay with us plus exclusive polling reveals Labor minority governments likely, but there is there a chance the coalition could turn this around.
That's next. Welcome back.
Well, one thing that the leader's debate really exposed last night was Anthony Albanesi's lies and it is a saga that has dominated the headlines today, the negative gearing stoush that's got done and alban Ezy trading barbs. Now this started with an apparent debate misstep when the leaders were grilled and why they are both shying away from heavy duty reform on negative gearing and capital gains tax.
To fix the House in crisis.
And you, of course remember last year it came to light that Labor was modeling this stuff because it was a treasurer at the time.
It is not unusual at all for governments or for treasurers to get advice on contentious issues which are in the public domain, including in the Parliament. It is not unusual for treasurers to do that.
Then strolled Elbow last night, contradicting all of that, suggesting it wasn't modeled by the government at all.
Was it modeled, It certainly wasn't commissioned by us to do so.
It was modeled by the government. It was public it's publicly available. This Prime Minister has a problem with the truth.
And so Jim Chalmers was then sent in to mop up the mess.
Today, it should be normal practice, It is normal practice to seek or receive advice on these issues from time to time. We didn't commission modeling. The view from the Treasury is that a change to negative gearing wouldn't get the sort of improvement that we desperately need to see in our economy when it comes to supply, and that's why our focus is not on changing that. Our focus is on building homes.
Yes, so now we're just using the word advice instead of modeling.
That'll do it. That'll clarify absolutely everything.
Joining us now to discuss this is Adam Crichton, the Institute of Public Affairs chief economist and senior fellow. Adam, good to see you, Thank you so much for joining me. Look, this is the story that has dominated the news cycle today. But what is your take on what has happened here?
Well, look, this is obviously something the Labor Party has looked at for many years. They've wanted to crack down on negative gearing. But as a voter and as an economist, I find it very frustrating. I mean this, you know, there's no negative gearing policy if you like, if you look back, you know through Australian politics, no party has introduced negative giving. This is just a fundamental part of the way our tax system works.
It goes back to the.
Nineteenth thirty six Income Tax Act in fact, and it just means that we can write off our losses against our income. That's just the way the Australian system works. There was a brief period in the eighties where the Labor government I think from ninet eighty five to nineteen eighty seven they knocked it on the head and actually rents went up, so it was actually negative for renters at the time. But the reality is this is a
side show. This is not going to change the reality of housing costs for Australians and it's frustrating to see this debate dominate. I mean, this is a story from six months ago, basically, so just a reminder of how boring this election campaign really is.
Asol.
That's exactly what I said at the start of the show, Adam, I think the campaign's boring. Mum and Dad at home who can't pay for their electricity bills, who can't put food on the table, do not give a rats right now about negative gearing. They worry about how they're actually going to pay for things, and that's where the messaging is getting off course.
Look, I want to talk to you about some.
Polling out today in the Daily Telegraph which suggests that minority government is very likely in another back to back blow for opposition later Peter Dutton sixty six seats. Now, that's what Labor is on track to win. By contrast, the Coalition is winning or ahead in fifty five. There's one hundred and fifty seats in the all important Lower House. So Adam it says that there are about fourteen seats now that are looking too close to call. What's your feel on where things are heading here?
Well, look, if you look at the betting markets and you look at the poles, it's not looking great for the coalition, is it. I mean, that's you know, my worst nightmare personally is it's a Labour Greens minority government. And frankly that's probably the most likely outcome at the moment. I mean, if I was Peter Dutton, and you know, I mean I'm not a sopologist, but if I was Peter Dutton, you know, I'd be trying to throw some
grenades out there now. And you know, maybe, for instance, say we'll dump net zero and let's have a real debate, because ultimately zero is the biggest tax on the Australian economy. I mean, forget you know, the Trump tariffs. I mean, that's that's just a nothing. I mean, the biggest tax on Australian economy is by far and away the net zero policy, which is crushing our industry. It's increasing our costs. You know, it's you know, it's fatal to our future prosperity.
But sadly there's no debate about that key issue. And you know, if you look around the world, countries are saying we can't do it without nuclear power. I mean, I think the Coalition needs to be more front footed on nuclear power. They keep getting attacked on it. They don't speak about it anymore. But frankly, I think we're the only G twenty country in the world it does not have nuclear power. So it's kind of crazy we don't,
especially given we have all the uranium. So why doesn't the Coalition go on the front foot on this.
Yeah, we have the minerals on our doorstep, but I completely agree, and yeah, I just find it extraordinary that it's almost been put a little bit on the back burner, this nuclear debate on this for this campaign, and it's meant to be the signature policy. But I want to ask you, though, what is it saying that the price if you look at the primary vote of both parties, still it's not great for both. What does it say about the number of undecided voters still out there.
Well, look, I think you're seeing throughout Western countries and Australia in particular, declining vote for the major parties because people are just dissatisfied with the options that are provided by left and right.
I think it's going to continue.
I mean, if I was a betting man, I would say that in this election you're going to see the lowest primary vote in history of the Coalition and also the Labor Party. And I don't blame people. I mean, I'm going to vote, but you know, I mean my first preference is not going to be one of the two major parties. If you're a thinking person, why would it be. You know, you want someone to do something, you want to fix, you know, to fix Australia's downward spiral.
It's very depressing, you know, we're just we're getting more spending, more regulation, and it's because both major parties. In my view, it's the fall of compulsory voting. You're just going for the median voter who doesn't care, doesn't pay any attention, and you get the exact policies that reflect that.
Yeah, we've got to heap of public holidays coming up too, so it certainly doesn't help the campaign to try and keep people engaged had them. Crichton, nice to see you, Thank you so much for joining me on the show this evening.
We're coming up after the break.
The lawfare continues, a literal state is now suing Donald Trump, would you believe?
And those climate wars, as we just said, they are back.
Albow and Dunton pressed on climate change and their responsors unleash fierce debate.
That's next welcome back.
Well, it looks like the climate wars are back because last night during the leadership showdown, Albo and Dunton were asked whether the natural disasters we've seen recently where the result of climate change?
And here was that exchange.
I don't know, David, because I'm not a scientist, and I can't tell you whether the temperature has risen in Fargaminde as a result of climate change, or that the water levels are up in Fargaminda's latest flood as a result of climate change. And I think the honest answer for most people is that they don't.
Can I talk about the science and be a prime minister who backs it out up? The science is very clear. Doesn't mean that every single weather event is because of climate change. It does mean that the science told us that the events would be more extreme and they'd be more frequent.
He loves the science, doesn't he enjoining us now to discuss the skinys Contributed to Joe Hildebrand and from GT Communications. Helloa, ready, how good is the science?
Science?
Says that this is going to be a great segment. How good is the science? The science is fantastic. I love the science. It's it's like modeling leave in the climate. It's like modeling.
You can get it to say whatever you want. You can get Sien I do. I do completely believe in climate change. But I'm sympathetic to what Peter Dutton said because I have no idea. I mean, I've got you know, I know a good Beatles song when I hear one, because I can understand that because I know music. But I can't I can't tell you whether or not you
know this science adds up or whatever. So you do you just go with whatever people who are smarter than you and more expert than you in that particular field and say, all right, But of course you've also got to have a degree of skepticism as well. We know that experts went a bit far during the pandemic and just turns out turns out they were actually doing things that had no signs behind them at all. But I'm
not a skeptic. But you can see from the look on Albow's face when Peter Dunton said that, he went, gotcha.
Yeah, Well, I just think that people don't care about the climate changed, but they've been lied to.
And I'll tell you why, because you've had al.
Gore who was like, we are all going to die all of the ice caps.
Well, that is true, everyone is going to them.
Did well eventually, obviously, But the whole boy who cried Wolf scenario where the climate things concended. My take on it was lucky enough to hear Jon Lomberg speak a couple of years ago in London, and the way he puts it is sensible. The climate is changing by nature of the fact that we live on Earth, that the records are if you put it in context of how long the Earth's been around, a bee is proverbial, right, So we know that the climate is changing.
Is there an emergency, absolutely not. Are we all going to die in fifteen years? Absolutely not. Is the sea going to arise and wipe out?
You know all of Bronte seen n Sydney.
Should have said Conte Sydney Beach if you're in Melbourne.
True, but every natural disaster we have in this country, Olbow every time has trotted out this year.
That's because he's Signe d. It's not his model.
I don't think it's that, and he's not and he's not as bad as some. But I think you are right that it is a real problem. And again I say this is someone who did a sort of whole big series with News Corps. Basically, how we get that. The argument over is it real or not is almost secondary. The question is what do.
We do about it?
How much?
How much are we prepared to sacrifice our way of life.
And do Also, the missing piece of this conversation is how green is green energy?
Not green at all. Let's be really bloody clear about that.
Your tesla, my ex tesla, which I don't miss is not green to produce.
It's not clean to produce.
You don't hear about the environmental damage too, of all the wind turbines and.
Everything like that getting missed out. It does not go there.
But I want to move on because the Coalition has declared it will eradicate immigration roughts and shunks after a top university revealed that half of its foreign students had dropped out of their degrees or.
Failed to rock up altogether.
Joe, you know, uneds are rightly slamming these phantom students to yeah, drop that.
I mean, it's just astronomical. But look, something needs to be done here, sure.
Absolutely, And it's strange that the Coalition is saying it's going to tackle it because they had legislation before the Parliament from the government which was actually tackling this, and they voted against it. And they voted against it because it was part of the government, the Labor government's plan to reduce the number of international students, which again the Coalition also voted against and then came out with their own plan to do to do the exactly the same thing.
So again it's just and I don't want to join the pylon because they're having a bad enough time as it is. And it's another example of this campaign and the Coalition not knowing where it really sits or stands on anything, and it's flipping and flopping.
I do agree with that. That has been a lot of flipping and flopping.
And I still think the bigger issue here at play, in my opinion, is the immigration rate, which we know is out of control under.
Under like foreign students, Yeah, absolutely, and foreign students are one cog in that wheel. And I can't disagree with anything Joe said. Just universities are such I hate using this phrase, but I can't go anywhere else tonight. It's just a hot mess. They can't control, they can't clean up their own backyard. You've got the situation is a University of Queensland was a Q two, so you've got
that situation going on with their law faculty. The incredible work Joanna old Briston has been doing on law faculties in general, you've got the falling standards of education, you've got campus security for Jewish students, all of these things in universities going please give us some more money, and the federal government fit in fairness, churning a blind eye to all of that. And now I'm not surprised that you know, isn't there funding based on how many bums they get on sea?
That's it, right.
So the messy thing is that international students live a huge amount of money for versus that taxpayer would otherwise have to pay for. And they spend money in the economy as well. So that is a good thing you want to keep. There are bogus phantom lines.
We're almost were always our top.
But I want, I want, I know, look, I'd love to keep talking about immigration, but I actually want to talk about this because I think this is hilarious. California would you believe is suing Donald Trump over his tariff? Rayjime? They're upset, They've had enough. I don't even know if you can do this. I don't know what the deal is, Jema Butter, what do you think.
I don't understand that. I also have no sympathy for Gavin usim in his government.
I have no well, I don't forgety of us have any sympathy.
Let's be really, you know the state of California is is it a failed state? I don't know, but I have no sympathy for them. And can they sue Donald Trump?
I don't know.
Well, apparently they can. Apparently they're upset Joe.
I thought they were still in the same country. I don't think is actually succeeded yet. So obviously they feel like in Australia, but they feel like they're being hit by the fact that, you know, the prices will go up in California like they go everywhere else. But you're right for any cause against Trump. Davin Newsome is the worst poster boy because he's just so thoroughly kind of obnoxious and pretentious and unlikable.
Yeah, no, I agree, you can't try.
Well, do get me.
I'm available a Barbie doll going It was remember when we went out to the to the fires dresses Care.
It was just when he pretended he was on the phone to Joe Biden.
Just just absolutely and yet these people continue to retain their position and people vote for them, And I just don't know which his worse democracy?
It's democracy. Well listen whatever the dictator goes a long way too. I agree.
Unfortunately we have run out of time.
He just got too carried away with climate.
That's what that was our obsession tonight, with the climate obsession.
Can you believe it stayed with us after the break a landmark UK court ruling on what a woman is? Yeah, what a woman is.
It's a huge victory for common sense and JK Rowling is thrilled about it.
That's next, welcome back.
Let's turn to the UK now where it took a court to rule that a woman is a biological female.
I mean, can you believe it?
A court actually had to rule that a bloke who puts on a dress and a.
Wig is not a woman.
But yet here we are in twenty twenty five and here was part of that judgment being handed down.
The unanimous decision of this court is that the terms women and sex in the Equality Act twenty to ten refer to a biological woman and biological sex.
There were celebratory scenes of jubilation after that result came through.
Chief among them was JK Rowling.
She said, quote it took three extraordinary tenacious Scottish women with an army behind them to get this case heard by the Supreme Court, and in winning they've protected the rights of women and girls across the UK. Joinny me now to discuss this is Tom Slater, editor of Spiked Online. Tom, thank you for joining me. What's been the reaction to the judgment over there?
Oh, it's been jubilation, certainly from a lot of the gender critical feminists and gay rights campaigners who I've been speaking to. I mean, it really does feel like a tremendous seismic moment. As you're alluding to in your introduction there, it is absurd that we ever had to be in a position where a court had to declare that women actually exist. But as we all know, in all of our Western societies we've been taken down this rabbit hole
for so long. Many of the people that you can see celebrating on the screen there have been fighting a very courageous but lonely battle in some cases for more than twenty years now, and unfrankly in awe how much
they've achieved considering what they've been up against. They thought this at the grassroots, they thought this in the courts, They thought this in the court of public opinion, and this feels like whilst one one wants to declare victory too quickly, they're a lot closer to winning on this issue of common sense and biological sex than they were twenty four hours ago.
Well, you know, it's just been an extraordinarycire rasure of women and this is part of the problem here. But you've got your Foreign secretary over there, David Lammy, who once said that men can grow a cervix. For goodness sake, Keir star was saying, it's not right to say that only women have a cervix. What sort of wop nonsense are they talking about.
It's incredible the Labor Party really drank the trends call aid on this front. I mean, Keir Starmer eventually count this very torturous position, which is that you know, most women don't have a penis ninety nine point nine percent probably not, but there is still one in a thousand. You think, how many where did you get to this
particular position. It's interesting now the Labor Party, now in government, previously in opposition, are having to kind of pretend that they were always on board with this to begin with. Their equalities spokesperson saying that we recognize the ruling. We've always supported protections on the basis of sex and sex based rights. It's all very we have always a war
of East Asia. But I think it shows how much of this was really propelled, not necessarily by people in the Labor Party or people in government being true believers, although there are some of those, They were all running
scared of this ideology. Hopefully, this ruling, even if it's a bit cowardly, even if it's a bit of a reverse ferrit we'll just give them cover to admit what they all knew to begin with, which is there are two sexes and that's fundamentally important if you want to protect women's rights.
I mean, who would have thought basic biology.
Yet again here we are what sort of an impact do you think this is now going to have to female sports and female only spaces? Do you think is this changed the game?
No?
Absolutely, If you go through the judgment itself, it makes clear that there are going to be knock on effects here. We've already seen. Actually some organizations announced kind of plans to pursue, for instance, the NHS if it doesn't change its guidance, which primarily works on the basis of self
identification as well as gender recognition certification. We've had the British Transport Police, which has already announced that as an interim measure it's going to ban trans identified police officers from searching women. That this has to happen purely on the basis of biological sect or, as it always should have been. So there's going to be fights to come. But the nature of this ruling, the precedent that it sets down, the fact that this is the Supreme Court,
the highest court in the land. It's going to have legal ramifications, but I think also cultural and political ramifications. It's suddenly become a lot more acceptable to say what has been obvious to all of us to begin with. And that's a tremendous victory in its own self, I think absolutely.
And look, I wish that here in Australia we would be following suit, but we're certainly a long way behind. And look, I want to get your take on reports that the Ministry of Defense over there may have banned electric vehicles with Chinese parts from parking within two miles of military sites due to safety concerns. Tom apparently staff at an RAF in Cambridgeshire must park those evs outside, explain what's going on here.
This is really striking. So this report from gb News over here talking about how specifically at RAF Witting in Cambridgeshire, which includes this cycle the path Finder Building, which is believed to kind of house one of the world's largest spy facilities, the sort of thing you wouldn't want potentially hostile foreign actors to be anywhere near that. They have
put these restrictions in. It's not all RAF or military sites, but by any stretch of the imagination, but does reflect a growing nervousness on the part of the state, on the part of the government about potential room for espionage. But you know, the Labor government have a very muddled position on this. On the one hand, they're trying to
hug China quite close. There's even talk of them approving this super embassy that the Chinese Communist Party you want to put in the middle of central London, which was blocked by the last Conservative government for fear it would be a place for espionage and for secret police forces
and so on to operate from. And yet you can still you can still see that the kind of information they're getting the kind of advice that they're getting from their security services and from their military chiefs is that they need to be a lot more cautious. So maybe this is the beginning of a more cautious approach than we've seen so far from them.
Yeah, I mean, and you can understand why they're certainly doing this. You you just don't know.
But it says a lot about electric veh as well. I got to say, Tom Slater, it's nice to catch up with you. Thank you so much for joining me on the show this evening, and thank you for your company. That's all we've got time for. I'll see you tomorrow at five pm for my show. But now here is Paul Murray in the man Cave.
From the sky New Center.
This is Paul Murray Live.
Hello, ad, Welcome to the show before the long weekend, before another long weekend, both of course with incredible importance to Christian Australians this weekend and then to all Australians next weekend, Happy Easter. And of course this time next week I'm going to be living a dream because we are going to be in Western Australia. We will be on our way to Calgooley and I want you to join us next Sunday. Okay, not this but next Sunday night, the twenty seven, in Calgooley. If you can make it,
get yourself there. Ourtown at skynews dot com dot you ourtown at skynews dot com dot you love to get into the orange dirt. We will do so next weekend, looking forward to it. Sixteen days until the federal election. Tuesday is when the first votes will be cast. In an election where there is a fork in the road, there is a way to continue what we are doing with the problems we've had over the past three years, or a chance, as the opposition will say, to put
the country back on track. At the am an easy well today again just basking in the terribleness of the performance that he had last night at the debate.