Sharri | 16 September

Why on Sky News.

This is Sharry.

Good Evening, Welcome to the show.

Tonight, the ABC admits it doctored a video adding in gunshots to accuse a commando.

Of being a war criminal.

This major admission from the ABC's investigations unit. Ben Fordham and Sarah Henderson would join me tonight to discuss this bombshell revelation. Well, Donald Trump speaks out after a second assassination attempt? Can the Secret Service actually keep him safe? I look at this with Kosher Gata and joining us live the polster behind new research that shows Dutton could be the next Prime Minister. Albanezi clearly on the nose

Albo will be a one term PM.

But first tonight, the ABC has made a bombshell admission that it published fake footage with extra gunshots added in a report wrongly accusing a hero commander of being a war criminal. This revelation has rocked the ABC after its beleagued investigations unit made the devastating admission that it used fabricated audio as part of its defamatory pursuit of Heston Russell. As you know, Russell is a decorated Farmer special Forces

We don't have the vision that comes immediately before this, but this Australian soldier is firing towards what appeared to be unarmed civilians in residential compounds.

And they're saying that you're shooting at unarmed civilians.

And this guy had literally just been on the back of a motorbike with his mate shooting at two of my teams that were on the ground. But we don't see any of it, no, nor do they, but they're still happy to jump to a conclusion from fifteen seconds worth of footage.

And that was Heston Russell on Channel seven speaking about the original ABC broadcast from two years ago. Russell gave the ABC the raw footage to show the whole context, but the ABC wouldn't fix its report and Russell took the public broadcaster to court. He won and was awarded almost four hundred k in damages.

Two things, First and foremost, it's not me. Secondly, here's the full context. They were not unarmed civilians.

Incredibly, the ABC refused to acknowledge it, so in September of twenty twenty two, Russell commenced defamation proceedings in the Federal Court to defend himself again against their accusations of war crimes. The reporter Mark Willisy is saying, we don't know what happened before this, but he does. He's known about it since April last year. For a year he's known. So what's online, what's up on the net is a lie.

Absolutely.

And now Heston Russell has made the quite extraordinary discovery that the ABC had edited its footage, adding in extra gunshots and taking a fifteen second clip entirely out of context. Here was that amazing revelation on Channel seven last night.

In the actual helmet cam vision, it's a warning shot, then Heston's command to shoot.

Followed by six.

Shots, and then seven went on to explain how the single warning shot became six.

Have a look, they've literally added extra gunshots.

That's phenomenon.

So I fell off my chair when I saw this.

A forensic audio expert analyzed the footage and had this to say last night.

They've taken the audio from the six shots and they've applied it to this video in the news clip, and they've copied and pasted across this scene. It completely misrepresents what those soldiers were going through that day.

It also makes you wonder where else has been fabricated?

Doesn't it correct well?

When presented with the evidence, the ABC admitted the concoction. They said, we have removed the online video where an error has been identified based on preliminary inspection of the audio. The ABC is seeking more inf on how this occurred. Joe Puccini, Mark Willersey, and Josh Robertson had no role in the production and editing of the online video you've brought to our attention. Any suggestion that they have acted

And I spent two months checking out, going back to this guy, getting more detail, more detailed.

And this is this idea that we we make up and we don't.

That's Joe Hood abround, laughing out loud.

He can't help himself. And we'll get his opinion on that in just a minute. But as you saw, Mark Willisey never mentioned there that his source told him not to rely on his memory at all. Now, this is a journalist, Mark Willersey, who has called news corp tabloids, murdock bottom feeders. Well, I'll tell you this news corp would never add extra gunshots into a video to falsely accuse a decorated soldier of war crimes. This unthinkable conduct happened at the ABC, and it keeps claiming it's the

The ABC not to rely on his memory. He said it was hazy.

What's worse, it's now eventuated that Heston wasn't even in Afghanistan at the time that the ABC claimed the war crime happened.

When the ABC published their articles saying this happened between June and July, and I produced my deployment record that showed we weren't even in Afghanistan during that time.

Pudin Well, another American soldier who did work with Heston Russell, had this to say about him.

Most of our one on one interaction was with with Heston, and then usually we you know, we'd get up with the platuna in the aircraft. You know, most of the communication it was with Heston.

Could you rank him highly?

I held him in the highest regard out of everybody I worked with. I thought he was the most professional commander that I got the hand A pleasure of work went down. I spent a year in Afghanistan during that deployment, and at no point during that time that I ever did we ever think that any of the engagements were illegal or unethical or.

Outside the rules of it.

Absolutely so.

Did anybody try to call you, any journalists from Australia Do they try to get in touch?

No one ever trying to call me or contact me about it.

No, sir.

You just think how far removed is that account from how the ABC chose to portray Heston Russell. They portrayed him as a murderer who they claimed killed innocent civilians, and the public broadcaster has refused to apologize, showing extreme arrogance even after being found in a court of law to have wrongly pursued an innocent veteran. And here is the ABC's from a managing director showing no remorse for destroying Russell's life after publishing utter lies about him.

What do you say to war veteran Heston Russell, the ABC wrongfully accused of committing all come at.

The moment, I would say that. And the court agrees that those stories were in the public interests. The ABC held a genuine belief that they were in the public interest. The court degrees of that.

I'm not interested in your belief, I'm interested in the facts you have been found to have him properly and wrongly accused mister Heston Russell of being a war criminal. What do you say, firstly to mister Heston Russell, Sandra, if.

You're asking for me to apologize to mister Russell, I'm not going to apologize to mister Russell.

It's unbelievable. All the ABC is erroneous.

Reporting brought Heston Russell almost to the edge, and the ABC even went after his sexuality, shaming him he thought about taking his own life.

Well.

Rebecca Giles, his lawyer, said that she felt that ABC was trying to push Russell over the edge.

I think the personal attacks were so hurtful to him that potentially there was a hope that he wouldn't survive them.

This is disgraceful.

The ABC recklessly destroyed the reputation of a fine serving commander who had repeatedly put his own life on the line fighting for our country. The ABC tried to prove that he was a war criminal, and even in the face of growing evidence that he was innocent and highly respected, refused to acknowledge the truth. Well, there needs to be accountability here. Yet we've seen ABC executives behave as arrogantly

Welcome it to you both.

Now.

James, you wrote a very strong piece about this in the Telegraph today. What's your take on this shoddy journalism?

Well, this is as bad as it gets, but it's part of a wider four year campaign that the ABC ran against our soldiers, where there were dozens of stories published, every bit of footage, every from Defense or another sorcering government was allowed to be massaged together into a campaign against.

Some of the most vulnerable people in the community.

It was rumor, it was innuendo, and ultimately, in the last twelve months, the ABC has had to take down from my count three stories in regards to war crimes, two of them relating to the Heston Russell case after he won the defamation case against them, and now this one where they've conceded that there've been multiple gunshots added to a war crime. I mean, this is really really bad.

Yeah.

I also liked when you wrote in your piece today you asked, what is this off for online clicks or trying to get gongs at industry award nights.

Yeah, that's right, And I think with a lot of media outlets, or sorry, a few of them, it became a race to try and outdo each other and say, okay, who can we name here? We want to go to this mission, We want to find out what people are saying, and ultimately they weren't getting the whole story. They were getting tiny little bits of information and dressing them up as incredibly serious accusations.

And the way that this continued.

And let's face it, at the very beginning, Heston Russell wanted an apology and his legal fees covered to the

We're sorry.

Someone just went bang bang bang. You know, a couple more times that person's gone there on a contract. Don't worry, Come on, it doesn't. The journalists who put their name to this story, we all know this, would have sat there, would have looked through the whole thing and decided what went to We're in the end, so you know, And the fact the ABC didn't go out hard on it this morning, like we know they do when you know they want to stand up for themselves indicates that there is a big problem.

Yeah.

Heston Russell came on this program when he first won his defamation case.

He was very emotional.

I'm pretty sure it was his first television interview, and he said that ABC nearly broke him. And he said it was harder to come up against the ABC than any terrorist in Afghanistan. Joe, you can see the human consequences that ABC never cared that they were potentially breaking a soldier with no evidence to support it.

Yeah.

I've only met Heston Russell, I think once or twice. It's always struck me as the most incredible individual and incredibly decent and honest and warm and compassionate person. I don't know why you would single him out as being a murdering war criminal without any apparent evidence, and.

I think that a lot of the I think there are a couple of interesting things.

One is it's a matter of people in glasshouses not throwing stones. Now, every journal gets things wrong from time to time, but not every media institution has its own inner institution, A, which have more resources than any other organization in the country, and B, which sits in judgment quite literally over every other media organization.

So ABC Paul Barr is a nice guy. I like it.

But the ABC is the only one with a show called Media Watch, which says, right, all you are the ones you're not living up to expectations despite the fact we're scrambling on far smaller budgets.

The ABC has also got its.

Own fact check unit, and I think that is currently being revamped after a slight incident with Dick Smith. And I was lucky enough to do a function with the person overseeing it, and I'm sure he.

Was very point being.

And yet even after all that, they still manage to do something like this. And this tells me that there must be some weird, preconceived, hard baked in idea of soldiers as just been intrinsically murderously bad people.

If only we could.

Just get to the bottom of it, because I don't know how else you would take this one little scaret.

I think he's been this journalist that the ABC have this god complex and they think they couldn't possibly be wrong. I should just point out that David Addison, who refused to apologize in that grilling by Sarah Henderson before he is still in the job.

He leaves next year.

And Sarah Henderson and Ben Fordham are coming up on the show to talk more about this. But let's turn to this massive news today, the second attempted assassination.

Of Donald Trump.

Now, at this point, I'm worried whether he's actually going to make it to the election alive.

And you know, you just.

Think there are so many crazy enemies out there. They keep coming for Donald Trump.

James, are you worried.

About this that voters might not actually have a choice, that they might succeed in killing him.

Well, I think we'd be silly to think this will be the last attempt assassination attempt on Donald Trump. And I think the hostility we're seeing America right now is frightening.

I think, you know, we.

Have two people that are in a really genuine contest here. The polls have even up since Joe Biden dropped out, But ultimately it's terrifying to think that you could be heading into a poll and anytime Donald Trump steps out in public or goes on a golf course in this case, that there would be a possible risk on his life. I always wonder why the media in these stories reports on the person's political.

Views or who they've voted for previously. I find that irrelevant.

For someone to be taking this course of action is just unhinged, and it is terrifying that in a country like America this does go on. But thank god we live in Australia, I suppose.

Well, the worst part is it's so incredibly stupid, Like if this person is trying to stop Donald Trump, it is events like this which actually make him more popular. The more you make him a martyr, the more popular is. This is why the judge was smart enough to know not to sentence him before election day. This is why his popularity shot up to unprecedented heights after the first

Just fueling him.

But I find it, I actually find it very interesting that this person, who does appear to be a Democrat supporter, has previously said that apparently he said he voted for Donald Trump in twenty sixteen, but he voted in a Democratic primary.

And well or whatever whatever.

But the point I think, well, no, I think the point is though, that this seems to have been very much downplayed, Like whenever else you get an attempted shooter or attemption, it's like, oh, it's an extreme right winger with you know, with you know, all these crazy views, and he loves guns, and he's got you know, he's a racist and he hates this.

We only seeing the assassination Trump, that's.

Right, But as soon as it's someone with links to the Democrats, it's like, oh, yeah.

He was known to police.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

And Koshergarder would join me later to speak about Joe Biden's reaction to this.

Now let's have a look at Twiggy Forest.

Now we know he loves a bit of good publicity and he was keen to reveal the man behind the headlines to the Daily Telegraph on the weekend.

He then went on to detail, and this.

Is the very first paragraph of the entire story.

He talks about an horrific.

Childhood trauma, and the Telly reports that at eight years of age, Twiggy recall sitting in the back of his father's ute holding the hand of a badly burnt and dying man, and Twiggy says, I don't share that story, but I wanted to share it with you because it's why I have such a deep.

Appreciation for life.

Well, that's interesting, he says, this is a story he doesn't share. But let's have a look at the Sydney Morning Herald from back in two thousand and nine, where again the start of the story says, when he was eight, Andrew Forrest held a man in his final moments before death from bushfire injuries. The man passed away as the youngsters sang him nursery rhymes. Now, James, obviously this is a tragic story.

But what is.

Twiggy trying to achieve here? Is this an image brandt Well?

I think two years a very fascinating person, and the supporters of him say that he's on this campaign to save the planet.

Other people have accused him.

Of flat at greenwashing, and I think the truth lights somewhere in the middle there. But he's always struck me as someone that is desperate to be liked by the public and wants to leave this great legacy.

Now that can be done in a range.

Of ways, but for him it's clearly very important and on a number of fronts, with a number of the things he's done.

Publicly over the last few years.

I feel like, ultimately he is desperate to make that legacy count. He's clearly forgotten the fact that he told the story previously fifteen years.

Ago, but I can't remember much that I did fifteen Tell you a story fifteen years is exactly.

So much positive publicity that I guess he can't remember his own spent now. The who's who of Australian television came together last night in a moving memorial for TV legend Reg Grundy, six years since his pass and he was remembered in a joint memorial with his late wife, Joy Chambers Grundy, she passed away last year. Have a look at some of the tributes to him from Tracy Grimshaw, Alan Jones and Tony Abbott.

For decades from the dawn of television, Reg Grundy was Australia's most prolific and successful TV producer. Joy was the love of his life and Reggie, as she called him, was certainly hers.

If ever there was an Australian team of achievement, these two were that team. Reg Grundy was the Rupert Murdoch of television, the biggest independent television producer in the world.

Joe Alan Jones, made the point last night that Reg Grundy was so private that his legacy hasn't properly been celebrated.

Reg Grundy, It's difficult to overstate.

It's impossible, in fact, to overstate how much of a titan he is. This man has almost godlike status in television, and you don't.

Really know it. Like everyone would know. At the end of every show you've.

Ever watched, a real of fortune or a blankety blanks or perfect match, whatever, you know, the Grundy thing would come out and bubicuous. He never actually think of the person behind it. It was incredibly reclusive. I think he' lived for the last few decades of his life with joy in Bermuda, and it was impossible to see, possible to get in touch with and he had it was almost like a sort of Bond villain, but without the villain part, Like you just had this incredible mystique about.

Him, but absolute reverence.

When you do daytime television for seven years, you see all these sort of old kind of legends of the eighties and the nineties come through, people like Greg Evans, for example, and John Bagen all these people, and they would speak in almost hush tones about him as though again it was as close to sort of a demi

Yes, no, incredible legacy. All right, Joe Hildebrand and James Willis. Great to have you on.

Thank you, thank you.

Now let's return to these massive bombshell revelations that the ABC has doctored video. There's now urgent investigations underway at the ABC. The footage featuring that compromised audio.

Has been removed.

To look at this further, let's bring in now two GB Breakfast host Ben Fod and Ben, great to have you on the show.

From the very start of.

This saga, you pointed out that the ABC's reporting was not up to scratch, But this video editing is just the latest egregious example.

I remember the TV show Frontline, Sharry. I'm sure you do as well. It was one of those fantastic shows put together by the working dog team here in Australia, Rob Sitch and Jane Kennedy and many others, and they highlighted some of the crazy tricks and track that TV Current Affairs crews get up to, and that was all aimed at the commercial TV networks, of course, and we always presume that our ABC would never do a thing like that. I don't know how something like this happens.

More than it already is.

And to move the gun shots from the end of the sequence to the start of the sequence, you're changing the story because, as we've heard from Heston Russell, there was one warning shot and if you look closely at that warning shot, it was not directed at the individual on the ground. The gun moved away from them and shot the ground near them to send a sign to them that we're up above and we're coming after you.

Russell one hundred percent. He had his reputation and life destroyed over this. It's possible that he might not have survived it. Thankfully he has. Thankfully he is seeing justice now thanks to the courts and media reporting, including yours on the two GB. But these personal attacks have been incredibly hurtful, the arrogance of the ABC not only refusing to apologize, but also Mark Willisy's conduct.

I mean, Ben, when you were first reporting on this, Mark.

Willisey rang your producer James Willison, who's now at the Telly, who I just had on the show and yelled at you guys over this.

I can still remember sitting on air that morning and talking to the microphone and just looking outside the studio window and seeing James Willis out there with a shocked look on his face. And look, James is a bloke who can handle many many things. He's not intimidated by anyone, but to see his reaction that morning, and then when I threw to a commercial break, I asked him what was going on and he explained that Mark Willisey had just unloaded on him. James was in stun silence and

That was the source.

He didn't see anything. He was not an eyewitness. He was an ear witness. He heard a sound and from that sound he came up with a claim that turned into the ABC calling it a war crime. And then you know, they had the platoon wrong, they had the rotation wrong, they had the dates wrong. It was wrong, wrong, wrong, And now we find out there was a manipulation going on in the edit suite. And look, I'm with James

Higher up, how high? Who do you think should lose their job?

Mark Willersey, Well, look, I certainly think that this story warrants a proper examination of processes. I think if you have a look at Joe Puccini, who was above Mark Willersey, she was just running a defense left, right and center from the very beginning on this instead of sitting down and saying, right, oh, let's start from the beginning here,

All Right, Ben Fordham, always love having you on the show, and I have to say I was very moved by your story this morning, terrible story about that twelve year old girl who took her own life after being so badly bullied. And you know you are just a champion of so many families. So I'm sure you'll talk about that on air again tomorrow if everyone watches starting at

Now to someone else who's been.

Relentless in holding the ABC to account and senate estimates over this. We've showed you the grilling that Sarah Henderson gave the ABC bosses and she joins us now, Sarah, thank you for your time. Look, you just heard Ben Fordham say that perhaps the head of the ABC's investigations unit, Joe Puccini, should be sacked over this. What consequences do you think there should be after this admission by the ABC that it docted video to add in more gunshots.

We'll shrey good evening, firstly, let me say this is a story the ABC got very very wrong and there needs to be a full investigation. This is the most appalling standards of journalism, and the fact that the ABC was presented with the evidence showing they had the story wrong and they continue to prosecute the case in the federal court mounting up millions of dollars in costs is

So this is a very very serious.

Matter and we need all of the answers, Sharry, and we need them urgently.

Sarah, what's your view on the ABC using unlimited taxpayer funds for a case like this? Do you think there should be a limit to how far the ABC can go when it's defending ultimately a hopeless defamation case with taxpayer funds.

Well, I think the bottom line is that they failed the ordinary standards of good journalism. They didn't interrogate the facts, and rather than do their job, they continue to prosecute this in the Federal court, mounting millions of dollars. And it's very clear to me, Shari that the ABC has not been a model vitigant. They could have resolved and settled this matter for a very small amount of money.

All right, Well, Sarah Henderson, good on you for holding them to account and thank you for your time this evening. Now after the break, could we be heading for Peter Dutton Prime Minister ship. Well, the polster behind this new research will Join Me Live, plus a war of words between the PM and Elon Musk as Musk doubles down on his fascist comment that's all coming up. Don't go away, welcome back. Well, Anthony Albernezi should be getting worried because you.

Primary is at forty two percent.

We're joining us toyn pack is Freshwater Strategy director Leo Shanahan. Leo, this is extraordinary polling. Can you tell us a bit more about these results?

Yeah, well, look, I mean you say it's extraordinary, it's actually pretty consistent with the trend that we've had. We had a trend whereby two pp effectively Labor fell behind a month ago and had fallen behind before. Now it's at fifty two to forty eight to the Coalition. Now that is you know, it is within the margin of error, but it's showing pretty consistently, it's about fifty to fifty two aabouts. And a really worrying thing for Labor is that is that primary vote that's dropped down just to

And I should say he is a highly respective polster by both political parties. Can you tell us which vote issues and concerns are shaping the results, contributing to this momentum.

Yeah, well, it's that key. It's that cost of living again, Sharry. I mean it's been I've spoken to you before about this, but look at that. I mean it's cost of living in daylight and really a cost of living and housing an accommodation are really a super issue in terms of the way in which it's viewed in the electric because housing accommodation is very much the cost housing and accommodation, that is, interest rates rent for renters and interest rates

That it would.

Peter Dutton's also spent a good amount of time, you know, a full fortnight of a parliamentary sitting period focusing on alban easy bringing in Gazans without proper security checks. How does this issue of immigration and national security feature in voters.

Concerns, Well, it does increasingly actually figure in voter concerns, and concerningly for the Labor Party, it's very much an issue that the Coalition historically is owned and that trend

Then from the immigration from immigrated attention exactly.

Yep, all right, Leah Shanahan, thank you so much for your time, really appreciate it. Thanks y Now, Labor Insider also believes Albanezi could be on the cusp of a major pical defeat, and he'll speak about this on air for the first time after the break. Plus, Joe Biden and Kamala Harris respond to the second assassination attempt on Donald Trump.

That's all coming up. Welcome back.

Well, a prominent labor strategist is predicting that labor might be on the cusp of a voice like federal election defeat, and he thinks the coalition could be poised to win the next election. And Cameron Milner joins us now along with John Howard's former press secretary David Gazard for our regular Monday panel. Welcome gentlemen, Cameron, talk us through your reasoning here.

Well, Sharie, a week ago you challenged me on the program to name the seats and show that I was the only person saying Labor could lose, and so I went through the exercise and I got Cos Samaris, a very good polster from Redbridge, to check my work as well.

We looked at news.

Pot, we looked at Freshwater, we looked at all the poles out there, and all the poles are saying one thing, Labour's behind and even further behind than the last election on their primary and the Coalition consolidate their primary to election winning levels in the low forties. And so we extrapolate that seat by seat, state by state, Labour's well behind.

Yeah, and that article, of course is in the Night Leave. If you want to read it, you can search for that online. Dave Gazard, what do you think we've heard about this Freshwater polling tonight, which is an official polling company Cameron's given his analysis. Do you think this might be wish thinking by some or do you think the momentum is against Albanzi here?

Well, the momentum is certainly against Albinesi. The question is can he arrest the slide and bring it back into a position where he can win. Now, you can come back from fifty two to forty eight down, there's no problem with that. John Howard did that several times, and he did it over the course of the election campaign.

But Cameron is quite right.

The numbers have just kept drifting for Anthony Albanesi and there is no sign of any restoration in sight. The other thing that I think we can add to his interesting analysis is that even that the Teal Teals, the Teals that would never normally vote for the coalition in a pink fit but are in coalition seats, they would have to think very carefully about going against the wishes of a large swing towards the coalition in seats that have traditionally been co There's been a couple of examples

Yeah, indeed was Its going to be a tough battle. That's for show for both sides. Let's have a look at the Labour's misinformation bill now. Now, this has been widely criticized by the left and the right, by every group.

Under the sun.

The Coalition has accused Albanezy of being contemptuous of free speech. Here was David Coleman with Andrew Clenel yesterday.

The government got this wrong catastrophically last time, Andrews. So I've minused to put this bill out in June last year. We had four months when pretty much everyone in Australia came out and said it was a grotesque piece of legislation, from the Civil liberties councils to the Human Rights Commission. They pulled the bill in disgrace in November. They then work on it for ten months and then they've come out with a bill which has a lot of issues.

Caaron, I've spoken a lot on the show about my concerns about this piece of legislation. From a journalism perspective, Elon Musk has come out and accused the Albanezi government of being fascists over this.

What do you think, Well, I'm not on social media, but the social media is full of awful stuff, awful terrorism stuff, racism and semitism, misogynistic hate. So it's a sewer. It's a sewer shari and if it's going to be a news or organization, if it wants to promulgate itself as that, it needs to be held to the same standards that our show does, or you know, the Australian does, or the wider newspapers and the radio in television Australia.

Just because he's offended.

Just because Albo doesn't like it, doesn't mean it's wrong.

Shari.

I think that's the real concern about this bill, that the misinformation disinformation test is not about whether it's true, whether it's false, or whether it's actually offensive.

It's just whether Albo doesn't like it.

I think that's a really poor standard to try to put into the bill.

I mean, David Gazard, we've heard the number of things the Prime Minister has accused of being misinformation, including people who opposed the Voice. So there are a lot of concerns around this. We saw how much was censored during the COVID pandemic. There are a lot of concerns about having legislation around misinformation.

Yeah, there's no doubt.

And when you get as Cameron has just rightly pointed out, the various ministerial powers where ministers can direct reviews into matters that it deems to be misinformation. Then you've got another worry because it's the government forcing the chilling hand of censorship into the community. You know, it's taken all of a few days to find out that academics who say one thing are exempt from the legislation, but people who repeat what they hear by the academics are caught

Imagine, Yeah, it is. It's quite terrifying.

Now, very quickly before we go from a Defense foss Chief Angus Campbell and other prominent military figures are being urged to give back their medals. Cameron, what do you think do you think this would be appropriate for the top brice to surrender their honors given others have had to.

Well, it stops at the top as far as I'm concerned, Shari, and they should if they're not asked to leave them, they should actually do the voluntary thing and give them up. I mean, ultimately, the buck stops at the top of the Defense Force. For what has been found the burrit and report. You can't just fly middle management. The CEO has got to go as well.

David, what's your take on this?

Yeah, look, I hate this debate. In the Defense services, we train these people to go into really, really difficult jobs in a wide range of challenging circumstances, and then we pick it apart from the side through through media articles and inquiries when it's highly dynamic. But I tend to agree with Cameron on this. If there is malfeasan's displayed in the defense forces, the buck stops with the

Yeah, I think this debate is going to run for a while yet. All Right, David Gazzard, Camra.

Milner, thank you for your time.

Now after the break, Donald Trump says he hates Taylor Swift.

We'll talk about that.

Plus, Biden and Kamala respond to the second assassination attempt. This is an insider comes out to claim that the US ABC network leaked questions to Kamala ahead of the debate, don't go away, that's after the break, welcome back.

Well. Photos have emerged of Donald Trump.

In golf gear and smiling after the second attempt on his life.

In just two months.

Let's bring in now our Sky News contributor Koshergade to discuss Kosher. This is highly concerning another assassination attempt. What has been the reaction from Kamala Andree Biden along with the fomb president today.

Really concerning and just stepping back really quickly, Shari, it really is such a remarkable day, and I feel very sad for my country that there's this level of hatred out there, whether directly or stoked or every which way in between. And I do fear for the former president that now this has not happened for forty years in the history of the country. The last one was Ronald Reagan's attempted assassination, and now in a matter of sixty two days, you have not one, but two attempts. So

Think was a good look.

And I also really quickly looked at other people like former President Obama, Michelle Obama, vice President Mike Pen's, Dick Cheney, all these people who are obviously not big fans of Trump. There was the silence, I think was quite conspicuous. I didn't see a lot of statements coming out from them, and I think that's something that's a little bit unfortunate, because this really is a serious matter.

Yeah, they claim to care about democracy, Well, democracy means both candidates staying alive before and after the election, and I think there are serious concerns that Donald Trump may not survive an assassination attempt. I think this is a genuinely terrifying prospect. Now we got another indication today that Trump hasn't taken Taylor Swift's endorsement of Kamala Harris Well.

He wrote on social.

Media, I hate Taylor Swift, but surely this reaction Kosher won't go down well either, given she is literally one of the most popular figures in well not just the US but lively.

Yes, I think you know that's Trump being Trump with his four worded tweet that drove all these media cycles. I think the whole Taylor Swift thing, it's great for commanding attention in the media cycle and sucking up the oxygen, just given the name brand that she is, and Trump knows how to play into that, for better or for worse. I don't know that she's really going to influence too many opinions of undecided voters, the few remaining ones in

Yeah.

I think it is possible though, that people like their favorite pop star but don't necessarily follow their political insights. And as many have pointed out, she is the woman famous from making wrong decisions, at least.

When it comes to men. So there you go.

Look just twenty seconds, Kosher. There's claims on social media. We don't know if they're credible or not. They're probably not credible that a US whistleblower says that the questions were given to Kamala Harris before the debate.

Yes, in regardless of the veracity of those comments, I think what it's highlighting and underscoring is what we all saw with our own eyes in terms of the lopsided nature of the moderators, and that what's interesting here is it's getting a lot of weight and traction from people like Bill Ackman and Elon Musk that are asking Bob Iger, the CEO of Disney that's the parent company of ABC,

All right, Always great to have you on the show, Koshagada, Thank you, and that's it for me. I'll see you tomorrow at eight o'clock. Right now, Paul Mara