Bryan Johnson | Shane Smith Has Questions

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nwl.co.uk forward slash reduce my bill. Northumbrian Water is here to offer all our customers water without the worry. Tell you what, honestly, what I'm doing right now... I'm trying to make Don't Die into the world's most influential ideology. Are you really trying to live forever? Living forever and living for tomorrow are identical concepts. The fastest growing ideology in human history.

This year alone, the movement had landed in San Francisco, Singapore, and Miami. And have something like, you know, a million citizens around the world who are all in on this philosophy. I'm hoping that you will learn things that you didn't anticipate learning today.

We have leaders trained all over the world who are organizing local groups. So Don't Die is a religion. Don't Die is an economic system. Don't Die is a political system. Don't Die is an ethical, moral, social system. Let's say we have something like a trillion dollars under management.

where people take their savings and they put it into a don't die managed fund, where we can move money in markets to actually move towards things that push towards don't die. But basically, we're trying to build a nation state and a religion and a... social movement in like a two-year time period. I get why people have said you're obsessed with Joseph Smith and you want to be your own Joseph Smith. Actually, it's not Joseph Smith. My competitor is Jesus.

All right, here we go. You ready? I'm ready. Sherlock Holmes. Hercule Poirot. Chevalier Auguste Dupin. The three best detectives ever. I went down a rabbit hole. I don't like to over-research because it takes away sort of the spontaneity of the conversation. And I did over-research. And as I was over-researching, I was thinking, Sherlock Holmes, why? Because you get pissed off after a while of Sherlock Holmes goes to the country. Yeah. And there's a bumpkin.

police sergeant going, I don't know, Mr. Sherlock, that seems a bit odd. And you're like, okay, dude. He's been in the newspaper for solving the Queen's murder. Like he found the jewels of the king, whatever. He's the best detective. But yet it's still that sort of, you know...

We're going to just ask the same questions. We're going to have the same foil. We're going to, oh, he's the dumb police sergeant. And that's going to show how smart. Why did I think that? Because everyone asks you the same questions. It's the same interview. And why? Because you're an interesting cat and you're polarizing. So for comments, like on one side, it's incredibly vitriolic. On the other, it's adulation.

But I was like, yeah, I can't do that. I can't do the same questions and the same answers because you're a great interview, but you've done that 500 times before. Now, are we going to get to some of them? Yes, we're going to have to. So Brian Johnson, famous for Don't Die. As a species, we accept our inevitable decay, decline, and death. I would argue that the opposite should be true.

And also, you're just sort of like an internet persona. We're going to talk about the three power laws of health. If anyone can discover the cure to eternal life, it's Brian Johnson. This man is spending $2 million a year to reverse aging. You're going to go old now. Teethnos. I'm not familiar with that. Oh, you're going to like it. Okay. Teethnos was the lover of Eos.

who was the goddess of dawn, famous in Greek mythology. I remembered it in the periphery of my consciousness when I was thinking about you. And I looked it up. But I remember the actual myth. And the myth is, so Eos was in love with Tethnos. Tethnos was immortal. Eos was a goddess. I remember this now. So she asks Zeus for everlasting life for her lover, but forgets to ask for everlasting youth. Yeah. So he grows older, but doesn't stay young. So he...

he gets smaller and smaller, and he gets sadder and sadder, and he becomes a cicada. And that's why there's so many cicadas in Greece. Cicada's like a grasshopper, but they make that sound. Like all of these things, there's a moral to it, which is... careful what you wish for which is if you wish for immortality there's always unforeseen things that happen like he becomes a cricket who has to watch his goddess who never dies and that's him being sad.

Thoughts on that. Metaphysical, life-aging, go. Yeah. I guess first question for you, as you went down this rabbit hole, what does this look like to you? You know, what I didn't like was interviewers being like mean or look at this crazy guy. There's a lot of that, you know, which is, I think, lazy. Look, it's the internet. Yeah. So there's a lot of anger. And I guess, like, obviously, people don't want to be made.

to feel stupid, right? And it's like, well, this guy should eat some bacon or whatever. So I was surprised that the sort of people wishing that, you know, oh, well, you know, something's going to happen and it's all going to be bullshit. Look, I have all those questions, too. But to me, it's like I wanted to start with, you know, life, death, aging, because to me, what time immemorial?

Since the beginning of written language, we've been thinking about this. And you have said this. It's our sort of number one fascination. So why am I getting so much?

I just said two swear words. We're going to have to drop those out. Is this a non-vulgar podcast? It isn't, but you know what we found? Yeah. Is YouTube doesn't like swearing. Yeah. Did you know that? Yeah, exactly. I do not. So, and I have a... bit of a potty mouth how long have you had a potty mouth like your entire life yeah yeah even as a kid yeah you just like you found it you're like this is this is it i didn't found it no my dad is like

The Yates of swearing. But let's get into it. You started it, so let's get into your youth. So you started, your dad was a problematic cat. Yeah, I mean, I really have this complex emotional relationship talking about it because... My first conscious memory of existence is being in the bed with him, rubbing his back because I could feel that he felt bad and I wanted him to feel good. And so I've had this deep connection to him my entire life. of always caring for him and then he went through

quite a few years of intense challenges. Addiction. Yeah, exactly. It was only just the past couple of years where I actually was able to say openly that he had those challenges before I was trying to bury it. Right, right, right. So, yeah, it's very complicated because I'm very... proud of my father but like uh it's hard for me to take openly yeah it was a difficult childhood you want your dad to be a regular dad yeah and your dad is

A complex human being. Yes. And young people, youth, don't understand complexities very well. They just want the same dad that everybody else has. Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, I tell my kids now, like kids, I am here. Like you've got a dad that's intensely engaged in your life. So just so you like understand state of affairs, this is.

Like that's not always the case. Like sometimes the cards in life give you something different. So, you know, you're not wise enough yet to realize this, but like really lean into this thing. Like if your parents are present, like I'm here to help you.

fully so yeah it's been a good experience for me but then like typically you follow where like a child doesn't have a father then they over express and then that child you guys appreciate it much and then that kind of goes in these well can I be honest yeah because when I first heard so

I'm going to give you the synopsis of you, which is, this is what I want. Yeah. Which is a Mormon. Yeah. Right. Obsessed with Joseph Smith and Mormon church, then leaves the church becomes this sort of, you know, anti-aging is the new religion. becomes obsessed by it, makes the money being an entrepreneur, and spends the money now on this anti-aging stuff, right? So we haven't even gone. We're going to go for my first question. So speaking of that.

ambition, longevity, all tied up into one, is in an article from December of 2023, you told Vanity Fair you might be interested in running for president, and then tweeted, and I quote, We need more nighttime erections in Washington, D.C. Too much stress, sleep deprivation and bad habits have made us flaccid. I'm ready. to present my nighttime erection results if called upon. Go. Yeah, it's really, I guess I'm making some meta societal commentary that we live in this culture.

Basically, you are your surroundings, and you're oblivious to it. None of us can really see it very clearly. I'm highlighting that the majority of Congress is poorly slept, poorly nutritious, poor nutrition, doesn't exercise much, and is getting aged. That's a combination that produces challenges in good decision-making about them leading the country. So if we want to be a strong country, if we want to lead the world and we want to be vigorous, then I think it's...

reasonable that our leaders would be that, like they would be the thing we want them to bring about into the world. And so I was commenting that perhaps there's... some introspection that would be beneficial of like, we want to be that thing ourselves. So basically you're using your penis as a parable for being, you know, well-rested, best nutrients, well-rested.

Your brain is clear. You don't have brain plaque. Yeah. Okay, I'll give you maybe the layers of this. I was in San Francisco last week. I was with some of the more powerful people in that world. Yeah. One of them turned to me and they said, you know, I've been casually following your stuff for years. The thing that got me, nighttime erections. And I was like, because I've always wondered, is it?

Is it lowbrow? Is it crass? I've always tried to find my own disposition towards it because I'm not a person that I don't normally play in that kind of stuff. But it really hit. And what we found is like. Nighttime erections, nobody talked about these things before I started talking about it. Sure.

What they are is they're one of the most important biomarkers you can have as a human. Like, you can measure your cholesterol. For, like, blood pressure? It's cardiovascular. It's physiological. It's psychological. And so you can say, how big are your muscles? You can say, are you fat? Are you skinny?

You have bad cholesterol. You have good cholesterol. You can make these general statements, but nighttime erections, both male and female, is one of the most powerful markers for a person's overall health. And if a man doesn't have man and woman, it's easier to measure men than women.

But men who don't have nighttime erections are 70% more likely to have a premature death. And so it's a big deal. But it really captures culture in a way that's unique. Well, you're just scared to piss out of me. But, yeah, I mean, you remember them.

You know, when you're 15 or, you know, when you're sexual prime and, you know, you ride the bus and you wake up every minute. As you get older, that stops. So when my kids were going to school when they were younger, when they would leave the door, I would say, be sure. And...

trip kids to school, knock their books out of their hands, you know, say rude things. Sounds like my dad. Dad, I know, I know, I know. But like the point was, if I told them like, be kind, you know, be considerate, help people. It just goes in one ear off the other. They don't hear it. And so it's like when a speed limit is 15 miles per hour, you don't pay attention. If it's 17, you're like, it's 17. So you have to structure information so it lodges. And so I always played the inverse.

with my kids like the exact opposite and they always thought it was such a fun game and so boners are kind of like that where if you say be fit or exercise like yeah i've heard it but you talk about that and now it creates this new opening of this conversation and so if you talk about what do we want in a political leader you have all these you have 10 to 20 to 30 words we use all the time yeah whatever you talk about them being flaccid I get it and so it's really this entire thing has been

how to use language and medical terminology and these biomarker approaches to actually have a conversation about the future of being human. So as people think I'm talking about boners, I'm not. I'm talking about AI. I'm talking about AI and the future of being human. That's the whole bridge. The boners are the hook.

Yeah, but it metaphorically captures it, it symbolically captures it, it biologically captures it, but many people don't understand that that's the entire thing I'm trying to do. Yeah, you have a reaction because it's something you can resonate with. You're exactly right because if you...

say look eat right exercise sleep like all those things are like okay I know but if you're like morning boners you're like hey yeah I'll have that conversation All right, so this brings us into the realm of, sadly, questions that have been done by other people and other things that you've... Whatever you ask, I will give you something entirely novel. There we go. I like it. So you've sort of touched on it a little bit that you, whenever...

Anyone asks you something or brings up something, you're like, well, you're very data-driven, you like data for yourself, and if there's something you don't know, you're like, show me the data. Your ear is like 61 or 64 years old because you used to shoot guns. But your heart is this and your lungs are this. how do you like what like how do we test for that and are like how do we make sure that those tests are reliable yeah because when i studied political science and and

you have to study stats. And one of the things they teach you is you can make a stat say anything, like figure out the narrative first and then insert the stat. So how do you know that it's real? Like if we start at the edge of the spectrum, we say, if we have a, a 2-year-old next to a 90-year-old. And we ask 100 people which person is 2 and which one is 90. You get a very clear conclusion that you can determine biological age when you contrast a 2-year-old versus a 90-year-old.

And then if you do that same thing and you close in from a 3-year-old to a 79-year-old, right, and you keep on coming in, at some point, you know, the difference between a 43-year-old and a 44-year-old, you can't quite tell. So there. Who has all these banks of data? Like where do you get them?

So sometimes it's governmental databases. Sometimes it's researchers. And so you can basically just say, again, the two-year-old heart is different than the 80-year-old heart. They have different cellular structures. They have different plaques. So you can basically tease out.

what are the characteristics of age? What does the skin of a two-year-old look like versus 90? 90, it's wrinkly and it's sagging. Why? And so you can tease out those molecular characteristics. And so what we've done is we've said, from a molecular perspective in the body, you can tell if a body is two years old or 20 years old or 80 years old, and you can do so with all these different markers. So what we've done is we basically tried, so I'm a collection of 35 trillion cells.

tried to probe my 35 trillion cells and say, How old are you in your structure, in your function? And then we said, okay, now how do we make you younger and how do we make you slow down the speed of aging, like where damage naturally occurs? And so that's what's really been, I think, the change. here is that you can find out a biological age and then change that but you have to start from a molecular perspective this podcast is brought to you by aura

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Yeah. Because you said, like, I want to do like aging Olympics. And once we get a series of criteria, but then there has to be, the data has to be the same for everybody and all that stuff. And that's why I start with like the obvious example. Because there's no dispute that who's 2 and who's 80. Do we agree with that? Sure. A two-year-old, their brain and heart and skin, it's all different than an age-old. So if you start at the extremes... But your markers, those are...

The same for all two-year-olds and all nine-year-olds, et cetera, et cetera? Well, that's exactly the question. Generally speaking, I've never seen a baby with saggy skin or wrinkles. You can start teasing out what things are obvious and you get into more things that are more narrow and non-obvious. And you just work down from obvious to non-obvious. And that's what we've done. And so some data sets are very easy. Like, for example, generally speaking.

Your max heart rate is 220 beats per minute minus your age. So if you're 20 years old, your max heart rate should be 200. If you're 30 years old, your max heart rate should be 190. Now, there's some variation, but generally speaking, you drop 220 minus your age. as you get older and so that data is pretty consistent over a lot of humans like generally the model works you can take the same model and you can do on almost anything else like what are your levels of like you know nad

Over time, there's a decline curve. What about your eyesight? Over time, there's a decline curve. And so there's good enough models in the world where you can see age-related decline according to all variables in the body. So a lot of people begin aging. Like your thymus begins aging, I believe, at age 13. So it begins really early. But you see in certain parts of people's lives, like in...

A person's like late 20s, early 30s, there's like a kind of a big change, right? 40, I heard. We're an evolutionary experiment, and it stops at 40. Your brain stops creating brain cells at 40. Your body starts deteriorating. Yeah. 40 is what... I think, yes, I did this research the day of how much do you die on a daily basis? And so the response, so like you can, like your, your brain, I, if I'm not mistaken, after the age of 25, your brain shrinks every year thereafter.

And so you can then put it on a per day calculation of how much. You can say how much do your telomeres, the end caps, your chromosomes, how much do they shorten? So you can actually do the math on a per day basis. how much entropy is happening inside your body. So that's what we've done. We've gone to the ultimate degree of figuring out what does entropy do to your body on a daily basis.

Okay, speaking as a personal aside, what have you found about brain entropy and how do we stop it? Yeah, so I guess... Recent stuff there is I just completed 60 sessions doing hyperbaric oxygen therapy. So I sit in a chamber. It looks like an alien box. Yeah. And then I get 100% oxygen. I breathe that for 20 minutes and I go off.

five minutes and i cycle on and off and it's in two atmospheres so it's roughly 30 meters below the ocean of pressure i do that so i did 60 sessions of 90 minutes each and we saw significant improvements in my brain wow yeah Yeah. And so there are things you can do to naturally, like, for example, like one of the measures. Sorry, is that a service that somebody offers or you built your own? Yeah, I put it in my home. Right. Because otherwise, I do so many.

things i wouldn't have time so i just put it in the garage and how do you buy a hyperbaric chamber yeah i've worked with a company out of turkey to do this it's hard shell so typically you see like these These little tubes, you go in and you lay down, but they only get 1.2 atmospheres, so it's not enough. You need two atmospheres to hit the spec on the protocol. You get a little bit high on the oxygen.

You know, you could hot box it for sure. No, from the oxygen. No. I mean, when you first start. Because when I get pure oxygen, I'm like, this is great. Yeah. I mean, I guess like maybe when I first started, maybe a little bit, but now I don't, yeah. But that had, so we're going to publish our results next week.

It had a huge impact on my brain. For example, P-Tal, which is one of these proteins you don't want for Alzheimer's, it dropped by something like 80%. It just crushed it. So if you can... Prove, because I've invested in a couple of pharmaceutical companies that are trying to find the cure or slow down Alzheimer's. If you can prove that you're...

Turkish-made hypobaric chamber works, that's huge. You'll see the markers. We show inflammation. We show blood vessel growth. We show cardiovascular improvement. It's probably one of the most effective therapies we've ever done. Well, that's fascinating. To go back to everything, I find it fascinating. All of this stuff is fascinating, and I want to go through it one by one. That's, I think, the main one. It's a natural springboard into what we're talking about because...

People get older, right? Yet now, and I agree with you that we're on the sort of inflection point of health and wellness and tech. And I want to get into AI. Obviously, it's the big thing. But I want to walk before we run. But when you get into it, the first thing that anyone will say or a lot of people will say is, okay, fine, we have better medical science now. People are living longer.

dementia has gone through the roof because our brains, like I said at 40, you said at 25, which is even more depressing, can't keep pace with modern science. And so that's why we have Ronald Reagan, Joe Biden, and everybody that we've... we know and who's older so how like if you're going to save your body or make your body younger

then how do you save your brain? I guess this is one of them. But overall, as a question, isn't that a problem with aging? Yeah, it is. So what we've done is, so going back to the calculation of how much do you die every single day. We basically said, how do you slow down that speed of death? And so if you say the average life expectancy is 77 years old, take that, divide it by the number of days, and there you have your number. And so we have successfully slowed down my speed.

of aging to almost half wow so my birthday is now every 21 months and so that's how you do it so like when you have this um Alzheimer's protein accumulating in your brain, where if it gets to a certain threshold, it tips. If you can stop that from accumulating, you're in a good situation. If you can stop your telomeres from losing their end caps, you can stop blood vessels from retreating.

So that's what we're trying to do is like slow down all these inevitable processes and then like reverse the damage we've done. But that's what we've tried. Like it's a brand new paradigm because some people naturally like, oh, my aunt drinks, you know, a cup of whiskey a day and smokes and she lives.

like 119 they're confusing that she had she won the genetic lottery versus like her lifestyle did that thing and so we're trying to train people up on the idea that you do have control over how fast or how slow you you age and how fast you increase your likelihood of disease or stay away from it. Yeah, I think that's, I guess you get this all the time, but I mean, the... Grandparent, like World War II, sort of greatest generation. Everyone smoked filterless cigarettes. Everyone drank.

Everyone had like an arrowhead in their knee or like a bullet in their elbow. And they lived like my, my grandmother. I had one grandmother live till she was 101 and I had another grandmother live till she was 98. And the only one was a drinker. Yeah. Drank every day, smoked every day. Yeah. One never drank. The only. correlation to anyone neither of them had a job so like yeah you know there's no stress of that kind there anyway

And so I was like, okay, stress is a killer. But that's my rudimentary, put my toes in the pool. But all these people lived until they were super old and did all the shit that we weren't supposed to be doing. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, so there's like a, it's such a big question because if we take a category of dye, let's just say there's a dye input. A dye may be cigarettes, it may be alcohol, it may be our environmental toxins, it may be stress. And if you just simply say...

how bad are those sources of dye? And so we're comparing their generation or our generation. It's not clear which one has it worse. If you look at the toxins we consume on a daily basis, in our water, in the air we breathe, in the food we consume, we may have it worse than them. And so these questions are so complicated. And so what we've been trying to do is to say, okay, let's just take all variables of potential dye. Every single thing that increases the death of my body, I want to isolate.

to figure out how much is it contributing to my dye and then i want to try to offset it and so we've tried to take this really rigorous approach of making a very clean distinction what causes the body to die yeah yeah and so i mean this

This is why it's hard to reason through these things because if you – someone could easily say, well, my parents did blank, therefore. Yes, which is what people do. Totally, which is – you really can't have a structured argument, a conversation like that. So speaking of – which there's I'm sure you know this and you're going to have an answer for it but this doctor says that what you're doing is not scientific approach because there's too many you have hundreds of interventions

He claims that he's doing this to sort of help the process along. But of course, he's trying all sorts of things in one individual. That is not the way you would do a scientific experiment. so it's impossible to tell which ones are working so i'm sure you're familiar with that but as we're talking about all of these die or like all of these data points etc how do you know

what's working, what's not. For example, because now I've taken a personal interest, is how do you know it's the hyperbaric chamber that's helping your Alzheimer's or brain function versus gene therapy? Blueberries, whatever it is. Yeah. We isolate therapies.

So we'll do – we have – I'm the most measured person in history. And sorry, I don't want to keep stopping because I want you to go. But how do they measure you? Like blood testing? Yeah. Get into the – Every test that we can find to measure.

me we do so easy ones like blood i hate but it's tough right do you how many do you get one a day through the vein like once every couple weeks and then the fingers you know i do it like almost daily yeah i'm getting fingerprint cards that we do I do saliva, stool, I do MRIs, ultrasound, we do fitness tests.

um mitochondrial like we just do hundreds of tests like i measure my semen like we measure everything microplastics in my blood microplastics in my semen who doesn't know you know i have i have a lot so i have a lot of microplastics in my testicles Why wouldn't you? So that comes from water or? Yeah, this is the thing where, so.

Yeah, so we do that, and we chase down water supply. Like, what does the water have? Not just you. We're assuming that a lot of modern men have microplastics. Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Which is leading to, because people don't know, but we have filters down there, so that filters that are...

and women have them in their breasts. So this is leading to prostate cancer number one for men, breast cancer number one for women. And 50% more in our brains than we had a decade ago. So the accumulation is very, very high. And so we're trying to isolate all of these variables. And so when scientists criticize me of not being scientific, fine, whatever, what I'm doing is I'm introducing the concept.

that we know, for example, that being overweight is not good for life expectancy. Sure, that's me. That's everyone I know. That's not disputed a lot. You can find outliers where people are... obese and live long because they've got certain genes or whatever but generally speaking and so like no starting that principle then you can start walking back um what is the biomarker for like a proper body mass index what is the appropriate level for blood glucose

levels you don't have a spike what is appropriate levels for cholesterol so you can actually we know a lot and so when they take me and they're like oh like you know they've pushed away but they don't um and it's really weird because it's they They really should say what Brian is doing is really a good example of scientific measurement by doing this stuff. Now, whether you can conclude like a population level study, we can't do that.

He's introducing the concept that measuring things is really good. Referencing scientific data is really good. And so it confuses people because they're like, oh, it's not scientific valid. So what is it then? Is it like, is it woo science? So it's really. I think that...

The scientists should be much more articulate and say, what I do like here is measurement is amazing. Science begins with counting. And so I'm measuring everything. So that's going back to your question. So I measure everything. isolate a therapy, and we say, what happens to these biomarkers when I, my baseline, and then when I do the therapy, and we measure afterwards, and we say, what happened?

And so we do this continually through all these different therapies. And so it's not double placebo. It's not controlled. So there's variability, and that's fine. We're trying to our very best in these narrow circumstances. So it still is informative. Look, fascinating. Hold on, I'm going to double check, but I think that the same doctor said it's not scientific, but that it's good that you're doing it because it brings attention to the field.

It's good, no? We got some good with the bad? No, it's good. It's like, I think the anti-aging scientists have been very stingy. That they view themselves as the righteous carriers of the field going forward. And anyone who doesn't do it the way they do. And so I think they really, the move for them, they don't have these good intuitions on social media. They really should.

leaned into it and said, yes, and. We like what he's doing, and let us tell you how we're going to complement what he's doing with our stuff. And instead, they said, no but. And no but always loses. Right. Always. And so they just don't have right intuitions on social media landscape and the no but just kind of kills it. Yeah. They should just lean into it. So let's get down to.

some of the controversial stuff. See, my problem is, to go back to my problem with everything, is I'll go to my weird, anything you put in your body is going to have a repercussion that is hitherto. No, right. So anything you ingest, anything. And it could be stuff you don't know. It could be microplastics. It could be heavy metals. All this crap could be from the air or whatever. And so therefore, anything you ingest, any drug, anything you take. So I don't like to take anything.

pretty much anything you know if you take antibiotics it kills your probiotics and it's like napalm for your biome and all this stuff so you're taking a lot of stuff and it reminds me of one story which i'll keep quick but I think, and I want you to go to town after this one, is Finish Stride. Yeah, finasteride. Finasteride. Yeah. Propecia. Yeah. So I had a doctor, and I wasn't even losing my hair, but he was saying my buddy was losing his hair, so he took Propecia for years and years and years.

But he said, look, if you take a tiny little amount of this stuff, you won't get prostate cancer. And not all, but if you live a long life, you're going to probably get prostate cancer. So you just take it. You won't get prostate cancer. So just do it proactively, right? Pretty good pitch. So he gave me, they're tiny little pills, and he gave me a pill cutter. Yeah.

And I traveled a lot. I was doing a news show and whatever, and so I was taking the pills. No, I just couldn't get into cutting them and whatever. So I took, I don't know, three weeks, and then I couldn't be arsed.

post finasteride syndrome is like suicidal thoughts your penis doesn't work speaking of erections uh it shrinks so you're taking this for your hair loss to try theoretically because you want to get girlfriends you get girlfriends and your penis doesn't work yeah exactly feeling suicidal which is worse yeah so then the reason why i know about it is because they had to send me the

literature on it because i had been prescribed yeah the the drug thank god i didn't take it my buddy who took it by the way for his hair didn't have any or laces so like that's the problem like you're gonna get is you're taking so many things how do you know One of them is, for example, rapamycin. Yeah. So I'm sure you hear this all the time. I'm a layman.

You're taking a lot of stuff. What if they have unforeseen? Yeah. Yeah. A lot of people start with the assumption that I'm at greater risk than they are because they assume I do a lot of experimentation. Sure. And what I try to explain to them is. They do as much experimentation as I do. Theirs is just uncontrolled. So when they ate the burger and fries for lunch, that's an experimentation. Cocaine. Cocaine, exactly. We're experimenting all the time with it. So I argue that.

I'm a lower risk experimenter than someone else because I'm measuring everything. So for every drug I take, not supplements, not foods, everything I do, we have extensive analysis on the profile. Like what is the intent? What are the intended effects? What are the side effects? And so I've never taken finasteride for that reason. We know the side effect profile. We know the numbers. We've seen the clinical studies and the data. I would never touch it. It's way too risky. For the yield, for that.

Trade-off is not worth it. But you have this, I think it's an immune suppressor. Yeah, so rapamycin, yeah. So rapamycin is, I took it. I took it for several years. It's one of the most promising drugs in anti-aging. So if you ask anti-aging scientists.

what are you most excited about rapamycin would probably be number one wow and so it has a lot of uh the evidence behind it's really good but why what's the uh that basically has um anti-aging effects like it has it's a unique molecule but sorry when i say why i mean like is it because it depresses our immune system and our immune system ages us or something oh it's working on the mTOR pathway so it's like a Yeah, it's a...

There's details on it, but basically like in my studies, it passed like the... Well, that's the mice one. You test things in mice, right? And then they had an initial result that was really great. Then they did this much more advanced testing protocol, which is also great. more rigorous study protocol among multiple groups. And it's kind of like passing through stages of scientific acceptance. And so it hit a certain threshold where scientists were like,

this is pretty good. It's rigorously studied. The results are solid. They've been reproduced. So everyone's like looking good. Now we need to show it into like dogs and show it into humans. So the translation from animals to humans is not there yet. So I was doing rapamycin.

And so we were measuring this extensively, but it's not a free drug in that you have side effects. You're going to go thumbs out of your back. Exactly. Basically, yeah. But all things have side effects. Coffee has side effects. Sure. What? Do you drink coffee? Yeah. How much? Not much. I drink tea, a lot of tea. What kind of tea? Irish breakfast tea. Yeah, that's your jam. Gunpowder tea. In the morning? Yeah.

Yeah. First thing. Yeah. Okay. And then when does coffee come in? Whenever. Oh, really? Chaos theory. Is that how your life? Chaos. Total chaos. My life is chaos. So when you wake up. You're not quite even sure how the day is going to go. No. Whoa. Chaos. Every day, chaos. That's including who you're going to talk to. Today, I guess we had this scheduled, so I thought some organization, but generally speaking, around these organized appointments. Yeah, I mean.

It used to be even worse. I travel quite a bit, and it would be like my ex-wife, maybe my ex-wife, would be like, that's not how people are. People don't go to Iraq within two hours' notice. And you're like, yeah, they do, because that's the news. Otherwise, they call it the olds. You have to go as it's happening.

And like, when are you going to be home? I'm going to be home when I'm going to be like, I'm going to try to get, but we have to go to Turkey because the Syria, because the Kurds are at war. And so we have to get a helicopter and you get home. You know, I'm alive. I made it home. And they'd be like, Yeah, it's 3.30. And you've been doing this for, this is you. Yeah, chaos. All the time. Whenever you eat. Now, I'm obsessed with sleep. Yeah. I like to eat, but I like to eat like...

Things that aren't going to kill me. Yeah. I used to drink a lot of booze. Yeah, what kind of booze? Well, mostly wine. Yeah. But as I get older. Yeah. I can't handle the hangovers. Yeah, side effect. And so I literally, thank you, I could pull back from any kind of... you know, drug or alcohol or anything. I could pull back quite easily. And now, just naturally, a lot less booze. But the booze in the olden days led to a lot of chaos. Yeah, I'm sure. Yeah. So do you like this? I don't mind it.

But it's just what I know. Yeah. Yeah. And what's your chronological age right now? A million. I'm the opposite of you, which is why I find you so fascinating. Look, again, just to be clear, too, I don't have any moral quandary about any of this. Like the people are like. well, rapamycin, it could be bad, and he's taking things that are bad for him. Who cares? It's you. You can do whatever the hell you want. Like people say, oh, Shane, you shouldn't have that whiskey. Okay.

F you. Like if you want to take rapamycin, I'm like, go. And by the way, if I can benefit from your suffering, I would love that. So actually, I'll finish rapamycin. Rapamycin, I took it. I did it for years. We decided to stop because it does have side effects. So I get these small tissue infections like canker sores and stuff like that. I think it lowers my HRV. It makes my nervous system like a bit more heightened up.

So like it negatively affects my sleep. It raised my blood glucose. So I kind of have these complicated things like finasteride. Finasteride had like sexual dysfunction. Rapamycin has its own set of things. And so we stopped doing it. And then we, after that, we also, a month later, we found a paper that came out.

it actually increased the speed of aging on one variable which is looking at these dna methylation patterns and so like the fun thing about this is like the internet like love this right like right here you got this don't die guy who's doing like

one of the best drugs in anti-aging, and this new study comes out, and it's like, actually, it's helping him, making him age faster. Now, like, is that really the case? Are we going to find more data? Like, TBD. But still, it was funny. I hate I told you so, people. Sorry. It was funny. No, I don't like them. I know.

I'm going to get, but let him do what he wants. Like, I told you so. So people were like, people were like, lol, right? Like it was like, it was a banger across social media. People were like, this is, we love the don't die guy dying. And then other people were like, You guys don't understand.

this is science, right? Like you, you want to try stuff, you want to publish the results, whether they're positive or negative, you want to publish those. And so it was just like, fine, like all of it's fine. It also, you know, pretends that. I am going to die in a very ironic, well, me in particular, in an ironic way. Right. So that's fine. Well, you're just going to have a much longer obituary.

because we're all going to die. I mean, unless you've found some stuff, we're not going to die, but we're all going to die. You're going to die, theoretically, a lot later than the rest of us and have a lot more healthy existence during that extra time. Yeah, you know, like... So Shane, I'm serious for a minute for this. I don't think that it's clear that we're going to die. So that's great.

I got legit. Yeah, I do. But I don't know as much about it as you do. Yeah. I've got another question for you. Okay, first I want to delve into that because that's a huge statement. And by the way, it's a huge statement, and I don't take statements lightly, a huge statement by a guy who's spent a lot more time than I have researching and doing it, and by the way, using his own body as a guinea pig.

get into that but is there a shortcut and the reason why i ask is other people in silicon valley um It's a different thing, but it relates, is interstellar travel. And they were saying, well, we're not going to get in a spaceship and go. We're going to download our consciousness into an AI or whatever and send it into a clone.

or of someone else that lives over there and then you're in the new fleshy vessel and then you go. So if you can download your consciousness, which they're already working on. into an ai or whatever and then you can have a perfect body why do i take 75 supplements an hour. Yeah. I mean, we may get there. We don't know. Because we're not there yet and you are human. Exactly. You need to buy yourself time. You need to be around. To understand what I'm trying to do, imagine if...

If you're off and then you're turned on and all of a sudden you have consciousness and you don't know anything, like nothing, like as an adult, you wake up and it's like, okay, what do I do now? Survive. How do I live? Just like your very first impulse, your very first thought. What do you do? What do I do with this boner? Shut up. Just like at the absolute essence, like ground zero epicenter of you wake up in your conscious. What?

What do you think about? What do you do? What do you prioritize? What do you want? And that's what I'm trying to say is this moment is like an on button, an on switch. we just turned on, on our path to superintelligence. And it's this really spectacular moment.

where we realize we've been running scripts of how society has told us to live. Like we want to do this. We need to do that. We want to become that. They're all just pre-programmed. But if you just say that's all like what we've been programmed to do. You open up. That's what don't die is, is you turn it on and you say, what is existence? That's what I'm trying to say is this moment. Love it. Now let's get, that's the macro. Let's get to the micro. Don't die.

So you said the jury's not in yet. It's like, how do you not die? Yeah. So this is... Okay, let me try to... Don't die. is the final boss ideology of intelligent existence. So the final boss of the universe is entropy. It's this, right? Like at some point in time, the energy runs out of energy. The universe runs out of energy. So entropy is the final boss. And then you start layering up all the other abstractions. The reason why Don't Die is the final boss ideology is...

As you give birth to super intelligence as a species, the zeroth order priority becomes don't die. That's the only thing intelligence cares about. intelligence doesn't care about accomplishment or accolades or or having a building named after them or like a number of followers it just doesn't want to die and once it doesn't want to die how do you know take any

Take our own intelligence. Take animal intelligence. Take any intelligence that's been emergent. It has that natural instinct. Now, will AI have that? We'll see. But the idea, if we are... If we are giving birth to AI and AI has some kind of relationship with us, like if we seed it to some extent, possible. But what I'm saying is as we are emerging with AI.

Our shared instinct is don't die. And that's whatever you believe in an afterlife, whether you believe in whatever. Don't die is the most played game by every human on the planet every second of every day. Right now, you and I are both playing Don't Die. So in this room, if something threatened our lives, we would stop this conversation.

And we'd say not dying is a higher priority. So any moment in your life where anything that threatens your existence, you deprioritize everything else in existence to make sure you're not dead. Now, if you die slowly, like you have a fried chicken. chicken. That's fine. But don't die. Cancer probably would be a better sales tool than fried chicken, but sure. Yeah. You remember when COVID happened in March of, you know, whatever, 2022? 2020. 2020.

the world shut down overnight. Like all events were canceled. Everyone's plans were canceled. Like, and let's see, not talk about like what happened afterwards or we all split, but like, that's how badly we don't want to die. We don't want to die. That's a good point. We really don't want to die at any moment. And so, yeah, this conversation normally takes me...

two hours to actually explain it. So I'm really rushing it. But what I'm trying to say... I thought you were, because you did this, and then I was like, oh, he's trying to dumb it down for me. No, because people are... I've had this conversation, so I've been doing...

these dinners at my house. I spent two hours going through this conversation. I've done it enough times. I know with 99% accuracy what a person's going to say to us. They're pre-programmed, they're pre-scripted. People are watching this and I'm like, I know exactly.

what they're gonna think I know what they're gonna say in my defense that's why I started with Sherlock Holmes because I've seen the same questions and you give the same answers I'm like I don't want to do a script yeah you know and by the way this is incredibly interesting so I didn't want to interrupt but keep going yeah so What I'm trying to suggest is that the most important thing happening on planet Earth is we're giving birth to superintelligence.

what do you do? And I'm saying that there's no existing form of human thought, not in democracy, not in capitalism, not any religion. Like we can't go to democracy and say like, Hey, what should we do? We can't go to capitalism. help us solve the AI alignment problem and what we do as a species. So what I'm saying is a new ideology needs to emerge. I'll tell you, honestly, what I'm doing right now is... I'm trying to make Don't Die into the world's most influential ideology by 2027.

So two years time. Fast. Exactly. The fastest growing ideology in human history. Wow. And have something like, you know, a million citizens around the world who are all in on this philosophy. We have basically leaders trained all over the world who are organizing local groups. So Don't Die is a religion. Don't Die is an economic system. Don't Die is a political system. Don't Die is an ethical and moral and social system. Let's say we have something like a trillion.

dollars under management where people take their savings and they put it into a don't die managed fund where we can move money in markets to actually move towards things that push towards don't die but basically trying to build a nation state and a religion and a social... movement in a two-year time period to basically track with the progress of AI so that we have a guiding light on what we do as a species in this moment. That's the goal.

I mean, it's ambitious, obviously. I get why people have said you're obsessed with Joseph Smith. And you want to be your own Joseph Smith. So that I didn't understand before. Actually, it's not Joseph Smith. My competitor is Jesus. people will hear this and be like, oh my God, like he's lost his mind. Right. But like, if you just say who has played don't die. Right. Right. Like Jesus delivered a don't die message. He said,

Here's the story. Do these things and you don't die. You get after that, right? And so there's been so many pitches on do this, don't die. And so basically the question is, in our age, what is salvation? If you don't die, then you're going to be... I don't know if you're going to be Jesus, but you're going to be up there. So it's not that I am. You're going to be Jesus. It's this ideology, basically this movement that we are all part of. We are our own salvation. So that's the goal.

It's not a one-man person. It's not like... It's also, look, I don't know, maybe you shoot for the moon and you hit the stars, but look, again, if you don't die... Like, if you win this thing, because there's a lot of naysayers who are going to be like, well, he's going to die, and then when he dies, that's what I was being pithy about.

you're going to have a better obituary than me. But look, if you don't die, then people are going to sign up in droves, obviously, because they don't want to die. And so having a fund or moving capital markets or political entities, it's not so crazy.

It's crazy to think that it's going to happen in two years. Maybe in 30 years when you don't die and everybody else is dead and you're sitting there going, here I am. And they'll be like, give me the rapamycin. Let's go. Well, that's interesting. I mean, look, if anybody... in the world, I think, just said, I've...

done it through meditation i've done it through ai i've done it through science i've done it through not pooing i've done it through whatever it is and said this is the way to do it also people like i think to be told like this is the way you do it this way and then this is the way and if

you said like here are the steps that you're the 10 steps and if you do these you don't die i mean you'd be you'd be up there yeah it's pretty crazy pretty i mean crazy like yeah crazy like a fox how do you deal with people I said that's crazy in a modern way. But how do people say that's crazy? None of us have any idea what we're talking about. Right. And if we all introspect, we realize that we are not the independent thinkers we think we are. We do what other people do.

We want to be part of the tribe. We don't want to be ostracized. And so it doesn't matter at all. What anyone says in response to my ideas. Right. Okay. The only thing that matters is what they do. Right. And so don't die is, I would argue, one of the fastest growing ideologies in the world right now. Wow.

Already. How? Like online? Yeah, in the zeitgeist. Like social media. Yeah, like you say, like, what are the leading ideologies of the world right now, right? You could say, like, I am an American, a nation state, and within the American structure, I'm either a Republican. or Democrat or I'm hard and I'm left or I'm right or whatever. So if you latch onto an ideology, like where is it? And then which one of those are growing at what speed? Don't die.

challenges the status quo of all those systems right all of them yeah because it supersedes them all exactly that it's the final boss ideology and the primary and it's like the it's the most obvious thing it's inevitable So it's not even a question whether this is correct. It is inevitably correct. It's just a matter of when are you going to be an early adopter or are you going to be a late adopter? And so it's just it's on its way. It's been born. It's running. And can you not die?

I mean, this is the thing. So like we are. So if OK, that requires us to think about how fast my progress be. to try to solve the actual things that stop us from dying, right? If we say, okay, well, I can map the 19th century into the 20th century and say, how fast did things progress in those timeframes? And can I use that to extrapolate a model about what would happen in the future? That's one way of doing it.

it but now it's a case that with ai we're bringing online you know you could say like the equivalent of billions of phd equivalent intelligences in this insanely short period of time and soon it'll probably be trillions So now we have basically like billions or even trillions of geniuses now working on these problems. And you just say, okay, I take that on face value.

how fast might be the speed we can make progress now there's still real world limitations like you have to run studies and you have to like do all that but basically To me, it's a very simple observation. The amount of intelligence coming online right now is insane. It's more than we can comprehend. We can't even speak intelligently to know how much is coming online. And in that case, I would say if I'm a... So this is like a Pascal's wager. Like, I'm a betting man.

I want to be around for this because I think that I probably can't predict what actually was going to happen. Therefore, the only thing I know about existence, like literally the only thing I know about existence is I don't want to die right now. Yeah. Outside of that, it's I.

can't see it anymore and so that's when it comes back to this thing of like any other ideology that's going to supersede this and be like but brian live life like why would i take your old paradigm of living life of like being out with friends and drinking and smoking and stuff like that that's I don't know. Okay, but you know what? It's not.

Sort of is. So I want to say for me, it is not. It is painful. I have terrible sleep. The next morning I'm grumpy. My mind is clattered. I have terrible judgment. Wrecks me. You're still good. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. That's the only thing that keeps people from doing it all the time is like the next morning. But people even like that. I mean, you like that sort of hangover kind of silly feeling or. chaos versus you're highly regimented um is you know survival is number one

Fighting boredom's number two. I mean, like, most people want to talk about entropy. Like, we went to a deli out here in the valley that's a famous deli, Brent's Deli. And we were sitting there, and it was all old people. Yeah. They had oxygen. It was a riot of humanity. And I was watching, I was saying the irony of what would you think if you saw our breakfast? But A, but B, you know, everyone was dying in there, quite obviously dying.

It was like literally also a look at sort of the majority of lives lived are sort of... you know shuffling off into death sort of stultifyingly boring and yeah staying out here and in the valley and just sort of existing and look at least you're

You're saying, you know, rage, rage against the dying of the light. And also you've at least rewired your brain to say, hey, ingesting these things or trying these things or doing these things, you know, bring me happiness. Yeah. And also I'm saying that like, so right now. There's a cultural norm that Shane in this moment at like whatever time it is right now.

You have the ultimate authority to decide what you do. If there's whiskey in front of you, do you want to drink the whiskey? You're like, well, who do I consult? Me, right now. You don't consult you one year from now. You don't consult you five years from now. And you don't consult you who's dead. Right. So I had a friend. I have a high school friend. He 42 years old. He died in his sleep just recently. He had an enlarged heart. He didn't know it was an issue. Now.

If he could trace back and make life decisions, he might make very different decisions. So in the moment where you're like, yeah, it's kind of fun to drink, smoke, and be out late. I wonder if you actually expanded the concept of what does it mean to be Shane?

and who gets decision authority like that's a very weird concept for us or when that's a good that's a good philosophical question but when so for example if i was 29 and you would ask me that i'd say even if i knew it was going to kill me i'd say i don't give That's right. Because I want to enjoy my life and I want to live it the way I want to live it until I die. If you're 62. Yes.

And they say, okay, you can have 10 more years of boners or be in a wheelchair for 10 years. You're going to go back to a 29-year-old and say, dude, what are you doing? Stop doing that. Yeah, exactly. But it depends on when you ask the question. Exactly. And then it matters who gets to vote on what time.

And so now if you throw into the equation where let's say in five years time, we legitimately figured out how to like rejuvenate ourselves, where if you're like a 60 year old with like kind of a broken body hurt, you can't sleep and it's painful and you can get back to it.

20 year old, vibrant youthful state. And so then the pitch is like, would you like, would you give up a few old school things to make sure you're around for this thing? That's why this bargain is so interesting. When death is inevitable. YOLO is the default. And it's so hard to see past YOLO where everyone cements into YOLO of like, of course you're YOLO. Like, what else would you do? But that's what I'm saying that this moment, this is...

This is when people from 500 years in the future, when they look back at this moment, they will see this is the moment in the history books where we transition from death being inevitable. to a horizon where we didn't quite know how long we could live. But it's basically like this is the moment. Pretty amazing. Death is not only, sorry, inevitable. It's beautiful, i.e. people believe, or there is a societal norm that believes that life is special.

beautiful and poetic because it's so short yeah people have an endless list of why death is beautiful but no one's volunteering to die yeah sure so it's cope It's like, again, once you realize— Well, people want to die. I think they don't want to, but people are sort of ready to die when they're older. They're like, my back hurts. So I think you— In a very, very narrow way. old band yeah but you hit the nail on the head which is if you could go to a 62 year old and say okay it sucks now but

You know, my patent-pending hyperbaric chamber. Yeah, exactly. You can go into it, and your Alzheimer's goes away, and your knee pain goes away, and everything goes away. So now you're starting to get it. It's like we're starting to like peel back the layers of the onion. But you realize like even if you can analyze in your own commentary, right? If you start.

evaluating what society has programmed you to think you realize like, it's not like Shane independently be like, I choose this existence. You're programmed with all these things you've been told. And when you get some. new frameworks it's like honestly like i can kind of see that contrast yeah and so this is it just takes a little bit of time to warm up yeah but you realize you're otherwise trapped in this yolo thing that's yeah

I'm sold. When you become Joseph Smith, I'm going to be your Brigham Young, and I'll be number two of the throne. I wanted to... I don't even... All of these seem, you know, anticlimactic after... after that discussion. But I have a bunch of stuff here that I wrote myself. One is I love Greece. I lived there before coming back here and starting Bison.

I love the story. There's a guy, a steel worker from Pittsburgh, went to the hospital and they're like, you have stage four lung cancer and you're going to die. So just, you know, whatever you want to do, do it because. So he's like, well, I have some family in Greece. I always wanted to go back, so he went to Ikaria.

You know, 20 years later, they found him. He's still there. And it wasn't like they effed up the... the x-rays and stuff i mean he had stage four cancer icari is now a blue zone and people live well into their hundreds i've been there many times i'm fascinated by it they have a lot of weird things like they have the horta but like horta just means bitter greens but their horta grows like in these tide pools and it's sort of like it's a superfood which you talk about. It's called Samphir.

And they also have a honey, which only really exists there. And no stress, like the stores leave their doors open and you just leave whatever money you want. And there's like hills, so you go up and down. Another blue zone, Sardinia, same, like diet and up and down. Okinawa, I want to say, is another one where they have the purple yams. So there are geographical ways that then become genetic. What do you think? What are your thoughts on blue zones?

Yeah, I mean, they've been in the press quite a bit. One, because they uncovered a lot of fraud. Oh, really? Whoa, whoa, whoa. What's the fraud? Lying? Life insurance fraud, yeah. Yeah, some of the data has been called into question because of good old-fashioned human fraud of people collecting money. Well, now you just bum me out. No, that's fine. I think I haven't looked into this too closely. I think there's still an effect.

I don't know if it's as pronounced, but it got muddied because of the fraud. Well, but hold on. There's fraud in Sardinia, Okinawa, and Icaria? Yeah, in driving those numbers, yeah, there's basically the number for pumped because humans were doing fraud. I see there. I do something every day. I didn't know that. Well, that's terrible.

I guess it's terrible for you, too, because I was going to say it kind of proves your theory a little bit, which is like superfoods, rest, exercise, lack of stress lead to.

longer life yeah maybe uh the other thing is what do you have to say since we're in la right now and i cannot because i'm kind of a germaphobe yeah germaware germaware like when anyone's like you know someone's sick and they're like you know and and you're like what are you doing and you're like you know how people get sick it's not like wind on the back of your neck like it's your

you know, stuff getting into my, anyway, if we're in LA right now and you're doing all these things that are, and like you've had Tesla's burn and, you know, you know, houses with lead paint and you've had insulation and asbestos and all this stuff. Now, this is probably a lot of fraud as well, but they're coming to every house saying you need $250,000 of remediation or you're sitting in a cancer pit.

Um, what if you're doing all these things correctly? Yeah. And then there's a fire in LA and we're all going to die. Yeah. Yeah, so we've been very on top of this. So we started working with a few groups that are measuring air quality, water quality, soil quality. So we're trying to generate data. So we're waiting for data on a broader collection set. Inside my house, we measure all these variables. So we measure

Perfect air, perfect water quality, et cetera. So we're trying our very best. So in my house, we try to maintain a perfect ecosystem. Outside, we try to measure. So it's underway. It's a legitimate question. How bad is it right now? We don't have data yet.

Still in the collection phase. What kind of water do you drink? So I have a reverse osmosis system with a carbon bed. So you do your own. Yeah, so it's about $1,000. Yeah, on my website, anybody can see what I have. And the guy who does my system, anybody can do that. So, again, we try to measure everything, like every single calorie I put into my mouth, every single drop of water. We measure everything.

Of course, there's always risk. I walk out of this studio and I'm going to breathe the air of Los Angeles. And so that's right. So there are some things we can't control. So we are humble. We're self-aware. We realize we can't control all things. But if you want to be the Olympic champion gold medalist of not dying, which you've said before, or I'm paraphrasing, why not move to Fiji or Switzerland?

Yeah, so we're currently talking about it. Really? Yeah. We have a big team here, and so it's a big decision. Right, right, right. So we're trying to make an informed decision. Yeah. Yeah, but we're open to it. We're open to live somewhere else. Yeah. Where? That's a good question.

Because every place has its own trade-off. Like New Zealand, but New Zealand has the big rents in the ozone, so there's all kinds of... Yeah, and also New Zealand is a few decades behind in medical technology. It's very hard to get stuff done there. I was just there. Great country for a whole bunch of reasons. Dubai is great for all kinds of reasons, but the air quality there is awful. So there's always trade-offs everywhere you go.

It's not a clean, like there's just one place to go. What's up there? So a friend of mine, actually, he just built some longevity maps where he uses data to quantify these things of where are the clusters. So he's trying to build like a new Blue Zones model based upon data.

that can be trusted so i'm working with him on that of like where are the true next blue zones it's still being done but come on give me a ball no i don't know we're not gonna hold you to it he the first version of the map he showed me there was he has the world map Yeah, yeah. things are going where who's going to do well winners and losers and then also contemplations on longevity on income all the above so what i didn't know

Which thank you for. I didn't know before today is that you want to build the largest new religion or whatever you want to call it. That's interesting. I thought you want to live longer and have a better quality of life as you live longer, which is totally rational, totally sane. What are the top five... breakthroughs that you've found or seen or stumbled upon yeah so i'll tell you i'll just give it to you

So here's what I'd suggest for you from basically what I've learned. So one is you want to find anything that is threatening your life right now. No, I'm talking about like chemical breakthroughs or drugs. I know. I go to Mayo and they tell me why. Oh, cool. Okay. Yeah. No, like here's the thing, like Zempik or… Oh, I see. Or Remsveratol, whatever it is. Yeah. So the thing that I do not think that the things I'm doing now…

are going to allow me to not die. Right. The things I'm doing now. Your beginning. Will allow me to be healthy. Yeah. And now will I extend my lifespan? I don't know. Yeah. So the point of this is not that I don't think I'm going to save what I'm doing. I'm trying to say. that my daily practice is a new ideology. And this new ideology is a final bias ideology for all of intelligence. It's final bias for humans and for AI. So I'm basically...

I'm practicing an ideology by doing this. And so in that... You're practicing it based on the theory, not the practice, not the synthesis. Yes, exactly. Like people, you can understand ideology or beliefs through... preaching, or you can understand it through behavior. You have faith.

Yeah, or I have data. You have faith in data. Anyway, give me the five things that you found that are amazing. Yeah, the five most amazing things for everyone to do right now. Number one is to manage your resting heart rate before sleep. the number one highest value thing you can do so because sleep is the most important thing in the entire world that you can do and your resting heart rate just before bed is your highest value predictor of whether you'll sleep well or poorly and so

I'm a big sleeper. Yeah, so you just want to drive down your resting heart rate. So you want to have your last meal of the day at least two hours before bed. What about bathing? Is that good? Yeah, so you can do it. So that's a wind-up routine. So the biggest one, though, is food.

So if your bedtime is at 10, eat your last meal of the day at 8. Done. Easy. But then try 7. I don't want any of that stuff. I want a drug or something. Like you've found something. I don't think I have a good answer for you. Really? Wow. Okay. Probaric oxygen therapy has been great, but it's not up there. I'm sold on that. Yeah, it's up there. That's great. It's not a replacement for sleep or for exercise. I got it. Yeah. The other ones are pretty marginal. You want to have the basics in place.

but uh yeah there's okay the top five are the the five things you're deficient in yeah me Anyone. Oh yeah. Okay. Yeah. Like they, so this is what I've done at my company blueprint is we just say like, here's a foundation.

and then figure out your deficiencies. People always want to say, what is your number one supplement or what's your number one thing? It's the thing you're deficient in. Oh, I wanted to bring this up too. You say we're at war with ourselves or we're at war with our brains. I love that. I don't want to get into that.

The other thing is, and now speaking of social media and its power, I read this somewhere. I don't even remember where it's on social media. And it was somebody saying, look, we have these parasites in our brain. And some parasites like sugar and some parasites.

like fat and so it's like when you're hungry you're like you go to the fridge and you open it up and you're like do I want you know meat or do i want ice cream and it's the various parasites fighting now you could say it's a parasite or you could say it's because humans want sugar and fat because we couldn't get it before in our diet so you know so the human just wants salt or sugar Sure.

Got it. But no, I'm talking about medical, like you said, like it was MPIC in minor micro doses or something, or it could be good or whatever. The other thing I saw on social media, which was interesting, I don't know if it's true, is they say like your cartilage, if you want to measure it.

age, cartilage in young people is white. By the time you get older, it's sort of yellowed and it's burnt. And that's because we generate some sort of chemical that ages us. And you're like, okay, well, let's get rid of that chemical.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, well said. Get into that. Yeah, this is what I'm talking about. So starting off the example of two-year-old, nine-year-old, we see a baseline. What does their cartridge look like? And then what happens in that process? What drives it down? What makes it yellow? What makes it brittle? So yeah.

Yeah, so those are all chemical processes we're trying to offset. And so it has to do with diet and sleep and exercise. See, I don't want that answer. I want the ozempic and the hyperbaric shamer. I want you to say, look, I did all these things, Shane, and I found... Okay, okay, here we go. Yeah, go on.

for you okay um i am currently doing a focused shockwave therapy so i first talked about this because i did this on my penis yes yeah as you do as you do so well first of all what shockwave therapy why would you do it on your penis so we were there's a lot of similarities in your research here just joking so it was actually so I was doing a therapy for my lungs and we were trying to

rejuvenate my lungs and I was inhaling uh this stuff and I while I was doing I thought I might as well pair another therapy with this so I sat on this electromagnetic uh thing and it was stimulating because it was like rebuild muscles in the anus because as you age those muscles

muscles deteriorate so like we're just like messing around like can we rebuild muscle so i did this and i started having a lot of nighttime erections and i was like what it's like brought this up with my team why and so then uh we did a research like why do a

happen at night and we found all this rich literature of like actually it's a really big deal and it's a biomarker so then we said okay so can i get a can i actually measure it so then we looked around and we found a company that had a little device

I should have brought one today. It's a cube. It's like a centimeter cubed. You put it on the base of your penis and you go to bed and you forget you have it on. It's very low key. And you wake up in the morning and it tells you how many erections you had and what this...

strength of each one was. And so you go through typically three to five cycles, where you'll go through an erection cycle, maybe it's 40 minutes, stops, or next erection cycle, and you get an overall score. And then you can age yourself. So like, for example, the average 70 year old

has nighttime erections of, I think, 50 minutes. And the average 18-year-old has an average of about two hours and 30 minutes. During their sleep. Yep. So it declines with time. So as you're 18, two and a half hours roughly per night. When you're 18, you have a boner for two and a half hours.

hours at night? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So then we said, okay, so now I've got a baseline. So I was, uh, two hours and 12 minutes, which was about where a 45 year old would be. And so then we said, okay, what therapy change nighttime erections. And so one of the therapies we found clinical evidence for was focused shockwave therapy. So it's sending acoustical waves and it creates these micro damages in the tissue and you rebuild.

Right, like when you work out. Yeah, exactly. And so this technology is used for rehabilitation, like knees and ankles and ACLs, et cetera. It can also be used for the penis. And so we did that. You're going to have a lot of old dudes sitting on clothes dryers.

After they see this. The study showed it works for erectile dysfunction. Wow. So I didn't have ED. I didn't have ED, but we were saying, can you basically, if it works for that. Yeah, it's your biomarker. I get it. So I did it. And so we did that. And my nighttime. erections now are around three hours per night. So I'm substantially more than an average 18-year-old. So this is the thing where people say, so when the scientist says,

What Brian's doing is not scientific, right? I'm having... erections that are longer than the average 18 year old you take you take my other markers too it's like fine i'll take that also my body is legitimately functioning like yeah an 18 year old right right it's not

Following the age curves, like we're interesting. And so, yeah, so back to your question. So once we figured out this technology was cool for one therapy, we did said, what if we did it for my entire body? Right. So I started, I got a machine at the house. So now we do the protocol. call where I do focus chakra therapy on every joint of my body. So my back, my elbows, my wrists, my knees, and I just got an MRI back.

I fixed a torn meniscus. So I fixed the tear I had in my right knee, which they're very hard to repair. So that is an example of like, it's an easy answer. Do focus shockwave therapy. On your joints, so even if you have an injury like a sprained ankle or something that happened years ago, you can still go back to it and do this, and it has rejuvenation effects. That's amazing because that was another question.

You talked about your body. You say I used to shoot guns, so my ear is this, but my heart is this. You're like, well, what happens if you're rejuvenating your body and you have like – I used to play football, I think. Yes. So you have like – a busted knee from football or a broken ankle or because i have that now i'm like yeah this thing hurts and they're like yeah did you hurt it and i'm like yeah when i was 17 playing rugby exactly and they're like yeah well now that's what it is so so

So that's interesting because if you can actually – because you don't want to sort of get older where the sum of your old parts and half of your parts are broken. So like you start – if you piece together our conversation today and you start saying like, okay, HBOT. can make your brain have less proteins that contribute to Alzheimer's. So HBOT is the hyperbaric chamber, and that is plaque in your brain. How does it...

How does it take the plaque out? Because it doesn't plaque them up through your biome. The plaque is Parkinson's, Alzheimer's.

Louis body dementia, I want to say? Basically, when you do a hyperbaric, when we inhale oxygen, our bodies get a certain degree of oxygen saturation. But when you get into hyperbaric, you're in this... compressed chamber and you're getting 100% oxygen versus our atmosphere 21% oxygen so you're getting hyper concentrated oxygen in a hyper compressed chamber therefore then it takes it pushes it through your plasma and diffuses oxygen throughout your entire body so you get a high

state of oxygenation throughout the entire body and this increased oxygenation it does all sorts of positive things like it triggers stem cell production it reduces inflammation great yeah so it just has all these whole body effects which is why it's been so fun for us is like it just So that's a big one. I'm going to say that's number one. It's a good one, yeah. Then you got the shockwaves number two. What's three and four and five?

It's been really hard to find really good therapies that work really good. I think someone else has been a banger. Like the blue light, red light business, is that work or no? It's okay. So medium. Exactly. It's like I do it every day. But the effects, I think, are pretty subtle. Mm-hmm. The hyperbaric is also good for skin therapy. Sorry.

The hyperbaric rejuvenates collagen. It rejuvenates elastin. It eliminates senescent cells, like the dead cells. So it's probably the best whole body skin rejuvenation thing you can do out there. You got me. That's number one. Every time you say it, I just keep saying it. So what I do is I have the hyperbaric and I have a – it's just like this chair. And I put a desk in there and I have my computer. So you can do it if you just –

Put it in your home and just make it part of your daily ritual. How long? Two hours? Yeah, like 90 to 120-minute sessions. I mean, it's a big investment. Are there any – because a lot of men, speaking of boners, a lot of men like to take – take testosterone because you get cut, so you don't have to work out as much, but you get whatever. Some downsides, rage, aggression, and being impossibly horny, but also it feeds cancer.

Like as certain types of cancers for men, there's a reason why our testosterone drops. And so that's what I worry about. Like there's a buddy of mine was on. high levels of testosterone because he liked the effects that he saw. And then they're like, yeah, it's feeding this cancer, which is growing, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Just measure. Make sure you're always, always, always measuring.

Most people don't measure their... Yeah. So for example, if your friend who's doing testosterone, if he's doing it, he's got to measure it. Like you have to pair measurement with therapy. How do you measure it? Just with your blood. Actually, yeah, for sure blood with vein. I wonder if you can do a blood spot card for testosterone, just like a finger prick.

I'm pretty sure 90% of the people don't know. Oh, yeah. So my company, Blueprint, does it. We do a blood dropper. So I can send in my blood, and you'll give me all the markers. Yeah, exactly. The general rule is... And this is why what we're doing is so valuable. We measure everything. And measurement is like 90% of the value. It tells you if you're doing it right or wrong, if you should start or stop. It's like you need that.

baseline and you need to know if it's working so if you're doing the therapy like if you're going to HBOT measure like see like know where you're starting and to see if it works i'm into hbot i'm probably gonna have shockwaves on my penis because of you and also do your you said an ankle or knee right oh i've got all kinds

So do your joint. I'm telling you, it's so good. So do all your joints, and especially the places where you got injured. Yeah, because I used to play rugby, and I tore my... uh tendons but i also broke my ankle at the same time they put a big cast on it which is the worst thing you can do for tendons and so to this day like every once in a while you know your achilles will pop which is terrible even worse worse is your plantar fasciitis

and you can't walk. Exactly. Which sucks. Yeah, yeah. So use it for all those things. Like, you'll see when they, there's this little wand, as they roll around your ankle and your foot, it will find your injury. Wow. And you'll see it. Like, when it lands, like, it's a pure... seen pain.

You'll feel it. It's a good pain. You'll know it's working, so stick it out. It's remarkably effective. You'll need a couple therapies. Okay, so we've got shock treatment, which now you had me at shock therapy. Now you're saying it's a piercing pain. I'm like, I'm not putting that much.

Yeah, it's worth it. We're going to put it in your anus, Shane. It's going to be piercing pain. I'm like, no. Okay, so the pain is worth it. Now we're getting to the religion. You're a masochist. Here we go. That's two. Give me three and four. Just two more. I'm not even going to ask for five. Two more. All right. Something that surprised you with its efficacy. Not diet, not sleep, not...

I mean, we did mesenchymal stem cells. We're still waiting for those results. It wasn't a clear banger. Now, it could be the case that... I'm already healthy and I don't have a major problem. So that doesn't qualify. What about why are you so, like, I'm going to say addicted, why are you so hot on plasma?

Oh, I'm not. Okay. So we tried it. I mean, I did this for my dad because he was experiencing cognitive decline, and there was interesting evidence showing that it was potentially useful for that. Yeah. I've currently done, recently I've done three plasma treatments where I've removed all the plasma in my body. So we're waiting for the results on that. So you get like new plasma to replace it? I replace it with albumin and the body rebuilds the plasma. So results pending for that.

And so we were talking about Silicon Valley and they were talking about that they're all into your penis research. Silicon Valley, the show made fun of the blood boys. What does that do? That's the plasma? Yeah, that's what I'm doing. Yeah. So the idea is that plasma.

you can get rid of a bunch of junk, like take out the trash by getting it out and having the body rebuild plasma. Young plasma better than old plasma. Well, so right now that the therapy now is you don't even need a donor. You just go hooked up to a machine. You've got a needle.

one arm the other one it takes blood out of one arm separates the plasma from the blood and then takes your plasma out so afterwards you have like this gigantic bag of plasma it's your plasma exactly so it's like think of it like you feel weak or anything you don't feel the difference it's think of it like so it's like it's four four point five liters total wow it's a lot so you're like this gigantic bag and then you put back in the body album

So you have the same one-to-one replacement with the new liquid, and then your body rebuilds. plasma over the coming days and so that process you're trying to remove toxins remove garbage it's like repopulating your biome exactly you know with a super uh Fecal transplant from a super biome. Yeah. So I did three so far. Did you ever do any of those? So we haven't done a fecal transplant. We've been interested in it. Yeah. But back to HBOT. Right. We saw the most stunning results of my microbiome.

my doctor's ever seen with HBOT. It keeps coming in at number one. I don't even know why that was. It's funny because I've heard about HBOT for addressing acute traumatic brain injury or things like that. But no one has ever articulated. It does whole body skin rejuvenation, right? It does microbiome. You had me at brain plaque. I'm in. And maybe I'm just biased because it's so recent that I did it this morning. I've been doing it constantly the past three months.

But you can tell I'm really struggling to find therapies that just have a very clean way. I'm very surprised because obviously you do this more than anybody else. I get it. Okay, sleeping, eating, fine. But you try all these therapies, supplements, I thought you'd have an easy top five. I'm glad you have a top two, and I like both of the top twos.

But I thought you'd have like a bang, bang, bang. Yeah. Plasma could be. We're still waiting for the results. Yeah. Stem cells maybe. We've done three. Stem cells are – you have to be really careful. Yeah. Be careful. Like I don't want to say –

They're just universally good. You need to find a good provider, have a hypothesis on what you're trying to do. What's the thing where if you have a bad knee, for example, they take out your blood, they spin it around, hyperoxygenate, and then inject it back in?

That seems to be having. Yeah, yeah. I think PRP is great. Yeah. I did that on my ankle. Yeah, and? It's great. Not as good as the sonic wave. No, I sprained my ankle, and I did like a six therapy thing on top of each other. I did a focal shock. therapy plus prp plus peptides plus this magnetic thing plus red light and i had one of the fastest recovery times yeah the doctor you've ever seen and then i so something else i've been doing um i just oh i'm gonna do sauna in April.

So there's a lot of good data on sauna that's observational data, but you want interventional. You want to show you can actually say, here's a problem. When you say sauna, like sauna, sauna hot, sauna to a cold pool or whatever. Exactly, sauna, yeah. So I think we'll do that. sauna in the coming months i'm mad at you because i built a sauna a japanese sauna in my backyard and uh

It burned down. Oh, no. In the fires. Oh, no. Did you use it a lot? I used it every day. I put it near my office, and it was made out of these Japanese burnt redwood stuff. And it burned down. Yeah, I'm sorry about that, Shane. You broke my heart. All right. I could talk to you about this until the cows come home, but we're running out of time here because we're already two hours in, and I haven't even gotten any of my questions. I wanted to...

So again, to go back to the beginning, and thank you, because I think we have had a... a little bit of a unique i just didn't want to be your your your everyday oh yeah you're a bit crazy because you you eat broccoli instead of bacon i get it that's that stuff's all given to me okay and maybe we should get into that because you seem to but seriously like

Okay, I know what I should do. Like sleep is a big one. That's come to the fore in recent, but like diet, exercise, all that's boring. Sleep is a big one. Don't drink, don't smoke, fine. I get it. But I want AI. Maybe we didn't get in there.

enough into because I know you're evangelical about that I love the fact that you want to be religion universal bank and you're basically the terror of end of times people who are like it's going to be one government one bank that's going to be you it's going to be the new religion But I wanted to get back to your dad. You know, most people, let's say, are addicted. Oh, I wanted to get to two things. So maybe we're going to have to talk for two more hours. But two things. One is addiction.

Just as a concept. People are addicted. I'm probably addicted to a bunch of stuff. People are addicted to stuff. We could be addicted to Pop-Tarts or sugar, cigarettes. I've pretty much been good at... quitting everything, you know. The only thing I ever had any difficulty was cigarettes. Basically, I used to joke like, I like the test. It's just your mouth opening in the cigarette, like nicotine coming out and talking because it's pure addiction. I mean, you don't really.

get anything out of it except for just a nicotine hit. So I think that's, but anyways, addiction. But a lot of people get clean, heroin addicts, et cetera, et cetera. And then they become like, I ran four marathons back to back or like, you know, I did the Sahara to, you know, these crazy. Is this a form of addiction? Because when you.

talk about like i'm always perpetually a little bit hungry but i like it or vaguely masochistic we didn't even get to the shock waving uranus but you know there's fairly you know masochistic and also kind of uh ocd-ish and or addictive personality traits that go with it. Now, you're addicted to being healthy, so who cares? And again, in my opinion, you're allowed to be addicted to anything you want to be. Again, people are like, well, it might damage him.

Isn't that his decision? Why do I care if it damages him? But if it's good, I want that data. I want to know the good stuff. That's why I asked you for your top five because let's say you do 50. Five of them will be transformational. 50 will be yes oh that's another thing so i have three questions yeah uh every five years you know there'll be a big oh takes vitamin d for this or take cod liver oil for that or take this for this or yeah

women's menopausal vitamins, and then every five years they'll be like, yeah, that's all possible. Like if it's a powdered form, like vitamin C, let's say the biggest one, number one, vitamin C. If you take it as a vitamin C, like it's a powder and not in an orange, it's useless. that true is that not true i don't know yeah you know yeah tell me measure like so yeah i can't i'm not gonna do blood tests just does it work or does it not work yeah i mean so it's um

Again, I would just say measure. Like I take vitamin C daily. But you take it like a powder form. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. But apparently it does both. It doesn't work. Yeah, so it changes my levels. Yeah, so my levels are optimal. So it does work for you. Yeah, but to your point, I need to do the negative experiment. I need to take it out of my protocol and then test whether my levels decrease. Yeah, because I get bummed because you're just...

It's like, well, I'm taking all this, and then every five years, like, yeah, it doesn't really work. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Who knows? Okay, so that's one. Two is, are you an addict to longevity? I am a normal human in the year 2030. Right. You're ahead of the game. Just like, yeah, this is how all humans are going to behave in 2030. Okay. And a new question, because this is, truth be told, the most interesting thing you've said today, which, by the way, you didn't catch me laughing because...

Who knows? Again, if you could not die, you could be the next prophet. How do you get there? Why do you get there? And why do you want to get there? Yeah. It's a big one. Message boards, get ready. I think that's my answer, is that I don't think that I can say anything intelligent anymore about life. That's just the honest truth. Mango. Ryan, thank you so much for your time. Come back and tell us about how your...

Your hyperbaric chamber is working because I think that's number one, two, and three for me. Yeah, good. All right. Thanks for your time, brother. Yep. This podcast is brought to you by Aura. By the time you hear about a data breach, your information has already been exposed for months. On average, companies take 277 days to report a breach. That's nine months where hackers have access to your personal data, your name,

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