Six. It's your fucking job to know what I should buy. Welcome to Service Design Principles I'm Guy Martin, joined by the author of the Service Design Principles series of books. Founder of the Swiss Innovation Academy and Service Design Practitioner, The explicit Daniele Catalanotto.
Hi Guy, Definitely one of the adjectives my mum will love.
It's a good adjective for this one, because this episode has the explicit tag. Each episode we look at one of the principles from your books, the Service Design Principles 1-100. And today it is principle number six. It's your fucking job to know what I should buy. So first things first. It sounds like this is personal, Daniele.
Indeed it is. You know, it's. It's one of those stories, you know, where where after the experience, you go out and you're just swearing a bit in the streets. And. And that's basically what happens here. basically I was buying flowers for my wife and I'm very bad at buying flowers. And so I came in saying to the person, I don't know anything about flowers, so here's what I'm trying to do. As I know my wife loves yellow. I have a budget of 50 bucks
Mm hmm.
and I don't care that much about how it looks because I don't understand it. Culture. Help me do something with 50 bucks in yellow
Sure.
and
You're the expert.
you're the expert. I don't know that stuff. I'm not so interested. Let's be honest. And then, you know, the person just kept on asking questions and I was like, No, it's you know, I've been clear in the relationship. I'm giving you the power to make decisions based on this new information. Could you just take could you just use the power and know the person? Okay, Do you think she prefers this type of flowers or maybe more roses? I have no idea. But. And do
you think it will be more something vertical or more something horizontal? I, I don't know about this. And, you know, and.
But she's asking questions. That's good, right? Isn't it?
Yeah, but the whole deal for me was please don't ask me question. Don't make me feel even dumber than what I am, you know,
Ah, right!
And
Mm hmm.
that was very hard for me. It was like she this person coming back and asking questions where it's revealed how illiterate I am with flowers, you know, and how maybe I'm in an unemotional husband because I don't know what's her favorite flower, you know, And I don't know
if she likes tall flowers or small flowers. And and there, you know, you you I think maybe emotionally I got out like, feeling like I'm a bad husband, you know, even if I bought flowers for it for for my wife, you know, which I think wasn't the goal for me, you know, in the in that experience.
So you want you want some guidance on on. You know, I don't know the answers to any of your questions, but let's. Let's try some. It's a first draft again, right? That's, you know, these flowers. I don't know. Maybe when I take them home, I'll know a little bit more next time. But I'm telling you now, whatever question you can ask me, I'm going to say I'm not sure. I don't know.
Yeah. And, and even if you want to, to, to have this conversation bit where you say it's important that the person interacts, you know, then you still can frame it in a way you know, that is helpful.
Mm.
for example Try to get in questions where you know people have the answer. if the person asked, might I ask, how old is your wife? Oh, she's about 34. Okay. And do you live in a home or do you do you live in a home or in apartments? You know, and asking these kind of questions where I didn't feel like, oh, I know my wife, I'm a good husband, you know, But then it gives her information maybe to select the type of flower based on age and preferences
Right.
and then say, okay, so based on what you're telling me, you know, as you are living in the city, which is a bit far away from here, I'm going to pick a type of flower that will stay healthy until you go home. And at that age, usually, you know, my other customers who are female prefer to buy this kind of flowers. So I would recommend that one. And then I would feel like, Oh, this is very personalized, this is special.
Mm hmm. So it's not that you are being asked questions. It was the type of questions. It was
it's like asking questions that I don't have the answer about.
And you've been clear that you didn't have the answers, too.
And which then gives you the feeling that there is incompetence because you're like, if you're asking me questions that I don't have the answer about, it means that you don't know what you what you're doing.
You can't connect my needs to what you're offering and say, okay, well, I live an hour away, so I need something that will last. You can't connect that to you know. Well, that eliminates this particular type of flower or this particular arrangement or something. Right.
so I'm extremely happy that we have these conversations because because sometimes there is kind of like a light bulb moment and and this is happening, which is I think what's happening here is that it's a lot about revealing that the person that the service provider isn't in in a power where he when he asks the question, it's a question that generates an answer which is not I don't know,
but which always the people can answer with yes, no or something specific. Because when you do that, it gives the impression to people that you know of what you're talking about, because you would never ask a question that where the answer will be, I don't know.
Mm.
And therefore, this is a very good point here, which is it's the way you're asking questions can change how people feel about your own and about your own competences. So if you ask a question where people can answer all the ways, then you will figure, Oh, the person asking me the question is very competent because she asked me a question when I can feel competent.
Right . You're not expected to be a florist and be able to answer the questions that a florist would answer
Exactly.
or that your your wife would answer, you know, because you're not
Yeah.
your wife either.
Yeah, indeed.
So no, that's, that's really good. I, I also go to florists occasionally and buy my flowers. You know, go back to our first episode where we talked about, you know, you don't just have the courtship. You have to keep delivering throughout the marriage. there's two flowers
that my wife doesn't like. And I'm sure to say that, but anything else. I don't know. So I say, okay, I need a bunch of flowers without this flower and this flower because it reminds my wife of funerals that, you know, death flowers or something
Mm.
like these. But then it's like, Oh, what colours that I don't know what's in season. Okay. And these are. I'll put something together for you and then I'll do something. And then it's like I learn something from it as I. Why did you pick that? It allows also for me to ask
questions and learn. And there's a, a, a potential for education there that actually as this relationship goes on and I continue to come back and buy flowers from you because you've, you know, provided such good service and you've made it easy for me to come back that that I can learn more. And then my requests in future will make your job easier as well, because I'll come in and say, okay, I need a bunch of flowers. That's this budget. I don't want this, I don't
want this. It's going to be this colour and it's for this particular occasion and and throw that in. Everything else is up to you.
yeah. And, and this kind of interactions, you know, that, that there are learning interactions too, which is I think a very good point is that if people don't know, you know, you can kind of give a bit of a of an extra information and see if they're interested in it. And if you feel that they are interested in it, then you can give a bit more and then they they see, Oh, I wasn't just buying flowers. I learned something about flowers, which means that next time I will ask this question.
hmm.
So that's, oh, now I've learned something.
It's a really interesting interaction to do it that way. And I try. Maybe I'm an annoying person. I always try and learn something from every interaction I have or come away at least with, with some extra value. So, yeah, I think it's important that if I'm coming to you as an expert that that you show that competency in the questions that you ask and if I'm if I, if I don't know something that you feel, oh well you should probably know this, then help me, help me
understand it. And the next time it won't be as slow a transaction or as annoying or I don't know.
Absolutely. I think there is a very important thing that you said here, which is when I come to you as an expert, which means that I believe you are the expert.
Hmm.
And and I think this is very important as salespeople have to notice this, like to who am I coming today among am I coming to the expert or am I coming to someone who's selling? Because sometimes you perfectly know what you want. And the thing that you don't want is people asking you questions,
Right.
you know, because you say, Hey, I want 12 roses. This colour, please do it. And it's like, okay, I'm just coming to buy flowers. Other times it's like, Oh, I'm coming to an expert and other times I'm coming to an educator,
Mm
which means now I'm not coming just for a service where you give me something grades based on the little knowledge I have, but you expand also my knowledge and being able to to see that sometimes I'm coming to you because I want the expert. Sometimes I'm coming to you because I want something from you. But I'd love to you to educate me. And sometimes I don't want anything from you outside of the product that I'm asking.
Perfect place to end it. Thanks very much.
Thanks to you. Cheers!