Welcome to the Send Parenting Podcast . I'm your neurodiverse host , dr Olivia Kessel , and , more importantly , I'm mother to my wonderfully neurodivergent daughter , alexandra , who really inspired this podcast .
As a veteran in navigating the world of neurodiversity in a UK education system , I've uncovered a wealth of misinformation alongside many answers and solutions that were never taught to me in medical school or in any of the parenting handbooks . Each week on this podcast I will be bringing the experts to your ears to empower you on your parenting crusade .
Happy New Year . I can't quite believe it's 2024 . This month will be the year anniversary of the Send Parenting Podcast . We are one years old . Thank you for listening , as many of us are still on holiday or our children are still on holiday .
The next two episodes will be bite-sized summaries from two popular episodes last year , easy to listen and digest when time is of the essence . In this episode , I will be joined by my bite-sized co-host , Tamsen Hendry , the SEAT advisor , to discuss our top takeaways from podcast 13 with Heidi Mavir , author of the Sunday Times Best Seller .
Your Child is Not Broken . Heidi's honesty , wit and lived an experience about her son and her journey to diagnosis with ADHD and autism is atonic and a great way to kick off the new year . Welcome Tamsen . It is our third bite-sized summary .
Today we're going to tackle Heidi Mavir , who I have to say was one of my most direct and funniest guests with a wicked sense of humor , who has been on the Send Parenting Podcast . Why don't you start us off today in terms of what your top takeaway tips were from Heidi's podcast ?
Yeah , that was really hard because there were so many . I would say that she's absolutely fearless inspirational .
I found the conversation between the two of you really interesting about the origin of neurodiversity , because it's a question that I hear all the time why do you think there's more people that are neurodiverse and what's the explanation for that , the understanding of that ? Actually it's a natural process of it's a genetic mutation , a natural continuum of variation .
Yeah , and it made me think well , maybe our children in the neurodiverse community are actually evolving .
Humankind , yeah , absolutely yeah , really interesting conversation about that , and I think there needs to be more conversations about what people's belief is from different backgrounds , based on their expert opinion or their experience of the origin of you know , why is it happening ? Is it actually happening or are we just getting better at identifying it ?
And also it comes . It ties in for me to the point of where there's that parental blame . Like you know , with even , I mean today . Like you know , before you can have an ADHD diagnosis , you have to go through parenting school , you know , because it must , and this is still today . You know what I mean . No , it's not .
It has nothing to do with how we , as parents , raise our child . It is a genetic variation , you know , which changes the way our neurons speak to each other and how our synapses work and , as you say , it could be an evolutionary adaptation which will save our lives one day .
Because with these , you know , neurodiverse people , myself included , we think out of the box . So you know we've got some big problems coming along the horizon which are going to need some pretty interesting solutions . So it's taking that blame from the parents and explaining it that it's just , you know , like we have different color hair , we have different color .
You know different ways , we , you know the ways we're made up .
And it's interesting because I think it's almost that you know . I say to people all the time look , if you need to help with sleep or if you need this , just go through the motions , tell them yeah , I'll listen to you about a bedtime routine . No , I've never tried that before . Thank you so much . You know . Go to that aspect .
What's interesting about the parenting courses you talk about , which often parenting puzzle or those kind of things , it's almost like , okay , we can't keep these children in the box anymore because parents have become more aware , so let's try and move a step and put the parents in a box .
So , yes , you can explain this by neurodiversity , or you can take full accountability , because if we , if , if , um , if they don't put the accountability on parents , they've got to put it in policy . And the wider um , the wider government .
And we wouldn't want to do that now , would we no ?
definitely not Um . So , and also , what I really uh , took away from it was the importance of understanding the fight or flight response , Um , and actually how , if , when that isn't managed properly , it can lead to a trauma response .
And actually , again , there is a slight change in the education system that more and more schools are becoming trauma informed , but again , still at the very early age , early stages of that Um . So those were my um , yeah , those are my top three .
Yeah , and I think you know my my top takeaways are very aligned to yours as well , maybe looking at from a slightly different point .
So you know the origin of neurodiversity but also the fact that there's this journey as a parent and Heidi was quite open and honest about it in terms of discovering your own neurodiversity through wanting to support and help your child , and that you know how her family you know getting together and all hugging each other .
That's their normal and I think you know . If you look at , you know neurodiverse people tend to marry other neurodiverse people and have neurodiverse children . So you know it's normal and actually neurodiversity is normal and once we start classifying people as different or disabled or special , you know it's just a different .
We're all part of the same interesting mosaic and puzzle of life , you know .
Yeah , and that was really when , you know , I was really thinking about that . When she talks about the fact that it wasn't a little husband said actually it's really not normal that when you go to a family party , you'll tickle each other and that's part of that .
Without realizing it , they're sent to regulation and it's often the same for for all families that you go to all these , you know , you get a diagnosis .
You go to all these groups , you do all this reading and actually you come full circle and realize that you were parenting your child how they needed to be parented in the first place , but without a label and without a book .
And it's then , when you start introducing those books and those labels and everything else that you start doubting yourself and actually you're doing a really good job in the first place .
And I think you know she highlights that really too in terms of again and I mean , we hear this from so many of the podcast guests that you need to trust your gut .
But the fact is you are kind of programmed not to trust your gut because you're looking at and you know I'm a doctor , but I can still with teachers and whatever , and even with other doctors , you know , if they tell me something , I'm like , oh , okay , okay , you know .
And so you know when , when she was , you know , dragging her child to go and touch that post at school , her gut told her that was completely wrong , but it took her , you know , and that , that , just it resonated with me because sometimes you listen and you shouldn't be listening , you know , and it's hard , especially with authoritarian figures like educators , like
doctors , to actually say , no , you know what . Actually , I know my child the best and I know what needs to be done here .
You know and also it's that that under you know , when we talk about knowledge is power , and I know I always go back to the graduated response , the local offer . But it is about teachers saying , look , you know , why don't you try and bring school and touch the gate ?
So actually that that's maybe their take on a graduated response , but it certainly isn't what the graduated response is about and I certainly know from my situation , if I took my son and did that , once we're going to go to school and touch the gate , that would be the expectation forever .
So it's about and I think one of Dr Maryam , I think , talks about it later is take the advice , but actually not all of it . Take that advice and relate it to your child and what your knowledge of him . But that I think the whole journey that you go on generally makes you feel vulnerable as a parent .
So it's it's just re-educating yourself to tap into your instinct .
Yeah , absolutely . And you know , my final thing was also , you know , finding your community , and I think Heidi has really done that . Not only she found a community , she's welcoming everyone to her community .
And she's very , you know . Yeah , I'd like to say yeah .
Yeah , she's doing a . I think she's doing a seminar now . I saw on Instagram , you know , about you know explaining your neurodiversities and getting people to understand it , embrace it and love it . So it'll be interesting to see I think she's just launched it , actually this September how that goes . But you know , I take my hat off to her .
What would you say , tamsen , were her top tips that she would have wanted us to take away ?
So I , I I've had , I've I've got some ideas , but I would , I would I hope that we've taken from it what she would want us to . I'd say she probably wouldn't mind where everyone took from it . So touch up your inherent knowledge of your child . I think that was really loud and clear in her in her message .
Again , prioritize your mental health or costs , which was also Dr Fisher's takeaway . Yeah , that you know that .
I think when , in a very honest way , when you live with a child who's got high anxiety levels , you almost become I don't know what the word is , but you almost become , you just become used to it that that high level of anxiety in your household feels normal , as your new norms . You live with it .
But actually , no , it it that any child , any person living with that level of anxiety , that needs to be addressed because whatever , in whatever format that needs to be a day at home or actually mental health . It's made me remember again the importance of the reality of living with anxiety . It's , it can't be overlooked . And , like you said , find your community .
So those , I think , were her three top 10 , three mental health , finding your community and trusting your gaps .
Yeah , and you know it's so important and none of those . You know those are simple things , but you can really . All of those things can get eroded , because you can be eroded as a parent in terms of your trusting , your gut and your confidence . You can . Also , your community is going to change to a degree . Do you know what I mean ?
Your community that you wrote in you might not fit there . So then there's also , I don't know , I felt sometimes shame or unable to connect with people that didn't understand or even I wouldn't even you know share with them what I was going through .
But finding , finding you know , then going to a special school and finding people like me , finding other parents like me , was very liberating and also I think Dr Fisher made a really good point and and I did hear it within HIDES as well is be careful that your community doesn't become an echo chamber .
You know , find a community of people that are further on than you , that can advise and help you , but also people you can support , the behind you as well as people on their journey , as well as people at your level .
So you know , if you go in I've gone into communities before that I think will be helpful and there's a lot of anger and I'm not there , I've passed that or I'm not there yet . So actually understanding when it's time to remove yourself and find a new community .
Yeah , I'm on a WhatsApp group that I've just terminated because of that reason and and you've got to find the right one for you .
That's okay , that they need because that's part of their journey . But recognizing when that's not good for you anymore or not helpful , or or you're disagreeing with everything that's being said , then it's time to to you know , spread your wings .
That there's a saying there , because you like saying there's a reason in the season .
Absolutely , that is so true , and actually sometimes you hang around a bit longer because you can be of help to other people , but then it's still time to go .
Yeah , and that's one thing I really have to admire about all the mothers that I've met is that everyone is willing to help . Do you know what I mean ? There's a general feeling of wanting to give back , wanting to help , and you know , I think that that is lovely .
And it's it's empathy like you've never known it before . Yeah , exactly .
Absolutely Well , excellent . I'm sure I hope that Heidi will agree with us , and I'm sure she doesn't . We'll hear about it . So thank you , love you , bye , bye . Thank you , send Parenting Tribe for your continued support . I look forward to having you join us and meet our amazing guests through 2024 .
Next week , tamsen and I will be discussing another bite-size from parenting expert Dr Mary Ann . A must listen before school starts . For those of you who haven't already , please rate the podcast and follow us on Instagram at Send Parenting Podcasts . Wishing you a good week ahead .