The power. You're in a Runner podcast series is brought to you by Nike Running and Rebel.
The best part is really just you know, you're always racing yourself. It's such a measurable event, so you can always try and challenge yourself, have personal bests on various training sessions or races. Yeah, when I'm not super keen on it, or you know, the weather's a bit cold and wet and winter like, spicing up the location, doing different loops and things like that, I think is a really good way to make it feel fresh and new
and less kind of repetitive. You're always wanting more, wanting to achieve the next goal, and so it's so easy to finish a championship and be like, Okay, next time, I want to do this, I want to do that. So this year I sort of tried really hard to kind of stop and celebrate and soak it all up.
Welcome to the C's the Yay Podcast. Busy and happy are not the same thing. We too rarely question what makes the heart seeing. We work, then we rest, but rarely we play and often don't realize there's more than one way. So this is a platform to hear and explore the stories of those who found lives they adore, the good, bad and ugly. The best and worst day
will bear all the facets of seizing your yea. I'm Sarah Davidson or a spoonful of Sarah, a lawyer turned funentrepreneur who swapped the suits and heels to co found matcha Maiden and matcha Milk Bark CZA is a series of conversations on finding a life you love and exploring the self doubt, challenge, joy and fulfillment along the way. Welcome to our final episode of the Power Your Inner Runner podcast series in partnership with Nike Running and Rebel Gosh.
That has gone so quickly. I feel so lucky to have been able to pick the brains of three amazing Nike athletes and olympians on Everyone's Behalf. The tips and tricks they've shared have enhanced my training so much, which you've probably been able to see from the fast improvements that I've been sharing on socials, and I hope they've done it the same for some of you, whether you're
a running beginner or a season pro. They've jampaig so much universal advice into these chats that will be invaluable in the lead up to Melbourne Marathon and beyond. But even if you're not interested in running in the least, I think all three of these women still have fascinating path yer's that are empowering, motivating, and just a joy to listen to. So we've heard from Katrina on mastering your mindset and Chanaide on distance determination and defying the doubters.
But I still have some pretty specific questions left around fuel, What and when does one eat and drink before, during, and after a race? How lucky are we to have as our third and final guest Lindon Hall, a fifteen hundred meter Olympian Nike athlete and very conveniently for us, also a qualified dietitian who headed to America after high school to get the college experience at Florida State University.
Today we get into the guts of our guts and again in the few runs I've done since recording this episode has dramatically improved my running experience as well as the practical stuff. We also hear how Linden went from being spellbound watching the Atlanta Olympics as a five year old to actually making it to the Olympics, first in
Rio and then again this year in Tokyo. It gave me goosebumps to hear Linden explain how it felt to actually qualify after dreaming of this moment since childhood and working so hard to become the fastest fifteen hundred meter runner in Australian history. Even cooler, she got faster and faster in Tokyo from the heat to the semifinal and then the overall final, where she finished in sixth place
with a personal best. So we also get some fabulous tips on improving speed and why you often don't do so by running your competition speed over and over, but by doing all kinds of other runs instead. Mind blown. As I've been recording these episodes, I've really been reminded of how powerful sport can be. I mean, I get so oh TIERI during the Olympics, for the way it connects people, transcending language, culture and geography, even on a
very local personal level. I've been reminded how transformative sport can be, which is a big tenet of rebels. Sport is calling campaign. If you've been out of the sporting loop for a while, Sport can be such an antidote to life's challenges, whether you have professional or competitive aspirations or whether you don't. So I hope some of you here sport calling your name again and get motivated to
move those bodies. Also, just a reminder in case anyone was worried, these episodes aren't sequential, so if you're only tuning in now, don't worry. Each segment stands alone and you can listen to the episodes in whatever order you like. I hope you enjoy Linden as much as I did. Linden, Welcome to the show. I'm so thrilled to have you here.
Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's great, dang it.
I've just been following your journey for so long, but particularly in Tokyo, running your PV, reuniting with your dog the other day. It's so lovely to actually sit down with you properly to chat.
Yeah, it's been a super fun last twelve months, especially obviously Tokyo. The Olympics is always always the peak for sports, so it's really special that, you know, we got to actually get away with having the Olympics, given you know, the state of the world and what it looked like. I think it made it, you know, that much sweeter to get there when it was so up in the air for so long.
Absolutely, it was so special. I kind of was in that camp just beforehand of oh, like why are they even doing it and all the poor athletes won't have audiences. But then I feel like the whole world paused to rally around everyone and it just brought us all so much joy just when you needed it most. I can't imagine what it would have been like to actually be there.
Yeah, I think despite there being no crowds, you really fell at the support from everyone in Australia and you felt like everyone was watching. And I know, I think everyone got creative with you know, how to support the athletes, and I guess we've got really good at adapting and being creative over the last you know, two years now, so you know, everyone's been training for it almost like
you know, just like US athletes. So yeah, it was really cool and the Australian team, you know, our other athletes were obviously to come out and watch at the track, which I think Australia was like the only country that had their whole team coming out every night with like handmade signs with like terrible puns about everyone's last names, and we had drowns and like you know, we were the only people who got cheered for on the start line and that was so special to feel like you
had your teammates there watching you.
Oh my gosh, I have goosebumps from that, just thinking like, I love Australia, we are the greatest, Like hearing your teammates cheering for you, and you got faster and faster, Like this is why I'm so excited to have you here today, because that's been one of the main questions is pace and like how do you and how do
you support your running? So today's theme is refuel, replenish and recharge, And I'm so thrilled that you also just happened to have studied dietetics, so that's wonderful, you multi talented little champion. But what I thought we would start with is just a couple of intro questions and then we'll sort of run through your career to this point so everyone knows what your running journey has been like, and then maybe we'll jump into some of the audience questions.
So to begin with, where do you sit in the running landscape, What is your ideal distance. Obviously in the Olympics you're a superstar fifteen hundred meter runner. Do you like longer runs too or shorter runs? You know, where's your space?
I love the track, So if it's shorter, faster life, it's going to make you throw up, Like I'm all about it. I think i'd know a little bit like violent or something on the inside. Just you know, love that element of training because it's the closest to racing, I guess, and it's just really pushing the limits. And then you know, on the other end of the spectrum, your easier runs are social and you know more about recovery, so they're not you know, chasing your goals as much.
So I think they have a really different purpose. And so yeah, I love just challenging myself because probably you know that real speed work and probably not as good at and it's a little bit newer to my training repertoire, so I feel like I've got more room to improve. But yeah, there's something something fun about putting on your spikes and trying to run as fast as you possibly get until you sort of, you know, just end up laying dead on the track. I probably sound like an
absolutely crazy person. And I know I like running at all, but I can totally relate to the whole like starting, you know, a new runner at the moment because I've just come off two weeks hotel quarantine where obviously I wasn't running, and starting to run again. I did like a thirty minute jog, which shouldn't you know, in my normal training regime is not not much of a run, one of the shorter ones they get to do, and oh, maybet the next day I thought i'd been hit by
a bus. So I really understand and I'm like, oh god, this is why people don't like running. It really hurts. So I'm slowly getting there and you know, the muscles are remembering how to run, but yeah, I kind of get it now. I think that's crazy.
But we've actually got you at the perfect time because you have sort of had to really take a pause from moving your body really at all because you've been stuck in a room. So it's actually awesome to sort of catch you at this time where you're rebuilding from scratch, because that is like the really relatable part of running that you do have to kind of keep it up
to actually keep that level of fitness. So the other two intro questions for the kind of either skeptical runner or the like hesitant or maybe fearful runner because a lot of people are kind of scared of the whole idea and it's the most democratic and beautiful thing to do. But I think until you know that, you know, you need someone to just give you a little push. So what is your absolute favorite part of running? And what is the hardest part of running? But how you combat that?
Yeah, I think for me the best part is really just you know, you're always racing yourself. It's such a measurable event, so you can always try and challenge yourself, you know, have personal bests on various training sessions or races or gym workouts or things like that, and it's so individual and you can, you know, kind of always
be chasing your own goals. You know. I think in team sports you sort of don't have that because is you're you know, it's a bit you know, you might oh, yeah, I had really good number of kicks today or something.
I don't know, you know, like do you even watch other sports?
I do, But you know, I love that It's it's kind of all about you and you can't know a bit of a control freak. So I think you just have so much control over what you're putting in and then it's really measurable, which I love because it's great to be able to see those improvements, whether it be you know, in the gym or on the track or just you know, being how to run further than you have before.
And like Survivor, I found that as well as like a brand new bet. In fact, I used to be
an anti runner. I really thought, I, you know, there were runners and there were non runners, but I realized, like, actually, it's so democratic because you're really just running against yourself and using like the Nike running app to see I started maybe two years ago and comparing like my times and distances because it's all sort of in one place, and being like I actually have gotten faster and further dramatically. It's so satisfying, Like it's such a rewarding thing to do.
Yeah, So it's I love that because, yeah, you have so much control and just kind of bettering yourself, which is really cool. I guess the most challenging part for me is or I guess like a least favorite part of training is probably our Sunday long run, which is you know, probably shown its face on any kind of first time marathon training program for anyone out there. And yeah,
I just find it really long. I get tired. It's Sunday, it's the end of the week, so you know you're doing it on tired legs usually, so it's a lot further than fifteen hundred meters as well, And people always like, oh, do you have to run that, you know, for twenty two k on a Sunday, Like you only raise fifteen hundred meters And I was like, I wish I didn't have to, honestly, but you know, it's kind of part
of the package. And the kind of great thing about that is you know every runner from really eight hundred meters up to the marathon does a Sunday long run, so it's such a social occasion and so many runners in Melbourne. You know, we have a great running community in Melbourne, and you know, many people who won't train together throughout the week for their main training but will happily come together for a Sunday run and everyone kind of works in together and it's really fun because you
catch up with people. You make it social and it's the weekend. People have got time to go for coffee and brunch afterwards. So yeah, I think it's for that Sunday long run. For me, it's making it social, making sure I'm going with a friend, you know, having friends for coffee afterwards is a bit of a reward for getting through the week and mixing up the location as well.
Like I mean, I know I fall into the routine a lot of just going to the same place, but yeah, when I'm not super keen on it, or you know, the weather's a bit you know, cold and wet and winter like, spicing up the location, doing different loops and things like that, I think is a really good way to you know, make it feel fresh and new and less kind of repetitive, because running is a pretty repetitive spot.
But this is something that I've actually only just really started to understand because I've only just started to do kind of longer distances, is that I kind of hit this plateau where once I master a certain distance, and by master, I mean like as in, I don't die halfway through, oh I do die, but like I can actually finish it. It's that to get faster, you can't
just repeat it. Over and over again. So like a fifteen hundred runner like you, you don't just do fifteen hundred over and over again and hope that you get faster. And one of the biggest questions we've had is how do you once you do plateau at a certain time and pace, like, how do you get faster? And I'm so excited to get into that with you because the fact that you do have to do a twenty two kilometer run for a fifteen hundred race is so interesting.
So cannot wait to get into that with you. But first, can we go through what I call your way tya or your path ya, which is just explaining how you got into running, because I think that also helps everyone understand where your background is and where all your knowledge, particularly around refueling comes from, because you know you have studied dietetics as well, and how that's kind of worked
into your career. So take us back to very young Linden penleyan ess anding grandma watching the Atlanta Olympics, like, what was your pathway into running? And yeah, what led you?
Hear? Yeah, So we're going to be a really long way back. I feel like, I mean, maybe I'm just old now or something the stories longer. But I guess I kind of like I loved sports when I was little, and you know, always, you know, had three or four sports on the go, and you know at school or outside of school, and netball and swimming and things like that. And I probably thought I was going to be a swimmer.
That's really interesting.
It's a terrible idea.
I'll too talented. Like I said, I just thought I was.
I now associated swimming with injuries, so I really don't like it. Yeah, So it was always pretty active and things like that. And in primary school I've made state championships for athletics and for swimming, and you got like a T shirt that said, you know, state championships two thousand and three or whatever it was. And I really wanted the cross country one to kind of like complete the set. So that was like my big incentive to
make state cross country. So I grew up about an hour from Melbourne, so we went to Bendigo for our sort of zone cross country. Oh my god, I think I think I would have been lucky because you know, there's not not quite as much I guess probably depth as you know in the city. Maybe there's less kids, but you know, maybe getting that state cross country t shirt was a little bit more attainable.
Perhaps you are being far too humble. I'm sure you were just an amazing runner, as we have since discovered.
Yeah, so grade six, you know, twelve year old Linden made state cross country championships And like, obviously I was pretty nervous, and you know, we're driving down. It's about an hour drive to Melbourne. You know, the closer we get, the more nervous I get. And I sort of start reading through the paperwork and I'm telling mom, I'm like, oh, how cool is this? Like if you come top five you get to go to Queensland for nationals, And you know, moms are like, oh, you know there's lots of girls.
You know, they're really good. Just have fun, try your best, et cetera, like the Queensland, Like how co would that be? And then you know, as I get nervous and I'm like, mom my shoes they suck, Like how am I supposed to make it to Queensland and these shoes? You know, this is going to be your fault if I don't make it kind of thing.
Oh, totally end of your life exactly.
So, without probably thinking a whole lot mums. So they said to me, okay, like, if you make it to Queensland, like, we'll stop at reve along the way home and get you a new pair of shoes, like the best running shoes. So like a few hours later, I was very smugly at Rebel Sport getting a new pair of shoes. So I managed to come second and got to the National cross country So that was kind of when I first I was sort of like, oh, maybe I'm not so
bad at this running thing. And then shortly after that I joined the athletic club at Essendon and sort of you know, got a coach and sort of went from there and got to run, you know, at nationals and things like that all through school, which was pretty cool.
And I think some of the funnest parts of high school were, you know, going away to National cross country and like the friends I made on those trips or some of my closest friends today, you know, we still hang out a fairbit, and I think that's really cool, those friendships through sport that are just super special.
Oh that's so lovely.
Yeah, one of the coolest things. Actually, this is kind of mardly off topic, but we had fifteen girls on our Victorian cross country team that won in grade six. We had five in Tokyo at the Olympics out of fifteen.
In that same group.
From that same group of fifteen girls, stop, I know I was the only one running, two cycling and two playing basketball.
That is amazing, I know, like what a stat what attent.
I know it was worth the tension.
I always think, though, this is why I love going through people's whole pathway or path yay, like not just the chapter we walk into in your life now where you know, you know, you're a fifteen hundred runner, You've got really clear goals, your PBS and accolades are all over the place, like it's you know, no one is an
overnight success. Like it has taken you back since cross country with that group of girls in grade six, and like you know, there's so many different seeds along the way that are planted to get you to where you are now. And I find it's so interesting to go through all these chapters and connect all the dots and then you know, trace them to where you are now. So that's amazing, I know.
It's so cool.
Yeah.
So I was, you know, round pretty well through high school, you know, made nationals things like that. It was really good at coming a second, which was really frustrating.
The bridesmaid it.
Was really close. It was so annoying, But I'm definitely very stubborn and persistent. I do it's how nicely you want to frame it. So yes, just kind of kept showing up, and eventually, I think in year eleven, I finally won a national championship, which was really cool, but the girl that was always beating me was injured, so she wasn't there, so it wasn't quite as satisfy. I just really wanted to beat her because I never did.
Oh, but it's it's just what you how you perform on the day, right, Like you know that guy in the was it the speed skating when everyone else in front of him fell over, I'm like, he's still won on the day, exactly exactly right.
And then kind of like late high school, I think like a lot of I was, I sort of really like plataued. I mean, you know, you're going through so much development and just kind of you know, before that you were essentially, you know, the same as the boys, and then things start to change and it's harder to improve you know, when you are pretty good as a junior, you set the bar pretty high. So I definitely really
platawed kind of through late high school. And obviously, you know, you're doing VCE and things like that, so you've got other stresses in your life and you're trying to be a seventeen eighteen year old and you know, have fun with your friends as well. It was probably the only time I kind of thought about not running with probably sort of around your eleven year twelve, and then, as I said, pretty stubborn, pretty persistent, it was like I've committed far too much of my life to this already,
Like I've got to see this through. And then after doing well maybe a year and a half of UNI at Melbourne UNI, I was like, you know what, this isn't that much fun. I don't really love like chemistry things like that. I wasn't quite studying what I wanted to. It was a little bit of a like you know,
pathways that of course wasn't loving running. Sort of found myself without a coach because my coach moved into state and so decided to go to American College and run in the into double A system, which I think was like probably one of the best decisions I ever made. I had, like not only I get to travel, got my university undergrad paid for made so many amazing friends, and you know, got to live overseas for four years, which is really.
Cool, and in Florida of all places, right, like not just overseas, but like at FSU.
Yeah, it was a pretty cool place to go. Like we had great weather year round, great running, you know, had a great group of girls to run with, you know, every day. It was amazing, Like it was just like handed to you on a plate. It was like, you go go be the best you can because here is
everything you need. I feel like it was the closest thing to sort of being a professional athlete without actually being one, which I think was probably that like push I needed to get to that next level because I was surrounded by you know, so many driven women who just wanted to be the best and get the most out of them and you know, you kind of had no choice but to go along for the ride. And you know, by the end of sort of college, I was like I finished in twenty fifteen, so the next
year was an Olympic. Yeah, so I was kind of like, oh, real, Olympics, hey, which I've been pretty obsessed with since I was little, like Sydney Olympics. I was in grade three, so it was like prime impressionable age and I was obsessed. I still have this box that I like decorated with like my own drawings of like the mascots and like oh my the cauldron and things like that.
Was it Harvey million Oi or something? I se Yeah, and Millennium Olympics exactly who is Harvey?
Don't know? Maybe he designed them maybe, Yeah. So I was like obsessed with the Olympics, So it was it was pretty cool to finally like be in a position where I was kind of within a sniff of maybe qualifying. Yeah. So the next year, I guess, like big things happen in Olympic years, like you see it every year, like people just come out of the woodwork and have incredible years because that's the magic of the Olympics really and yeah, I improved like nine seconds that year and ended up
making it too rear and came thirteenth. So I was that painful like first person to miss the final by point oh zero two street a second and it was like such a happy, sad moment because obviously, like ad achieved so much more than I expect that year and you know, made my first Australian team gone to the Olympics. But you know, you always want more as an athlete, and I think, you know, we're all pretty guilty of that of you know, always wanting wanting more, wanting to
do more. And I think that's why we keep coming back the next year, because you know, you want to better yourself and you want to you know, chase those medals and things like that.
Oh my gosh, I love you are such an amazing example of just pure dedication to a goal. And I love the idea that I think sometimes like not necessarily in the sporting or athletic context, or it's quite measurable. Something I always talk about on the show is the idea that your why, once you find it, that stays the same, but you're how, oh, that has to change along the way through different chapters, and your how when you were in Melbourne starting at Melbourne UNI, like that
wasn't necessarily the right how for you. It took a big shift in environment, a completely sideways sort of not really sideways, but you know, big shift to a different country to do college somewhere else and study something different and then come back. Like I love the idea that your goal has never wavered, but the way that you kind of made it there and made it work for you has had to change along the way. And it's
so interesting. I find that just so fascinating, the way people find and keep their motivation as you build up to something. Because again, like an Olympics is only every four years or five kind of this year, yeah, or three, but you have to stay focused, like you can't wake up or go to the Olympics. You know, you have to be patient while you make your way to these goals.
And that's also something I find really interesting, Like how has your last five years been like once you did get that pinnacle, Like, how did you stay patient just waiting for Tokyo?
Well, I guess, like, you know, we get the somewhat of attention every four years for the Olympics, but you know, there's still plenty happening in those in between years, I guess in the athletics world, so you've always got goals along the way. It's not you know, I think if you measured your entire career on the Olympics, which is obviously huge. You're kind of setting yourself up a little bit,
but not necessarily disaster. But if you know that one race every four years something goes wrong, you know, you get sick, you get tripped. You know, you kind of want other things, like you've got your World Championships, which are on alternate years for US, we obviously have come up games which will have next year, which is good to have those sort of the goals in between, and you know it's not quite the Olympic Games, but you
know you've still got just amazing quality of competition. And yeah, probably doesn't get I guess, quite as noticed outside of the athletics world, but I think, you know, they're really good to have in between and really good to track your progress and see where you're sitting with all of the other girls. And yeah, I think I got not lucky.
I think I things worked out really well, that I had a really great year in an Olympic year, you know, from an injury perspective, But you know, so much of that was down to, you know, so much for the planning by my coaches and support staff and you know, just the support network that I have and just making sure everything was as perfect and smooth as it could
possibly be. And I think, you know, for such an individual sport, that team you surround yourself with is so important because you do spend a lot of time on your own and things like that. So we have those really great you know, supports around you is really important
and other people making decisions. You know, sometimes you get so caught up in the emotion of it all because you know, you asked, everyone is so passionate about it, and you put so much into it that sometimes having that person to be like, no, that idea, you will get injured if you go and do that, or like, you can't do five races in one week, that's a
terrible idea. You know, maybe you're quite that extreme, but you know, it's really good to have those sort of people to keep you in check as well.
And then, oh my gosh, you got to Tokyo and you improved your time from the heats to the semis and then to the finals every time, got faster to run your PV. To come sixth in an Olympic final, Oh my gosh, congratulations. Has it settled in yet? How are you feeling?
I definitely had to watch the race back a couple of times just sort of digest it and kind of break it down a little bit, just kind of you know, let it all register. But I think what was really different for me this year going into the you know, major championship of the year was just I had so much more confidence and just a real kind of, I guess,
sense of belonging in that race. I think, you know, obviously, you roll up to the Olympics and you're like, well, the World Championships, and you're like, I want to make the final, because that's what you want to do, you know, that's that's the aim of the task. But I think previously I'd lined up being like I wish I make
the final. I want you know, whereas this year it was like, no, you've done all the work, like everything's been gone really well, like you should, and we'll make the final because you you know, we've done everything to be there, You've run as fast as these other girls, Whereas I think other years I've come in being like, oh, maybe if like everything goes right and maybe like a couple other people have bad races and like maybe I get really lucky, I might get the last spot in
the final, and that'd be great. But this year, like it was just such a different mindset and it was just so powerful to line up and feel like that. I think the heats, I was so nervous, but it was the heats and because of the COVID pandemic obviously we haven't had raced overseas almost two years, so it was you know, just lining up with other you know, women of that level was you know a little bit like ooh people.
Whereas humans, yeah, social distance, mate, don't be that close to me. They should have extended the lanes.
Exactly. So like I think that was like, oh my gosh, other people in the race, other people in the track. You know, I was so stressed about getting tripped up or something because our races in Australia are a lot, a lot smaller, especially on the girl's side. You know, we don't have that same depth and we don't have you know, twelve girls within like three seconds of each other or something. You know, it's a bit more spread out, so you get a bit more room on the track.
So that was like the biggest thing I was scared about going in almost was just like people. So yeah, by the time we got to the semi final round, I was like, okay, like I know what I'm doing now, like we're right at home. And I was just, yeah, felt so much more confident and so much more settled lining up for that race, and then yet carried that through to the final. Actually said, I like got progressively less nervous, wow, as we went through the rounds. I
mean I was pretty nervou stood by the final. And I think we had like a really long care room beforehand when they you know, organize you beforehand and you know, get your numbers and things like that. And we were waiting just at the edge of the track under the stands, and the women's four hundred was right before us, and obviously everyone like I feel like no one missed, you know,
how amazing Alison Felix was. And she kind of, you know, obviously ran incredible and needed to sort of just line a heap and die and she kind of came and laid like right in our core room area, like wrapped in an American life, just like dead on the ground. And I was like, all right, that's that's pretty cool.
And then we had the women's jab going on at the same time, and we had three girls in that final and they had the TV showing that like in this area, and they just showed Kelsey our Australian athlete who ended up winning the bronze medal, you know, through her medal winning throw. And I was like, oh my god, there's no shortage of inspiration, like just right here. And that was like so cool to have, you know, those two athletes just do amazing things sort of right then
and there. It was such a great like unintentional fire up. I was like, okay, like this is the chit like we're at the Olympics.
Oh my gosh, how exciting. Oh you just must feel so proud and and like all of us feel so proud for you. What an amazing achievement.
Yeah, I thank you. It's so fun to talk about because I feel like I get to almost like live it all again.
Well, I like feel like it's such a privilege to get to sit down with Olympians and talk about it because you almost like you sort of see it and you get really caught up in the emotion. But then hearing about what it felt like on the ground is like triple goosebumps. It's just so exciting to hear what it felt like you And also to look at you and know that you're reflecting, like often it is the first or second time you've really thought about it with
some distance and perspective as well. Like that actually happened to.
Me, What, yeah, I do have to sort of take that step back and kind of be like that's pretty cool, you know, I think, yeah, you know, you're always wanting more, wanting to achieve the next goal, and so it's so easy to you know, finish a championship and be like, Okay, next time I want to do this, I want to do that, and you start immediately moving on to how am I going to do that? Why I'm going to do that? But I think, you know, it's so valuable.
And I've sort of actually read a newspaper article before the Olympics were originally meant to be that was had a bunch of coats from Ian Thorpe about how, you know, he'd sort of been a bit like that in his career in terms of not really celebrating some of the successes when they happened. And I think I sort of looked back on my sort of last few years, you know, since the last Olympics, and I was like, you know what, I was really quick to move on, and I just
wanted to do more. So this year I sort of tried really hard to kind of stop and celebrate and soak it all up and you know, share it with the people who have been so important to getting me to that start or getting to that finish line. You know, my friends, my family, my coaches and training partners and things like that, and just really acknowledge, I guess, not only their contribution, but to sort of to share that
success that we were all a part of. Yeah, I think it's just, you know, it makes you really appreciate all the work that you put in to achieve a goal rather than being like, all right, what's next. I mean, obviously you need to need to do that as well, but I think kind of having that pause before moving on it's been really important. And Yeah, I feel like I did a much better job of that this year, and it was kind of cool to be out to reflect.
You actually did a really lovely post on that a little while ago, like maybe six or seven post back. I saw that you did take like a real moment to reflect on what you'd achieved and list the things, which often feels really awkward to sort of list your achievements over the year, but to stop and reflect on them, like that's a big part of CZA. What is the point in achieving your goals if you're just going to start chasing the next one straight away after and never
let it settle. So I love that idea of taking a moment to celebrate and really reflect on your achievements. We have so many questions from people who have been incredibly inspired by you, who are so excited about running, but who really just don't know where to start, or who don't have the coaches or the team or the background years and years of running behind them like you do. So I'm very, very grateful to have you here to
pick your brains today. From a practical standpoint, the first thing I'd love to ask you about, particularly in the context of how well you've done recently and how much you've increased your speed over the last couple of years,
is just that how do you increase your time? I think that's the question I got asked the most when I announced that we were going to do this, And I know that for a lot of people that was in the context of a half marathon or a much longer distance, but even the fact that you mentioned how vary do your distances have to be for a fifteen hundred? How do you work you said speedwork before. What is
speed work for you? How do you actually think that people can break through those plateaus they might have hit?
Well? I think, you know, having consistency and not having injuries and staying healthy is obviously like your first step.
You know, you can't sort of jump to the next one before you've kind of got a solid standing on that first you know, you can't, Like, I guess even just right now, in my sort of return to running, I've spent the last two weeks just doing jogs and haven't done a whole lot any harder or faster, and just kind of you know, remembering how to run, letting my muscles adapt and so that you know, I'm not going to risk getting injured by just jumping straight in. Yeah,
I guess. So it's almost. Yeah. We like to really work back from you know, that most important race, so obviously that was the Olympics last year, and kind of being like all right, like this is where we need to be, and then kind of working backwards from sort of that race day, you know, to build up that consistency and kind of I guess the closer we get to race day, typically a lot of the running gets shorter and faster because you know, you're really trying to
sharpen up. I guess it's pretty different to those people running a marathon and a half marathon to a fifteen hundred, that's for sure, But you know, you do want to sort of be a bit fresher and faster come race day. So I guess, yeah, that sort of longer, less fun. In my opinion, training is definitely going to come earlier, and that's kind of what's coming for us in the next few weeks. But I think being able to improve, you need to I guess, like we're saying before, is
not just keep doing the same thing. You know, have that variety in your training and have different distances and different intervals or things like that, and mix it up with you know, some hill running or some you know running on different surfaces and changing it up to you know,
keep challenging yourself in different ways. You know, obviously probably not throwing a thousand new things at yourself in a week, but you know, picking you know, maybe one thing a week to challenge yourself on and maybe that's you know, doing a hilly run one day a week rather than
running around a flat course every week or something. Or maybe it's running ten minutes longer, or you know, if you've got to watch the tracks your pace, it's you know, maybe running for the last five minutes of your run a little bit faster or something like that, and just finding you know, little new ways to get to challenge yourself and slowly creep it up and you know, definitely
not throwing it all yourself in one go. I think it's it's very much, as you know, a tiered approach and you know, add one new thing and kind of you know, let yourself adjust to it. I guess you know it's going to make you sow, probably as I'm finding asking my return to run and Jim Lan things like that, and you know, wait till you sort of feel like you've got on top of that and you're not like, don't feel like you've been hit by a
bus the next day. And then you know, when you feel confident with that, you know, then maybe you can try another way to challenge yourself. And I think sometimes we're having you know, maybe a training partner or something is really good because you can kind of push each other sometimes. You know, if you're going out for a run on your own, it's like, I was going to go do that, you know, hilly run today, but you know,
a bit tired. But you know, if you've already told your friend or hey, we're going to go run at whatever park and there's hills there, you're like, well, better go. I think, you know, having that accountability when you're you know, trying new things or things that are hard is really cool. And then you know you kind of get to celebrate at the end, you know, high five and things like that. It's you know, kind of fun. Just to achieve it together. I think that makes it more fun.
So hilly runs important for us because you're like, a track is flat obviously, so for speedwork, do you make sure to include different kind of like gradients in running as well as just intervals of different speeds within a flat surface.
Yeah, we definitely do some hill sprints and things like that that really, I guess they're not much fun. I don't love them. I complain a lot.
Obviously they're good for you though.
Like vegetables, But yeah, it's probably something we do further away from racing. I guess, you know, I often pull up pretty sore, so I like to do well. I get told to do that a lot further away from when in more of a preparation phase than sort of a competition phase, that's for sure, because yeah, it's a different way to challenge yourself, I guess. And so you're using different muscles and things like that, so it gets stronger, that's for sure.
Yeah, I think that's really good advice because I often just do the same texture, like the same kind of ground, and just vary the distance, and then I'm like one, I getting faster in each of these distances, But it's probably because it's not varied at all. I just do the same thing but change out good how far I'm going, and then wonder why I'm not getting faster. But I think, yeah, varying that up just so your legs can kind of get used to it is something definitely to integrate into
your routine. What about you mentioned before about injury, and I think that's another reason why, Like remembering non runner me I used to start running, I wouldn't do a warm up, I wouldn't do a warm down. I just go from zero to hero and then I'd be so sore, and then that would fuel my belief that I hated running, but it was only because I wasn't doing it properly. What about I mean a big part of today's topic is replenishing and recharging. How do you warm up properly?
And how do you warm down properly? Like what actual exercises do you do? How long do you put into that?
Yeah, the last of normal warm up warm down is usually just an easy jog and then obviously with some sort of dynamic drills and stretching and things like that,
which yeah, definitely to sort of get you going. And you know, sometimes there's a few extra bits and pieces that might have come from physio if you know, you've had a problem with something, and just keeping on top of all those little things and looking after yourself in between so that you know you're showing up for the next run and you're not in the worst state possible, I guess, you know, to help yourself a little bit, as easy as is just to be like, oh, I'm done,
thank god. I don't know. Everyone's busy and you're trying to squeeze, you know, in here and there, So sometimes you are a bit you know, go go go, but yeah, sort of probably taking the time to you know, make sure you doodle warm down, or getting enough food into you and the right foods into you, and you know in summer especially, you know as we're coming into you know, keeping hydrated and getting enough sleep. I think sleeper is
pretty undervalued as a recovery tool. I think it's, you know, we're so busy and distracted these days as well, Like it's easy, like the amount of times it's so easy and you're like, oh my gosh, it's like eleven o'clock, you know, you just get caught up watching squid games or something, which was us last night, and you're like, oh my gosh. So I think just like having routines is really good to you know, once you make something a habit around your recovery and things like that, it's
it's so much easier. It's less of a chore. You can't just do it without thinking. You're like, yeah, okay, finish my run, my gym session. I have this snack in the car on the way to you know, work or something. Yeah, and things like that.
Yeah, I found that I remember to warm up and do some like calf stretches and quads and just like really quick sort of simple leg stretches. But warming down is something you just forget because you kind of like, oh, I've done it, you know, tick, and you just want to rush off to the next thing. But if you go and sit down straight away and then like an hour later try and stand up, I'm like, Oh, that's why people warm down. What do you actually do as a warm down? Like what exercises or do you walk
it off? Like what kind of advice do you have to people who don't actually know what a warm down is.
Yeah, so if we've been doing a track session or some harder running, we'll just do like an easy jog. For me, that's fifteen minutes. But you know, that's all
sort of in context of my overall training. I guess, you know, if it's five minutes because your session was ten minutes, you know that makes sense as well, And that fifteen minutes is like as slow as it needs to be on that day, and it's probably the slowest running I do for the week, And it's often the first few minutes are the worst, like and kind of once you get that hard running out of your legs a little bit you kind of almost flush it out,
and you know, the last few minutes you're like, Okay, yes, that was a good idea, Like I needed that. Yeah, but yeah. Often, you know, if you're training with someone else, in that first five minutes, it's kind of like, okay, no one talk.
Like no, no, worse, I cannot.
Exactly, so it's kind of like, yeah. It's like you know, when you get in the beach and it's really cold. In that first few minutes, you're like, oh, sort of freezing, and then after a few minutes you're like, oh, yeah, this is pretty good. This is nice. It's kind of that saying, like, you know, get through the first little bit when you're really tired, and then you kind of come good and you adjust and you kind of flush it out of your legs and you definitely feel better
for it the next day. But at the time you're like, it is the longest like three k's of my life.
Oh my god, I love that three cases you're warmed down. Do you do the same on like a long run day, So on your Sunday long runs at the end of the run, what would you normally do.
I'll often just do some like sort of dynamic drills are not necessary, like sort of some static stretches, but sort of yeah, a few sort of I guess, like walking lunge stretches and a few sort of things like that, I guess just to do it sort of depends what's sawing cranky as to sort of probably what gets more attention. But for example, I find my hips get really tired
after a long run, just you know, fatigued. So yeah, a lot of kind of like sort of lungy stretches, you know, your arms over your head and twisting and kind of just trying to I love the just kind of yeah, trying to free up sort of that sort of movement through my hips and sort of some like leg swings and things like that, just to kind of try and loosen up the sort of hips and back and things like that. For me, tends to get a little bit cranky after those longer runs.
And are you like are you a bath person or you're going to the ocean for the cold person? Like is it hot recovery, cold recovery? What do you think is best for the legs?
Well, it depends what you've got access to. Like we don't have a bath at home, so it's oh my god. Hopefully in my next place we will, but right now we don't. But we live pretty close to the beach, so yeah, sometimes I do head down there after after training, especially in summer when it's kind of hot and refreshing
as well. But yeah, definitely when I know I've got a session that's really going to challenge me, and maybe I've got a race coming up and I want to make sure I'm recovering well, we'll use the ice baths or like the hot and cold pools, which is not like my favorite activity, but in other one of those kind of like but the bullet I know this is good for me scenarios, which is, yeah, you know, you always do feel a little bit a little bit better
for it. But yeah, I do kind of spend a bit of time in compression socks and things like my calves tend to get pretty cranky. Yeah, I've had some injuries with those in the past, so I like to try and baby those a little bit. And yeah, so I think it's just finding, yeah, the things on that for you get sore and tired, or the things that might have been injuries in the past, and finding its little things that make them feel better and recover better, you know, just be pham rolling or a spiky ball
or yoga or something like that. You know, there's everyrun's got different ways of making their bodies feel good.
Yeah, now, drawing on your dietetics qualifications, this is something that, again along with speed, has been the most common question and also something that I worry about a lot, refueling after a run, but also fueling before a run. I discovered the other day I tried to go for a run before breakfast because I thought then my stomach wouldn't I wouldn't have to wait for the food to settle and just avoid that whole thing. But I just didn't
have enough energy. Like I figured out, I'm an afternoon runner. But the kind of question that came up a lot was and this is like maybe not for a fifteen hundred runner, but just from your dietetics background, people are like, how do you fuel up before a longer run? Are you meant to fuel during the run? You know, are you supposed to not eat so that your stomach doesn't you know, get all upset? And also how do you
run and hydrate without getting a stitch? Like these dietetics questions I was like, oh my god, Linda, help so talk us through running nutrition.
Yeah all right, well, yeah, like you said, you definitely want some fuel in the tank, especially for those those longer runs. So the things that are going to give our muscles the most fuel that the fuel we're actually going to use on that run is you know, our carbohydrates. And I guess the simpler that form of carbohydrate is, the easier it is for us to digest, and the
quicker that energy we'll get to our muscles. So, you know, you really quick carbohydrates like your gatorade, your you know, white bread, a banana, like lollies, things like that.
Oh my god. I thought this was all just like us justifying ourselves having like carb loading. But I'm so glad you're confirming it.
Yeah. Yeah, carbs aren't like essential. So yeah, if you're sort of getting up and running or you know, running in the afternoon, it's those sort of people are Carbohydrates are the ones you want to be getting in that sort of you know, hour two hours before. They're typically going to sit a little bit better. And I think sometimes if you do struggle to digest them, sometimes things that are in a liquid form sit a bit better
with a lot of people. So just you know, I guess that's just absorbed, a little easier, a little quicker,
a little easier on the gut. And then yeah, I guess if you're actually going in to do, you know, like a really long run or something, it's you know, I'm sure people are if they're preparing to run a half marathon or a marathon, Yeah, you definitely want to be taking on some fuel, you know, beyond that kind of hour and a half sort of marker of time, and whether that's gels, gatorad, lollies, all sorts of things. You know. I think everyone has different things that they
like or convenient to carry or things like that. Or if you know, if you're going to run back by where you've parked your car or something, you can kind of have a quick step off, or you know, if you've got to cram a gel in your sports bar or something like that, it's you Yeah, but I think what's really cool about that is it gives you, you know, if you are going to go and run a marathon, you definitely want to be practicing what nutrition you're going
to take on in your marathon. In your training, we don't want to be trying new things on race day.
I've had an awkward toilet moment because I tried something the first day on a race day and I'm never doing that again. So is that a thing like you have to train your body, including your bladder and boughs to cope with things along the run, because I in my mind, I was always like I will try and not eat before and then not eat during so that my body just doesn't get confused with like putting extra stuff in it. But is that totally the wrong thing
to do because then you just don't have the fuel. Yeah, definitely, Like the more you practice, you know, taking on any kind of fuel mid run while you're running, you know, the more tolerance you're going to get kind of training you've got in a way to take on that fuel, to use that fuel and it's less like poly to cause and cause an upset hopefully. So yeah, definitely something you want to be practicing in your training, that's yeah,
that's for sure. And you know, finding different people different brands of products you know work better for others or different you know, sort of you've got gels, you've got drinks, you've got like lollies and chews and bars and you know, so many different forms.
Of getting nutrition in that it's really important to be find what works best for you from a practicality, you know standpoint as well as you know taste digestion and you know what's its best. Yeah, So definitely practicing these things before race day is like the golden rule of nutrition. I feel like, from you know, running a marathon.
Perspective, and that is so interesting that you mentioned about the hour and a half mark like that that's about where you should start because I wouldn't even know. I'm like, I'd just eat all my gels straight away and then be like, oh, I've got none left.
You can definitely take them on earlier, and you know, people definitely tend to, but I guess you're not going to start running out until that point. I guess in terms of what you've got on board from your breakfast or you didn't have the night before and things like that.
Yeah, so what then should you eat like the night before? And then what should you eat straight after? Because that's another thing that I always like. It's so easy because sometimes after you finish running you feel sick. I often feel a little bit not really sick, but just a bit nauseous and not super hungry. But I know that like for your muscles to recover from a long run, it's important to just push through that fielly and actually
put something in your body. So what should you be eating straight after a run?
Yeah, for sure. So in our recovery, we want carbo hydrates because we want to replace the carbohydrates that we've just used. We want some protein because that's going to obviously help repair our muscle damage that we might have done and help us get stronger again. And carbs and protein work pretty well together, so they work better in a pair rather than separately. And then we want to rehydrate as well, because we've obviously been sweating and things
a lot. So they're sort of our three goals, I guess.
And I think it's about, you know, when we are feeling a bit nauseous or run really hard and it's getting something in and then maybe you're getting something of better quality, and maybe when you've sort of settled down, so that's something you know, might just be gatorade or something, because that's going to give you some carbohydrates and some hydration, and then you know you might settle down your stomach a little bit later and be able to have you know,
some yogurt or a smoothie or something something like that that's maybe not quite as palatable in the like immediately after finishing. Yeah, and then obviously working out what's like practical if you're out and about in the summer and you've driven thirty minutes to somewhere that you've run or something, you know, what's going to stay food safe in the car at that time while you're running.
You don't want to sound in the middle of a run.
Yeah, I think there's a lot of planning to make sure you know you're packing snacks or you know that like, oh yeah, as soon as I'm done, there's like holes around the corner and I can go there and pick up whatever snack you like to have. So I think, like the worst thing for me is getting caught without snacks.
I hate being caught without whether I'm running or not exactly.
So I think planning, planning is key for that recovery, to know that you know you've got something there. I'm a huge fan of an up and go because it kind of ticks all of those boxes, and in summer, I like chuck in the freezer and then by the time I'm done running, it's still cold but defrosted.
That's a great tip.
Super handy because it's got it's obviously the liquid, so it's got to rehalf rehydration element, but it's also got some carbs and protein from the milk and the flavoring and things like that. So a bit about like all in one kind of ties me over to wake at home and then I'll get home and have breakfast or dinner or lunch, whatever time a day it is.
And the night before when I'm running a long run, and I'm like, the night before, I'm just going to go for like a massive bowl of pasta or something. Is that actually what you should be doing? Like are you actually carveloading from the night before a long run?
I mean, if you're running to a point where you think you're going to use all of those carbohydrates. So yeah, like if you're going to go for a two hour run, you definitely want to put a bit of attention on, you know, having a few more carbs the night before, because that way, I guess you're waking up and your fuel tanks is already full.
Well, Lindon, that was such useful information. I honestly was just like stabbing in the wind, making random guesses about carb loading and when to eat. And I obviously now understand that trying to run without any fuel is such a bad idea. So I'm so glad that I understand why that was not going down too well for me. Thank you so much for sharing all of your wisdom and knowledge and beautiful story. It's been so so lovely to have you today. Last question for you, what's your favorite quote?
Oh right, it sounds a bit silly, but my favorite is when you go back to a bit of toy story here. Yes, my favorite pre race, I guess is probably where it came from is just run like the wind pools. I. I love it, which kind of just started because it's like a little joke with my mom and I when I was a kid, and then you know, we kind of just kept it going and you know, even before the Olympic, should texts me and be like, run like the wind puls Ie, and it just like
makes me happy. It's a bit funny, it's a bit cute, it relaxes me, and it's about running kind of.
Oh my gosh, I love it so much, and I love that it's like that little injection of like not taking it too seriously, but you are taking it seriously. It's a bit of fun. It's like very czya. I love it so much.
Yeah, that's my fast favorite one.
Oh well, thank you so much for joining Linden. It is just such a pleasure and I know so many people listening will have gained so much from this today.
Thanks so much for the chat. It was so fun.
Another wonderful episode, jam packed with nuggets of wisdom that I hope you all found as useful as I have in the lead up to Melvin Mara and beyond. If you are running in Melbourne Marathon, please let us know. I'd love to look out for you on the day and hear any of your training takeaways from these chats. It's so exciting for our guests and these wonderful athletes to see how you've been implementing things that they might have shared. And yeah, watch you guys getting excited about
the sport. As always, I would love you in the neighborhood to share the episode if you enjoyed listening, tagging all of us at Linden dot hole at Nike Running and at Rebel Sport, so that we can keep growing the neighborhood as far and wide as possible and hopefully accessing a lot of other potential or aspiring or even already pro runners. I hope this is helping you all embrace that and motivating you to a achieve your running potential.
Thank you so much to Nike and Rebel for making this miniseries possible, and hopefully we can bring you many more in the future. Hope you guys are all having a great week and seizing your yay