I believe that life is for yes people and you've just got to take opportunities and if they don't work out, boo who like When conditions are stable, you may as well go with your gut and see where it leads to you. I'm not really a product person. I'm a brand person. I believe that people come in for how a brand makes them feel, and return because of how a brand makes them feel.
Welcome to the sees the Yay Podcast.
Busy and happy are not the same thing. We too rarely question what makes the heart seeing. We work, then we rest, but rarely we play and often don't realize there's more than one way. So this is a platform to.
Hear and explore the stories of those who found lives They adore, the.
Good, bad and ugly. The best and worst day will bear all the facets of seizing your yay.
I'm Sarah Davidson or Spoonful of Sarah, a lawyer turned fu entrepreneurs walktor suits and heels to co found matcha Maiden and matcha Milk Bark CZA is a series of conversations on finding a life you love and exploring the self doubt, challenge, joy and fulfillment along the way. Hello, lovely neighborhood. I hope you are all having a wonderful week.
I think we were originally scheduled for a Years of Our Lives episode right now after last week's guest episode, and Ange and I have actually already recorded that Years of Our Lives episode a little bit more organized than usual, But as that will probably end up being our sign off for a short break while Nick and I wait for this little baby Davidson to arrive, it made more sense to pop this week's guest in first, particularly as
she has carried us through the past few weeks. I'm talking, of course, about the incredible co founder of The Memo and founder of The Blow, Phoebe Simmons, who I have been fangirling for so many years and am so excited
to share with you. If you've been anywhere near my socials, you'll know how heavily I've leaned on Phoebe and The Memo and their incredible team during this pregnant and how much they've taken the stress and overwhelm out of preparing for a little one, leaving room for us to fully enjoy and just get excited about what's to come, we'll cover, of course, how the Memo has absolutely revolutionized a whole industry that has traditionally and somewhat inexplicably been pretty functional
and daggy for something that is so cute, and turned it into a world that is now finally beautifully esthetic, carefully curated, and most importantly user friendly with life saving lists which you'll hear all about. I feel like it's pretty much become like the mecha of the baby world. It is such a pleasure to be in the Memo and shopping there, which actually makes sense given that's where Phoebe started off her career on an incredible pathway to
living and breathing. Brand building, which you'll also hear about how it took her from Mecca to LVMH, around the world to Benefit Cosmetics and back home she's such an incredible businesswoman, and then of course to her own two businesses, the Blow and then the Met. The second part is then a Q and A based on yours and mostly my questions actually about some of the biggest decisions when preparing for a new baby. Phoebe just gives such valuable advice.
I was mainly asking questions for myself. It just happened that a lot of you submitted the same ones. You might also notice a bit of a sound change around that Part two. Her AirPods died at the perfect interval.
Sounds like it was recorded on two different days, but it wasn't, although we will probably be needing to record on a different day for a follow up part two, if not a follow up full series, as we barely scratch the surface, not only of Phoebe's incredible part ya all the knowledge and wisdom, different dots that had to connect and chapters that got her to where she is today just changing people's literally changing people's lives, including our own,
but also for the follow up questions, because her knowledge is just endless, and not only her she helped us so much in this chapter, but there's a whole postpartum chapter as well, and I'm sure that many of you will have follow up questions based on what she shared today,
so stay tuned for that. Let us know if anyone else has any more questions and would like a follow up Part two, even if it's just giving me an excuse to catch up with her again, because she's just such an easy conversationalist, as you guys will hear, so I will let Phoebe tell you the rest herself. I really do hope you guys enjoy this one and get as much out of it as I did. Phoebe, Welcome to Cca.
Thank you so much, Sarah. I'm really really happy to be here. This is going to be fun.
I'm so excited. Just before we started recording, Phoebe introduced herself as a longtime listener, first time caller. It makes me so happy that you've been listening. I think we've been mutually fangirling each other for years.
Yes, absolutely, absolutely love what you do, Sarah, and I'm just thrilled that you're at this stage in your life and in your pregnancy. You've done a phenomenal job getting to this place, so we're just so so happy for you.
Well, thank you so much. And if anyone hasn't been following along, although I'm sure you will have seen it on socials, half the reason why I I am here and my mental health is semi intact is because Phoebe has been my fairy baby mother for the past couple of months. And every time I have a MENTV about like what am I supposed to buy? And what does
this mean? And one of these words, either you or the list you've created, or the beautiful team you've compiled, like have come in and just taken the stress and overwhelming fear out of it. So I am so grateful for you, so grateful for everything you do.
I'm so thrilled.
That's what we're all about.
We're all about helping you feel good and prepared and supported during what can be such an overwhelming time, and it should be a really exciting time. So I'm glad that we're here for you.
Yeah, you have absolutely done that, removed the brain space that it takes up to be stressed and allowed room for excitement and joy. And like the first time I came into the memo and you were there, we were just so excited because the list just take care of the stressful bit and the rest is just joy. So it's lovely.
Well, you know, the thing is like shopping for baby should be fun, Like it's fun to be able to invest in your new family. It's a whole new category that you never have got to explore before as a first time parent. So yeah, we really wanted to create an enjoyable and feel good experience.
We absolutely have done that. But as you know as a ECA listener, I love to go through all the bits and parts of not just your pathway, but also your personality and how you even got to this stage, because I think people often they will meet you now and they'll see you as this hugely successful mum who has the balance right and who's got two incredible, all incredible businesses, But it can really seem like you always knew that this is what the gap in the market was,
and that you're so clear on your purpose now, But you know it never happens that way. So I kind of like to first give a bit of context before we jump into the amazing questions people have been submitting and draw on your knowledge. I'd love to go back to the start to sort of how Phoebe became Phoebe. So can we go back all the way to maybe even childhood? Like what were you like? What did you
gravitate towards? Did you know what you wanted to be when you grew up or were you just one of those people who had no idea and kind of let it all on revel?
Oh? No, I always knew what I wanted to I'm a very decisive person growing up. I wanted to have a shop, and so I sometimes you know, say to Kate, got just pinch yourself, like thinking that, you know, I've got the blow in little Collins Street in Melbourne. And then the fact that we've got the memo as an actual store with like a register. I remember when you
used to play shops and it was so fun. You got to interact with people and you know, hand over the bag like I still get a kick out of that, and being able to interact with our customers, you know, with an actual store. You know, obviously we have the online store as well, but this is really a dream come true and it's something I always wanted to do
as a child. I was very procroached and focused. I think for me, the biggest kind of light bulb moment was when I was I guess fifteen, you know when you can start working, and I went and worked at the Body Shop in Geelong, which was at the height of fashion in Geelong, I.
Imagine cutting edge. Yeah, yeah, I was.
Not only story in Geelong and we really went for it with the body button so iconic, so iconic, and I got a really amazing sense of brand building through an it erotic who was the founder of the Body Shop and what she had created, which was really a brand that meant something and a brand that stood for something.
And so then after I did commerce at Melbourne UNI, or while I was doing commerce at Melbourne UNI, I was working for Mecca, and you know, another great case in point of what they've been able to build there in terms of a really unique position in the market, ownership of the market, finding those gaps and also doing brand and service and experience and curations so well. So yes, I would say my runway to building the blow. And of course the memo was pretty clear.
Which I love because you do often hear the alternative way of things happening where you're like, you know, people
are like, I had no idea whatsoever. I fell into this and I fell into that, And I love that even if it wasn't immediate, and even if it wasn't like the very first thing you did that you did kind of always know you wanted a shop and that yeah, even though it took you know, lots of steps to get there, that that was the goal and now you're living that dream and that is so incredibly exciting because it is like then a full circle because you knew
that that's what you wanted to do. But I also think it's so interesting to see how many chapters you had before that, so getting your start at Mecca and learning about how to build big brands, but also working overseas, so going to London with LVMH and then to you know, Asia, a totally different market to work with Benefit, and then coming back to Australia to sort of work as a
marketing director. And that's really interesting to me because that was you not being a founder yet and working within the structure of a corporation even though you knew that you wanted to have your own shop. So talk to us about like why those were formative and why you know, perhaps you didn't start your own thing straight off the bat when you finished UNI, because I think we're all
very impatient to get to the end. So if you knew that was the end goal, why wasn't that the first step, why did you sort of take those steps?
Well, I guess, I mean I always just loved the idea of it and loved it the idea of it as a kid, but I didn't really check back in on it while I was in my twenties and early thirties until I had the idea for the blow, and
then until Kate had the idea for the memo. For me, I really wanted to after UNI, I really wanted to move to the UK, and I was so fortunate to be set up with through Mecca, with a skincare company called Nude Skincare, which was a small, independent, very entrepreneurial brand, but it had an amazing distribution in you know, the top department stores like Harrods and Selfridges and John Lewis
in the UK and then Sapphor in the US. So it was an amazing foundation for me to understand how brands work with retail and how retail works with brands.
But then, in an incredible twist of fate, Nude was acquired by LVMH lou Veton mlly Tennessey, which is the biggest luxury goods business in the world, and so I got to learn how to build a brand, the Lvier mah way, how to express a brand, the alviermh Way, how to market a brand, the alviermh Way, which is a once in a lifetime opportunity and you just say yes and you hold on tide. And I learned a lot from the team. Apart from Christian Duor, I was spending time in Paris, and you know, I was twenty
five twenty six. So for me, like my eyes were wide open and I would do whatever it took to be able to soak up as much experience as I could. My hand was up like it was raised high in b such a keno. Yeah, and like how great. And
I think that's the benefit of living overseas. Sometimes you can just get rocketed to experiences that you may not have if you're based in the same town your whole life in Australia, you just global exposure can become much bigger if you're fortunate enough to be in the right
place at the right time, which I was. But then after about four years, I was really keen with my partner at the time to move to Singapore and so LVMH transferred me to Benefit Cosmetics in Southeast Asia, where I headed up the expansion of Benefits business and brand across SPORA in Southeast Asia. So that's like working in markets like India, Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia. And what I weren't there was that the Benefit brand was so strong.
It was so clear they had such a clear vision of exactly what made Benefits so unique in the market in the world, but then how that would apply to completely different countries, languages, cultures, buying habits, beauty, taste and trends. But yet the brand was still so strong and clear. It didn't change, it didn't wager, it was who it was and customers took what they liked from it. It was amazing. Benefit is the most amazing brand. And then
I was keen to come home. So after about eighteen months, I moved back to Australia and then I started a position as the marketing director for Benefit Cosmetics based in Sydney, which was just fantastic. And then I had the idea for the plot.
Okay, well, I love that we kind of got to go through that because I think, yeah, a lot of people meet you now and you are introduced as the founder of the Blow and the Memo, and it's very very entrepreneurial heavy kind of skating over the fact that a lot of your learning and your skill set, that the whole absorbing by osmosis about brand building and different markets and knowing what has been able to make the Blow and the Memo so successful came from before your
entrepreneurial journey. And there is also a lot of focus I think on people talking about making that lead of faith and you know, people leaving to start their own business because they hate their time in corporate and sometimes not a lot of you know, emphasis on the fact that working insider company can be such a valuable place to take opportunities to work overseas, to learn from the
best brand builders in the world. So what's your perspective on your time before you had the idea and when you were in that learning phase versus waiting for the idea to come rather than sometimes people reverse engineer the journey. If I just want to have my own thing, I don't know what I'm going to do yet, so I feel lost, like what's my place in the world. I like that you learn everything you could and then the idea struck and then that was the next chapter.
Yes, I was not in patience to start my own business. I didn't know if it was ever something that I necessarily needed to do because I was enjoying my corporate role so much. And I just ride the wave right and I go where it feels good. I'm very instinctive, and I go with my gut and I was just loving my role at Benefit. And I think for me, I have had brand drummed into me. Like the discipline that you learn at LVMH is world class. And you know, I learned that if a brand doesn't stand for anything,
it won't stand out at all. It needs to mean something. And I think this is this spirit that we've taken into the blow. And then the memo is anyone can sell stuff, Like we know that there's big box retailers, we know that there's major global online businesses that sell stuff, and they sell stuff really, really well. What I'm more interested in is creating brands that mean something to people, that help them feel supported, that lift them up, that
resonate and stay with them. And so for me, that's more about an experience than a commerciality, and then the rest will follow. I'm not really a product person, I'm a brand person. I believe that people come in for how a brand makes them feel and return because of how a brand makes them feel. So yeah, that was
what was under my belt. And then I was spending a lot of time in San Francisco with Benefit, that's where their head office is, and I was seeing these North American women getting their blow drys once or twice a week. They were turning to the service as a way to feel more polished and powerful. They're going in at six am to get their hair done. And then I got on that trend, and then I was coming back because I need it. I have a lot of trouble with doing my own hair. I'm not a skilled
and it's always been an issue for me. Like growing up and untamed, didn't I love a blow dry. So when I came back home to see me, I couldn't find that service. Blow dry bars existed, but they weren't in a CBD location, they weren't at a consistent The service wasn't consistent, it wasn't a competitive price, it wasn't decked out in the way that I thought. It wasn't a space that made me feel really good. I wasn't
excited to be there. I didn't think I was going to bump into anyone who would make me feel even better about my day. And so I thought that there was an opportunity to deliver this to Australian women. And I'd seen the success of brow bars through benefit around the world, and I thought that that same application could be done to blow dry bars in Australia. So I moved back to Melbourne and I opened the blow in September twenty eighteen.
Oh my gosh, I love that so much because I offered say that. One of my favorite quotes is I think it's Maya Angelou, and that's people will never remember what you said or what you did. They'll always remember how you made them feel. And by extension, the product is important. But so many brands like they're advertising for things like Coca Cola. It's not the Coca Cola, it's the feeling that that brand tries to create for you,
and that's what you keep returning to. So I love that that's such a constant theme for you in brand building, but also that on your own personal pathway, you don't have to be really unhappy somewhere to make a change. I think that's another thing that people sort of think, unless it's bad, I don't have to change what I'm doing if it's just fine, if I'm ticking lots of boxes, if I'm financially stable, like, why would I look for anything else? Rather than It's okay to want something different
and more, even if you're not desperately unhappy. So it's wonderful to hear that you loved your career that you had and yet you could still see that it was you had an idea that was worth making a jump for without waiting until it was like possible for you to keep going. Because I think that's what does keep a lot of people in careers that don't necessarily fulfill them because they just think it's ungrateful to leave, or it's just yeah that you need some sort of discomfort
to change. So when you did get to that point, what was your leap? Was it going part time first? Did you kind of go all in and just like resign, Like how did you take that step? Was it gradual or was it an all or nothing? I am the Blow now, Well I did work on The Blow behind the scenes for probably about six months.
I think I had a really long notice period, so I gave a lot of time to the business to let them work through a progression plan for me, and then I think I left. I left Sydney for Melbourne to start The Blow, maybe like five or six weeks before we opened the doors. WHOA, that's so short. Yeah, well it was ready to go. I mean, you know that was basically taking the leaf, like picking up the keys and the builders getting to work. But it was everything else was all set up right, like the brand
had already been done. And what I found really helpful for me was that the way I approached all of those tasks was I did everything that I could do as the Walmart prior, so like, yeah, the brand marketing, all the Instagram obviously, the website, the services, everything that didn't require boots on the ground and a time limit. Then I did that first, and then it meant that as the store was being built, we could focus on
recruitment team and starting to turn things on. So it made it feel less congested in those last five or six weeks.
Yeah, And I think that's what a lot of people do to manage the perceived ve scale of a jump from one thing to the other. Is like, do as much as you can well with your feed are in both doors to minimize how gaping that hole can feel. How did you find you mentioned that when you're sort of ready for a new chapter, it's very intuitive for you, and I think that is an amazing way to make
decisions that often leads to very few regrets. And when you're listening to your gut and blocking out all the noise of all the different things in society that are pulling you in different ways, that you kind of find the path that's meant for you. But I know a lot of people struggle with societal expectations on the outside, but then internally self doubt imposter syndrome, particularly if it's moving from the safety of an employment role to starting
something on your own. You've never done it before, you don't have necessarily the safety of a boss or a corporate structure to fall back on when you were going all in and not on an online store either. The overheads for an act premises that you're renovating. You know, that's very scary. How do you deal with fear and novelty and discomfort when you're doing something so new? Did you feel like self doubt as an emotion or were you just so focused?
No, I don't have self doubt and I don't believe in imposter syndrome. Really, it's a patriarchal construct common sera. It's not a thing.
You are the first person who's just called it like that, though, like I think a lot of people think that they just don't say it. I love that, Yeah.
We need to stop giving that airtime. I think it's mind over matter. For me, Yeah, it was insignive. I just thought with the blow that I had enough skill, experience and resources to be able to do it, like why not me? And I think Kate and I both felt that with the memo as well. I believe that life is for yes people. I mean, I know you live like that as well, and you've just got to take off chimneys and if they don't work out, boo who.
Like it's you know, I know that I'm privileged to say that, and I know that there are consequences for actions, and particularly with businesses. And I mean, you know, the blow went through COVID in Melbourne like it was dire. It was really hard, you know, and that was scary. But when conditions are stable, you may as well go with your gut and see where it leads to you. Otherwise your life's just going to be pretty straightforward and
you know, not that exciting. And that's why I'm for some people, it's just not for me.
I love that so much. It is so refreshing because I think there's also something about the Australian culture of like tall poppy syndrome and our need to always be so self deprecating. That makes imposter syndrome automatically part of the conversation. And I love that You're just like, nah, like I had the empirical data, I was qualified to do this. Why not me? And that is the totally logical response to why it should work and how it
did work. But I feel like it's so foreign to hear people say that because you're right, it's just an automatic part of the dialogue. It's like so self doubt because you're a woman doing something new. It's like, well, I just didn't let it cripple. It just wasn't really a thing. I love that so much, so refreshing.
I mean, you can even listen to it or you can't lack, but how's it going to serve you? That's not helpful. It's the same with comparison culture. That is not helpful. So just don't play into it.
I love that, and it can be really you know, some people would have had the idea for the blow and then watched you execute it, and now still, you know, years later, be thinking, oh, I had that idea and I just did nothing with it. So I love that you go straight to action, like, well, I've got the idea, so I'm not going to lose time waiting to execute it. How did you know when the memo was going to be the next thing? Because again, I think this like
evolution of chapters. I have this tendency when I start a new chapter, I like pat myself on the back of a little while and think that was big and scare and you did it, and think, Okay, well I'll ride this way forever. No, now, how do you know when it's like I can actually add something else to the mix. I've got a new idea. I could cope with a totally different industry, totally different setup, a business partner like Baby and Beauty, totally different. How did that come about?
Well, that was just an amazing opportunity that Kate presented to me. So I knew Kate through beauty when I was at Benefit and she was at Maya and she'd been at David Jones and then she moved on to Mecca, and so her background is in brand buying, so she had a really great understanding of creating a really unique experience and also curated assortment through her time at Mecca and when she was pregnant. She walked into big box retail.
She was so excited. She was ready to like buy that first thing whatever it was going to be, that she was going to be recommended when she was pregnant. And then she looked back out again. She was overwhelmed. She was disappointed, and she was confused. She was confused not only with where to start, but also confused why no one in Australia had seen baby as a legitimate
opportunity to solve. As you know, I'm sure a lot of your listeners as similar to us in the fact that you used to a certain level of experience when it comes to beauty, fashion, lifestyle, fitness, wellness. But yet why had that not been carried over into the baby industry. So she thought that there was a really big opportunity there. And then she came to me with her idea, and it was a walk around the town and it was an instant yes, like it made total sense. And then
I went home and I started researching it. And I never looked at the baby industry because I was thirty, how old would I have been? Pretty warm petty tree, and not many of my friends had had kids yet. And I hadn't met my partner Sean, then husband.
I know, I was going to say, by the way, husband, as of like seven days ago, congratulations.
Didn't have any idea about the baby industry, which, by the way, is exactly how most people approach first time parenthood. They have no idea where to start, what to do, because they haven't had to look at this industry before. So I went home and I had a look, and I was really surprised at how unsophisticated, how overly commercial, and also a little bit how juvenile some of the
language and the branding was. And I saw a big opportunity to create a brand that would speak to parents in the way that they are used to people, customers, as audience, as a way that they're used to being spoken to in other industries, in a really modern and exciting way. And so yeah, we carved out the voice,
the DNA, the position of the men. Kate put together the most amazing list of products, the products that she had been recommended from a list all of you know, her friends passed around This list of that really did build the basis of the memo. You need three of these. Borrow this from a friend. Don't worry about that product, you definitely need this. But in her experience, she'd had to go off and buy all of these products from a really fragmented industry, like some stuff she was getting
brought in from the States. Some stuff she did have to go to big box retail. There's a lot of shipping charges when you're you know, putting it all together from all these different places. So she pulled all of these products under one roof, which became the MEMO, and we've since obviously expanded our assortment to cater to different taste, price points, lifestyle needs, and yeah, the rest is history. We're four and a half years in now.
Oh my gosh, that's gone so quickly.
Yeah, has is just before COVID as well, it's about four months, four or five months before COVID, so it's the right time to start an online business. And then yeah, we open this store three years after that.
Oh okay, yeah, so there was quite a while of online and then yeah. Yeah, it's just extraordinary thinking now how my experience has been versus even now, even four years later, same market. If you remove the MEMO from the equation, like, I don't know what I would have done for that curation there still is a gap if you weren't there. It's alarming, and it is unusual that it's one of those industries where people are actually like pandemic or no pandemic. If you're ever going to be
willing to invest money in something, it's your child. It's like parenthould and baby and when you want the best, and you know, we might compromise on beauty during a pandemic or a fashion but into it is like you have such a sense of you want safety, you want reliability, but you also want it to be beautiful and exciting, and it's everything else is so daggy and functional, which, like function is obviously important, but you kind of want
that like mecha experience where you feel pampered and everything looks beautiful and which is exactly how you feel the moment you step it to the memo. And I just can't believe that four short years ago there was nothing in that gap.
No, exactly, And so yeah, it was that same thing of if not us, who like, let's go this is really exciting. And I actually think it was beneficial to our brand's evolution in that I wasn't a parent and so I really challenged Kate, because I just didn't understand. Like she was saying, you know, okay, we're going to stock this nipple shield. I'm like, but what is it? Because I was looking online and reading about the product that would be stocking, I'm like, I still don't underst
stand it. And so a key element of our brand voids is this no assumed knowledge. We just cannot assume that people know what a nipple shield is going to do unless we explain it to them and break it down, just like you would talk to a friend and so, you know, just like I would say to you, Sarah
when we caught up in the Armadale boutique. It was like, okay, so like this is what you actually need, this is how it works, Like yes, you're definitely going to need this, or this is something that you might want to consider, you know, once you've had a baby, let's see how you go. You know, you don't need everything at once. This is only something if you're needing to solve this problem. I hope that still, four and a half years on, we're able to express that.
I think that's even cooler that it wasn't two mums who had had that exact same experience and just gone through it because you could speak from a I still don't know what any of these things are. I still have no base knowledge. But then you also have a mum who has sort of just bought all those things. So I love that in a business partnership where you're not overlapping on your role all the time. Otherwise why
would you need two of you. It's kind of nice that you went on the journey as you were building this business, which is amazing and so cool. And I said before we started recording, I wish we could do a four part series or five part series on this because I just want to ask you questions about actually
starting the memo and getting it off the ground. But we have had so many questions that draw on just what you mentioned, the sort of demystifying how confusing and overwhelming being a parent is for the first time, and knowing what to buy and how to choose what's right. And it has genuinely made the last couple of months so enjoyable that you have narrowed down so much information and spoken to me as if I've never heard the information before, because I never have. Yeah, So I've grouped.
We've had a lot of submitted questions, and I've thrown in some of my own that are sort of grouped into themes of yeah, the most things that you would get asked, And hopefully if anyone does have any more questions about the actual business side of starting the memoe getting them off the ground, maybe we could have phoebe back another time to sort of do a follow up
Q and A would be my pleasure. But to move on to the baby prep questions, my first question for you was what is the most sold product.
It's silverrettes, Is it really? Yeah?
Is that why you said nipple shields straightaway?
Well, different things, Sarah. So, silverrettes are nursing cups. They are made of pure medical grades silver. They're antibacterial and anti inflammatory, and you wear them as a preventative measure against nipple damage or to help heal nipple damage. So, for those who don't know, when you start breastfeeding, it can be incredibly and comfortable for some people, and in some cases quite painful because your baby is learning how
to feed and it doesn't come naturally to everyone. And so we recommend that everyone grabs a pair of silverrette and you wear them from that first day for a couple of weeks, so I would wear them twenty four to seven, I think for about six weeks, except obviously when I was feeding, and it just works like magic to protect against you know, not to be too graphic, but cut nipples, bleeding nipples, sore nipples, pulled nipples, all of that uncomfortable feeling, like silverrettes are there for you,
and I hope can bring a lot of parents who are attempting to breastfeed more comfort.
It's so funny that that is the answer, because I reckon maybe even two weeks ago, I had never heard of silverrettes. Before I knew about nipple balms and nursing bras and like you know, the heat and ice packs you can put kind of in your nursing bras. But I walked into the memo the other day when I went in and saw silverrettes for the time and am wearing them right now, are you right at this minute,
right now? Because I just started expressing colostrum, oh right, okay, yesterday, and I went a little bit hard because I got very excited that it worked. Sure, and I was collecting like more than I thought I would on day one, and so I was like I'm going to fill the whole harckefy like I had the little collector and this morning I was like, I'm a bit sore, and I asked someone like, what can you do preventatively and they were like, well, you bought the silverettees, so you can
get them out and put them in now. And so I'm wearing them right now.
Will I love that?
Well?
I hope they work for you.
Have They've been amazing. I've had them on for like seven hours.
Great, that's exactly what we want. You're expressing colostrum. That's exciting. That's good you've been able to do that. And yeah, you just pop them in in the little hucker containers and just write the date on them. So if this when's your due date? Two weeks away, so you pop
that in the freezer with the date. But then if you're expressing colostrum when you're actually in hospital after you've given birth, you can just pop them in the fridge because you might use them, particularly over those first couple of days in hospital before your milk comes in. So it just gives that extra little nutrient top up to your baby.
Yeah, okay, so I was going to do other questions first, But now that we're on the breastfeeding colostrum, there are a lot of questions in that category, so I might start with them now that we're on it. Yes, one of the questions which I had yesterday was do you need nipple cream if you have silverettes or is it kind of one or the other.
My answer is not necessarily. Silverette should do the work of helping with nipple damage. The best thing for nipple damage, in my opinion, is not putting an ointment on any open wounds. It's air dry, it's even a little bit of your natural breast milk around the nipple. And silverrettes and nipple cream can be really helpful to create a barrier around the nipple and actually a little bit of slip when your baby is attaching. But I don't believe that you need both.
Amazing. One of the questions was how early can you start collecting colostrum and what is the range at the memo for to help you do that.
So generally the advice, the medical advice is not before thirty six weeks, and not really at all. If you have a high risk pregnancy, which I had myself, you always check with your GP before you express colostrum because it is part of that building up for labor process.
And so yeah, around that thirty six thirty seven week mark, if you get the you'll clear from your GP and then you can either catch it in a little like a little cup and then use a syringe to extract it, and then if you already had your baby, you can pop that syringe into your baby's mouth and give it to them that way, or you can store it in a colossrum collector like the one that we have from Harker, and you can put it in their fridge and I think generally it will last a couple of weeks, three
to four weeks in the fridge or in the freezer for three to four months.
It's amazing. I learned so much just in that one day. So I've got the Hakker collectors that are presterbilized, they're BPA free, and they're amazing because you can express directly into them and then the baby can feed directly from them, so you're not like transferring a lot of things around. Someone asked, there are two sizes. There's a smaller one that I've been using. Their question was have I used the larger sized collector from Harker. I haven't. Do you
guys sell them? And why would you use the larger size one?
We've just got the one which is large enough. It was definitely large enough for me.
I think it's twenty mil versus forty mil.
I think you're doing pretty well if you expressing that much. And yeah, it's good to have individual ones.
I would say, do you guys sell labels to mark the date or do you just write them on them?
The milky goodness the pack does come with labels which has there's syringes in it as well. Harker doesn't. But I just the way I used the Harker ones was I just wrote with a sharpie.
Yep, that's what I've been doing. Harker also make a wearable breast pump. Is that for only once your milk actually comes in? Or do people pump for colostrum?
Okay? So this is where we get into a lactation consultant territory. Okay, So but I can tell you my experience.
So on day two and three, I was incredibly uncomfortable with massive, massive cement boobs and a huge amount of oversupply that I just couldn't get out, and you always need to strike that balance of whether if you're pumping early on, you're essentially signaling to create more milk, which can overstimulate your supply, and so it needs to be assessed, probably best with the midwife or with a lactation consultant. The Harker Manual Silicon breast pump is best used to
catch letdown of milk. And so if you've got you know, if you're feeding your baby on one boob and then your other boob is starting to really leag like, catch it with the Harker and it will create a certain amount of pressure and then you can use that milk down the track. I think it's unlikely that you would use that tool or that aid for colostrum in my understanding.
And then once your milk does come in. Do you have a favorite wearable breast pump in the range? I think you told me about this one, yes, So I use the.
U high Embody. It was incredible. It was just the most important thing to me was that, well many things about it. It was comfortable, and it gave me my independence. So I think I started using a bread pump from about maybe one or two months in because I was really mobile. I was out and about, I wasn't with Remy all the time, and I could do it from the warehouse, from my car, from the footy, from a restaurant and get on with my day. And so you just pop it inside your bra it catches the milk.
Then you stew it in a milk bag, and then you can either put that milk bag in the fridge or the freezer, and your baby has milk. And yeah, most importantly, it didn't hurt my nipples. It was very, very comfortable and intuitive and easy to use.
And I love that the memo never makes you feel like there's a stupid question, because I feel like at the beginning, you're sort of like, well, if I'm breastfeeding my baby on my breast, like why do I need a pump? So when you talk about your independence, like what is that allowing you to do?
So there's a few reasons why you'd use a breast pump, you know, Lactation consultants might advise to use a breast pump as a way to stimulate supply because it essentially shows the breast that it it's being used and extracting milk like a baby wood and so it can be used in that way. How I used it was a
way to be away from my baby. So when I went back to paid work in the office, I would be sitting at my desk and I would pump around midday, and so I would replace that midday feed for him, you know, and then he would take either a bottle with formula or a bottle with breast milk. But also, like I could go out for dinner, I could be away from him. I wanted to be able to live my life and be social and not be stuck at
home all the time. That was important to me, and I think that's you know, I was so surprised when this pump came out. A lot of people were saying, Wow, that's so extraordinary, that's revolutionary, and it kind of got my back up a bit because I was like, well, why wasn't this created thirty years ago? Like this is fifty years ago. These are products that can really help women, and yet no one, when no one was investing in us in a way to give us our freedom and independence.
And it's so so important to that your postpartum recovery, your mindset, how you feel after giving birth, your identity and so I'm just thrilled that there's so much more innovation coming through in the mum category now.
Absolutely, I mean it's wild that no one else could feed your baby on any other time schedule, then the baby's time schedule until you could pump milk to store.
And then you're pumping by being plugged in. So Kate was talking about when you know, when she had her first child, you know, she was at a wedding and she had to go on pump like in the toilets, like tied to a wall. She didn't have the you know, the rechargeable option, and like that's no fun. That means you're away for an hour, whereas I was at a wedding, sitting at dinner having a conversation, Like I didn't lose any time or fun.
Yeah, that's so Yeah, no one can even tell that you're doing that. That's amazing. What about the bottle prep machines that are done for you. I think one of the examples was Tommy Tippe. I haven't actually heard of these yet. Yeah, are they worth it? Are they wasted money? What's your opinion on them? Like bottling the milk for you?
My opinion? And the Memo's position is you invest in whatever makes your life easier. Pairing bottles is time consuming and sometimes it might just be too hard for you in the middle of the night. So we're actually getting the Tommy to be one next week or the week end of March. And there's also the Baby Breaser Formula Pro Advance, which is basically like a cappuccino machine. You're literally just and it all comes out. It's amazing. Both products are there to help you more easily make a bottle.
And so if that's something that is stressing you out or is eating into your time, or yeah, is making you not enjoy this experience as much, then maybe it is with you investing if you can rationalize the cost.
Yeah, I love that mentality. Back to the sort of gen a trend questions, what is something that people always suggest or that people assume they need that you don't think they actually need to be buying, Like the one thing everyone's like comes in for and then you're like, guys, you don't need that yet, or you don't need it now, or.
So the one thing that I often see that I always have a chuckle about a wipe warmers, And we will never stop them at the memo wipe warm it like a product that actually warms a wipe, so your baby bum is more comfortable, but pretty good, Like I
don't think that that is worth investing in. A top seller for us is a nappy bin, which just surprises me because I just put it in a bag and then put it straight in the bin because I don't want nappies anywhere inside environment, like lighter candle let's, But a lot of people do really enjoy that, but it's not something that I would call an essential. Yeah, I think they're two kind of key ones, Like you don't have to warm the white I've always start.
What about the top thing like the reverse the top thing you recommend that people are surprised by that they sort of didn't think they'd need.
Well, I just don't really go straight to baby. I go straight to mum. So there's a stat that comes out of the States that one in ten products bought for new families of mum the rest of the baby. So what does that tell you? It means that the baby is the focus. Great, the baby is being cared for, the baby is set, But what about the things that are helping the mum recover from what can be traumatic, what can be overwhelming, what is a huge transformational time?
And you know time in hospital, there's a lot of healing that needs to be done. There's a lot of emphasis that needs to be placed on mental health over that time, on nutrition, on getting enough sleep. So I always recommend for me the product that I always give my friends after giving birth is the tenth Flow State, which is an incredible supplement that you only take after giving birth. It's for the postpartum period. And when I say it changed my life, I mean it brought me
back to life. It gave me a sense of clarity, energy, and vitality that I forgot existed after giving birth.
Oh, I love that. And that was also an answer to the next question, which I also liked the way it was phrased. Which was the favorite thing to give new parents, not favorite thing to give new babies.
Yeah, the other thing is just like anything that will get you more sleep, which is something for the baby and also something for you. So like if you want a great little tool that they probably haven't been given. I can't shout more about the baby shushar.
I was gonna say the sushir.
That's for the susha. It literally like it brings your baby down. It just calms them down, and it literally goes shhh, and it would just I'd turn it on and Remy would just chill out. So that's a really great one. That's a fun one to invest in.
I love that it's for both the baby and it's the parents.
Yes, because if your baby's come, you'll be calm. It's a good one for the car, and hopefully it will bring you a bit more sleep. Use that and then you've got your white machine kind of running in, you know. At the same time.
Yeah, I'm excited for that. For myself, I think I need a white noise machine, definitely.
Definitely.
So then when it does come to the baby, I think one of the things that happens is like, you know, you have a baby shower and there are so many gifts for a newborn, and there's so many pieces of clothing, and then people forget they grow every five seconds and they last in the four zeros for like one minute. So when it comes to actually essentral clothing for newborns and blankets, like you know, how in that first couple of weeks or first couple of months and what sizes.
I had no idea if it was like do I need ten onesies or a hundred onesies? Do I need like like literally, there's no clue of do I need two Muslim wraps and two swattles or do I need like fifty? What's a kind of ballpark a central number that you think allows them to Obviously every baby's born a different size, but what would you start with. There's like a safety pack.
Sure, so have a look at our list. We've got a newborn clothing list that's really helpful. A few things to keep in mind is, obviously, if your baby's premi or extra small, there's a five zero option. Newborn is four zeros and it's unlikely that you'll get I mean, it depends. As you said, all babies are different. I wouldn't go too heavy on the newborn size is because
they will grow out of them quite soon. I think I would have had two or three newborn things, which was very like hospital at first week or two, and then it's all about that zero to three months. And you know, if that's proving a little bit big, don't worry about just roll back the sleeve like a big deal. It's much better to be too big than too small, and then you get a bit more longevity out of it. You need to consider what time of year you're having
your baby. They always need one more layer than you. So that's why we always recommend that you start with a singlet or a body suit and you know six to eight maybe singlets and bodysuits and you know four to six grow suits, which you know with zips. Really recommend the zips because they're easy to get on and off. And with a blanket, you won't use a blanket in their cotch. That's not recommended as safe. You would use a blanket if you're out and about in the prem
over winter or cooler climate. Yeah, you wouldn't put them to sleep with a blanket. You put them to sleep in a sleeping bag or a swaddle in those first few weeks and months, and that essentially acts like a blanket or a doner and it keeps them swaddled really tight and comfortable.
It's crazy like that blew my mind, even having been around a lot of babies in our friends had a lot of babies that firstly, when I first saw them in bed with nothing, I was like, where's the blanket? Like I don't get it, but like, because it's a suffocation risk, you can't just have material everywhere. But like in my brain, of course you go, oh, baby sleep blanket. Like it was so weird to me that they were like no blankets for babies.
I was like, oh, oh, okay, what yeah exactly, So yeah, I really recommend those sleeping bags from Love to Dream or Ergo Pouch or wool Babe, Like they're so great and you go through the transitions as their arms go out, when they start to roll, you transition them with their arms out and just yeah, follow those steps and then you get the right weight to the climate that you're in.
So as you're going into winter, you get a heavier tog which is like a heavier blanket like your winter your winter bedding, and it's really cozy.
I wish they made them same. That's our next business ideas adult grow suits and sleeping sacks but with the little arm thing because they're so cute.
And then like if you're having a baby in winter, like you'll need like socks, you know, a cardi or a jumper. You don't have to go too much into that, you know, like washrints repeat, they'll need hats, so you know those little knotted hats. If you're having a baby in winter, maybe you get like two of those and maybe a beanie for outside. Something like that is a good balance.
I think, even learning as well that the babies obviously they can't regulate their temperature straight away, so having like a single it underneath all their onesies. I didn't know that either, and the membo was just like it made it so straightforward. So guys, in the show notes, I will link all the lists that we've been talking about as well, so you don't have to be furiously writing
down numbers because it's it's all there. And there's also lists for your hospital bag as well versus just generally things you want to have at home. But one thing that I also found really really interesting and you wouldn't have thought about until you were buying, is the pram
capsule car seat conversation. We had lots of questions about that, and you explained it to me, and then I got you to explain it to Nick so that we understood all of the options of the mechanics of that and then changed into a stroller and all of those things. So can you give us the little rundown on the capsule PRAM versus the non capsual PRAM and the integration of the car seat and all of those.
Things, of course. So there's two types of prams that you can buy. You can buy a PRAM which would normally come with a bacinette attachment, which is like a flat thing. You know, you see the prams with the little shield over them, and that's what the baby can live in, can sleep in, can hang out in for newborn up to about six months. Then when they're ready to sit up, you will transition them into their seat, which is an additional attachment that would come with your PRAM.
When you're ready to use something a little bit leaner and cleaner, a travel stroller is a good way to go, and that is a lot thinner. They can sit up right or it can be kind of reclined a little bit. They can sleep in it, and you can put take that on planes. You can put it in the back of your car, like that's the one. A travel stroller is what lives in the boot of my car and you can only really use that from six months onwards,
and it's great for toddlers. But a prem is something that you would use from newborn and we still use it when we're going out and about, like to park, and that lives in the house and it does the streets. What your option for a car seat and a capsule is, when you take your baby home from hospital, you're going to need a car seat or a capsule safely fitted
in your car. You can have a car seat from newborn age it's super safe, but when you park, you need to take your baby out of that car seat and you would either put them into your pram or take them into the house or wherever you're going if
you buy a capsule. A capsule is detachable, and that's something that can be really helpful, like it was for me if you're planning on getting out and about, if you're planning on going to meeting, sitting at cafes, and you don't want to take the baby out of the car seat because they will wake up or they could wake up. So a capsule is a really great way to not disturb a baby's sleep if you're taking them
from car to out and about. The great thing about a capsule is that you can carry it and it also fits onto your prem so you can put that attach it into your PRAM and take them out and about as well, so you wouldn't use your bacinet. At that point, someone asked if they needed the capsule and
the bacinet attachment for the PRAM. Technically yes, like all prams will come with that bacinet attachment, so you're going to get that anyway, And it's also flatter, and you're not recommended to keep your baby in a capsule for long periods of time, whereas a PRAM you kind of can for you know, there are SIDS guidelines, you can look them up. But yes, you would need the capsule because the capsule is what can be safely attached into your car.
Oh my gosh. I had no idea that all those options were things. But once you explained that, of course, if the car seat is all just one thing, you would be waking up your child every single time you want to run into the grab it, takeaway coffee, run into grab the groceries, Whereas if they're in the capture, you just take the whole capsule out and they stay asleep. And I was like, don't say any more words, I will get the capsule thing totally.
I am really recommend capsules for people who are planning to be out and about.
Yeah, and then that it just can fit in the pram if you want it to, or you can leave the basinet on. I love that versatility, and you guys have seen I will link the choices we ended up going with from Bugaboo. They all integrate together and it's just so amazing.
So amazing.
Well, you want your bang for buck, right, you want it to be able to change. I'm conscious of time, so I will just ask one more and then maybe send you the last couple that are more discrete kind of questions about like opening hours and stuff like that. But the last one on like a gear purchase investment note was the baby lounger or bouncer and then the cocoona baby nests. So you had shown me like, and I understand why this is overwhelming because they all look
like they do similar things. So there's like the kind of cushy cushion where the baby sits flat but all nestled in. Then there's like the bouncer thing where they're on a diagonal and you're kind of bouncing them, Like, what are the ages for all those? Do you get all of them? Do you get some of them. Do you get one first and then think about the other one.
You don't need all of them, and just around safety once again, like I'm not an experts, not a sleep expert. If you want more detailed information, go to SIDS and check it out. It is not recommended that babies sleep in a baby lounger. A baby lounger is for play or chill out, and it's a place where they can kind of safely rest. I personally didn't use a baby loannger. I used a baby bouncer. So the Baby Beyond one
is just so good. It has three levels. It can rock your baby gently, they can rock themselves gently, and it's a really safe and comfortable place for them to hang out and see the world. And you can also really move it very easily. The Cocuona Baby is goat like obsessed with it. You use it for the first three months of your baby's life. I used it for his day naps. I didn't use it for night naps, and I don't believe it's recommended that babies sleep in
it overnight. Treason Cocuona nest is so great is because it mimics the shape of the womb, so it's quite kind of contoured and it just keeps them really nice and tight, and there's a little elastic strap that holds them in. That's a resting place and a chill out place for them that is also mobile and some people, you know, I used it all around the house, so it would be sitting on the floor, you know, in front of the TV and stuff, or you can put it in their cot if you would like to. Essentially
it's a bacinette, So it's just for newborn babies. Yeah, I think Remy moved out of his at about three months. But it keeps them nice and tight and cozy and essentially swaddled in those early days, which is really important where comfort is key to their I guess, their conditioning and their introduction into the world without being too much of a shock to the system. So my answer is, you don't need a baby lounger if you have a bouncer,
you don't need a baby lounger. If you're wanting them to sleep in something that is versatile and mobile around the house, I would recommend the Cocuna Baby instead.
But would you get the Cocuna Baby and a bouncer are they serving different Yeah.
Yeah, so the nest is more of a sleep it's a bascinet essentially. It just doesn't have the walls, and the bouncer is just so great for them to hang out like I would. My foot would be tapping that bouncer like all day long when I was working on emails or I was doing calls, and you know, I'd take it to the office or I think, hell out of the warehouse. You can take it to your mom's house or your grandma's house, or yet. A bouncer is a really great parenting tool.
Oh my gosh. Well, I will send you some of the other questions to make sure that they get answered. And I feel like we're going to have to do a follow up at some point because this is going to generate I think a lot of further questions. And I feel like I'm going to have to put links and diagrams because you've just helped demistify the landscape so much, which you've done for us and hopefully now done for so many of our listeners and guys. The Memo website
has all of the resources that we've mentioned. I'll put links to everything and direct links to each section as well, so you know where to go back to, Phoebe. I'm so so grateful for your time. Phoebe just got married, by the way, like literally seven days ago, and squeeze this in in between the festivities, so.
It's all part of it. It's all part of it. Nothing's changed for us, So back to business as usual, BAU totally. But I'm just so grateful. Thank you for having our conversation, for hosting me, and I'm just so thrilled that you're able to share your own story with your audience and with people like me. I find it really inspirational and enlightening. So you're doing a great job. Keep it up.
Oh thank you so much, and there'll be many follow ons guys of me actually talking about the things that we have talked about, that I have bought, and then updating you on how it's actually worked once the baby arrives.
What I would say on that, Seriah, is the whole point is that your experience will be completely different to mine, and we really want everyone to understand that as they're going through their baby journey, please don't compare yourself to other people and that person's getting babies, getting more sleep, or that one's feeding so much easier, you know, easy, unique experience, and you just have to do it your way. So don't get too stressed out with what's going on
around you. Trust your instincts, look at some resources, get help from the experts. I am not one of them. You know, there are lactation concerns, there are sleep experts, there's midwives. You know, there's all of those people, your maternal child healthness. And also talk to your friends. If you're not feeling great, it's really really normal or it's really common, I should say, it's very common in that
postpartum phase to not feel like yourself. Look up those resources and look after yourself.
Amazing advice, perfect way to close out. Thank you so much, Phoebe. I'll include links to your page, to the memos page and places that people can find you and well check in for a follow up. Thank you so much for everything.
Thank you.
Okay, is Phoebe not one of the most incredible women you have ever heard from? And if anyone else is on their pregnancy journey, a you are welcome. I mean so many nuggets and fells of wisdom from Phoebe from the memo that have just made the last few weeks and months a breeze, taking so much stress and overwhelm and overthinking out of the process. But b if you're also on your pregnancy journey, I've just loved sharing it so much with you, guys. It's been so beautiful to
connect with so many of you. I didn't actually realize how many of us were kind of going through things at the same time, and how beautiful it is to share that. So I hope you enjoyed listening along and got a lot out of it. Please do share the episode. We're so lucky to have so much of her time given to such a busy woman and had just got married literally seven days before this episode, so please share
the love. Tagging at Phoebe actually and at from the memo and as mentioned, I've include all the links to the list we mentioned the products she mentioned in the show notes. If you would like a part two or more part three, part four series, let us know and we can line it up. And in the meantime, I hope you are all having the most wonderful week and are seizing your yay