Joe and Renae Ingles // From courtside to courtship and commitment to the clan

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More of my career than not. I was very comfortable and very safe. It's actually the times in my career where things were the toughest or the hardest, or I had setbacks or really pushed myself out of those comfort zones is when I really thrived.

I guess I just try to kind of enjoy and embrace the journey as it was, like I played last Weook, because I enjoyed it.

I never thought I'd make all this money and have this house, and there's a lot more to it than just like a salary and all that stuff.

Welcome to the Seas the Yay Podcast. Busy and happy are not the same thing. We too rarely question what makes the heart seeing. We work, then we rest, but rarely we play and often don't realize there's more than one way. So this is a platform to hear and explore the stories of those who found lives. They adore the good, bad and ugly. The best and worst day

Wow.

Yeah, excited to be here. I've listened to you for a while now. I'm very excited to be on the other side.

Oh, it is such an honor. As I said before, a little notification just came up saying Joe Ingles is in the waiting room and I was like, wow, I haven't seen that dude since I watched him play live in twenty eighteen. I mean, we may best friends then, so I let us see you again.

I'm closer there at the game than we are right now. It's going on.

So yeah, long time. How you been great?

A lot's changed since whatever year that was eight nineteen. So yeah, different world we live in today, know.

Gosh, it's crazy. It still feels like we're in a movie. I'm still waiting to wake up and be like, oh, I can come over to you. Otherwise I would have made the trip. I would have been like, this is a business expense. I need to come over and see Joe and Renee, just hang out with Biancha in Utah.

Gal.

I know, honestly, we just hope that this is all a bad dreaming, that one day we wake up and that things have changed, because we actually haven't been.

Home to Australia and over two and a half years now.

And had you told us that two and a half years ago, we would have just laughed at you and said absolutely not.

You know, family and friends.

And Australia is such a huge part of who we are, so we're missing normal life like a lot of people are. Yeah.

Absolutely. It's funny though, you know, I often try and find at least the silver like us. It's a stretch some days, but there's always a small silver lighting. And I think about this all the time. Imagine doing this if there was ever going to be a global pandemic. Imagine doing it without the Internet, like before FaceTime and before Zoom, what would you have done like smoke signaled your family in Australia.

Honestly, yeah, no, I don't.

Yeah, but it has been a great leveler also. And on that note, Renae and how you'll know from listening to the podcast that I like to start with a little leveler, a bit of a nice breaker to ask everyone what the most down to earth or relatable thing is about them, which is a bit of a weird question, but I think it's just really important because you do often get this glossy, surface level identity when you read the media or social media, and particularly in the case

Or I'm a snorer.

I can happily definitely if I sleep on my back, or if I have a couple too many beers, my snoring.

Yeah, it's more of a couch night. If I come home after.

A few beers, it's a couch.

She can't get me with that one.

I'm well aware and I'm very comfortable within myself with that.

Yeah, I'm glad. Yep, get it out, get ahead of the story.

She would have belt me because I actually enjoy sleeping on my back sometimes, but she will like belt me and elbow me if she.

Like snoring on your back and I roll over on the side again.

And the sacrifices you make.

You know, it's hard committed, right, Oh yeah, No, I think in answering your question, I think when people look at our instagrams, look at our story on paper, or even just you know, sort of think about Joe being an NBA player, the generalization is that it's a pretty luxurious, sparkly, glamorous life. And I think at the end of the day, there's especially for us, less.

Of that than any of the sparkle.

If you can see the mess line this camera right now.

Yeah, it's actually and obviously even more so now during the pandemic, but even beforehand it's actually quite a lonely existence, and that's for both of us. So, you know, when Joe's on the road, he gets to stay in nice hotels and they fly in charter flights and get nice meals and all of that, but at the end of the day, he's lying in a hotel bed alone or watching TV and stuff and missing out on what the

You know exactly.

And I think at the end of the day, what probably I think we hope keeps us grounded and is most relatable is.

Just that our kids are our world.

So you know, you can have all the accolades or the basketball or you know, any of the fancy bright lights and designer clothes or nice cars or whatever it is, but at the end of the day, it's just about our kids. And ninety eight percent of our day revolves around keeping those kids happy and healthy, and then everything else comes second to that.

So, you know, just like any average parents, I guess you could say.

And from Joe's perspective, you know, you look at his last couple of years and what he's achieved on the basketball court and off the basketball court, which to me is probably more important. At the end of the day, he's my husband, Joe, and he's the kid's dad like his dad. He's not joeing with the NBA player John's medallist at the Olympics. He's he's daughter.

Although some days I come home and all the Miller's friends call me mister Joe Ingles.

That're so cute.

They call mister Renee or mister Joe, but sometimes they get a bit like joking.

With it, and they're like, and then Miller will come home and be like Joe Ingles, Joe Ingles with pretty funny games, because yeah, I could have a.

Career high or have the worst game in the world, and I obviously get to come home and regardless of that, I'm dad and I'm still taking the trash out or whatever.

Like, we were very regular people.

We are very very boring, very poor.

So when I got asked to go on the Housewives of Salt Lake City or whatever you call.

It, stop edge. Oh my god.

Another one of.

My teammates wives did as well, and obviously she was never going to do it from her own well, neither of us would have wanted to do.

Yeah, I can already see. It's like not your vibe.

We would laugh about it all the time because it would be like literally like if you could see there's like kids crap everywhere and we're like they.

Would be like, oh, what are you guys going to do today?

Like for the filming or like we're not like we played laser tag for like four hours an.

Hour and then we've got to drive the kids to school or therapy, or we've got to go to swimming lessons or a soccer game.

But other than like you're going to get too many parties or any fun.

Stuff out of the Tlama moments.

I think it would have been the first, probably quickest to be hired and fired on a reality TV show.

That nine o'clock every night. It would have been extremely boring.

But we're very, very lucky, and I have wonderful opportunities to live a great life because of what Joe does. But it's actually all of the small things that we probably appreciate more on a daily.

Basis, and it gives us an opportunity to give back, And yeah, that's the most rewarding part.

That was a really long windowed answer. Yeah, maybe we obviously think we're very grounded.

We are so we are like so so unbelieve it. We are under the ground. But this is why I love this show so much because even that answer is amazing, Like people forget you guys have to take out the ruppish,

Room, like we can see it from here, like laying on a door in our living room next to Miller's, so every time Miller opens.

The door, it's like clean clon bangu dent.

And yeah, it was a very grounding moment after like probably the biggest achievement of my basketball career. Yeah, Miller was like, yeah, cool, but I got one last year when I was playing songs.

So obviously the same.

Well it works in me absolute reverse of that as well, Like there have.

Been some hard losses that Joe's taken, or I remember when you came home after losing that last playoff match and we all have breakfast tore together and Milla was like, did you win? And You're like no, She was okay, next time, so what are we having for breakfast?

Like, kids keep me grounded. Yeah, I keep you grounded.

And that's a beautiful thing about children as well. I just love that they have no perception that you're like super famous and really successful. It's just like your your mom and dad.

I do get some like random hellos and whatever in the streets and Miller always Miller is very switched on with it as always, like why did he just say hello to you?

I don't even know.

What are your friend?

Da?

Are you mate? Like me? Is that chick on? Oh she's your friend? I know she is. Oh gosh. Well, as I mentioned to you guys before we started recording, I think because there is so much out there, so much material out there on the amazing things you have done. Of course I want to talk a little bit about, you know, the highs of your career, but also to talk about how you got there, all the chapters that don't get any airtime but that have formed who you are,

The Olympics, I did one quick, like two minute thing after a couple of days after on one of my friends radio shows at Adelaide, just because she asked, and I was like, yeah, cool, we were sitting but this is like the first the first one.

Oh my gosh, so much yany guys are bestie, I remember what happened.

It's what you do, it's you know what it is what you do for family, really family first. We spoke about this, so you're wayta. I think one of the most interesting things in people's stories is going back to their childhood and finding out at what point they stopped making decisions based on what they love and find interesting and start letting like societal expectations about success in Korea and then like how you get how all the dot points start that then ultimately lead you to where you

Joe?

You were in Adelaide at Lake ginandera College, Renee in Melbourne at MITA Christina Carey like even school.

Girl does research.

Gosh, childhood. I loved my childhood. I have two siblings. I'm the oldest of three, so I've got a younger brother and a younger sister, and two beautiful parents who gave us absolutely every opportunity in the world to choose or be passionate about whatever it was we wanted that to be. So I played two musical instruments. I did about ten different sports, and I'm not even joking. There was netball, basketball, swimming, tennis, taekwondo.

Yeah, you name it.

I did it all so and so did my siblings. So my parents were literally just a taxi service for all of us and gave us too many amazing opportunities.

And you grew up in the middle of nowhere, so there was like a.

Lot of driving.

With mum and dad and late night dinners and homework and too late after sports and all of that sort of thing.

But we were really, really lucky.

And a really really close knit family grew up in the Patch, which I was known as the Cabbage Patch Kid later in life during my career because no one no.

One knew where the patch was.

So meeting Joe who was from Happy Valley, who no one else knows where.

A Happy Valley is, it was It's meant to be.

It was a match made in you know what these small towns are like. But for me, my real passions were netball and basketball, and that's what I've sort of into my team years went on with.

I was a lot better at netball and when.

It came down times to making decisions of which sport, I really wanted to put my heart and soul into netball for me, one because I was better at it, and two because I had some really.

Close knit friendships and stuff in there as well.

So the way I came through the pathways back in the day was very traditional. So played at each state level, I captain at each date level and then made my way into the Melbourne Phoenix which it was at the time, which is now the Melbourne Vixen's And I remember in Brade six having posters on my wall of the Australian netball team at the time and saying I really want to play for Australia one day. And Mum has said this to me later in my life that she just at the time patted me on the back.

Of me that's great, dream big, Yeah, yeah, anything is possible.

That's right. I'll support you. But just work hard. Trying is a really great thing.

So, you know, I think once I got into those middle teen years and realized that, you know, maybe this could be a thing, that's when I really started making all my decisions based around what was going to be best.

For my netball.

I moved schools halfway through year ten, which I really didn't want to do, but my parents found that was the best thing for me.

And I really.

Struggled with that because I think as an older, more experienced athlete before I retired, I think you look back on your journey and all of the decisions that you made.

Very early in.

My career and for more of my career than not, I was very comfortable and very safe and realized that I liked that feeling. And then it's actually the times in my career where things were the toughest or the hardest, or I had setbacks or really pushed myself out of those comfort zones and you moved to the Adelaie Thunderbirds is when I really thrived. I love learning, and I think my entire life, whether that's been in schooling or my career in netball or now with kids, learning is

I don't like learning, that is very I don't like it.

You know what the great thing is about you two is that you both had your biggest decision wasn't letting go of the big dream and like settling for a normal career, it was letting go of all the other sports you were already good at, which one to go pro. In both of your stories, closing one that paid more at the time.

The wonderful thing.

That female sport I think gives us and has certainly given me, especially back. You know when I came into the system almost twenty years ago, which is terrifying is that you know, there wasn't the netball. The financial side of things wasn't there, so it didn't set you up for the rest of your life. So my parents were huge on study and me still doing really well in school and having a career outside of netball.

And I remember at the time just thinking this isn't what I want to do. I'll do it, and I was a good student and did it all.

But now I'm so grateful that I guess I came through and I did, because you know, life after netball is, you know, just as tough, if not tougher than what it is just.

Getting to run around each weekend and do what you love.

So yeah, absolutely, And I'd love to ask you about that too, because I think that identity shift once you do move out of something that's been your focus your entire life is a huge challenge. What do you do after the dream that it can be so difficult? Joe? What about you? First? On the way there, I mean, every kid who loves basketball wants to play in the NBA, but I mean, how many Australians have actually done that. You're one of, like I can count on you know, two hands. It's crazy.

Yeah, I guess very similar to an A.

I was very lucky as a kid, just me and my older sister, mum and dad and very similar like kind of got everything. We wanted to play it as many sports as we wanted. Mom dad obviously driving us to buy. I played bastpell, cricket and AFL were kind of a three that I was kind of, I.

Guess focused on more than anything else.

And my sister wasn't massive into sports, played a bit of like casual netball and stuff, but she played the piano and was way better at.

School than what I was.

Went to a private school and kind of went down that path. I went to a public school. Basketball was actually a subject amazing.

Yeah, so I knew very early on I wanted to play basketball. I wanted to play I grew up in Adelaide. I wanted to play for the thirty six is. The adelade thirty six Is was the be all and end all.

Brettma, who was the captain and a friend now was their best player, and I wanted to be Brett mar like that.

Was my bream.

I wanted to then obviously play for Australia. Watching as you get older and can kind of realize what the Olympics are and stuff like that.

So yeah, very very kind of normal childhood.

I guess parents got divorced as we were pretty young, which was I don't think at the time I even worried about it. I was just like, oh cool, Like now I can get twenty dollars off of my man twenty dollars off that. But we ended up living with my dad and my dad worked away a lot of the time, so it was really me and my sister as housemates. I guess you call it as like fourteen

Got amazing, and then the other thing like it's a bit of a funny.

So I remember when I think it's like year eight or nine and whatever, you're picking your subjects to work out, like what you want to be do you want to be a doctor? Or like you need to do this or and missus O'Reilly, who was my teacher at the time. I still red hair, short little glasses, and I was sitting I.

Hope she's listening right now.

She would have told this a couple of times before.

But I was sitting next to my mom as I'm going through and she said, well, what do you want to be? And I said I want to play basket. And obviously, at this age i'm forty, I feel like I'm very well aware, like that's what I want to do. It's not like I hope every kid gets a great education, but I hated school.

I didn't really I went to the school pillar if bast we didn't go to make friends. I didn't go to get it. I went to play basket.

Complete opposite idea. Meetings where I had to pick my subjects were stressful.

I had to get it right and I said that and she said, oh haha, like you've got to pick something a bit more realistic.

And all I remember happening was my mom like under the table, like grabbing my leg and being like, because I have a bit of a potty mouth, and we'll say what's on my mind, and was ready to, like as a fourteen or whatever, I would like yell at her and swear at her. I was just like in the end of it was like whatever, Like I don't really care what you think. I'm basically not going to go to school anyway. I'm going to go figure this

We actually would have met at the Airs if she turned it down and I went, which we wouldn't probably be today.

Was meant to be that way. Yes, we'll get to that story too. We'll get to the meeting story anyway.

Yeah, like from I guess like fourteen fifteen, we lived by ourselves. At sixteen, I moved to camera, So I've kind of been I guess a bit more like I wouldn't say mature, but I probably grew up a little bit quicker and just yeah, I was just obviously so locked in on this basketball thing, basketball, cricket, AFL.

I think I was decent at all.

And I wouldn't say but similar to every day Like, I chose basketball purely because of the friends I was playing with. I didn't know if I was any better at it at the time or not, but I had some really cool friends that I wanted to play with, and I didn't really want to play outside in the rain and the AFL.

And that as well all the sunn that's your reasons.

And then there was like eight a m in the mud of the AFL and I was like, you just go playing this heated gym, and I obviously had a good friends so I was, yeah, that's how it kind of started, and obviously went to the AS and went from there.

Wow, gosh, it's so fascinating for myself. When you're someone who doesn't have a really clear vision from the time you're a kid about what you want to do, you

Always screwed because no education was pretty determined to get it done.

So yeah, well, what I'd love to ask just a couple of questions on this part of your careers, because again, I know we can find out a lot, I mean, everything about both of your stellar careers that are still continuing elsewhere. But one of the things that I think is broadly applicable to everyone who has a goal they want to achieve that's massive, like the NBA or like playing for your country, But in all the chapters before you get there, you can't just wake up and play NBA.

I guess for me it was even I remember I played for a club called the No Longer City Tigers, which was in Adelaide and around the corner from our house, and not that it was like I don't think at the time, I thought it was a setback, but like trying out for the Division one team and not making it, could be put in the second team and trying out for the state teams, which they mentioned about being captain all about like getting cut from those teams. And I only ever made it as a top age. I never

But.

Even the basketball there and the people I was around with Shane Hill, Jacob Holm, some of these guys, Brian Gorge and who twelve years later I went to bronze medal with being around some of those guys, and then going in the NBA Draft when you think you're ready quote unquote ready or your managers think you're ready, probably

I'm like, shit, I'm not getting picked. Like you kind of hit this.

Realization but I was very lucky that one I had an English passport so I could go play in Europe. But I just, I guess, I just try to kind of enjoy and embrace the journey as it was, like I, yeah, I'm in Division two and I'm fourteen, Like I still had good friends, I still enjoyed it.

I played basketball because I enjoyed it.

I never thought I'd make all this money and have this house and like whatever it.

Is, the more materialistic stuff.

And I still think more or less it's still the same way today, Like, yeah, all that stuff's great, But I play because I love my teammates, I love the kids and Renee, I'm going to watch like it's there's a lot more to it than just like a salary and all that stuff. So went to Europe and was pretty happy there. I think, different country, like different experience.

We got to live in.

Barcelona for three years, we lived in Grenada my first year for a little bit, we lived in Israel and Tel Aviv, and yeah, just kind of kept, I guess, kept plugging away, slowly knowing that in my mind I thought I was getting better and better each year. I don't know if I was not at the time, and the only clear kind of thing I did know was by the last year. It was my fifth year in Europe in Tel Aviv, I was like, I am not gone back to Europe. I'd had enough in Europe. I didn't want to live there.

She was still playing, so we were doing long distance and all that. I was like, I'm either making the NBA or I'm going to.

Go play for Melbourne or Adelaide like whoever at the time in Australia. So I came over to it camp with the Clippers. I was like, yeah, this is a chance. This is like the door. I'm twenty seven. The door was like this much open and I'm going to I'm going to make it. And the it was almost like a perfect scenario, if you can think of an NBA

I put everything into that.

I was there like first there, last one to leave. I trying to do everything I could to make it and got calm on the last day. As the story has been told, but like Renee was on the plane flight over, and I probably thought I was going to make the team before she landed, and then landed and was like, hey, I Scott cart in LA.

For a little while. We had a few days in La to.

I guess, try and figure out what we were going to do or what I was going to do career wise. And then we were sitting at lunch at some like Asian restaurant or something and got a call from my manager and I was like quickly like and he's like Utah Jazz one year, you got to fly out like

I was going to say, had you even been there before?

No, it's like New York.

We had suitcases full of cloths for La and in the snow here in.

Utah and landed here and then it was again back to that like this is my last chance.

I'm going to literally put everything in.

It was on a non guarantee my first year and obviously ended up making the team my first year, signed a.

Two year deal after that and signed a four year deal, and then we thought we'd.

Been here for a year, and.

You guys, it's pretty long winded answer, but I think for me it was just like I don't really get too high or too low, Like I'm pretty low.

I would say that about Joe without putting in on you, is that what you see is what you get with Joe, and whether it's a win or a loss or anything in between, or a setback.

I don't think I've ever even heard.

Really say that he's had a setback, because it's just like, go on with the next day and then what's next, what training's next, what team's next, what sort of next on the calendar.

It's never he doesn't really dwell on anything as such. He loves revenge. So someone cuts him to.

The team or it says he can't do something, then you know, even if it's a couple of years later, he's like.

Yes, like the redhead teacher about.

As as he's doing it. Yeah, but he really doesn't dwell on anything. I think that's one of our biggest differences. But one of the biggest level is for me while I was still playing, is that Joe was so laid back and didn't care too much about anything.

I mean that in the right way.

It was a really nice way to play though, like there was sort of more relaxed attitude around it all.

And especially once you add kids to it too. It's like the game's great, and it's again given as a lot of this in life and whatever, but it's like I still going to get up and take mid of the school at seven forty five, and we're going to do this and that, and obviously everything with Jacob and even when I was playing in Europe, like if I don't make the NBA, like I'm still making good money

Do and I'd be like, I'm going to grab a bit and figure out the games.

I just got to win a medal tomorrow.

Yeah, I'm kind of.

Like what Joe said is I was more the athlete that would critique everything, every performance, good bad, why that happened, why that didn't happen, if I didn't make a team. Then I would get feedback straight away, and I would really analyze that feedback, probably too much, rather than just taking it for what it was.

Wasn't strong enough? She was coming back right a strong person in the world.

Yeah, I think that's just a bodybuilder now, you know.

Even in you know, I can think back to primary school sports and then state teams and whatever. It was that I was always willing to outwork anyone. So whilst there was obviously raw talent and stuff there and I understood the game, I was always willing to outwork or work the hardest, which I think at times in my career was also a detriment to me and what I could have achieved as well, certainly lost a lot of sleep over the time, worrying about things and.

Having anxiety over things that I.

Couldn't control, whether that be other people in the team, or you know, playing my performance in my mind before it's even happened.

But you know, hindsight's a wonderful thing.

But I definitely think that it was my work ethic over all that probably you know, saw me standing on the podium and crying tears because I was able to win those medals. So I think when I think about the chapters of my life, and you know, we're just saying this to a couple of friends the other night at dinner, is I've always would talk about periods of my life or teams that I've made, teams that I

I've got all of the same.

Values and wants and needs and loves and passions and all of those things. But the renee before kids as opposed to the renee after kids in both a career sense, A wife all of those things, a friend, all of those things. Of course, I've had to adapt and change, and I think had I learned some of the lessons that I had from being mum and had put them into my career earlier on, and well, you know, I think my career probably could have been better, or a.

Team more the Zella's time and a million medals.

And yeah, but you know, you just.

Get perspective, I think, And I think I played better netball after having kids, with you know, less.

Work, but more quality training, more perspective, less stress, less anxiety over any of those things that I couldn't control purely one because I was too tired. I played after having kids and having the kids on the sidelines, and there was just I think different. It's a totally different life off the court as opposter on the court before.

And after kids.

So I think I'm still obviously living the chapter since having the kids.

But yeah, I just see everything that happened before as that chapter of my life and then this is the next one now that I'm on.

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Well, and it's a pandemic has done the same thing to all of us. You know, It's given us all so much perspective and maybe given everyone a little bit more direction and understanding of what we can actually be grateful for. And that's the small modiments in life, or the small social interactions that have been taken away from us, or you know, before the pandemic complaining that we had to go to work. It's a privilege. People can't go to work, you know, it is. It's a privilege. So

I'm the same, much more like Una in terms of like overthinking, of analyzing, worrying about everything. But the quote that really helps me is the five by five rule. It's if it's not going to matter in five years, don't give it more than five minutes. And there's not a single time where that hasn't worked out really well, Like things just don't matter.

But do you mean that I could actually like get to a point of justifying in my mind.

Yes, absolutely, because the hypothetical situation totally. Like my astrologer thinks that the cards might say that it's going to matter in five years because Taurus is in Mercury and Venus and I can't explain.

Yeah, yeah, that's where John and I find out balance, I think for a complete.

Opposite ends of the spectrum and all of that sort.

Of stuff, which has been really nice throughout each other's careers is maybe meeting in the middle a little bit there so keeps it well.

It's obvious that you've become a perfect match for each other the love story, even though the universe conspired to keep you apart the first time at the aas you have since found each other, and I would love you to quickly rehash the love story before we move on to your beautiful kids and what you've been doing. But one more question, on your careers quickly before we move into that is just having reached the levels that you have both reached that not many people have and get

Yeah, I've read that somewhere.

Yeah, everyone made a big deal about it, like it was the first time, and she's like, no, we do it. It's a sport wide thing all the time.

Well, fix our boss.

I think people just don't really, especially in the NBA, Like it doesn't look so glamorous because you guys see on you know, social media and on the TV and media outlets these guys walking in, you know, all decked out beautiful clothes and fashion sense and all of that. But that's five minutes of that full entire game night, like a game night for us.

Yeah, we were literally just discussing this the other day.

To shoot around in the morning, Yeah, for a couple of hours, like job one of the kids at school, go to shoot around for a few hours, literally, come back, have some to eat. I'll go lay down like nine out of ten days as the odd day that I can't or Rene's or something on that. Like I'm not that superstitious, so like I need to sleep from two to three otherwise I won't play it. Like another thing that'll we're very dear, Like I can just cruise through like a whole day and whatever, but.

Like, yeah, go lay down for an hour. Then I'll go pick up one of.

The kids, come home for half an hour and play do whatever entertaining for a little bit, and then I'm taking off like three four hours before the game, getting home at twelve one o'clock in the morning, and then obviously back up for school at seven thirty.

The next day again or seven or whatever. So there is a lot Like even today, we're in the off season now.

I left Miller of school seven fifty five, went to the arena, and I went straight to pick up Jacob at tooth. I left at two thirty to get there by three, so I hadn't been home all day. This is offseason, so I'm just doing some of my own stuff and some team stuff. But yeah, I think it's the NBA, especially you see the money side of it, and yeah, we stay in nice hotels and drive nice.

Cars and whatever.

Granted, like is the salary exactly like too much or not? Like it's a lot of money. I get that, but the guys work hard for their money. Like regardless, if we can debate all.

Day, whether it's sacrifice a lot.

Sacrifice a lot, we were No, I'm saving that for one of your other later questions.

I was going to say something, but oh, oh, there.

There is a lot of I mean even just the fact we haven't gone home into a half years, Like we can't go Jack's never met we got ten months old, He's never met any family. Rene, his brother's got one year old twin girls. Rene's brother and best friend, which is another story. But we've never met them like two yells, so there's a lot of things. Our twins from like three to five are so different from when our parents last saw them.

I know another thing that this drives me crazy. And you as the I feel like you'd be a planner just like I am. Overthink everything whilst you have the whole NBA season and you can see that in front of us. D don't get their schedules for the next day until like nine or ten o'clock at night for the next day. So for Renee, who like plans the next five years, it's it's been an adjustment.

It's hard.

Yeah, that makes me anxious.

My whole career off getting like my schedule is a text message, like more or less.

The night before, maybe a bit more structured, but literally like my life is a text message, Like I wait for someone to tell us what time practicing tell.

Rene, And I'm often in bed by the time you get the text message.

So then if I wake well I shouldn't say if when I wake up with one of the.

Three kids during the night, I'll check it like to see, oh, what's.

Jokes forward schedule because it's just like I don't have to explain anything. And yeah, but that's just like the way life. It's I don't even like talking to you now about it, Like, yeah, it's annoying as hell. Like we just got the schedule actually pretty early, we got about like just before we got on the call with you. Yeah, and but it's like, yeah, that's just how it's just.

More like you can't sort of it's hard to schedule things like with the kids.

Or doctors anything, Joe trying to be there to see the kids or whatever.

It's just I mean, that's nitpicking. Seriously, that's the hardest thing we're dealing with. But it's yeah, but.

It's interesting, like you wouldn't think that you'd think you guys would have weeks ahead of Yeah.

It's got one side of it. It's extremely glamorous and fancy and like whatever word you want to use. But there's another side of it that's a grind and like your body years sleep, Like we get home from road trips at three in the morning, and I'll be up with the kids as early as I can physically, like peel my eyes open, but people just think like, oh, you're in a nice hotel, Like it doesn't matter where you sleep.

Three in our sleep is real.

Sleep, yeah for sure. And kids are kids a lot.

More of a grind. But yeah, Also on the flip side, like obviously.

Very lucky and I love it, like I kind of love the lifestyle of being a basketball Yeah.

Well and truly season your ya, which is absolutely amazing, But you have also had to work incredibly hard to win over your wife. I heard that you had to beg for a coffee date.

But quite a while finally someone has the real story. We've obviously spoken to someone who knows the real story.

I don't know you got that from with us.

Tell the truth so you cannot confirm or deny.

The truth, the real, real truth, which I've like honestly never told the real story because I just don't know why every time.

Because it's funny and I'll probably still get something wrong, so Redee will probably, but you.

Might not have a wife at the end of this, so be careful.

The real truth before. But this is the real truth. So I actually I'm sweating as you say.

No, So, like I moved to Melbourne to play with the Dragon. She was playing for the Bigs, and so we're both in Melbourne and anyone that's listening that's our age or give will take a few years. Well know, at the time, the club called c Q was like the hottest play.

So I used to see Renee.

We like basketball and that ball is a very small world, like we all kind of knew each other or through the as or like whatever it was. That was a very it's almost like a little small community within itself. And so I would always see Renee at the place, the bar, whatever, and I probably saw a few other times and other things, but it was like she's I guess, but Rene had Renee had a boyfriend at the time, and I was just being a young idiot at the time.

It was like a full announcements to the public.

No one thought it was like an official relationship until you put it on your bloody Facebook page or whatever it was. I did that, and I don't know if we'd even like really spoken every or not, but added her on Facebook and started talking her on Facebook, which is.

So DMS, and then that's totably better than what kids are doing these days.

It is definitely better than our kids are doing these days.

Started obviously just like very regular conversation because we both kind of she just won the championship.

I just won with the Dragons.

Is why we both wanted the championships right before we met, which is probably why we saw each other partying way too much that week or two. And then it ended up asking, I think, whatever's what numbers, So we were talking a bit more normally than Facebook, and then yeah, I would just keep I kept asking her like let's go to lunch or dinner or breakfast or like whatever, I don't care what meal it is of the day.

And she would always say yes.

But then I would like wake up in the morning or an hour before and she'd be like, oh sorry, like vixi's gotta be doing a clinic.

I can't come to them.

Oh sorry, I woke up and feel a bit sick like and I was like, look, this girl's crazy like you.

No one They were like going out for dinner this one night, and I called and said, I'm so sorry this has come up.

I can't come. But the real thing.

I actually don't even know if I ever told you is I'd actually gone and got a spray TN and I was driving home my cairl. I was like, I clearly can't go out for dinner when I'm just out of spray to hand, so obviously you're life and I'm so sorry this has come up with my family, and yeah, sorry, this is amazing.

And then one day, from her point of view, her mom, she was obviously telling her mom that this like crackhead from Adelaide was annoying her and trying to get her to go out for lunch, dinner, whatever we were trying to do, and her mom ended up saying like, why don't you just go one day and then if you hate him, you hate him, you never have to see him again. If he's cool, then like whatever, you figure.

It out, So good advice mom.

Again, like planning, I think it was lunch lunch, and obviously, like from her point of view, which I know now, she was like fully in for this one. From my point of view, getting canceled like six billions, I was like, screw this, I'm going out tonight on the like Saturday night or whatever. So I went out with my buddies and got home at like the crack of dawn because I was like, I'm going to wake up at some point unil were canceled text message anyway, so like whatever.

Oh yeah, yeah, you're hungover, physically drift sedious, fuck well done, well done.

She had a clinic or whatever, so I was like fuck, like shower, shower, put like spray too much clone because I felt like alcohol.

And then she picked me up in her Vixen's car because she.

Covered.

I came in sweatpants because I was like I really don't care about.

And I was in jeans and a jacket and that.

Is so I would never go out and meet someone in pants anyway.

Well, he just asked you out to breakfast, lunch or dinner or whatever, Like if he asked you like that, i'd probably wear track. Friends.

Then we ended up going to the place on athen Street or whatever it was, and Securlda had lunch.

I hat like a typical, like I don't want to eat in front of the boy, and I was like hung over his house. I was like she was.

Going to the toilet, stealing a designer, and because I was so hungry, then she dropped me back. It was all like good or whatever, and then I just we were texting a bit, and then we ended up hanging out again.

That night. I went to her house and.

We watched the movie Same Day, Stop It Two.

Dates, ordered pizzas and just hung out whatever, and then like every day since then, we I think we saw each other every day after that until I had.

Already signed a deal in Spain.

So I was like I was leaving a month later. Months so we were like, oh my god.

I kind of just hung out every day like doing whatever because we were both still training and doing whatever we had to do. And then it was like kind of like right, well, if you want to come over, you can come over.

We'll see, like see what happens. I'm got, like I've signed. I kin'd of get out of it. Not that I would have got out of it.

It was just like super like we literally just had fun. Knowing I was leaving in a month, so it was just like whatever, clearly go anywhere.

But it's been good and.

I was like, oh, shout your flight over to Spain if you want.

You know, I just come. I heard that you knew right away that you wanted to marry her.

So we had the first lunch or whatever it was, and we were talking throughout the day and I think it was in those text messages whatever I told her.

I can fill the gap since the details yit.

Yeah, I feel like filling And went on our first day eating sweatpants track pants, which.

That is just like what that's a move, ren A. That is a power.

Anyone who knew at the time I would never do that yet literally.

Do I know that?

Like that was for him, just like this is my dream girl. She I don't even have to wear jeans for this girl. Like in my sweats, I've got like one pair of jeans I do not wear.

I'm like sweats twenty for seven.

There's not one fancy bit of clothing in.

My Anyway, we hung out.

I was meant to go onto another clinic that afternoon, but we were like enjoying each other company that so I texted Caitlin Pwaits and I was like, thank you, yes, Katie, we're here today because of you, And she covered the coaching clinic for me. I got changed in the car to go to lunch in a movie, which again I'm never on like a.

First date, would I go and get changed in the car.

But there you go.

This is apparently who I was that day. Anyway, we hung out. It was really good.

I dropped him back home and wasn't even turned out of his street and I got a text message saying we're going to get married.

I'm going to marry Yeah.

Oh my god, that's the I might still been drug.

Yeah, I can.

Far too much colone, because if I actually sit here and really think about it, I can still smell that.

You can smell it, you.

Know when someone's drank it and the breath smells like alcohol. Self.

Yeah, I finally got this girl to come and I haven't been canceled on now going to smell like an idiot, and she's going to think I've been out or which I had been.

But which you absolutely had.

Anyway, it's been what twelve thirteen years now, and it's yeah, here we are, and you can still smell the Actually, the first time he's ever admitted to anyone with me being around, that he actually did the chasing.

So I recorded this, so you've got it forever.

She did come there.

And then she came to Grenada and me and then did After that, I was like, I guess we have to We spoke on every day.

Remember when he used to Scott for face.

To change our Facebook status.

Now, I guess we should make it a complicated Facebook official.

It's complicated.

It was complicated. It's with the remae and it's complicated. Remember you could have a person and it's complicated with the person.

Literally, it's been twelve to thirteen years now, and I think eight or nine of those have been long distance, so oh wow, be tough, hard, But here we are three kids later, living.

In three kids, three kids and also two incredible careers. I mean, you guys have juggled more. I mean, marriage and children in themselves are enormous endeavors to do with anyone and still be able to have a chat with them, sit next to each other on the couch and tell your love story with a smile on your face. But you know, managing long distance and two careers as well that have competing needs, and then three kids and then, oh gosh, you guys are just well.

I think a part of that as well as like a little bit of why it works.

Well it's like yeah, I agree, Yeah, I've got to whatever, go.

To Spain, but I'll figure it out. Like I've got to be in Australia, Okay, we'll figure it out. Like I've seened it. I've got to go with the Boomers, right, will come to Sydney.

Or wherever, like like.

It's just it is what it is, Like I was never going to go tell Renee like, no, you can't play this year. You've got to come to Spain and sit in the crowd and watch me play and give up your career, like it's just not an option, Like I'm going to the Olympics, all right, We'll figure out how to like can you get there right?

If you can?

It's figure it out, Like I remember one All Star break, I flew to England Liverpool to watch like two games with the Australian Diamonds because I was like games, you just figure it, Like what am I supposed to do?

Like I'm not going to not like if I can, so like you just figure it out.

Like so it's honestly think too, Like we always laugh about it, like people say, oh, what works in your marriage or what doesn't or whatever. I think we always joke about it, but at the end of the day, we feel like we've always been in the honey room period because even with Joe's career now and we're living here, No, I mean that in that we've always had so much time a part at the time that we're together, it's

Sort of stuff.

So I think it's just like treasuring that quality time that we've had and we've always had to do it. So, you know, we met and then a month later we left for nine months, so that sounds normal.

We don't know anything.

With us, so when I still work.

Then yeah, I was going to say, oh my god, we still.

Like each other.

Then one time after we got shut down and we had a couple months I mean yeah, where we were the first to like put COVID on the map a little bit, so we were pretty strict with our lockdown, so we like I was at home every single day, which probably for everyone, all of us at times.

I'm worried, said.

When we were talking about that too.

I had been away for seven weeks with the Olympics, and I came home and obviously, like Renee, had a list of things she wanted to do, understandably because she'd been stuck with three kids for seven weeks, and so I was like, you do what you need to do. And like the first three or four days, I didn't leave the house post Olympics.

I was just here with the kids.

And this is me like taking an hour.

Yeah, it's if she wasn't day.

Have coffee with your friend, like go and do do what like you deserve to do. Like day three or four, I was like Rene came back and I was like, I don't know how you stay at the house like all day, because this.

Is I can't hard.

I could do it if I really had to, but like it's now, I know what you would like, have an hour in the gym with not the kids, like hanging off your back for fucking twenty minutes.

I think what I'll get off to Joe's retirement is that I'm one hundred percent going into the workforce. After that, we're just going to completely spot rolls again and then it's my turn. Yeah, yeah, the next chapter.

That is a big thing, Renee, that you you you guys have had twins, Miller and Jacob and then Jack was born last year, and that you left the game in your prime. It wasn't you know, like you'd we were tapering already, or you were already planning to take a back seat, or you were ready to retire. You know, it was. It was a big It's just such an exclusive pathway. Yeah, yeah, how has that been for you?

From my perspective?

In hindsight, the time that I retired was probably absolutely perfect because then COVID hit the next season. There's absolutely no way we could have juggled our lives from different countries and managing COVID and netball, moved into a bubble into Brisbane and all of that sort of stuff. So in hindsight, it was actually the perfect time. I think it was literally last week. It was two years ago that I officially retired and it was my last game and haven't even been in a netball.

Stadium since because we haven't been back in Australia since.

I've watched all.

The games, might watch a lot from over here and replays and all that sort of thing. I think, at the end of the day, I'll never regret the decision that I made because I made it for Joe and

But I just there's no regret, is there hurt? No, not really.

However, there's just that burning desire inside me to do something else, and I don't know what that is yet. I'm running a marathon, but that is definitely not a bucket list.

Item for me. I'm doing it for our.

Charity, Culture City, and I'm doing it for Jacob and one of our best friends' kids, all of who are both on the spectrum. So I'm doing it for them. So that's giving me a little bit. I think that's a band aid at the moment, but for me, should know what's next. And I wish that I could still be playing in the netball arena. I do definitely we miss it. I don't miss the meetings. I don't miss the politics. So don't miss ice sparks and fitness testing and skin folds and.

I hate cool.

I don't miss.

Any of that.

But you know, I certainly miss running out there on match day with some of my best friends and playing the.

Game that I love.

And I have to admit every time I sit in the arena and one of my absolute favorite things to do is to watch Joe play.

But that you know, when you hear the music playing and the.

Crowd loud and Joe doing so well, that it's hard. It's hard not to go to that space of oh what if that was me? What if I could still do that? But yeah, I don't think I can ever look back and regret that decision, because you know that our kids are absolutely thriving. And yet given that COVID had hit and we've all been through the last couple of years that we had been through, that I would have had to retire due to COVID because I wouldn't

Definitely miss it.

The door is closed on playing professional netball, but I'm hoping that something else can open.

I just don't know what that is.

But even when we got we got pregnant, when they got.

Pregnant, what are you telling me?

Science is pretty amazing these days?

You, Tay is like really progressive?

Wow, the like I.

Remember her retirement press conference with Adelaide and sitting there and having photos and like, oh, yeah, like this is the end, and she probably knew it too, but we both kind of knew like this is the end because it almost like had to be at that time, But it wasn't going to be the end.

Like Renet wasn't ready to stop playing.

It was just there was like a bump in the road because we were going to have these kids, and that's what was going to happen at that time.

I had the kids.

I had the kids.

Months old.

But I knew that she was going to go back eventually, whether it be the year after however long after, she was going to figure it out and get back.

And I guess glad that she got an opportunity to at.

Least play, and because same thing, like I loved sitting there with the twins and watching her play, like it was pretty cool to be on the flip side of it, because I probably didn't think I would get to do that, especially with kids, because of obviously the female being a

They weren't that far but like to wave and all that.

So it was it was cool to be able to do that and get back and see her play with the kids or post kids. But yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if she ended up playing professionally.

Again, like unless the two months are washed up, Renee three.

Kids, you're running a marathon. But I think it's really it's a lovely reminder that you can miss something without regretting that you're not doing it anymore. And also that beautiful new beginnings are often disguised as painful endings that

Yeah.

Well, autism I think has changed our lives forever in the best way possible, which I know some people listen to and go, what like, your child's got autism, But it's something that we definitely celebrate. We knew what autism was before Jacob got diagnosed, but we had absolutely no idea what living with autism actually meant or felt like, or what that meant for the family moving forward. And in a nutshell, autism can look so many different ways

It's really challenging, it's hard.

But it has brought so much joy to our family and I think probably one of the things that has grounded us more than anything in our entire lives or careers or any setback. I think it just brought us back to life a little bit to celebrate the small moments, not just with Jacob, but with Miller and now with Jack and with each other, and Joe's career and achievements, that the small things sometimes matter more than the bigger things in terms of what we do. I think our

We never knew how we were going.

To do that or what that was going to look like, and I think this has really just given us our purpose, and we do it for Jacob and we want a better, more understanding, inclusive future and world for him.

So why wouldn't we use.

Our platforms to go out there and talk about it and celebrate him as an individual, and of course the other two kids just as much as well. We are on the board of four ASD Kids in Australia and Culture City over here in America. I got one hundred

What I see.

They have a little boy, Oliver, who is four months younger than Jacob, who has also recently just been diagnosed as on the spectrum. And I decided, you know, I've never wanted to run a marathon. Anyone who knows Netbourne knows that it's.

A speed and power sport. It's not from distance running. So whilst all of these people who write the loveliest supportive messages to me on Instagram that I can do it because I was an athlete well, very different athletes, not in marathon.

It's not one of those things that I've ever looked at and gone, oh my gosh, I want to run for black five hours straight. Like that doesn't inspire me, but it's not on my bucket list. It because you know what, some days for Jacob and for Oliver are incredibly difficult and challenging, and there's so much across their day that they are told that they cannot do or that they maybe find more challenging to do. And you know what, we make them do it. We teach them

So that's where my inspiration comes from.

That's where what at the moment is getting me through those really long Sunday runs that and sees the eight podcasts.

But yeah, I'm doing it.

It's really hard, and I know, sound like a wingy girl saying that, but I'm finding out really.

It's five hours not my gem.

You know.

If I'm going to leave Joe and the kids for a couple of hours to run on a Sunday.

You know, there are better things that I would love to go out for breakfast and coffee with my girlfriends.

Run to a massage parlor and run back as.

My time away from the kids.

Yeah, but you know, we're getting there, and I'm ticking the boxes and now it's about six weeks away, so.

I'm really excited for it to be over.

And I'm at about sixty percent of my goal of raising about fifteen thousand dollars, so fingers crossed it can get there.

Oh my gosh, And that is so extraordinary. We're training for the Melbourne Marathon, but I'm doing the half, which as a former non runner recently converted to actually I loved. I've loved and it's been amazing, but twenty one still feels pretty long, so I can't imagine having to do double that. That's just extraordinary. We only just been there. It was meant to be in October, but we just found out because of the lockdowns, it's been pushed out in December, and I'm like, I can't keep up this

It's just really Yeah, it's more that you know, I've got to walk the walk, not just talk the talk.

So yeah, I'm doing it.

And you know, how can we support you in that? How can anyone just donate or can they jump online?

Oh?

Yes, I have a fundraising page which is on the Culture City website under their fundraising and donation section. So I'll be able to give you the link and you could put it in your show notes.

That would be amazing.

But even if people could shout me a coffee, that much is the donation. I know it's a really scary world at the moment out there, and people are having a lot of financial hardship, certainly with COVID and all of those things. Understand how tough it is for everyone, But shout me a coffee with the donation, and I would really really appreciate it because I'm doing it for a greater pause and hopefully for a more inclusive world.

Oh that's so beautiful. I'm sure there will be so many people in the neighborhood who can shout at least a coffee in your journey. You guys are doing really really wonderful things. Thank you and raising awareness of something as you mentioned, like people might have heard of it. I know about the diagnosis, but not understand what it's like to live with or how you can help. You know,

Feel like and here could completely contradict how grounded he was at the start and what he does.

You love bass cars and cool starts, everything surrounded person.

I've got some weird hobbies, not weird hobbies, but I'm obsessed with like real estate, so.

I invest in real estate for my family.

There is long term, yeah.

And we're like we're building a house at the moment. So like things like that keepers very very busy. I do have an old school car kind of obsession as well, but I don't have that nice But I think for both of us too, is it's a lot of it.

In the pool with the kids all day and stuff like that. Like it's I think.

Going back to earlier when you're talking about like our schedule and Renee being stuck at the house.

Kind of thing and trying to get out for a marathon run.

And on away and all that, when there's probably not that often that we're all five of us, like the kids, you're at school and Jack snapping and there's so much going on. Five of us aren't actually like always really together at the same time, awake and happy, and like.

It's to get so when we can actually all be together and be outside or go to the park or go make a little quick trip somewhere to spend some time together and give the kids memories.

And Jacob before San Diego kept telling you like, I want to go to the beach. I want to go to the beach, and we're like, the.

Beach is Australia.

He think, yeah, could do that. So we made up a beach in San Diego and he loved it. Yeah. I think they're the things.

That my own personal hobbies are great, but I kind of try and do them on the side or on the road or at night whenever kids are in bed. But I think when we can be all five of us together is the most fun. Playing laser tag the other day around the house.

Laser takes so much fun. Also, I've been looking at some of the yanchors. Does Utah is beautiful? There are so many amazing places you can go hiking. I have no I have no picture of you, tarry my brain.

You get like the best of both worlds.

So in the summer it's like the desert hot like forties, boiling hot, dry, like miserable, and then in the inter it's like the complete opposite. It's like three feet of snow.

White Christmas.

Oh my gosh, yeah, miserable.

So I see why you chose a sport that you can play inside a temperature controlled court. Yeah, yeah, got it.

But it is beautiful, Like the National parks are great. We live kind of just on the basin now and so you get a bit of a view downtown and it's actually a nicest city than we've been in eight years now. Like we remember first getting here and there was like four restaurants and they were like the typical cheesecake factory and olive garden all that, and now like any food you want you can get a really good.

Meal, any kind of cuisine or whatever.

Like it's we actually say that Salt Lake City to us is very much like the Adelaide of Australia, like a big country town, pills just not far away. You can get up for a ski and all that sort of thing. Very close knit community, you know, you know, you run into Bob who knows that, Jenny who knows like everyone knows everyone. It's a really nice small town.

Close knit than we thought. Kids going to school because now they're like, we all know everyone everyone. We're just a random Australian.

Oh gosh, that's lovely. Just to finish up, second last question, three interesting things about each of you that don't normally come up interviews.

And special you know this is.

Very special.

Firsts.

Something I thought about this, something that absolutely no one knows about me is I have really really like ringlet hair, like really pearls. Yeah, no one ever looked social media and no one would ever believe that.

But how long do you have to straightening or is it chemically straight?

I don't know. It's so thin that I just like wash it and then blow driyal straighten it and I only really wash my hair.

Maybe once or twice a week.

So yeah, gal, I hear we're in lockdown.

Still, especially pandemic, there's no one to impress, so no, yep, So there's there's one thing.

That's fascinating.

A second one.

My first break down was so he kind of like contradicts a little bit, like I'm saying I'm not superstitious and all that I have, Like weird, it's not superstitious because.

It's not.

I think it is superstitious, but he's not.

It happens to go completely around game day, so I feel like that makes it a superstition.

Now it's just like with my so like the perfect example is my beard right now, which is disgusting. But during the Olympics, we started playing games and we started winning, and I was like, oh, shave tomorrow or whatever.

And then we went again, and then we went again, and then we went again.

Not just feeling things.

So this is like yeah, and then a little bit with the jazz, but obviously like over eighty two I'm not going to not shave for eighty two games because it's disgusting.

Yeah, because your wife, But it's not like he's very particular about Yeah, like when he.

I wouldn't say it's like a superstition, but I just like the kind of like people like just keep rolling with it, like why why change it?

It's not like.

I'm pretty sure that's a superstition Joe, and has to be done at the right time with the hair trim which he gets his.

Head because I can't get if I get my haircut and my beard don at the same time, I look like I'm twelve again.

I can confirm that chime, which it is, like.

And I'll go get my haircut soon, which I spoke to my guy today.

You've got a guy, and I'll leave.

That for a few days and then I'll eventually like trim my beard and then otherwise it's like going for my.

Looking like it's a very specific schedule. I could feel like you've got to really coordinate.

Wow, I don't care about shaving or like hates my beard more than me.

I don't care about it. I hate my husband's bed too, but I also hate clean shaving. Yeah, you look fine, like middle double yeah weirdly. Yeah, that's a good one.

I reckon.

Well, actually, you've actually done a fair deep dive full of research, so anything's going to guess what my first job was.

It's probably you, but.

My first paying job was on a mobile animal farm and we used.

To go who baits and birthday parties and the Blue Heelers set.

Yeah, I wasn't not, Oh my god, I love animals. That would be the best job job.

Can you believe that mobile?

I actually can't believe that. I thought you were going to say, like a mobile phone shop or something. I was like, okay, stopping calm down photophone year.

Old kids from killing guinea pigs basically.

And then she was a bartender.

I was a bartender for three and a half years with Joe Curran.

Yep, quiet Hotel classon Oh my gosh.

My second one that I wrote down was definitely something that people would know, but not as cool as my beard.

Just a second tier fact.

So since I went to Grenada my first year in two thousand and eight two thousand and nine when we finished the season, I haven't had a Christmas in Australia since.

Since two thousand and eight.

Wow eight was my last Christmas in Australia, which we probably played on Boxing Day I reckon with the NBL, So I probably didn't even really have a Christmas in two thousand and eight. So ever since I've known Renee, we've never had a Christmas in Australia together or a part Oh.

My gosh that they've all been Northern Hemisphere, cold Christmases. And now it's going to be so weird for you guys when you do get back and Christmas.

Yeah, one in a couple of Europe, so I had multiple Europe. I'm saying the weather is decent there, but what everyone in Utah has been snow.

It's kind of nice though. Christmas when it's snowing is really magical.

Well, it's going to be funny with the kids because obviously they only know why.

They think why Christmas is normal. It's just.

The shrinks on the barbie for.

All their Christmas cards actually make sense. Yeah, unlike us. Well yeah, exactly.

My third one, which Renee remind under me the other day when we were talking about it.

So I used to get really really mad and the can openers.

Quite literally he cannot use the cannon.

I would be losing my mind and swearing.

She was just like like broken, like swearing, swearing, screaming the house down and complaining that it's broken.

And then obviously realize that I'm left handed, so left handed, it's actually.

A lot more. I think it all makes it possible.

But apparently there's left handed left hand.

Actually, birthday's coming up, maybe I'll get you a left handed canon.

What a great present, honestly.

Would be like what are you talking about? And then whatever can or whatever would be open?

And I was like, what the.

How did she do?

I was like it was I've spoken for twenty minutes, like you just fixed it, and it's.

I love that famous NBA player. Can't open it, cannot open it just can't. You cannot do it.

We've got now like we've had it for a while. I figured out how to work it so I can do it.

And it's it's not like yeah, you know when the cans just not a neat.

Yeah, not a smooth brain.

You're a smooth like plugged a little hole. And I've like stabbed the knife around it.

You've just been pretending that you can use it. You're like, look, Rene, I did it, but you've got a knife and like hacked around just to like.

It wouldn't surprise me.

But it's amazing, very very difficult to you.

Wow, the challenges, the challenges.

My third one that I feel like people that know me would know this, but people that are listening who hadn't known us before wouldn't know this. But my favorite meal ever in the entire world, and no one else can do it the same. Joe has done it really well, but still not the same. Is my dad curried sausages.

Oh my god, I love Courage.

My gosh.

They are just like, oh God, I missed soraying that I haven't had them in.

Like three years.

Coals like coals.

No one else can make it the same. You just get the perfect mix of curry and like everything.

It's just anyway. My favorite ever is my Dad's caacter.

I still remember going to house at the Patch one time and she was like having Dad's Courage sausages, and.

I was like, they're actually.

Like unbelievable, amazing. When you come back home, I'm just gonna like turn up on your dad's stores and be like, I need, I need to understand what you're talking about with these sausages.

You know, we do curried sausages with rice, like white rice.

Whereas a lot of people do curried sausages or like curries with potato, but we do it with rice.

So just just a heads up for when you come.

It's the part is.

It's not like a banger is a mash.

It's like saying like we're having carried like I don't even like curry, Like what are.

You talking about?

What is happening?

Like Pepper's spicy for an a and now we're eating It's true.

Wow, guys, the whole world knows you so much right now, this is so wonderful. Ship No, like s PC is going to ship all the like pullin the pull tin so that you don't have to use the can so much better except when you pull them off and then you just screw, like when the whole thing comes off and then you can't use the opener either, and you're just like, well, I'm never going to get.

The baby you can't.

Oh and last question, guys, what's your favorite quote.

On the truth.

Yeah, I'm not gonna lie. I don't. I'm not a quota not a quote.

A lot of people aren't. It's only weird people like me who have one for every situation, Like it just comes out.

I think it's a part of like earlier, like I'm just too like I just kind of.

Can't remember anything, so I feel like you can.

Quote from and I'll be like pull my phone out like trying to google like best quotes of twenty twenty one.

I just don't.

I think a part of it is just like no, like kind of just roll with it, like I'm I don't need anything to have to tell me what to do each day in the text the.

Text message and the text messages reply.

But then they're like it's just like it's suddenly like not playing well or whatever, like I'll figure it out, Like I don't need it.

I don't need quotes.

Yeah, to me, I'm going to get a little bit cheesy because I had been thinking about this.

Obviously.

I've listened to your podcast a lot, so I've been listening to everyone else's quotes, and I was just.

Like, oh no, I was feeling like the quote pressure, you know.

But I actually have to say, for so much of my career and any netballer that has been a teammate of mine and maybe listening, we go, oh my gosh, we're an April quotes from here and here, And I always used to post quotes and have quotes on my wall and quotes of my diary and all of that stuff. And I honestly, when I think about it now, I think it was because I was just outsourcing inspiration all the time externally rather than sort of getting it from within.

This is a really long way of telling you this. Anyway, this is a beautiful We had to.

Really learn to communicate, and I think our time apart just really made us grateful for what each other could bring, regardless of how completely opposite of each other.

We are that we brought each other.

That balance, and we always used to say to each other, like whether it was Joe's early morning or my late night, or my early morning at his late night, or just signing off and saying goodbye, whatever it was, we always used to say to each other.

Thanks for making a difference.

And we've probably gone a little bit away from that at the moment, but it is actually still something that not a mantra that I live by or a quote that I live by, but I just think that every person that I crossed parts with, or you know, with Jacob or Miller or Jack, the kids or Joe and our relationship is.

How can I make a difference in a positive way?

Obviously, so I kind of just yeah, we always used to say to each other, probably go back to that, but I think at the end of the day, you know, he's making such a huge difference to my life and hopefully vice versa and the kids didn't going through the pandemic. So thanks for making a difference is something that we always.

Just used to text each other.

So you're going to say what the last emojis were?

That's why I thought, oh, oh, we still do that so.

We I don't even know how it started, but now you're like, hey, I see a good night. Like wherever we are, we would always finish it with the love heart emoji, the pound fist and the flames, because you know people used to do that like that. Yes, I don't even know how it started, but we used to like joke and do it to each other all the time, like when I was leaving the house or like whatever, and then it just always I don't even know when

To be like it's so cute.

Like acting like twelve year olds.

But it's just like maybe that's why thanks man, scrap, because it.

Was because it's just like I prefer you know what, I like words. Both of those are awesome. I love both of them. You both are making such a huge difference.

Is anyone not giving you a quote?

No one's ever kno giving me a quote. I've had people quote themselves, which is cute. No one's ever given me an emoji before. That's a pretty good one. That's a flex. I really like that, Joe, that's a flex right there.

When you're saying that, I was like, I was trying to think of how it started, and it was obviously just a completely random thing that happened.

And then it's been, however, many years of just randomly doing it.

I'm just doing it. What do you guys call each other? I feel like it's really interesting when you first are round a couple when they're speaking to each other, Like you go over to someone's place for dinner and they're cute word for each other is like the versions of baby or bar, but like you know, the first time you.

Hear it, and you're always like something no one else ever knows. So everyone in the netball world calls me nay or neighbor. That's I've always just been name.

Nay, Nay, Nay, Nay, neighbor, neighbor.

Joe never called me a nickname ever, It's always been Renee.

Like he's never called me nay, and everyone else's family friends calls me nay. He's never ever refuses.

He's always just said, and I'm like, I guess I'm always in trouble.

I don't know.

Yeah, wait, even like there's no bub or babe.

Or a if anything, but no, he would never say baby, you taxed it, but you would never actually call me babe or I say babe all the time, Babe, Joe, Joe, Joe mister times you know, like Joe will go on like tour like the Boomers or on a blong broad trip and like it'll just like slip out and then he yo, bro, and I'll be like.

No, no, no, you can see it again. It's even finished coming out of his lips. He's like, I'm retracting that.

So my husband does the opposite. He's like, so we his dad's unewell and he's just gone into quarantine and tazzy. And so we've been doing long distance medium distance a little bit this year. But because all his work is online as well, he'll go to other people and be like hey, honey, or like love you to like one of his mates, so one of his clients, because we're like texting all the time. It's done it so many times. He's like, they all just accept the love heart.

Now. I don't know why I've always I think the whole to me, it was always like a teammates thing. It's not me teammate like.

So it's like bro, It's like bro to you, It's like, no, we're not growing out. Maybe the episode should be called Seize the Name.

Well, I actually did listen in one of your other podcasts. You were saying that really wanted to get someone and a question because you really wanted to say seize the nay. And I was going to like, I literally neally texted you to be like you could use it anyway.

I was like, but here you go.

Oh you guys, you're amazing. This was absolutely delightful. I've taken up so much of your time, which now even more I appreciate how little time you get together at home, So thank you so much for spending a night on the show. This has just been delightful. I'm so excited to follow your journey with the run and see that the neighborhood can get behind you.

I'm excited now to follow your journey with your run as well. And we obviously love what you're doing and all the positive energy that you're putting out there.

So keep it up. Because you have two listeners over here.

We love our podcast and we certainly love CESDA, So thank you for having a song it's been so fun.

Real housewives who's so like sy.

Oh even more. I appreciate that, like I'm the same. I'm in bed at six pm. If I can so thank you guys so much. You've been amazing, and I'll make sure to include links to the fundraising pages in the show notes.

Awesome, thanks so much.

Like I said at the start, I'm a little bit in love with these too. I don't know how they keep such a good head on their shoulders, but they do it with such grace. Like we mentioned, it would be wonderful if anyone in the neighborhood whose circumstances allow could get around Rene's marathon effort coming up in the New York Marathon. We would so so appreciate it. So I've popped some links in the show notes if you'd