Hey, everyone, welcome to the Scouter Vision where we talk all things dragon Ball. I'm your house Angela and I'm Mike, and today we're gonna talk about what was the better sequel than Dragon Ball Z?
Was it Dragon Ball GZ or Dragon Ball Super. There's two ways you can go with this, and both are good, but we're gonna talk about what we think is better.
So let's hop in the sampots and let's start the show.
Ladies and gentlemen. We're back with a new episode of Scouter Vision, and I'm so excited to get into this one. We have a topic that's very polarizing. I see all over social media, all over YouTube, a lot of people are discussing what was the better sequel to Dragon Ball Z? Was it Dragon Ball GT or Dragon Ball Super. But before we get into that, Angela, where can they find us on social media?
You can find us on antiktok at Scouter adapt Vision Pod. That is Scouter Adopt Vision Pod.
Okay, so right off, the bad GT are super go?
Uh? Okay, Well, since you put me on the spot, I'm gonna have to say super Why I don't know. I feel like it just went a little better with the story after Z because I don't know, it starts like right after as opposed to GT, where it starts like ten years later, because there's like a huge ass gap.
There's a gap in Super too, it's about like three years yeah, but definitely less of a gap in Super than GT. And I don't know. So the way I see it is you could break this down into a couple different categories. Right, story is obviously one production is definitely one too, because I feel that GT's production is hand in hand with dragon Ball Z. So GT goes right after I mean GT goes right after dragon Ball Z.
It fits in with you. If you watch GT, it looks like you're watching dragon Ball Z, but just with the darker tone.
Yeah, I have to agree with that one.
Now, Super I do feel had a better story. But the one thing I did not like about Dragon Ball Super was if you watched the Battle of Gods and if you watch Resurrection F you basically had to rewatch those shows in episodic form because it starts out by retelling the movies, where GT starts out with original content. Even though it starts out whack. Everyone knows the freaking first arc of GT is whack.
I kind of sit there that.
Honestly, everybody Cartoon Network new because Cartoon Network they cut that whole arc out and start with the Baby arc and call those the last the lost episodes.
The lost episodes.
But everyone knows that it starts out whack. But how good does Superstar? It doesn't start out good. Super You have to sit through about thirty episodes of retelling the movies of Resurrection F and Battle of Gods. So I feel like when it comes to the start of both series, you had to skip if you want to get to the good shit anyway.
Yeah, well, if you want to skip like the first whatever amount of episodes it is, you can't just watch Battle of Gods and then Resurrection F first.
Especially if you think about Battle of God's and Resurrection F having better animation. That was another thing. So GT's animation was really good. It was, like I said, on par with Dragonball Z, where the animation style for Super didn't really get cooking into probably the Goku Black arc, and that was because they were trying to keep up with the manga. Yeah, and they were rushing out episodes of the anime because the mango was still fresh and
coming out. I believe like they had about maybe a month to animate everything that they're seeing in the manga, and because of that, it was a rush job for the first couple arcs of Super. That's why you get really weird, you know, far shots of Beers where he looks like an easter bunny. You get very smudgy faced Goku where it looks like it was drawn by a
three year old. And it wasn't until like the Goku Black arc, it wasn't until I would even say Super animation didn't really get good until the Tournament of Power. That's when it was like, oh my god, this is really good.
Like even though those things weren't necessarily good, I still like the animation that it had, like you know, for like the focus points of it, and like the forward shot.
You know, I agree, but when it comes to production, I'm giving it to GT. GT did not have that problem from the start, and that was because GT was its own breakaway story. Even though it was the continuation of Dragon Ball Z. GT did not have a manga, so they didn't have to reanimate some of the things from the manga. What it was was they were able to just animate right off the bat where Super was trying to animate from the manga, and the Mango is
still fresh and new. If you go all the way back to Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z. When they were animating these scenes from the manga, the Mango already been out for ten years.
Yeah, I had some time.
They had time to get it. We're here. It's like, okay, the next the next part of the Goku Black arc is being animated, and the manga comes out in a week, so we got to make sure we animated right away because we had to put out an episode. So it was a rush job. The start of Super was a rush job, and that's where I feel like Super kinda misses me. But so both start out really really bad in my opinion.
I mean, GT like, as far as that animation goes, it's pretty consistent with Z, like it's slightly similar, but it's also like a little better at the same time. My only thing is some characters have bigger heads.
Oh yeah on their bodies, like the balloon heads.
Yeah, Like I understand that was probably the style, but it just looks off, especially if it's not everyone. Because you compare like like chi Chi, Yeah, if you compare her to Goku, Goku looks normal. But Chee Chee's head looks way too big.
Yeah, a couple of heads look pretty big. Also, I saw that I noticed that mister Satan said was really big at times where it was like massive.
His was the worst. It was like really big.
I honestly think that if I'm going to just get you know what, I'll give an answer right off the bat. I think that Super is the better show. But I think that dragon Ball GT may be a better sequel to dragon Ball Z. And I might explain why right at the end of dragon Ball Z. If you remember, we ended with the tournament ten years later, we ended with the introduction of Ub, and we end dragon Ball Z with Goku going off to train Ub. The start
of dragon Ball GT is Goku training Ube. It's a better sequel where basically dragon Ball Z ends ten years after the fight with Majimbu and where Superstars you have to go backwards and talk about what happened within those ten years, where in dragon Ball Z is said that those ten years were ten years a piece. But it really wasn't ten years a piece, was it. Now that we know about Dragon Ball Dima and Dragon Ball Super.
So with that being said, you have to forget about everything that happened at the end of dragon Ball Z with Goku going off to train ub If you want Super to make sense, if you go with GT, you're just going off of what we saw at the end and the end of Dragon Ball Z. Remember, we see a pan, we see Ube, and we don't get that right away in Super because we have to go backwards.
So if we're talking about a sequel, I think that GT plays off of what we saw at the end of dragon Ball Z. If you want to talk about Super, then it would have been better if you ended Dragon Ball Z with the Majubu saga instead of going off and saying this is what happens ten years later.
Yeah. I was gonna say, if you like, remove that last bit of dragon Ball Z where it shows like the ten years later thing, I think Super would work out pretty well, honestly in my opinion.
Yeah, I agree, And you know Super is canon that that plays another role. Yeah, because if you say that GT's not Cannon and Super's Cannon, then that would mean that the definitive sequel to dragon Ball Z is Dragon Ball Super. Anyway, Yeah, but I honestly think that when it comes to Dragon Ball Super Dragon Ball Super in my opinion, is the better show, better stories, better characters. Like if you compare the characters, I much rather bearis
Wheeze over anybody in GT. I like the villains, like I was a big fan of Baby Baby Vegeta, and I liked the whole story of Baby and I liked you know, Super seventeen was pretty cool but lasted only like three episodes. That's bullshit.
Yeah, I feel like the build up was like a lot longer than like, you know, him being in there.
Yeah, I mean he died quick. But if you look at the character development of GC, the one thing I do like is you had other characters getting the shine you had gotten had his own little storyline with being a ladies man, Trunks who is now the CEO of Capsule Corp. But doesn't like the job, Vegeta who has domesticated and became a regular father, but now he hates himself because Kakara keeps getting stronger, and where's his saying pride. You have Pan who is introduced and you see her
grow up. You have all these. You have Ub who we get to see and Ub and Majen Boo fuse and create majub and you see all these characters, storylines and development, where for Super, the one thing that I liked was also the one thing that I didn't like, which was very contradicting. But I liked that there was more of an emphasis on Gokun Vegeta, But I don't like that the emphasis on Gokun Vegeta meant that there
was no emphasis on anybody else. Finishing Dragon Ball Z, we had got Tanks, we don't get got tanks, and Dragon Ball Super we had Gohan has a child, and Gohan is you know, goes from scholar to the man who helped defeat Majimboo, and there's no development for Gohan, like we just forgot about everybody else. It became the Goku and Vegeta show.
Yeah, I mean I have to agree because there's more Seine than other characters in Dragon Ball GT as opposed to Super, because Dragon Ball Super kind of continued along with Z where it kind of put more of the focus on Goku and Vegeta. I don't know, like if the whole first arc did not exist in GT, I think it would have went a lot better because starting with the Baby saga would have been like a better start to it.
I agree. I feel like they didn't have an identity, nor did they know what they were doing with the show. They wanted to give you the event, the adventure, the adventure style of Dragon Ball, and people didn't want that. People didn't want to go back. People want the action of dragon Ball Z. So they quickly, you know, pivoted and gave us the action of dragon Ball Z with
the Baby arc. But they should have just started with that, because if it's a sequel to Dragon Ball Z, why are we going back to the style of Dragon Ball. There's a way you could do it where it works, because I've seen it in Dima Dimo worked. Dimon worked where you had the adventures of them going through the Demon Realm and then you had also at the end the crazy fight scenes. Yea, like Dragon Ball Z and Dragon Ball Super. But it's like there was no identity
for GT. You went too much on the adventure side and forgot to put in, you know, some cool fight scenes, and then there was no build up until like episode twenty six when we saw Doctor Meu and you know Baby. It was weird because it seemed like they did a pivot as opposed to a natural progression to more action.
It just like jumped to it as opposed to just transitioning smoothly into like the next arc.
Whereas for Super you got action right off the bat. It felt like Dragon Ball Z because you got action right off the bat. But the problem is that action you got was action. You already knows what's gonna happen
in your race saw. So if you, like I said, said, and I keep going back to this, if you watched the movies Battle of Gods and if you saw Resurrection f then watching those two there's little changes like that of you know, Malmo's birthday being at Capsule Corp. Her birthday was on a cruise ship and that was how you know beers came to the cruise ship and they fought in the sky where I don't care about those little changes. I still know the Super saying God is Goku.
I still know that you need five sayings with pure hearts to come together. You still know that Bears is not going to destroy Earth. He's going to take Goku under his wing pretty much. You still know Freezer comes back and he has a new Golden form. So the first like thirty episodes of Super, you don't really need to watch if you saw those movies. And if there's any show that starts out with an arc that you don't need to watch, that's a horrible way to start out.
There's you know, a first impression is everything, and if your first impression is you could skip this. That's where both shows I think failed.
Yeah, both of them. It's like the first like twenty five thirty episodes. It's like I could have gone without that. But I mean, we also can't say everyone has seen those Battle Gods and Resurrection f so maybe they just started with the actual show as opposed to that. But I mean, I'm pretty sure majority of the people saw the movies too.
Of course. And I also say the thing that GT had over Super was even though it was a bad arc to start out with, it was a new arc. It was a fresh arc and people didn't know.
Yeah, that's where they have the upper hand.
Now let's talk about the endings. For Dragon Ball GT we end with the Shadow Dragons arc and Omega Chenron, And for Dragon Ball Super we end with the Tournament of Power m H, which had the better ending.
I don't know, like no offense to GT. I couldn't really follow the whole Shadow Dragon arc. It was a little I don't know, it was a little feeling to me personally, but that's that's probably a me thing. But personally, I like the Tournament of Power. That was like my favorite.
I've come on this podcast and I said numerous times that the Tournament of Power is probably one of the greatest things I've seen in dragon Ball. It was really cool to see eighty fighters a battle royal style, you know, especially a wrestling fan like me, I love that battle royal style, everyone going at it at the same time, and there was a lot at Steak. There's a mistake in GT as well.
But even more so in Super because your whole universe is at steak.
I do like the fact that the dragon Balls played a role at the end of Super, at the end of GT, just because we have now at that point three different series where we saw the dragon Balls be absolutely abused by Power right and in GT, dragon Ball Z, and Dragon Ball those dragon balls have been used for wiches that are good, which is at bad and they've been overused. So I like that the final arc in at the time in dragon Ball history was centered around
the dragon Balls. Yeah, I mean it's called dragon Ball, right, so it was cool, but I don't know, there was a lot of things that were built up to that I felt like did not really make sense.
No, Like the first couple of shadow Dragons, It's like, what is this?
Yeah, Like Omega Chenron was awesome, Yeah, but we didn't start with Omega Chenanron. We started out with the goofy ass, badass dragon. But then like the whole show, we're waiting for super saying for Vegeta, Super Saying for Vegeta, And the thing is, I understand how Goku became super saying for It was from the bloods Waves, right, but it was weird to me that Vegeta did not want to get to that transformation on his own, you know, accord.
It was weird to me because Vegeta always wants to outpower, out Will and outdo Cacarat and not take the easy way out. Where in Super in Dragon Ball GT, I should say it's Boma who creates a bloodswege machine that gives Vegeta the chance to go super Saying four. That's one thing I didn't like.
You kept you kept eating the same thing, and I'm like, I understand, but it's a different story.
It took away from the Vegeta we all know, and then Vegeta who in the past and Dragon Ball Z. Right, here's an example, dragon Ball Z, Vegeta comes out of the Hyperbolic time chamber and he has this new power he had, He's super Vegta, right, and he wants to test out that new power. Right, look at Daima. He becomes Super Saiying three or what he calls Ultimate Vegeta, and the first thing he does is wants to test out that new power.
Yeah.
In dragon Ball GT, he becomes Super Saiying four, and the first thing he says, besides you know, before he even wants to test out his new power as a super saying, is let's fuse. This is Vegeta who hates fusing with Kakarat.
He always he always makes like a big deal about it, like it's like the grossest thing in the world, Like regardless whether it's the Patara earrings or the Fusion dance.
No, he hates it. But before we even see what a super saying for Vegeta could do, the first thing he wants to do is fuse with Gocoo. Definitely goes away from the Vegeta, we know, and I think that that's where GTT really starts to Like miss me, they took the stories of these characters and characters that are established and their personality traits that are established and went the opposite route with it. I can understand progression, like
we saw Vegeta progress. He came here to destroy Earth, and then by the end of Dragon Ball Z he's saving Earth and he's omitting that Goku is the strongest, Right, That's good storyline progression. Not Here's a guy who always, you know, never looked for the easy way out, but here looks for the East way out, and then a guy who never wants to fuse with Goku but instantly wants to fuse with Goku. It took away from Vegeta.
He's got way too much pride to just say, oh yeah, let me just use the blunt swaves to transform to Super Saiyan for it, and especially way too much pride to just immediately fuse with Goku.
And if you look at Dragon Ball Super, it was the opposite. Yeah, dragon Ball Super, Vegeta got a lot of shine, Vegeta got a lot of transformations. It was all on his own accord. Even in the manga because and that's the one thing I gotta say is it is hard to compare Super to GT when GT was only sixty four episodes and Dragon Ball Super was one hundred and thirty one episodes. But it's continuing with the manga.
Yeah, I was gonna say it's continuing the manga.
So technically, I mean, I don't know. July seventh, we're going to get a lot more of a I guess clear clearer direction for Dragon Ball Super when Toora Toorro has that Japan anime expo. But the story could continue GT. The story's done, you can't continue it Super. You can see I know in GT, Goku goes off with Chenron and then we do a hundred year time jump and we see Goku Junior and Vegeta Junior facing off in
the martial arts tournament. But it wasn't follow up, don And I know that there was a movie about Goku Junior and Vegeta Junior and Pan who's like one hundred plus year old, But I don't think they're ever going to go back now and follow up on that story of what happens with Goku Junior one hundred years later.
I think you can't.
It's done.
Plus it's way too much of a jump as opposed to the ten years that it originally had.
Yeah, I mean it was cool to see the little bit of a glimpse in the future, to see, all right, Goku has a great great great grandson who follows up and his footsteps, and I like that. But I don't know. I feel like there's a lot more intrigue with what happened in the Moral arc, what happens in the Granola arc, the full Superhero arc, and what's going to happen in the future with Black Freezer. I'm more intrigued by that story continuing than if we go back and continue the GT.
Yeah, Goku Junior arc, Goku Junior arc.
All right, so definitively it is now time to give your answer GT or Super? What is the better Dragon Ball Z sequel?
Well, personally, I do still have to say, is I think Dragon Ball Super is the better sequel? I don't know. It's it's really hard because.
Because you love bears, all right, can I not? You love bears?
Yes, I love beers and weeks. However, like like I said, if you want to like go right off of like animation everything. Like, I think GT is technically the better sequel. However, I prefer the Super route. And it was directly from like a Cura Toriyama because it was continuing the manga, which is all his work anyway, So it's like going along with like the actual story, you know what I mean?
Yeah, I got to agree. I'm going with Dragon Ball Super as well. One question I forgot to ask beforehand, and it's going to lead us to our next topic for Thursday's episode. What show had the better transformations? Was it Super or GT? Reminder and GT. We have Super saying three Kid Goku and we have Super saying four, Goku Super saying four Vegeta, and we have Super saying four Gojta. You can even throw in majub there too.
Right, yeah, Super, there's like a bunch Super.
You had Super saying God, Super Saiying Blue. Eventually Super Saiying Blue evolved Super Saying Blue with Kyo.
Kin Ultra Instinct.
Yeah yeah, Ultra Instinct sign mastered Ultra Instinct. You have Freezer with Golden Friezer. You have Goku Black with Rose, which I know, Super got very transformation heavy, especially if you want to continue with you know, Gohan Beast and Orange Piccolo.
I mean it kind of makes sense.
Though everyone got progressed. Yeah, where Super I like that. I like the Super got everybody stronger. But I do like that GT really looked at Super, saying four as the pinnacle of a Super Saiyan and that's as far as you could go. But I even though there was a lot in Super, you can't stop ultra instinct.
Ever, I was gonna say, honestly, I think Super still had like the better transformations because it's not like it was just Gokol and Vegeta like you saw like a lot of different transformations.
Yeah, for sure. So that leads us to our topic on Thursday. What do we talk about on Thursday?
On Thursday, we're gonna talk about our top ten favorite transformations in all of dragon Ball. Yeah, so that includes dragon Ball Z, dragon Ball GT, and Dragon Ball Super.
Now I know your favorite. I'm going to give a little spoiler. I know your favorite is when Zorbon became that beastly Zorbon figure.
I think that's your favorite, but you know it's not. Yes, it is, because you brought it up.
Oh you you your favorite is Captain Gin. You going full Frog.
That was ridiculous.
Anyway, we'll catch you here on Thursday with a new episode a Scout Division. I love you all, See you Thursday.
You guys,