What's going on? Ladies and gents Roberts? Thanks. Kiddo. Savage.com today. I've got special guest, Chris Crowley on the line. He and I have been in contact via Instagram for like three years. Now. I've kind of seen his competitive bodybuilding Journey unfold from as he says, from fatty to Nanny bodybuilder. He's lost a ton of weight.
He's done a, you know, ketogenic diet, throughout his whole competition career and he's honestly just totally turned his health and his life around 180 degrees. So he's got a very inspiring story. I learned a ton from him. I really appreciate the A person that he is, I'm excited for what his future holds and how it continues to impact and inspire people in a positive way. So I have no doubt that you'll take something from this conversation. Without further Ado, sit back,
relax. Enjoy the podcast with Chris. We are live. Chris. How are you man? I'm doing great. How are you Robert? I'm doing wonderfully well myself. So I'm excited to get you on the podcast because As you and I have been in touch on social media. Instagram predominantly for how many years now, probably like three. Maybe I would say three. Sure. And you reached out about three years ago. And you had you, I was just kind of watching your journey unfold.
You were pretty heavy set to begin with. You did a show lost a lot of weight for that show. And then you just enter a show. Was it last year with your last show? Last year was about correct? I did two shows left. Last year and you looked phenomenal. I mean like the the transformation from your before before to your most, you know, recent to competition. Appearance is just super
impressive, man. You've got a. You just started out doing a new YouTube channel, your Instagrams fatty tuna fatty body butter, which is just, I like the play on words there. So I want to see just wanted to get you on the podcast kind of Dive In Your Story man, because I've seen your journey on the fold, you know, firsthand, and I just wanted to dive deeper into a brother. Thank you. It is an honor to do this.
Yes, probably back in 2018, is when I discussed, when I started endeavoring into natural bodybuilding. I'm I'm 47 now. And from the time I was probably thirty eight until maybe until I started endeavoring it to the Natural bodybuilding. I was very heavy. Set, probably the high, the heaviest I got during that timeframe was probably close to run 270 pounds.
I and then I went to, I was in Detroit for a business trip and I ran into while I was at the holiday and they have not Holiday Inn on my little, my saying, the Embassy Suites completely different Hotel chain. They're not was at the little happy hour thing and there was this guy across The restaurant his name's Dave Bowers. He's a promoter with the NPC out in Indianapolis. He's a big bodybuilder. I mean, this guy's polo shirt had muscles popping out of it and we were talking and that's
when I decided. So that would have been in 2018. I would have been, I mean wanted I don't even 44, 43 44, I decided at that point out. You know, what? I'm going Endeavor to do this bodybuilding thing, because I just it's one of those things where Time is of the essence and sooner or later all the things you wanted to do. You won't have time to do any more. So, so I'm going to do this. I had to be natural because for the health reasons and also my wife was very adamant that she
didn't want me doing that stuff. And as far as you're using a performance-enhancing drugs, so my doctor at the time. It already prescribed me to be on a low carb diet. So in order to do that I said, okay. Well ketogenic bodybuilding it. Is I didn't even know that that the two terms don't normally go together. But when I looked up YouTube for ketogenic bodybuilding, yours was the first channel I Came Upon and that's kind of, I guess. You can say that you helped
create this monster. Well, no, I mean, you've been the one, put in the work, man. So, I mean, I can't take any credit there. I mean, you're the one that's put in the work at the one that's hit the macros. You must put in the training and made the transformation happen. So kudos to you for making that a reality. But I mean Bonnie bully man like to say hey, this is what I'm going to do. That was it like an aha moment for you, when you realize, hey, look, I'm just I'm too heavy
this isn't healthy. My health is compromised. Was there like a catalyst for you to really be motivated to go make 180 degree shift like them? Yes. Yes. Thank you for asking that. I was on. I'm sorry. I'm getting a little emotional. I was on two different blood pressure medicines at the time and one of the medicines, I was taken double the dose double the recommended dose as prescribed by my doctor. My doctor said, I need you to take two of these pills, when the normal dosage is just one.
And so I was dealing with that. And even with that, my blood pressure was still on the higher end. My father, he had his first stroke at 48 years old and he recovered, okay? From that. And then he had his second stroke somewhere in his early 50s, and he never really fully recovered.
I mean, he's still alive and with us today, but he never, really fully recovered from it. And so, like, his left hand is Just for all intents and purposes unusable and he doesn't get around that much that well anymore and I saw that. And I've been married now to the same beautiful woman, since 1995. So I was looking at if I didn't start changing my life right now.
I was going to have those same problems and my quality of life and then the quality of life for my my wife, and my two children. Aaron and now third child as my, my son's married to a beautiful woman named Haley. I just didn't want to put that burden on them. So I knew I had to change something in my life. I thought was gonna if I was going to make those things happen and you would have thought, just wanted to be healthy was going to be enough, but I have a competitive Spirit to me.
I used to dabble in boxing and Brazilian jiu-jitsu. In my early 30s, but the idea of either getting punched in the face or getting my arm Twisted, all out of shape, just to stay competitive, isn't my idea of a good time now that I'm closer to 50 and 40, but I've always enjoyed bodybuilding. I've always enjoyed watching back in the day when it was like Arnold Schwarzenegger. Dorian Yates. Ronnie Coleman. Lila brought is definitely one of my favorites as well. You know, this is something I
really enjoy. Enjoy and I already know how to lift weights and I do lift weights. Why don't I just try to put everything all together and make this the thing that I use as the Catalyst to get healthy and now I'm in the best shape of my life. In fact, just last year. I was switching over my light and my not my yeah. My life insurance policy because the life insurance policy. I had with work, just wasn't
great. So I went to the private sector Are they had quoted me at One Premium because of my age.
And then when they came to my house and took my physical, they actually dropped my premiums, it at much lower because I was basically, in the shape of a man in his late 20s, as opposed to someone, who's as old as I am. So there's just been the journey is just been so beautiful, and I guess the best way to say it is just like things that you didn't think could happen and then along the way, I've inspired a lot of my friends and family
from back in high school or just hanging around me now that they haven't earned changed their life for the better and it's just been such a great. Great journey was there like like before you took up bodybuilding? So this is pre 37. 38 years old. Were you living like a relatively normal life, or was it?
Was it more unhealthy than most? I mean, you said, you have to about 250 pounds, but you just eating a bunch of processed foods, just over caloric consumption and not really active, or what kind of guy he to that band point to begin with. So I would say that I would often on active. I was doing the Jiu-Jitsu and the thing is what you just, you don't necessarily have to be light. You can use your weight against your opponent and I definitely did that but I would I would
eat. Eat, I guess. Yeah, I wasn't eating perfectly. I was definitely enjoying a lot more beer than I should have. And just because it was Michelob, Ultra, as opposed to, you know, full bodied beer, calories, are still going to matter. And yeah, might be only two carbs per beer. But when you have 20 of them that still 40 carbs and I was working out, I was doing like your CrossFit style workouts or I was doing a lot of Of kettlebell workouts.
I really enjoyed kettlebells and, you know, a lot of the different marketing of some of these programs, especially when it came to the Kettlebell broke programming at least back.
Then you know, you're getting these people telling you oh, you know, you can lose weight without the dishonor of diet and aerobics was actually one of the quotes I had heard and one of these programs, you know, basically telling you, well, if you're doing these kettle bell swings and everything else, you know, your burner enough calories that you're not To get that way. And I was believing the hype. Even though the mirror was telling me a much different story. I was believing.
Well, I'm doing these workouts so I can eat whatever I want and I did, I mean Pizza is much as I truly love pizza boy, rivers in from Chicago. I love my pizza it got, but that was you know, instead of just having one or two slices. I was basically even a an entire large pizza, all do myself, and then washing it down with a Diet Pepsi.
So yeah, feel like, you know, a lot of people, I don't know what the Tipping Point is. It's probably been highly individualized but you know, for whatever reason, it seems like once people are in their 30s, that's kind of like where they wind up settling that becomes the, the trajectory of their life. Not, you know, I don't want to I don't want to paint too broad a brush.
Stroke are missing. I mean, like, said howling to visualize, but I feel like, you know, you've got a lot of your habits in place, by the time, you know, you're in your 30s, by that point. You you pretty much know where you're at from a career standpoint. You've got, you know, kids that kind of has an impact on life and your daily schedule. So like the habits that have brought you to the point where you're at in your 30s. Typically, don't deviate too too much from that by and large for
most people. I feel so like when you are 37, so kind of latter, latter part of your 30s, and you've got a totally shift your nutrition to a ketogenic diet and then totally switch your, your lifestyle factors into more of a Any building roll like that's got to be a pretty hard transition. Like, was that did that come easy for you over there times a few months in where you were? Like, this is not who I am. This is not what I want to do.
This is not the direction. I want to take things over. You pretty much hooked from the get-go. Okay. I was hooked from the get-go as far as enjoying the training and enjoying the diet. However, the first competition I did was in 2019, I did. Natural muscle Association. I did their show called The Rain of fire, and I was not in the condition to get up on stage yet, and that wasn't because it was because I wasn't training, but it wasn't. I didn't have all the factors in
play yet. I was still even though I listen to you. I'd also listen to some other ketogenic people out there and I was picking and choosing, not what I needed to hear. But what I wanted to hear. So, I wanted to hear that. I could still have the keto fat bombs at, but still put me at a caloric Surplus and still lose weight because I'm ketogenic, right? So I was doing that and maybe I lost a little bit of weight mainly because of the exercise routine and the cardio and
everything else. But when I got up on stage, I was still that guy, we've all seen it. Somebody who paid an entry fee. Maybe did the work, but didn't really We put in enough work to be a competitive bodybuilder. And that was my first show and it was very humiliating at that
point. Is, when I found you another guy, Robert Goodwin the you to put out the best information when it comes to the ketogenic bodybuilding world as far as look, you know, macronutrients matter as do calories, and when I finally got that combination in place, there was no stopping me. And I can't picture my life now. Without natural bodybuilding. End this way of this diet and his way of life, the ketogenic way.
Yeah. No, I think I mean, I'm probably a little biased but I feel like he didn't diet and and Bonnie, but especially natural bodybuilding. Kind of go hand-in-hand. It just works really well for me. It's obviously, it worked very well for you. Rob. Goodwin's killed as well. He and I have very different protocols. But I mean, I feel like there's a lot of common ground. We both share. R. And there's definitely a lot of misinformation and confusion out there around the ketogenic diet
and body composition changes. I mean, the notion that you can simply be in ketosis and everything will just miraculously happen and you'll be good to go is is what a lot of people believe and it's unfortunate because they're doing so many things, right. But the things that really matter to elicit the response was looking for they're doing totally wrong. So kind of differentiate between Fact from fiction there and really dialing in what needs to
happen is key. But like said, man, you obviously got it down and figured it out because your last show me you looked incredible. Thank you. Thank you. That's what the last shows I did. So going back, when I met that gentlemen, Dave Bowers. I wanted to kind of Go full circle. If you will. I did the, I did two shows. I did an NPC show, which was his show called The, there was Indian Indiana, Indiana state championships for the people that are from that state.
And thankfully, I'm from I live in Ohio, as opposed to Indiana. So I had to do the battle of the state's. That's it. Up to Indiana guys. I'm just kidding. I love you. And so I did that show it Battle of the states that particular NPC show was not a tested show. So the athletes could be on performance-enhancing drugs if they so desired. I knew going into that show because I am natural that I would be at somewhat of a disadvantage.
And I was, but it was honestly, one of the more exciting moments of my life. I got to meet some great people, one person in particular. The bread Killian, who won the classic physique, show that day. He ran into me and was talking to me about how David shared my story with him, and he was really excited to meet me. So that was a very humbling experience. Like he saw my transformation and then real full circle. As I did. I was coming back home from Indianapolis.
I had placed dead last and all the categories and it really broke my heart, but I knew that because I wasn't an enhanced athlete. That I wasn't at a disadvantage. It just happened to be more of a disadvantage and I was willing to realize this on the driest shoe or the the most recent ones. No, not that the NPC show. I placed dead last and then this next show the show that I did last. I actually won first place and three out of the four divisions and got my Pro card twice.
I got to Pro cards out of that show one. Our masters open bodybuilding and then 14 just open bodybuilding regardless of the age and that was to the encouragement of my wife because we were driving home from Indianapolis to Cleveland. She just said you absolutely not giving up. You've worked way too hard. You look way too good, you're going to do another show, but you're going to do a test it show. So you're at a Level Playing Field with the other athletes.
I was ready to just hang it up for that year and you know, get into the offseason. Or the bulking phase, but to her encouragement, and thank God for for this beautiful woman. I competed again and really one of the culminating moments of my bodybuilding career. So far, is going from a person with that, you know, 44-inch waist down to a guy that was 28-inch waist for the first time since I was a teenager and winning. Not just one but two pro cards in one show. It was just euphoric.
Yeah. No, I mean you look you look amazing, man. And I feel like, you know, competing a bunt against a bunch of untested athletes, when you are a natural athlete, is is no joke. I mean, it's I've competed in tested shows of competing on test. It shows, there's like a totally different vibe, totally different camaraderie. It's like totally different sport, honestly. Yes, but, you know, hats off to you for for doing both, if you
are. Natural. And I always recommend people that are listening, like, if you are natural, you know, give yourself the benefit out to compete against other people that are natural as well. I just prefer the vibe. Honestly. I feel like I don't want to be too cliché here. But I feel like there's a lot of that is a clicks and stuff that happened when you when you start going to a bunch of the the untested shows. And they're not all like this.
There's like a there's like a, an unhealthy level of competitiveness. Whereas it seems as though amongst most of the Natural. So that competed in there seems to be a lot more camaraderie. And just, you know, good-natured, you know, friendly competition backstage, amongst all the natural competitors. I noticed that too when I was doing the different shows and I get it. I mean, in the untested shows, especially in the bigger leagues. These folks are looking at.
This is probably going to be the way to make a career out of body building whereas and the natural. So And if you win the mr. Natural Olympia with the eye and be a, you're probably not going to make enough money to pay the bills. So this turns into a wouldn't say an expensive hobby. But this does turn into more of a lifestyle as opposed to a career. So I understand the level of competition with the untested athletes as opposed to the tested athletes.
And yeah, the camaraderie I've made some of them some of my greatest friends doing Doing this with this lifestyle and yeah, I wouldn't trade it for the world kind of percent ma'am. Let me ask you this. So a lot of people and this is true even in like the the ketogenic biohacking space.
Like when people I brought on several guests, the podcast that are hormone specialists and they often times point two, you know, once you reach a certain age, it's going to be advantageous to, you know, take some eggs on just hormones for both males and females simply doesn't perform at an elite level, not necessarily. It from a body breaks down but they're not. They're not making these recommendations from a professional bodybuilding
standpoint. They're just simply talking about improving overall vitality and Health and Longevity. So, when you hear that, you think of that, you hear all these recommendations for going, Exotics hormone round. Is that something that sways you at all? Or it kind of gets in the back of your mind, not even from a competitive bodybuilding standpoint, but just from a, from a overall health and well-being standpoint.
It did in the beginning. I was when I you know, you see it and you know it as well as I do that, you know, just even in the regular gym settings, you've got folks that have no desire to compete. There three or four times bigger than you and it's because they're, you know, they're using gear and so you're looking at your progress going, dang, I would do so much better if I just did this.
And so, you know, but I'd like I said, I made that vow to my wife and then I promised God, I wasn't going to do it and then as far as like, using it for Vitality purposes, if I had to, I might consider it, but I haven't had knock on wood. I haven't had any issues with, you know, things like
performance, male performance. If you will, I'm trying to keep this PG, but I haven't had any issues with that, except for maybe about four weeks out from a, you know, a contest where you're really Dialing in your Macros and you just barely have enough energy to hit the gym. So I thought you know, since I haven't had any of those problems that way, I haven't I just haven't felt the need. I mean, I believe that for the most part there's enough things that are natural that you can
use like going. Well, for example, just the kind of diet that you and I use. We're having enough healthy fats that were put in enough about as much testosterone. Can through our bodies. Plus, I'll I use tongkat Ali fiducia degress this and Boron to just help kind of absorb some of the free testosterone that's in my body. And so far mrs. From fatty daddy, bodybuilders been. Okay, so I don't feel the need to unknown a defy myself to go any further. And I think that that makes sense, man.
I feel like a lot of people that just seems to be in the in the Public's eye a lot right now. People are I mean like male hormone clinics are popping up at every street corner testing that's super easy to get a script for anything. I mean you can walk in, you could have a bad night's sleep. Have your testosterone tank because that bad night's sleep. Go to a doctor, have them run your lab, see that it's low because of that acute reason and they'll write your script unless
a lot of cases. I mean, it's kind of crazy how easy it is to get some of these prescriptions for Exotics hormones and some people know what they're doing in some people haven't a clue what they're doing and I feel like it's often times more. So Ladder people not having a clue what they're doing. Not understanding the long-term
repercussions. If they don't do it correctly, but I think you know, if your diet style then if your lifestyle thought and if your sleep styled and everything is optimized to the best of your ability in a sustainable way. I mean, you should be able to pretty well rock and roll with
what you've got naturally. And I feel like that's been my messaging from day one and also, as a natural body butter, I mean, you and I both know, the, the banned substance list is no joke, depending on what federation you're not. They won't allow anything. And, I mean, even things that aren't performance-enhancing at all. They still won't allow they. Just they, if there's even a question to it. They just won't allow it. So anything that's questionable like, on a back of a pill
bottle. I don't even, I don't even take it because I don't want to risk the, you know, not being allowed to compete in these Federation. So, I feel like if you're doing well, thus far naturally man, no sense to deviate from that, keep
rocking and rolling. Exactly, and I also think if I could kind of add to that, we live in a society is great as our country is, and how many opportunities are are, we live in a society where so many folks, want things now, and they're going to try to reason with themselves and their only fooling themselves by doing this, by the way, by saying, well, you know, it's trt, and it's by a doctor. So it's okay. No, it's still steroids, and I'm
not trying. Say that steroids in and of themselves up for bad because there are good medical uses for it. But it's so easy to just get a prescription for the stuff and tell yourself. This is what you're doing it for just because you want to fill out your T-shirt a little bit tighter than you would have if you were just doing the work without the extra staring without the extra performance enhancing use and we both know that whether you're taking gear or not.
It doesn't take away from the fact that you're working hard. There is no drug for hard to replace hard work. But if you telling yourself that your natural, then you need to be natural all the way. Don't just don't BS about it. Either be real about it or say no, I'm I'm gear. Yeah. 100% minute. I have no qualms whatsoever with people that take stuff, like, I don't care to each their own.
What I do care is if you are going to be misleading and say, hey, look, I'm natural, but you're taking a bunch of stuff. That's clearly. Not and especially if you're trying to compete against people that are natural like that. That's where I draw the line there.
I mean, to each their own, do whatever you want to do, would be honest about those decisions and at the end the day, like, if you are taking stuff and you were, you were taking, what would bring you up to a quote-unquote natural level, like a lot of people make that argument they say, hey, look, I'm on trt. I had low levels. I'm only taking enough to bring me up to what is naturally, you know, relevant for my age and Status Etc.
Cetera, but the caveat is when you do a prep as you and I both know your natural levels, declined quite a bit and I think doing a ketogenic diet minimizes that decline but it still declines, then the less. So if you are continuing to take anxiety hormones to a point that you're at quote-unquote natural levels in the context of a prep, your by definition going to have much higher levels than all the competitors that are truly natural and not taking it in exoticness lie, which is not
fair. Right. Exactly finish, you know, that's you just something. Sometimes you just got to deal with the the hand, you're dealt. And again, there's so many ways. I mean lifting heavy things and eating proper food is going to do so many great things for you that you just don't necessarily need those injections and your book. You said it perfectly. It's like the ketogenic diet and resistance training is probably one of the closest things if not, Seeing out there.
That's a fountain of youth. I'm 47 years old. I get mistaken for somebody in this in his 30s pretty much all the time. And I certainly don't mind it. Yeah, I mean you certainly don't look like you're 47 years old, you're doing something right? For sure. Thank you. Do you test your levels naturally? Just had a curious. Like, do you do it a baseline test before prep after prep? Just kind of see where you're at.
No, I just really let the mirror, tell me what I need to do. And you know, I'm the only Only Breadwinner in the house. So trying to justify the expense to find out where I'm at. And when I'm already spending enough money to get a spray tan and a speedo and everything else. I figured okay, I'll just kind of if something happens where I'm feeling like I might get law
then I'll go hit the doctors. But otherwise, I just kind of the scale the mirror and the judges I let that kind of decide what happens makes sense to me ma'am. Let's switch gears a little bit and talk nutrition. There's a lot of different ways. Skin a cat when it comes to getting dialed in. I mean, you can obviously get shoulder lean with a bunch of carbohydrates. You can get shoaling with the ketogenic diet. You can get shoaling with super high protein.
What have you done? That's worked really well for you. Okay. Well, of course, the definitely making sure my calories are in a deficit when I'm needing to lose the weight and making sure that they're a little bit higher. I do tend to win. I'm on offseason. If you will, although I hate that term, what I'm doing. My bulking season. I have tended to overdo it on the calorie sometimes, and that hate myself when I'm about getting back into prep mode, but
during prep. Well, during the whole time. I keep my cat, my protein at a higher level than the standard ketogenic diet. And I did learn this from, I know you said you and Rob good would have different protocols. I did learn this more. So out of from him. I keep my carbs relatively low, I would say at the highest 50 grams a day. I keep my fat where my fat in my protein calories are just about the same. I know that fat has nine calories per gram.
Protein has four. So what kind of keeping that in the same? The G might not be similar but the calories will be similar like kind of do that. I have used intermittent fasting in the past. I like it. It. But the problem is, is that I'm getting closer and closer to the prep and my calories are lower and lower. I am just too hungry to intermittent fast during that time frame. So, but I also can't do that spacing of just three hours per meal because I'm just hungry all day. I gone day.
So I've kind of done the for our thing because then I'm only feeling a little bit hungry for about an hour between meals as opposed to feeling hungry throughout the whole day. When I'm more in when my calories aren't really too, too low, I can enter minute fast and it doesn't bother me and I kind of go with the flow on a mat. It's like if I'm having a really busy day, and I know I'm not going to get a chance to eat.
It's not the end of the world. But thankfully, I've been working from home for a little bit now. So being able to, you know, I don't have to worry too much about meal prep as much as I can. Just go upstairs, throw my eggs and my egg whites in the pan to cook them. Up and maybe enjoy a couple slices of bacon and some Tim Hortons coffee and go to town. There you go. There you go. What's the the lowest your calories? Get going into the print o are going.
I asked let the very end of the proprietor. Yeah, right around the end of the prep last year. I was down to like 13:15 and it was miserable. But thankfully, it was just for about four weeks. But right now, yeah, right now I am a So I'm just shy of 11 weeks. I'm almost ten weeks out and I'm at just around 1840 calories right now. It's the pretty low you hungry right now know, and what I've kind of learned is I eat. Foods that will be bet.
I can eat more of and volume, but yet the calories aren't too bad like, say, for example, chicken like chicken chicken breasts and then some egg whites and protein powders. Things that still give me a good bang for my buck protein wise, but caloric wise aren't too too high and maybe one day out of that week. Most likely on Sunday after church, my wife and I go to lunch somewhere. I'm going to get that steak and eggs, and I'm going to enjoy it.
And even though I might get a little bit over my caloric stealing that one day. I already know that come Monday. When I'm destroying myself in the gym. I'm going to make up for those calories. I took in. Yeah. No, that makes sense. I always recommend having like a ketogenic caloric refeed there towards the end, make it sustainable, but also kind of give it a little boost. Yes, how low does your friend get? Like those last four weeks, when you're, like, the 1300 calories?
How low is your fat on that intake? Gosh, I'd have to go. Look what I want to say. It was probably around 50 grams last time right now. I'm at about 90 and then my protein is 220 and my carbs are 50 or less. And I don't really care about the. I mean, I don't really worry about hitting my carbohydrates. I mean, it's like if I say like today, I think I might have already only had about 15 grams of carbs. I don't intend on even hitting,
higher than that. I'm going to go over to my son's house later today, any of the filet mignon. So if my protein goes up a little bit higher or my fat goes a little bit higher but my carb stay low like, you know, under that ceiling that's fine by me. The carbs are for me. The carbs are more of this is as high as I'm going to allow myself to get to today. But if I go lower than more
power to me, yeah, totally. What about carbs during like peak week that you increase your carbs drove in or no, so, I only really started doing this, like, peak week was foreign to me in the twenty20 competitions because I just didn't know enough, and I wasn't about to risk anything by, you know, manipulating anything else. I figured I'm this is the packs. I'm going to bring so I did. Carb up on both shows, in fact, so, but I start introducing cards and not even go into high
like 100 grams tops sale. Say the show is on Saturday. I'll bring in the carbs on Wednesday on that Friday before a show. I might might have a potato on that evening for for dinner and that's it. On the day of the competition. Pretty much all caution to the wind. I have enjoyed the rice and that was a called The Rice Krispie treats. I had a couple of little bottles of red wine to make the veins pop out. I saw the guys in the backstage
just pounding down, honey. Like it was going out of style owes the weirdest thing I've ever seen. But yeah, I was doing that. I the first show with the rice krispie treats. I think I overdid it. The second one. I just I kept on have like maybe two or three. The I did do that and I don't honestly as even though I have my Pro card, I don't know enough to know if that was necessarily the greatest thing or not.
I got I won so maybe it works. But this next show when people eat comes up. I might change it up a little bit just to see where I'm at and go from there. Yeah, I'm a big, I mean, it's totally standard practice for most competitors to have like some type of carb up strategy during Peak Week in the day before do a depletion phase and then a, you know, super compensation phase. And I'm kind of like an outlier that I don't do that. I don't recommend that I don't introduce more carbs.
I definitely introduce more fats and proteins and more calories and tweak my electrolytes, but I don't ever really do any kind of crazy car UPS because I feel like you're kind of flirting with fire if you don't time it right? If you don't have the It amount your exponentially more likely to retain unnecessary fluid in the subcutaneous layer of skin and kind of wash out some of that definition. That doesn't mean it's guaranteed going to happen.
But you, you run that risk for sure, but honestly a lot of people that do that, what I find like to be the biggest downside is that it makes kind of raining in that intake post, show that much more challenging. I mean, did you find it was easier or hard to kind of return back to you know, healthy
eating? The show is over and you kind of go off the rails and a little bit of everything inside or a lot of bit off the rails off the rails to the point where Depression started setting in so September, what was the show for rain of fire with natural muscle Association? And after I won, I got home. I so I ate this. The listeners are going to get shocked and throw something at me if ever meet. And I ate I think a dozen king-size peanut butter cups right after the show got home.
Then we went out somewhere to eat. I think we had Mexican food. And normally when I've gone to Mexican food, which I love, I'll get the order the fajitas without the tortillas without the refried beans without the rice. Basically. The ketogenic part of it, right? But that day, I ate everything under the sun. Drink everything under the sun and I thought, okay. It's just going to be that one day. The next day. I woke up feeling like complete garbage.
And then when we went to, it was a Sunday. We went to church and then we were going out somewhere for wherever we were going to eat. I'm the only person in the house that is on a by wife maintain, you know, she keeps her car is relatively low, but I'm the only person in the house that keeps them as low as I do, and but I decided that day. We At this one restaurant that we frequent a lot.
I decided I was going to enjoy their pizza and I enjoyed 10, and then I know, I sure I had a couple beers and the next thing, you know, it was like at least one day a week. I was saying, oh, I'm just going to have a little bit of a refeed. Well, those refeeds turned into just eating, whatever the hell I wanted.
And then next thing, you know, I was down, I was at like 162 on the day of the show, and then I think I almost got up to 200 pounds before the new year and so that was the only in about a three month time frame as hard to believe that that would have been almost 30 pounds of fat because, you know, Grant a pound of fat is 3500 extra calories. I can't imagine. It was all of that, but I don't think it was all water retention
either. So, I started getting depressed because I wasn't seeing the muscular definition, and I was worried that I was going to go back to being that guy. With the 40-some odd inch waist with the high blood pressure and everything else. And so I just I had to I recently flip the switch and okay. Get back in gear because you you have you know, you you only got this one life. You're enjoying this sport. You still have plenty of gas in the tank.
Get back into the swing of things because, you know, it's only it's only Me who can do this. I have to be the person to get up and do what's right for my health and for the sport and to just enjoy the quality of life that I've been blessed to renew since finding the sport. Yeah, I think that's that's super important man. Like I'm I did the exact same thing after my first several shows when I was falling like a car based protocol and like I
got depressed. I developed a bunch of disordered eating Tendencies. I could just screwed my life up for years, honestly. And I don't like I don't want to group. Everybody doesn't inject that into one basket by any means, but I feel like a pretty good percentage of the people that follow a ketogenic diet do so because they don't do well with carbs. Maybe from a digestive standpoint.
I don't do well with cars but I think a lot of them don't do well with carbs from a psychological standpoint. They can't moderate it. They have an addictive tendency towards them. So for me, when I set out to do ketogenic by, Anybody. It was like look, I want to optimize, you know, my prep, my protocol, my reverse that everything in its totality from following a strict ketogenic approach. And if it hadn't contributed to my success in the first place, I don't want to bring it in
post-show. So for me like doing the whole car Buffs, I don't fight they make that big of a difference in the peeking. Anyways, so bad a table by being able to just totally negate them. It made it much easier. You for me to not be tempted by them. Post-show. And I feel like having the control over them from a psychological standpoint. There has just made the whole process much more sustainable for me personally.
Yeah, I have to agree with you there because I do have an extremely addictive personality of former smoker easily smoke two packs a day and then, you know, like the junk food, forget about it. I used my wall even though this isn't a junk-food. It was definitely, not something that you should eat in large quantities. If you had a jar of chunky peanut butter in front of me, I'm talking one of the big family size jars and bottles. Another bottle of gallon of milk next to me.
I was set for a good two hours and I would eat that whole down part. I'm sorry. I shouldn't because I would eat that whole jar within a day. And you know, those are the kind of things that I had to restrain had to take those things completely out of my life because it was one of those things where I just I knew I couldn't control those. I couldn't control that stuff in moderation, which of course, that's the phrase in America, everything in moderation, everything amount.
Duration, that's like saying you can do heroin in moderation. If it's something that's gonna make you do, you know just go off the rails. Why even bother moderating it, just don't do it. And I'd much rather, I'd much rather overeat on steak and eggs, then overeat on birthday cake. Because I know that the steak and eggs is going to, at least provide me nutrients. I need, whereas birthday cake is going to provide me with processed sugar, and I might as well just top that off with some
cocaine. Yeah. A sentiment. I feel like. I feel like what is often the main contributing factor for these binging purging Tendencies and just this depression and self. Guilt is the notion that you've done something wrong and should be punished for it. I guess is a bad word, but you know what I'm saying? So like when people go off the rails and they eat stuff that they know like you can't you can't in your right mind say but you're doing your body good by eating a bunch of, you know,
birthday. Okay, but you can feel good about eating steak and eggs, you know, so like if you don't have that guilt associated with eating steak and eggs, but you do with birthday cake, then that guilt is what becomes the Catalyst for making things even worse and having kind of like this downward spiral effect. So if you just totally negate that guilt aspect and only eat foods that you don't have to feel guilty for that helps the whole thing through and through.
And, I mean, yeah, you can definitely over eat steak and eggs depending on the goals and what not If you're trying to, you can over, eat anything, like caloric, Surplus is going to be a closer place, no matter where it comes from, but you're not going to be near as guilty from eating, you know, equal calories, and steak and eggs. You would be probably from eating whole bunch of birthday cake, right? And quite honestly, steak and eggs, just tastes so darn good,
no matter what. Anyway, so, I just, I could eat that every meal and not care. I love it. Yeah, totally man. Totally. Well, what, what's in the pipeline for? You mean like you get that show? You said your 10 weeks out current. So I guess they need to get their show in the pipeline. Right?
Yes. So the United States bodybuilding Federation has the kings and queens show in Akron, Ohio. So I'm going to do that with the natural muscle Association. I have to defend my Pro card and actually try to make some money to recoup some of the money. I've spent over the years, they have the mr. Cleveland, which will be in October, so Going to do that. I since have recently my passion for fitness and something I want
to iterate. If I make a lot of folks when they start to Endeavor and becoming a physical transformation, they really shy away from the idea of body building. When in actuality bodybuilding is exactly the thing one needs. It doesn't matter if you plan on getting up on stage with you. No, a bikini or Speedo and a spray tan or if you just want to look a lot better by definition.
You're a bodybuilder. If you're eating better to change your physical composition and you're lifting weights and doing any other form of like cardio or something like that. That's what a bodybuilder is. And so I've really made this a passion to help others because I have inspired others with my journey. I became certified as a bodybuilding specialist with is essay. And so I've become a trainer where I provide nutrition plans and workout plans, a combination of the both at desire for
iron.com. I also have my YouTube channel. I already had the channel before the website. So that's at from fatty to Natty bodybuilder on YouTube. And of course, Instagram from fatty to Natty bodybuilder. Is there. I've been I'm really enjoying this journey and helping other people and I'm going to keep doing this. I mean, I'm going to be that 80 year old guy getting up on stage, hitting the most muscular pose and destroying the 20 year, olds, right next to me.
No, man. That's, that's the goal. For sure. I mean, I've I'm more excited about how I look at 73 years old than how I look at 35 years old because you know, that's that's kind of like that. Anomaly that people like man and you can't look good at 73 years old. You can't look like you're worthy of stepping on stage, but I feel like if you And the right habits in place in the front end and you just keep doing that and that compounds over time you get your nutrition down.
Then you got your train down then there's literally no limit to what you can achieve. So you being 47 years old looking like you do, man. I mean, you're a perfect Testament to that. Thank you. I like to throw a shout out. Since you said something about someone in their 70s, a person who I've become great friends with, he's like a father, a brother and a great friend of me, Don Mannarino. We compete together, Batman.
I want you 71 years. Sold and there's I think there's some pictures of them of him and I competing together on my Instagram page. The guy is in phenomenal shape. And if you ever met him, you would think he might be in his 50s, but he certainly does not look like he's in a 70s. He's a grandfather, best shape of, you know, most men that and 30s. We wish they could be as a good a shape as this guy. So I'm telling you folks.
If you haven't already figured it out, natural bodybuilding is the Fountain of Youth 100% match. Just posted a picture of Robby Robinson on my newsletter this past week, and I think he's like 75 76 now or something like that. And I mean, you know what? He looks like. He looks phenomenal, right? And it's like I mean like that's and that's and that's another div. I don't know what his I'm sure
he's probably not natural. I probably didn't do near as much drugs as everybody else in that era did right? Because he looks as good as he does.
Now as old as he is, but I feel that there's a totally different look that comes with natural athletes versus those that Get massive, you know, in their earlier years, but did so with a bunch of gear like, it seems as though you're able to maintain that type of muscle density, as long as you're continually stimulate that muscle, as you age and stay on top of your nutrition. Like the look that you bring the table over the years seems to be a much better longer-lasting.
Look. Yes, for sure. And I mean, I don't know, there's, I just can't think of, I mean, I play music in a cover band. Here in the Cleveland, Ohio area. I, you know, I work, I do some of these other things and being a husband and a father is, of course, the most rewarding thing out there. But on an individual selfish level, I want to say selfish does like the mean way but Jill self just something for yourself.
I just can't think of too many things, more exhilarating than going into the gym, having a beautiful work out, putting that music on in your headphones and then going home, eating the proper things that are Going to get you to your goals. And then one of these days you're going to look in the mirror. You're not even going to recognize yourself because you're not that person that you
were two years ago. And you're no longer living with regret of wondering what you might have been able to do, you're doing it. Amen, to that, man. And you mentioned, you play in the band before we started recording. You brought the fact that that you just recently lost your bass players that, right. Yes. Correct, really good friend. Marc Brown. He passed away two weekends to go and he had a massive heart attack. I'm not exactly sure what contributed to it.
It could have just been an act of God, but one thing I learned from him and from his beautiful wife, Lynn is those to live their lives with Vigor every single day and I think that's something that the world needs. You live your life with a big bigger every single day and that's regardless of what your goals are. As much as I know, most of the
people is into this podcast. Their goals are probably going to be more along the lines of body building and of the day, you know, God doesn't give you a refund. If your life sucks. And if you live in America, you owe it to yourself because you have all the tools available to make the most out of your life. And so pursue those goals. Well, I don't care what they are.
Bodybuilding, of course, is one of my goals, but I learned that from Marc. That I'd only had him in my life for a very short time, but he touched it very deeply and that was one of the greatest lessons I learned from him. That really pushed me to go. Keep pursuing all the different goals. I have in my life before the wheels fall off. And I'm no longer here, just live every day with Vigor and loved life. You're given a menu that man. A hundred percent agree.
I mean, there's days that we wake up and we have bad days. Like that's just part of it happens to all of us and you can't change. JH that necessary because it's bound to happen. But if you start waking up and more often than not, you're having a bad day, you got to change something. You got to be the Catalyst for
growth there. You got to be the one that makes makes a move because nobody's going to care about your life, as much as you do. No One's Gonna care about your health as much as you do. So the ball is always in your court. No one is going to give you anything. The world isn't fair. You got to be the one to make make the change happen. So if you're not happy, if you're not waking up with a Zeal for life than And something wrong, right?
Right. Exactly. And I mean, there's people you know, I don't want to sound like, you know, it's America are nothing but we know that there's so many people that come to this country because of the opportunities that you can get here that you can't get anywhere else. And then you and I were lucky enough to from day one. Be a part of this nation and it's like, well, you know, and you're a testament to that. I, you know, I watched your story.
I mean, you used to work at a railroad and Here you are. Now, something that most people don't even have thought of a, basically, a brick made out of these different, you know, food items to become a, you know, food prep for a snack /, really tasty, dag on meal. And here, you are living a very full life. You have a beautiful wife.
You got a child on the way, you're the American dream and that's it's just one of those things that, you know, and American Dream, doesn't necessarily have to have a dollar sign to it. And in fact, it shouldn't at all, but it definitely should have a happiness signed to it. And that's no, no something I learned from Mark and that's something that I do now with the music with the bodybuilding spending beautiful time with my wife. It could be anything. We could be playing card games
together. We can be hiking together. We could just be watching a silly show on TV, but you know, I don't want to waste a single moment that I'll never get back if I'm not. Not chasing something that is fulfilling my life, either. By trying to do bring men and women closer to God or pursuing, some goals that I know are going to bring good about this world. It's not worth my time. I can't agree more men. I mean that is you said it perfectly. I can't top then some not even
going to try. You are you are doing. You're making waves man. You're inspiring people in ways. You don't even know. You inspire me kind of senior Journey unfold through Instagram over the past three years since I've known you. So, keep doing what you doing, brother. I appreciate you more than, you know, I appreciate the message. You're putting out there and I'm excited for what the future holds for you, man.
Thank you, and I thought, if I may say, so, your friendship has even though I know it's only been through virtual signal because Arkansas, and Cleveland Ohio, or Ted that far away for us to go out for a steak dinner, your friendship, and your advice, and everything that you've given me over the years, has definitely been one of the main contributing factors to meet. Changing my life around. And folks, if you're not given Rob some love and some support,
you're doing it wrong. He's a wealth of knowledge. He's a great man. And I really owe a lot of my physical well-being to you and my success in this career and my happiness through this endeavor, because of you and a few other folks out there, man. I certainly do appreciate that. But like I said, the beginning, you're the one is put into work, not me. So, hats off to you, brother. Keep doing what you're doing, and I Will I will spread the word about you as best? I can, man.
Thank you so much. Thank you Chris. There's everything you do for you. Just let me know. Brother. You got my, you got my contact info and keep in touch, man. Well, likewise, and if you're ever up in Cleveland, and you feel like working out with the Cleveland Oak, let me know. And definitely steak. Dinners on me, 100%, man. Likewise, if you're ever in, Arkansas. All right. See you bud. See you.