Well hello ladies and gents. Robert Sykes, Keto, savage.com. And today I've got special guest Doctor Gabrielle Lyon on the line. She likely needs no introduction, but we dive deep into the wonderful world of protein, amino acids, protein distribution, muscle preservation, muscle building and all things anti aging. She's got a new book that just recently came out called Forever Strong. So we talk about that, we talk
about all kinds of things. I've got no doubt that you will take something from this conversation. So that further delay, sit back, relax, take some notes on the podcast with Doctor Gabrielle Lyon and we are live Doctor Gabrielle Lyon, How are you today? I'm doing great. Thanks so much for having me. Hey, I'm excited to be chatting with you. So we've interacted at various conferences that we've spoken at
together. You are certainly leading the charge as it pertains to eating more protein, making sure that you're metabolically sound, especially in the the female demographic. I feel like we've needed a figure in that space for quite some time, so I'm glad to see you grab and laugh by the horns and just wrinkling then. Yeah, I couldn't agree with you more.
You know, when we go back and we think about the health and Wellness journey of our world, especially from Western society, there really is a huge dichotomy. The heavy weights, the eating steak is all for the guys and a woman should eat salad and do some cardio, maybe some cardio classes, grab a leotard, maybe a a bandana and get her done. But the reality is women need to be lifting and lifting heavy things and eating more protein, and nothing is going to help
their fertility. Nothing is going to help their body composition, their brain function. They're aging more than being physically strong. I completely agree. I don't know where that narrative started from because like maybe I'm biased, but when I look at females out in the space, I find it much more attractive if they're a sturdy is a good word.
I feel like if you're self-sufficient and able to be just capable, like if you're able to go pick up heavyweights, that is much more appealing to me than just simply walking on the treadmill. If you're able to eat a steak and not, you know, be shameful of the food you're eating as opposed to a picking out of salad, like, I don't know where this narrative to just eat very small amounts and only stick to cardio started, but I'm glad to see that it's shifting. Yeah, me too. Me too.
And it really it really, the time is right. And I think women particularly are just simply fed up. No pun intended, but fed up with the way things have gone. Completely agree. I want to get a little back story like you are. You've been in the space for quite some time. You've been like putting out content for years now. What was your catalyst for even getting in the health and nutrition space to begin with? Like, did you struggle from some type of some type of ailment in
your prior life? Like what was the initial catalyst? Yeah, I am a bit unusual because my training in nutritional sciences started when I was 17 and I never changed. I graduated high school early and I moved in with my godmother who was one of the original founding idea Pushers of Functional medicine, and she was the group before Mark Hyman, before functional medicine had a name, and her name is Liz Lipsky.
For those in the functional medicine space, she is the gut health person who really wrote one of the original books on health and gut healing, and that was called Digestive Wellness. I moved in with her when I was 17 and became fascinated with nutritional sciences. I really felt that that was the way of the future and that's how individuals could change the
trajectory of health and aging. And from there I went and I studied nutritional sciences, was so grateful to fall into the mentorship and the lab of Doctor Donald Lehman, who is, or the listener is really a pioneer. He's a world class scientist and a world leading expert in protein metabolism and protein nutrition. And he's mentored me over the last 20 years and I never changed. You know, I I never changed my perspective that food, nutrition
and fitness were key. I mean, there was a moment where I realized that it wasn't about fat and it really was about skeletal muscle. And that happened in my fellowship. So Fast forward through medical school, I did undergraduate nutritional sciences, and then I did a fellowship actually in nutritional sciences and geriatrics at Washington University, which is very a
prestigious institution. And I had this aha moment there that changed everything for me. I would imagine in working alongside geriatrics you like that that is just a frontline view as to what happens as you age if you lack lean tissue. And I'm glad to see the narrative shifting from people just focusing on losing body fat to actually building and
preserving lean tissue. Because if you are doing everything to optimize for that, the body fat becomes somewhat secondary, like it's just going to happen by default. Yeah, that that's absolutely right. And arguably that's what we've seen happen for the last 50 years. We've been hyper focused on obesity and with that focus we think about what one has to
lose. And if you're constantly focused on losing quote weight, we all know especially, I mean obviously you do this for a profession that when you go through crash diets and when you go through really intense pushes for weight loss, you invariably lose not just fat, but depending on the way in which you do it, you could lose 50% muscle mass. And that over time becomes devastating for people.
And that is what we have seen, especially with an aging population, because habits are very difficult to change. And when someone begins the Jenny Craig experience in their 30s or even in their 20s, they're likely to continue to repeat this every year. People are going on some kind of expansive or intensive weight loss experience. And over the years, it really does destroy metabolism.
Yeah, I I've been trying to shout that from the rooftops for years as a natural bodybuilder because I feel like the fat loss phase gets all the attention and people seldom talk about the importance of proper reverse dieting and coming out of those deficit periods. Not that there's anything wrong with the deficit if done healthfully and strategically, but there's a whole other side of the coin there.
And that is oftentimes unspoken. And if you are chronically restricting your intake, totally independent of the macro nutrient distribution of that intake. But if you are just simply not eating enough fuel, what that does to you from a hormonal standpoint, from a metabolic standpoint like that, does not bounce back instantaneously and people are digging themselves deeper and deeper into a hole.
Yeah. I think that you bring up a really great point and especially when you think about are people overconsuming or are they underconsuming and how do we determine which person is doing what. And really at the core of all of this from my perspective is you have to begin by looking at what kind of dietary protein and how much they're having. Of course you can't just, you know, ingest dietary protein and build muscle. You do need a very particular stimulus.
But from a foundational nutrition perspective, I love reverse dieting. I think it is very important. And then, you know, a second step to that, especially as we think about aging, is dietary. Protein becomes even more important. And it's actually the only macro nutrient whose needs change because an older population and an aging population has a decreased efficiency of protein utilization, not just from gut extraction but from this phenomenon called anabolic resistance.
And I think it's really fascinating that you're a natural bodybuilder because I I often think about how women fare or would fare within that because men don't necessarily have to have a decline in testosterone. And it's it's so it's fascinating to me, but women will all have a decline in hormonal status, but men not necessarily. It's really interesting.
So when it comes to fluctuations in hormones, as one ages there, I've had several people on the podcast that have talked about this and there it's kind of like the Wild West right now, like there's all these different hormone clinics that are popping up. Some are are well warranted and some are probably not. So much what What is your overview general stance on exogenous hormones for an aging female demographic as those natural fluctuations and
hormones change? Yes, I believe that hormone replacement therapy is of great benefit and really the the women's, the Women's Health Initiative has done hormone replacement a huge disservice. I mean this, this group of studies came out 20 some years ago and nobody critiqued it, nobody really examined the data or questioned it in a way where it really put a bad spin on hormone replacement therapy. From my perspective, I believe hormone replacement therapy is
extremely safe. And I think, yes, it is the Wild West right now. But in the next 10 years, I think that everybody is going to be on hormone replacement therapy. And in fact, you're probably going to go to your doctor, and if you're not on it, they're going to think that the doctor is way behind the times. Yeah, I I definitely think that is the way things are moving and obviously people need to get their own individual labs
checked. You're not going to make any blanket statements for the masses, but is there a demographic of females that would benefit from not necessarily jumping on HRT as they age? Or is it pretty much a unanimous, you know, if you're wanting to become optimal from both a health and longevity standpoint, that's going to be the route you take. I do. I I do believe that that is
going to be true. Certainly it is a woman's prerogative whether she chooses to go through hormone replacement therapy or menopause replacement therapy. I I think that we do see cardiovascular benefits, I think we see bone benefits, we certainly see muscle benefits and brain benefits is there. From my perspective, unless a woman has an active cancer that potentially is estrogen positive, then maybe that would not be ideal.
But again, you know, from a male perspective, there was a long time that individuals thought that testosterone replacement therapy caused prostate cancer. And in fact, they found that not to be true. And there are a handful of trials, especially now that are coming out that those individuals with prostate cancer actually do better on testosterone replacement therapy.
So I think that there's still a lot we don't know in terms of how positive it is. As you get more and more steeped in the research, would you recommend a specific modality for administering this exogenous hormone? Like is the bioidentical format typically the best? Is there like 1 medium that you've seen more success with than others, whether it be the the pellets or the injections or
the creams? I find that injections are best you can control it typically a sub Q injection more than once a day or more. Sorry. More than once a day, more than once a week seems to be the best for both men and women. And then for women. Some women do better with a cream of estradiol cream. Some women do better with a patch. It just certainly depends. And how often, always, always oral progesterone versus a cream because of the it's metabolized.
Yeah. Yeah, and how often should someone go and get their labs drawn to make sure that they're administering the right dosage as their body changes? Once you're once, you're stable every six months and prior to that stability. Every three months. Yeah, Yep. I want to kind of switch gears and talk about protein. I feel like you probably get asked about protein non-stop. You're probably tired of hearing the same questions, but you just have a book come out that talks
largely about protein. So I feel like it's relevant. Yes, Forever strong first book of its kind. Yeah, I'm excited to read it. When it comes to protein, there's a lot of misconceptions around the type, the quality,
the quantity, all the above. A general rule of thumb for protein consumption that I've seen tossed around that's been in the the bodybuilding space for forever and it's probably pre applicable to the general public, is if you are targeting about 1g of protein per pound of lean mass as a minimum you're pretty well safe. From a muscle degradation standpoint. That should be a pretty good
baseline, Would you agree? Well, the I think I would need some clarification because what how would we define lean mass If we don't it's challenging because we don't directly measure it. A DEXA is somewhat of an extrapolation. So how I mean I would say ideal body weight. I I don't go off of lean mass because I don't think that we the data would suggest that we don't have a direct way in which in which we're measuring it accurately and most people don't know their lean mass.
So that would be my clarifying question. So when you're looking at protein recommendations and you, you typically do 1g per pound of ideal weight. Yes, because most individuals don't know their lean body mass or their skeletal muscle mass. They just, they don't. And we have found that over the years, over the last two decades to be really effective for ideal body weight.
And then of course an individual will say, well, I don't know what my ideal body weight is. And I would say that the last time they felt amazing. And again, it's it's all about what is the goal that one would want to target. And then you mentioned that as one ages that protein requirement shifts as well. What does that look like? Do you change that recommendation as that person ages or how do you kind of navigate? Those well, we could first think about what is the current
protein recommendation. And the current recommendation is .8g per kilogram of body weight or 0.37g per pound of body weight. That is the minimum requirement to prevent deficiencies. These numbers this is the RDA. These numbers have not changed easily since the 80s and is based also on high quality proteins. For example, the .8g or .37g per pound is not based on plant based proteins, so that's something to understand. And these were nitrogen balance studies.
Nitrogen balance studies are, or was a way of collecting information and studying animals that allowed them to grow with the lowest amount of protein and still get growth and the cheapest way to do it. So it was the highest amount of carbohydrates, lowest amount of protein to to still support growth. That was originally where it came from. And then 18 year old they were largely soldiers. 18 year old men were evaluated and those individuals were found to have .8g per kilogram of a need to
prevent deficiencies. And this leads us to two questions. Number one, what kind of health outcome is a nitrogen balance and we don't look at nitrogen balance as a health outcome. And then #2, how is a young 18 year old active male really going to represent women in menopause, older women, older gentlemen, men in their 40s, etcetera. So the the baseline recommendations have been determined to be quite low, especially to support healthy aging.
And if you look at some of the position statements like the proteage paper, then you'll see that 1.2 to 1.6g of protein per kilogram, Those individuals do much better from a muscle mass perspective, from a body composition perspective, from a blood glucose regulation, triglycerides, insulin and fat loss. So we have to think what is a optimal protein diet and an optimal protein diet is double
the RDA. And when you implement that, we do see you know the the evidence supports that those people always do better the difference between .8g to 1.2 to 1.6 people always fare better. I think I I'm in total agreement with you. I I'm pretty heavy-handed on the protein. I also consume quite a bit of dietary fat and overall calories with my training load. But I feel like so many people, women especially, have for whatever reason a very hard time getting adequate protein in.
I don't know if it's because they are just simply not consuming enough overall calories at their metabolic rate and hunger signaling is down regulated, but so many people struggle with just simply getting 80 grams of protein in a day. Do you have any recommendations for that demographic? Yeah, I mean you're absolutely right. So the the data would support that. The protein intake is around 68G for women, maybe around 100 grams for men.
Shakes are wonderful. You know, it is challenging for women, it seems like specifically to get in more protein. This is where structure comes in and sparking your metabolism. Not having chaotic eating and throwing in an extra protein shake could be very valuable. Preferably A whey based protein shake. Yes, for sure. But I also think that they now have animal based you know, Mark Bell made a great steak and shake. I think that there's other ways for individuals who can't tolerate whey.
Yeah, the steak shake's great. We put that in one of our keto brick flavors. It's. Probably amazing. What do you guys usually recommend? So I've got several different flavors we've got, we've got a brick that uses his steak shake for the organ blend. We have some that use whey protein concentrate, that's grass finished whey. And we do have some that have a plant protein. But on the plant protein ones we use one that has both pre P protein and rice protein concentrate.
So you get the full amino acid spectrum. Yep, and that's certainly a way to do it. Now, I'd love to kind of pick your brain when it comes to protein distribution, because there's a lot of people in the low carb keto space that are doing like an OMAD approach. And there's pros and cons to that depending on what the goals are, what, what is sustainable, what your daily routine looks like from a muscle protein synthesis standpoint.
If the goal is to build and preserve muscle, there's certainly a benefit to having more than one meal that contains adequate protein throughout the day. When people come to me and they ask if I'm consuming ample protein throughout the day, but it's coming in one sitting, am I doing myself a disservice there? What would you say in that regard? Absolutely. And really this came out of, if you look at some of the earlier studies by Arnell in the 90s and again this was in elderly women.
But they looked at what's called protein pulse feeding where they looked at a distribution. For example, they fed women close to the RDA which was low 64 grams of protein in either a spread pattern which was small meals of 20 grams or less or at least one meal with 50 grams of protein.
And then they showed that the pulse pattern which more than one meal of 50 grams, so it had 50 grams and then an additional meal those individuals had a greater 24 hour protein balance and they were able to maintain greater fat free mass. And this was really one of the first studies that highlighted that adjusting dosing per meal while was important even while macro nutrients were the same, you know and that's one. And then from from there, it, sorry about that.
From there, it talked about how when you stimulate muscle protein synthesis at least more than once a day, you certainly have a better muscle response, particularly in aging. And there's multiple ways to stimulate muscle protein synthesis, like weight training for instance, also stimulates muscle proteins. Absolutely.
So if somebody was to go the route of an OMAD approach, if they're consuming ample protein in that one meal largely are ideally, you know, greater than the recommended daily allowance. And they're also training in a window of time that is a little bit separate from that. They're still getting those two muscle protein synthesis spikes. Yeah, yeah, I I do think, yes, training absolutely stimulates muscle protein synthesis.
I I definitely think that the literature would support more than one meal a day because from a muscle perspective, you Max out the muscle protein synthesis, the amino acid integration at around 55g. And when we think about muscle protein synthesis from a amino acid perspective, it's the incorporation, It's a biomarker of muscular health. It's what we believe over time to be a mechanism that helps with lean mass retention, muscle protein synthesis in terms of
hypertrophy over time. Again, it's not a direct measure, but when you incorporate these amino acids one time a day, you have a lower 24 hour muscle protein synthetic response. So in an ideal world, if you and I actually wrote about this in my book, I did 3 tracks. I did one track for hypertrophy, which was 4 meals, 4 meals a day of hitting at least 50 grams of protein. Arguably, if you're a a woman, you might not need that much.
There's ways to adjust that. But if you're really thinking about longevity, then two meals a day of at least 50 grams of protein will certainly protect muscle mass in a more robust way. Yeah, it's interesting. Like when I'm in a building phase, I'm consuming north of 3500 calories. So for me in that state, I don't find it pleasant to consume all of that in one sitting. So I'll typically break that into two or three meals by
default. When I'm in a cutting phase, I find it more psychologically sustainable to have one large meal that I actually say to me, as opposed to multiple smaller meals that always leave me wanting more. So I'll do the OMET approach in the deficit, which again is not trying to prioritize muscle growth more so me just trying to make being in a deficit as sustainable as possible.
But in that context, if I separate the training from the meal and then maybe supplement with some leucine or amino acids intermittently in between, that would likely be the best way to mitigate any adverse response there. I don't know if separate I, you know, I think it's an interesting in perspective. I I certainly would never recommend supplementing with leucine alone because when you supplement with leucine alone you create somewhat of an imbalance of isoleucine and valine.
So there's leucine, isoleucine and valine, and leucine alone would not be something I would supplement. But where there could be some benefit is an essential amino acid mix where you have all of the amino acids and then your body will make the remainder. That could certainly help offset any kind of degradation or potentially allowing you to mitigate those aspects. Totally out of curiosity, what is a typical day of eating and training frequency look like for
you? Like how do you structure your routine to optimize muscle protein synthesis and just go throughout your day-to-day? Yeah, I train first thing in the morning. I train first thing in the morning and then I'll have some kind of protein. I do train fast it I haven't today because I've been kind of rushing around with you know I've had two very little kids so been rushing around this morning but I will eat, you know I might eat two to three times a day and I will obviously always
prioritize protein. The and it might be actually low fat Greek yogurt with some berries post training. It could be and it doesn't have to be post training Again, the more active you are, the less it matters when you're getting that protein in. I will also have some lean steak. I love Piedmontese, We eat them all the time and I'll have some greens. I love Shishado Peppers but I have around 100 to 110 grams of protein a day. I'm a very small person.
For me that's around 1g per pound, ideal body weight, and then actually I'm more carbohydrate heavy. I just seem to be a really fast burner. So I'll have that equal amount of carbohydrates but not quite as much fat. I seem to just not do very well on FAT. Any idea what your total caloric can take? Averages out on a daily basis. Probably around 15 to 2000 calories, 15102 thousand calories. And you feel pretty satiated and fuelled with that. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I I have to actually force
myself to eat. I probably do better and perform much better if I can get food down. Have you been? Are you? Like, you know, so it's interesting. I some people live to eat and some people eat because they just have to. I am one of those people that I do not care about food at all. I'm so uninterested in terms of it doesn't really have to taste good. I mean, listen, in my book I made everything taste good and it really is well designed and well done.
But for me, I'm not a I'm not a foodie, I'd say that. Yeah, I am, definitely. Whether or not I'm a foodie is totally dependent on whether or not I'm in a cut or building phase. If I'm at a surplus, then I could think less about food. Like, it just is what it is, you know, part of the day when I'm in a deficit, it's like, OK, I'm definitely thinking about that next meal because I'm getting hungry for sure. When it comes to weight training, especially in the aging female demographic, I've
got to give shout out to my mom. I've been trying to get her to adopt A keto low carb diet for forever now and she's finally doing that and she's killing it with it. And she's eating ample protein. She's up to 2000 calories a day. She weighs about 100 and 10115 lbs, So getting ample nutrition in there and she's recently started weight training, which
I'm also super proud of her for. But I feel like a lot of women that are in the aging demographic have this resistance to weight train if they weren't brought up doing that. So how do you kind of structure the conversation around teaching them the benefits of, hey, look, you're not going to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger in two weeks. How is this going to benefit you from a longevity standpoint? Like what does that conversation look like?
I mean, one thing that we have to think is how do they want to age? People can appreciate, like you said, you can sit in the you get to sit in the front row of aging. You get to see how your parents age and that is typically striking enough to make people pivot. And understanding that it's it's really critical to re evaluate how you go forward and you have to understand that muscle is like your body armor and you have to put in the effort now before it becomes a liability
later. You pull, you put in the effort. You know skeletal muscle is metabolic currency, It's your health currency. It cannot be bought, it cannot be sold, it cannot be bargained for. It has to be earned. You have to build strong muscle because it's not that you want to train to get better at exercising, you want to train because you want to become more
functional. You want to be able to go on a flight and put your suitcase up. You want to be able to get out of your car, get off the toilet, get off the ground, pair your groceries. If you fail to train for everyday life, you will lose the capacity to do these things.
Totally agree. A lot of people that are older feel that it is nearly impossible to build more lean tissue at that stage because they just simply haven't been doing it. As their hormones change, as they age, as their ability to synthesize muscle protein shifts, what what does the research show in their ability to build more lean tissue if they are consuming ample nutrition, ample protein, and providing ample stimuli through
that training load? That women, that men and women easily at 75 years old, there's data to support that they will build muscle so it's never too late. It is never too it is never too late, which is is incredible that 7585 years old that they can improve strength and hypertrophy regardless of the age. Yeah, I was hoping you'd say that. I totally agree. Talk to me about your book. What was the what was the motivation for writing this book? How is this different than any
other books out there? Just kind of give me some back story on the book. Yeah, I'd love to. People believe that we have an obesity epidemic. I don't think that we do. We do not have an obesity epidemic. What we have is a muscle crisis. We have a midlife muscle crisis. And when you think about all these diseases of aging, we think about that they're caused by obesity. But the cause, one of the primary causes of obesity and all of these metabolic diseases
is unhealthy skeletal muscle. And that's really the framework. And that's the beginning. And this book shatters every paradigm about thinking about obesity. It talks all about skeletal muscle health from a medical metabolic perspective that is easy for everybody to read, and it will shift the entire paradigm of thinking we don't
have an obesity epidemic. The the issue is the skeletal muscle that we have ends up over time when it is sedentary and fueled incorrectly, will end up looking like a marbled stake rather than a filet. This happens decades before someone becomes obese, decades before any of these issues happen. And this book. We know. When I wrote this book, there really was. There was two reasons why I
wrote this book. When I was in my fellowship doing geriatrics and nutritional sciences at Washoe, I fell in love with one of these participants, and she was a mom in her mid 50s. She'd had three kids. She'd cycled with the same 20 to 30 lbs her entire life. She did exactly what the medical community had told her to which was eat less and exercise more. And what ended up happening is I was looking at the interface between brain function and body composition. And so I imaged her brain.
This is part of the research I was doing, and her brain in her 50s looked like an Alzheimer's brain, looked like the beginning of an Alzheimer's brain. And it was so devastating, and I felt so deeply responsible that I failed her, the medical community had failed her, that the messaging had failed her, that I started obsessively thinking about it.
And I started to think about the patients I was seeing in the nursing home, the patients I was seeing in the dementia ward, the patients I was seeing in the hospital. And I realized that the one thing they had in common was not that they were over fat, it was that they were under muscle. And it wasn't that they had an obesity problem, it was that they had a muscle problem. And that is why I wrote the book, to protect the next generation, to protect this
generation. And I wrote the book or my mentor Doctor Donald Layman of 20 years who you know again as one of the world leading protein and muscle experts, has taken me under his wing and taught me. And so the book is dedicated to him and I wanted to take all the bench side research, put it in an evidence based, easy to read layman book.
I love it. I'm certainly excited to read it for people that want to kind of have a proxy like some people need like an eye opening moment that brings clarity to their life and the fact that hey, look, this is not the ideal lifestyle. This is not people even realize how sick they are because it's just become a chronic situation. They just accept that as the norm.
What is a good proxy for people that are listening to just be objective in whether or not they need to take more of a priority to building and preserving lean tissue? Like, is it an MRI scan? Is it just simply being objective on how you feel and function throughout the day? Like, what do you recommend for people that are not so much in the health and nutrition space, but just the everyday person to just have a an awakening moment of like, hey, this is the
reality of the situation. This is what your body is telling you. This is what needs to be done about it. Yeah, there's really two ways I look at that physical strength. Are you physically strong? How many push ups can you do? How many sit ups can you do? How many or not sit ups? You know, it can be push ups. It can be squats. How long can you hang on a bar for? What is your deadlift or how much are you moving if you're not someone who is in the the
gym lifting free weights? How much are you moving on the machine? How strong are you? You know how strong you are. Are you happy with that strength? What is your strength going to look like in five years if you continue the habits that you're doing and then Fast forward to What does your blood work like look like? What is your insulin? What is your glucose? Show me those markers. What is your triglycerides? What is your APOB? Show me your fasting sugar. Show me your hemoglobin A1C.
All of these are markers of skeletal muscle health. Then yes, right now we have access to a DEXA. Eventually we'll have something available called a deuterated creatine AD 3 creatine study. We don't have that yet. AMRI is not financially feasible for many people. So the DEXA is the best that we're going to have. So go ahead and use that. You can use an in body scale and you track it, use the same thing, same hydration, same
time. And that's how I would look at it. I would look at the strength, I would look at the markers and then I would look at the objective physical body composition aspects. Totally. What is your recommended minimal viable dose or most bang for your buck approach to training in that demographic that is just simply trying to get healthy? Is it like a basic simple compound movements, variable resistance training using something like the the X3 bar and bands? I know you recently had him on
the podcast like how? How would you structure that for some of us getting into this? Well, one it that is, it really just depends on where the person is. I think that we have to think about how do we train to get better at life. And again, it it fully depends. In an ideal world if someone had been training, I would really like to add in some kind of high intensity interval training. That doesn't mean doing sprints. It could be an Airdyne bike.
It could be something very safe, something that really challenges that cardiovascular system, that really challenges that full body capacity, that anaerobic system. So I do think that there is a huge benefit to that type stuff. There's huge benefit. And then also having some kind of heavyweight, whether it is kettle bells, whether it is again a squat, again, it really depends on the person. But three days? A week of heavy resistance training?
Again, if someone is older, they can do lighter weights and more reps having one kind of high intensity interval session again, it could be 10 minutes. And you know the the next thing that I would think about is kettle bells, carries those kinds of things. Yeah, functional type movements. Yeah. Yeah, I was, I was diving into some research and it looks like, you know, you've got the hypertrophy, you've got the strength component, you've got
the cardiovascular conditioning. But of all of those, explosivity is one of the first things that we lose as we aid to doing movements that really focus on the explosive nature and the range of motion. So like something as simple as, you know box jumps, which may not be feasible for people right now, but something they could work towards. But just simply working on the explosive factor is one of the things that you really want to privatize as you age 'cause that's the 1st to go. Yes.
And also, I love that you said that. What about being able to have some kind of plyometric landing in terms of if they fall? Yeah, totally. Push up very much agree A. 100% I want to kind of shift the conversation and talk a little bit about mindset and psychology. Like for you personally, do you feel that you are doing your calling in life? Like is this fulfilling your purpose? It seems as though that's the case, but I'm. Curious as to like. How you know that to be the case
and how you? Know. Oh my gosh, are you kidding? I was uniquely positioned and groomed for this. What are the chances that I graduate high school early and my godmother is one of the founders of functional medicine? What are the chances of that? Then I decide I'm going to study nutritional sciences and I land in the lab of one of the world leading experts who made the discovery that we all stand on today about protein distribution and recommendations. What are the chances of that?
I mean, that's extraordinarily unusual. That then trained and mentored me, who continues to mentor me over 20 years later. And not only that, it is an obsession for me. It is not it. I I love reading about it. I'm going to tell you something that I don't think I've ever seen on a podcast. I love reading about amino acids. That's pretty nerdy. I. I love reading about the way in which amino acids work, the way
in which protein works. It is, I mean, so fascinating and the desire to share that it feels like it's a responsibility. So do I believe that I am living my purpose? There is no one else that is uniquely positioned that has had the mentorship that I've had or the education right. The education is incredibly unique that I have been given. And the other last piece is it's not about me, it truly is about the message.
It is not about the messenger because I I think that that always keeps me humble and my husband who is a former Navy SEAL is a very service oriented servant leader and I it is the way that we operate as a unit and our belief of what we put out into the world. I think that last component is key because I I resonate with everything you just said.
I feel like I am most certainly doing my calling in life and I'm uniquely positioned to do so. And for people like you and I that have that degree of certainty and confidence that we are waking up with purpose and intentionality, it makes going through the day-to-day struggles somewhat effortless because you know what the bigger purpose is. But knowing that you're doing it for others and that you are just a messenger is key. Adding more value than you take is paramount.
I feel like if you were to do all this selfishly or if I was to do all this selfishly, they would not be the foundational base that needs to exist in order to sustain the day-to-day. But for people that have not yet found that calling, they don't
know their purpose. I think simply from a health standpoint, recognizing that they can be a better service to others, enrich the quality of life of those around them, have more quality time with their friends, with their children, with their grandchildren, as their age. Like if you have that as the motivating factor as to why you should prioritize your health, ample protein consumption,
resistance training. It makes the struggle of getting up and going to the gym or putting the right food on your plate so much more easy. Yeah, you know, and certainly also having community. Yeah. And having people that hold you to a higher standard, you know, in our house, and what we talk about a lot is that you don't set goals. You set standards for the way in
which you execute your life. You set standards for what you believe, what you will tolerate, what you believe are the right things to do. And when you set standards for a way of operating, then you rely on your standards over your feelings. You rely on your standards over your discipline. You rely on your standards over your flexibility and that allows you to move forward.
I agree. I feel like we live in a society that values moderation and flexibility and balance, and I've always said that balance is bullshit. Like I I like having non negotiables in life that you don't ever deviate from. And if you structure those in a way that propel the overall trajectory forward, you're not likely going to deviate. And while you may not make substantial progress on the day-to-day, you are still making
progress. And that, compounded over time, is what leads to a truly successful in fulfilling life. Wonderful. I totally agree with that. Out of curiosity, you said you have two kids. How old are they? Three and almost so Three, almost 3 and 4 1/2. OK, so this is a somewhat selfish question because I have a year and a half year old as
well. Or now and anytime I bring some on the podcast that has children and they know the importance of eating quality food and that's the kind of food they bring to their home. How do you navigate the waters of what they're eating outside the home when you don't have control of the groceries? Like how do you kind of structure that? Yeah, it's really challenging. I try to minimize any kind of drama, you know, it's it's just very challenging. We teach them what is healthy.
We teach them what is unhealthy, but we want to make it so if they go to a birthday party, they're not the weird kid that can't have something. So again we say, oh wow, do you think that that's a healthy choice or this? But we we certainly don't restrict and we also don't have junk in the house. Yeah, I think that's key. Like finding a you know, what you provide for their environment within the home is totally up to you. But then as they go out into the world, you can't rule them with
an iron fist. The rest of life they're just going to rebel and no one wins. Right, totally agree. Well, I know you're short on time. You got a busy schedule, but I am super grateful for your time for this podcast and I'm incredibly excited about your book. I do love the Paradigm Shifters. I do love those that go against the grain. It's it's live now, right? People can. Yeah, so they can get it on Amazon. It's called Forever Strong. It was an instant New York Time
bestseller. It outsold Atomic Habits, and it outsold Arnold Schwarzenegger's book in his first week. Very cool, very cool. And where do people go to find out more about you independent of the book? They can go to my Instagram or my website Doctor Gabrielle Lyon. I have a great podcast as well. We have a YouTube with a great newsletter that gives tons of free information they can and also when does this come out actually? Just a few weeks. I'm not super ahead on my podcast.
Oh wonderful. I have a summit in Austin, January 13th and 14th, and it's a forever strong summit. Love to have you there and it's going to be incredible. Awesome. I will certainly see if I can make it. Are you going to the Metabolic Health summit? I will not be able to go this time. All right. Well, hopefully I'll see you in Austin then. Yes, we'd love to have you so you can message me separately and I I would love to get you a ticket to that.
Sounds great. Well, Doctor Gabriel Line, I certainly appreciate the time. I appreciate all you're doing for the space and for the health of just everybody out there. So keep fighting the fight, keep doing what you're doing. And if there's everything I can do to help, by all means, just let me know. Thank you so much. Thank you my friend. Take care. Have a good one. OK. Bye.