Now one of your pudding. I got a string going on here, something just because my dog. Something killed your dog, my dog. We're flying through the air over the tree. I don't know how it did it, Okay, Damn, I'm really confused. All I saw was my dog coming over the fence and he was dead. And once you hit the ground like, I didn't see any cars. All I saw was my dog coming over the fence. Sat, what are you putting? We got some wonder or
something crawling around out here? Did you see what it was or was it was? Standing enough. I'm out here looking through the window now and I don't see anything. I don't want to go outside. Jesus quice, you better hello, get somebody out here when I'm out there. I thought of a bitch of about sixty for nine. I don't know. Easy ann out there. Yeah, I'm working right. Hey. I want to welcome my guest to the show. It is Scott and Hannah. They're traveling right now,
but originally from Oregon. I want to welcome you both to the show. Thanks so much for being here. Hey, thank you Brian for having us our pleasure. I am glad to have you guys. Let's get right into it. Let's talk about this one at a time, Scott, I guess you could take this question first if you want. What got you interested in the bigfoot subject to begin with. I grew up in the Pacific Northwest and specifically the Blue Mountains of eastern Oregon, and bigfoot lore was always a
big thing up there. And when I was little, I remember seeing the Patterson Gimblin film as a newsreel before a movie. They used to do that back in the day. They used to run these little newsreels. This is back in the early seventies. So I saw that bigfoot walking across the screen there, I'm like, wow, that is so cool, and it was always in the back of my mind. But what really got me into it is later on in life. I became an anthropologist and my expertise is in
Native American culture. So I was working with a lot of tribal members and I came across a pictograph that I didn't know. That's what I used to do is read pittographs. That was my specialty. And I asked a Native American elder what this was and he said, in his language, jay Ali, which was met Harryman, and this is from the Mewalk tribe in California, and I said, hairy man, and I go, you mean Bigfoot And he looked at me and he goes yes, and I said they exist.
And then he give me a glance like I'm stupid, and then turned around and walk the way. So that's what really got me into it. From then on, during my career as an anthropologists working with different tribes, I always ask him about pigpoot legends and stuff after that, and I figured, if there's this much history with the tribe, they've got to be something here. After I retired from doing the anthropology stuff, I jumped right into
the Bigfoot research. Awesome, what about you, Hannah, It's so interesting. We were talking a little bit about it off the air. I've said it to Kathy and Bob's train. I've had them on the show independent of one another, and it always fascinates me, and I've said it to Bob and Kathy. How great I think it is that people who are in a relationship, no matter what that is, as far as a life partner,
whatever the partnership is, to have that shared interest. Because most of us in the Bigfoot community don't have that right we get looked at like we're crazy. Our wives or our husbands look at us like we've got four heads if you talk about bigfoot. So I think it's so cool that you guys are a couple and you have this shared an interest. Hannah, what was it that got you interested in the subject to begin with? Twenty one years of
marriage to him. I didn't even see Harry and the Hendersons until long after we were married. I had no not only no interests, they had no knowledge of the subject at all. Bigfoot never was a part of my life ever. Growing up. I was very much a city girl and I had my own career path and interests that had nothing to do with being out in the forest or hiking through the mountains or anything like that. So this is a later in life interest for me. But when he shares his encounter,
he'll go into this a little bit more. But it was when he shared with me not just his photograph, his digital photograph, but the fact that there was an empty frame before it and an empty frame after it, and then this in the middle, it was like, oh, okay, and that's where I first started. Maybe he doesn't have for him, I don't know. I still give him that foreheaded look from time to time, but not about Bigfoot. So that's where I started, at least giving credence to
the idea. And I think where I really started to buy in was when we started traveling and the events that led up to that. By that point in my life, I said, let's just do it. Let's go make this work. Let's make your passion our thing, and just go do it. And it's grown over the years, and since that time, my own not fight encounters have just solidified that for me. Oh and here's something funny
anadote. She grew up in Yakima, Washington. She lived across the street from a guy named Roger Patterson. Roger Patterson, and she didn't know anything about Bigfoot. She literally lived across the street from him. With that said, I lived across the street from his property and I was like nine. My opinion about that has grown over the years the more people that I've interviewed. I now think everything in some ways are connected, and I don't think
that is something to be taken lightly. I think that there was a reason that you lived where you lived when you were nine years old. So let's talk a little bit about Scott. You had that conversation with this Native American and he gave you the nod that bigfoot was real. Is that what spurred you into getting into the research part of this or was it the experience that really led you down the path to really start researching and getting into the subject.
Actually it was finding that pictograph. Not only did the elder tell me what it was, but after seeing that pictograph, I started looking into other pictographs I've found. And that's what really spurred my interest in the bigfoot thing, is because wait, I've got documentation here that that's a thousand years old.
I've got here's a story of a bigfoot. And so I started looking into all the other pictographs and stuff that I had researched, And of course there's that famous one in California, the one that's on the cover Kathy Strain's book. So I saw that, and then I saw the detailed drawing of it, and I noticed something on there that I don't think anybody had talked
about. Is down in the bottom of the corner. And this is one of the things I talked about it when I do talks at squash fistles and things, is there's two symbols in the bottom of that that are at levels the Native Americans quit using at lettls fifteen hundred to two thousand years ago, So does that make that pictograph two thousand years old? So that's what kind of got me into it. I said, So this didn't start in nineteen
sixty seven or nineteen fifty six with Jerry Krew. This started thousands of years ago, so they've been here for a while. So that's what really intrigued me, is the history. So then I started doing more research into the footprint casts and the morphology of the foot and all that other stuff, because we had to learn that in anthropology school too, So that's when I started
really diving into it. So I've been actually doing it for twenty five years, but because I worked for universities and we did archaeological digs, and I couldn't really just hey, I'm looking for Bigfoot because funding would go away or the university professor would look at me funny and say, you're not going to work here much longer. I had to keep it down low until five years ago I came out of the Bigfoot closet. But I had been gathering stuff
for about twenty five years. So that's what really got me into it was just the history. Let's talk a little bit about that history before we get into your encounter and your experiences. I just finished a book and I did an entire chapter on the Native American relationship with Bigfoot, the history, the lore, not just lore, but the passing on of their experiences with these things. It's fascinated me since day one. I think that's one of the
things that draws a lot of people that are interested in this subject. Is there anything that stuck out to you through the course of your twenty five years of looking into the Native American connection to these things, outside of maybe the pictographs and other things. Is there anything that has surprised you or really stuck out to you as something that more people should maybe and be taking a look at as far as what the Native American connection to Bigfoot or Sasquatch may mean
for the rest of us who are looking into it in present day. One other thing that's really struck me is the names for these things in their languages and the relationship the tribes have had with them. Some tribes, I meant, the Gibbewah actually have a treaty with them. Bigfoot told the Ajibewah that if they traded with a white man, I'm going to go into the mountains and never be seen again. And so they traded with a white man.
So what happened. Some of this lure is just fantastic, But when you get into the names that they call them, it's interesting because a lot of the translations of the names is harry man, benevolent brother, spirit being for his friend, things like that. Then you get into wendigo, cannibal monster, there's one gosh you can't bring to mine real quick the native word for
it, but it was like kidnapper basically. So it was really interesting to me the relationships that some tribes have really good relationships and some tribes don't. And I was always interested in trying to figure out why. But most of the ones that have the scary names for these are the southern tribes, so I guess the Bigfoot in the South ormeanor. But that's one of the interesting things when you get into the history and the war, is the relationship that
the tribes had with Bigfoot. It was really interesting. Gotcha, So let's move into your experience and your encounter with this thing. I want to hear all about that. So just take us back to where you were, what you were doing, and tell us what happened. Okay, five years ago, we started a website where people could submit reports in the Blue Mountains. It was interesting. I just threw up a Facebook page and said, Hey, if you've had an experience in the Blue Mountains, let me know.
And what was funny is our local newspaper guy was really into Bigfoot, so he came and did a story on me, and then it got in the newspaper, and then it ended up on the news wire, and then it crashed our website because so many people submitting reports all over the nation. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. But what had happened is after that had been up for a few months, I got five reports from five different people they didn't know each other, in the same area in the same week.
And I'm like, oh, guess where I need to be. You know, I started hanging out in that area, hiking that area. I did it every evening for about a week, and then I was going to go out one night to go pike the area. And the funny thing was is Hannah had a friend who her dad was having a birthday, and he had never been big foot. He always interested in big but he wanted to go out with me. So I had never met this guy before that day, so I threw him in the truck with me. We took him out
there, and lo and behold, we saw a bigfoot. The first day. He was in the woods looking for bigfoot. But I think that was that's why I saw a big because I had a newbie with me. Pretty sure, But no, what was happened When we were hiking a trail we came across the smell. Now I had heard stories of it. I had never experienced it in my life, but it is hard to explain. It's just bad and it's almost gag you bad. And once I smelled at it,
I was fairly certain we were on target. And so we're looking around. It's thick forest where we were at couldn't see anything. So I told him, let's hike down the trail a little bit and maybe it'll follow us. Or because it was drizzling a little bit, so I thought maybe it was muddy, little muddy road we were on. Of course, the smell
went away, so I just turned around. We went went back into the smell came back, so I just screamed off into the woods, probably the dumbest thing in the world to do, and I just wont they know unto the woods, and it mimicked me, almost exactly, made the same sound I made back at me. And that's when we was able to locate it. It was a couple hundred feet away a little opening in the trees. I saw this head rocking side to side looking at me. I had my
camera ready to go. I pulled up. I got one picture and we heard the whistle off in the woods and it turned walked away. So my experience was about three seconds worth of sighting. But I did get the typical blurry photo the bigfoot because my camera focused on the limbs in front of it, not where it was standing behind it. It was almost forty foot behind the tree. I did have a witness with me, and after that I spent three days in that area. I crawled down off the It was on
a real steep hill to get down there where it was standing. We found sixteen's footprints with nine ers footprints next to them, walking away from where it was standing, so I actually have the footprints of where it was standing. So I've got the blurry photograph, I got the footprints, no way to record the smell. But I witnessed with me and we measured everything shot lasers through trees. That's one of the thing working on archaeological dings my whole life,
and I know how to document stuff. So we got everything documented as intricately as possible. So I got the footprints. I figured out it was six foot tall where it was standing from the angle where my camera was. So that was my experience. Came home at one o'clock in the morning and
shook her away, that said, florry picture. Let's go back to end the moment when this is happening, because I've talked to so many people who have had very similar experiences and seeing these things for the first time, even if you're out looking for them, it's got to be one of those experiences that I don't even know what the rush would be like, because I've been in what I believe to be close proximity to these things up and Radium recently, and I tell you it was a very scary thing for me to do
a night hike and go out six eight hundred yards into the woods away from the campfire, away from base camp, surrounded by five other people, but it didn't matter. I was shaking uncontrollably. Adrenaline was pumping. Did you immediately know what you were looking at after the smell and then you saw this thing from this distance? Just describe a little bit about what you were feeling in that moment and what was going through your mind as a researcher saying,
holy shit, I'm finding what I've been looking for this whole time. Yeah, there was definitely a holy shit moment and my brain was telling me you need to slow down, you need to document this, put your science hat on, come on, dude, and the rest of my body was just shaken. It was like, no, I got to get this picture. And I can understand why people get blurry pictures of these things because it changes
your pull outlook on the world. Basically, in an instant, I was like, I am seeing what I've been looking for twenty five years and it's right there and I got to see it for three seconds. And my brain was telling me to slow down and document this, but my body wasn't going to do that. It was like I was just so excited. I wasn't
scared, which is weird. I was just excited. I almost ran off the hill to chase it, saying probably wouldn't have been a great idea, but if it hadn't been like almost straight up and down, it probably would have. It was different because I had been out there looking for a long time, and I grew up in the woods. We lived in a little cabin in the middle of the woods. I spent my whole life in there. The woods don't scare me. I've run across a bear face to face
and stuff, so I wasn't scared. I guess I meant. I've had other encounters later recently that I was like, we need to leave, But that actual sighting and seeing it turn and walk away from me, I think that was the helpful thing because it didn't stay there or bluff charge me or anything like that. It was like it left. So I'm like, Okay, it was more scared of me than I was of it, And but
I was. I don't know. It's like the whole gamut of emotions at the same time, just trying to focus and gather the evidence I could. But no, I wasn't actually scared, y'all. But Hannah, when this guy comes home, and he's waking you up frantically. At one o'clock in the morning, he showed picture what was going through your mind. Had you already accepted the fact that these things were real before he had this experience or
was that the final nail in the coffin for you? I think before that moment I was certainly open to the reality of it, because I had never had anything remotely concrete, and my whole life I've been you know what, there is far more mystery out there than there is concrete knowledge. And as soon as we know something for sure, we opened a whole lot of doors that we know nothing. So I was very open to the mystery of it. My first reaction was turned the damn light off. I've got to get
up at five am. I will look at this another time. But I think you stayed up all night looking at that. And I got up in the morning, got ready for work, and he had me come down to his setup and he had me look at the photos on the computer, and I was like, okay, so you just don't quite know where to go with that. And I want to make a disclaimer. I'm not a natural I don't have a lot of natural intelligence. I'm very intelligent, but not
as far as nature. That is always a learning skill for me. So even looking at the pictures, I didn't know where to look or what to look at, I say, so it took him some time to say, okay, look here, look at that, and then oh, is that a face? So I think the picture was the point where I said, okay, it's no longer me having to be open to it. It was me definitely saying there is definitely something out there. And I think at that
point I was far more supportive. Not that okay, I've had my moments of not being very supportive in the past, and he was aforeheaded wonder, but I think at that point I was far more supportive of him taking it seriously. This is becoming more than a hobby. I tell people. Now, that's where Sasquatch stole his soul right there. Never completely gotten him back.
I could definitely understand that, and that's one of the things that has always compelled me about anecdotal experiences, like somebody coming back and saying, hey, I saw this, and even if you have a photograph. We're still debating some of those to this very day. We still talk about the Patterson Gimlin film, we talk about the Paul Freeman footage. That's one of the things I had doubts about the Paul Freeman footage for many years. I just
could not quite get there on whether that was a real creature. A couple of things changed my mind about that. The enhancements that Doug Hicheck did and Alex did on that footage where you can actually see the baby lift. It was mind blowing to me. Why I had Michael Freeman Paul Freeman son on the show. Michael sent that to me after we got off of our interview that night, so I'd still not even seen it when I talked to him
at that point. Regardless, like I did, just see that footage and it blew my mind, and I was like, oh, okay, it's still one of those things that's iffy because there's plenty of people out there. Oh yeah, I'm seeing the baby lift. It's nothing but a doll. He's picking a doll up. The dude in the suit's picking a doll up off a tree. Right. But what really put me over the edge and firmly in the Paul Freeman camp was having a conversation with Michael his son.
Paul has obviously passed away in the early two thousands, so he's not around to have those conversations anymore. But I'll tell you what pushed me over the edge was very much what you just described. Paul came home from his trip out into the woods. Michael was there with a friend of his who was over. I guess it was during the summer or whatever. Paul Freeman was
so excited, beyond elated that he had captured this footage. He made those kids sit there and Michael literally said, Brian, I thought we were going to break the fricking tape because my dad kept watching it over and over again, and he knew his dad better than any who knows you better than your son or your daughter, your dad knowing your kids, and he knew at
that moment his dad had captured something very special. Once I had the conversation with Michael, and I've since become friends with Michael, I know him very well. I know he's not pulling my leg, and I certainly am comfortable knowing now that Paul Freeman didn't hoax that footage. If he did hoax the footage, why would he come home and act that way? With his child. You don't hoax your kids. I don't think that he wasn't trying to try the hoax out on his kid and his kid's friends, very much like
your store. Not that anybody has to try to validate anything, but I think when you have that extra layer of credibility. He knew you had to get up at five o'clock and I'm wanting to go to work. He looks like a very intelligent man, probably knows it wasn't in his best interest to shake you away to turn I don't at one am unless he had something special. So that just adds to that little layer of credibility that honestly you don't
get in a lot of anecdotal situations like that. I'm very glad that he woke you up at one o'clock in the morning, but in retrospect, I'm sure you probably are too. It wasn't great at the I've been in that situation. It's not fun to be woken up at one o'clock when you've got to be up so earl. Just for people who are listening to this, I think that's one of the things that I certainly look for in these kind of situations is how does the person react. Is it a natural reaction to
having that kind of experience, and I certainly think that is. You mentioned other experiences, Scott. Obviously you said you weren't scared, so you went back out in the woods. How long did it take you after that initial experience to have any other experiences with these tucks? And stay tuned for more sasquatch out to see. We'll be right back after these messages, oh,
five six years. Say, we're luckier than most bigfoot groups. I think because we have one hundred people part of our group, as we're a national group, Nick drew over the last five years or so, we have a lot of people in the woods, and we also have a website where people cement reports. And since we travel full time in an RV, when we get a bunch of reports in a certain area, we'll travel to that part
of the country and just hang out there for a month or two. So I have a little bit of an advantage that way over other people who just are going out to their spot once a week or so. We have found footprints probably once a year somewhere in the country, and that's just because of reports and stuff we get. We do have one of our researchers who is in the Crater Lake, Oregon area, which is a very hot spot. In fact, the place we hang out there is called Wind to Go Pass.
Just this last summer we stay what seven days. There are cameras seven days camping in this area, and stuff happened every night. It was creepy to hear stuff walking around your camp at one o'clock in the morning, which is weird. There's a theory that they avoid trail cameras. I've never got one on any of my trail cameras. So we do put trail cameras out, but we tape over the ir because I think they can see it.
But we also put out just those cheap dollars store motion lights that you can get, the solar powered motion lights, and we put them next to our cameras. If it does trigger it, the light will come on and the camera will have some light to collect something. But we were just hanging out the campfire, which I think is the best thing to do. You just hang out in the campfire and wait let them come to you because you're not
going to sneak up on them. So we're hanging out, bussing around the campfire, and then lights in the woods, and we put them about two hundred yards off in the woods quite a way a way. We see lights start popping off down in the woods. I'm like, oh crap, something's triggering the cameras down there. So we jumped up and used the thermals and did all the stuff. I did think we caught a blurry thermal photo.
But to have that something crunching around the woods and we're hearing these weird like fog horn calls, I had never even heard that described by anybody before. We'd all around us that night. I got a little word like, I hear it over here, and I hear it over here, and I hear stuff down there, I hear stuff behind us. I'm like, are we in the kill zone? You know? Here? I don't know that one.
I was getting a little shaky. But what had happened was we had also we had got a bunch of flat rocks off the beach and took them up in the mountains and had stacked them in little pyramids on stumps out in the woods. And after that experience that night, we found a couple of our stacks of rocks had been rearranged. Then one of the flat rocks had been picked up, turned sideways and jammed like a hatchet into the top of the stump. We left that there. The next night we went back and
something had pounded it all the way down into the stump. I don't think bears can do that. And then we found an eight inch footprint next to the stump there too. I think we had a juvenile messing with us all that weekend. That was the other experience, but that was five years from my first one. I want to go back to the first experience that you had and talk a little bit about the two sets of footprints. You said what you saw was six feet in high. Do you think that was the
smaller one or do you think there was a bigger one there? Given in retrospect what you experienced and then what you were able to go back and ascertain through your investigation, what do you think was going on there? Do you think it was maybe a mother in a juvenile, maybe a male and a juvenile. I know it's objective, but you've got to have thoughts about that. What do you think was going on in that situation? Yeah? I do think there were actually I think there were three, to be honest with
you, because we found the two footprints from where they were standing. But we heard that whistle off in the woods to our left, cartaways away. So what I think it was is again a juvenile. And I think that's when most people have experience as juvenile's messing up, because I think the adults are smarter than that. So when I saw the one, we even back and forth and I got that one photo. We heard this swhistle off of the woods and it turned to walk towards a whistle. But after fighting the
footprints there we found the big ones and the small ones. I'm pretty sure the six foot one was the nine is footprints. I'm almost sure that was a juvenile. And then later on I actually was showing my photo. We were at a conference and we were with the gal the sheequatchers, and I was showing the photo and one of the gals said, there's one standing behind the one you got a picture of it. I'm like, what, I'd looked at that for four years. I've always focused on that one, and
I started looking closer. I'm like, I could be kind of thing. And then just last year I got somebody who was really good at photo enhancing and took my photo and enhanced it, and sure enough, there was one standing behind it. You can see it plain as day. Once we got the photo enhanced, and I didn't see one. I saw two, but I only saw one, but there was two of them standing there. I didn't see the other ones standing behind it. It was standing still, blended
in whatever, but the camera did. And then I actually took her back after she got off worked and picked day. We went back up there and she saw the footprints and she helped me cast them, so that kind of convinced her a little bit more. What I saw there when we were looking at the footprints is because this whole encounter happened on a really seep cut bank. That you have the lower portion where they were, and then the road where they were walking, and then there was more hill going up the other
side. When we were investigating, these creatures crossed the road, so we were casting on the upper hill where they were, and there were you could see nine inch and the fifteen inch next to each other. There were three of the adults, assuming it was the adult, and then there were two from the smaller prints. And after the second smaller print, you saw this drag mark. Now my background is in clinical social work and behavioral science stuff like that, and when I saw that, it was like, oh,
I see what happened here? Junior wasn't keeping up. Mom grabbed him by the ear. And that's actually what excites me about this research is looking at how much information you can get from five tracks in a drag mark. What does that say about them? It says that they are very much primates, probably more human than not. And so just by studying primate behavior you can
see a lot of what they do. But it really flushed out for me their level of consciousness, their level of intention, and I started to get excited about it. That's where I started associating with his bigfoot staff, and it was exciting to me. By the time he went on the road full time. I think everybody in our town had enough of me. But you just go do your big foot thing. I love it. Have you had
other experiences? I'm curious about the common things that you hear, the wood knocks, the vocalizations, the tree structures, formations, x's full crumbs, those kind of things. Are you getting reports from people in these areas that are experiencing things like that. And have you seen or heard or experienced any of that stuff when you guys have been out there, Yeah, all of the above. Yeah, we get a lot of stuff sent to us.
We got a gal who's part of our group in Vermont actually cast a thirteen inch print and she sent it to us, and it's a cripple foot. I took it to doctor Jeff and we compared it to the original cripple foot casts and it matches exactly. It's just smaller and the opposite foot, but
it has the same problem, the same morphology. We found that. I actually had a Native American and the yu Matilla tribe in Oregon it contacted me and he said he had been where he hunts his hunting ground last October hunting deer, and then he came back at early spring to do mushroom hunting in the same area and found this tree structure that wasn't there in October. So we went and checked that out and it was like a dome, like an igloo shape with a floor with a floor in it, like a furbo floor.
Yeah, and I thought a person could have done this. It was fourteen feet around and five feet tall. I mean it only had an opening up towards the top of it, a smaller opening, and I thought that's weird. But we checked every limb in that whole structure and none of them were cut. They were all broken off, some of them four inches around, tree branches broken in half. We found a three inch fir tree woven into this, and then they were woven too. It wasn't just piled on
each other. They were woven together. But we found a three inch fur tree that still had the root ball on it. It had been pulled out of the ground riots and all woven into the structure. Yeah, and I'm like, I can't pull weeds out of the garden. I'm not going to pull a three inch for TT. So that one was really interesting. And trees had been pushed over to build a fence around this all the way around,
and I'm thinking it's possibly. My conclusion was, I think it's a playpen or a nursery that they build to put their babies in while they go out and do stuff. So we did find that. That was a couple of years ago. And actually we had a pretty interest and we were looking at this tree structure and we had our dog with us, so we have this fond hope that one day she'll be a really good kidabr dog and be able to help us in our squatch efforts. So far, she's just a
pain in the ass. But we had her dog and she got loose. She's a runner. I'm busy trying to find our dog while they're trying to do this investigation. And all of a sudden, we heard yipping up the
mountain and we knew that there were coyotes in the area. Our dog is gone because as we knew her well enough to know, she's going to go after those and it's going to be all her and things, and he's a gonner, and so we abandoned the tree structure, even the guy that was with us, And as we started following those yips, we started hearing tree knocks over by where the structure was. The closer we got to the yips, the more we heard knocks where the structure was, And finally we said,
we've got to go see figure out what's going on there. We got back to the tree structure. We didn't see anything there, but at that point in time, the yipping stopped, and then our dog came back. We got back to the truck and we started just for fun. Scott grabbed his he keeps a baseball bat in the truck, and he grabbed it and he just gave a tree a really good whack, and out in the distance in the opposite direction, we heard a whoop back. It's the weirdest thing.
I am a trained singer. I got on my little look there and we went back and for this, and we did our research. There were four wheelers in the area. We knew there were, and so you know, we went and saw where the four wheel trails were. The whoops were coming from the opposite direction where there were no trails. Probably for about forty five minutes, we went back and forth the other sound, getting further and further away every time. It was very interesting. I was like, will
you come away from that kind of thing you're going. I'm not quite sure what happened there, but something happened. I think perhaps I don't know, this was just me, you know what, whatever happened there, the dog came back. That's it. The whole thing was about the damn dog messing
everything up again. But it was an interesting thing to get because before the dog got away and before we went on this wild goose chase going towards the coyote ips and we hadn't had any indicators that anything else was in the area. It was only after the dog escaped that this started happening. It was a weird, weird It was a weird day. Yeah, it's very interesting because I'd never experienced any wood knocks here on our property in North Carolina until
I don't know, it's probably been two or three months ago. I'm horrible with time frames, but I imagine I've talked about it on the show before, so whenever I started talking about it two or three months ago, and it only happened after I found the very first print on our property. It
was after a hike. It was probably two or three days afterwards. I go out to do what we do in the middle of the woods at three o'clock in the morning, off the porch, I hear what sounds like four power knocks off in the distance over the ridge behind us, and I thought, that's really interesting. If you know the area that I live in, there's nobody up at three o'clock in the morning, number one, and they're certainly not going to be knocking on anything. So I filed it away and
said, that's interesting. It could have been a wood knock. Now in retrospect, having heard what I believe to be authentic wood knocks and radium, it sounded very similar. Let me ask you when you guys are hearing this, and I know you said the baseball bat. I have a baseball bat that I've used to do knocks here on the property. When I was in radium, Todd had I guess theory would be the right word. Or he
thought or thinks that sasquatch aren't using wood on wood. They're using the combination of like mouth pops, which I was doing a couple of times and got responses myself, and using rocks on trees. You're nodding, So is that kind of where you guys are at? Is that where you're hearing and what you think you're experiencing. Absolutely? Yeah. I came to pruss that conclusion quite a few years ago. From what we've heard in tree knocks over the
years. It's got to be rocks. They're hitting trees with rocks. Is wood on wood isn't going to have that kind of resonance? Yeah? And possibly rock clacking completely rock on rock, Yeah, because that will have a different resonance. Wood on wood just doesn't it doesn't doesn't make a sound like that. Yeah. And one of the things that was very interesting we were hanging out with Shane Corson from the Olympic Project and the Olympic Project that had
found all these nests, these woven nests. One of the nests they found two big rocks in it that weren't from the area, and he had them with him at one of the conferences we were together at and I got the look at him. And one of the things we do when we were doing Native American archaeology, digging up ancient sites and stuff, we would find rocks
that they used to make arrowheads and stuff with. And one of the things we always did is just pick up the rock and roll it round to your hand and see where it fit, because they would pick rocks that felt good, and these rocks felt good to be able to put in my hands, and you could see the scratch marks where they had been clacked together. I'm pretty sure that they kept those in the nests. Just when a bigfoot goes out away from the nest and he gets lost, he hits a tree,
somebody else, blocks of rocks Oh, you're over there. I'm gonna that's the direction I needed to go. Yeah, dumb ass, we're over here. One of the things that have come up so many times on the show, and especially somebody who's been looking into this as long as you have, Scott and obviously Hannah you've been on board now for quite a few years, is the WU and the high strangeness that comes along with some of the stories.
Are you guys hearing a lot of that? Because I had conversations with Clif Brrickman about and cliffs like No, probably one to three percent of the stories and the encounters that they hear at the Bigfoot Center and he hears as he's traveling around and doing speaking engagements and things like that may include something that would be considered WU or high strangeness, Whereas I'm probably twenty percent, maybe
twenty five percent of the encounter stories it's maybe in conjunction with or sometimes it's simultaneously orbes turning into things and those kind of things. Hey, are you experiencing any of the high strangeness when you guys have been out in the woods and or are you getting reports enough to even mention in the statistics that would be considered high strangeness are woo that's in conjunction with sasquatching activity or encounters.
I would say it's a very small amount, and the ones we get, I don't know, maybe because people know I'm an anthropologist and they don't even share it with me. Though I did have one lady tell me that she was having sex with bigfoot for five years. I'm like, oh, okay, you can get me some DNA. Huh. But no, it's a very small amount. Now, some of the Native American stories, like the Miewok tribe, I worked with them probably the most in my career. Kathy
and I both have worked with the Miewok tribe a lot. You worked at the northern and she worked at the southern, so a lot of the Miewok stories that she has and I have are similar. But I also worked a lot with the Nesberst tribe up here and they have a lot of Bigfoot legends. The Seven Devils area in Oregon, there's a place called Seven Devils. There's like these seven mountains, and the legend is those are actually Bigfoot that
work tricked into turning into mountains back in the day. And stay tuned for more sasquatch out to sea. We'll be right back after these messages. So I've got a lot of those legends. But I've got three pictographs that nobody has ever seen with Bigfoot stories on them, and they have a legend wherever Bigfoot goes, a light follows. And then it wasn't up until when we were in Leavenworth. It was just about six months. It was June July
sometime, feels like a lifetime. We were up in the mountains outside of Leavenworth, Washington, and I was getting ready to crawl into the tent and I looked out in the forest and I saw a light and I said, who's out there with a flashlight walking around? Because we had a hiked down off the hill where that was, and it went probably two three hundred yards and then there was a cliff and so you had to go through our camp
to get out there. I'm like, that's weird. So I held up my phone and I started just filming this light in the woods out there, and it would move and then it would disappear, and then it would come back on over here and it would move back and it would disappear, and then it would streak across the through the trees and stop and I'm like, no way. So what I did was I scratched out the ground where I
was standing. So I went back the next day and held my phone because I'd put it up against my chest so I knew where it was at. So I held my phone in the same place, stood in the same thing, and took a picture. And there's no way there was anything. It was just thick forest right there, so there was nothing behind it. And again it was on the side of a hill. It was downhill, so there wasn't anyone camping there having fun with the laser lighters. Yeah, yeah,
it was no one there. So I've had that one weird experience. I don't know, but as far as a lot of the stuff goes, I have a weird theory about it because going to these conferences and things. Some of the conferences we go to are like, I have bigfoot, people
have UFO people have the ghost hunting people. And I got to thinking about one day we were talking about some of these ghost hunters and they were showing me some of their evidence that they collected, and I said, I wonder if the woo stuff are ghost bigfoot, that could an account for a lot of stuff I don't know, but uh, lots of a multi genre. That is a rabbit hole I've never went down. Thank you for that, Scott, and I'm gonna go down to We've mentioned it a couple of times.
You guys have talked about your website, You've talked about your group. I think you guys have a YouTube channel. Let's talk about all the stuff. Where can people find you? Where can they find you stuff? How can they send you a report? How can they get in contact with you? Guys? Hey, our website is Squatchamerica dot com. Very simple. We have a contact form there, We have a report form. Our email is just as simple, squatch America at gmail dot com. Our YouTube channel
is squatch America on YouTube. We keep it really grand consistent, and we respond to everything. If you email us, we will respond. If you send us squatch America on Facebook, will you message us? We will usually respond. Those are probably the hardest messages to stay on top of the Facebook one. Yeah, but honestly, best bad is squatch America gmail dot com. We check that neurotically, so that's the best way for people to get
a hold of us. But people sent. I think our website has our phone number on it, so people call us, they can text message us. We really try to stay available, and that's one of the things that when we went nation well, actually even before we went nationwide, we really place a lot of value in the relationships with people that we developed. Yesterday, we were on another show with someone and who asked us, there's so much angst and just nastiness in the Bigfoot community, and we walk away from
that just as strongly as Bigfoot walked away from the Ojibwat. We don't have anything to do with that. Our philosophy is everybody has a piece of the big puzzle, and if we would all put them together, we're going to have a much better picture of this. So we really value relationships with people. And we are squatch Americans. We are one big tribe of people going after the same goal. Yeah, and she's more WO than I am,
so well, I am not WU. Actually my thought on WU is, like I said at the beginning, there's way more mystery out there than we can even comprehend. And the things we call WU, the things that we call magic, the things that we call supernatural, it's just science. We don't understand. Yet I truly believe that the deeper we go there are some who will disagree with me. That's okay, knock yourselves out. But the deeper we go into understanding quantum physics, the deeper the rabbit holes going to
get. But just it's going to open up so much of our understanding as to what the nature of reality is. And it's far bigger than we could ever possibly imagine. She's got a master's in social work and she worked for Child protect Services and her expertise in therapy was in trauma, trauma and personality to sort ordership. And I think, honestly, when you're talking about mental health issues, even last night, we were talking to the whole topic of
what species do to ensure their survival. When you're thinking about survival and if you're talking about people today, we have just spent the last three years being globally traumatized. No matter where on the conspiracy spectrum you are, our species, humanity has been under collective trauma for at least three years, probably a
lot longer than that. And my opinion, and I think it's a very educated opinion, is that most human beings right now are coming from a place of unresolved trauma in just about every area of their life, and that can manifest in so many different ways, so many different ways. It just gives me chills to think about. I always wondered how my social work education. I'm a trained social worker and I'm a trained musician. It's like, how is all this going to help it? And so far it's been pretty awesome.
How it's played into that very well said everybody, go check it out. I will have all the links in the show notes you guys, go check out. Scott and Hannah show him some love. Thank you guys so much for coming on and talking to me and sharing your experiences of haw a blast talking to you. Oh, thank you, thanks for having us. It was fun. They say, you don't have to go home, but you can't stay. I want to step step Joy this child, that chart everything, call me, ride back, right back, Joy for me,
Joy staying right you call it right away? Still still stay fast, sat down to dotsass still stassess things used these things