You know, every now and then I think you might like to hear something from us, nice and easy working. There's just one thing, you see, we never ever do nothing nice and easy. We always do it nice. We're gonna take the beginning of this song and do it easy, but then we're gonna do the finish. May we do crowd new old Listen to the story now. Now, this is obviously not the regular intro to the show that you're hearing, because we are paying tribute to an icon and someone
who was very influential in my life as an artist. The incomparable Tina Turner passed away in her home just outside of Zerich, Switzerland, on Wednesday, May twenty fourth. The post on her official Facebook page reads, it is with great sadness that we announced the passing of Tina Turner. With her music and her boundless passion for life, she enchanted millions of fans around the world and inspired stars of tomorrow. Today we say goodbye to a dear friend who
leaves us all her greatest work, her music. All our heartfelt compassion goes out to her family. Tina. We will miss you dearly, So with that I pay tribute to Tina Turner and the only way I know how with our music. You must try to do that and be loving. Start to do it even we don't need to do. I want is my I can't stand the right against my window, bringing my sweet memories. I can't stand the right stand together. But then you wean golden night, the time for
sweetness, but a bitter kids bringing to his knee. When I was a little girl, I had a bright when we do now. I love you the floy I love the right. Come. I'm gonna find a dancer for you what you want me to do? But men, get tromber. We must stop pretending. I can't eve the spy. I don't care who's all right? I don't really want to fight. I folks want to welcome my guests to the show. It is Greg from the Great American Landscape. Welcome
back to the show Man. Thanks. I was really looking forward to quite honestly, and I've been, as you say, jumping in and doing a lot of research and getting ready. I like to subjects, and you know it's funny is we've talked about a lot of things, but never really and extensively on your main show. I know it's always about something else, but we are going to talk about bigfoot tonight. So I was really glad to
a get you back on the show. I've missed these conversations and when you suggested this topic, I was like, well, we can definitely do that. So one of the things I know we're going to get into, well a lot of the things we're going to get into is some of the things that have bugged both you and I about bigfoot and bigfoot research and sasquatchery in
general over these last few years. So let's just get right in. I know you've got a list that you've brought with you, so let's kind of get into the list and tear into some of these subjects one by one, okay, And I'll try not to use words like it's squatchy and stuff like that little thing to get on my nerves even though it's it's kind of funny. I've got my big foot t shirt on. What you can't see is
it says winner of the Hide and Seek Contest. And I get a lot of comments on this when I'm walking around with it on, and people are like, that's great because you know kind of place to the point of where is he and I've been binging a lot of your shows and a lot of the TV shows on the subject lately. I thought we got to talk about this, and I've got some big issues. I'm I want to be a believer. I'm gonna put it that way, use the X file lines,
I want to believe. But you've been using a football analogy and what was your thought on that? Basically, Well, it came from Pat Turner from Squatch Talk doing one of the shows we did last towards the end of the year last year. Pat was like, you know, the Paterson Gimblin film put us on the five yard line and we've kind of been stuck there ever
since nineteen sixty seven. So I've said that in multiple times on the show and use that analogy sort of that we're on the five yard line in Bigfoot research, and frankly, I don't see it moving anytime saying yeah, and I see it quite a bit differently. I think the PG film, which you know, quite honestly, I never heard that term PG until everybody's usually just nobody can say those two words together. I guess they're tripping over it. The PG film, I think, But it's on the fifty yard line.
It's you know, it's a video, is it real? So it's kind of a fifty fifty thing for me. Right, we're in the middle. Which way are we going to go? But I actually think we've progressed and then regressed. I think we're on like our own fifteen. I don't think we're on the fifteen about to score because I think the Bigfoot community in some ways has screwed themselves with just the way they go about it, the way they present themselves. I don't think it comes off as credible. Sometimes.
I don't think they mean to be that way. I don't even know if they know they're shooting themselves in the foot sometimes, you know, we'll talk about a little bit about DNA films, big giant leaps of faith on things. So yeah, so that's kind of where I'm at. I think where we retreated a lot, and I'm hoping we can make it up with a more scientific approach than a lot of what I've seen. One of your recent shows had a guy on that was talking about a new part two of
a documentary that's coming out that he wants people to donate money too. Now, the guy very interesting. A lot of talk about DNA, which will hope something comes out of that, because when I visited on my show Great America, Now you got me? Is the American landscape that you know? Actually the Great American Landscape actually has a good ring to it. Maybe I
should have updated. We went to the Taurus, the pre tourists or tourist pre Bigfoot Museum in Fulton, California, and it's struggling a little bit out here now. We visited before COVID and it's a tiny little place on the edge of Fulton, California, in some redwoods. And he told me about a book which I haven't had time to read yet, called Nature of the Beast. Now. It was written by Brian Sykes. And if anybody knows or have heard about the Seven Daughters of Eve, he's the one through DNA
discovered that we all are connected to that mitochondrial Eve. So he's got some I always say science behind him. Some credibility probably is the word I was looking for. So that should be an interesting read. And he's kind of a guy who probably when he speaks about DNA people listen that. I like. That was at Merrill Lynch. What was that old commercial when Merrill Lynch speaks, people listen that kind of a thing. So that's on my to
do list. Another one he gave me two was Abominable, Snowman and big Foot, Sasquatch, oh Man, Grassman, Long Name, and Skunk Apes by Agon T. Sanderson's supposed to be a very It's a book written a sixties but very pivotal. I haven't ready. So here's some of my questions. I keep hearing things as I watched, like I've been been watching Finding Bigfoot because I'd been a while since I watched it. I've been told Bobo was sick, that he'd even been poisoned at one point. I don't know
if that's true. Came up from a third party who was supposed to be in the know. But when you see him presently, he's lost a lot of weight. I mean, good for him. I'd sure like to lose that kind of weight. But I so I watched the first or second season, and I thought, you know, I'm just gonna jump to twelve. There was a newest season on the streaming device. I use to see if
anything has changed. Not really, they're still making these giant leaps. They were actually in town for the PG like fiftieth anniversary up there, and I almost said Willow Creek. I don't think that's rights a Willow Creek, Bluff
Creed, Bluff, Creed, whatever. The little talent is, you know, the big squatchy gathering, and I found that nothing's really changed or making these big giant leaps and things would come out like, um, Bigfoot is attracted to the color blue and this is a good gifting thing, right. I'm like, well, how do you know this? Because even you said you've gifted and I have a kind of I don't say an issue with gifting, but there's a lot of wild animals out there that will take things,
you know, raccoons. I used to own a raccoon. Didn't know I wasn't supposed to do till after I had it, very good at taking things. In fact, they are little thieves, a little they're very good.
And when they make these absolutes, it just drives me crazy because here's guys that have said and this covers all the shows because expedition ever or expedition that's attraction, sorry, expedition Bigfoot is probably the one I have a little more respect for because I like their approach the guy that's you know, let's say, overseeing it, tracking sightings, putting it into spread sheets, figuring out where they supposedly are during certain seasons, and then attacking it that way.
To me, that seems like a pretty logical approach. But even those guys make stupid decisions. Always see something. Let's run, You've just violated all the rules, right, let's run after. Let's do this. Oh there's a TP that's obviously bigfoot? Is it? Have you ever seen bigfoot? Make this TP? How do you know this tepee thing is a bigfoot? And then there was one I heard last night. I think for the first time it was a whispering thing. First it was like, hey, man,
I scientist. Lady, she's not an anthropologies is a field biologist? I think she said I was clear. Today I heard yeah man, or yeay man, Oh that's no Bigfoot's do that all the time. How the hell do you know that? You know, if we had so much evidence, all the supposed evidence, we would be seeing this guy Jane, you know goodall or what was the other one, Diane Fosse types would be sitting with them and studying them. Let's kind of put this in perspective. They
say they've been see what's fifty I don't do the math. Fifty years since the Kim Lee film. These guys say they've been tracking it squatching for twenty five years or more. The first guy, the first Westerner to see a guerrilla was like an eighteen fifties I think. Okay, So, you know, honestly, we judge a lot of our history by the Western world, even though the Eastern world has probably seen these things, or the African world
has seen these things forever. But to the Western guy eighteen fifties, superbacks weren't even known until nineteen oh two. So yeah, forty years, fifty years before sasquatch was found. But we're laying around watching what they do, we're observing them, we're teaching them to sign, but we still can't find the sasquatch. You know, it doesn't make any sense. But I want, I do want to believe. I believe he can exist, I really do. But just guy can't be that elusive. And then you have to
get into all the oil. He's part of the UFO phenomenon, or he's he's a shape shifter. I'd heard that the first time at the Tourist Museum of up North here in California. I'm like, really, they're shape shifters. I didn't know that. And these things are spoken with absolute you know. But I'm like, where's all the scat? You know, where's the
bones? Now? You know? People try to say, oh, in fact, in fact, this one I mentioned to an anthropologist when I was doing a dinosaur thing, something about, you know, I heard it's not very common to find bearer skulls or skeletons. And one guy says, I saw one x amount of you know, I was doing my field research. They're out there, but it's like we want to kind of snake through some of these. Oh you never see bears out dead in the woods, but
you'll find many people that say they have. But the researchers a lot of times they want to leave things on the table and not discussed and put that into the mix. And that's what I find really frustrating. I mean, how do we know that and this would be a large group of people with hypertricuiosis or how do you however you pronounce that you know what that is?
Right when they're totally covered with what werewolf syndrome. I think it's called because I was looking at the PG film again and there's not much facial features. I mean, you see eyes and it looks like it's all fur from there, and I you know, I like Harry. From Harry to Henderson's that's my favorite Sasquatch expressions. You can see the phase, but he's still a
big furry guy. But that's really not what the Patterson film shows. And a lot of other photographs tend to show something that you can barely see a mouth. If you just see eyes, they're always out of focus. I don't think I've ever seen an in focus one. Now I know it was Patterson. He fell off his horse or something. He's getting the camera ready, but he got it fairly stable. And a lot of these ones, you know, the camera's going all over and I've heard people say, well,
they're probably panicking. Okay, fine. I'm on the monorail in Las Vegas a recent convention, and I saw a particular flight coming out or coming in to the airport, and I'm going to go blank on the name of the flight. They're white planes with a red stripe and they fly from Las Vegas Airport. There a fifty one Janice thank you. Once I found it, I stabilized on it and I would you could say I was panicking because I wanted to see it, and I like, all I got to get
the sun film. This is cool. I've seen it a hundred times when I've been in Vegas. But you know, and I've steadied myself up, it can be done. I don't know why everybody acts like this is such a hard thing to do to get a steady shot of anything, whether it's the UFO, the big Foot, the chupacabra, the you know, you name the beast that we can't seem to get a freaking decent footage on.
And everybody is carrying a camera these days. It's not like you've got to go get a roll of film, be prepared to know what you're doing. You can just point and shoot it. Why are we still fifty years later, twenty five for all these supposedly I absolutely know it's Bigfoot. I've seen him. Where was your camera? Where was your recording device? At night?
You know this is where stuff starts to fall apart. For me, Before we get too far down the rabbit hole, let me kind of go down the list a little bit and let's start off with the Finding Bigfoot stuff, right, I tend to agree with I've never watched the show. Honestly, I have to admit that most people find it interesting that I do a Bigfoot podcast and I've never watched one episode. Maybe a couple of times. I watched Finding big Foot back in the day, but I wasn't an avid
watcher, and I've never watched Expedition Bigfoot. You know, I've hung out with Russell Accord. I hung out with him just a few weeks ago. He's a super nice guy, really not knowledgible, just fun guy to be around. Right, I've never watched the show. I've met Maria, I've met him, I've met Ronnie, but never watched the show. And I've had people to watch one of the shows. Do that one. Well, that's what people tell me that, That's what people have said. They take
a very scientific approach. Maria is a scientist. She does her thing, and he yes, So you have these people running around doing their thing. Right, And let's go back to the Finding Bigfoot. I've had Cliff on the show before. Cliff and I've had some great conversations about Bigfoot in just stuff in general. Never talked to Bobo, but I've known people who have talked to him, and I'm about to. We're doing a conference here in
July. Him, Matt Moneymaker, and Renee Holland from Finding Bigfoot will be there, so I'll get to have a conversation with all three of those guys. So here's the thing about television. Obviously, some of the things you describe are obviously for television. There's producers involved. Anytime you do in television, you know you're in the business, right, you know what you gotta do to keep people interested. So they got to do these It's got to
be at night. They've got to run towards whatever's happening, the whoop or the holler or the you know, the tree knock. So I get that. I do think that a lot of people have told me that it appears that Expedition Bigfoot are trying to use some tools that maybe haven't been employed before. We've talked. I've done entire shows recently about drones and using drones. I think they had an episode where they tried to use drones to possibly get
footage of these things. They had. They had a tethered drone. I think they were doing. I don't remember if it was infrared or some spectrum you know thing, but yes, so the tether drone could stay it much longer. You know, the average drones twenty thirty minutes I think of flight time. That's what mine is. So yeah, they seem to be trying a much more scientific approach. So there's only one scientists on the show, and she sometimes there's a lot of issues with the way the other guys act
or approach or whatever. Yes, I was gonna say with Finding Bigfoot. When I had the conversation with Cliff recently, he said that one of the very first episodes, that that infamous one where moneymakers going there's a squatching on the hill or whatever, he said, they caught one on thermal that night. That it was either a giant naked man in the middle of the woods where they were filming, trying to hoax them, or it was a big
Foot. That's Cliff's analogy on the situation. And I believe Cliff to be a very honest guy. I don't think he has any reason to lie. I don't think he would lie about anything, frankly, from what I know of him. But they are convinced that that's what they got. Now, is that what it was? I don't know. I wasn't there, but
I think they're at least they were trying to do the right thing. But I certainly get your trepidation about it because the show was on twelve season and it's now famously you know, not finding Bigfoot is usually what I hear when people talk about finding Bigfoot, because they did find some things, and maybe tracks and foot castings and stuff like that Cliff considers to be real evidence.
But outside of that, right, I don't think there's any much more of a there there, and I think exp some big Foot has probably hited down the same path. What were you going to say, stay tuned for more Sasquatch out to sea warming right back after these messages? Well, I was gonna say, you know, I'll speak to the thermal, of course, because you can't get a true image on the thermal. You're seeing an outline. And I've wondered about when this show, any of these shows show up
to an area. Is it pretty well known they're there, They've booked hotels there, they try to come in on the slide. But you know, finding Bigfoot, they have a town meeting to get people to raise their hand to see, and of course sent the audience always raises their hands and says they've seen one. You know, I can raise my hand. I think I've told the story about seeing a UFO. Didn't say I saw a flying
saucer. I saw something flying. I couldn't identified doing weird things that being in the Air Force didn't seem like, you know the way aircraft but fly. And this was way back before you know stealth or F twenty twos and some of these that can do some pretty amazing things. But I leave it
open. But the big Foot, and then after doing the show with the dinosaur, the anthropologists and talking about foot casts and things, and them talking about the science of why they think sometimes casts don't look like what you think they look like, because of course I had to bring up we're dinosaurs and men ever you know here at the same time they always say no, of
course science doesn't believe that. Yet there are what some people consider evidence of footprints and footprints, and then they are scientific explanation goes to the point of like shrinkage and different things, or did he get a full push and how it could look and they're quick to dismiss it. I get it, But some of the stuff we're done here, even wood knocks. I mean,
I you live in kind of a woody area. There's a lot of things to be heard that on a general night you probably couldn't explain without a lot of really in depth research to figure out where the wind blows, the thing snaps. It sounds like this, an acorn falls, You think it's you know, you've something's been thrown at you. I don't know. Some of this stuff just seems really really far fetched, and it's become the absolute.
Woodknocks for the absolute, this howl, the howl. If it seems like the Sierra Sounds are the kind of the quintessential, we know this is something that we can't identify to sounds the closest to what most people say bigfoots sound like. Instead of going out there with Bobo or whoever and yelling some sound they think sounds like a squatch, why not play the Sierra Sounds and let
that do the talking, if you will. Now, I listen to that show that you recently had about the Sierra Sounds, found it completely fascinating until I couldn't decide who was talking because I guess the recording had the guy that was recording it talking at the same time, and at a certain point it became very unclear. And what I have found, because I've done a lot of ghost walks and watched enough zach Began's to see how they play things.
Hearing something in person versus hearing it through the TV or a secondary recording sometimes changes things quite a bit. It's not like seeing it or seeing or hearing it in first person. So I'll give a break sometimes for those things. But I don't understand if they want to do this scientifically. Stop yelling, because quite honestly, it's like you barking at your dog. Dog looks at you like you're an idiot. You know, he might bark back. They
might get some other animals to make some noise. I don't think they're really doing anything but looking like I don't want to call him fools, but it just doesn't seem like a scientific approach, and it's not very approach. Doesn't seem to be very scientific, you know. That's kind of my problem, and sort of like ancient Aliens, which again I love the show, but everything's always aliens on these shows. If they can't explain it. The scientists
as well, it's not explained to them. It's always Bigfoot. Well, Bigfoot is known to do this. Every new show or every few new shows, something new comes up and scientists or they say, they know that Bigfoot does this, but there's not a consensus, you know they I think they like to think there's a consensus. Then I heard they think they bury their own. But what'd you find, like a come across a graveyard at some point? Then, I mean, we're raised to such a level of intelligence,
I say, we they assume they eat meat? Why they could be vegetarians for all we know. There's just so many absolutes that I have. I have a trouble with. And then I went to the hunting one because I really do believe no one, no film, no picture is ever to be solving this absolute sign. The scientific community, for whatever reason, doesn't even want to jump in on this. The guy interviewed up at this museum
went to school to be an anthropologist. He wanted to write his dissertation on Bigfoot, and they told him no. So when science tells you no, it kind of turns you off. I had an art instructor do that to me, came buy as working a piece of clay, smashed it. You can do better than that. I was like an eighteen year old and pressurable kid. You know, that's not the way to inspire someone to be more
creative. And this is kind of where I go. You know. It's like there was one with the hunting one where they thought Bigfoot took the dog. What happens when your dog is attacked by someone they don't know. They yelped, the growl, they scream, but Bigfoot going, you know, cover his mouth, and I mean they make big leaves and then they end up finding the dog. By the end of the show, it just went
under a building. And those guys always say they're gonna help somebody. Almost at the end of every show, there's no answer, there's no help. They haven't scared anything away, and they do stupid stuff like Johnny, h something just walked by me. We'll stay there. Maybe it'll circle back around. What would a most hunters do something go military people. They're gonna they're
gonna go after that. And I think the head guy in the Hunting big Foot team, so see, I mean, he'll walk up and seem like a nice guy, but then later it comes off as kind of this arrogant backwoods Southern I'm gonna kill this thing and bag it and hang it by its feet and bring it into town. And though I do believe that maybe what it's gonna take for any scientists to believe, really, I'm gonna come on.
Science just doesn't want to accept this stuff. They're opening it up to UFOs, which is surprising, even the tik tak videos and all that. But the Big Man just doesn't seem to be accepted. Though. You know, I don't believe in giants now, I think giants have existed a little bit. That is, that is biblical faith out of the book. You know, we've been taught the whole Nefflin thing. That could all be very true. We don't know. Today. I think we would have seen these
people. I do believe there could be wood apes, There could be a range of tangs. After watching the Tiger King and seeing what those different guys had brought into this country or rescued from other people brought into this country. How do we not know? Maybe not dissimilar to the newer versions of the Planet of the Apes. When they got some intelligence, they went off, They lived in the woods. For the most part, people never saw unless
they intruded on their area. I think that could happen when you really realize how vast this country is. And I know, living in southern California, I live in what I don't call a city. It's in there, you know, suburbia. My cousins and like Missouri, South Dakota, they think I live in this big city. I'd say, no, big cities like San Francisco, New York, Chicago. To me, those are cities.
I'm just in suburbia that just never stops. Though. Ten twenty miles from here, people are getting jumped by cougars mountain lines as they're bicycling in the local mountains. We got bears. I actually tried to look up. We were talking about let's find some modern's what's going on right now in the big Foot world. Everything I found was the latest five videos You've got to see. You know that I typed in my local mountains. Yes, there's been
some sightings, of course, nothing on film, nothing on cameras. All stories, and I think it's easy to work yourself up into that. I mean, how you've been to campfires as a kid. Somebody tells a story got you all worked up, and now everything you hear is whatever has been told. Right. One of the things I've said before about like finding Bigfoot, and now I guess for the next generation would be the Expedition Bigfoot. It did a lot of great things in my opinion, in that it brought
Sasquatch into everybody's home. It brought Bigfoot into the zeitgeist for everybody to feel okay we're talking about right, And I think that's a good thing in a lot of cases. But the other negative are plenty of the things that you talked about with the wood knocking, and again a lot of that stuff was for television, right. You got to have something to do, and that's what I've I've talked about that on the show before, Like what do you
do when you're out looking for Bigfoot? If you can't yell in the woods and you can't beat on a tree, Nobody's going to watch a show where somebody sits around for twelve hours in the dark and nothing happens, right, So they have to spice it up. So I get that point. But I do agree with you. Is that spicing up now? Because almost all the shows kind of accept this. Now you've been to bigfoot conferences, right, Oh yeah, so is wooden knocking considered church if you will? Oh
yeah. There's plenty of people that you talk to that we'll talk in definitives about tree structures. They'll talk in definitives about wood knocking, they'll talk about the vocalizations. And that's where I draw the line, And that's why I really have an issue with anybody, whether it be a television show or a researcher up giving a talk or coming on my show. I've said it plenty of times. Anybody who comes on and and definitives I'm really really weary of.
And I try not to have those people on the show because everything we're talking about a subjective because we don't know well. A lot of people argue that they do know they exist because they've seen them. But for the rest of the world who have not like myself and like you, who want to be believers and want to find answers to the question, definitively, the rest of us need proof, right, But you can't talk in definitives about what
you know that they do. And I hear that often. Right. We'll get into a little bit of that I think we're going to talk a little bit more about DNA. I certainly want to get into that before we move on to anything else. But when you start talking in definitives, my answer is always this, how do you know that, How have you proven this? What scientific research have you done, what controls did you put into place? How many times has this theory been tested and retested? And how do
you come to that conclusion? And it's usually just well, we've done it. When we've been out researching, we know that break sticks in this direction. It's a trail marker to let everybody know that they take this trail and there's a secret trail on the left, and there's a secret trail if it's
broken on the right. That's what I was watching one where they found the kill and it was obviously a bigfoot kill, Brian, Don't you know because the bone of the deer was twisted and broke, It's not because the bear or the deer was maybe attacked by a cat or a bear and it rolled down the hill and it broke. It's like, no, only big foots
can do that. And again, unless that's been an observed thing. That's why I go back to like Jane Goodall and doctor FOSSi, who literally lived with these things and observed and scientifically proved through the observation, reobservation and reobservation again. And that where now that I listened to one of your recent shows about DNA gathering, if and I can trust those guys as knowing what they're talking about. On hunting big foot, there was a DNA sample they were
getting. They're tweezering into this little envelope. Everybody's breathing on it, no one's got a mask. They took it to their DNA expert, who happens to be a bigfoot researcher. I find that a little too close to the family. You know, you need to take that outside. And I kept thinking, well, they got all these inconclusives, right, why can't we just gather all those inconclusives together and you know, have them worked in a big pot. And then they were saying, you can't do that because there's
one there's no control. You don't know how it was gathered, who gathered it, whether or not they're breathing on it, all the stuff they can transfer human DNA to it. So unless you've got a control group, and the same people, and they were talking about they only have three guys that gather it, you know, and they've got a procedure and they got and I'm like them, See that's science, not Oh I see some hair on a tree. It's at nine feet. That's got to be a squatch because
nothing else can get up that high. For folks who may not have heard the show you're talking about aired, I think this past week it was Justin and Jay from Cryptid to the Corn and Justin is a filled biologist and he was talking about particularly e DNA samples that they were taking in these large areas and very much like you said, they had to go to school for this. There is a lot of training involved in collection of DNA. It's not
just I use tweezers, so everything's good because I didn't touch it. And yeah, yeah, yeah, you can't breathe on it because your breath there's droplets of your DNA in your breath if you if you breathe on a sample, it's done basically, and that's one of the things that you mentioned Doug high Check earlier. Doug was on a couple of weeks ago. He's doing the Sasquatch a legend. Meet Science Too. The kickstarter was fully funded.
I think they hit it eighty five thousand dollars or something so legid. Meet Science Too was coming and they've got a lot of samples of DNA. I just posted a show as we talked today. It's Sunday. Jeff from Pine Island Research was on. Jeff been on before and shared his encounter story, pretty compelling story a couple of years ago on the show, and I had Jeff back recently because he's written a book about his experiences and some of his
research, and a couple of the things that you mentioned. I jotted down some notes. The color blue came up and that we'll talk a little bit about that. Jeff talked about his research, but we also talked about DNA because he's collected quite a few samples of what he believes to be the sea bum, or that white, chalky, kind of oily substance that comes up. We have sebon ourselves. Human beings have it, all apes have it.
If you've ever been and seeing guerrillas sometimes in the zoo, they'll have like these big golf ball sized clumps of the stuff underneath their armpits, and it's basically this white oily sort of substance that they secrete naturally, feet and hands, those kind of things. And he put out part of what Jeff did with his research. If you guys listened to the show today, If not, you can go back and check it out. It's the Pine Island
Incident show. He talks about how he tried to do some research by thinking outside the box. He wasn't out taking cameras out, he wasn't out putting up trail cams. He wasn't beating on the trees and whooping in hollering. He and Doug came together, Doug hi chicking. He got together and talked about some things that they could do to put out things that might interest a sasquatch if they were in the area, and try to collect hair samples and
pull some DNA from those. So Jeff started taking out like these bounty balls that you get at Walmart for two bucks, and he would take them out and throw them in a field and play with him. You know, he's eight miles out, he's having to kayak out into the middle of nowhere, into these clearings, and he's playing with this ball and he's kicking it around and talking to it and laughing in case something's watching, and he leaves it,
and in some cases it was moved. I think at one point it got moved eighty five yards from where he left it, and he collected hair samples. They were using some material. I don't know if it was velcrow or what. In some cases he was doing these things, leaving them out and collecting hair samples, and he was collecting what looked like see them off of this ball. And hopefully he's kind of going back and forth and whether they're going to test it dear in the Legend Meet Science documentary, or if
he may be doing it his own, he's doing another project. But I said all that to say one of the things you mentioned is it being a little too close to home. And I know the way that Doug and Jeff are planning on taking his samples or whatever Doug has, they're doing it the right way. In my opinion. They're not going to a lab and saying here's a check, we want you to test this and see if it's from
a big foot. At that point you've lost all credibility. In my opinion, that's not the way to do it if you're writing somebody a check and saying I'd like it, I'd really like it if you'd find this. You know, by the way, here's a check for forty grand to do the test. You know, you'd like to think that people wouldn't do it, But are they more likely to find what you're wanting them to look for? Versus, Hey, we're just going to go and give you a sample.
We're not going to tell you where it came from, what it is. We don't have any dog in the fight. We just wanted you to test it and tell us what happens. So that's sort of the approach to the DNA they're taking. And I think it's that's a good approach because I do believe, you know, and I say this as an outsider, you know, I'm an armchair quarterback on this, But science, I think has become
a little lazy these days. They're trying to make their data fit what they wanted to answer what they're looking for, rather than leading it the other way. And I'll give you a quick example. A friend of mine and I granted this is twenty five years ago, local community college, taking physics, and there's this test where you take like a coin. It's but it's a it's a predetermined weighted coin used for experiments, so it's not like a quarter,
so it's gonna be absolutely perfect. Supposedly you're supposed to flip an x amount of times and science will or physics will tell you, you know, there's a certain percentage whatever. Well, my friend wasn't getting that answer, and the guy it's like, Oh, don't worry about it, because just just write write it down. It's fine. You should have got this way. But I didn't get this, So that could mean there's an imperfection in this this coin or what we're using. Oh no, no, no,
no, it should come out this way. Just write it down your pad. And so when you're doing that kind of stuff, that doesn't help. And then I wanted to say about the ball, what I what I listened to, that what I thought of. There's a place out by Edwards Air Force Base a little further out called the Cat House, and it's not what you're thinking. It's a rescue or large cats that most likely were here illegally,
panthers, lions, tigers. I don't think there's any bears, and a lot of peacocks, I mean, you talk about things that can make weird and loud noises. I don't know if you've ever been around the herd, a flock us or flocks flock of these things, and they can leap, I mean, well leap wud their feathers coming out up on top of the buildings. But now I'll get back to noise that we hear sometimes. But the big cats were playing with bowling balls some reason. They're fascinated with
the ball. So I'm taking some of my when I get time to go back, some my old bowling balls that don't use anymore, years old, and they play with them like their toys. You know, we left the sixteen pounds. Why I watch that camp throw this ball. They're like, you know, and it's over there. So I think I tended to think of cats playing with that. And what was the name of the podcast again, the Cryptids of the Corn podcast. That was the guys that were on.
That's a great name. Yeah, I wouldn't say the props to that. And when I heard that, I'm like, that is awesome. That's sometimes it's all in the name. You know, you might be drawn. I was drawing sasquatch Honestly, I'm like, oh, great logo. Yeah I went there first before some of the other ones, so um, props to you. Also, yeah, it's good stuff. So if we can talk about noises a little bit, because that's something on this really new episode
of Finding Bigfoot. And of course when she said she heard something, oh yeah, people here like whispering and vocalization all the time. All right, I have some first hand experience with something like that. Stay tuned for more Sasquatch outsee wing. Right back after these messages, I'm out in the middle of the desert in California and we stopped at this abandoned gas station on the
edge of the Mojabbi preserve. I'm flying my drone and there's tennis shoes thrown all over the place, over wires, over wherever they could get them to hang. And I thought I heard people whispering. I'm thinking I'm having a paranormal you know. Thing happened to me right now in the middle of the day. Yell over to the cameraman from my show. We were just out there having fun. Hey do you hear that? He's like, hear what, I should come over here. We just stood there listening, he heard
what sounded like whispering. It's gonna be the air movement through the shoes, through the building, what's left of it. I don't believe I was getting a message from the other side, because nothing is very clear. And I've heard it now again somewhere else with a similar type of thing going on. I think that's just, you know, how the what's I don't know what the terminees. I always forget it. The mind sees what it wants to see, all right, We've see in clouds, we see whatever, right.
I don't think it's far off from hearing either. You want to believe Bigfoot's talking me. You want to believe that they say hey, yeah, or whatever it was all the time. I think this goes again to I want to believe it I heard something. It must be it verse is because if you really wanted to study that, you just sit down and start recording, and you do it again, and you do it again. You try to reproduce this. But I know it's TV two. They're there for day
or two whatever they're doing. But they call themselves researchers, the hunting guys. Don't. They're just out there in a bad one, which it really I'm fifty fifty. I think you need the body. But and there it goes to the DNA. You got all this stuff, you haven't you eventually have to have something to compare it to or you'll never get an answer. What are you going to do if you never have a body or the arm torn off one, or you know, something to drag back to. You
weren't finding the grave that they're supposedly buried in. How are you ever going to compare the DNA? All you'll get is unknown humanoid ape whatever. Before we get into the DNA, I want to talk a little bit more about the auditory stuff, and there's probably I haven't looked it up. There's probably an auditory version of paradolia that you were talking about seeing what you want to
see and hearing what you want to hear. But before we get into that, let's talk a little bit about You brought up the Cira sounds, and I did that show recently. I hadn't Ron Moore head on again. We didn't really talk about the Cira sounds because we had done that before, but I had Scott Nelson. The crypto ling was to broke down those sounds. And spent months and months analyzing them. What's been decades at this point. But here's the weird part that most people don't talk about, and it completely
escapes me. I can't believe. I think it might have been. Oh, it was Jeff actually, the one who from Pine Island Research. He does his own podcast and it's called Pine Island Research, and he recently had I believe he had Ron Moore head on, and Jeff had gotten sort of some inside information about the fact that there was more to the Sierra Sounds than what has been released. Because we know that there's ours, right, because
Ron sells these things. I think there's about ninety minutes or so that he has that he has released out there in the zeit. Guys, we all know the three or four minute compilations that you can look at on YouTube, and you can even hear some of them in the opening to my show. They're commonly used in the bigfoot community, right, and a lot of researchers,
to your point, do actually take the Sierra Sounds out. I've talked to researchers who have gotten a lot of alleged responses by playing those kind of sound blasting those into the woods. Instead of doing their own calls. But it came out recently on Jeff Show. Ron Moorehead basically admitted that he has hours and I'm talking, I'm throwing darts here, but I think it was something like another eighteen hours of recordings that he has never released that is out
there for yeah, for the Cierra sounds. So I don't know what's in if anything's ever gonna happen to those. I don't know if Ron's ever going to release them, or if anybody's gonna ever get to see them or hear them. But they're out there, right, So there's even more out there in the zeitgeis for people to take a listen to and take a look at. But I agree with you with the sounds. I try to do that if you approach this subject at all. We have heard really weird things here
on our property. We've heard what sounds like ohio hows and the distance. I've heard close vocalizations here near the property that have scared the crap out of me. I don't know what they are, you know, I never have definitively said ever that it was bigfoot? Could it be sure? Could there be a logical natural explanation. Absolutely, You'll never hear me say anything definitive unless I know it for a fact. If I see something making that sound,
then I'm going to tell you what I saw. But other than that, the definitives go out the window for me. But I think there is a lot of things that happen that people have these experiences on these shows or researchers in general, just out doing their thing, and they don't necessarily stop and think, because some people, unfortunately get bigfoot on the brain and everything becomes bigfoot, and I don't think that does anybody a service. Honestly,
I've said that plenty of times. If you make everything bigfoot, then there's no room for anything else. There's no room for any discussions about what it could be or could not be. If it's just a definitive for you, then we really have nothing to talk about. As far as the DNA goes, you know, there's a lot out there. We've got the Melboy Ketchum DNA study. I think in twenty twelve or something like that, she's back
on the radar. I've reached out to doctor Ketchum multiple times and invited her on the show to talk about her first study talk about what she has going on now, and she has politely declined to come on the show, so you and I can have a little bit of that conversation, I guess now without her. She told me she wasn't doing any podcast interviews, and then I see at least two interviews that she did recently, and I was watching one of them just over the last couple of days, and I have to
be honest, there's a lot there. You know, I'm not a DNA expert. I'm not a doctor, I'm not a PhD. I'm not an expert on anything related to bigfoot, right. All of my expertise is in law enforcement and other things that I've done previously in my life. You know, I'm a half decent podcaster, so I can't even claim to be an expert podcaster, right. But what I do know is that a lot of
people have a lot of issues with doctor Ketchum's initial study. And I even heard her talking about on one of her recent podcast interviews that they made it through the first round to peer review, and then they didn't make it past the second round to peer review because some of the same ones who had passed it in the first round refused to either look at it again, and then they start snowballing, and she starts talking about government conspiracies and it's the government's
fault that they can't get this peer reviewed, and they can't get it published. They had to buy this. It's just a whole thing, right, And now she's asking for more money and raising more money, and the last time I looked, I think that we're up to about twenty three thousand dollars
on her go fund me to do this Dogman DNA study. And the only thing that comes to mind, outside of some of the many things that she said in interviews, that I sort of scratched my head about it, and again, I would love to give her the opportunity to come on and talk about firsthand and maybe defend her position on the show. But without that, I'm only left to draw my own conclusions. And some of the things that she says, it's pretty out there, because she talks in definitives about sasquatch
is absolutely one percent real. There are millions of them around the world. In her first study, she's obviously did the mitochondrial DNA and it's human female and the unknown contributor for the male part of it. She thinks these things are genetically engineered. She doesn't think they're natural creatures. And same thing with dog Man, because she claims to have what she knows to be samples from dog Man that she can't wait to test. So there's a lot of definitives
there, right. I know this. I know that, yet nothing has been proven scientifically outside of the fact that you tested DNA that was had mitochondrial DNA was female human female, and then something else. So that's all we
really know. And back to your point, I said of that, I was a long way to get there, But I said all that to say to your point, that's the problem I have with anybody really testing DNA of some unknown species or crypted because without a comparison sample of a known entity, how do you ever say definitively that what you have is X and not something else? Right, I just don't know where you go from that with DNA.
And how do you know that you know if you've out the money chondrial eve if you will, and it's an unknown male contributor, I would guess that many scientists I would say you've got a contaminated male portion of the DNA, and leave it at that. But you know when you said it went through peer review, if I was reading it right, her first peer review was questioned because I think it's the De Novo fiasco. It's called because the group that was peer reviewing it was a group she started as a group to
do the peer review. Are you familiar with that? I have heard some rumblings about that, and when you sent that to me today, I sort of looked at it. What I've heard doctor Ketchum say in the past is they eventually had to buy the entity and I don't know, I can't it's escaping me right now. I can't think of the word. I was trying to say the word earlier. The God, it's going to drive me crazy. They ended up having to buy the place where the review came from.
Oh my god, I'm gonna have to I'm sorry, folks, I have to google it and put it in the intro the journal. Yes, thank you. Oh my god. I can't believe. It's like complete brain fart. It was. I could not. But they ended up having to buy
the journal to eventually be able to get the peer reviews. They had to buy it because they wouldn't give them the peer reviews until they bought the journal, So a lot of people kind of throw that stone, and I don't necessarily think that's accurate, because it was a separate entity when the peer review started, and then when they didn't get passed or they refused to do the second round, they ended up purchasing the journal just according to doctor Ketchum,
get access to all of the material that they refused to release. So they just bought it. And a lot of people say, you know, it's kind of hanky. You can't own the same thing that you know. It's supposed to be a separate entity. That's keeping you honest, so to speak. But I don't think that's necessarily accurate. I think it was the way that she said they had to buy the journal after the fact. But let's just lay all of that aside and just go back again to like you said,
her answer to that, I've heard that everybody says it's contamination. No, it's not contamination. We have proof it's not contamination. None of the samples were contaminated. Okay, well, I haven't seen the proof. It may exist. I mean, she claims a lot of stuffs on her website. I haven't read through all of that. So if it's there, so be it. I'll take a look at it. But just saying something doesn't
necessarily make it true. Right, So how are these samples collected if she didn't go out and collect these samples herself and you, unless you have a really good chain of custody, it's very difficult to say definitively that there was not a chance for some contamination. Maybe it didn't getting contaminated by her or her people are in the lab, but what about before it got to you? So and again we're talking about bigfoot and DNA, we're talking about dog
man DNA. We're talking about things that aren't supposed to exist. Yet she's very definitive in the fact that they do because a she claims she proved it with her first round to studies with the genome project and the bigfoot DNA and the hair sample. They've supposedly got hair samples from these things. And she says that sasquatch hair doesn't produce DNA in the shaft like every other mammal on vertebrate animal on mammal on Earth. It does in the shaft, or it
does in the root, but not in the hair. Shaft itself, and she says that she unique to sasquatch. Again, how do you know that convenient? I'm very convenient exactly. So well, let me ask you when you were in the force. Were they collecting DNA yet? Oh yeah, yeah, I left there in twenty sixteen, So okay, all right, so yeah, fairly new. If I understand DNA collection somewhat even a smidge correctly, the people who are collecting are also in the database, so they
can separate them. This is known and just in case they do contaminate it, and anybody who may have been in let's say a murder room, they'd walked into the let's say you were the responding officer, either your DNA's on file, or they might take a sample for you. Because you were initially they're not knowing what you're coming into. You could have possibly, you know, left cells contaminated the scene. They want to eliminate you. That is
somewhat how that works today in modern police work. Right, It's possible we didn't do that as a department. You know, I don't know that, and I'm not one hundred percent sure. The Denbo things seemed kind of squirrely and like you said they had to buy it to get an answer, which almost says seems like a pay to play type of thing. But you know,
it raises questions on credibility, and she may be totally sincere. But again, like say, if you don't have a sample to compare to and Sasquatch, I can get behind far more than Dogman, mixture of dog Man, right, you might as well have senatars and you know, mermaids. It's just that goes into the hi and alien theory with hybrids and mixing. It's like if she believes Bigfoot was engineered by home, is just now going into the alien side of the Bigfoot and myth. Well here's the thing.
Yeah, you gotta say, well, who's engineering it? You know, from what I've heard her say, she believes that Bigfoot is a hybrid. She believes that Dogman is a hybrid, and she claims to know exactly what both are and where they come from. But that's only going to come out after the new study's done. And again that's one of the issues that I really have here, is if you're in this, in my opinion, for the right reasons, and you're trying to bring answers to the subject. Why
is it that you're holding out this information? I mean, she did this study in twenty twelve, and if you have all this definitive information about Bigfoot, why didn't it come out then? Why hasn't it come out in the last eleven years or so? Why do we have to wait for another round of funding. Why do you have to do more testing on what you claim to be dogman DNA and go back and take a look at some other stuff as far as the Bigfoot DNA is concerned, and then you're going to give
us all the answers. I just I don't like that kind of situation, because if you're a scientist and you're doing this for the scientific reasons that you say you are, just give us the information. Just put the information out there for everybody to see what's in it. For holding it for over a decade and then having to raise another round of funding to go do more DNA testing on some other cryptid to then say, oh, well, now I can tell you what Bigfoot is, and I'll also tell you what dog Man
is, but only after we complete our funding. Like that, it just desiates he would narrow in if she could prove one, let's say Bigfoot and she I mean if it was proved one even ninety eight, you know, I think some people would be like, oh wow, this is you know, we're we got to be looking into this. Then move on and people are going to give you funding if you can prove the one. Let's not mix it all together. Even the guy that was raising the money for this
second documentary he left, he teased a little bit like that too. I can't tell you other people have been jumping in on my research or trying to beat me to this. Beat me. I mean even that sometimes I was like, not again, how many times if I watched a UFO show or a big Foot show. You know, Bobo is just describing his twenty five year ago if as first sighting through a night vision scope, I could be a guy of Gilly suit. I mean, seriously, at the distance he
was at, he's trying to give perspective on size. He doesn't know. He didn't go down there to see what the size of the trees or the bushes and whatever. I really, you know, I've looked through night vision scopes. It's good, but especially twenty five years ago, not like the guys have today in the field and I've been taken. I've even taken photos on my digital SLR through a night scope and got a halfway decent photo. But you know, could you tell me what antelope that was I was shooting
or what deer I was shooting? No, but you know a basic shape of a type of animal. Well when big footing manner kind of close except for maybe the length of the arms and the descriptions they always talk about the neck goes into the shoulders. Well, how do they know that they're so covered with hair? How do they know there's no neck there? You know? Because it's just I mean, I've seen some guys there's some pretty big hair and long hair, big beards, can't see their neck. I can
make the same claim on a good old boy down south getting gaiters. Not to throw aspersions at you guys in the South. But you know, a lot of these things aren't definitive enough, you know, and you can't reproduce. What it drives me crazy is like you say, the absolutes and with the DNA thing, I absolutely got it, but there's no proof. I mean, can you imagine the mark you'd make on history? You know, Jane Goodall, wait for twenty years before she released her information the doctor Fossa
because I can't remember her first Diane. Diane maybe wait to release information. I mean, she's writing it down, she's getting it out. It just doesn't make sense now she might have way to the year or two. But we're talking how long has this been in twenty twelve, so we're in eleven years. I know science isn't fast. I know DNA isn't fast, but it's getting faster and faster where they can get stuff quickly. What has taken
so long? And again, you know, I hope that she's able to do this, and I hope she's able to prove the species would be awesome, but I think what it does, in my opinion, is, you know, my show is all about encounters, and I've said it so many times recently, I've gotten a little perturbed with people who have come on the show and made some really fantastical claims, because here's the thing. If you come on my show and you share your encounter story, nobody's going to beat
you up. It's not what it's about. You know. I don't have people on the show that don't believe they experience what they experience and people want to hear those stories. And I believe that those stories are data to be put into the database and we can draw from and make our own conclusions. And nobody who comes on my show and says I had an experience where this thing walked up and did X Y Z, or it came across the road
while I was driving by, or whatever the case may be. Anybody, I could go out tomorrow, Greg, you could go out tomorrow and have a very similar experience with something you can't explain. Right, But I tell you when you have these fantastical claims and again, not to go. I
will go back to doctor Ketchen one last time. You know, in this recent interview, she was going on with the person who was interviewing her about all these experiences she's had with Bigfoot and the things that they've left her on her property and how they've torn up her pecan trees, and you know, she's interacted with a clan of ten that she's seen multiple times. And I'm like, where is the evidence for any of this? And of course she says, I have evidence. I have pictures, and I have all these
things that they've given me that'll come out later. I'll put that out later, and again it's just one of those things where the more fantastical the claims that you're making. If you're saying, if you're one of these people that are saying, I can take you out and show you ten bigfoot tomorrow, and I know every one of their names, and I've grown up with them, and I've watched them birth their children, and we have this fantastic relationship,
and yet you present no evidence to corroborate what you're saying. You know, my question to you is where is it? Why is there no evidence? And everybody has an experience and everybody has their reasons behind it. You've heard thought to catch them say I don't go in the I don't take cameras out in the woods. That's not what I do, that kind of thing. Conveniently, there's no evidence to collaborate these fantastical claims. And I just
honest is a scientist. Why wouldn't you stay tuned for more Sasquatch Odyssey will be right back after these messages. Yeah, if you're just Joe Schmo, who's going out to you know, enjoy some time in the woods, and maybe you don't have your celf on with you and you haven't experience. Okay,
I can let that slide. But if you're a scientist and you want to be taken seriously as a scientist and APPROACHSS scientifically, I think you have to do something and put a good faith foot forward to say I'm at least going to present something, because I think if you did that and you don't just talking all these absolutes and I know this for a fact kind of thing, people would tend to take you a little bit more seriously. And I
think that's at the end of the day. That's sort of the rub for me with most all of this stuff, outside of the anecdotal experiences, and again there's some of those that are really fantastical that you know, I scratch my head and I say, gosh, you know, that's kind of difficult to believe. But if it is your experience, then that's what it is.
But when you go into this habituation, and you know, I know this for a fact, there's a clan of ten of them that visit the property and oh, by the way, I've got all their DNA and I know exactly where they came from and their hybrids and they're engineered by whomever. Maybe it's ancient aliens or whatever the case may be, that has far greater technology than we've ever had. That kind of thing, I think is how
she's put it. You just kind of lose me there in the weeds because there are people out and you put doctor Meldrum on your notes, and I'll bring doctor Meldram up. There's a lot of pep who have issues with him for whatever reason, you know, they don't necessarily agree with his synopsis on whatever. But I've talked to the man a couple of times, and he knows his stuff. He is a PhD. He studies human and bipedal locomotion, and he can break down the morphology of anything's foot if it's bipedal,
he can break it down for you case by case. And I have talked to him about the Patterson Gimblin film, for example, and that he has examined those cast of those footprints that were taking that day, because it's not just the film, it is the casting of the feet as well. He set it on my show. I am as certain as if I were standing on that sandbar when that film was made, that that is a real sasquatch walking across that based on what I have examined in the morphology of that particular
animal's foot. That's a very scientific approach from me. He doesn't say that lightly, and he can back it up with the science of wine. He can take a foot, a skeleton of a foot, and break it down for you and talk through that. That is a scientific approach to this. And he has staked his claims on it for years, and he's put himself out there for it. He has been beaten up. He almost lost ten year because of it, and he continues to go around to this very day
and defend his position on anything you ask him about. He'll defend his position scientifically and give her a reason. And if he can't, he'll say I can't. But anybody that claims to be a scientist and doesn't approach it the same way that Meldrum does, I tend not to listen to the same way that I listen. Yeah, you know what I'm saying. I'm with you there, and I've seen him over the years, and you know, a lot of different types of shows, and he does bring that air of scientific
knowledge, you know, to me that gives some credibility. He's not conveniently living in a place where they're presenting themselves to him. And he's also a researcher. That's where some of the credit ability with some others that we've been talking about. How convenient is that people are bringing stuff to him. He'll go out and research, but he breaks it down. I think unjustly,
doctor Ketchum has been criticized because her PhD is in veterinary sciences. It's still a PhD, and you don't get that lightly, and it's still back to a science, and there's still anatomy. There's still a lot of things that most of us will be, you know. So that gives her to me credibility. Whether or not she's a research scientist, that's something else. And there are those who that's all they do is research. They never go in the field. They just got numbers, they look at data. I prefer
the person that gets dirty, gets out there and looks and touches. That's my kind of scientist guy. So I give I gotta give her. I think props on that not everybody gets one lightly, But I do find some of the things convenient. You know, dur in my backyard, you know, you got a great UFO showing your other one paranormal, one long drive. I'm listening is that this is great. I'm really believing it. And then this woman made a big left turn and I think I emailed you once
before. And that's where these stories are compelling. But then sometimes they break that air of maybe you're so close and then who you know? Government conspiracy or and that's not that those aren't out there and sometimes are real, but that's when you, you know, when you base a lot of your findings on that, and then I have to hide certain things. I don't know if it's your show. Somebody was saying that the government knows what it is.
They've got them they you know, it's well, you know, quite honestly, you know, the government can't tell me what the weather is going to be tomorrow, but yet they want to tell us what global warming is could be like in twenty years whatever. They've been wrong for the last twenty thirty years. And I supposed to believe that they they know bigfoots here, or they're following them, or they're doing whatever. I just that's when I
lose a little bit of credibility. The government is not always a big bad boogeyman that knows everything. I mean, quite honestly, I think half the government doesn't even know what the other half is doing. Most of the time, they're still disconnected. They're so confused themselves sometimes. Yeah, can we talk about some of the funny names that big foots are called? I found three, there's more, the wood booger when I heard this the other days
out of Virginia, not far up the road from you. Have you ever heard that term before, wood boogers? Yes? I have you. What do you call sasquatch in North Carolina? Is it just sasquatch? Yeah? Everybody says sasquats your big foot here? No, okay, okay, And of course you had the sasquatch. Those are big Foot's kind of the normal thing. But when I heard wood boogers, I started to break up laughing. I'm like, I'm tapping that into my notes, wood, But how
do you spell wood boogers as the funniest things? Now, there's something I really did, really want to talk about. Let me knock some of these out. We still got the list. I've been checking them off. And then some of this goes back to finding big Foot, but it carries again into a lot of the other shows and I go back. I mean, my first time I think all the PG film was on The lenarn Emoy Show in Search of and then we had Charity of the God Movies when I was
a kid. A lot of this stuff that I'm like, this is really cool. Don't know if it's real, but this is cool, you know lock That's all this. But some of the stuff I've heard cross some of these programs. Bigfoots are attracted to women. I've heard that what evidence or raves. They're gonna do a rave because they know Bigfoots attracted to it, or they're gonna shoot off the fireworks because they're curious people. They're gonna come
in and look. Quite honestly, if I was a wild ape man, I think I'd be going as far away from big explosions and crap like that personally. But the one thing I've heard on multiple shows now is proof of the PG film and to disprove the guy that came and said I wore the costume, I'm the guy that walked. I made the impressions. Is that Planet of the Apes which came out in sixty eight or not, probably a film at sixty eight thinking came out sixty nine that that was the epitome of
costume design and they couldn't do what was in the PG film. But you know, that's a pretty broad statement because one the film wasn't intending to make a Bigfoot. They were intending to really vary from the original book if you've ever read Planet of the Apes, to look kind of like us, but apes, they're in societies, they're wearing clothes. Of course, it doesn't look like that they're making more of a I mean, their faces are very
similar to chimpanzees and guerrillas rangutans. But of course, like I mentioned earlier, the Bigfoot looked like about the eyes or the only thing you see and everything else's is big fur. So to say they couldn't do it. Also, you go to the second film, there's a sauna scene, which is kind of hilarious on the thought of them sitting in a sauna. Most people probably have never seen either one of these first two films in their entirety.
They probably seen them on TV because most of the people here talking about him they're in their twenties. I saw the first one in the theater only because we were seeing the second one a little too young to see that. I'm sixty three. Parents probably would you know? What would I known at three or four years later? Right? But at the time the next one came out, and then I love these films. I really don't think. I
didn't know for years because I didn't remember. There's a scene. There's a hunting scene in the first one where they've got humans men hanging by their feet, hanging across, you know, carrying them on sticks like they've just they've been out on a hunt. They're taking pictures with their kills. That's always been edited out of the TV version. I've never seen in a TV version, So I think there's a lot of assumptions here, and again the assumption
that they couldn't make this costume, and I disagree. I know there's a guy and he was on this Finding big Foot show in the fiftieth anniversary whatever, who's done some research on the film. He took a few frames. I guess there was only three known copies, first generation copies. I thought the wife still had the original because I couldn't even tell you what show was.
Some research guy they got permission to go to her house. He built a rig for his camera and duplicated the film frame by frame, because most of what most of us have seen has been duplicates of duplicates of duplicates, very degenerated film. And if anybody doesn't get it because they've never had to experience duplicating BHS or film, and how it can degrade copy after copy, especially when you copy the copy. Go see multiplicity with the original Batman that.
I'll tell you what happens when you get multiple copies down the road, right, And that film looked entirely different once I saw a first generation copy done and high. You know, he did it on a digital SLR, so it was a much higher resolution than the original film. But this guy says, oh wow, we found a fourth first generation copy in a bunch of boxes that was in his stuff or something like that. I forgot the exact details. So he's doing what essentially his HDR what now your phone does
or your TV does. By software and photography. I used to do it by multiple exposing off of a tripod at different levels. You combine it like in Photoshop or something, and you can get the really lows and the highs. You blend them all together, And essentially that's what he did with a couple of frames of the film and the image of I forgot what they call her because they're assuming she's a female, which maybe the guy's just out of shape. I don't know, maybe he's got some he needs a man's ear.
And it looked one hundred percent better. Still grainy, but it made the edges pop out. It was kind of cool to see. But did it really change anything. No, some of the things they say they see like muscletr stuff like that. I don't know. The film is great, but sometimes I wonder is that a suit? I really do? I want to believe it's real. I sincerely want to believe it's real. But something in the back of my mind says no. But I'm like ninety eight,
Yeah, I'm going to accept it. But I can't accept what these young uns are saying that Hollywood and couldn't have done that too, because I really think they could now do these two had the budget or known anybody that could make that suit for them. No, because anything you would have bought off the shelf would have looked like that stupid gorilla. And what was that movie with you talking about brain fart Eddie Murphy, you know, trading places.
I remember the gorilla at the end. You know, it's like really bad costume on Jim Belushi. That's about all those commercially available. So the thought that these guys could get a hold of something at that level is that's pretty slim. So that gives me a little bit more credibility. But I can't believe that they write this off based off a sci fi film that wasn't intending
to try to give that kind of texture and malt and stuff. But if you go look at the one that where they're in the sauna, I mean you can kind of tell there's a chess plate for the you know this part where it's no hair on it, Yeah, you could kind of tell it's a leg going in maybe you know he's wearing a pant. That's Harry that they needed to go to a higher level. There was no need to in those films. I mean, their face makeup was enough as outstanding anyways.
That's I just I just want to get that out there because I've heard three shows I think lately mentioned using Planet of the Apes movie is a definitive reason to prove the PG film and I don't think you can do that. Those guys had rifles. They should have shot the damn thing right there and ended the discussion back then. But you know, our sensibilities of hunting were a little different than it is today. You would have shot it, it would
have been done. Well, there's a whole another rat hole we could go down. I think M. K. Davis has claimed that there was a massacre that day, but we're not going to go into that tonight. For sure. I have not heard that one. You'll have to maybe we'll have to come back and talk about that at some point in time. But I agree with you, man, I think there's I'm about you know, it's fifty fifty for me. Sometimes on the Patterson Ghilan film, sometimes I'm eighty
twenty. I want to believe more than anything in the world. But there's something that just has been gnawing that says, oh, man, that could the lizard brain going. It could be the guy in the suit. I don't know, but the mystery continues. There's obviously a lot of things that pistol us off about Bigfoot, but we keep coming back to the well and we definitely addressed a lot of those tonight, and I'm sure that people are going to listen to this and probably say, yeah, I've had some of
the same issues with some of this stuff. You know, It's one of those things where I'm with you. I think it's going to take a body that somebody's going to drag in and say, definitively, here's one science. Go to town figure out what it is. They'll probably want to to make sure just to finalize that this is what it's it's supposed to be whatever. But at the end of the day, I think we all keep coming back because it's a fascinating subject and I really want the answers it really is.
I'm sorry, I forget if this cuts each other off. I'm just gonna, you know, get excited and responding. But just think you're one of your revenues of income would go away. It was proved. I mean, quite honestly, there's an industry. Nothing against your podcast because I love it, but you know, there is an industry to keep this, this mystery alive. I mean, look, I've got the T shirts. I showed you what I got for my birthday, very cool sculpture of bigfoot. I
love the genre so fun and cool because it's it is believable. It's not so dog man. To me, it's not half man half. I can't get into that one. I'm more I could go down skin walkers because there's a mystery paranormal thing about I could get more down that line. But the Highbreds you know, can't really go there. But to me, I don't look as big Foot is necessarily having to be a hybrid. It could be
like you know what mammoth is to elephant, human to an abe. I think it's believable, and there's so much out there, and like, oh, I think I started, I didn't finish it. Us say suburbia dwellers who never get beyond you know, maybe one hundred miles of their home. I've never seen how that asked and wild and open this country is, it's amazing easily I think it could hold a small population. I don't know. The Bigfoot guys of the BFRL thinks there's two to six thousand in North America.
And again let he base that off of where's the science behind that? I just want to know. I mean, if you can give me a definitive, real reason why I should believe why electronics don't work around and why they like girls, why they like a Ray, I'd be all in on it, and I might even go meet you up there. I'd quite honestly, I'd like to go squatching, But I don't think my thirty eight's going
to protect me from the cougar, the bear. There's so much out there that I'm not equipped and never been trained to handle or be aware of what to look for. You know, you know, living in a place like you do on the edge of the woods might creep me out a little bit. And I say, you hear weird noises. Yeah, it's a scary world out there, you know you live kind of on the edge of it. Well. As always, Greg, it's been great man, Greg from
the American Landscape you guys got out on YouTube. He's got some great stuff over there, and we'll certainly have to have you back from more discussions. Man, it's always good. I's good. I'd love to. They say you don't wantta go home, but you can't stay here. I don't want to be world out time, this job, that time, everything coming right, baby, joy for me. I need to stay right. I'm coming right away. Time. Consus usssssss used to us ens