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Now. I know what your reporting. I got a strain of going on here. Something just killing my dog. Something killed your dog, my dog. We're flying to or over the trade. I don't know how it did it, okay, dam and I'm really confused. Also, I thought my dog coming over the fence, and they would have did when you hit the girl entertaining cards. And although I saw it was my dog coming over the fen what are you reporting? We gotta some one or something crawling around
out here. You see what it was. I'm out here looking up near the window now and I don't need anything. I don't want to go outside heat. Anybody here, Hello, get somebody out here. What's going on out there? I thought I'm a bit about second four nine. I don't know he's him out there? Yeah, I'm looking right. Hey, everyone, it's Brian. No, you didn't click the wrong podcast. This is
the Sasquatch Odyssey, but I'm not here this week. I just dropped in to tell you guys that I am actually on vacation and Wayne is going to be taking care of you over the next few episodes. Have no fear. He's put together some amazing guests and some amazing encounter stories. I know you guys are going to enjoy them just as much as I have. I will be back with a brand new episode for you guys on Wednesday, May seventeenth, but until then, as always, sit back, relax, and enjoy
the show. Daniel, how are you doing, sir. I'm doing just fine, and thank you for having me. Thank you, yes, sir, Yes, sir, Thank you so very much for taking the time out of your busy day and sunny Los Angeles. What's it like in Cali today? Well, today's a warm day, but prior to today, it's been very cool and rainy in southern California, actually all of California. But now it's starting to warm up, which is a good thing. What is the
temperature usually around this time of year in California? Oh, probably around seventy five, between seventy five and eighty very comfortable. Yeah, the term sunny southern sunny California, or is sunny southern California. We've been in the eighties down here, and I'm in Tennessee lass in Arkansas, and it's gotten up there about ninety A couple of times. Down here, it is. It gets miserable in the summer. Down here. It's cold right now. I
don't know what day I'm wearing clothes. Start out in a sweater, switched a T shirt, back in a sweater. So I'm ready for some eighty degree weather. All right, Daniel, let's get things rolling. First off, I want to hear what gut you started in the big book world. What peat your interest? Was it an encounter? This is what happened and
and win most people who followed me. I can trace my roots to my interest in the subject matter to one movie that I saw at the walk In Theater about nineteen seventy three when I was about ten years old, and it was called The Legend of Boggy Creek. And it, just as I said before, it kind of hit me like a ton of bricks because they were talking about this creature and at the time, ten years old, I didn't know whether they were talking about like a fictional creature or real creature. Because
again you're ten years old and you're looking at something. This movie was kind of a documentary style but also thriller style, to kind of a mix a doc you thriller, so to speak. And so when I was done with that movie, it just kind of lodged into me and I was wanted to know more. And so somehow, probably within the next year or so, I kind of started figuring out what they were talking about in that movie Boggy
Creek in The Foul Monster, that this was like this Bigfoot thing. So I went to the library and I started checking out books on Bigfoot, and that's how I got going. So I got going very young. That's how I got started completely. Yeah, you talked to a lot of people, and that movie, a legendary Boggy Creek, has meant something to so many people. Normally what you hear is the Patterson Gimmlin film obviously is what got
people interested in the subject. But next I have found all the people I've talked to, and that's the first question I ask everyone that I bring on, and it's usually Patty film. And then the legend of Boggy Creek. For me, I was not aware of the Patterson film till much later, or a little bit later, by way of a commercial advertisement I think, for a movie called The Mysterious Monsters, and I think that was part of what they would call today the trailer that you saw commercial on TV. And
that's when I kind of became aware of the Patterson Gimlin film. But even before it was the legend of Boggy Creek that just really sucked me in. I guess if I were a drug addict or an alcoholic and the movie was about either of those subjects, I would have been dead by now. That's funny. Funny we talked about the Paterson Gimblin film, and that's a good
segue into what you know. I think we're gonna be talking about. The majority of this episode is just how much all the knowledge that you have acquired over this film and just your your experience with it. It's my opinion, and I've said this before, the whole mystery with big Foot was solved in nineteen sixty seven. In my opinion, that film proved to everyone that there is an unknown North American primate walking around in the woods. I don't know
what else people need to see. Once you look at that film, what was your opinion? I guess my first opinion was something like, there seems to be something more going on here than what you would consider like a movie that you saw on television where there's a man in a gorilla costume. It didn't have that look and feel to it, and so that's what you know. I knew there was something there to it that looked very real to me, and so as the years went on, I gained more knowledge about it.
But let me backtrack just a second year. In the early middle seventies, I started collecting some of the books, and there weren't a lot of them out, but somehow I managed to find a book, I guess, on the Track of the Sasquatch by John Greene that was published in sixty eight, and so on the back of the book he had his address there. And then I saw that he had I guess, maybe two more booklets, and so I ordered those and I also wrote a letter to him and he
wrote back, probably didn't know. I was just a teenager at the time. And then same thing with Sasquatched by Don Hunter and Renee de Hinden that at the back of his book he had a postal address, and I wrote to him as well, and he wrote back, And like I've told various people, it's like being apprenticeship program with like Kobe Bryant and Wilt Chamberlain or Kobe Bryant and Michael Jordan. However away you want to slice it, I went, I got dialed in or plugged in straight to the top immediately.
So it was good schooling. And so I'm fifty nine now. I didn't know that I would be active this long, but here I am, and I guess I owe part of the credit to those two individuals who are no longer with us. Yeah, I mean you you hit it right on the head when you compared those guys in their field to Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan or you know, because those were a big time and it's awesome everybody can
say that they had mentors like that. That's all very very cool. The main question that I want to ask you, and the question that I have when it comes to the Patterson Gimming with film, and I feel like a lot of people have this question. In your opinion, how were these two cowboys able to get so close to this sasquatch before it realized that they were on them. What happened, in your opinion, My opinion is this is that a couple of things were in their favor. Is that they were on
horseback. They had three horses as they were going walking upstream on Bluff Creek. And so generally, if the creek is going south, or you're going upstream and the stream is going the opposite direction, generally the wind is going to be heading away from the subjects. So in other words, any smell is not going to be pushed towards the subject, the unknown subject that was on that sandbar, and so that could have been part of the element of
surprise. And so the other thing is that it certainly appears, based on my research, that the subject was squatting down in the creek and possibly getting a drink of water, in which case it may have been temporarily distracted. And so I'm writing about this right now. In fact, I was writing about it just yesterday, that this may have been the element surprise, that
they were able to get so close. And so Roger part of his testimony that he told his wife and I visited with pat Patterson May June of two thousand and nine. According to pat Patter, which is the widow of Roger Patterson, she said shortly after the film was shot that Roger was talking in which case. In this case, Patricia Patterson's sister was in the house and
she was on a manual typewriter typing what Roger stated. And part of what he stated was that the subject was crouched down by the creek, and so that was his initial, the very first detection of what he saw. And Roger was ahead of Bob Gimlin, so he saw the thing first, and probably within moments, maybe one, two three, Bob Gimlin would see what Roger saw. And so by then the subject gets up, turns around,
starts to walk away. And so maybe because it was distracted, maybe because the wind was going away from the subject and not towards the subject, and maybe because they were on horseback that everything was different in which they could approach very close. That's my idea about it. And still, you know, various researchers kind of have different estimates as to how close they were. The closest they ever were to the subject. By Roger's own admission, I think
when I first saw it. He said it was about one hundred and twenty feet, and then he was able to close that gap a little bit. But then as he stood still for the later part of the motion picture, the subject gains more distance than you could see it on film as you get closer to the end of the film. Yeah, that's I told you before we got started that I had an opinion. I have a theory of how they got so close, and you and I can't agree on the biggest part
of it. I think horses. The horses have something to do with the reason they were able to get so close. I think there's something to do with big foot and horses. I don't know if they're fascinated with them. I don't. I don't know what it is. But this is just my opinion. Well, if let's us call the subject Patty from care going forward, is that possibly the subject may have seen horses prior to seeing Roger and
Bob. And because it looks like a natural animal, like maybe it's like a deer or something in a way, because it's four legged, is that it wasn't intimidated, it wasn't scared, and maybe he had to do a double take realizing that there were people on these horses that may have caused a
little bit of alarm. But I wanted to address another point that you brought up is that I think you stated that in nineteen sixty seven, this motion picture came in Roger Patterson's film call it the PG Film, and that you indicated it should have settled the matter right there and then, well, a lot of people felt that way. But within that time, from sixty seven to twenty twenty three, a whole new community grew up of skeptics end doubters,
and they even have magazines called Skeptic and Skeptical Enquirer. They kind of failed differently about it. In the sense that we feel that it's a biological, real creature that we know is Bigfoot. They see it as just a man in a costume. There's a whole community out there that has that point
of view, which I don't agree with. But you could see what happened from sixty seven to twenty twenty three that there's this supposing point of view, and unfortunately, I don't think they have a lot of backing because, as I've stated before, if it is just a man in a costume, the proof is in not putting in the sense that it's a man in a costume, then you should be able to duplicate it. But I want to date, they had all this time, almost fifty plus years, and no one
has done it. They've tried to do it. In fact, they had the so called guy Bob Horonymus in an ape suit trying to duplicate it. But it doesn't come anywhere close to what you see in the original PG film, And so that by itself should speak volumes. Absolutely absolutely. We've talked about it several times on this show, and I don't want to misspeak, Daniel, but I believe maybe you can correct me. And I meant to look it up before we came on. I just got busy with my daughter
and I wasn't able to confirm it. But either the a couple of years before or prior to the Petty film, or after the movie Planet of the Apes was out and they won the Academy Award for Best Costume, it was either before or right before or right after. And if that was the best that Hollywood could do as far as costumes, how did these cowboys? How were they able to do that? Stay tuned for more paranormal Odyssey. Well, that's just it. And for the record, it was just months later.
It was I think in February of sixty eight that The Planet of the Apes was released to theaters nationwide. So the PG film came first and then the Planet of the Apes. But yeah, that is a good point, is that what Roger produced is better than what we see in the Planet of the Apes. So then the question is you mean to tell me that a broke cowboy from Yakima, Washington was able to pull off something better than we see in the Planet of the Apes. I mean, he could have been
employed in Hollywood, but he wasn't. He was in Yakima, Washington, right, And he went specifically to the Bluff Creek area, him and Bob Gimlin because there were reports of footprints in that area and they wanted to follow up and they weren't able to get there until October, and that's when they were hoping to see some more tracks, but they didn't. Actually they did
take that back. They were hoping to see some more tracks for a documentary that Roger Patterson wanted to make, but instead of seeing the tracks, they saw literally the track maker. And then they saw the tracks and so it was a two for one, so to speak. So yeah, Plan of the Apes Principal filming began in nineteen sixty seven and the movie was released in nineteen sixty eight and won the Best Oscar. It was sixty eight or sixty
nine that they won the Academy Award. It was hold On, I think it was sixty nine, but the movie came out in sixty eight, and there is no way I'm looking at just the makeup, the hours and hours of the actors in the makeup chairs, There's no way that those two guys could have done this. Stay tuned for more Sasquatch outsee Waring right back after these messages. Yeah, but see, I agree with you one hundred percent.
But again the skeptical and doubting community don't agree because their point of view is that all you're seeing is something on film. It's not physical evidence, not the body. And so a long time ago I was of the firm impression that the only thing that is ever going to settle the question is a body of a bigfoot, and nothing else will suffice. I mean, we have from sixty seven one of the best films ever the world, and science
and the general public isn't buying it one hundred. But if you had a body, you'd have incontest you'd have incontestable, robust, physical evidence that no one can doubt. I mean, you could doubt it, but there's the proof right in front of your face. Unfortunately, I think you're one hundred point Rod Daniel. I say unfortunately, because it's gonna take the death of one of these things. We know that they're out there, we know that they have to pass away, they have to die. In the best case
scenario is someone comes across one that's already to see right right. I don't know that that's going to happen. So then you get the argument between the two different sides and the big quick community, the biological versus the woo Do we need to kill one? And a lot of the biological people say, yeah, that's what it's gonna take. We're gonna have to have someone to take one of these things down. And then you've got the wou side that says, no, these are don't I'm not going to get into all that,
but they don't want to see anybody hurt one of these things. And I can see both sides, I really can. I'm with you, it's going to take a body if you have something like the Paterson Gimblet film, and that's not convincing people. What's going to convince people? You said, at a body, how do you stand on that? Do you think one needs to be killed? Well to prove it? Yes, but just the idea of killing something that we're not really too certain about in terms of where
it is in relationship to man, I don't know. Then you're getting into a lot of questions, ethical questions and whatnot. But then I would stop right there and I would say, all the deer hunters in North America, you know, you can go shoot deer certain certain seasons on the provision that you have a license. But then again, look at all the poachers who
go out without a license and do it anyway. So I'm saying my point is it's whether it's right or wrong is somewhat immaterial, because it's not going to stop someone who's bloodthirsty, who wants to go out just bag one. You see what I'm saying. Yeah, just because there's a stop sign out in the middle of the country at the railroad tracks, I'm sure there's a lot of people that they don't see a train, they're just going to blow right by it. Yeah, you're right, they're exactly right. So Patterson
gimmem a film nineteen sixty seven that coming up on sixty years ago. If sixty seven years ago, why haven't we been able to get more footage, to get at least one more film? And people will argue the Freeman footage is good, and I think it's great. That's probably number two in my opinion on bigfoot evidence. But why haven't we been able to get more footage on par with the Patty Well, two things that come to mind immediately is
one, the rarity of the creatures population can't be that big. I mean, people every day see dogs and cats. That's because they run in the millions and they're domesticated. But something like this, we don't know what the population is, but one could suspect that it's very low. And two, the data seems to suggest that we're dealing with a nocturnal animal more than a
diurnal an animal that operates during the daytime. And so what Roger and Bob saw may have been this thing just getting up to get a drink and going back up into the hills to go sleep again. And so they they may have just you know, every once in a while someone does win the latto and so they hit the big footbotto in the sense that their timing was just
right, and it's inevitable sooner or later something like that would happen. Now with regard to the Freeman footage that was shot in August of ninety two, while the jury is still out on that too, but yeah, in terms of clarity, it's a very good film and a very good video because that
was by then things converted over from film to video. And why someone has not got another video, I'm not certain about, but I would suspect it might have to do something with the fact that they're mostly nighttime creatures and mostly
the numbers aren't that big. I mean, it's not like every day if we talk about a known North American animal such as the wolverine, that you get good pictures or a good video, even though which actually I got a backtrack a little bit just last month, I think, or earlier this month, they got some footage of wolverines in the state of Oregon, which kind of was surprising in the sense that wolverines have not been noted in the state
of Oregon for quite some time, in fact, decades if I'm not mistaken, But it does happen. So I mean it could be. I mean, the show could end today with you and I and tomorrow someone might get the best footage ever of a big foot. I don't know. So why it hasn't happened again, I'm not certain about. But you have to look at who Roger Patterson was in that era. He was a trailblazer literally in the sense that he was going against the grain and he was hell bent on
doing his big footing thing. At the time, the late sixties, he had three children at home and a wife and he and when I spoke with pat Patterson, his widow, I said, well, how do you remember Roger when he got the big foot bug? And I think what she told me just a few words. He was always gone. And so once he got that bigfoot bug, he was always gone, trying to find information or trying to go look somewhere where he could find some information or actually see one
or tracks. And so he was he was gung ho. And so yeah, it seemed like someone not gung ho. He'd probably eventually have success had he lived, had he lived in instead of dying prematurely. Who knows. He may have pulled out another He may have gotten another footage. You know, he was that. I never met Roger Patterson, but the people that knew him said that he was. He was a short guy, about five foot three inches tall, but he was just full of energy and so any
bigfoot was his thing. Like like I said, his wife said, he was always gone, and so that you know, and as he did. Uh. He was interviewed for a documentary in sixty eight by doctor John Napier, and he says that in there when he got that footage, that it was a great moment for him. And so, I mean, most people will never see a big foot to begin with. Not only did he see one, but he had the presence of mind to get his camera out of
his saddle bag on his horse to get some pretty decent footage. Maybe what I'm trying to say, had it not been Roger Patterson, any other person on that horse may have not been may have not been able to pull off what Roger did. So it just really epic. Yeah, as a youngster, he did gymnastics with his brothers, and so because of his agility, that may have helped too, because most people don't realize that his horse reared up and fell over and he fell with it. He was still able to
get on his feet. Wow, I didn't know that, and I certainly did. That's part of his testimony, and I'm right. I'm actually working on another booklet about the Patterson Gimblin film. In nineteen ninety four and then later in two thousand and three, I had a booklet that was called Bigfoot at Bluff Creek, And if I may, I'll show it to you. This is my shop copy. Let's see if we can see it up here we go. And so these things are bold, very hard to get.
They're all sold out. But since that time, from two thousand and three to twenty twenty three, which is what twenty years is, a lot of things have changed in terms of in terms of our knowledge about the PG film. And so I'll be filling in the readers with all those things that people are not necessarily too aware of. For instance, nobody ever had, to my knowledge, on a tape recorder. Asked Bob see when I got going. Roger Patterson was deceased, but I did have access to Bob Gimlin and
on numerous occasions. I consider him a friend and a colleague, and he's I guess ninety years old then. But I asked him, I said, when you guys him and Roger, when you were on that sandbar and started looking around after the creature departed, I said, I asked him, well, how did that subject, Patty, how did she get there to that point where you first saw her? No one, I guess had the presence of mine as an investigator or interrogator or someone who asked questions, asked that
question, and he says, well, it's like this. When we looked right there at the edge of Bluff Creek, we only saw those tracks departing from that creek onto the sandbar and then away. It was just one thing. So that would imply that what the subject was doing to get to that
point, because it didn't fly sasquatches don't fly. It was literally in the creek, and that would suggest something an animal that possesses a great amount of intelligence, that was deliberately trying to avoid leaving tracks, and so it may have got to that point just walking in the creek, decided to get a drink, and then there was disturbances by the horses and Roger and Bob, and then it had no choice but to take off in a different direction on
the sandbar because the only tracks that were seen on that sandbar were from the creek away as the subject walk and was filmed. And then that's it.
And so that is really a very interesting piece of information because prior to that, actually just a few months earlier, John Green and Renee to Hendon were up on Blue Creek Mountain with various other people to examine the Blue Creek Mountain tracks and there were two or three different individuals, I think a fifteen inch track and a thirteen inch track and Blue Creek Mountain from where they saw those tracks to the Patterson Gimblin film site as the crow flies might be six miles,
so that's basically the what I consider the same area. And so maybe when they were examining not those trackways up on Blue Creek Mountain, maybe these hairy furry creatures were looking at them from behind the bush saying like what are they doing looking at these and maybe Patty was part of them, and maybe they kind of said, hey, we should avoid leaving tracks. Wow,
that's interesting. And since you talk about track and the ones too and from the then MK Davis was able to figure out something pretty interesting with the track. Way with all of his work, the work that he's done with the Petterson Gimlin film. What's your opinion on the work that MK Davis has done and particularly what he found out with the track. Well, I don't follow too much of MK Davis's work today. I think a lot of it's very
colorful. But two things that he did that are I think very significant, and I'll be writing about them in the book. I'm actually happy that you mentioned that his number one he was the Bigfooter of the year, I believe in for the Bigfoot Times newsletter, which I edit and published for December of two thousand and seven, may have been December of two thousand and six.
For his singular work, which is as brilliant, is that he found that you could see images on the film itself of what you would call, let's just put it this way, when a boat goes in the water and you look at the back of the boat, there's a wake that's created in the water, and so as the subject is walking on the Patterson Gimblin film site, you could see indentations behind her in certain frames that you can't one hundred percent say that those are tracks, but they're right in line with Patty,
and so it's highly suggestive that is her individual track way. And two, I guess other people have done it since he did it. He did, I guess, one of the first runs of stabilization of the film, and so that was very significant in the sense that you're able to see the best frames of the movie stabilized, and so that was a very worthwhile project.
So those two things that within the film itself you can see indentations behind the subject that are highly suggestive of tracks in the ground because you could see the ground. And two the stabilation stabilization of the film, which is again a very significant piece of work. Everything else he has done I haven't really kept too much track of because he's done so much. It's just like I don't have time to review everything. He has done a lot. He has done
a lot. MK has been on the show once before, and I lock him. I think that he does really, really good work. Have you seen some of the pictures that he's been able to get of the face of Patty's face? Have you caught any of those? I think I've seen some
of it on Facebook, But how can I put it? There's there's only so much you're going to get out of the grain on the film, exactly the full out and the best work that was ever done was done by Renee to Hindon and Bruce Bonney in nineteen eighty when they had access to the original film and they made the cibachrome prints, which the general public didn't really learn
about until much much later. And really, I think until the Internet got going and there were web pages and some websites and then later social media, until all of that was put out there on a large scale, that they realized that there were really sharp frames from the film. And that was from Bonnie, Bruce Bonney and Renee to Hindon and that work was done in nineteen eighty and so that's their work, not so much MK Davis and so MK
Davis never worked with the original film. Bruce Bonney and Renee to Hinden did, So that's the difference. I mean, if you're going to have an opinion about a Picasso, it's not like you could be looking at a second copy to say like, oh, it's this and this and this. To really have an informed opinion, you have to come from the original. That's
true. Yeah, that's that's very true. What do you think about the upcoming like all the AI technology that's coming about now, and what do you think that's going to do to a lot of people that are doing hoaxes and that, because, I mean the AI technology now is mind blowing. Well, I think I think it's going to be able to more quickly expose the videos that are posted on YouTube and whatnot as to whether they're fake or real.
I mean, I don't think anyone keeps track anymore, but there's probably a new Bigfoot video posted to YouTube every week, if not a time every day, and everyone scratching their head as to whether it's real or not. And I always tell people, I said, the first two questions you should ask is who took the who took the video, who took the pictures? And where? And if you don't have that information, back up, walk away and forget about it. Yeah that's great advice. Yeah, well it
is because you have to know the stores. I mean, if you look at the PG film, it was immediately Roger pretty much immediately gave the location away because other investigators got to that film site and we knew immediately within the day who was involved, and it was just Roger Patterson and Bob Gimlin. There was never a mention of Bob Horonymus. He didn't he didn't inject himself into the situation until much later. Stay tuned for more Paranormal Odyssey. And
so that's basically my take on that. But getting back with a I think the beauty of that, in fact, I was listening to a radio program on the way home, is that there are people in the community who are doing maps of North America with all the data points of sightings and footprints. And so what AI does is kind of looks at the past data and makes
a predictive model as to what's going to happen in the future. Right, And so if you could crunch all that data, the more the data the better and say like, oh, here's a predictive model of what might happen in twenty twenty four, and it might say you should be looking for bigfoot in the state of Missouri or the state of Florida, or whatever the case may be. And so yeah, I think AI in general might be a
good thing to have. And with that said, the other thing is these game cameras that are seemed to be getting better and better every time you look up. Is that. I think that's a very good application for what we're doing. And a lot of people think that, oh they can sense him, they could smell plastic or this and that. Well, eventually I think there's going to be a sasquatch that walks by, that trips up, that is not cognizant of this information and we get some good footage. Hope stay
tuned for more sasquatch outsee. Will be right back after these messages. Yeah, thank you. We got our first question of the nut here. Daniel comes from Brown Dwarf. He asked that Daniel know if there's any part of the PEG film that has never been released. No, it's all been released.
In fact, the first people to see the film saw everything, and that was alb Atlee, John Green, Renee de Hendon, Jim McLaren, possibly albi Atlee's wife if she was there at aldi Atlee's home, and that was Sunday, October twenty second, and so they saw the entire thing. So if there was anything not released, they would have known about it and said something because they saw the original thing and they never said like, oh, they've never released this or they've never released that. So no, okay,
So those were the first people that Patterson showed the footage to. Yeah. In fact, that late ald Atlee was probably the very first person ever to see the footage by himself, just to see if something was on the reel before Roger arrived. Bob Gimlin didn't see it originally on October twenty second at the Atlee home because he was home and he was sick and he was tired, and so it was Aldi Atlee, Roger's brother in law, John Green, Renee de Hindon, Jim McLaren, and more than likely Aldie Atlee
wife who lived in that household as well. So they shoot the footage, they get the footage, they have to be you know how in the hall get in heaven. We get it. We did it. We finally got it. What's the first thing they do after they get the footage? Do they immediately do they in the excursion route then and head back or what did
they do? They make the plaster of Paris castings, and then before they make the plaster of Paris castings, they filmed Bob Gimlin walking alongside the tracks with Bob's horse, and then also they got footage of Roger making the plaster of Paris castings. And then they cleared out of the area and they stop in Willow Creek to tell actually phone Al Hodgson, who was living at the time, about what had transpired, and from there they went out to the
to quote unquote airmail the film. But according to Bob Gimlin, when I spoke with him, he says, I do definitely recall being at an airport, and this was more than likely murray Field. And what murray Field did. It wasn't an airport where you jump on like a commercial airport like lax People airport, but it was an airport with small planes that carried certain cargo from point A to point B. And so that's what Murray Phild did at
the time, and they're still open and that's what they still do. They get things, say a set of blueprints or something from one point to the other point. And so it appears that Roger had stopped there with Bob, and that Roger went in and had both of the films, the film of the subject and the film of the footprints airmailed off specifically to his brother in law, brother in law Aldia to take proceed of in Yakima, Washington.
And so if you fly out Friday night, or say, for instance, the weather was bad Friday night, they could still do it first thing in the morning Saturday morning, which is October twenty one. And that journey from yak from Murray, phil to Yakima is a little over four hundred miles,
so you could do that in an airplane within a couple of hours. And so Al the athlete has in his possession the films on Saturday, and there he takes them to get them processed, and then by Sunday he has them all done, probably by Saturday, and by Sunday they're watching the films. So there's there's no impossibility of that scenario. It's it's you could do it. Anyone can do it on the provision that you have a plane. Because
they saw those films first. The premiere showing of the PG film happened October twenty second in Yakima, Washington at Aldie atlets Home. We got another question here the time with Tiffany taken into account how they stumbled upon Patty. In your opinion, do you feel that the woodknock people do really make a difference in some kind of response from yes, I think anyone that wants to do
woodknocks, I would not discourage it. I mean, a woodknock is a woodknock, whether it's a baseball with a baseball bat or with just a piece of wood that's on the forest floor. Is that Yeah, it's I would say it's a good strategy. But back when, in the early days of bigfooting, no one was doing that. But people were hearing these wood knocks and they were wondering who was making them. And it sure seems like our Harry friends Bigfoot are the likely culprits of doing this. We're not certain why,
but perhaps it's a way of getting in touch with your neighbor. We've spent fifty minutes talking about the Patterson Gamle fam. I have a question, so, what made you start the Bigfoot Times? What made you do all
of this? Well, in January of nineteen ninety nine, excuse me, January of nineteen ninety eight, I started the Bigfoot Times newsletter, and my motivation for doing it is because at the time there were other newsletters out there and I felt that they were not as good as they could be, and so I wanted to produce a newsletter that was really good and really worth the
people who were spending money on a subscription to it. And so twenty five years later, the Bigfoot Times is the only one that still stands as a physical newsletter that is printed on paper mailed out to a readership. There's no other newsletter in the world that can say that. And when I started, gradually all the other newsletters that were being published, such as The Bigfoot co Op and Don Keating's Newsletter and a couple of Ray Crow's newsletter from Oregon,
they all went to extinct. And the Bigfoot Time still WIMPs. That's awesome. Quarter of a century, quarter of a century and still going strong. You and I were talked a little bit before before we came on, and go ahead and tell everybody, it's just you that puts this together, right, It's just one person. I'm the editor and the publisher, and I get it printed every month, and I happen to have a copy right here we can see. So this is the January twenty twenty three editions, so
this would be the mark start year of the newsletter. It's always printed on the yellow sheet of paper four pages long, comes out every month and it's super easy to subscribe to, and there's a lot of information. As Henry May from Mississippi says, there's stuff in The Bigfoot Times that you just don't find anywhere. And so he's a long time subscriber, and I'm sure he's a happy subscriber as well. True story, and you can verify this,
Daniel, I've subscribed today. So when should I expect my first as soon as the mail gets there, because your mail was already dropped in the mail a couple of hours ago. Oh wow, so I'm already about to get man, that's awesome. We have another question, is there a digital version of it? At the present time, there's no digital version of The Bigfoot Times. But as time goes on, because people have requested back issues, we're going to digitize them and or make them available in a digital fashion for
people to have. And so that's in the works. But there's I'm a one horse shop, so everything that gets done is by one person alone. So between publishing the newsletter, working nine to five as a union license electrician, and then working on my new book, I've got my hands full.
Yes, you do, because we were talking briefly before we came on, and you're coming up on nine hundreds of these things that you do a month, right, Yeah, So I'm I am literally an expert at folding paper, suffing them in an envelope and getting a stamp on and getting everything else on. I do it very quick, and yeah, it's it takes a little bit the whole. Once the newsletters printed, it takes about another solid two days between work to get them all folded stuff mailed out. And we
got a membership all over the world. The state that has the most memberships as a state of Ohio. For some reason, it's not Washington, it's not Oregon, it's not California, it's Ohio. That's interesting. I find that very interesting too. And I've only been to the Ohio Bigfoot conference one time, picked up quite a bit of memberships there and they're still going strong. I don't know what it is about Ohio, but they love the newsletter,
and so I never piss anyone off in Ohio. And in terms of worldwide, it seems like the UK is the number one place that they get take the newsletter. Wow, really wow, So Ohio they love their grassmen out there. Huh, I guess they do, because the membership there is bigger than Washington State. It's bigger than Oregon, it's bigger than California, and you would expect the opposite, but Ohio, Franks number one, it's it's just one of those things. I'm gonna pup this back up here so
that people can see exactly how they can get their subscription. And it's what less than twenty two bucks for the year, Is that right, Daniel? That's correct. Just go to Bigfoot Times dot net and you could get your own membership. What I think is the most impressive It isn't just the over a quarter of a century of one man doing this by himself. That's impressive enough, but the fact that it's lasted this long in the age that we're in, the age of the Internet. Everyone is digital. You got you
got your encyclopedia in your hand at all times. You can look up whatever you want at any time. The people still choose to pay you to send them four pieces of paper every month so that they How awesome is that? Yeah? That is a very interesting point because we are the being in a digital age where everything's accessible on a laptop or your phone and instead people want
to get a real piece of paper in the mail. And for twenty five years this has been happening and I'm just delighted to be the person behind it. You're doing something right, manly. How should I say if if you've done it for a quarter of century and it's still going that, yes, you must have the right ingredients. Definitely, absolutely, definitely, all right, Lisa, you got anything else? I don't want to keep Daniel. I have a million questions, but I think we should just bringing back for
another time because I've just been sitting here listening and it's amazing. Yeah. Like I said, Daniel, I don't want to keep y'all. Not. My closing statement is that I've investigated for a good part of my life and it's my opinion that what we call bigfoot is a living species here in North America that is extremely rare. It's not or it's not mythology, but biological reality. That's my opinion. Yeah, And there is one thing. The
question is did want to ask you? You you know, in doing the big Foot towns all these years, you do a Bigfooter of the Year. You give an award each year how long have you been doing that since the start? And surprisingly Don Keating from Ohio was the first big Footer of the Year and so that was nineteen ninety eight December of nineteen ninety eight, and at the time he was younger, but he was just on fire and he had a great big foot meet there in Ohio every year. So he is
one of the legendary players of bigfooting from the state of Ohio. And then coincidentally, every year has always been a male. And in two thousand nineteen, people people thought, well, he's just going to pick another guy, another guy, another guy, another guy, because he's a guy and big footings for guys. But in two thousand nineteen b Mills b Ea Mills from the state of Ohio was the first person, first woman ever to pick up the title big Footer of the Year. Wow, she broke the glass ceiling.
And I'm very delighted that she did. And it's just like, so I never had any discrimination going on it just a woman had never risen to that point. And then finally she did it. Yeah, and I don't know how many people that would argue with that. She I just think so many women, I don't know maybe are intimidated to get into this or they're looked at as like, oh, you know, like I tell Wayne, I was a closeted big footter, you know for a long time because you
just kind of do you really believe in that? You know, you get that stigma kind and I think women are just afraid to really come out and dive into the investigations and the research, and it is it's kind of like a boys club, you know, Stay tuned for more Sasquatch out to Sea will be right back after these messages a little bit. But there's there's there's some women that are really out there hitting it hard. So yeah, Jolly Covington, Montana from Texas. Yes, stop on big trips every year.
So that's very commendable activity. Oh yeah, I wish I could do the same, but someone's got to pay the bills in my household. We got a question here. I already told you I was gonna let you go, and I apologize, Daniel, Okay, I did want to get this one in right here from doctor John baron Chog. What does the criteria used to
evaluate who gets the pride? There's no set criteria, but there is it's something that the person has done that's original over the top, that distinguishes them from the path and say, for instance, in twenty nineteen, it was not just finding tracks for b mills, but it was the documentation of the evidence that became very important. So anybody could see tracks, but that level of documentation. Not only that, but from the state of Ohio, the
track ways that she has collected, there's nothing that even comes close. I mean, she has foster of Paris castings that would rival castings from the Pacific Northwest. And then to top that off, the castings that she has of some of the footprints have what we call dermal ridges on the toes, which makes it even more impressive. And she brought all of this to life. It was her investigative abilities, it was her dime everything else that did all
of this. And whether she was a woman or a man, it doesn't matter. It was her work, very unique, very original. And so yeah, that there's no set criteria is the answer that. Yeah, that was a really good question I asked you. I started this line of questioning
for one reason. You are a very respected researcher yourself, and you've gotten to talk to some of the greatest ever of all time, and you put out this this newsletter every year where you picked the best in your opinion, and if you don't want to answer, that's bond in your opinion, Who is the greatest researcher who has done the most for the subject of a bigfoot research well to date my opinion, I would probably have to say John Greene,
who passed away in two thou sixteen as a newspaper journalist, and the books that he published he kind of was able to categorize at everything instead of this stories from the backwoods that he was trying to make better sense of it, that kind of from an anthropological point of view, that it has certain behavioral characteristics and these are the reports and etc. So I would probably have to take my hat off to John green But by the same token, in
terms of best visual evidence, no one can stand next to Roger Patterson. He's alone in that category. So green never got any footage, but still the amount of data that he accumulated prior to the Internet becoming widespread is very, very impressive. Yeah, I would say John Green, Roger Patterson, and I would not leave out Ivan Sanderson, who published this Mammoth book in nineteen sixty one, long before you had any of those tools to do anything
with. I mean, it was all done on a manual typewriter. Oh yeah, all right, yeah, I agree, I would agree with those elections. All right, Daniel, I'm gonna let you go, buddy. I didn't mean to keep you this much over an hour, but let me let me just thank you for taking the time to yes to come and hang out. I've been a fan of yours for a while and I've really enjoyed getting to sit with you. I appreciate it. Me thank you for having
me. And let's hope that within my lifetime at least that maybe we'll have some concrete physical evidence that would be yes, yes, sir, yes, sir. All right, you enjoyed the rest of your day out in sunny California, sir. Okay, Well, thank you, and I'm tuning out. Bye bye, bye bye, thank you. They say you don't gotta go home, but you can't stay here, and no, I don't want to be the line. Were all out time, this tribe, that time, everything calling right back right back, joy for me and try to stay
right now. I'm coming right away. Sin of back, blood, cultural pain, comfortable