Salty Dogs Podcast with Casey Phillips: 2019 Recap

dilready touchdown tampl Day, Derek Books. The most spariable player here the national Football Like third is Tuck Daggers in where You're Gonna wear the Super Bowl. We call them the Salty Dogs. Hello again everybody, and welcome back to I Guess, the final Salty Dogs podcast of the two thousand nineteen season. Even though we're two days into two thousand twenty. Yeah, Happy New Year, by Happy to Year,

jeff I'm Scott Smith's Jeffrey. Then we have an honor resalter Dog with us, Casey Phillips, Thank you guys for having me. Love to kick off the new year. Feel honored to be on this show. Well, you were actually requested. Wow, we're requested guests. One guy sent us like a multipart question, and one was when you're gonna have Casey on again? Wow? Well he became my new favorite fan right there. I don't remember his name. My reply was, it doesn't Casey

do enough? She's on every video? Yeah, I mean seriously, but this one is sounds like particulate special. Sounds like he's getting your case for working too hard. Casey. Yeah, I mean that's rough. I don't know how I'm gonna to handle this burn, this sick burn over here. That's that's what you do when when you're trying to get your next job, you say when they ask you, you know, what's your weakness? I just sometimes I just work. I care too much. That worked too hard. All of my

weaknesses are mostrain. So here's what you're here for, Casey to join us in a sort of a wrap up of the whole season. We usually end up talking at length about the last game, but we're just gonna take a bigger picture. Look here, Yeah, I agree, So we'll do We'll do things like state our opinions on Team MVP and things like that. But is there any topic you want to go over before we get to that, Jeff, pretty good, I mean kind of mellowed after the Are

you mellow right now? After the new year? Out with the old, in with the new. It's a new mellow less less because I've only been at work for two and a half hour and there's no reason to Jack. I mean, I'm gonna have to pick up my saltiness level to make up for years. You've got something you I have a number or a stat think is the most incredible stat about our entire season, the five thousand yards. That's incredible. But I think this is more telling. I

think this sums everything up. The Buccaneers led the league in points allowed off of turnovers with you know, there was a bunch of picks six is there was a lot of turnovers. That was clearly the problem with the season. Right this team takes, you know, put to cut those turnvers in half. Give us the defensive turnaround we got in the second half, and the obviously prolific abilities of the offense, and I think you're at least a winning team and maybe in the playoffs. So that's not the

whole stat though. Wait, there's more behind Drew, I am please tell me Jeff had to quit some some young people at lunch the other day. Where does that come from? Some young people? You know where? I mean? I know it comes from a game show, but which one? I don't think I can name you? Which one's I thought of it the other day? Um? Yeah, yeah, okay. So what's behind door two is the fact that despite allowing the most points off turnovers, the Buccaneers actually outscored their

opponents in points off turnovers. We had a hundred thirty points scored off of turnovers, which is fantastic. You lead leading points scored off turnovers, you're usually in the playoffs unless you're also leading in Uh so doesn't that pretty much say that? As as astounding as that is, it's not shocking. It just does well you saw it well, no, because this was the year of Can you believe it was quarterbacks and then thirty for thirty? Can you believe you had five turnovers in a game and you only

lose by three points? Can you leave that? Can you believe you had a you have? Well, at the time they got hurt, you had the second and third leading receivers in the NFL, and and coach thought they would both get and then can you believe they both pulled hamstrings? Can you can you believe we have the sack leader

in the NFL? Yeah, that's what I thought was cool about that statu is just what it shows about what our defense has been able to do to even create that many turnovers, to have that many options to score points. And to me, one of my can you believe was how many games we were saying that the defense saved the day that after the identity of this Buccaneers team for several years, that we were used to saying, well,

thank goodness, our offense can score forty points. And this year there were several games that it was, man, thank goodness, our defense held them, Our defense forced turnovers, and it was just such a it seemed like such a shift in narrative. It was about mid season where that shifted, because I mean, think of the Rams game. Defense didn't help a lot in that one. Uh, they helped enough. They scored the winning touchdown that they didn't give up fifty six. There you go, all right? So that was

that Those are our favorite stats. It's a good stuff. Yeah, I like that. Can you believe we have the sack leader because hey, we've never had it before, even worn SAP when he had sixteen point five, Leroy Glover at seventeen, but going into last weekend because Chandler Jones went off in week sixteen got four. Yeah, so he's at nineteen and Shacks at sixteen point five and that point, I'm

thinking there's no way. And he and we actually talked about it a little bit because it looked like he was going to lead wire to wire and and then he loses it, and he loses it. Yeah, yeah, nothing like Shack, just letting us wait till the last minute that last game, really trying to hold on it and like almost I love the JPP got several sacks the game before, but I wanted to be like, stop, let's shack that one, which is I'm aware not how it works,

but but it's pretty cool. On bucks dot com or on the app, you can see where they miked up Shack, and it's pretty cool that JPP was very excited for him, saying you got it, you got it. If you haven't seen it, you know, three weeks, maybe this week, maybe this week maybe called small programming. JPP ended up with eight point five sacks and I only played what ten games like that, and he wasn't really in total great

football shap when he first got back. What do you think he would have had and what do you think Shack would have had if JPP had been here all year? Well, I'm of the rising tide lifts all boats kind of philosophy, so I don't think he would have seriously cut into checks total. But yeah, if he had played the whole year and would be playing at the level he's playing at the end, you gotta believe he makes it into

double digits, that would be an amazing right. But we ended up with forty seven sacks, which is the second most we've ever had, So the pass rush is there, at least until March. I'm saying, then we get him back. Only six minutes in the podcast and you're already all right, you ready for this round table type discussion. Let's start with Team MVP. Alright, let me open this up, open one up. Oh you got some? No, I don't I have. This is really kind of embarrassing because Casey's sitting with

papers in front of her. You're sitting in with with papers in front of you. I have nothing all I'm doing is looking at all I have is your email saying hey, here's what I wanted. I'm also going to tell you, so you don't really have to. Well, I understand Casey did a stacking the papers. Yes I did, and you're lucky it didn't make any ambies because Jeff hates the ambient noise. Oh man, when you have a well, see, if I get asked to be on Salty Dogs, I'm

gonna come prepared. I'm gonna come with my research. I'm ready. You know, I'm taking the show seriously, unlike Ja. All here's the thing. I don't need to write it down. I lived it, Okay, Okay, it's all stored up in his memory bank over there. Yeah all right, so you go first case he has our guest. Who's who's the team MVP? Okay, Um, So this is actually the one that I think I struggled with more than any of the others. All the others, like, I had things that

came to me. Yeah real quick. I kind of really put on the I know, I was really hoping this was the one that I wasn't going to go first on, but um, I decided to go with Chris Godwin Um, I felt like it's the combination of not only what he did, but the fact that he made everybody else better that what he lets Mike then do, and the fact that, again we talked about how rare it is to have two teammates over a thousand yards, two teammates at the same position making the Pro Bowl, that that

is rare, that usually it is sort of more of a cannibalistic thing. One guy has an amazing year and

it takes away from everybody else. But he was so reliable and made plays in big moments, And I think about his you know, his catch in Atlanta for that long touchdown early on when we're down three oh, and there's been a couple of turnovers, like he was the kind of guy that could really elevate the moment and the team and and open things up for Mike Evans and and keep Mike from being able to just only

be the one doubled all the time. Um So, yeah, I just I felt in his his work ethic, his locker room presence, everything that they talked about, even as a rookie, he just didn't act like one at all. So his demeanor and then his actual just xs and O's abilities and then what he did for the rest of the offense overall for jamis as a security blanket. At times I thought was really big, if we're at like, if we're this is a democratic debate or something. I think I think she said at all, Like I just

say said what she said. H Well, I mean it would have been my number one choice as I wrote down three names, him and Shack and Lavonte David, but I think I'd go with god one in the end say, I went with Lavonte David. And the reason why I went with Lavonte David is because of his leadership ability that showed this year that out of and some people would think out of nowhere, but Levante is a quiet leader.

He's kind of a quiet guy anyways. But the presence he took command of the locker room and the fact that the defense was playing so poorly in the beginning, and uh, the young guys were paying attention to him and he was Yeah, he played. He had a good year. It gets overshadowed when you're not winning. But I think his leadership ability made him the m v P because we are not going to the playoffs. But I think where we got was because of his leadership. It's a

good choice. I agree with that. One of the good things about the less stretch of season as I felt like people started to give Lavonte the love that he deserves. Yeah, he was getting talked about a lot more, and he tends to be overlooked quite a bit, like as in the Pro Bowl. Yeah. I don't normally discuss or have, you know, say, my conversations what I have with players, but I am going to share this because they thought.

I thought it was so telling. I saw Levante on Monday when we were you know, players are leaving, and um, we shook, gave a hug, and um, he said, I am so excited, And I said really, and he goes, I am so excited for the young guys. How well they came together. And that's why I say about that, is he he just said that how quickly they were grasping once it came together, you know, once they started to understand. And if you start looking at the statistics of the beginning of the year and where we end

up this time, it's it's it's pretty strong. And you know, we always hear that someone's got to be a leader, someone's got to do something, and I was surprised during the year when uh, Bruce arians made a comment, you know, what did you say after a game? He said, I have to say anything Lavante Davon. I think that was after that Tennessee game that was such a brutal loss, And yeah, you heard that. It was that he really did go in there. And it is the fact you

mentioned he's he's a quieter player in general. That to me makes it more um impactful when he does speak. That if it's someone that's always talking, there's maybe not that way to elevate it. But because he is just more of a lead by example guy, when he says something, people listen because he does back it up with his play.

And there were there was the Tennessee game, and I think one or two other games where you heard that if it was either at halftime or after the game, he was the one really stepping in, stepping up to say this is not who we are, this is unacceptable, and you could tell it made an impact on the guys.

It's the Tony Dungee theory. He always said, you know, he was famously not didn't raise his voice much, and the players would say he was that kind, he was that teacher at school that didn't raise your voice, but when he did gave you a little bit attention. Yeah, yeah, I gave you a look. Well, I think it's fun too, is you know, we can discuss m v p s. But it's nice that we have a number of them, and I can remember there are times that we you were looking hard. It's by the way, we're not going

to do any breaks in this one. We're gonna go straight through. So if you came here for that great interstitial music, yeah you're not getting music. I mean that's why I'm here. That means my life is simple. I drop it in and go unless case he starts customing. Well, yeah, you know you alright. Next one biggest surprise of the season, would you like to go first shift? Well, I think your biggest surprise for me would be shock. I just I did not you know, I knew he was a

good player. Um, he's also a really pretty cool person. I think nineteen point five Sex came as a big surprise to so many names. I think, ye. But interesting enough, he was in Denver and we had him on the Salty Dogs and he had talked about how he you know, he was learning behind Von Miller. He was always in the back. The games he did play in in Denver, he was getting a sack. He was getting a sack like almost. I'm not saying he didn't believe it himself.

He definitely believed himself. His goal, as he said, was to get to double digits, and he almost doubled that. So and and it's fascinating that. Um, you know, he bet on himself and I'm always a big believer. He won. He won. I mean, he took a deal, He had a couple of options. He took a one year deal. I mean four million dollars. There is a lot of money, but it's it is amazing. And again, I also like the root for the guys that are really good guys. Yea truly, Um I had that is my number one

choice too. But I'll give one other choice, the fact that the secondary came together, uh, you know, in the second half of the season, because you could We've seen seasons and very recently where the secondary was struggling and it just never got better, right, And we were at this time at one point you could you could reasonably be looking at this going, oh man, the Bucks have really dropped a lot of assets into the secondary draft assets and it's not happening. You're gonna have to start over.

And you know, because we had Rummer Bunting and Carlton Davis and Jamal Dean and nim G Stewart and Mike Edwards and Jordan Whitehead. All these were recent draft picks. So the fact that it came together, it changes everything. And we didn't now in retrospect and go, Okay, I

get it. There they've young guys, I think, no offense, but I think the release of Vernon Hargraves helped kind of put the you know, it made it easier for Lavonte David to be a leader, and it let these guys kind of forge their own path and they decided to work harder and harder. That was the That was a little bit of a surprise, A very pleasant one. Yeah,

Shack was my pick as well. If I was going to go with another one, I think my mind might be um the way that Breshad Paraman finished the year, because I mean he just at the beginning of the season just was almost a non factor. And when you thought that he was going to be your solid number three target, I mean yes, again, Mike and Chris are taking a lot of your targets and and coach kept talking about how it was just opportunities. But all the time,

it's just an opportunities. But like you know, coaches are going to say that regardless, you know, because they're not gonna so yeah, I mean, like you know, you know, a coach isn't gonna want to trash a player of like, oh yeah, well he's not doing what he's supposed to like he I mean, Bruce will occasionally call guys out like that we've seen. But I was like, Okay, is it really opportunities or usually though, if like you you really force them to give you opportunities almost if you're

playing well enough. And I just didn't really know what he was going to pan out to be. And then man, he proved that really was what it was. It was just opportunities. It's hard to be the number three guy on this team. Yeah. Bruce said that on on the show that I Do with him that he said that usually anyone outside of the number one and two guys, and maybe even the number two sometimes are going to walk in on Monday and be a little upset. But he said, you know you you always you love guys

that want the ball. Everyone wants the ball, and he said, there's only so many to go around, and usually if you're a number three guy, you're not getting it very often.

There was something through a statut brushot when he was talking on Mondays along lines of, you know, the first half of the season, you're only catching like thirty three percent of your targets and now here at the end it's up to seventy And I'm like, Okay, this is really a bad sample size issu're here because it was like six out of his first eighteen or something like that.

And targets are kind of a dumbstat that coaches hate because you know, sometimes you're targeted, but it's not really catchable. And he was such a deep ball threat that he's getting a lower percentage type of a pass that's you know, he's not getting these five yards slants that are a lot more gimmy than a sixty yard bomb. So that's also not fair to compare him to other guys. And you also pointed out when he was with Cleveland, he came on in the second half of the year and

it seems the same here. It seems like he's that guy. So if you're ever going to make a playoff run, that's the guy that just wants to put him in like a hermetically sealed bag until him it's eight games and bring him out. And he was pretty solid, very good. All right, let's move on. All right, what was your best What was the best or most enjoyable game for you this year? I guess that's my It was the

Rams game probably, Yeah, that's what I picked. Fireworks. It was so much fun and you went there at the beginning of that how many every many weeks in a row was that we were to be away from home and it was the very beginning of it, and it looked awfully daunting, and in fact it did prove to be. But getting that first win in l A against the team I know they missed the playoffs, but at the time they were defeated, they were they had been in the Super Bowl. They just got done beating the Saints,

and you got, yeah, that's right. And then it made that five and a half hour playing flight home a lot a lot more tolerable when you're getting into four in the morning. Well, I liked it too, because the game previously was such a letdown. Yeah, that was part of what made me pick it was it was such a letdown. So then you go to this game and I think you saw what the team could be. I think that was what you kind of stood there and went, yeah, you want holy smokes, this is this is something special.

But then the defense did what they needed to do to win the game. They got four takeaways in that game. You know, you you kind of forget that because there were so many points that they allowed. They did get four takeaways, They scored the touchdown and one of the one of the touchdowns for the Rams was actually picked six, so you can't blame him for that one. That's also true.

But yeah, I just thought also that getting to watch Sue scoop and score at the end against his former team, and there was just so much to it, the storyline wise, and and it did feel like after that Giants game, that kind of game can be defining in so many ways, but it is such a brutal loss, and to see that the team would respond the way they did gave me a hope that no matter what happens this year, it's not going to mean a permanent downslide after a

negative game like they didn't become contagious, and I thought that is why they were able to even finish the year. The way they were is that this was a team that didn't care what had happened the week before that. Each game, really they were coming in ready to do work. Go ahead. My runner up was the Indie game, just because it was It was wild and was back and forth, and we made a couple of really good comebacks, and mainly because it was at home. We needed to show

that kind of game to the home crowd. What what what I do? What I liked about the Rams game is it it made me think, holy smokes, look at this offense, Look what this office can do. And so there it was a hope factor. You you lose Mike Evans and Chris Godlin down the stretch and Scotty Miller too. That kind of makes it, I know, stepped up, but you know it was. I think it made it easier

for defenses to figure us out. And you saw that in Alaska you only to worry about one guy twenty two points at halftime and none afterwards, and you got over time. So of course the kicking game was an issue there. Alright, Well, how about your least in jobil game Casey Carolina and London, we all picked the same things for everything. I mean you have to go. I mean seven turnovers. That was so brutal, and it was they were leading the whole game. It never felt close.

It was yeah, there was not a time when you're like, oh maybe, no, it just felt from beginning to end and it allowed the Carolina fans to take over, and so it was like, yes, but it very much felt like a road game, which was very brutal, and you

everything that could have gone wrong went wrong. Because that's even the game that Bobo Wilson muffed some punts and was when we ended up releasing him after that, and I just think, I mean, when you have seven turnovers and muffed it, just it was like, got, nothing can

go right here. And then you know that when you talk about how great it us to have that long flight home from l a after win, talk about a nine hour overnight flight on the way home from London, and they're also just as so much build up to that game because it's the London game. But if that game actually happens at home and it happens exactly the

same way, yes, it's still brutal. But it's not. It doesn't feel as weighty in some ways because it was London and you go early and it's this whole international scale things that just it was everything that could have gone wrong went wrong. I remember after the first play my head dropped and I went, we came all this way for this, and that's how I felt. That's how

I felt, because it is. It's a brutal trip. It's there were a lot of games, especially down the stretch, where it started off bad, when we were able to rally this time it just never happened, and we started to get a little bit close. You started to believe it was possible, and then the Bobo Wilson, well you weren't really sure if you're able to come back. And then as the season went a pick six didn't bother you,

as it was like, okay, game on, let's go. So yeah that I will say my second least favorite game was the Giants game, and uh that game. I thought it was an exciting game. It was a game the big way it ended and because it was going to be the way it ended. And then it was the start of being on the road for seven straight weeks and usually you you go back and look at the game you lost, and you go, if that play had happened, that played it happened, it probably comes out differently, but

you don't know for sure. Like the Tennessee game, if they had if they had allowed that punter that fumble return, we feel like we probably would have won, But you don't know for sure, because there's still times on the game when it's a kick at the end of regulation to win it. You can very much, you can very much say that's what happened. I will say, I will say, you know, we were talking about the best games. I do want to throw in. I thought the Seattle game

ranked up there was great. It was a good and it sucked that that that we lost, but it was a fun game. It was entertaining and I and I I don't care what anybody else says. Had we won the coin toss, I think we would have won because I think both defenses were exhausted. Somebody might point to week seven. I at going to say that at least you could say that we managed, we managed to keep short. But the good news the reason why I say we were going to the reason why I was gonna, the

reason why I feel that way is. You gotta remember Jamis did march them down to tie the game. Yeah, so he was on a roll at that point. Point and in and in our last game, you brought it up. We scored twenty two points in the first half. We score anything in the second half. Yeah, alright, Jeff, you want to go first. I don't know if you got

a best offensive play of the whole seat. By the way, let me point out I have a few questions we could sprinkle in and I should read this because this guy didn't know we were going to do this, and he said, Happy New Year, Salty Dogs. Since news, music, and sports media are looking at the best of two thousand nineteen, why not get the Salty Dogs best of two thousand nineteen, like best offensive and best defensive play. Wow. I hope you both have an awesome offseason and look

forward to next year. Go Bucks. Kent Denny from Tampa, we've heard things, can't Yeah, he nailed it. Yeah you were you rud our mind actually resund and let him know the best offensive. So this segment is brought to you by Kent Any of Tampa. I am going to say, Chris Godwin Detroit game, which play the touchdown, the one handed grap oh, the one where he's fallen backwards, like, okay, that's right. Yeah, yeah, that was a tough play. Did

show off his skills, didn't Yeah? I had forgot about that when even Bruce talked about how he couldn't believe that he came away with it, that everybody went from thinking it was a pick to being a touchdown. I forgot about that one. That's good. Yeah, you know, this is a weird one for me because the one that jumped out right away to me is actually the play in which Mike Evins got hurt. So it's hard to say the best play the year, but it was indicative

of what this team can do. It was a sixty one year touchdown, which is awesome, but it also was just Jamie sees I probably single high coverage. Mike's out here, hey beach golf, the line, straight fly, and we we hit that play a lot this year, even with Brashad Perryman, and it's when when Jamis is on and my healthy. It just kind of shows what this offense can do in a in a moment. Now, it's maybe not the best choice for the best stuff, it's a place since

Mike suffered a season ending injury on it. But it's the one that Amelily pops out in my head. I wait to you, guys, I do have a second one, Okay, So I went more of the favorite offensive place you have to It's funny because I thought about jokingly just like eliminating some of my workload here and saying that was my favorite offensive and defensive play of the year,

since he's a defensive player that I could count for both. Um. I just thought that it was so fun and I mean, and it's also really impressive that you have someone like him that can be such a weapon in so many different ways. Um and just and it spoke to Bruce arians talking about how their whole staff was all about looking at the players they had and using them in the ways that they are best capable. I mean, there is no better example of that. He said. Putting in

there in that role was not a gimmick. He said, he was our best choice on this roster, the best

choice for the this job that we want. Yep. And so I thought that was great and I I felt like it was sort of also at a turning point in the season when that that win in Atlanta was a really big deal and it was um when the team just started being able to have fun again that they you know, they had this losing streak and it just it felt like, man, like, this has been so rough and you know, this long road stretch and all these sort of points of adversity, and that felt like

this moment of man, we can really celebrate what we're becoming now. So and Dirk Cutterard was a little scorn on that one because look what he did the last game. He's like, I see your big Yeah, I see your big touchdown. I raised because it's not a two yard passed now. You don't see that kind of big had He had to run like twenty two yards after he caught the trusting a big man to have the ball

for that long is impressive. Does a Bruce was saying, and why they did this with Van it was like he doesn't have to go anywhere, he doesn't have to We had him on the show and if you watch it now and think about him saying this, he said, first of all, when he caught it, he was certain there was somebody right behind him. He thought he was going to get hit right away. That's why he's like tucking the ball right and then he ran almost the back of the end zone and he told us he

didn't realize he was in the end zone yet. He was just making sure I am going to score no matter what. He's about to do a forest gump and just keep running out of I thought of one other two that it would be a runner up for me, and I'm glad it's Chris Godwin because he had so many great plays. But remember I think it was in Atlanta. Yeah, that was the one I brought up earlier when I

talked about him being the MVP. I didn't get a picture of my mind till now, but it's one where he kind of caught it between two guys and the linebacker fell off and he actually had to I think stiff farm one of them off of him, and it was pretty gread. Yeah, that would have been my second choice as well, after the VA one. I loved that play. I thought that spoke so much to him and just his ability to be so slippery. I can do it all, he can. Yeah, it doesn't matter where you put that ball,

he'll get the first guy. There was a play in maybe he was in the last game when he got hurt where he caught the ball around the tin and there was one defender. I'm like, he's not going down in the tin that first guy. Very rarely does the first defender get Chris God went down, and unless he's catching it in a defenseless way, but if he catches it with any room to maneuver off, the first guy almost never get them down, which is pretty great skill

to have. Okay, um, best defensive play, I think it's my turn. Um, My mine is the Jamal Dean interception in the Arizona game. Just first of all, it was a game changing play. We were losing, they were about to go by another score probably, and it set up the game winning score. But moreover, it also was really

the first inkling of what we had there. It was it was the one where he said he he knew what was going to happen because he's been doing all that extra tape study with Todd Bowls and he saw the alignments like there's only one place this throws going and that that was the result of extra studies. So not only was it a critical play, it also was a really good emblem of what was going to happen in the second half of the season. That's a great one. Yeah, that would have been That was one of my second

choice ones. So I like that one as well. Um I picked I sort of had a tie in my mind with these two, uh, Devin White's two different fumble recoveries for touchdowns. UM. I couldn't really pick between the two because I felt like the one against the Jags was more important because of what it actually meant for the game and a win. Um. But when you returned, Yeah, then I was like, why so I can't decide even though we lost that game like that, they were just

kind of tied in my mind. And then I thought I kind of put him together, you know, at the idea that he was the you know what, is the first rookie to score touchdowns on defensive fumble recoveries to two of them since so I felt like those kind of package deal. Those those were my my favorite bodies. Way. UM, this is a good place to mention that. Today it was announced in the morning that Devin White was named the NFL Defensive Player of the Month. I think we

often say NFC, but it's actually just an NFL. It's it's not split up by conferences, and he's the first guy. He won in November two and he's the first guy to win it two consecutive months since Brian Cushing in two thousand nine. And they've been given this awardaway since would he be at the first rookie to get it. It's it's just Defensive Rookie of the Month, so it's already I'm not sure, but I had defensive rookie because the first guy to win that in consecutive months since

Brian Cushing in two thousand nine. So he had he was basically the most impactful defensive rookie in the league for the second half of the season. And you know, he had the knee injury and Bruce what he's talks about how that really slowed him down at first. But you saw the player they said we were getting when we picked up fifth the world And it's really exciting.

Isn't he the first Buck to get it twice? He's the first Buck to get it twice ever, But yeah, Lavante wanted Wance to no one want to know Spence, but he's the first to get it twice. It's pretty incredible. So, yeah, I Hain made the right choice. Yeah, I think, so I have to go with run. You know, I timed that last night. I found it on YouTube and timed it from the moment he touched the ball till when he scores. It was like ten point one two seconds. He is a very fast and ninety one yards in

ten like, isn't a great hundred yard way. They do hundred meters, don't they. Right, Yeah, you're yourself, But I'm just trying to figure out how fast that is. If that's really good. It seems really good. He looked really fast. Yeah, and he's carrying the ball which slows you down to But I remember his forty time at the combine. That was the thing that ever that got us really excited.

I mean I thought about between him, Jamal Dean, and then maybe it was it Bundy, that we had three guys that they're forty times Jamal Dean was, I think, yeah, so, and I think that Devin was one of, if not the fastest linebacker to we have some of the guys that were really they wanted a lot more speed on defense. I kind of agree with both of you, though, because Jamal Dean his interception sealed the deal from the game, so you gotta have to you kind of remember that.

But but Devin White having u the year that he had, being injured and still coming back and playing strong, I think you know you can the guys is I've never seen anybody as fast as he is. And sometimes he's too fast because you see him somethings run over the play, which is not a bad thing because eventually he'll figure out the justice speed. But I would go with there was there was a stretch in the Giants game when it seemed like Shack Barrett was getting a sack every

two seconds, and then that was as a group of players. Yeah, he ended up with four but didn't win Defensive Player of the Week because they never give it to a losing team, which is just which is yeah, I wanted the week before. So all right, uh, top unanswered question idea.

And so here's what I did. I mean, everyone knows it's the Jamis thing, so I decided to say that like other than that, because so what I went with is who's going to be back from the defensive front, so sort of D line outside linebacker combination, which I figured is what we'd all go with on the other than Jamis. Yea, um, nineteen players on this team could become unrestricted free agents. That is incredible, and seven of those are outside linebacker or d line people. If you'd

like to know the names, you can look up. I wrote a story about that on Tuesday, I think. But yes, Sue Jpp, massive shock. I mean, man, this is there's the potential for a coach, right, of course he does. He's also not the one having to deal with the salary cap, you know, like our guy Mike Greenberg, who's the one who does that is probably back their sweating hearing. Yeah, and then and even when he's like talking everybody up so much, don't you know that over there, like you're

driving the price up? But yeah, I mean I think that the only guys who really aren't I think are are what Goldston Vita and Anthony Nelson. That's about it in terms of the defensive line and outside linebackers. Um and I just think that not only is it important just because of what they did, We've talked so much about the young secondary and how important it has been the change that they've been able to have the growth and that do we really you know, think that this

group is what it takes to to get the job done. Well, so much of that is depending on how long do they have to cover, And you know when you're they're still gonna be young next year, that even though yeah, they're not gonna be rookies anymore, they're still gonna be very young. And the more help you can give them up front, the better. So to me, that is just such a massive part of this team's success moving forward is do you still have the pressure that you had

this year? You know, it's great about when you look at the you start looking up the numbers to demonstrate what we all saw that the defense pulled a big one eight in the second half of the season, right, Uh, so much improved? Is that? Usually when I think about the sands, I'm thinking, Okay, I'm gonna look up many yards per game we allowed in the first half of the second half and showed the big difference that way, And there was a difference, But that's not where the

it really shows up. Where it shows up as is the play the playmakers, the plays that were being made, Like I don't remember exactly, but I wrote it in a story something like led the league and passes defense led the league. In quarterback hits was up there and sacks was up there and interceptions was up there in turnovers, takeaways, fumbles, force phone recovers the plays, and I think that's a

Todd Bowls defense. And personally, after watching the type style defense we've been playing for previous years, I like this a lot more. And I don't care about the arts because that's what the NFL is now. It's making plays, right. Yeah, I would agree with that, and I I think his

defense is really fun to watch. I mean, all the blitz is, all the different things he's calling up and dialing up, and it's and I I noticed such a theme this year and all the different radio shows that I did when I would bring a player on and I would ask every one of them if they run the defense, about Todd Bowls, his scheme and system, what they liked about it. All of them were so fired at their their eyes were sort of light at their I love his scheme and his system and lets it's fun,

It's got different stuff. It lets us do a bunch of different things, and it lets them play aggressive. And I think that's why we saw such a shift in the second half of the season, is when you're being called to be that aggressive, you have to be instinctive and reactive that it's you've got to be going immediately, and if you're having to think about what you're doing,

it's not gonna work very well. So you saw when they really understood the scheme, when it started clicking where it was reactionary and not something you're having to think

about each play, That's when the shift happened. I what I like about the D line is and it's pretty impressive when you start thinking about all the different personalities that came in on that line and got and how they all meshed together, I mean loud and brash, yeah, and then bringing Sue in, you know, that was that was that was a great He was a very good leader, and that was a big you know, we kind of go by the wayside, but you know, Gerald McCoy leaves

and they fill that gap with with Sue and he and the play in the leadership. Yes, and and then and then you have j P. P who is the fiery guy, but he comes back in and gets everybody going. It is such a good combination of the subdued, calm

leadership and the fiery leadership. And I think that on the defensive line you do kind of need this balance that I think that Sue and JPP really are kind of a nice tandem there, and then you have guys like Shack and Vita that like there, they'll be fired up, but they're just kind of these good, good guys that

are good locker room guys that everybody likes. And I think about even how Vita would talk about how um he had started calling Sue big girl just to get him to smile and crack a little bit, and I just can do that. But yeah, yelling if if, if you see Sue in public, I would not recommend try and that probably need to be bigger than him, and not many people either that. Or you gotta be like all the way down the hallway when you yelling yes, you gotta be ready to run and then you go no, no,

I wasn't talking about you there behind somebody else. So yeah, to be specific, I had the exact same thing obviously, the Friege losses. And I don't think I don't think the betting man would think we're going to get all of those guys back. It doesn't seem likely. So it's going to be where does this team put its priorities

between Shack, Sue, Karl Nassa, JPP, and so on. I think it's going to be interesting to see how much of it is about our priorities of who we want to bring back is compared to just what other teams end up offering these guys that it may end up depending more on what other teams think of them even than what we do, because we might be prioritizing a certain guy all day long. But if you know, like let's say, if Shack is, let's say Shacks our top priority.

I don't know, but they've they've seem to make it pretty clear they want him back. Seems like a safe bet. So let's say he's our top priority. Let's say JPP is your second, and you you value him like crazy and one back. But let's say another team makes him their top priority in the position that we did with Shack. It's gonna be hard to compete against that. It's gonna be hard to get it done. Sorry, Mike Greenberg, would

you I'm just curious. You don't have to answer this, just just a thought when you were when you're talking about this, would you would you let a guy like Shack go because of what he's going to cost you and you get to keep a couple others. It's a valid point, but no, yeah, I'm the same way. I'd keep I'd keep the surefire star producing a guy and that's so hard to find. And let's not and let's not forget he's what seven now and doesn't have the miles on him that a guy has. That was the

big starter. You know that when he's getting to play behind von Miller, that that keeps his body fresh a little bit longer. And I don't think he was flukey like you. You know, you saw a real legitimate pass rush skills, the bend to get around the guard. And I agree with that because in the last game of the year he got three sacks, so they had Yeah, they could have been doubling him. That even when we saw that he was all of a sudden the one

getting all the attention, he was still producing. And the other thing about his longevity that I think is important is he talked about how he was late to the party of understanding how to take care of your body. That he says he looks at pictures of himself now from like end of college, like without a shirt on, and he's like, oh gosh, like like he said that himself that he's like, man like, it's crazy how you can maybe even weigh the same thing, but your body

composition just be so different. And so I think that he's made leaps and bounds and changes in his diet and just all these things about the way he's taking care of his body over the last few years that if he's been producing the way that he had up to this point, I think it can only get better moving forward. You know, it's funny if you look at it. Back during the draft, we were picking fifth and it was a good draft for what people considered we're good

edge rushers. And then it was pretty clear that we like Devin White quite a bit, and a lot of the mock drafts were giving us deepn White and somebody I'm not sure who, but if I had a mirror in here, I'd probably pick him out. Uh. Really felt like, yeah, Devin White's a one of a kind player, But it's so hard to find an edge rusher. I kind of hope we take like a Josh Allen or something. They knew what they were doing, They took a guy that they can make the impact over the field, and they

found an edge rusher. Anyway, Yeah, that's why they do what they do, and that's why we just talk about it. All right, one more. Alright, it's a little bit different because it's kind of looking ahead a little bit. What play or do you think Mike make the leap in? Ye? I have to say, Dean, he wouldn't give him the leap yet. I don't. I don't give him the leap yet. Um, once he learns to catch the ball every time he's

thrown to him, that Davis well the same. It seems like all those guys, if they start catching a better than all, they all need to stand by the juge machine and start working out. Because if they all start Sean catches the ball pretty well. Yeah, yeah, he does. He does bring it up. His little smile is a little grand sure hands. Yeah, I think that, uh, I think it would be huge. It would be huge, huge

for the te huge. How about um Anthony Nelson? Based on the fact that, A. I know they loved him when when we got him in the fourth round, I think they were ecstatic upstairs. They thought we got a total steal and that he was playing in the rotation before he got hurt. That hamstring injury knocked him out for like eight games, but he wantn't forget about him. But yeah, and you there's nothing in the stats yet they would I think in one sack that you would

go crazy over. But think about the fact that we may not be able to get all these guys back and we're gonna need some of his step up point. And they love his talent. He seems like a smart kid. Yeah, I think that's great. I have a mainstream choice and I have a sleeper choice. Okay, Um, the sleeper choice will be for the serious Bocks fans that like, you have to really be a serious Bucks fan to know who this person even is. So my first time Franklin, No,

but that would be great. My my mainstream choice is Carlton Davis. And the reason that I say that I think him for the leap ideas that, Um, what has always been sort of the best and worst part of Carlton is his aggressiveness that he plays with his physicalness and his excitement and energy and all of that. And it's great because it makes him makes him big plays, and it's terrible because it makes him be penalized a

fair amount. And we saw the penalties just almost disappear as at that midway point in the season that he ends up getting heard, he misses him time and he uses it to really delve into film, and it just seemed like the same way we talked about Jamal Dean having that shift after the Seattle game where he really learned how to learn essentially and learn it's spent all that time with bowls and looking at the film, it felt like Carlton Davis had a similar epiphany almost of

how to still play with aggressiveness but rain it in just enough to make it legal. And I felt like that just if we can get rid of those penalties from him, and then he also started, you know, it felt like the defining moment for him also was when Hardgraves left. All of a sudden, He's being asked to always consistently beyond the number one guy, and we saw how he shut down DeAndre Hopkins, and it just felt like he elevated to the role he was being called

upon when Hardgraves left. So the leap for him because both him and Dean and Murphy Buntin kind of showed in the second half they're good cornerbacks. The lead for him would be to become recognized as one of the better cornerbacks, yes, and an actual lockdown that you don't want to throw in his direction. That's yeah. My sleeper choice is to Dakota Dixon because coach mentioned yeah. And so he comes in undrafted guy, I mean, not even

slated to make the team, the gitimately the nicest person everything. Think. We had him on the podcast. He won the award in college for essentially being like an amazing person. It's the Jason Witten Character Award. That's just like, yeah, it's

basically the award is like, you're an incredible human. So he has an incredible story that I'm not even gonna get into like full details of because my plan is to do like an end up interview with him this this offseason and and get into like his his upgrading during his background. Yes, so I'm not going to spoil all of that, but he has an incredible story. Comes here as an undrafted guy, not set to make the team,

and then just slowly you watch during training camp. He's like your sixth safety, then he's your fifth, then he's your fourth, and he's slowly moving up, and all of a sudden he's running with the starters, and I was like, man, I wonder how much this is really indicative of how they feel about him, and it seemed like the coaches were saying some good things about him, and honestly, then he ends up hurting his shoulder. But what's crazy you found out that he he was injuring it while this

was going on. He was moving up the depth chart while struggling with his shoulder, but like slipping in and out of socket like that. He tried to kind of go through because of course, you know how it is when you're an undrafted guy and you're trying to make the team, like and finally just it was like slipping in and out of socket. I'll talk like he and and to realize that he was, yeah, I love that I'm in here and you guys are the ones that

get the He had that injury twice. That's fair. I get the way with these things, banging up against the Georgiana but while not being a hunter percent healthy, climbing the ranks like that. And then it wasn't until coaches press conference this last week that he said that he actually said, I think he would have been one of

our starting safeties. He had a shot at that, and I was like, wow, Okay, so that really did mean what I thought it meant watching him and training against I don't think we're gonna have to time to get to these questions here. But one of them did what are you worried about? Yeah, we got all the time in the world. Well, okay, then I'll just we can. There's three questions here. In one of them, in case you're worried, forty three minutes. Okay. This guy's name is

Justin Whittaker. He's a Bucks fan from Indianapolis. He said, thanks for a great podcast, and he says a big fan of show. One of his questions is Justin EM's being hurt all year. What is the plan with him? Is he coming back as the starter? And so do you think you will mess up the chemistry with this young secondary? And that that's actually how coach came to talk about uh Dakota because he was asked about what he thought about the secondary where the state of it,

and he said, I think we're find a cornerback. We may need to add somebody at safety, but they said, but maybe not, because as Casey was just saying, he said, Dacota Dixon had a chance to be the starting strong safety before he got hurt and he'll be back, and then he said and maybe Justin Evans. And then he was pressed a little bit on Justin Evans and he said, it's too early to tell. He recently had another procedure, I guess, on his foot, and he said the surgery

apparently went well. It's gonna be a couple of months. But if if he's ready to go by the off season, because he never really got back last year, so he hasn't really had a chance to see if he could be good in this. It will be hard though, knowing that again he doesn't have any of those reps in this new scheme, and that's tough. As we talked about that's I mean, that is what we talked about as being what changed for them is that they got to

start playing instinctively instead of reactively. And it's going to be a while before he's at that point. So you better hope he's back for the entirety of the off season program to try to get some of those out of the way, so then you'd have him, you'd have Jordan Whitehead, Mike Edwards. Mike Edwards who they drafted because thought it was a good fit for this defense, I think you'd have to resign. The team is in good

shape if they can just figure out the D line. Well, if they can just figure out if we can get the right guys, resign. Yeah, if you can figure out those oh, I don't know nineteen guys that we don't know if they're going to be back. So do you have a player making a leap? I did Jeff stuff. I just forget it. Like two minutes later, do you have one? I did one? Anthony Nelson? Okay, that's what you guys don't even listen to each other over here.

It's like an old married couple. Yes, doesn't even hear. Well, all right, then there we're done then, so if you really are Uh, you got any more questions? Uh? This also said do you think we bring back all the D line starters for next year or the majority of I think we already covered that. What what do you think is a plan? With jamis if I knew that, we'd be making a lot of money if we had that idea. Um. Bruce has said a lot of things on both sides of it, and I don't think there's Okay,

let's put it this way. He told them on Monday that he thinks the evaluation and then the decision on what the Bucks want to do with Jamie's moving forward. First of all, remember this is a two way street. Let's use the franchise tag. So um. He said they probably could have a decision internally within a couple of weeks. But that doesn't mean we're going to tell anybody because for strategic purposes. Yeah, there's no reason too, we may have to wait till March. Do we really know? What

you think? Too? Is that this is without being said, but I will say it. This is a huge free Chies decision. You think, yeah, just a tag. So it's not the same as as any other player that there's a lot more layers of people involved in this kind of a decision, right, And I say that from the very top because it's it's the owner's money too, all the way down to how does this play out? And you know the pros and the con so you know you could argue this all day long one way or

the other. I mean, when I discussed with people, I would say, if you think the three three possible paths are get him signed to a long term deal, use a tag on him, or let him go. Most of the people I talked to you think that shall come down in the middle and use a tag so you have one more year to figure it out. The only problem with the tag is you it's going to hit your cap hard, harder than if you decide to do

it more long. Yes, and if you're in that situation of would you say nineteen people, if you're trying to figure out let's say you're only trying to sign money for six, yeah, that could be tough because it just so happens to be on a year that there are so many free agents that the timing of that is unfortunate, that Jamis and all those and it's kind of like

what we talked about that it just so happened. You know, the year before that you had Kwan, Adam Humphries, Jamis, Donovan Alley, all these guys ending their rookie deals all at the same time. But if those yeah, that's a great draft. But if those players had been sort of spread out, it would have been easier to keep more of them. It was the fact that it was all at once, And and I kind of chuckle whenever people say, well, go get this quarterback and go get that quarterback like Trees.

Well there you know there's I mean, I'll use a name like Teddy Bridgewater. If you go back and look at when he was in Minnesota, no one thought they were like, you gotta get rid of this guy. But he was well, he was getting hurt a lot, so playing time very very badly. And then what happened. It took him a couple of years to make it back right, So I think he was a first round draft pick. Let's not forget No, that's what I'm saying. But but it's what I'm going at is you just don't know.

You know, one minute you're high, one minute, you're low one minute. But any free agent quarterback right now is going to cost you money. I'll give you what I think is a better example for what you're saying, and that would be Nick Foles a jillion dollars. I think that's what I heard the contract actually, and um, he was the m v P of the Super Bowl. And he's had more than just that he's had. He's had good, good years and I could see why the Jagger has

thought he could be the solution. But now they're on the hook and they're not sure if they if he's their guy, so a it cost a whole lot. And let me ask you a question. This this, this is kind of a year a year ago at this time they thought he was their guy. Yeah, that's my point. But I know, so, how in a year's time is he not your guy? Well, he didn't play well, I understand,

but perhaps they didn't play well. So so I don't understand how in in one year go from yes, I mean you do all this research, you do all because the NFL is a what have you done? That's kind of funny, unfortunate. It's kind of funny that Nick Foles used to kill us no matter what team he was playing for. He demolished us in several games, and it was it was us. They kind of got him. Yeah,

we got him knocked out of the starting lineup. That just overwhelmed rude that he hasn't, you know, publicly thanked us for some of his success. But but you know, I mean what I think that where Jacksonville is now, now that they have the clock set on the proper time, that will change everything. Did you rid about Tom Coughlin

being gone? I remember that that was the first big move they made the time real time I remember that from when we were there for preseason, when we practiced there for a week, and that I thought I was all confused about what time because I look at the clock and think it was time to like run out to practice or something. And then I look at my phone and I was like, I don't know what is happening.

And I remember one of my friends that works with the Jaguars was the one that explained to me that, oh, yeah, he sets it ahead for you to get there to meetings earlier. He's been doing that his whole career. He started that back Whens with the Giants. I don't think the team's generally end up liking it very much either. I can understand why it reminds me, uncomfortably a little too much of toes on the line start Alright, One more question, yeah, yo dogs, Yo dogs. Read the article

about how the Bucks rookies ranked in the NFL. If you guys saw that, but like first in force fumbls, first in touchdowns first, and interceptions first and passes defense from the rookies alone, what do you think? Where do you think this draft class ranks among all those in team history? Or is it too early to tell? Thanks and Happy New Year. A J calls himself a displaced Bucks fan in Texas the greatest I do. Yeah, we know everybody in Texas knows each other. We have a

Facebook group. Um yeah, I mean obviously he kind of he kind of tipped it there. It is too early to tell, I think, but yes, what is it? Three years is typically what you say about to evaluate a draft. I think three years is right. Yeah, but it's certainly very promising. Yeah. Uh, you know when you look at it, there's a couple of draft classes recently that are pretty promising. I mean think of last year. You've got Vita Vea,

and you've got Alex Cappyr, Carlton Davis, Jordan Whitehead. I mean, you forget though what they for you forget, and then in seventeen you got O G. You got Chris Gent. Unfortunate what happened to kindle back with But it was a good pick. He would I think that if it weren't with that car wreck, he would have made a massive difference on this defense. And so it's unfortunate because to me, you should still give them credit for that

being a great pick. It's just unfortunate. Uh, you know, after that you gotta go back aways to get to some good draft picks, but um, I don't know. The obviously there's probably no class is probably never gonna be topped because you got too. It's a little hard to top that. The rest of the draft really wasn't very productive though, but it doesn't matter now. And that's an

interesting point. How do you evaluate a draft of if let's say you're first and second round picks are incredible and nothing else pans out as compared to all of your picks pan out but none to the extreme, Like, which do you tend to go for a quality or quantity to consider a draft as successful? Let me ask you this, which one would you want? Personally? I almost want the one where you have more guys work out, because again, with injuries in a season, you can lose

one guy. Did I say the first two were incredible? I guess it depends how incredible and how like mediocre or not the other like if everybody pans out how well? You know? I mean, it's hard to kind of say that in general, but I think I personally am am a big believer in more. I mean, when you gets that's I mean, somebody told you you can have Warren step and Derrick Brooks and you knew they were gonna be Hall of famers, but you lose all the rest of your draft picks. You're gay, Okay, well I have

to have I don't know. If you look at New England, they do quite quite nicely without top round picks. How about the Rams. They don't have a first round picks two and their cap situation is Yeah, they're in a rough spot for the next few years. I think, all right, well that's all I got. That's it. Thanks, Yeah, thanks, has easy peasy done for the year. When when are we doing another one? A long time? Probably the Salty Dogs are going into hibernation where definitely not going to

do the combine? Are you into the combine? I always have to go to the combine. Look at how excited he is because he gets to hang out with me for a whole week. That's lucky dogs, you are U. The bad part is that it's in Indianapolis. Yes, and it's for Indianapolis if it was whatever the team does. But it's a great little city. It's not a good place in late February. You don't even have to go outside.

I know everybody says that it's all connected. I will forever remember us having to stand outside and do one of our videos because you know, we care about quality and we, for the sacrifice of the people, will stand in the cold if it's a good backdrop for us. And we are dying of cold, and dan Quinn just goes jogging behind us in like shorts and a T shirt.

I was like, that's that's a flex right there. And he even said he's like, hey, guys and just keeps on running and we're just so bundled and he's out there running a smiling first of all, smiling while running already insane, and then in the freezing so I was like already. Yeah. He made us just feel like idiots out there freezing into gold. But a lot of people made me feel like so there you go. Well, Casey, thank you for taking your time. Thanks most of the

times our guests right here for ten minutes. She did a full hour, Yeah she did. You know, it was fun. It was a good year. We'll do it again next year. Maybe we'll have to check the charts and see how we we need to update the intro with some plays. He hates because it's more work for him Yeah, I think I'm gonna eliminate the intro. Yeah, we just go straight to us. That's how popular we are now. All right, since you did, Thanks for listening.