In this episode, I'm speaking with Anna Gaynor. Anna describes herself as a career well being strategist. She shares strategies to help you prioritize well being and And maintain work life harmony with less hustle. I am so excited to have Anna in the studio today. She is vulnerable as she shares her own personal journey with overcoming extreme challenges and then becoming the person that she is today. I'm inspired by Anna every single day. Let's dive in.
Securing a big salary should be as easy as asking for more, right? Turns out, it's a little bit more than that. First, let me ask you, which of these apply to you? Reading org announcements with envy as other people get promoted? Working long hours with little to show for it? Getting more degrees, hoping to be seen. Don't feel bad. I made the same mistake myself without even realizing it. And it's not your fault.
In this podcast, I'm going to help you master the strategy and techniques on how to get promoted, how to double your paycheck, and how to secure more flexibility without adding more work or more degrees. You are listening to Salary Negotiations Made Simple, the show that builds your confidence and inspires you to negotiate for the career you deserve. Do you want to double your salary, secure an ideal career, and increase your confidence to powerfully negotiate every career move?
Then you are in exactly the right place. Hi, Anna. Welcome to the studio. How are you? I'm doing well. How are you? I'm great. Will you start us off with a quick introduction about yourself? Sure. So hi, everyone. My name is Anna Gaynor. I'm a career well being strategist. I'm originally from Brazil. I came to the United States after college. I've worked in the corporate world for over 10 years in the US and six plus years in Brazil. So I have experience working in both countries.
And my background is in HR. As a career strategist, I provide actionable strategies to help professionals prioritize well being and maintain work and life harmony with less hustle. Some of the topics that I write and speak about are career well being, work life harmony or balance. Work environment, job search, career, and flexibility at work. I am really happy to be here today talking to you, Dorothy, and all the listeners, all the people listening to us here, and I'm really happy to be here.
Great, happy to have you here. I've followed you for a while now. I love every content that you put out there. And, uh, tell me a little bit about why did, why well being, why is that your goal, even though you have a HR background, you know a lot about career strategy, et cetera. Sure. So as a high achiever coming from Brazil to the United States, I had no idea that I spent me years in toxic work environments because I didn't know what they were.
I grew up with this idea from my grandparents and then passed down to my parents that work dignifies you, meaning Be a good worker, do a good job, just keep your head down, keep hustling and grinding. And that's exactly what I did, except that coming to the U. S., I felt the need to do that 10 times harder. So I was already an achiever.
And then when I came here, that was so loud in my mind that I really had to work hard and I often feel like based on conversations that I have with other people from different countries, we always feel this need of proving ourselves. So there's always this desire to, I need to prove myself. So I need to work harder. I need to achieve. I need to achieve. So I had that mindset and I didn't know that I worked in environments that were not suitable for me, that were not made for me. to help me grow.
So when I learn about work environments, and that's why I talk about it a lot, because I think it's important for us to understand that the work environment is not just the place where you work, the office or home or whatever that is. The people also are, they are a big piece of the work environment. And so is the management style, all these different things. I had no idea of that. And I grew up saying yes to everything. I grew up with no boundaries in this idea of you have to be a team player.
You have to be a team player, and being a team player basically in my brain meant you have to say yes to everything. You have to take on any task, meaning a lot of the invisible tasks were sent my way, and the visible ones were sent to other people, and that's, that's what I start seeing. that the people that had visible work, they were the ones winning. They were the ones getting promotions, getting raises and everything else was everything else coming my way.
And after a couple of years, I was really, I, after a lot of stress and ongoing stress leads to burnout. And after a couple of years of just hustling and grinding, I really felt That burnout. I didn't know what that was. And I feel a couple of years ago, we were not talking about burnout and stress as we are today. And I didn't know what those things were. I started having health issues.
I went to, I remember having gastric issues and I went to Four different doctors, seriously, four different doctors, and they could not diagnose me. They were like thinking they had some ideas, but they could not diagnose me. And I, I wasn't eating. It wasn't, I was a mess. I was sincerely, I was a mess.
My, my health was not good, but what I noticed at that time, as I started reading books and searching for, trying to figure out my issue, I finally came across this idea that We were not going to the root cause. And what was the root cause? Of course it was my environment, but it was also stress and burnout. We were not going into the, when I started like stress management, therapy, all these different things, I started feeling better. And I started understanding.
So I just went deep in research and trying to figure it out. Why, what was going on? Right. And, As I was doing all those things, unfortunately, I was diagnosed with cancer. And that was the thing that led me exactly where I am right now. And to us talking about this right now, because it was the thing that completely changed my world. Because it was completely unexpected. And I had no idea that I was going to get such diagnosis.
I was in my mid thirties and I for eight months, I just have some mild pain and I thought I from exercise or for something else and I just kept getting and I feel like a lot of people do this, right? We have some symptom and we just keep pushing like I was going to go away. Let's wait and see the famous. Let's wait and see, right? And that's what I did until it got to a point that I realized I gotta do something about it just to get it out of my head, just to get that peace of mind.
And within less than a week, I got a diagnosis. And at that time, it was a time at work that it was a really tough time because I had so many projects. I had so much going on. And that's the thing that I say today. It's like your body. It's going to force you into this inconvenient break at the time that you really don't expect. And that's exactly what happened to me. So years and years, neglecting my health, my well being, only prioritizing work and thinking about work.
And of course you have different responsibilities and different things that you have to do, Work was always number one. Oh, you need me to do something at 10 p. m. Yeah, let me hop my computer and do it. That was the thing. That was the mindset. And health, being, hobbies, interests, things that you want to do outside of work, that was always like on the back of my mind, but not something that I was actively pursuing, right?
And During this whole time, I remember like somebody asking me, what do you like to do for fun, It's a simple question, but I did not have an answer for that because when I thought about my life at that time, when I thought about my day, it was basically I work from, I don't know, eight to six, seven or something, and I get home and I am tired and I don't have the time, the energy. To do anything else. And that was life.
This is what the hamster wheel, as they call it, like over and over doing the exact same thing and you're not going to get different results, right? So what I want to say about this whole thing, why well being? Why well being? Because if you are an achiever, if you have all these career goals and ideas for your life, you're not going to be able to be a top performer.
If your health and well being is compromised, and that's exactly what happened to me, this idea of, no, I have to achieve, I have to perform, I have to keep climbing the ladder, that all came crushing down when I got my diagnosis, and to this day, I still, treatment, like I am good, but I still, I have to take medication and things like that, so like, it changed my whole life, so what I want to say is like, The goal of well being, yes, it's important to
have career goals, it's important to, to figure out the different steps that you want to take in your career, because when you think about it, we spend a third of our days in our jobs, a lot of times way more than a third, right? When you think about it, most people don't work just eight hours. And, if you live in the United States, you are likely going to work, 40 plus years. You're going to be in this workforce for many, many years.
So if you want to continue to be a top performer and continue to grow in your career, you are not going to be able to do that if you don't take care of yourself. It's going to come back and haunt you. Like it's going to, something's going to happen to you. And next thing you're having some sort of chronic disease, and then you need a lot of treatment and medication. to be able to function.
So this whole idea of why you need to take care of well being, your well being, is because we're not robots, right? We can't continue on without this awareness and this intention to really take care of ourselves, to really make well being a priority, have hobbies, have interests, go see your doctor once a year. This is all important as we are achieving at work, as we're trying to climb the ladder, whatever that is for you. It's really powerful.
And thank you for being so vulnerable with your own challenges, as well as what you had to come to for a realization as you were working 10X. what you would normally or you would normally expect to work in your home country. So Anna, when you had this shift where you got this catastrophic diagnosis and you had to make changes, what was the reaction like from your family who probably expected you to be a high achiever, deliver huge outcomes?
They said work dignifies your life, like all these things. So what was their reaction and if there was something you had to do or overcome in that area? Yeah, so my whole family, they all still live in Brazil, but I remember when I got the diagnosis, my husband was right next to me and I could see like his face just like changing. It's as if that he would crush that, that, that thing that, that just comes like, Oh my gosh, I can't believe this happening. I'll tell you my reaction.
And I'll say this. It's a little, I feel ashamed by my reaction because at that time my mind was so into work and, Oh no, I'm, I'm good. I just say, Oh, okay. Okay. What do you need to do next? What do I need to do next? Like that was it. It's almost like this. I don't know. I don't know what happened in my brain at the time, but it was just like, Oh, okay. As if, Oh, I'm gonna, I'm gonna figure this out. And And I could see my husband really sad and me is just, Oh yeah, fine.
And then I just came back home and just went back to work. And it's almost like I didn't give myself time to process the insane, like huge change that was about to happen in my life. And it was a big change that eventually led me to quit my job. But it's just, I was just like, my mind was somewhere else because I have so much work to do. And I just didn't give myself the time to process. And of course, when I have to share the news with friends and family, they were devastated.
I think that's the word. And, and they were extremely supportive and including my husband at the time. And it's just like their mindset shift, it was like a mindset shift because they understood, Oh my gosh, like, this is a big deal. So they were not like excited.
I'm not expecting anything off me at the time because they understood my journey because I was trying to, to this day I haven't necessarily cried a lot about this whole thing because it's almost like I had so much going on at the time that I didn't allow myself to process my emotions and how deep This whole thing was at that time and they understood. So they were extremely supportive. My husband is still to this day. He is my big cheerleader, like always helping me along the way.
But at the, I feel like when something major like that happens, because it's a journey and everybody's journey is different, right? We can't, there's no way to compare what you had with somebody else, but. It's such a journey that I remember going through, like, surgery and still not knowing a lot of things about my situation or what would be the next steps. There was an idea that was laid out to me, like, okay, if this, then this, if that, then we're gonna do that.
So there were different scenarios playing out until I had the surgery, so there was a lot going on, but I just kept myself busy. I just kept my mind busy. And that was like my escape at the time. When I look back now, it's no, like you have something major. You really need to take that time, the time that you need to really go through those emotions and all these different things. And I feel like I just, I didn't do that because I was, I had so much going on at the time at work.
And I just kept, I'm not going to think about this. And I feel like. Each person, it's, it's a very personal journey and each person cope with things differently. But when you are like in that thing, like I, there's so much work that needs to be done. There's so much going on and it's just, it's almost like you are in autopilot pretty much. And I think that's how I was. Yeah. Yeah. But what do you say to somebody? And I hope, I hope the diagnosis is good and you're feeling better. I'm good.
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What do you do to maintain wellbeing? So clearly you make a great point about the reasons why you should prioritize wellbeing is as part of your career strategy or part of your life strategy. But suppose you hear a lot about layoffs. Suppose you're preparing for some sort of job insecurity. How do you maintain balance then? Because you are very nervous about being one of the people that gets cut. You don't want to look like you're prioritizing well being over results.
What advice do you have for people who have that job insecurity looming?
Sure. First of all, I want to clarify this because this idea of job security, I would say maybe very few jobs Might give you some sort of security, but I would say for the grand majority of people, including myself, there's no such a thing as job security, like job insecurity, like I've talked to many people as a career coach and sometimes people working for the same company for 20 years and they are generating incredible results out of the sudden.
They are out of a job and is of no fault of their own. And that's why it's, there's no such thing as job security. So, but I understand that when companies begin like this mass layoffs, you, it's really hard to not think that you're going to be a part of it, but what I would say is. Anytime is a good time to begin taking care of your mindset, taking care of your health, including in times of challenging times where you don't know what's going to happen tomorrow, right?
What I would say is, and again, that's another personal journey. Some people like to meditate. Some people can't sit still for one minute. And I get that. So what I would say is, figure out maybe one or two things that you can do in your day or even in a week. Let's say you like to dance, go to a group fitness class twice a week or begin meditating one minute a day. Just to calm your mind, you have these racing thoughts, seek therapy. I'm a huge proponent of therapy. Find the right therapist.
That's very important. That's a journey that I've been on the last couple of years and finding the right person is really important and just try to figure it out different. interests and hobbies that you can include in your week or even in your day to day. Self care is also a part of well being. It's very important. That could mean I have half an hour in the morning with my cup of tea and then I'm gonna journal. Whatever that looks like for you.
What I like to say is, It's important to not wait until challenging, crazy things happen to figure out coping mechanisms to deal with your stress, your anxiety, because when those moments happen, you need to figure out your tools. Okay. Today wasn't a good day. What can I do to make me feel better? Or sometimes even saying, Tomorrow's another day. Today the day is not being good, but maybe tomorrow things are going to get better or my mind is going to be in a better state.
So it's important to figure it out what works for you, because it's easy to say, Oh, meditate, journal, do this, do that. But then if that is some sort of habit that doesn't really go with your day or with your priorities, maybe you have little ones and it's just hard to get to that. Figure it out. It could be I'm going to drink more water, or I am going to call a friend because I need to talk anything. I'm going to go for a walk. There are many free things.
Of course, there are paid things that you can do, right? But there are many free things that you can do just to have that moment for yourself that brings you back to the present. And of course, it's important to take action too. If you are in a work environment that. If you're not happy, they might, there might be layoffs going on. I wouldn't wait until the last minute to scout the market, to start figuring out what you want to do next.
If you want to stay where you are, if you want to find, if you want to find a different job, if the environment's not good, there are better work environments out there is something that I didn't believe I thought everywhere was going to be the same way, but there are better work environments and what is good for one person. It may not be good for you, and that's okay. Are you finding the podcast helpful, inspiring, and illuminating?
Please make sure and hit the subscribe button so you never miss an episode. And if you found value in today's discussion, please take a moment to rate and review us. Your feedback helps others discover the show. Some people thrive and prefer open offices. They, they really like to have those interactions. Some other people, they prefer to be in a cubicle. They prefer to be in an enclosed office. They do better work that way. It, management styles, right?
Some people love to receive feedback all the time. Other people, It's just thought whenever we have a one on one, we talk about something it's these are the things that are important to know about yourself. So I feel like that self awareness also goes along with how you figure it out that month that been joining. And when we talk about maintaining what I want to make clear here, because we talk about a lot about achieving work and life balance and again, the whole balance.
Always give the idea of a scale, right? And the scale is, there's nothing wrong with the word itself, but it's the way that the word makes us think of this idea of a scale. When you think about a scale, what do you think? Fifty fifty, right? Gotta be, that's a balance. right? But that's not what it means.
Some days, some, let's say you have a child sick at home, you are going to be at work thinking about your child, even if your child is with your significant daughter or a nanny or in the school or whatever the scenario is, you are going to think, be thinking about your child, but there are going to be times that you are at home and let's say, There is an emergency going on at work and you need to maybe send an email at 9 p. m. So it's this idea, when I say, I don't usually use the
word balance, sometimes I do. But a lot of times I like to use harmony. Sometimes I use integration, blend. Because I do think it's Work is sometimes a part of life in the same way that life is sometimes a part of work because as soon as you walk into an office or as soon as you turn on your computer if you work from home, you are still that same person with those same problems. Yes, you can't be a different person. Yeah, you can't leave that person at home.
You might try to distract your mind because you have so much work going on, but it's still you, that piece of you, or maybe unfortunately you got some bad news or something, or there's something going on with a loved one or whatever is going on that is going to affect you. We are not robots. We are people with emotions. So I'm a firm believer of this idea of maintenance. as a cycle. Today, maybe I gave more of myself to work than to play with my child because I just have more work.
But tomorrow or this weekend, I am going to make time for things that bring me joy, that kind of thing. So it has to be an intention. And when I, we're going to talk more about this, but I'm going to give some tips on what you can do later to just help you begin that journey. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's actually a good segway.
So one of the questions that come up with my coaching or even when I'm posting on LinkedIn, if you are in this job search your full time job searcher, should you be making time for? Self-care being and how do you do that? What is the best practice to work that into your job search schedule? Absolutely. If you are a job seeker right now, and it if, of course if you have a job that's even harder because you have a full-time job and you have another full-time job basically.
searching for another job. And if you, if you don't have a job right now and you're still in the job search, that can be draining. That can be overwhelming because I'll say this, like you open LinkedIn and you get so many mixed messages from different people that is almost like impossible to understand. But what should I do next? This person said that I should do this to my resume, but this one is saying the completely opposite. So it's very confusing.
So that's why I always say find a few people that seem to be giving good advice. Test their advice and see if that works for you. But don't try to follow 20 different people and follow 20 different things because that it's going to be overwhelming. And what happens is people start, it's almost like they start giving up because they start sending applications and then it's like, oh, but now I have to change this. Now I have to change that.
And next thing I know, it's they send a bunch of applications and they're not getting results because they're testing a bunch of different things and they're not. They don't know how to follow a targeted job search, which is something that I teach. So it's very confusing. So what I was going to say is, even if you have a job, you don't have a job, it's important to rest. It's important to rest if you are a job seeker.
Because one of the examples I can give you here is, Let's say you really need a job and you start applying away. You just apply away and You were called for an interview and then you start looking. Okay, cool, but it's not really what I want to do I just applied to this job just because I It's almost, I just want some sort of result and then you get called for an interview, but you have no enthusiasm or you're tired. You don't even want to work for this company, but you still go.
But then when you show up, it's almost like you can't be yourself because you are tired. You don't necessarily want this job. It's almost like you're just there, but you're not there. Yeah. Yeah. So it's extremely important to take care of yourself, take care of your mind, specifically. And there are a lot of resources online. I will say, you know, there are videos on meditation. They are free meditation apps that you can try. You can also, like, use the library.
Library has so many resources that you can use that are, if you have a local library, with resources that are beneficial to you, see what they have, that maybe a book or something that could help you improve your well being, get into the self care mindset. It's important to take time for yourself. Don't see rest as not being productive. Because this was so ingrained in my brain, I didn't know how to rest. I didn't know how to relax because I was never taught those things.
Yeah. So I think it's extremely important if you really want to continue on that path, because that path can, I hate to say this because it's a hard thing to say, but it can last about six months, sometimes even longer, to search and to look for a job, to find the right job for you. So it's important that you get some rest. And relaxation and whatever that looks like for you, because again, there's no such a thing as job security.
And if you want to find a job that might work better for you than the previous job you have, or the current one you have, it's important to do that. that work, right? The self awareness, that discovery process, the figuring things out. So it's important to rest and reflect and do all those things as you're going through your job search. So it's quality over quantity.
Yeah. Do you have any recommendations that people can use as either an app or a tip or a trick, like actionable that they can do after listening to this? Podcast to incorporate that into their job search strategy, or if they have a full time job into that strategy. So if you have a full time job or if you don't have a full time job, I highly recommend that you can do a search on a targeted job search. You can go to my website.
I have a job search checklist that pretty much talks about what is a targeted job search. Because like I said, it's quality over quantity. So instead of sending a hundred applications and thinking, Oh, I'm moving the needle, I'm doing something.
You're better off sending 10 that you really took the time to check the job description, add keywords to your resume, even change things and really send a good application instead of thinking, I'm just going to send a generic resume and hopefully somebody's going to see somebody's going to see that I have what it takes for the job. And then I get, they're going to give me a call. That's not how it works. So it's important that you send good applications for jobs and think about keywords.
Think about the job tasks. Do you actually want those tasks? Are those things that you actually enjoy doing? Instead of just sending a bunch of applications expecting to go for interviews and Because it's draining after a while, even if you are being called for interviews It just then you start you turn to yourself in a sense that you start thinking what am I doing wrong?
And sometimes they might not you might not be doing anything wrong It's just like you're going for all these interviews for the jobs that are not really your thing so you might show up in a different way rather than For jobs that are actually good for you. So I would say Search for what is a targeted job search. That's the first step.
And the second thing I was going to say is Figure it out, like what you actually want to do, because when we are at work, sometimes we are working so many tasks and we think, Oh, I'm really good at Excel, but do I actually like that? Do I actually want a job where 60 percent of my time is going to be looking at spreadsheets all day? Do I, is this really what I want? Because sometimes I feel like a lot of people, they don't really read that job description like multiple times.
They don't do a research on the company to, to read about the culture. It's important to do all of those things. That's why I keep saying is quality over quantity, because you really want to go for the jobs that Would be a good match for you instead of just thinking. I'm just gonna go for this interview and see how it goes That's when you do such thing.
That's when you keep what that's when you go from One toxic or negative work environment into another without even thinking about it because you didn't take the time To figure it out that for yourself. What are your values? What do you want? What kind of workplace suits you and all these different things?
So those would be like the two steps the targeted job search figured out like What kind of career because a lot of times I remember people say oh I want Marketing, but I'm also open for something completely different. Let's say finance, two completely different things. So if you are looking for different things, you may want to actually have different resumes because one resume is going to speak to a particular job and the other resume is going to speak for something else.
So it's important to have this awareness and how you show up in the job search really matters. Yeah. And I like that because when you say quality over quantity, it also means that you're not willy nilly shotgun approach sending, it's taking up your time, it's taking up your energy, it's taking up a lot of resources for you and you're not getting the results.
But if you target it, if you focus it, focus drives results and you get the time back to prioritize self care, meditation, whatever that looks like for you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Great. Great. Thank you for that. So now we are in the rapid fire section of our, our episode. So are you ready, Anna? Sure. Let's do it. Okay. All right. So tell us, Anna, what is your favorite book right now? Okay, so it's always hard for me to just pick one thing.
I would pick one that I read a couple years ago that really opened my eyes when it comes to belonging. That was the first thing and that really it was life changing for me. It was Braving the Wilderness by Brené Brown. Yeah, I love that book. And the recent one that I read, uh, I believe it was last year. I mean, I'm always reading books, but one that really was really an impactful story that I felt like I was crying the whole book was Viola Davis autobiography.
Uh, it was such a, like, It's such a good book, like such an amazing story. I love reading biographies, especially written by the author, like autobiographies because they're really good. So yeah, I would say these two books, but yeah, I love it. I love asking this question because then I get my book club recommendations as well. What is your favorite movie right now or ever? Ah, that's a tough one because I love watching movies. I can pick one that I always watch, which is Pride and Prejudice.
I love the 2005 movie. I love Jane Austen's books and her work. But a current one that I just watched is Musica, which is on, it's on Amazon Prime. I love the Brazilian America story. Story. And that's what the movie, it's not the main goal of the movie, but you see a lot of Brazilian American culture in, it's based in New Jersey. So it's, I thought it was a really good representation of Brazilian Americans. Great. I love that. Love that, I'm gonna check that out.
Okay, what do you like to do outside of work? Okay, there comes the question that I told you I didn't know. Oh my gosh, so many things. Since I have, I had my awakening, I walk my dog, spend time with my husband, go for walks, watch movies, laugh. I love to laugh. I love being with my friends. I love to dance. Something that I didn't do for over 10 years. And today I do it like multiple, I dance multiple times a week. Just group exercise classes. There's so many things.
It's changed my life in a way that now there's so many things that I like to do. And before I wouldn't really have an answer to this question. Yeah, I love that. I love that you did that. Fantastic. And do you have a favorite pet peeve? Oh my gosh. Yes bad drivers. Just kidding Uh, but let me be more specific You're driving the car is Right behind you even though you're already like on the speed limit the car behind you keeps trying to go And there's no ways.
Okay, you're gonna have to somehow Create like wings and fly because there's nothing I can do. You can't get past me, but you're still driving really fast. I think that you really put other people's lives in danger and you also putting your life in danger, right? So I, that is something that I really can't like, It drives me crazy. Yeah, I love that. That's a good one. That's a really good one.
Anna, thank you so much for sharing all of that you shared with us, your story, your own challenges, how you overcame them and what people can learn from you. So if somebody wants to connect with you, how do they get in touch? So find me on LinkedIn, Anna Gaynor, A N N A G O E H N E R, or go to my website. I have free resources and I'm going to be adding more resources soon, so I highly recommend that you go check it out.
Thank you so much, Anna. It was a pleasure to have you in the studio and again, thanks a lot for sharing everything you shared. Thank you. I really appreciate the opportunity. Thank you. Take care. Bye. Bye for now. Bye. Bye. Bye. There you have it, my friends. A heartwarming story about how Anna overcame adversity and how to prioritize well being and maintain boundaries at work. Thank you for listening and bye for now. There you have it, my friends.
As you know, I'm on a mission to close the pay gap. Every podcast episode is designed to give you the tools, techniques, and inspiration so you can bravely advocate for yourself. Thank you for listening and bye for now.