Is Ergonomics A Waste of Money? #64

This week's episodes is ergo a waste of money . Is it worth your money ?

Maybe , maybe not .

I don't know . We're going to figure it out today .

We're going to work through it . Here we go .

Here we go All the time . People say to me ergo's great , ergo's bad , do we need ergo ? All I hear from plant to plant is we have ergo first . I think we determine is what are we even talking about ?

because I think that this is a really , really good one . So we're getting ready to start a cost series as it relates to safety . So how do we manage cost and safety ? Where do we find that cost savings for the continuous improvement we're looking for everyone's budget conscious and you guys asked for us to cover some stuff on ergo .

All right . So the first one is I don't have an ergo problem at my plant because we have turnover , so I don't have to worry about it . That's what I hear all the time .

Well , so I guess it really is dependent on what you manufacture , what your business is , Because I can tell you on the poultry side that is some of the most frequent cases we see are new employees because we didn't do the rampant at all .

Maybe they caused the turnover . Yeah , we didn't do it , yeah .

So we've got the turnover because of the high piece counts or we didn't do the work hardening , but we had a lot of ergo issues on the poultry side that we've seen because they just it's very physically demanding .

I thought the cow hide his . Ergo , I saw poultry . I'm like , oh no .

Oh yeah , I saw poultry . I'm like , oh no , oh yeah , the twisting and stuff .

There's a lot different on the poultry side .

So I think the first thing we want to do is really kind of expand what we consider ergonomics right .

Oh , I palletize .

So it's more than just .

I do count with a knife .

Yeah , it's more than . The three top things .

Yeah , we want to expand our view past its palletizing box makeup and we fix it by getting a new conveyor

And knife handling jobs right ? What could be presenting an issue that's past the production floor ? What about the outlying jobs ?

Our company Ergo . Eight hour , 10 hour , 12 hour drive , that's our Ergo .

Or standing for 10 to 12 hours .

Absolutely , or we got gotta do six hours yeah , we're out in the weather .

I mean , those are , those are our argo yeah , so I think part of it is anything that's extreme one direction or another , absolutely including .

It could be both sides of the spectrum so anything that's really hot , really cold , anything that's standing or sitting for prolonged periods I get promoted when I'm handling chemicals , so now I'm the one that does all the heavy lifting with the massive , massive beginning .

I'm the one , not the end user .

The end user's got the small container and they roll it around . I'm the ergo one , but it looks like they would have the ergo because they're actually doing it more , but their risk is lower than mine .

Because they're not able or allowed maybe at that facility to mix or titrate . That's correct .

And it's the weight of it , it's the containers , but I'm still doing it every night . I may have to do it 100 times a night , but I'm doing 50 . Yeah , so that's the weird stuff like that , so people do get caught up in . Well , it's small , you do it 100 times . It's a lot , yep , all right , so here's one that gets me . So I travel a lot .

Because , ergo , it's quite a time span . Yeah , it is .

But the point is ergo . People will say well , they wore this PPE for days , there wasn't a problem . But some people like when I'm new , I can feel it so as a new hire . The new hire , if you put PPE on them you don't have to worry about ergo with them , because they're going to tell you it feels weird and they're already having problems .

I think part of it is so in our industry we have to have PPE that meets a multitude of needs . Right , We've got to meet the food safety stuff . We've got to meet the safety stuff . You know , some of it is because of the maintenance teams or the chemical handling .

We select hearing protection .

Yeah , there's pre-approved styles that we are aware that meet the needs that we have , and then they get to pick because , again , everybody's shaped different . I'm very cognizant of this because , as a female . Most ppe in my past it's getting better now but most historically has been made for a male and so it's all way too big .

So it could be the thickness of the clothing , like thick pants , like arc flash you , you put arc flash on jen , so jen got some arc flash gear yeah , I've got a lot of cat too stuff yeah , and you know the arc flash I was wearing at the plants was super thick . Well , it weighs on you all day long and it's hot .

So I think it's really important , especially in the PPE side , that we don't gear everybody up to prevent the injury , just to cause it . On the ergo side , I mean , I'm thinking of even like my farms if we've got coveralls at my farms that are too big and we keep adjusting all the time .

So I also look at , ergo , some of the repetitive , so not just repetitive , as in doing the task but that I catch my eye , if I see them .

Completely yeah , all right .

So here's the , here's the one . Forklifts Right ? Okay , you told me that if I drive a forklift I got to face Ford when I drive it , so I don't run over everybody .

Yeah .

But you also told me , as a safety manager plant you can't drive with a bunch of pallets because you can't see around . So now you got to drive backwards or forward . Yeah , that forklift . You never gave me a chair to turn around .

Yeah , see your neck my whole day on .

The forklift is turned yeah , my whole day because the safety pause . So , yes , ergo man , not a cot . That was an issue , but it's forcing me from the safety side because I'm carrying these eight or nine pallets , I'm always turned backwards absolutely so now I'm always sore . I'm Absolutely so . Now I'm always sore , I'm always tilted , and now it's hard .

It's hard for me all day long .

That chair is not made to do that , right , right .

So that's one of our ergos , so that's one of our ergos , all right .

So another one is everyone has a top 10 for ergo and they say here they are , we're going to do knife handling , we've got this , we've got that . That's great . But what I look for is how many of the top 10 reduce the risk and I get a money payback on yes . So what I look at Ergo is I don't look at Ergo as a $50,000 machine that fixes the problem .

Yep .

And then , as I do , that , it seems to be easier to sell the ergo idea . So if I say , look at production , that's right . Look at the labor's not as bad and the piece count has went down or maybe it's the weight is reduced . So that's how I look at ergo .

Well , and I think a big thing that you can evaluate if you are a facility that's experiencing a lot of turnover is that the jobs that you're seeing the most turnover in . That might also have a correlation to ergo and if it does , you're seeing lots of turnover and you have ergo issues with it . That might be a good one to look at automation on .

Absolutely

How many times am I stepping over this weird drain ?

Yeah , and I'm getting this piece of plastic every time and I'm always leaning over to do it . That's the stuff that sometimes people miss when they look at ergo , because they'll evaluate well , I stand to do the job this way , well .

I think that's exactly it . So the ergo assessment is designed to say what is this job task ? I'm going to watch their job task , but we're not evaluating the environment sometimes to see , yeah , but in order for them to do their job tasks , this other stuff is weird over here , right .

So I use that time .

Every time a forklift comes in or every time somebody .

They have to move to the left a couple of weeks , so I use that ergo assessment as that . What can I engineer out around the person in their working area to have less ergo other issues .

Yeah , out around the person and their working area to have less or go other issues ? Yeah , can we adjust their their work setting so that they're not having to bend , twist , walk all ? All over the place and and carry this stuff at a weird angle . Absolutely right .

So that reduces my injuries , it makes my profit go up , yeah , and it gets rid of my my maintenance always complaining that something's always getting kicked or something's always getting loose Stood on or whatever . Well , it's because that design of that workstation isn't right .

And if I can engineer out those other controls , I actually can lower my hazard . You start looking at do I have an ergo job potentially , and you evaluate well , what's my repair and maintenance like in this department and if I start seeing a lot of weird repair and maintenance stuff that's repetitive from production employees doing a certain task .

Right , so I so that's your ROI , yeah . So when I look at ergo , whether it's a cost or not , I use it in different ways when I'm doing those assessments .

Yeah , so really it's an environment evaluation and a hazard evaluation . It's not exclusively just am I bending and twisting and have lots of repetition , it's a bigger thing .

I'm looking for everything they're doing that day and I'm also looking at . The last part is I'm looking at if that person's gone and we have someone called vacation , so Joe's the fill in for your job whenever you were gone . Mm-hmm you had an ergo assessment the way you did it and I'm throwing it in there tomorrow and I haven't done it .

Yeah .

So you've got to calculate that people are going to take vacation , people are going to take days off and someone's going to fill in . So I have two ways . I have the ergo , how they normally do it , yep . And then I'm like , okay , but six months going to come in and be able to do it , just like that .

And it's and it's goes back to that turnover issue , because that's something very similar to bringing a new employee . If they haven't been doing it for six months , to me they're basically a new employee .

Absolutely For that job .

For that job they don't have that , that buildup of that works , hardening , correct To help them out to prevent that injury .

Here's another ergo one . I'm a maintenance person at a plant and they give me the biggest belt I can carry with as many tools possible and there's no weight per tool calculation .

I don't want to go back to the shop because it's kind of far . So yeah , so I'm going to carry everything with me .

I'm like , okay , get them a cart you know , get them something put a central station , somewhere that has a lot of the tools so they can get access . It's not the walking . The ergo to me is the belt , but the reason is because they don't want to walk so far . So put a central station like a mini .

Go back and figure out why . Why are we doing it ? Why ?

are they doing that task , and talk to them , say why do you not want to walk back there ? And they tell you , because I've never seen anybody going way all the tools they're carrying and saying , well , you're over the limit , you can't take that . Now , you know so that you have to manage that .

The and I don't think we're suggesting you do that no but we're just saying realistically that's your ergo .

It is a lot of weight , it's the travel .

Especially for someone who is not used to doing that . There's going to be some back pain there .

Absolutely All right , and my last one's here If you do any kind of hose handling , daytime , nighttime , the number one thing I tell everybody is A when you carry a hose at the end of your shift , you're the tires .

You're the most sore Most of the time , yeah , when you're putting it away .

But the ergo evaluations are always about doing the work during the shift and most of my injuries come the last 30 minutes from taking that 200-foot heavy hose that is uncontrolled . What size and length and weight there are per location ?

Yeah , or is it two people ? Is that one person , you know ? Should it be two people carrying it ? Do ?

I put it in a pallet ? Do I put it a combo ? What did I do ? Because that's cause so . So don't look at ergo as as just the shift , and I'm doing that job 40 times .

It goes back to it's personal to a certain degree too , we can all handle different things in terms of weight and at the end of shift .

there's only certain people that do that task . That's what you're evaluating . You're evaluating that you're the tiredest . I'm 5'8" . I'm carrying 150 foot of hose through a plant that's trying to get running and it's wet , and I might be eight .

I'm carrying 150 foot of hose through a plant that's trying to get running and it's wet and I might be having stairs .

That's my injury slash ergo site , because that's when the weight and the problems I'm having are really affecting me . Yeah , it was bad all night , but that's when it ramps up that next level . Yep . So what can I do to injure an owl ? So , to close here today , these are our opinions opinions .

Please do a third arrest assessment . Yep , and if you want some more stuff on ergo , you know , yes , we have done some hazard evaluations , some ergo stuff . You can kind of see what we do and some of the services we offer over at allen-safetycom . You can check us out on any of the socials joe allen and jen allen on linkedin . You can follow us there .

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