Stephen Carpenter (Deftones)

We are so fortunate to have an amazing guest today, one of my favorite bands ever, and sure many of your favorite bands as well. We're joined by Stephen Carpenter of Deftones guitarist, absolute mammoth of a band. This group has a huge show coming up later this year with System of a Down. Bro, you guys sold like 50,000 tickets for that in an hour. What does it mean after all these years to still have so much support for the band? And also, bro, thank you so much for being

on the podcast. I am so stoked to have you. Thanks for having me. Obviously, it's an amazing feeling to be able to do that. I'm very grateful that people have that interest and, yeah, to be a good time. For those of you that didn't see my post on Instagram, I got to just totally thank you so much when people are texting me going, bro, are you seeing Steph from Deftones?

I was fucking wearing a Rock Feed shirt on the podcast. I didn't believe it. I saw you doing that and I was just blown away. I was wondering if he's going to see it. I actually saw your post before anyone else told me about it. So I was like, oh, no. I've been listening to your band for so long and you guys are really just an insane band. What do you remember about those early days when you first encountered your bandmates like Chino and growing up in those early years?

We were all in this in school, essentially, the same time. I'm three years older than, than Abe and Chino. So I had already graduated when I had met Abe, but I knew Chino because it's because I lived across the street for me back in the day. That's how we originally met. But other than that, we all really came together through skateboarding, meeting each other at different spots and having mutual friends and stuff like that and then just sort of jamming it out.

That's amazing. When you guys get together in a room early on and you guys start riffing and I don't know if you're practicing or whatever, but did you have a sense early on that you guys just had a musical chemistry that could take you places? I don't know if you'd say a sense, but I mean goals for sure. I definitely, I was driven. I was pushing to start a band and get to rock and out and all that. That was always a dream of mine.

And who were some of the bands early on that, you know, it seems like you're kind of more into the heavier stuff. Who were some of those bands early on that motivated you to pick up a guitar? I think a lot of people would probably say the same thing or definitely have said the same thing, but you know, a band hailing kiss.

You know, it was really the album cover for their Kiss Alive 2. You know, that was one of my first records I ever got when I was a kid and just opening that thing up. I was like, that's what I'm going to do. It seems like from talking to other guitarists. I don't know if this is the same for you, but I remember Zach Wilde told me that it has to feel like playing a video game to get really good and to kind of become one with the instrument.

Was it something that kind of came naturally to you or did you have to practice methodically to really find your sound? Well, I never really sought out to find my sound. I'd never really practice a lot. You know, I mean, as far as like, you know, I'm not trying to dismiss anything that I do, but, you know, as far as shreds level goes, you know, I'm very low on that scale of shredding.

As far as what we as guitar players define as shredding, you know, I mean, I played PowerCords and Palm mute as much as I can. And even the Palm meeting doesn't have that much, you know, role in what we do as a band as a player for me. I always gravitate to that stuff. And I know that, you know, my personal taste and interest is in that isn't the heavier stuff. But I listen to everything. I grew up with hip hop, you know, as hip hop was being born and all that.

All of you know, classic rock, you know, that's all been relevant. But just everything, RV, soul. I mean, it's not stuff that I listen to all the time. But I mean, I've always enjoyed disco was really popular. I have a junk team. So I mean, I enjoy all music. In fact, that's how I came up with the name, you know, deaf was at the time.

Obviously, the slang for cool, you know, and tones to me was kind of like a vague metaphor for like all styles of music. So the goal was, you know, water to play like the dopest things, you know, derivatives, you know, derived from all these different styles of music.

So deaf tones is kind of how that came to be as far as that goes. And I mean, I enjoy music. And you know, largely music that's drum driven. That's kind of really my where my interest is in the music itself. But yeah, guitar is bass keyboards, whatever all there. There's so many.

So much, I mean, so much to you know, to draw from and being excited about musically, I did you'll never know at all. I mean, like I get into like in the last handful of years, a lot of bands that I've gotten into, you know, they've been around like 10 years or more. And I'm like, where was I for the last decade.

But I know where I was. I was busy doing what we do. I was out busy working when I wasn't doing that. I was with friends or family. You know, so I didn't get to, you know, keep up with everything. But I'm like, like I said, you know, we're here together now because I'm on YouTube every day. You know, I watch videos every day. And you know, I love your channel. And I watch your your post every day when they come out.

So crazy to me. Yeah, hey, you know, that what you've heard this whole your life, your whole life, I'm sure, but it's a small world and six degrees, right. So I mean, I don't know why that's anything you want is the same. It's all it's all real all. Yeah. And like I said, why actually that day, I wasn't sure, you know, I, you know, I was just like, I wonder if he's actually going to see, you know, and like I said, I saw your post and then a friend of mine reached out our

facility. She's all in. She's like, you know, that she says she worked. I was like, no way get out of here. So I was like, yeah, no, absolutely not. I'm going to come do this, you know, bro, numerous people hit me up. And we're like, do you see this?

And I immediately went on YouTube and saw it. And it meant a lot to me because I've been listening to your band for so long and just like, you know, going back to like for me, it started with really white pony. And I'm like, mind blown by that. I was, I was, you know, probably in fifth grade when that came out, I was a total like, it was corn, it was slipknot for me, you know, for you, what what's the first show that you went to?

Oh, the first show I've seen, you know, like officially was probably S. Laire S. NFU. And there was a one more band is that a club in Sacramento. That's long, long ago. And I think that Sacramento probably had for me, I didn't, it was more like in the my space era, unfortunately. So like, it seems like scenes were a lot more to job have like a strong music scene growing up where you're from.

I mean, I think that that's just kind of the arts scene, you know, music's just one part of it. There's there's so many dimensions to the arts, you know, I mean, like a, like I said, all the different, even the different genres of music, they're all bound, you know, they're all they're all intertwined and have become a lot more so or over time.

Yeah, I know, I, you know, there was a scene, but I mean, I think that's, you know, the scene is always kind of just your groups of friends that you all hang out with. And as you start getting older, you start venturing out and you start meeting different people in different areas.

Yeah, before, before you know it, you know, your scene has grown from your neighborhood to your part of town to the, to the whole town. Now you're going outside of town and then you're doing other cities and other states. And then, you know, I mean, we've been doing this now internationally for a while, which, I mean, you, I'm sure you're aware of that I haven't traveled internationally now for a while.

But what I have read that, but I don't understand the reasons behind it. I don't know if you're comfortable sharing like I don't really. Yeah, no, I tell you it's just simple. I think like every single one of us wrangles with getting on a plane in somewhere. Yes. And it's still scarce for me. Sure. You know, and, and that's understandable. And so for me, that, you know, that anxiety.

When it came when it came around, you know, it was right around the time of when the pandemic started and all this. You know, I had already just, I had made that decision. And that was because we were getting ready to go on a trip. We were going to travel to this far off destination. And I was like, look, you know, if I got to go all that way and then get stuck out there and then they want to jab me with something. I was like, there's no way I'm going to do that. I mean, that's crazy.

And so that didn't happen. I was just like, you know, my decision was simple. Like all the anxiety that I deal with when it comes to that. I was like, look, I can just put a stop to this, but just not doing it anymore. And it's like, I'm going to lose out, you know, it's kind of, you know, it's a bummer. I mean, obviously I want to go out there and I want to, you know, perform those shows and be around all the people that support us and enjoy it.

But I'm like, yeah, this is a decision I made for myself. And that's not I mean, this people that understand and people that don't understand and for all those that don't understand, maybe one day they will. I don't know. Maybe they never will. Well, you know what though, I think that it also maybe is a testament to your bandmates because, you know, for you to be able to be able to do that and and them to have your back obviously as they do.

I think that's a beautiful thing as well. And I'm sure most fans are going to understand this. Dude, I used to almost be in tears when a plane would take off. It feels so unnatural to me. Like that, the propulsion systems that take off and all that. I struggle. I have, I still do, but I've, you know, it's tough, bro. It definitely freaked me out when I first started flying.

Yeah, I don't want to get into that whole conversation of all the sketchiness that it is or isn't involved with all that, right? It just for me, you know, I mean, even, you know, like as you talk about that, you know, the way I always just fell asleep before take off. You know, it was actually take off with wake up. But then I would go right back to sleep. I was like, all right, just go back to sleep. That's the easiest way for me to handle all this.

But yeah, like, you know, I just, I just think like I said, you know, for me, I was like, I can either keep feeling like this forever every time I do it. Or I could just stop feeling like this and just not do it. And like I said, it's not easy. You know, I said, I get to miss you now on not getting to go and enjoy something that I used to enjoy all the time.

And that was, you know, that was, that was a tough, tough thing to deal with. But, you know, the other thing is, like you said, you know, about the guys, you know, they got my back. But, you know, they at the same time, you know, they would love me there too. So, you know, it's not all, that's not the easiest thing. But I'm very grateful that, you know, we have a friend land to actually steps in and does all my parts of the other music.

And, you know, I'm just very grateful that, you know, I have that, you know, to give for the other guys, you know, so they can go because they want to keep going. You know, so I was like, I don't want to get in the way it does my number one reason. My number reason was just I literally can end all that anxiety by just not doing it.

You know, that was the, my number one reason. Number two is, you know, the last thing I want to do is go to any place far off. And then they're just going to go into lockdown because they feel like it. And I've become a refugee somewhere where I can't even get back to my house. I was like, yeah. And at, at, at, at minimum in this country, I could, I could walk myself home if I had to might take a long time, but I'm going to get there.

And I'm, I do not agree with that you got to take a vaccine to enter the country when you are out there on tour, like for as long as you all have been touring over the years.

For me, I think in addition to traveling internationally, something I hear from, from friends I really empathize with is, is it, is it tough for being away from home like, you know, going on like a, I'm sure you probably might even done longer than this, but 90 days, however long it is that you all are out there on the road. You know, is, is that seems tough to be away that extensively and that constantly.

Yeah, I mean, again, you know, still going along the same subject, you know, that's just another factor in what we're just talking about. I mean, how many, how many birthdays have I missed? How many, you know, weddings of friends, you know, family have happened that I never got to see.

Just, just not being around all your friends and family. And when you're young and you're, and you're getting, and you're getting into all this, you don't really think about that, you don't think about those the fix. But, you know, I've got, I've got family that's all grown up now that I was barely there around when they were growing up, because I was out being me, you know, so, yeah, it just, I could say, you know, I could stay here and, and get those experiences now.

And I don't know, just, I'm always enjoying life, but, you know, just have that fulfillment that I, like I said, I just, I never had. It's just hard to, to miss those events. It seems like for a lot of artists. And I think many musicians have wrestled with that every years. And, again, for, you know, I think it's easier when they're young, you don't, because you just, you know, I really considering, you know, how the impact is on you and all these different things.

But, again, you know, I mean, everybody works through it and everybody does their best. You know, you know, all my friends in the band, you know, the, the Frank and I are the only ones that didn't have kids. So everyone else, you know, they've got kids and, you know, I've seen all their kids growing up, they're all off in college now. You know, I mean, it's like, okay, we're old, you know, we're, I mean, we're not like, elderly yet, but, you know, I'm going to be 54 in a couple of weeks.

So I mean, it's not like, I'm not up there, but, you know, it's the things that, like I said, you know, you miss albums of stuff by making this is, I'm sure anyone that's lived the lifestyle like this would agree, you know, that you, you know, you sacrifice a lot of things for. For, for this to accomplish this, if you will, you know, and it's ongoing. I mean, we're, you, everyone's makes, you know, makes their best and does their best with everything. And, you know, you just, you're going.

I also think you have not only been a part of music history, but you've been around this, I'm, I'm very much fixated. If you haven't heard me rant about this on the late 90s in early 2000s era and rock. And like what a time you had a front row seat and you were a part of it, a huge part of it. What was that whole scene like during that era, it just seems like it was magic, you know, I don't know where you're at on the term new metal. Some people love it, some people hate it.

I think it's pretty much just considered the new metal era now. But what was that time like to have been there and had a front row seat to it? And again, you know, being immersed in it at the time, you don't really, you don't actually don't think about it because you're just out there doing your thing. And I'll definitely say that, you know, back in those days, the term new metal when they wanted to use that.

It was negative. I heard it wasn't, it was, it wasn't offensive, but you know, that's the, and, and I say, you know, let's just say it's negative, but it's not, it's not really negative. But definitely have a far more appreciation for that term at this very positive now than that. Yeah.

And, but at the time, you know, I mean, for me, having grown up, you know, with the big four and just metal being born, you know, in general, to me, you know, the term was kind of weird because I was like, well, it's just metal. It just happens to be the latest version of it, but we're just doing metal. So, yeah, I've always understood why the term was there, but, you know, I didn't, I didn't have any, like I said, I didn't have a greater appreciation for it until it was over.

What was that first big tour that you can remember going on, you know, that first, like, holy shit, I can't believe we're on this lineup. Well, our first actual tour tour was with the bad dreams, and that was that, that was pretty amazing, you know, and it actually didn't even finish. So I was kind of, you know, kind of some, you know, like it was surreal that old experience. Right.

But then our next actual tour was us, Sugar Ray and Monster Maggot, and that was us out there in a van, you know, doing that, that whole trip, you know, and it was amazing.

You know, I mean, we were all having fun getting to, you know, like we're traveling across the country, you know, versus, you know, locally in California and stuff like that. So I was, you know, it was, you know, it was, you know, that, you know, it was the grind because that then, you know, you were still out trying to play for crowds that no one knew who you were.

You know, and really outside of, you know, our area, you know, maybe they heard the name or they thought they heard the name, but it was all, it was all brand new all the time and then after that, you know, we did a tour with, with an anthrax and life of agony.

That was a dream come true. You know, like anthrax was my favorite band, you know, of the big four. I mean, I liked all the big four, but anthrax was the band that I really liked, you know, like, you know, and I think, you know, we were talking about that earlier, you know, just for a second about, you know, like that.

Starting for your tone and, you know, how, how to, you know, build, you know, getting all that point is like, my tone as far as I was concerned would have been just the sound of, you know, Scottian and, and Jim from fake no more. That was, that was the sound that I like, man, this is the sound that I want, you know, and I thought that was the sound I had, but, you know, obviously, what, what it is and what you think aren't the same.

But I think you're definitely perceived now as you have your own sound. I mean, DevTones has such a unique sound both instrumentally and vocally. And I just remember, I think probably the first song, because I was like, in this era, it was like very reliant on radio. So I think the first I became aware of DevTones was change. And I mean, God, that song goes so hard still to this day. What can you remember when that song was coming together when you were either writing it or recording it.

I'm very curious on like, whether people knew it was going to be a big song in the moment. If you had an idea of what it was going to do. No, no, it was a, and it was really organic. You know, most of the songs come come about, you know, pretty organically where we're just jamming.

Obviously, we'll, we'll craft them into more, you know, once we get, you know, through that initial jam. But, yeah, no, I think you're just, I think the excitement is just me able to like come up with a song in the moment. It's not, it wasn't a complete song in the moment. But I mean, you know, the parts were flowing somewhat right away when it come to that one.

No, I mean, it wasn't a, you know, I thought like, oh, this is going to be the real one or anything like it was just like, you know, whenever we get to that point, we all think we think that about all those songs when they're coming together. Like, oh, it's going to be a good song, you know, because you start feeling all excited and, and you're enjoying the vibe. But I mean, as far as like putting like, you know, a level of success to it.

Now, that's, that never really crosses your mind. Not seriously anyway. I mean, we'll kid about things, but, you know, we're never in a position where we're expecting anything to be anyway, you know. When you talk about touring and meeting so many people and growing up loving this music. Is there anyone that comes to mind that you met early on in your career where you're like, damn, I can't believe I met that guy.

One of your idols growing up that was really cool to you. That was a great experience. I've been, you know, I've been surprised the few moments, you know, I mean, like, so we got the tour with Kiss back in the 90s for like two weeks. That, you know, they were on that was one of their, you know, their, their big reunion tours. It was all original members at the time. I never imagined that was something that would ever happen. But, you know, I mean, we were close with those guys are in any way.

You know, I mean, we maybe like on a couple occasion at all pass by. I'm in a hallway and during that, you know, that little run. And, but we did another tour, not not too long after that. Maybe a couple years after that. And it was with a causing a causing and I want to say it was Cantera. And our, our, all our, all our gear was stolen at the last two dates in Detroit. Somebody stole our truck. And we ended up missing the first of the two shows.

And that night, you know, we were hanging out at the show and Ozzy came in and brought us a case of Heineken and a big giant bottle of Jack Daniels. And, you know, he was just giving us, you know, his, his love and saying, you know, how much that's soft and this and that. Yeah, I never would have imagined Ozzy doing something like that. Let alone me in that the time. You know, I mean, so that was pretty, pretty amazing.

I mean, very few people ever get the opportunity to meet Ozzy and then to play a show with them too was incredible. Did you ever do osfest for some reason? I think you all did osfest. Yeah, we did night, osfest and that's so sick. Those lines of that were crazy. And like you say, you know, I think all of us, I mean, everybody gets star struck in a little bit way.

And some little way when you meet someone you're familiar with, you know what I mean? I'm talking with you and I'm a little star struck because you're someone out familiar with. That's crazy. But, but, but I can say, you know, as a fan, I'm glad, you know, I'm glad that we got to have this opportunity or I can tell you, hey, you know, I know you're a fan, but I'm also a fan. And, you know, I mean, that's really, that's the whole really connection right now while I'm here. Yeah, I'm just part of.

Well, I mean, it, dude, it means the world to me and it also seriously is blown my mind. Before I heard this, I'm listening to DevTones every single week, twice or three times on the gym a week, you know, and it just is like it's timeless music. And I think even like, I hope I'm pronouncing this right. The album is, I think it's Koi Noi, Yoi Khan. I don't know how to say it. I'm so sorry for butchering that.

I think we all, but when we say it, mostly because how it just rolls off the tongue, but it's a Koi Noi, Yoi Khan. That record, bro. Yeah. That's my favorite. Is it, it's probably mine too other than, you know, white pony, but like, the riffs on that record and then the vibes and like the synthesizers and the production sounds so massive on it.

I listen to that record like in Tumed. I'm obsessed with that song. Just the way it kicks in when the chorus hits. Talk about that record and how that album came together because that's just one of for sure one of my all time favorites. We all. That came together like all of them do, you know, I mean, there's just a process that we go through and I'm not sure how different is for everyone else. I think everyone goes through essentially you going through a process.

The actual writing of that. I don't remember. I don't remember too much of that. You know, I mean, I remember some moments of it. I mean, we always, you know, we have our days where everything's good and another set of times where, you know, there's there's nothing happening, you know, we're just sitting around and we're just like somebody gets upset because we're feeling like we're wasting time and this and that I'm like, but this is what we do. This is kind of how we've done this. Right.

And that was for me, you know, when that record was done and we released it, that was, that was probably one of my hardest periods is because I actually was, you know, I had changed all my equipment that I was using prior to all that.

When I thought was going to bring, you know, you know, greater use or make things easier for me ended up making things more difficult. And that, you know, I'm not trying to hate on any, you know, any equipment or anything, but I was, that was when I first made a switch to using the acts of electronics.

I was like, do you're going to say that? Yeah. And I just went, you know, I went through some, some learning curves on that thing, like, you know, I don't know, everyone does, but, you know, I had a couple occasions where I've done a lot of programming on it and stuff like that. And I made the mistake of updating it while on tour and just wiped out all my settings.

Oh, my God. Never again. Well, I do that. You know, I mean, like I couldn't believe that happened. And like I said, I did that. Why see what the second time was, it's like, all right. That was it. And again, you know, I, I have a lot of grit, you know, gratitude for that period because I'm amazed. You know, I'm grateful like I said that we got through it like everyone, you know, kind of just forged through it because at that time, my guitar sound was garbage. Like to me, you need on that record.

Just not on the record. The record. The recording. Yeah, I was going to say it sounds amazing. Yeah, no, this is like my performances. And what was incredible to me, like, I was just like for me, I was struggling with it. It was not satisfying me personally. But then I would get compliments, you know, at the end of the shows, you know, people like I sounded so sick, blah, blah, blah.

And you know, you know, so I'm trying to like, you know, cope with my negative feelings toward, you know, what's happening. What was other people like trying to be like happy about it. I'm just like, wow, this is, this is crazy to me. I don't even, you know, I wasn't connecting. I know one day I actually, you know, a little thing triggered, you know, and I made an adjustment and it ended up being the thing that made all the difference in using that piece of equipment.

The two things I did was initially when I first started using it, I used that like a, like a preamp. So I was running that into a power app. And I was even, I wasn't paying attention to numbers or the dial or anything. I was just setting it up to my ears, making sure it's how to good. It was all good.

It was one day when you released that, their later version of it and they started, they added this feature called tone matching. That's kind of when everybody started modeling their app in that period of time. And I was like, oh, that's going to be sick. I'll be able to have my tone from every record will build the sound like all the records now, right. And that's really what, that was my step back was trying to achieve that.

And I was using, I don't even know if you're even familiar with, no, I am in the act of everyone, everything you're saying, because I knew you're going to say acts effects, because that was around the time that like, gent was taking off and everybody had the acts effects.

My buddy, John had it and we would like record covers and it sounded so sick. And then it was like, Kimper and everyone's like, yeah, the Kimper's the thing now. So no, I definitely know what you're talking about with that. And like, I think you're your own worst critic, though, you know, it's like when you, when you hear your tone and then other people come to the show and they're like, dude, that was sick.

Yeah, well, like I said, the thing that was bothering me, the thing I was struggling with was in the, in the blocks and the, in the effects blocks in the unit. My rig has always been, and most guitar player rigs are always in a mono, right? So, but I would, but I had, you know, I always used at least two cabinets and it would always be left and right. But without me even being conscious of it or paying, you know, really thinking much about it.

I've always been running a mono, mono sound, you know, so even though I, I'm looking at two cabinet. It's the same signal coming out of both of them. And it would only become a stereo signal when I add an a stereo effect. When I was building all my new patches during that time and setting everything up, I had set it up with a stereo cab block in there. And that was, you know, it was dividing up my signal and splitting it, you know, you know, given it the stereo.

Sound the width, if you will, you know, and to me, it was sounding hollow. It was out of phase. And I didn't know that because I'm not the last thing I'm thinking about a stuff like that. And it was like I said, one day I was just sitting around because like every day, you know, I was like, you know, we're always getting into some arguments. You know, it was always messing it's often done, you know, like live because I'm too.

Down this rabbit, you say when you say getting to, you know, messing stuff up, you're saying like, or your bandmates coming to you, like you screwed that up. Oh, my God, for sure, you know, yeah, no, and like I said, that was, you know, that was, but I wasn't arguing with them because they were right, you know, it wasn't sounding right. And only I couldn't figure it out.

And then one day I, you know, I thought to myself, I went back to when I originally started using it, I didn't have those problems. It wasn't until I started redoing everything. And after, like I said, a couple different updates. And you know, my patches, you know, trying to incorporate the tone matching, you know, sound into all this.

It wasn't until one day we were sitting somewhere on tour. I don't remember where and I was just like, how about I switched that cab block to a monoblock, you know, because I was always using a stereo cap. And I was like, I was like, because I've always been monobono. So let me just flip that and see what happened. So literally I went and just make that one change.

And my, all the problems I had literally went away that that gap that is in the sound when you're out of phase, immediately filled in. And I was like, wow, all this time, all I had to do was just flip it to mono, you know what I mean. And I, and again, like I said, back to where I'm grateful, grateful that that we were able to go through that period of time. And people were still able to enjoy that experience, even though for me and us, I was creating a problem in, you know, internally for us.

And I was like, I'm not going to say it was, you know, something. And, and that was really even kind of like, you know, this sort of even another problem because I'm at the place now where I'm using the line six helix, right. That's kind of my, my, the base in my, in my rig. And that's, I actually don't have a problem with that thing. I love it. Everything about it is working great.

And I'm not saying it's like cheaper than the acts of X. No, it's not saying, I mean, a little bit, it's a little bit cheaper, but not, not a lot. You know, I mean, the band of you are still going to spend, you know, 1500. Right. Wow. Yeah. So, but I, I've been able to, you know, like I said, if it's the sound that I want, you know, I can get it out of that thing right away. And now that I know I'm not dealing with this, this stereo thing, you know, I mean, I, like I said,

that's part of that problem is long gone, right. But that what became like I said, a side problem on top of that was, you know, I said, my, my home is clown on me all the time. They're always just like, I get it by other guitarist. No, no, I'm just talking about my friends. Oh, okay. Yeah. We're always, yeah, no, we are always picking on each other for this and that. And, you know, so now it's like, you know, if it came up problem where, you know, the next problem that got generated.

From doing all this gear changing was every time I changed, you know, like from my old system to the actual fix, I had to program everything. So what there was a lot of stuff in the catalog. I could do because I couldn't program the effects to sound like other effects from other state, right. And then I went, you know, then going from the, the acts effects to the light to the helix, right.

I had to start programming everything again. And it was, and the problem started being like, you know, every time we would have rehearsals, I'm like, hey guys, I need some time to where I could, you know, program stuff and, and make sure I got a dial. You know, so everybody's always in this waiting position for me because I got to do this, you know, stuff that I have a problem that I created, right.

But then I, you know, I guess there came a day where I absolutely was like, all right, this has to end. I can't keep this is not what this is not my goal and this is not the future, right. So I just had to strip down everything, simplify it and really lock down and get that it get it all programmed.

And there's probably some stuff still in the catalog that that probably I don't have the effects program to, but for the most part, I can get through just about everything at this point, you know, I don't know, I just said just, you know, my problems with equipment, you know, I mean, like, could easily be easily been remedied out. I just never switched to begin with, but that, you know, that's a bridge already crossed and here we are.

And you know, different from, you know, recording music, I just try to keep production stuff that I do simple as possible to just kind of like not have to get stuck in that analysis paralysis period, you know, and they just kind of takes the fun out of it.

And so, as you know, I mean, if you're a fan, you know, the timeline, you've seen all this, you know, take place, that would bring us up to go. Right. So everybody thinks I have this huge problem with go because, you know, some interview years ago, this is why, you know, I mean, like doing an interview, this is dumb.

You know, I was just talking about how I just wasn't having a good time, you know, like, there was, there was moments in, you know, during that session where I just wasn't, you know, happy, but I was, but I would tell people that so they wanted to distort it anyway that they want for their, you know, their purposes.

And, but I literally had, you know, only a problem with one song, but we made that record that was hearts and wires. And I just, for whatever reason, it wasn't jelling with me while it was being, you know, the creation of that song. And I just simply, whenever everybody started playing it, I just didn't even participate in it. And for two reasons, one, I didn't want to, again, I just, when I, when I, when I step aside, I'm just trying to stay out of the way.

I don't want to mess it up, you know, but the other was that I just, you know, I wasn't skewing it. You know, I mean, and as, as we got closer and closer to the recording of the record, I was just like, all right, the song is going to, it's, it's going forward with or without me, you know, I mean, I can, you know, that that was kind of like, you know, the perspective I had on it.

And I was like, it's time to actually come up with some parts that I actually like in this song would be something or. And so I did I bugled down and came up with some parts on there that I thought fit the song and the vibe of what was happening.

And I really like that. So that's actually one of my favorite songs off that record now. You know, I mean, for like, what's such a challenge, you know, and, but like trying to, you know, let everybody know, you know, it's like, and you know, I really actually like that record didn't have a problem with that. I probably have the least amount of problems in the end, you know, and.

Yeah, it's just weird how, you know, how things want to get, you know, stretched out like that, you know, but that that it started again, because like I said, the problems. And I was going with, you know, going through with the aspects up until that had led into that process, you know, it wasn't really, it was that same period of time where I, you know, that clicked and I had, you know, I figured out the solution to my process.

And I got on to, like I said, when I, when I got past that and I really just started training like any other piece of equipment that I would have done in the past, I got past all that, but it was, you know, was in that period of time and that's part of why, like I said, you know, like, you know, I was, you know, that that that was a struggle, but that woke me up, because when we did homes, I went back to my original gear.

Like that I was using from diamond eyes going back, I went back to that equipment, because I was like, you know what, I just don't want to deal with these issues, right? I want to, I want to add, you know, I was starting to use like real apps like when we actually started working on started writing for all times, I was using a couple different heads versus like Maxwell Rack that I want all my stuff and, and that really, you know, push, you know, after going through through that whole project, you know, which was amazing.

You know, went to this whole period of life that we're all living through right now that we're all, which is a total shit show for all of us, you know, it's insane. And you know, I mean, those are not like a whole kinds of all kinds of conversations that isn't even matter if we have. Yeah, I mean, blah. Yeah.

But here we are, we're working on another record, right? Are you as you know, I do a couple days on the Dr. Greenbun podcast and I've talked about, you know, this brought the, you know, the writing process now really all through the beginning of last year. And, but when we got into this, you know, the studio to actually where it was my turn time to do cards and all this, you know, over the past. I don't know.

Let's just say 10 years. Maybe it could have been less. I bought a bunch. I've, you know, I've acquired amplifiers along the way different heads and all that. And this record, I actually, you know, got to bust all these amps out doing, you know, the guitar is in. I was like, all right, you know, I mean, I've got this, you know, we're reinvigorated love for actual two amplifier.

There, you know, there is something about that that is, there's just undeniable. It just can't be beat. And, you know, I live in a world of both digital and analog and they both have a role and they're both amazing. And when used together properly, great satisfaction can be achieved. That's kind of like I said, that's kind of where I, you know, I'm at now, you know, but I'm not struggling with the program. You know, the optical is out of the way, you know.

Well, I personally did a lot to strip away a lot of that stuff. You know, I mean, just, you know, like I said, you know, I actually have an aspect in my rig, right? But I'm married to it because I used on the coil record, I used four or five different factory presets on songs, right? There's no way I'm going to achieve those, those effects with anything else. They are what they are.

I came out of that machine designed by those designers, I have to just use that piece of equipment to accomplish what I used it for, you know, and with this record, I, I, I haven't used the lot of effects at all this time around. Not to say I didn't use any, I definitely got effects on there and possibly more could show up, you know, nothing has at this moment, you know, I had it gotten added to it.

But my position has been, if I'm going to use effects, they're, they're the effects that are actually inside of the, the helix because it's already there. Like, and, and if I'm going to use any in there, I don't even want to go into changing them. I'm just going to use them as they were built in the, from the factory, you're in the con. That's what I'm using because should that device fail me anywhere.

And minimum I can go grab a new one from somewhere, turn it on and those sounds are just right there in the, I don't have to change nothing, you know, so, yeah, I just, you know, I tried to make it a lesson more this time around, you know, I think even over the last 10 years to a certain extent, there was a period where rock was pretty stale in my opinion.

I think it's because there was a time maybe five somebody years ago, a lot of bands were kind of sounding the same that were coming up, maybe you all have your own unique different sound, but there was a lot of similarity people would talk about this a lot. And now we're seeing newer bands that are coming out that are very different, you know, sleep token sounds very different from bad omens, et cetera.

I'm just curious what your thoughts are on like where rock is today and like maybe who are some of the bands that you're listening to that you kind of alluded to earlier. Sleep tokens one of those bands I love that they're amazing. Also Bill Murray. Oh wow, here. That is so sick his new albums out now.

Yeah, no, I got it. I love it, you know, and like I said earlier, you know, it's amazing. You know, he's been going or been doing stuff will over a decade, but you know, Bill Murray's been going on for a decade practically at this point, right? And that's why I was like, where the hell was I for a decade right? They're even hurt the me let alone the music, you know what I mean? And it's like, that's not even as far as being. He really came on to my radar maybe over the last year or so.

And he's it's not just the music you listen to it and it's so catchy. And there's elements of maybe Southern rock and then he's got some country singers that'll sing on tracks. But dude, his music videos, Triff me out, man, they're hilarious. Yeah, I love his videos. And again, you know, another, another group on that list. When I got into him, they were Eskimo Callboy, but now they're electric boy, you know, they're killing it.

Again, they've been, they got an entire catalog of record. We probably even did shows with them in Europe and I didn't even know it. Like, how did I never hear this stuff? You know, I mean, like we're at. And again, like I said, I'm just in my own little bubble. You know what I mean? I'm with all my people doing whatever we're doing. So I just, you know, are you kind of offst her shamedia? Like are you not really like, I don't know if you're on Instagram.

I don't. I'm on IG, but I'm not accurate. I haven't been on there for a. Again, probably through this whole pandemic period. And I want to get some shout outs, you know, just from the IG. Like I got to make this guy is named Johnny Brunza. Uh, uh, uh, a channel on YouTube. I think it's Sonic. The Rios. I can't remember that right off top right now, but awesome.

Awesome. Do lives in the Netherlands. You know, I was asking advice because I want to start my own channel too. You know, I, I'd literally been. I quit my. And I've been wanting wanting to set it up now for literally the last year. New it bro, but for what, but for whatever reason, I just procrastinate constantly because I don't need to have this perfect. I don't have. We all got to subscribe. Right, guys. No, bro. I'm doing you. That's one thing I know about is you just have to start YouTube.

You have to start. You'll look back and go, oh, that sucked, but you just have to. Yeah. Yeah. And so, so what I, so yeah, so how I started though was, I don't know if you're aware, but I started doing playthroughs for all all the. I've seen them on the depth terms channel. Yeah. And I'm not done yet. I haven't done any now for a while. You know, but that's because personally I've just been going. You know, going through life. You know, I mean, there's always something that's jamming me up.

And, um, but I, I'm going to, I'll tell you right now, the next video that I will be putting up when I do do it, because I already. I'm just on my schedule that it's just not on a calendar day. But it would be pink bag it off of wife on it. Wow. The last song offer there, you know, and that's where I'll pick up and, and I'll continue and I'll go through all the songs. And I'm playing the song. But I'm back. You know, there's something I didn't do anything on. I'm not going to go.

Of course, like, I'm on this song, you know. But you're in the podcasting too, though, which I also think is sick. You know, you could maybe talk about, say, you're interested in on your channel. You could bring guests on. It's very easy to do. Yeah. Yeah. But believe me, I got all the things that have been done, plan, be done.

You know, I've talked about all these things. I got ideas and I wanted you all these things. You know, I don't really want to get into like reviewing a clip or anything like that. Care less about that. But I got, but I like, I got a lot of equipment that I'm going to use. And, you know, and I will, I will show it often. I will be proud of whatever. And I'll be like, this piece is amazing. But I'm not looking to do that for anything other than personal.

Graphic occasion, you know, and mostly ultimately just to create more music. I mean, that's all it's going to end up driving you know at the end of the day. It's just be more music. And, yeah. But like I said, that's been a process like I've been, I've got, I've got all my gear to set up my stuff.

You know, I'm closer at it now than I actually was when I started. But that's only because I've exhausted everything. And I was like, the only thing that's jamming up at this point is me just get on and go. Right. And that's just the thing, just starting the process. But I mean, you'll have, I mean, everyone that's watching this will subscribe to your channel for sure. I mean, are you just going to be direct uploading to death tones.

No, it'd be my own channel. You know, yeah, I know it'll be my own. And like said, I do all the play threes and I put them up on the death tones. And, and shout out to everyone that's been paying attention to that, you know, and all the comments I read everyone's comments. And I love hearing everybody's saying I love all people's.

You know, I love you. I like reading the haters comments because all my haters. So I'll be cracking up with what fools got to see what they got to see. But I'm like, let's say I get it. I say some crazy. Do you ever like get on there like on like a like a shadow account and like rant and shit like no, you're not that, but you're not a real hater than you know what I mean? Like a real hater.

All day. Yeah, no, no, my, my hate is yeah, exactly, bro. Just just trash talking. I'm with that like WWE attitude era like shit. Levels. Where you wrestling fan? Still am. Yeah, I mean, I'm falling at closely or anything like that. But what do you do like outside of music for fun? Like what is your like?

What is there like any other hobbies you're into like completely unrelated to music? I'm very simple, you know, I, I've gotten, I'll tell you what, I've gotten so out of shape watching so much YouTube over the

town of handful of years or whatever, right? You know, and I've literally gotten to this place where you know, you know, some days it's a struggle, you know, I'm really tired, you know, I mean, I'm just exhausted. I don't want to do nothing. But I've been, you know, I've been out riding my bike. Take our little dog out for a bike rides every every morning. You know, she, you know, we got a little elderly little puppy. You know, she got that, you know, got their arts right as and go for walks all the time.

You know, which ultimately keeps me from going on walks and then I'm struggling. I'm just like, God, I gotta get out there and you all this, you know, so I'm really been, that's kind of been my personal focus is just getting, you know, getting outside and I move around. But other than that, keep it simple, you know, we just built some, you know, planners for in our, in our yard.

And I'm just, you know, I mean, just again, like I was talking about missing out on so many things because I've been out doing, I'm just living what would be considered to be your average life. I don't, I don't do anything that no one else has been doing, you know, I don't, my perspective, I share so many common things with everyone, you know, I mean, I can have a conversation with anyone about anything and have a great time.

Even when it's something about probably that I don't even like enough to be like, you know, I can appreciate hearing your perspective on it because I like, I like gaining the perspective. I found for me, I just started out loving walking and like, just like, I just got into like from watching YouTube, I would watch these people that would vlog going hiking and I'm like, I want to do this for some reason. And I think it's just like listening to podcasts while I walk, I guess. But, um,

that's what I do, you know, I mean, I go out, that's, that's funny that you say that because that's the thing that slows me down before I even get out the door because I feel like I'm just sitting there scrolling forever down my feet like, all right, anything that I just haven't seen a million time. You know, is there something new? I mean, I'm the same way. Of course there is, but, but your feed just wants to keep giving you what it thinks you need to have. And I'm like, stop thinking for me.

Anybody who's watching at home, bro, like, if you feel like shit, just going outside has half the battle, it seems, you know, and going for a walk. That definitely has done wonders for me. And it started me getting back into eventually running again and I've ended up losing 50 pounds and all this shit. And like, I never thought I would be able to do that to be honest. I just thought, oh, I'm not going to work out anymore.

Yeah, I relate to that. And, you know, I mean, so it's like, I'm just at that place where as an individual, I'm having to, you know, just force myself like, okay, you got yourself in this hole, you got to get yourself out of this hole. And it's not easy, but, you know, I mean, I'm in a better place now than I was six months ago, I'll be in a better place six months from now and so on. I just, you know, try to always maintain a positive perspective because I don't want to manifest the negativity.

So, you know, negativity is just right there just waiting for you. And reason for me, you know, you know, it's, and it's weird, you know, I, as you're saying that that was one of the things that got me in the way. And it's one of the things that got me out right in the bike all the time because in our area where we live, you know, we, we start the day off every day because we're close to the coast with the marine layer.

So, it's generally gray and chilly out before it gets warm and nice, you know what I mean. And, and like I said, during this past period of time, the pandemic, whatever you want to call it, blah, blah, blah. So, that part of me getting lazy and, and sitting inside on YouTube all the time wasn't because I was just so drawn to the content. I mean, whatever. I mean, it's interesting. But, you know, I always felt like we're in this perpetual state of winter where it's always cold.

It's always gray. But it's just always cold and gray here. It's not actually cold and gray everywhere else. So, I was like, I need to start leaning my, you know, my neighborhood and getting out. You know, it's been a help. I mean, I'm still, you know, I'm still not feeling the great like, you know, like I wish I would. But, but I'm feeling better, you know, and it's, it's just kind of takes some time.

That's, you know, like I said, I'm going, I'm learning all these things, you know, about, about myself and, and trying to get it right. Oh, hey, what's your name? That's so cute. It's Popo. I have four cats on my own. I love this. Oh, what's up, kid? Who we invading is that a sheer heat? I have all girls. Yeah, four in my life. Yeah, we have three, we have three cats in one dog. Oh, that is so cute. I have four cats and two boys, two girls and they are just hilarious.

Yeah, I love, I love animals all time. Me too. You know, from the most tiniest little thing that you never even think, you know, like I just love life. And it, you know, it, it, it's sad when life has to go or it gets taken, you know, but it's like, got always a remind yourself that it's just part of the cycle. I mean, we're all coming. We're all going to be the way it is.

Ain't no way around it. And, you know, that, and, you know, that, again, like we were talking about that earlier, just slightly. You know, I mean, that's the difference from when we started to now, you know, when we started in your young, the last thing you're thinking about is your mortality. And then you get up into your older years and you're like, oh, God, it's today and today, don't be one. Yeah. What was that? What was that pain? Was that what I know please don't be?

Yeah. Well, look, I don't want to hold you all day, especially that cat seems like it's, it's hungry or something. But I really want to say good. No, she's just, she just wants to. You know, my, it's actually our little dog. She's actually like staring at me like, can you let me out? I got a little bass. Well, I just want to say, dude, it means so much to me that you did this podcast. It really, really means a lot.

I've been listening to your band for so long. And I think it says a lot about you. As y'all know, most of these podcasts, yes, we just get connected directly. And with the success of your band, I just think it's freaking amazing. I know my audience is going to trip as well. And bro, come back on when that channel is ready to go. And we will all get behind you and subscribe and show love and support. And because definitely meant a lot when you wore that share crew.

I appreciate that. And like I said, you know, I'm here, you know, as a fan, you know, I'm not here in any official capacity. Trying to talk about the joke. I'm like, you know, I'm like, you know, I, you know, I started, I first heard of you with the beginning of your channel. I didn't say the beginning of the pandemic, but you know, it wasn't after that. Long after that is in that period of time. I went on another podcast and everybody was just like,

I'm like, I'm just going to step there. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. Yeah, the flatter stuff. Can we talk about it? Just what if, you know, it doesn't even matter if you talk about it. It's just your, it's your opinion. It only means something. It only means stuff to those that it means stuff. Exactly. But I also just, I want to be clear, bro, as well, because I do look into conspiracy.

I have no judgment towards anybody. You can look at the logo of my channel, you know, speaks for itself. You know, it's like, it's simple. There's reality. And then there's the reality that you think you're doing. That's the easiest way. Do you think that we're kind of in a simulation when you say like, I've looked a little bit into simulation theory. Like, and that's pretty wide. There's a lot of people who talk about that.

You want to tell you this? I'm going to tell you what I know. And what I know is that I have said with great humility and great arrogance for a long time that I know everything. And I say that because it just funny sounding, right? But having said that, I say that because I know down well, that I don't know everything. And if you're going to ask me about what this thing is, what it is, what we're hard on and this that I am at the lightest.

My perspective is simple, though, where I am now, you know, I didn't have an understanding of what God was or is. All the way through my youth, but I still like now, this is God's realm and it's undeniable. And if we're going to talk about science, well, science is God. God is science. Right. No, I definitely get down with that 100% bro. And I just again, I want to thank you for being here. I could sit here and talk to you for three hours.

And I would love for you to come back. And it's just amazing. I'm definitely going to come out to countless more shows in the future. And, you know, it's just been amazing. This whole thing has been amazing. It's been so sick talking to you. And I just really appreciate this man. Hey, like I said, you know, I took this opportunity as a fan. You know, I'm not here to be, you know, like said, it's not any official way or anything like that.

And yeah, thank you for your time too. You know what I mean? Like I got this was the last thing I was expecting today was to actually going all this. I was just like that I wanted to be just say, hey, you know, I appreciate what you do. You know, you know, it's it's it's it's it's it's nice. You know, I mean, it's not the world has so much stuff that just like just trying to drive you just pound you into the ground and you're not that.

I said, I bought it like I bought it to support work because you know, I mean, like said, I'm a fan to you. And, you know, I I enjoy that. That kind of thing creates this. Yes. You know, 100% well, bro, I appreciate you. Please come back when you've got the channel ready or any other time you ever want to. And thank you so much. Thank you. Appreciate it.