More Train Talk: The Great Train Robbery

I'll just late this way. They're given a plot of earth it's three ms by three meters, and they're allowed to use a couple of different implements to try to get worms to emerge from the earth. They're allowed to use a garden fork, you know, like those three fingers things, piece of wood if they want. They can have a source for music or sound, like a boom box or something.

And uh, the judges they start the time where they go, youve got thirty minutes, right, and then the goals to charm as many worms as they can to crawl up out of the dirt and present themselves on the surface, right, there's the only one rule, no dig right now. The idea is that, you know, you can use various techniques

to create vibration. That's what all the sound stuff is for the wood and everything, and then the vibrations drive the worms insane and they have to like stop beating on that two by four and they crawl out of the earth. Now, if you can guess, how many do you think as a world record for worms charmed out of the English soil in thirty minutes time? How many do they put in each bin three by three plot? And it's just thick with them. No, it's just normal earth.

They don't put they don't put any your own. It's not somewhere oh gosh, I don't know. In thirty minutes, just coming out of the earth. And the only rule is no digging, you know. That's that's multiple second because they all come up after exactly. So that that record, by the way, I set so it's out there if you want to break it, all right, I'll get to it. Ridiculous. That is really ridiculous. Again, I kind of want to know how it came about, and then I kind of don't.

I do. It's England, that's how it came about well, speaking of England. Yeah, you know what else is ridiculous aside from worm charming? A couple of things, Yeah, one on fifteen dude stealing a train. Yeah, this is ridiculous crime a podcast about absurd and outrageous capers, heists, cons. It's always murder free and on ridiculous. Damn right, we have a pretty cool theme song, right, Oh my god, it's the best. I love it. Trave killed it. Yeah, it totally fits the show somehow. Um, what would you

say is your favorite TV theme song? Speaking of theme songs with my clumsy segways, favorite TV themes, I mean, just offhand, I love Rockford Files. It's probably one of my ultimate favorites. I love the weird, jangly northern exposure just because it makes me happy when I hear it. Um, there's other ones. I mean, like, you know, Peter Gunn theme was a classic, and I ever watched it, but I've I've heard the song a bunch, and I think that's a really cool one. I'd probably say, let's go

with the Rockford Files be my favorite. Yeah, that makes sense. I like Walking Empire. I don't know that one. It's a jangly. Oh really it's like piano. No, it's an electric guitar. Oh, board Walk nachronistic. Yet it's a good song. Um, it's no lyrics, instrumental. They call it just the way you'd like it. Well, there are a lot of robberies on Boardwalk, Empire. I'm working on all my news right now. There's banking, sharp and clean. Um. Speaking of robberies, I'm

gonna tell you today about a robbery. Man, I'm into it here. Here's the thing. If it weren't not for this particular robbery, we likely wouldn't have had one of the greatest TV theme songs ever written. I'm gonna tell you. We'll get to that later. Buckled up. Let's talk crime. First. Hit me with you like crime, right, you never heard of it? That's when someone breaks the law. Let's talk robbery. Um, you've told me about train robberies before, right, Yeah, yeah, exactly,

Billy Minor Robin trains in the Old West. Um so, but when we hear about train robberies, we like we think of the Old West. Yeah, like the James Gang and people on horses with rifles and like, yeehaw, the train robbery. I want to tell you about today. Happened in nineteen sixty three, and it happened in the United Kingdom. Like this, I am just breaking all sorts of stereotypes when it comes to train robberies, steel horses, all this. Okay, So went down in there. Used to this train service

called the traveling post Office. So mail would be put on a train at one end of the country and sent towards London. So hey, wait a minute, a traveling post off. It makes it sound like it stops and I can go get some stamps if it comes to Brockhampton or whatever, like it really is, Like well, it's kind of no, it doesn't stop. Um, that's one of the train the call. But it's not. Okay, so check

this out. So the mail gets put on the train at one end of the country, like not all the way up to John of Roads north but like so that's the northernmost point, that past Northman Island. Oh, the northern moost point on the island. We're including Scotland, right, yeah, okay, UK, not England, and then the southernmost is Penzance where yes, so, but they wouldn't take it all the way. That's real,

Poe I didn't know that. Yeah. Um, they would go up to like Aberdeen is the northernmost point of this and they would load up with mail and then they'd head to London or South up are all of Australia's towns named towns in England. I mean there's a single new one. It's like where they got kicked out of. They know everything. They're like, oh, this is Aberdeen. Um. So they loaded up right and it's a long distance

that they have to go. The train is full of postal workers who are sorting the mail for delivery along the route. Yeah, so they and they're picking up mail as they go. So as they passed through these collection points, they would toss out their bags of mail to be delivered to that point. And then they also had like big nets where they would grab these mail bags hung from hooks, so the train didn't have to stop, would

just like slow down. Yeah exactly. And so they grabbed the mail and then they get that and they start sorting it where it has to go. Um, and the staff and the train just like kept sorting constantly as they as they rolled on. In three there were forty nine of these trains being used. So this is like a predominant amount of their mail services going this way.

I think so, I mean because they think about how we get mail if we look good at like the islands, the size of the state of California kind of yeah. And also the fact that we were fly our mail across country and they would just take a train because they used trains for most of their beautiful infrastructure they have. So some of the cars would be attached to passenger trains, but most were just dedicated postal trains um and so. Like I said, they went between Aberdeen and Scotland and

London or pen Zance up, um and so on. These trains. The second and third cars were always special. So listening to like steady music, Yeah, it was full of this. That's how they got their start. In her name. These were called hv P cars. That's high value packets. Oh I had no chet, not not HPV cars carrying human paplovirus virus h v P. It was not how they spread that across the country to give you that high

value packets, um packet man. So this is where registered mail and then most importantly a lot of cash those were kept. I'm listening. So normally there'd be about three thousand pounds sterling in that carriage, and in the sixties that's a ton, right, Yeah, well it's like seven million pounds sterling today, So seven million bucks rolling on down the tracks and give me a nice flot Yeah, nothing

to sniff at. In three, a postal security officer who was like pretty high up, he tells a lawyer or what they're calling a solicitor's clerk or as they would say, solicitors Clark Clark. They do, isn't it. Yeah, and they invented the language they did, so we're not doing it right. Um. See, he's like, look, I got a line on a heist. Check me out the barrister lawyer. The security officer for the post office goes and finds a lawyer. Okay, look

at me. Well he's kind of a good lawyer. So the lawyer turns around and it's like, hey, I know a guy who has a heist. I've got some clients. Yeah, he's got two criminal clients. Yeah, Gordon Goody. He goes to his own client. Yeah, I gotta lead boys, Gordon Goody and Buster Edwards. Gordon and Buster. So he's like, Gordon, Buster, I got a cat at the Postal Service says he knows he knows how to do a good heist. Gordon tall blonde fella, this is better than your last idea.

You guys should started a restaurant together. It's a tax right off Gordon Busters. I don't know that. Gordon is like super into criming and he got he got, you know, into it at a young age. He joined Busters Gang. Okay, you know it sounds like a forties so Buster he's the son of a bartender and he used to work in a sausage factory. Okay, but that means he's like deep into post war black market stuff. Yeah, he's a meat packer on the dirty. Yeah. Well, I mean, don't

forget uk UK ration were in place until nine. Yeah, so during the war, this whole black market economy comes up and actually chocolate but yeah, anything and so that you know, that continues on during ration NG and then it just like keeps up and it kind of merges in nicely with the pre existing criminal black market that was was already there. So it kind of explains to those sixties British rock bands love of American stuff that they didn't have anything is the deprivation. They're like oh

my god, I want some exactly. So in summary, Busters, a career criminal, now the security officer, he is known only as the Ulsterman. His identity remained a mystery for half a century. Ulsterman he knew which trains would be where and when. And he also knew that the postal service has sort of like beefed up security for the h VPS um after there had been like a couple of robbery attempts. So another thing that he knew, he'd a lot. Yeah, he knew that some of the train

cars didn't have that beefed up security. By the way, is Ulsterman like a job title. I only know Ulster is a place. He's from, Ulster. I just wanted to um. And so he knew which cars weren't tricked out and when they'd be used. So his yeah, his heist idea goes like this. So, as I said, h v P cars they normally carry around three grand after bank holidays, it's a lot more because it's a long weekend. People are spending their money. How much more I can see

in your eyes? I was wondering, he did you see the numbers? Somewhere between two and three million pounds whoa, Yeah, ten times as much just because of a holiday weekend. And then in nineteen sixty three that's the same as fifty eight million pounds today, and that's like sixty five million bucks dollars American dollars. I'll take it. That's a lot hot damn right. So Gordon and Buster they're like, you know what, that sounds like a good hen help me in, you know, Gordon and Busters can wait, We

just we got to do this. They had the bona FIDE's their criminals. They're part of the Southwest Gang, which is a London crime syndicate. But they're like, we need a much bigger crew for this. This is a big job, going to take a big Crew's going to take a big boy to swing this back. Yeah, So they go to recruit. They call in Bruce Reynolds and Charlie Wilson. Bruce sort of becomes the leader of the group. He's well known, he's a successful criminal, but you know what,

he didn't know anything about Robin No Train. So he's just like Charlie Wilson, the other guy. He's known as the Silent Man. He's a dangerous guy, bad man. That's what they say about the Silent Ones. So they got those two in place, they locked them and the next batch that they pick up were members of the South Coast Raiders. That sounds like like a Weekend Warrior motorcycle

club that girls my sister play. It sounds like they ride Harley fat Boys and we're like brand new leather vests and the balding ones where bandanas folded all tight over the tops of their heads. Everyone's sweaty. Everyone's wearing white Kirkland elevens. You see this. They like stop for beers and they stand by their bikes. They got their fingers hitched in their belt loops. They're waiting for their lunch table. They're going to order jalapeno poppers, like hands down.

One's gonna order chicken fingers. There's another who's like, I'll take a salad because his cardia. I want to talk to some that's the South Coast, but it's actually just kidding. It's an English gang in the sixties. So they had actual train robbers in their in their crew. Jim Hussey not real hussy, Tommy Wisby and Bob Welch. I'm hoping there won't be a quiz later. No because listen, I had to. I had to write out a chart when

I was doing this, and I wish I were joking. Um. There's also a guy named Roger Quadry, and he knew how to operate the train signals along the track. So that's helpful. You gotta get the train to stop. As I learned when you told me about Mr Minor that I thought that they were just jumping on the train while it was moving, and then they got to figure out where they're going to jop Yea. So apparently they

have to stop these trains. Yeah, there you go. Well, Jimmy White, he was in charge of uncoupling train carriage there is that's his specialty. Um. Then there's Ronnie Biggs. He's a prison pal of Bruce's. UM. Ronnie connected them with a guy named Peter who also was called stan Agget. I don't know why they gave him that name Stan whatever. Maybe it's like it's like he's hard as a rock, who knows who cares? Like Bob gran Bob granted. So

Stan agg he's a train engineer. He drove them suckers whatever. He's the prime guy for this, so they pick up more dudes, lots of rude dudes piling and on top of that they get to fifteen guys on the core heist team. There are associates out there who are helping with other logistical things. We have fifteen guys, so they figured, okay, we're going to rob the train on August eight ninety three. It's the one going from Glasgow to London's Houston station.

I've been there. So it leaves Glasgow the deer Green place. That's literally what Glasgow means in Celtic. Learn all kinds of stuff today. It's so educational today. So they leave in the middle of the night and the midnight train from Glasgow. Um, the best place to stop the train would be at a signal light at Sears Crossing and Zaren.

That's between Layton, Buzzard and Cheddington. And that sounds like I totally made that up, totally right near Hampton and that is half a mile from Bridego Bridge, bretty Go Bridge, um, and that's really on the lane. And that's forty something miles north of London, eleven miles south of Bletchley, made famous by the World War Two codebreakers at Bletchley Park. I just saw that on the map, and I was like, well,

actually I love that stuff geography. Um. So the plan was to uncouple the engine and the HVP cars from the rest of the train and then ditch the seventy two postal employees and the ten other cars, take the engine and the high value cars down the line to Brittago Bridge and then they're going to clean them out there, separate them out. The new gang. They needed a staging area hide out this newly formed supergroup. So they buy a place called leather Slade Farm. Again, I am not

making these names. Leather Slade Farm and that's twenty seven miles from Brittigo Bridge. It's like a nice brick farmhouse, got some you know, good land around it. Um. They figured that they could like make the cost of the farm back. Obviously with all these millions, it didn't cost him. It's an operational investment. Yeah, and it was cheap. So they set up a fake army unit at the farm

to disguise their vehicles. Yeah, they stockpiled supplies. Um. The heist was going to be on a Thursday, at the very start of the day, and so they planned to make it a long weekend. They missed the bank, wheat holiday, So they're going to do their own um, and they're going to stay through Sunday, so that um, they would be able to kind of like lay low and then disperse. But if you're going to stay that long, you know, they needed snacks, they need stuff like that, so they

stock up. Before the heist. They went out to the signal light at Sears Crossing and they covered up the green light with a glove. They shoved the glove right up in there, just just crammed the glove. Saren they just shoved. Why do you keep making that gesture? I just wanted to understand. They just shove the glove. Clear. We're clear gloves up there. It's pretty it's they're pretty tight. Um. So then they get a big old battery, a big enough and they plug it into the red lights, so

they control the red light. They control the vertical um. They go down the track and then they stretch a huge white sheet across the rails to signal a stopping point, like you know, stop here to get to Britty Go Bridge. It's just like you know, their own communication thing. Now they just wait. All they gotta do is wait, m are you on? It kind of looks like you're on the edge of your seat, right, I'm probably gonna fase in, So okay, let's cool you off with some ads. Just

get you fully back in the seat. When we come back from this break, I'm going to tell you how it went down on that fateful August night. I can't wait, Zaren. When we left off are impromptu gang fifteen guys. I didn't do it. They had everything prepped. They not just rob a train. They were going to steal a train, a train filled with the equivalent of sixty five million

dollars today. That amount just absolutely mind blowing. I can't, honestly, I cannot imagine what sixty million dollars is like, what it would like, just like any part of it. What would you do with that? How much would it weigh? I'm gonna tell you. I'm gonna tell you, Saren. I gotta tell you something close. Take a deep breath and picture it. Yes, it's three in the morning on August three. You aren't Saren. Now, I'm you're David Whitby. Dawn it On.

David Whitby. You're a twenty six year old crew member the Traveling Post Office locomotive. You're just chugging along down the West Coast mainline. You love your job, you take it very seriously. Tonight you're working with your pal Jack Mills. Jack. He's fifty eight seasoned train conductor. You have learned so much from him. You've worked together on these long haul mail runs. You're both from a town called Crew in Cheshire. It's a railway town. Your train boys to the core.

You got that train life. Um. As you reach Sears crossing, Jack mutters, right, seems the red signal light is on. That doesn't really make a lot of sense. It should be completely smooth sailing in this stretch. He brings the giant locomotive to a stop. He tells you to get out and see what's what. So you have to call the signalman from the phone box at the light and get to the bottom of this. You crunch along the gravel that runs alongside the rails, reach the phone box,

lift the receiver and you see it. The phone line has been cut. What you didn't know is that all the phone lines in the immediate vicinity had been cut. You sign frustration head back toward the engine. This is also puzzling. Just as you reach the engine, put your hand on the rail to climb the metal steps into the cab. You hear a crunch behind you footfall in the gravel. Before you can turn around, you're tackled by a masked figure. So other tufts, dressed in the hoods

and blue jumpsuits. They come out of the woods and they climb into the engine from both sides. Jack tries to fight off the outlaws, but one pulls out a club often referred to as a cash and bangs him on the head, so he slumps down to the ground. In the days other members of the crew, they scurry, you know, into uncouple the HVP cars from the rest of the train. Remember train operators stand Aggett. Yeah, it's his time to shine. He takes hem of this mighty engine.

He sits at the controls. He looks at the various knobs and levers. He size, Um, guys, you know how you pick me for your gang? Because I used to drive trains for a living. Well, the emphasis should have been on used to I'm retired and it looks like they've totally modernized everything since I've been last in the saddle, So we kind of need someone else to do this. Kay thinks by so everyone looks around at darn Ronnie Biggs.

He brought them a dud, and so Bruce orders Ronnie and stand off the train and down the tracks to help unload the loop. They get demoted, so they still need a conductor though, right. Um. They look down on the floor, pitiful Jack Mills, bleeding from the head in a daze. This guy just tried to defend his mighty steed, Jackie exactly. They order him up. You, David Whitby, you're laying mo You're crouched in the corner trying to like maybe they don't see me anymore. Um. The criminals watches

Jack Mills valiant and brave. He guides the train down the track as instructed. So after this shorty version of the train pulled into another stop at Brittago Bridge, the robbers forced their way into the hv P cars and they like rough up the supervisors. They get the staff under control really quickly because like they're not expecting this. They're just thinking, yeah, they're at work, like why do we keep stopping whatever? Um, what else could they do?

So all of them are forced to life face down on the floor in the corner of one of the carriages and then you and Jack handcuffed together and made to join them together again, Dave Jackie train boys. Um. So before you sit down, you look out the window and you see a huge truck and Austin load Star pulled up alongside the train, two land rovers with identical plates twinsies. Um. And then you're like, you're you're seeing like, okay,

I kind of get why they're fifteen guys here. This is a big operation, um, because they have the truck right this Austin load Star. The fifteen guys they line up and they are a human chain moving the sacks of all the mail to from the carriage to the truck. There are a hundred and twenty eight bags in these two carriages, and these guys move a hundred and twenty of them in a half hour. That's two point five tons of cash. That's a lot. Oh yeah. And also

you're just constantly twisted moving bag. Yeah and so but the thing is it's heavy because it's mostly ones five tons small bills. Um. So it takes to do this. Uh. They toss them in the back of the idling load Star. Um. The last bag gets flung in the truck and one of the robbers turns back into the carriage and yells. Don't move for half an hour, and they're like okay, everyone's checking their watch, like, hold on, I gotta get my stop watch. Um. And with that truck land rovers

they peel out into the night. They've just stolen two and a half million pounds this mind blowing fortune. Um. They ramble along the road to leather Slade Farm. They're listening to police brook and uh, they're listening to police broadcasts on the scanner. Leather Slade Farm sounds like where a heavy metal band would live. Yeah, yeah, that's one option. That's I know. I'm steering us that way. I'm not going to steer elsewhere. So take some forty five minutes

to get to leather Slade Farm. I'm just gonna keep saying it to driving that. Um. They pull up and they hear calls going out on the police radio about their taper. Yeah we'll see that. A postal worker on the train managed to flag down a passing train heading to Cheddington, and the police announced what would become a famous line over their radio band, can you give it to me with accent? No robbery has been committed and

you'll never believe it. They've stolen the train. I did that in my junior high production drama production voice and robbery has been committed and you'll never believe it. They've stolen the train. And then my mom is in the good job honey, Oh she's so good, and then she's like,

oh my god, she's daring. Um alright, so uh that comment that one of them made about don't go anywhere for thirty minutes, that was a bad idea because one of the witnesses told the cops and then the cops were like, okay, so that means that they're probably within a thirty mile radio, right, I know what this means. So circle on the map now. Um. It's also okay, it's like they have this area to search. It's pretty much mostly farmland, so it's not like, oh, there are

a lot of hidy holes um in like buildings and stuff. Um, it's about four thirty in the morning at this point. Those farm folk they're they're just getting up and these are good, honest folk. We want to help the cops. So they're not down for this kind of hanky stuff. No, no, no, no. So, as I said before, gang, they were going to hang out until Sunday, have given long relaxing weekend and leather slide farm. And that's kind of a bad idea. Now

it's crap. So they're like, know what, let's leave tomorrow Friday. Let's get out of here. So that whole witness information thing that became a problem too, because you, David Whitby, you saw the truck and the two land rovers plashing plates and you pass that on to the cops. Of course you did. Yikes for them, it's right, you've got to keep him in mind. Um. So they're working out this plan about how how are we going to get

out of this farm. They split up the hall. That's like first and foremost, let's let's divvy up this money. So they wound up doing sixteen shares. We're going to take the time to count out tons of small bills. That's the whole point. They have to if they're going to scatter, they have to take their little chunk. I don't recommend they get about a hundred and fifty thousand pounds each, and that's you know, three and a half million a guy today. That's a lot of money, but

it's also small bills. Yeah, volume was and then they divided the remaining ten thousand up into what they called drinks. Have you ever heard that term? It's like little bits for those who are the side associates who helped out A term. I don't know. Maybe it comes from like getting their beaks wet. I love that phrase, but get your beak wet. Um. So a couple of the gang. Then they got rides out to pick up new cars

to like be able to come back and leave the farm. Um. Other ones hung out, I don't know, rolled in the money or something. Who knows. Um, I do know they had a game of Monopoly there and they used their real cash to play the game exactly. Um. Now, uh, they're on the edge because not only are the cops looking for them, but they start hearing these low flying R A F planes and oh my god, you guys they called out the army or the air Force whatever it is, a f air force. Well yeah, it was

just it wasn't part of a search. It was just up that just got them all chalked up. And there's yeah. So then this guy named Mark shows up. I'm sorry, that's amazing. There's Mark. Mark. Mark's got a couple of guys with him. They've brought vans. I like to believe that Mark is a really friendly Canadian. Well, like, in every article I've read about this, Mark's name is in quotation marks and that's like, you know, because it's probably not his name, but it makes me laugh because it's

so generic. Right, Like you have this thing about how you can get into any party if you just say that Josh invited you. Yeah, Scott, Josh your Scott like they told me to come. Yeah, I'm a Scott, I'm Josh. Everyone knows some Josh. Mike makes a good one. Parts of the country, Eric works or in the south, trade in cody to entry points. Marks like Marks a dark horse on this. Yeah, you know, like it's I wouldn't

use marker Gary. These are not names anymore, you know. Well, I mean then we get into generational thing things like now like younger generations, it's going to be like Madison told me or Caitlin I was at Brooklyn and Ireland and know what's Gwyneth Paltrow's kid eggs Apple it is. Why do I know these things? I didn't want to know them. I want to forget them. Keep your secrets anyway, Mark, So Mark He's brought in by that original lawyer who

connected the Ulsterman with all these clowns. Mark's job was to come in and clean the place any trace of the gang, and then he's supposed to set the whole place on fire. He's going to burn down leather Slade Farm. So on Friday, the robbers they get in their various vehicles and much like the last scene in Ocean's eleven, they like scatter off one by one into the night. But let's go back at the train on Thursday morning.

Chief Superintendent Malcolm Futrell say that one more time, Malcolm, I like the laser fight in the middle of his name. He later played a storm trip. So I can see why, Chief Superintendent Malcolm of the Buckinghamshire Police Criminal Investigation Department, he was on the case. He was there, Zaron. He looked around the circus, well, hold onto your pants. He looked around at the chaos, and he's like, I need

Scotland Yard and therefore I need the Flying Squad. Hear me be excited about the arrival of police, the Flying Squad. This is like right before they go crooked. Too likely sixties, Remember it was like late sixties, early seventies, they went all Cercuco. Okay, so they start a grid search. They

get right on it. Border exit points are alert alerted like all the ports um the postmaster offers a reward quote to the first person giving information leading to the apprehension and conviction of the person is responsible for the robbery. So like, first in, you get some money. I'm not like free stamps with the rest of your life. Like you get six books of stamps and they're not the

forever kind, and you get to pick. He went on the radio and he said, the first person giving information relating to the apprehension and conviction of the person's responsible for the robbery. That's how he said it. I gotta take it back and gather myself. Thank you so much. When we get back, I'm gonna tell you just who that first person was. Yeah, all right, Saren, we're back. Oh tasty. I love them, you love them. They're fresh, They're so good. Where's my wallet? It's just what I needed.

So once upon a time there was a lonely shepherd. Ah, yeah, I know the story, and that shepherd was not just lonely, he was nosy, my kind of shepherd. Uh. He noticed that there's an awful lot of activity. Wasn't a guy with a technicolor coat? No, no, next time, next episode. Um, there's a farm adjacent to him, like the pasture that

he uses. It's a farm called leather Slade Farm. Other farm. Um. And so he's like, there's a lot of activity, and this is the place been quiet for a while ever, and all of sudden we got these military so goings. So he calls the cops. People, um, flying squad. They race over, They get on their on their little spaceships, fly over. Um they found something and that something was not the burned shell of a building. Oh he didn't get to it. No, Generic Mark failed to burn the

place down. Mark. In fact, Generic Mark failed to clean it up. In quote Mark Mark. Um, the guys already like in prep for Mark, Like they didn't want the housekeeper to show up to too messy of a house, so they wiped down their prints before they left. Yeah, but they're counting on Mark to like do his job like we just did, like a surface clean He come

in with a heavy cleaning. Um. I like to imagine that as the robbers like rolled out in their rides, Mark stood in the doorway of the farmhouse, like wearing an apron and cleaning gloves. Yeah, were waving like the long farewell at them like a sailor's wife on the dock. He's got like one rubber like dishwhing glove. And then the last car like leaves the drive and he rips off the apron and gloves like Mark quote unquote Mark. Um. So that said flying squad shows up places just covered.

It's just thick with evidence. What did they find, Saron evidence? They found evidence, They found food, They found about sleeping bags, snacks, um, the paper rappers that go around stacks of cash bands, snacks they found, um, they found empty mail bags like bats incriminating, and then inside snack rappers. Um, they found registered mail with no money in it, so like someone was sending something like, you know, assigned form. I'll send it registered mail so we know you get it in

this garbage. Um. And they also found the Monopoly game. They found the Monopoly game, and they found the huge truck and the land rovers, but they had been sort of hastily painted yellow. I don't know if the bad guys did that or quote unquote marked. That is his one last act is all throw some yellow paint on him. Uh all three all three vehicles though, and those are the vehicles identif Fine, it's seen. So the c s I Casts that come in, they're like collecting from their

little treasure tripe. They're just you know, they're drooling so exciting fingerprints totally. Um, they're like, oh, we got these guys in our cross hair. I could tasted. Um they find Prince? Where did they find Prince? Saren? Because remember they guys wiped everything down where where they filled in the petrol? The monopoly game, like the board they didn't wipe down the board. And then a bottle of Ketchup that was just they're snacking it up and they're like,

someone's drinking ketchup. They found a drinking that by and I thought maybe you wouldn't notice one of your favorite cocktails. I noticed Ketchup. It's like really thick to mata juice. Um. So unfortunately virgin bloody Mary, Yeah, you just gotta water it down. And a C in the yammers um pearls. Unfortunately we're fortunately for a gang of thieves. Um, the investigation starts to lose steam. They had Prince, but they didn't have everyone's prince and they had some names, but

they didn't know where to find them. So they're just like three days later, they're just standing in the yard farm. We just started playing monopoly. They got side tracked. Well, they go down all these rabbit holes, right. They went through a list of post office employees and traced their genealogy to see if they had any shared last names with any of their suspects. That's the most British thing I've ever heard. Is what we need to do is come over the genealogy for everybody in the post office.

One guy, they traced him his family back to Victorian Norach. They're gonna like, oh, we got back to the Doomsday book and they're like, oh, dead end, that's not really literally. Um So then they flagged. They also were flagging large purchases by postal employees. Like a year after this, some guy who worked in the HVP car tried to buy a car, just going to guess and they were like, what are you doing. He's like, I've been saving up for a kid out of here. I was traumatized. They

investigated him six ways from Sunday. Nothing. So they're not really getting a lot of leads. But then two informants come forward. I've been wonder when you got fifteen guys. They got fifteen friends. Yeah, and so they're able to provide like a rough list of names, and a lot of those matched up with the prince. So the head of the Flying Squad at the time was a guy named Ernie Millen, and he was ready to act. Is all feeling funny inside. He decides to distribute pictures of

the suspects to the press. First, he gave him out like wallet size, and many had the portraits at home for the holidays exactly. Um, this was already huge news, right, I mean, this is just driving everyone bonkers. Um, gigantic heist, the great train robbery at the time, like the press referring to yeah, so um. Next in line for the head of the Flying Squad was a guy named Tommy Butler.

Tommy Tommy, and he's like, this is a really bad idea. Guys, don't put it in the don't put their pictures out there. It turned out to be correct a bad idea because as soon as the photo made the paper, all the guys go underground immediately because they're going to get recognized because everyone's reading about this. Tommy Butler then becomes head of the Flying all about fighting the crime. He's all about stopping the criming. And he had really good nicknames.

One day Tommy because I could get it done. He's like so quick to bust up one day Tommy the gray Fox. Not bad, that's foxy. I don't know. They're like that guy is such a good detective and he's really foxy. He's the gray Fox. And then they called him Mr. Flying Squad because they're like Jimmy Flying Squad over there. He's like, come on now. But he lived and breathed the anti crimings. Um confirmed bachelor who lived with his mom. But you know he was like he

worked these crazy long hours. He was all about busting back and married to the crime. He really was. I mean he really was. You can only give your heart to tell many things. There's only so much of you to go around when you're that foxy. Um. So he's all about busting and he got it done. He did busted. Eight days after the robbery. They caught their first criminal eight days Roger Cordrey. Alright, guy, he was the one in charge of messing with the train signals. He's the

glove jammer. Yeah, I again. He tried to pay his landlord three months rent at once in small bills. Now she was the widow of a cop, so she immediately she's like, something is hinky. And then a few weeks later, that lawyer who connected the ulsterman to the crooks, he gets caught. The lawyer gets popped. So he was already says, oh, yeah, totally, and so like, slowly but surely the police nabbed six more. Yeah, they got him, they got the group. Yeah, eight of

the core crew and a few hangers on. They stood trial in nineteen sixty four, so the next year media sensation. They had to move to a bigger venue to accommodate all these crowds. One of the cases was dismissed because of like fumbling with evidence and procedure and the I don't know whatever they and then the other seven get convicted and they got thirty years each thirty years. But it was like the magnitude of the robbery. But still

don't they have a standard? Well, something I thought was interesting In a lot of the documentaries that I watched about this, they would mention like how bad they felt, that they not bad, but that it was they realized it was such a bad thing to be stealing from the queen. Why, well, come on, dude, the queen was a very special gal. I get that, But would they have felt that bad way about to say the king

or is it just particular crown? But they said it with a sort of affection for the queen, was reserved for her in a way that we haven't seen yet. Well, I don't think we're going to shoot coming up? Okay, So Charlie Wilson, he's another one, the silent man, bad bad man. He gets a thirty year sentence, but he managed to escape from prison. Something you'll like their personal war. I knew, I knew that was so excited. Three men busted in and got him out of prison in just

three minutes. That set some sort of rap right um. From there he goes to Paris and gets plastic surgery. Then he goes to Mexico. He's doing every cliche you can pick up. And then from there he goes to Quebec and he becomes like a pillar of the community. He's just involved in a bunch of stuff. Scotland Yard, though, eventually tracks him down, brings him back. He has to serve out the rest of the yeah. Um. Then he goes back to criming after that and he gets killed

in a drug deal in Spain, in rug deal. Yeah. So he's you know, he's up in years and your last moments are like no, two for five there you go, well and that's what happens. Um. So then, like Charlie Ronnie Biggs, he also escaped from prison. Ronnie familiar. He will he kind of snuck out with some other guys who had planned an escape together. He just was like an escape stow away. He's like, I'll go with you. Do like a fair invader on the subway who slips

in with a person anyway. He's also he wants to be like Charlie so much because he then goes to Paris and gets plastic surgery. Um. And then after that he goes to Australia and then goes to Brazil and there's no extradition treaty with Brazil and at that time their dictatorship. If I believe, well, they can't give they can't.

They're not doing anything. You're not getting No, he's able to just go live his life and celebrate his journey out in the open, living his best life while he's there, he produced tracks for the Sex Pistols, and then when he's seventy one, he goes back to England after he had a couple of strokes like it's not funny the way I said it, couple like you know all and

I'm hitting moment um. He knew he could be arrested, but then um, he said he wanted to quote walk into a Margate pub Margaret pub as an Englishman and buy a pint of bitter and buy a pint of better. He keep coming across this with the people who would get away, they think and they want their sense of their life and it's worth everything exactly. So as soon as he gets off the plane he's arrested. He doesn't

even get a pint of bitter. No, that happened, man, Like you just okay, you could have that sent to you. They have they you you know, you robbed a mail card, you know, the ship things totally. So he he goes back, serves out the rest of his sentence. He gets denied parole at one point and then he gets compassionate release at the age of eighty. So because he was on his last legs. Then we got Gordon Goody He was

one of the original seven arrested. He got out of jail in nineteen seventy five when he was forty six years old, changed his name to Dave and opened a restaurant with his friend Buster. Yes, um, so before he goes in though, before he goes into jail, he gets this friend and has the friend like and trusts him with the riches he made a friend he went down today. No, he gets a friend of his and it's like, I'm going to entrust you with maybeaches and you know you're

in charge of my affairs. Test that friendship first, so then um the you know. He says like, you gotta make a promise to me, and that friend loyalist. And Gordon gets out and he's rich. Gordon's got cash. He moves to Spain and just cools out. Everybody needs a friend like that. Right. Two years before he passed away, he participated in a documentary called A Tale of Two Thieves. It's pretty good. Um, it's worth watching just for Gordon

because it's such a character. Um. It tells his story, But the most important part is that he finally reveals the name of the Ulsterman. Can you give me the guy had never been caught or named. Gordon spills the beans that it was a Belfast born postmaster named Patrick McKenna. What's funny in the documentary is that they have to call in all these researchers and investigators because there are too many Patrick McKenna's in the thirty two counties to

narrow it down. So but they solved the mystery, so they you know, but what about the other guys you're asking? Look at that bleeding good question. So Buster Edwards he starts a restaurant with his new friend day that he met with our producer Dave so Um. Buster Edwards, former sausage factory worker. He took his family and ran off to Mexico. And he did eventually go back home a couple of years later. And guess what did fifteen years?

Couldn't resist the siren call? What is it? The food is not that good, the weather is not that great. So he gets out and he needs a job, so he starts selling flowers outside of Waterloo train station. Like he's a character in Mary Poppin. Yeah, he's like Tuppance. Um. There's a movie called Buster and Phil Collins stars as Buster. That's about him, know, what I'm doing. This buster had a tragic end, so we're just going to stop at that. Jimmy White, the train conscious um un coupler. Uh, he

was on the runaround England, thank you. He was on the run around England with his family. And he did like he'd worked really hard to blend in because he thought he was like the invisible guy. No one, you know, no one could recognize him. But like people kept betraying him and all, not like turning him in, but just like taking his money or like doing him dirty and deals, and then you can't go to the police. Yeah, and then he gets recognized eighteen years and then there's Bruce Reynolds,

the Master. He called the robbery his Sistine Chapel. And he hid out after the robbery, waiting for a passport for a while. So he did most of the work lying on his back. And then uh, he hopped around on all these flights until he reached Mexico, Mexico. Yeah, go to Venezuela, Brazil. I mean, come on, that guy got to hang out. Um. He starts calling himself Keith Clement Miller, so he gets a new name. His wife and kid they joined him in Mexico and they lived

this like cool life. Buster and Charlie come to visit him on their various times on the lamb, like his friends going to see him, like some fast and furious. Yeah, and so they're having this really cool, like high flying lifestyle style in Mexico. Yeah, lots of villas and lots of like fruity drinks. Um. Then the family they moved to Canada, then they go back to England. Then they go to the south of France and then back to

England again, which was a smart go to Spain. Well, he couldn't resist his pals, so he was the last one to get caught, and he did ten years. When he got out, he tried to go straight, but eventually

he got back into money laundering, drug trafficking. He gets pinched for dealing speed and he did three years in the eighties and then after that bust he went legit as a media commentator, and then he wrote his autobiography and his wife and stunt son the best way to become an author, right, they stood by him all the whole time, right there with him. Wife. Goody, Now do you remember how I was talking about TV theme songs about four hours ago. Yes, yes, my answer is Rockford file.

You know which one is really good? The theme from the Sopranos, Oh my god, yeah, it's a great one to beat the whaling harmonica, Got myself a gun. You know who played that whaling harmonica, Little Walter. It's the sound that's evocative of the underworld, the psychic pain living none other than Nick Reynolds, son of Bruce Reynolds. He's a sculptor and a member of the group Alabama three and that's the band behind this theme song for the Sopranos.

He lived a wild life, wild family. And I think that we have Bruce Reynolds and this his Sistine Chapel train robbery to think for the emotion and the feeling that his son Nick laid into that track, that is amazing. So the legitimacy, like the crime coming and emerging into music, and you're like, that feels so authentic, and you know he's like the AJ Now. It took me a long time to get back to theme songs, but I made a promise, I made a contract and I got you there.

What's your ridiculous takeaway that I should be involved in British crime because apparently they need some help with some of this, like, hey, don't go back to England if you've got no way with it. Everybody needs some help with my theory of Look, there's three points to a crime. You're missing the last, Yeah, commit the crime, get away crime. Everyone's like, yeah, I got away with it. I'm like no, It's it's a constant exactly, it's a continuing It's like love.

Every day you got to renew the love. Every day you got to get away again, exactly, exactly. Well, that's beautiful. That's a beautiful committing getting away when the crime is like love a lot like a successful marriage. Exactly, that's a beautiful takeaway. And that is it for today. If you find us, uh, it'll be online at Ridiculous Crime

on both Twitter and Instagram, So remember everybody, Zaron. Twitter is for the smarter discourse and Instagram is where we put the photos for each episode show you what we're talking about, and then the stories are for chuckles um and sneak peaks um. If you want to email us, try Ridiculous Crime at gmail dot com. Tune in next time. Ridiculous Crime is hosted by Elizabeth Dutton and Zaren Burnett produced and edited by High Value packet distributor Dave Kuston.

Researches by Train Come Blur Marisa Brown. The theme song is by Giant Truck specialist Thomas Lee and Can Takers postal sorter Travis Dutton. Executive producers are Reluctant Expatriots Ben Bolan and Mell Brown d Quiet Say It One More Time, We Dequeous Crew. Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeart Radio. For more podcasts to my heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.