Didn't See That Coming: LifeLock Unlocked

going to go do this. They are encouraged and I quote, to choose the phone that best fits to his or her hand or looks the nicest. This is according to the official website for the sport. Okay, and then they are told that there are quote clearly two parties in this. Some believe that the heavier phones fly further than lighter ones, and others think just the opposite. M Now, I don't have opinions about heavier or lighter. I just want to chuck a phone and be able to compete. Yeah, yeah,

that's for me. I mean, how many times do you drive when you're out of your car? Like I could totally fling this thing. It's just me, Okay, I don't know. There's a part of me that thinks I would want that no Kia brick. Yeah, and like I think I could hurl that pretty far. Shop at that some of those big smartphones like the big Apple or like the other ones that are just like kind of like small iPad,

you could throw it like a frisbee. I think you're gonna get too much surface area and it's gonna flail out. I think you want like either one of those like razors, or like one of those bricks, right you got masked holding together, or else like something real slight. Yeah. Anyway, the idea is you want to throw it to if you're going to really compete. Three hundred and twenty feet is the record so far. Wow, that's serious. That's ninety seven meters or almost ninety eight meters. Yeah, so I

almost a football field, Am I correct in that? Yeah? So if you hear noise next time you come to headquarters, it's just me out back practicing. So I'll have like a bucket of phones and just be hitting a fence. That's what that is. In case you hear that, it's me and the boys bopping. That is ridiculous. Okay, I thought, So, do you know what else is ridiculous? No baiting people into stealing your identity and then being surprised when they do. Wait, okay,

this is ridiculous crime. A podcast about absurd and outrageous capers heist cause it's always nine murder free and one ridiculous zen Elizabeth, I know you've posed as someone else before, but if you have, you ever had you someone steal your identity? Not that I'm aware of. Okay, Um, I had a sort of identity theft, but not really okay. So years ago I started getting emails from Instagram with links to reset my password, but I hadn't attempted to do such a thing. So this went on for a

couple of months and it stopped. Um, I feel like Instagram used to, or maybe still does, tell you where the attempted log in was from. Sounds familiar, right, So somehow I found out that the attempts were coming from Colorado, so that was weird. Every now and then I'd get email newsletters from politicians or car dealerships in Colorado, so I would just unsubscribe. Move on. I like to keep a clean inbox. In box zero huh, Yeah, fast forward

to about two years ago. I started getting tons of emails about applications to various colleges in the Mountain region, and then a few that were a little farther afield. These were automated replies to request for information from someone using my email address, they had to actively go sign up. I was getting like fifty a week. It's a lot,

and it was annoying. So some of the emails were directed at parents of prospective students, which made me think that maybe someone's mom had like forgotten her email address, forgotten their child's email, yeah, and that it was like theirs was deceptively close to mine or something. So whatever, the email stopped and I figured that she had got into college, and you know, congratulations to them and their impending student debt. I also I got an email from

an urgent care clinic in Denver confirming a COVID test. Nice, so I hope they didn't get the vidis, but like, we'll see. So then something super weird happened. A couple of months ago, I got an email congratulating me on listing my house for sale in Denver from a storage company. Okay, and it included the address of the supposed house. Oh wow.

So I looked up the listing and I emailed the listing agent special Detective Yes, and I told him my story, and I asked him to contact the client for me, because I thought, once and for all, I have to tell this woman, your email address is not my challenge. You finally got a chance to connect, right, And so I get an email from the other Elizabeth Dutton like an hour later, and it was wild from the set of the TV show. Sorry, oh, that's a whole other story.

She doesn't go by Elizabeth, she never has. Oh not the show. My god, we're here with Beth Dutton. Still, I'm sorry. No, No, what's it called a Yellowstone? Yeah? No, she goes by her middle name and always has so she doesn't have anything. And it's not Clyde. No, she doesn't have anything in Elizabeth Dutton, right, And our emails are nowhere close to each other. So her kids, like, they went to college around the time I was getting the emails, but they went back east. They didn't stay

in the region. And one of her kids also drives the same make of car that I was getting oil change reminders from in Colorado, but they didn't buy it. At the dealership and they never took it to that dealership for service. Wait, what, it's weird. She and I are still stumped about it to this day. So there's a third Elizabeth Dutton out there, we guess in Colorado, both of you. But why would it go to her her address? Her home address was listed on the email

to me. Well, have an idea for that. Yeah, that could have been automated where he went with the Elizabeth Dutton address, like it could have been the system it self kicked in the address like an autocomplete. So I can see how they could go to the wrong address. But she'd have to be in the same system, so you'd have to have so that system would be your two Duttons. I guess maybe it's weird. I don't know,

that's super weird. And the fact that they have the same cars and we're sure she wasn't lying to you, well maybe, I mean, there's no reason for her. I asked her if people asked her if she's related to the Duttons on Yellowstone. Oh, you got to have that moment. The dutt No, because she doesn't go by Elizabeth and I, you know, so they don't do the last name, it actually has to be Elizabeth. They're like, I don't hear

it otherwise. Yeah, I suppose, but like I think have I said on here before about how people asked me about it all the time and they think it's like real family that are you related to the Duttons? Like, yeah, like it's a real we were not ranchers. When I asked you if you're related to Rock Dutton, the actor you know from Charles Dutton, Yeah, from The Rock And I was like, are you related to Rock Dutton? And you would invite that Rock was the show and Charles

Dutton was the actor. It's I don't I get it, you know, it's difficult. Well that's when I was also going by Rock Yeah, that was really the Rock Dotton at AOL dot com. Yeah. I was like, this is just all kinds of confusing, and with a que I was like, okay, Rock, Well, um, so anyway, she and I are stumped. Someone else is like stealing our identities but not really, but there was no borrowing them lightly right?

Was it like traditional identity theft? You know? There was a prolific identity thief named Philip Cummings in two thousand and four. He pleaded guilty to what was pretty much the largest identity theft case in the history of the United States. UM he worked for Telidata Communications in New York running credit checks and can we stop for one second and talk about how bogus credit scores and credit reports are. Oh yeah, I mean that's like something they invented.

And everyone was like, yeah, well, pretend this is a real deal. The FICO score only goes back to like nineteen eighty nine. Yeah, it sustains total economic inequality, and it's a poor indicator of for something. It's inaccurate totally. Plus, people use game you can play. I mean, it's it's not real. It's not like a People use it for things unrelated to credit, like job applications, and you get punished for not having enough credit cards or not having

credit cards. I didn't have I didn't use credit cards for a decade. I didn't have any credit and so I didn't have a credit score. So I would go in places they didn't have enough information to tabulate a credit score for me, so I couldn't do anything because they're like it was like I was a five year old. I had just no credit. Well, and if you if too many people run a report, it affects the number. Oh really yeah, I say this as someone with near

a near perfect credit score. I think it's garbage anyway. So this dude he used his access to steal the passwords of more than thirty thousand customers, and then he sold those to criminals, and the criminals in turn led everyone drive. I like picturing him in like a park trying to like sell them one at a time, little scraps of last post it all told though, they got about fifty to one hundred million dollars out of these thirty thousand people. Wow, yeah, he soaked them. Then there

was Abraham Abdulla. He found sensitive information like addresses, data burr, social security numbers, phone numbers for people like Oprah, Steven Spielberg, Warren Buffett, and then he would submit change of address forms and have their mail sent to him. And then that gave him access to stuff like credit cards and base statements, right, and postcards. And it's like, oh, that's

what Gail said. I think that's why the post office takes a little small credit card charge now, Like if you do a change of address, Yeah, I moved recently, and like I had to do that and you have to give him a credit. I think they charge it and it charges back whatever I took pay attention. But so that that's fill it out online. Yeah. Another good one is what happened to this guy Cody Nipe in

twenty twenty one. He had just closed down his hookah bar, tea room and board game business and didn't work no, and he hated. He needed to a ride to be able to deliver for door Dash and Grubhub. Okay, you know where this was, oddly enough, Colorado interesting center of all identity coming full circle. So he saw a car that he liked on Facebook marketplace as one does, that's where you shot for cars, and he contacted the seller. They met up, Cody took the car for a spin,

and then they agreed on a price thirty five. Cody paid cash, The seller hands over the title and the key seller takes off in an uber. Cody drives his sweet little new to him Yaris home me. A week later, Cody goes to the DMV to register the car and he's told it's stolen. Cody, your car stolen. He's like, no, it's in the parking lot. The DMB told them to

take the car. He told him to take the car to the sheriff's office because maybe it was reported stolen a long time ago and then recovered and they forgot to take the flag off the record. Cody goes to the sheriff's office. No luck, the car is actually stolen. Come to find out, the original owners had gone on vacation and they pulled the brain genius move of leaving the title and extra key in the glove box. I don't know any just reported like, well, you know that's

what they did. Know why that's the business heronic move? Why not just tape it to the window. I mean it, I this makes me wonder if the owners were in on it. That's just pure speculation, but it really was. Huh so like a four thousand dollars car. I'm not thinking much as going into this one. Well, either way, Cody had to surrender the car and he's out thirty five. Yeah. Well, you know, so what I'm saying is this, be careful, Saron.

I will be careful. Um. I keep an eye on my credit score and all that, but I don't subscribe to like a service to protect my identity. Sure do you? I didn't even know there was such a thing. Well, I know there are such LifeLock, right, Yes, I'm aware of it. That brings us to the subject of today's episode, LifeLock. Are you familiar with LifeLock? I think I've heard the ads or heard you say it, just like around the office,

just going around LifeLock. It's like a flack but less grading. Yeah, LifeLock. They saw software that scans for identity, theft, credit score activity, and the use of personal information. The company was started in two thousand and five by Todd Davis and Robert Maynard. You're writing this down. Yes. It was bought by Smantech in twenty seventeen for two point three billion dollars. Wow,

but a lot happened before twenty seventeen. Okay, it's now Norton LifeLock because it got bought again or spun off, I don't know whatever. Anyway, So at the start, Davis was the CEO and Maynard was the cook the coup. I don't know if you remember the ads from back in the day, but Davis and Maynard, as well as their company spokesman, they they gave out their social Security numbers because they were so sure that product work. What do you mean gave out like on their business cards,

like number. Oh yeah, no, like they had it in the ads. It creates all this. But they had their social security number just on the strings. Put his social security number on a flatbed truck that drove around. Then they put it in TV and print ads, his social security number. The ad said that LifeLock made the data quote useless to criminals. He put his social security number on the website right there on Beyonce's Internet for all the same So and we're talking about him. So I'm

guessing this did not work out, and it was. It was great, it worked the end um. They had lots of celebrity spokesman Rush Limbaugh, Paul Harvey, Howard Stern, really going for a certain audience, Montell Williams. Yep, it's a murderers row of trustworthy guys. Yeah. Really can they not get alxtre back in there? But here's the thing. The celebrities didn't offer up their social Security number. No, no, So the company charged one hundred dollars a year, or

they'd give you a deal ten dollars a month. Okay, so you get a deal if you do pay in full for a year. That was back in two thousand and seven to help the customers monitor their accounts with the three credit reporting bureaus. It also offered a million dollar insurance policy to cover losses if a customer was victim of identity theft. So by early two thousand and seven, LifeLock said it had only paid out losses three times

in amounts far less than a million dollars. Right by May of two thousand and seven, LifeLock claimed to have one hundred and fifty thousand customers and they'd recently received six million dollars in seed investments. But a year later they said it they had a million customers. So this

thing's just booming. Yeah, you know, with like the Internet's getting more and more accessible to people, and everyone's talking about identity theft, and it becomes this hot button issue exactly, And it became an issue where people were worried about it. They're talking about it, so everyone's like, what can I do? I need to want something simple? Yeah, it's simple. They're going to do it ten bucks a month and they

can protect me. June two thousand and seven, Wired reported that Davis was the victim of identity theft, so not to victim blame. But that's what you get smearing your social security number all over the place. Now, a thief used his social security number to get a five hundred dollars loan from a check cashing company in Fort Worth, Texas hundred bucks. The thief also had Davis's wife's cell phone number, and Davis only found out about this when the company called his wife to try and recover the

unpaid debt. He was not alerted by LifeLock. So a LifeLock spokesperson said that because the check cashing company didn't run a credit report on the social security number, the fraud alert was not revealed. So there's no way that LifeLock could have performed. Yeah, but no criminal charges were filed though. I right, Well, when we get back from this break, i'll tell you all right, all right, we're back. Hey,

you look at us? Hey. So, Todd Davis, the CEO of LifeLock, put his social security number all over ads for the company. It's everywhere. So he put on a pair of red boxers and went hanging out in a bullpen. He's like, how many bulls do we have here? Exactly? Okay? Now, LifeLock was supposed to be so badass though that no one would be able to steal his identity and I don't know take out a loan for five hundred bucks,

but they did. The person who did it was caught, but no criminal charges were ever filed because that would have gotten press. Well why you're saying before the Fort Worth police could finish their investigation. Well, let me show you, Zareny, close your eye, I want you to picture it. It's late summer two thousand and seven. You're a freelance cameraman in Fort Worth, Texas. You get work here and there

doing weddings and corporate shoots. You get a call from Todd Davis, CEO of LifeLock, the company that you keep seeing ads for. He wants to hire you for a project, and you're pretty excited. This could be your big break into commercial work. Davis is a little amped up, telling you that this is a very important project and he needs someone tough and willing to go the extra mile. That's me. Someone with a good camera and some moxie. That's you, Zaron. You tell Davis that you're his man

for this project, and you ask when and where? When and where? He tells you that he'll send a van to pick you up tomorrow morning. Next morning, you hear a car horn two it outside. You head out to the waiting van, and the man in the front seat identifies himself as Todd Davis. He tells you to hop in. You slide open the side door and climb inside. There's another man in the back who introduces himself as mister Davis's private investigator. The driver of the van pulls away

from the curb and heads across town. You try and make small talk, but no one's biting. Davis just shuffles through papers and a Manilla folder on his lap. You drive through the city streets and into sleepy suburban neighborhoods. The van pulls up in front of a modest house. Okay, Davis says, as he turns in his seat and too looking in the eyes. When we get inside, I'll give you the signal and you start rolling. What's the signal,

you ask, I'll point to you. Got it. You figure that this must be some sort of customer testimonial video. You're pleased that the day is clear, so maybe you can get nice outdoor shots later on, we'll see played by air. I'm looking around from there's no big check. So I think it's right. So you, Davis, and the PI and the driver. You all make your way up to the front door. Davis pounds on the door. Door creaks open. There stands a man looking back at you

with wide eyes. Davis pushes his way in and you all follow. This doesn't seem like a customer testimonials erin with the resident now sitting at his own kitchen table. Davis turns and gives you the signal. You start rolling. Todd Davis starts yelling a lot. He's yelling at the guy about some five hundred dollars loan he took out. He's hollering at the man asking how he got some cell phone number. The private eye is yelling tell him the guy just to confess. You're starting to get uncomfortable.

The yelling continues, with Davis absolutely browbeating the guy about what you have deduced his identity theft man. You think to yourself, this LifeLock is serious about protecting their cos he's personally going after the scammer. This is wild. The more details you hear, though, the more you realize that the one who got scammed was Todd Davis. Davis pulls some papers from inside that folder and slams him onto the table. He tells the guy to sign the papers,

it's a confession. If he doesn't, Davis tells him the cops are going to come and arrest him. The man scans the papers and tries desperately to understand the situation. You now, as you should feel like crap on the bottom of a shoe that you're involved in this whole thing. Davis continues to brate the guy as he starts to sign the confession. You get him, you get him signing the paper on film, and then you shut it down. That's it. Davis grabs the tape from your camera, triumphant.

He takes the signed confession and he heads to the van. As the van cruises down the road, you realize that you aren't heading towards your house. You pull into the parking lot of a police station and Davis struts inside. You slide open the van door, and you walk over to a pay phone and call a cap. You want nothing to do with any of this, so why didn't they file charges? The private eye was the one who

found the suspect fort Worth PD. They were waiting on records from AT and T that would confirm the IP address that they had was linked to the suspect. Sergeant J. D. Moore of the Major Case Unit told Davis to sit tight. They get this guy. Davis is impatient. He went to the house and he taped that confession only. The suspect then told the police that he was totally coerced, and the tape backed him up. Good job's Aaron. Yeah, I was worried and we are filming something we should not

filming a cry exactly. So the charges are dropped because Davis got his filthy mitzen. He defended the quality of their service through it all, He said, quote, it was not a failure on the part of LifeLock or the fraud Alert system, because neither were ever given the chance to succeed. The real problem is that there are companies operating which are allowed to issue these loans without validating

an identity. That is a problem, he continued. The LifeLock system did what it has always claimed it would in support of any member and completely fixed the problems. I was not out any money and my credit score was not negatively impacted. To go one step further, as proof that our system works, there have been at least eighty seven other attempts to use my information since I began providing my social Security number two years ago, but none

have been successful. None, right, so Davids. He later goes on MSNBC and he claims that the five hundred dollar phony loan was the only time that a thief had ever been successful in stealing his identity. Survey says not true. In October of two thousand and seven, someone in Georgia opened an AT and T account in his name and ran up two thousand, three hundred and ninety dollars in charges. I love all these petty crimes that they're doing. Like the guys like doing this big broad yeah, come and

get me. People were like, okay, will totally. No one's going big on any of this. I mean maybe they figure that'll get flagged if they go too big on. I don't know. I think you could get away of the madserati or two I guess, so really put your back into it, or just like at least a luxury shopping spy. Some watches exactly go on a test drive and go, hey, you might getting out. I think I ran over something. Can you check the tire? When he

gets out? Zoom awag. So this AT and T account, LifeLock, he only found out about it be when it went to collections. LifeLock didn't catch it. Now AT and T will run a social Security number one kind of stuff. There was also a Verizon account in New York that had a one hundred and eighty six dollars tab. Once again, they were like, I need a couple, I need a new phone and a cover. They're like, okay, LifeLock, CEO,

it's on. You think it's better. A Texas utility bill in his name for one hundred and twenty two dollars. People were banking gas bills with a Credit one bank debt for five hundred and seventy three dollars. Didn't even buy like a college school billk. But here's these are all separate. These are so multiple times people are successfully getting his identity and then they're going, I'm gonna go

get some roll of stamps. He owed three hundred and twelve dollars to Swiss Colony, which is a gift basket company. Swiss Colony, they are about three hundred and twelve dollars a gift basket. Hey, how much Dido pepperage farms? There were credit accounts opened at USA Savings Bank and at Gap Moving, but they had no balance even they didn't even get either. They didn't get to atter. The people were like, I'll just pay this one off MYSELFE me a card. But now I can get the card. Great

building my credit guys. Oh no, it's not my social scurity number. Um. In all, there were thirteen episodes of identity theft for old Todd David were people are using it to get jobs where they are doing like other stuff like that. You're like, oh, yeah, here's you go, here's my social Security number. Well, you know, you think about it like a lot of undocumented Yeah, to provide it. So Todd's she's just generating money all over the place.

Maybe that was his whole scam the whole time. It's like I'll put it out there, people will use it. I will reach the tax benefits. So it was for like three or two thousand and seven to twenty ten, thirteen times they actually, you know, were successful thirteen times. Okay, thirteen, it's distinct different times, Okay. Exactly twenty and ten was

the year that the FTC came calling. So all those ads claiming that LifeLock was so effective against identity theft that the CEO could go as far as putting his social Security number out into the public. Those ads that said the company could protect against such things as quote ever happening to you, guaranteed, and that they worked to stop identity theft before it happens, Well that's false. It's been proven out, it's false thirteen times, and putting that

in an ad is against the law. Fraudulent. Yes, so the La Times wrote, quote alluding to Davis's traveling social security truck. Then FDC chair John Leeviovitz declared that quote, while LifeLock promised consumers complete protection against all types of identity theft, in truth, the protection it actually provided left enough holes that you could drive a truck through it.

A truck and truck. It's a good metaphor. So the FDC said that at least until September of two thousand and seven, LifeLock had failed to provide quote reasonable and appropriate security to prevent unauthorized access to personal information used in its corporate network. So why Wilfred Brimley wouldn't be involved with this? Would not I wouldn't let people be involved with such a flyby to talk diabetes. Yeah, I'm a trustworthy pitchman. I'm one of these guys like David

Strathorn over there. Well, who's the one who does the reverse mortgage? Which one does? It? Doesn't he do? I don't know. Jim Garner, James Garner did reverse mortgages. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it was a dream. Yes, of weird dreams. So LifeLock was fined twelve million dollars. Eleven million of that was to refund customers who'd use the service and then provide consumer education. Apparently, the actual settlement was for thirty five million dollars, but the FTC agreed to change

that amount based on Lifelock's liquid assets. Oh so they didn't have much, but think about that. Okay, So remember they were bought by Symantec in twenty seventeen for two point three billion, but they couldn't even do a fine, you know, up to thirty five millions. I'm going to say that that is what the kids call sus. It's heavily sus. Yes, that is definitely like I am skeptical. I am the skeptical. So the company was ordered to be more truthful in its marketing and have better data security.

Davis was ordered to pay ten thousand dollars. Personally, you know what they should have done. They should have made them higher McAfee publicly, so it'd be like a whole embarrassment if you really want to have McAfee saying that he's keeping you safe. Well. The FTC also had a separate settlement with Maynard, the other guy that the coupe.

He'd stepped down from his position all the way back in two thousand and seven, and he wasn't required to pay, but there were limitations on that what he could do in terms of work in data security and identity theft okay. So in twenty fifteen, the FTC claimed that LifeLock violated the terms of the settlement, specifically the requirement that it better protect its consumers personal data. In October of twenty fifteen,

primary job the one thing you had one job. In October of twenty fifteen, LifeLock and the FTC settled for one hundred million sixty eight million, of which quote may be used to redress fees paid to LifeLock by class action consumers who were allegedly injured by the same behavior alleged by the FTC. SO and then here's what the La Times wrote in twenty fifteen. The value of many LifeLock services and safeguards start to evaporate when you give

them some thought or read the fine print. Oh yeah, yeah, like we don't do the very thing we say we do. I'd be like if firefighters didn't show up at your house. You're like, well, you know, the insurance had all these exceptions of what could actually be covered us, like Florida insurance companies. This is also from the La Times quote.

The guarantee chiefly covers the expenses of professionals such as lawyers, accountants, and investigators the company might hire to help you with your identity theft case, LifeLock will replace a handbag, purse, or wallet's stolen as a result of identity theft, But how often does ID theft lead to the loss of

a physical handbag. The guarantee might cover funds stolen from a bank account via identity fraud, but in many cases the bank would do so itself unless you can't document that the loss is due to ID theft, in which case LifeLock might not cover it either. Yeah, so they're basically saying we're kind of riding the banks cotail you can pay us to Exactly. We're not done here though. I mentioned Robert Maynard and that ft S coup right, Yeah,

he has a whole other story. Oh really, when we get back from this break, I'm going to tell you about the mysterious mister Maynard. Hey, Aaron Elizabeth, welcome to my crime dojo. It's nice. It's kind of steamy in here. I like what you've done with the carpeting. Thank you. That's shag Hey. By the way, every time you say coup, I keep thinking of Boots Riley and the band the Coup. So I'm like, that is not at allways think a movie coming out. It's really good. Anyway, Crime Dojo, here

we are. So I told you that Robert Maynard started LifeLock with Todd Davis and acted as the Coup before that. In the early nineties, Maynard founded a company called the National Credit Foundation Incorporated. These names are always like intended for you not to be able to parse them out there, sounds like a million other things. Exactly. It's like, yeah,

you know, I'm over here with the others. So it was a credit repair business, as they say, so only a few months in it was investigated by state and federal authorities who were cracking down on so called credit repair companies. For one, it was not actually a foundation, which implies nonprofit status, and it could also not actually fulfill its claim of helping quote anyone legally obtain good credit can't do it so, and it had not followed

state law filing various like necessary notifications and such. In nineteen ninety six, the FTC charged National Credit Foundation, Incorporated with misleading customers when it claimed it could erase bad credit caused by bank or filings. It also accused Maynard and other executives of making unauthorized withdrawals from various customer checking and debit accounts, wait from the customers accounts, not from the actual company's accounts. And they're not like, oh,

dipping in the company. Most of the withdrawals were around like three hundred dollars each. So they're doing the same thing ATM money right there. Yes, that's like the cap on a lot of ATM accounts. They're doing the same thing as as the bad criminals. But the five hundred dollars to pay the gas bill, they're like, oh, I'll use this to pay some parking tickets. So Maynards settled without admitting any wrongdoing and without being required to pay

redress because he wears a tie. I guess the deal here. As part of the settlement, he agreed to be barred from quote advertising, promoting, offering for sale, selling, performing, or distributing any product or service relating to credit improvement services. Now, wait a minute, this breaks my steel, big steel, little argument about America. This is more like steel. Little bit, wear a tie, wear a suit or some shoes that

needed has that he's hard from that, right? But then how could he work at LifeLock because it offered credit protection not credit improvements? He was very careful with the language there. So Maynard, he had a company called dot safe for a while and Phoenix that folded in two thousand and one. I have no idea what why not in two thousand and three Safe Repair. In two thousand and three, he spent twelve days in jail for defrauding on a sixteen thousand dollars loan from the Mirage Casino

in Las Vegas. He later used this story to say that that's what inspired him to start LifeLock, because he claimed that actually his identity had been stolen and that someone had illegally taken out the loan in his name, and he said, you know what, I was not even in Vegas when the loan was made. And one of the men who stole his identity and the money is now in jail for an unrelated murder. Right, this one up with. He's totally amping. However, the Phoenix New Times

field that that was not accurate. The Mirage had a copy of Maynard's Arizona driver's license on file attached to the casino marker. They had a picture of him signing. They had if you think that getting a credit card is hard, like those casinos don't let a penny slip through their fingers like they are. Yeah, they're they love documentation. If you're going to do money exchanges, they're like, Okay, here's the time, here's the date, here's what you were wearing. Right, So,

m Maynard. The reason why he avoided criminal charges it was because in Nevada has a program that gives people a second chance to pay their debts. So when he got busted on he's like, all right, final pay it. According to the Clark County DA's office, where Las Vegas is located, Maynard had never filed a police report for identity theft, which would have been standard practice if that had actually happened. He goes on to found LifeLock in two thousand and five. Do you know what else happened

in two thousand and five, I do not. American Express sued Maynard's father, Robert Maynard Senior, a Phoenix area I doctor, for one hundred and fifty four thousand in unpaid bills. Whoa yeah, was he running his practice with his car? Well? Maynard Senior denied the claims city never ordered the car. Oh,

of course, it was rumored. It was rumored that Maynard Junior may have stolen his own father's identity to get a card, and that's what inspired me to protect others from identity like, well, wait a second, doesn't he didn't give a cops subscription to LifeLock to his dad. So when AMEX looked into the issue, it found that someone with Maynard Senior's details had ordered the card, but that the bills went to a company called net Shield, and net Shield's address was in Phoenix, and it happened to

be the same address as Maynard Junior's then company thought Safe. No, I am shocked yeah. Maynard Senior eventually settled with AMEX. When asked by The New Times in two thousand and seven if his son had stolen his identity, doctor Maynard said, quote, can't disagree with that. Wow. Yeah, and at that time Desert Breeziness. Well at that time father and son hadn't spoken for two years. I was guessing this, yeah, just

on the tone, I know. However, in two thousand and nine, when asked about it again, Maynard Senior said that actually he and his son had opened the card together, so you got to protect your kids or the sun was now making good money. And he was like, look, I've changed my story. I think, well you'll see. I think that his father softened up. Okay. Two thousand and five was a big year, right. It was also the year

that Maynard Junior declared bankruptcy. Among the debts was one hundred and seventy thousand dollars owed to AMEX on his own card, but Maynard Senior was listed as a codebter. He also listed ten thousand dollars owed to a former girlfriend, twenty four thousand dollars to his children's private school, and various debts to other friends business partners, credit card companies, the Phoenix Library. He said that he only had twenty bucks in cash and fifteen dollars in the bank at

the time it was bankruptcy. So remember two thousand and five was the year that LifeLock started offering its services to the public. Was a big year. There's a lot going on. Maynard left the company in two thousand and seven. Remember why did he leave his dad? Well, no, he resigned following a Phoenix New Phoenix New Times just doing a bang up job here. They wrote an article that

uncovered previous business and financial improprieties. He remained a ten percent shareholder and a private marketing consultant to the company, and then he cashed out his shares and he made millions on it. After leaving LifeLock, Maynard moved to Hawaii in two thousand and eight. He started a company called can Do Island Ka n d Oo. It's an ocean adventure business Saron and they offered sailing, jet skiing, scuba diving, parasailing, other water sports for tourists. So he's a cruise director

without a cruise Well. Company launched in August of two thousand and nine and for two weeks took customers out on a catamaran that it had outfitted UM but it couldn't make its insurance premium payments, and then it went under. Okay, and the employees last paychecks bounced. How much? How much did Maynard spend on this business? Uh? Fifteen dollars? Well, how much you have in his bank account? He spent

nine million dollars? What on this business? How? I don't know the money he had a standing army of catamarans? Was he buying just like advertise? Okay? What a lot of banana boat? The sun block going on? Um? In twenty thirteen, Maynard and his wife declared bankruptcy again. Of course, listen, he had it. He said his debt was between ten and fifty million dollars somewhere in there. I don't know. Well, I think it's on the bankruptcy schedule where you get

to you check off. So this included the boat companies and the lenders for Cande Island umard. Sounds pretty out there. And no one, no one, not even he pointed to any condition that could have caused this behavior. Until twenty nineteen, Maynard gave an interview, and he said that the unpaid casino debt had stemmed from a gambling spree. He went on after an unsuccessful quote electro convulsive therapy to treat his depression. Wait like electric shock? Yeah, I had ECT. Yeah,

he says. It gave him man expells and memory loss. Wow, he said. Quote. One of the primary side effects of ECT is something called retrograde amnesia, basically short term memory loss of events leading up to and during treatment. I went to Las Vegas and took out a marker from the mirage, and I did not pay it back because I was in treatment at the time. I have no memory of this episode. When I was arrested, I thought my identity had been stolen, which had happened to me before.

I'm now convinced that I did it. I paid the marker and all charges were dropped. I don't know about it doesn't matter. But someone in my life who they had electro shock therapy and they don't remember I know exactly the years I was in their life at the time. They don't remember much of that time except for some memories that I'm in and they tell me to help them with their memory, and it doesn't work. Like he's describing, and not at all. It's not like, oh, I have

this ambient memory. It's like I can't remember what I did yesterday when I got all that money. It's not like that. Well, like, I won't speculate on anyone's mental state, particularly because I believe we're all hanging on by a thread and one click away from losing it. Maybe that's just me. I've dealt I've dealt with depression and anxiety, and you know that what's really exhausting about it keeping other people from knowing. That's like the most exhausting part.

So I buy that he was having manic episodes. Yeah, I'm not questioning them, But where he's extending it is where I question It's. Yeah. Well. In August twenty twenty Maynards self published a book called One Step Dude, My Continuing Journey from unf Wow, which, among other things, discusses his struggles with mental illness. Okay, so here's the synopsis for the book. It may not look like it at first glance, but I am one up dude. I've started

multiple businesses. Two have made billions. That's in all caps. I have made two multimillion dollar fortunes. I am a marine. I made it through college in two years, top of my class. I'm bipolar. Although it's difficult, it's also my secret weapon because I think differently than most people. I'm a best selling author and popular speaker. My kids and grandkids are healthy. I'm loved by a woman whose grace borders on holiness. I have everything. Sounds great, right, There's more.

I lie as easily as I breathe. Those fortunes I made blew them both. I ended up on food stamps and Medicaid between them. I've gone bankrupt three times. I've gone through three marriages. I self destruct on a regular basis. People love me. The more they love me, the more I hurt them. I am a victim and a survivor of the worst kinds of abuse, and now I am an abuser. I have many quote unquote friends, not one of them truly knows me. I have nothing when I

started this book in January of twenty twenty. This is where I was. My most recent business is being sold for parts, and my reputation is ruined. I'm about to be crucified for my failure in the local tabloid. I drive a one hundred thousand dollars car. I live in a five thousand dollars per month apartment. I have three dollars and forty seven cents in my checking account. I've just spent weeks in psychiatric hospitals because I was suicidal.

I can bench press thirty pounds after five minutes of aerobics. I'm totally gassed. I just learned that I have cluster B personality disorder. Never heard of it. Mean either it's bad, but it was the key, see what I mean, totally picked up. I decided that at fifty seven, it was time to start getting want to know more. Read the book. This is to sell a book is to sell. All

of that was an advertisement. It makes me want to spend my money on something that was one of the most amazingly honest tell me a book was self published without telling me a book was self Wow. I mean like it vascillated between like the steward smally I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and dog on it people like me, And then if you saw the other side of the mirror, whe it's like and also you have at three dollars

and you're like, WHOA. I have a number of people in my life, close friends and family who are bipolar. Oh same. And I have to say this reads very much like some something that they would write on a manic um. So I wish him the best, huish him the best. Um. I you know, his illness may have driven his actions, but that doesn't make them any less ridiculous, and that, you know, so um And I feel like he would agree. I think so he kind of he says,

he just basically said, Elizabeth, ridiculous. So Zarin, what's your ridiculous takeaway? Wow, that LifeLock is exactly what I thought it was. And like, I don't like to be right about these things, but I'm like that that's not something I need in my life. And I was like, no, that's not something anyone needs in their life. No, you've

got your life onlock. What's your ridiculous takeaway? And again I think that stuff like LifeLock, it preys on our fear of I mean, people who have their identities stolen. It's such a nightmare to get all of that unraveled and to prove up that no, those credit cards but yours and all the kind of stuff. And because we were saying, like, your credit score is so tied to so many things that if it gets damaged, then it

ruins all sorts of other things in your life. I think though, you know, the other thing are like um malware protection, Like you know, I won't name names on any of those companies, but the ones you know to get keep your computer safe, Yeah, those are a total racket. Like I had one for a while that when it expires, it like locks out all your computer and it fights with other programs. Yeah. So's it's a waste of time

and astortion. Like if a mafia member did that, that would be called they came in and said they got a nice business year to be ashamednything happened to cancel. That kind of stuff is insane. So you know, we we all have talked many times on this show about fear and how that drives people's motivations and you can make anyone do anything basic trade. Yeah, so you know, we can sign up for all of these supposed consumer protection things out of fear. You don't want your computer hacked,

you don't want you know, your identity stolen. But it's a racket in and of itself, and who's protecting you from lifelong exactly because they're out there dipping into people's bank accounts getting at three and I'm not saying this about current Norton LifeLock and casting aspersions and just you know, yes we all knows, don't sume me Norton lifelong. Well that was a very interesting because, like you know, I don't do anything in this world. I know nothing about

this world. So it's fascinating to know. I'm glad that I don't know anything about this. You're pretty close to off the grid, i'd say, trying. That's all I have. You can find us online at Ridiculous Crime on both Twitter for the talking Instagram for the cokin email us. If you want at ridiculous Crime at gmail dot com, download the iheartapp, weave us a talkback, sing me a little song, and then download the iHeart Hat. I Dare You, I Dare You? Download the iHeart Hat and where proudly

tune in next time. Ridiculous Crime is hosted by Elizabeth Dutton and Zaron Burnett, produced and edited by Dave Kuston, whose social Security number is six six six four two three five four nine. Research is by FTC Special Investigator Marissa Brown and Credit Approval Supervisor Andrea Song sharpen Tier. The theme song is by Thomas Sure that's my credit card, Lee and Travis, Oh yeah, that's my home address. Dutton. Executive producers are Swiss Colony salesman Ben Bolan and Noel Brown.

QUI say it one more time, We dequis quirre Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio. Four more podcasts to my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.