The Spoon

Today on Richard Ellis Talks. Every chance you get, look at your kids and tell them how great they are. Not just how pretty they look or how beautiful they are, but tell them how beautiful they are on the inside. Tell them what a great lady, what a great man, how polite they were. Encourage them in all these areas. And then when necessary, you discipline them. But I'm telling you, if there's balance in this thing, it's going to go a whole lot smoother than if you don't.

You're listening to Richard Ellis Talks with Richard Ellis. We're so grateful you've tuned into the program. Richard's talks are always straight from the Bible, filled with truth. We're also very excited to tell you about a project we've been working on for quite some time now.

Our mission has always been to reach the world for Jesus Christ. So this brand new concept to accomplish is bold and ambitious, and we're going to need your help. Richard will tell you more about it later on, but you can see it right now at our website. richardellis.com. But for right now, let's go ahead and get right into today's talk. Here's Richard Ellis. The title of today's message is The Spoon. Now, believe it or not,

This little piece of equipment, kitchen tool, that's used for many other things has an interesting history. There's a lot of controversy about whether you do or you do not use a spoon. And we've gone through it in this country, you know, about discipline and schools and parents. And if you're out in public nowadays, you're almost afraid to discipline your child, whether it's a switch.

I think I can remember being sent out in the backyard to pick my own switch. That's a pretty psychologically challenging thing in itself right there. I mean, how do you go pick out a limb that's going to contact your limbs and that, you know, your brain, that's not good for a child.

I suggest going with a spoon, but is there a place even biblically? And before you lose me here and think this is just about kids, we're going to start out with kids, and then I'm going to talk to you about adults. Because believe it or not, God's got his own spoons. If you use a spoon for disciplinary purposes in your home, this is not to threaten some child with. These are meant to be used if you use a spoon or whatever you use discipline. And it's not a nice thing usually.

discipline in most of the kids here. How many of you kids have ever been spanked? Anybody ever been spanked? But you know what? When you spank a kid, there's an interesting thing about it. It usually doesn't feel good, right? Now, as we get into this today, I want you to be aware of this. It's not supposed to. And whether it's for a child or an adult, one of the most amazing things that a gentleman by the name of Claude Townsend taught me years ago...

was that there's a difference in punishment and discipline. The intent of punishment is just to inflict pain. The intent of discipline is to teach you something. And we're going to look at a few passages today. God never comes along dealing with His own children, we His children, and says, you know what, I'm just mad at you, I'm going to punish you. And early on in my life, for some reason, I had this picture of God with this huge spoon.

And I was never going to hear from him basically unless I got out of line. But if I got out of line, wham! I was going to get smacked and he got some kind of delight out of inflicting pain on me and then it was over and just hope I don't screw up again. But he's not that way, and there's stuff in the Scripture to back that up even. Now let's start, if you will, over in Deuteronomy chapter 5.

All right, kids, and this also goes to big kids as well. Deuteronomy 5, verse 16, the fifth commandment, honor your father and your mother as the Lord your God has commanded you that your days may be long, and that doesn't mean you wake up early and go to bed late. When it says your days may be long, they feel that way all the time.

It means that you'll live a long time, according to the Scriptures, and that it may be well with you in the land which the Lord your God is giving you. And obviously this is written particularly to the people of Israel, but there are some principles that apply here. And this thing of honoring, I don't want to go too deep.

and go off on this tangent, but let me tell you something. Even if you're an adult and you don't even respect your mother and father for whatever reasons, there is a way to honor them. And I challenge you and I encourage you to find those ways, no matter how tough your childhood was or maybe even how abusive it might have been, to say, you know what, God, there is a way for me to honor them no matter what they've done to me. I can honor them and honor your word by doing that.

Now we're going to go through some passages in the Old Testament, some of the new pretty quickly. Job chapter 5, verses 17 and 18. Again, these are usually from left to right. But Job says in verse 17 of chapter 5,

He says, Behold, happy is the man whom God corrects. Therefore, do not despise the chasing of the Almighty, for he bruises, but he binds up. He wounds, but his hands make whole. Now this implies, doesn't imply, it states, And it says we ought to be happy if God corrects us and don't despise this chasing of the Almighty because even though he bruises, he binds up.

And even though he wounds, his hands make whole. It is painful. And I don't want to have anybody misunderstand this. When I get out of line, when you get out of line as a child, where it's your parents intervening or as an adult and it's God intervening. When God wants to teach us something and get our attention, He pulls a spoon out and He knows exactly what we need and what works on us, and He intends for it to hurt.

And the thing that was very confusing to me, I have some of you know, I have a six foot nine, 250 plus pound dad. And when you're a small child, it can just be terrifying. When he spanked, I didn't get spanked a lot because I didn't want to get spanked ever again. And he left such an impression.

on me and I had in some ways not a real healthy in some ways I was afraid there was a little tension with me and my dad because I knew if I crossed some lines there was consequence and when there's pain with those consequences you say you know what I don't want any more of that. So there was a point where I didn't get spanked anymore because all he had to do was breathe or something, and you just didn't want to mess with that. But there was consequence. It was painful.

And the same thing is true with God. And He knows what it takes. He knows what we need. And if we will get it up front, if when He disciplines us, we say, you know what? Yes, sir, I got it. It's amazing how that discipline doesn't come back again unless you're bullheaded and stubborn.

and it's back and forth, back and forth in the process. Look at Proverbs 3. Keep going to the right. Proverbs 3, verses 7 and following. Do not be wise in your own eyes. Fear the Lord and depart from evil. It will be health to your flesh and strength to your bones. Honor the Lord with your possessions and with the first fruits of all your increase so that your barns will be filled with plenty and your vats will overflow with new wine. And then look at this context. My son.

Do not despise the chastening of the Lord, nor detest His correction. In other words, don't get mad at God. For whom the Lord loves, He corrects. Just as a father, the son in whom He delights. Proof that God loves you, or proof in some ways, and biblically this is the case, if you want to know whether you love your children, let's say.

Now listen close. If you tell me and anybody else that you love your children, I'm going to ask you whether you discipline your children because if you don't, you don't love them. You're more concerned about not being uncomfortable, not doing the hard stuff, not hurting them in some way. And I'm going to tell you something. This planet has gone crazy with kids who are completely out of control because parents, in some cases, didn't love them enough to say no.

Well, I don't want to curb any of their appetites or their will or their imagination. You know what? It better get curbed or they're going to be out of control. And a three-year-old who threatens to punch you in the nose and get upset and you discipline is easier to manage than a 16-year-old.

And if you put some restraint and some respect and some fear of God and maybe you a little bit in the process early on, then when that child is big and way out of your control, they're not going to be out of control out there in the world with anybody anywhere. It's a travesty. It is a tragedy that parents do not discipline their kids. You say, but it's hard. You know what? It's going to get tougher if you don't do the tough stuff.

Verse 11 again. My son do not despise the chastening of the Lord, nor detest his correction. For whom the Lord loves, he corrects, just as a father the son in whom he delights. Proverbs 13, verse 24. He who spares his rod hates his son. Now it's not about if you love your kids, you discipline them, you chasten them. As a father does his son, that's the way God is. Now he's saying if you spare the rod, you are basically saying you hate your son. You hate your child.

And you're more worried about your comfort than doing the right thing. It is not easy, but you know what? Welcome to the planet. Being a parent is not easy. And doing the hard stuff is not easy. It's not about being buddies with your kids anyway. It's about raising them so that when they're big...

bigger, out of your sight, out of your control. Some things have been poured into them that they get. But he who loves him disciplines him. And look at this. In my translation, it says disciplines him promptly. Now I'm going to give you just some simple things that I advise. There's a difference in breaking a child's will and breaking a child's spirit. You are not...

supposed to. You're not trying to break a child's spirit. You're trying to break the child's will so that their will is submitted to your will. Why do I want my girls to obey? Because sooner or later, when I'm not the father and figure in their life, I'm their dad, I'm their father, but they know and say, God is my father, their father. And now the father in heaven is saying, this is what I want you to do. And they say, no.

Now, I'm not in trouble as much as they are. And if they learn to submit to God's will through submitting to my will, our will as parents, then it gets easier to transfer that and say, you know what, God, I know it worked out better when I obeyed my mom and dad.

I think it's going to work out better when I obey you. The consequences weren't fun then. I get it. They're not going to be fun now. Whatever you say, that's what I want. And you end up with obedient children. You end up with obedient Christians. Look at Proverbs 22.15. Foolishness. Proverbs 22.15. Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child. The rod of correction will drive it far from him. Proverbs 23.

And I'm reading you all of these because I don't want anybody mistaken that this is, well, it's just some obscure thing in the Bible. Proverbs 23, 12 and following. Apply your heart to instruction and your ears to words of knowledge. Do not withhold correction from a child. For if you beat him with a rod, he will not die. Now that sounds so harsh. What he's saying is, you know what? It ain't going to kill him. And the point there is, if you're doing it trying to kill him, you're out of bounds.

Spanking a child is not going to kill a child. They're going to whimper and wail and everybody in the mall is going to think you're trying to kill them. They're not going to die. They're going to live is the point. In a whole different way. Do not withhold correction from a child, for if you beat him with a rod, he will not die. You shall beat him with a rod and deliver his soul from hell. Now you say, well, that doesn't make sense. That's ridiculous. Let me tell you something.

If you don't get a hold of your kids and discipline them while you have the chance, and the world gets a hold of them with no discipline, no restraint, just whatever feels good, do it and go. It's out there every day, everywhere around us. Just look, open your eyes and see the results of just no discipline, no restraint.

Do these kids end up just by default being godly kids? The research will show you that most people who become Christians, if they don't do it by the time they're 18, it isn't happening. It still happens. It's not that God can't do it, but when kids are malleable, when they're young, when they get these things, it is a huge opportunity on the front side to get the job done. Proverbs 29. Proverbs 29, verse 15. The rod and rebuke give wisdom, but a child left to himself brings shame to his mother.

When the wicked are multiplied, transgression increases, but the righteous will see their fall. Correct your son, and he will give you rest. Yes, he will give delight to your soul. Now I'm telling you guys, and of course it doesn't apply to girls, it only talks about sons here. Because girls are perfect. It applies to both. He keeps saying, correct your son, correct your son. I'm just telling you, as a father of three girls, it works on both. Ephesians chapter 6.

Now this is to some of you kids listening today. I hope some of this is making sense. Ephesians 6 verse 1 and following says this, Children, obey your parents in the Lord for this is right. It's the right thing to do.

Honor your father and mother, which is the first commandment with promise. We read that out of Deuteronomy earlier. That it may be well with you, and you may live long on the earth. And you fathers, and look at verse 4. This is about parents. And you fathers, do not provoke your children to wrath.

but bring them up in the training and admonition of the Lord. And the word here, bring them up, means to nourish up to maturity, to nourish, to bring up. It's a process. Do not provoke your children to wrath.

And if you are not in control as a parent, you're going to be out of control in dealing with your kids, and kids can only handle so much and so much challenge, and at a point you will pick up on this, you're going to get them angry. You're going to get them so frustrated, they start to get angry, and that's not the problem. point it's to nurture them it's to teach them something not to provoke them and get them all bent out of shape more than they are

Colossians 3, and that's just a few pages to the right. Chapter 3, the same kind of deal. Children, verse 20. Children, obey your parents in all things, for this is well-pleasing to the Lord. Fathers, do not provoke your children lest they become discouraged.

And the word here for discouraged is a word that means to be disheartened, dispirited, or broken in spirit. Now you're not breaking their will, you're breaking their spirit. They just get so frustrated and so disheartened they want to give up. What are most kids trying to do? Please their parents.

Look at me, Daddy. Look what I can do. I did a good job. Just want some acknowledgement, some encouragement. And if all they're getting is discipline and all they're getting is hammered and never some encouragement, or I love you, or Daddy, look at me, you did a great job. You know why parents don't say that?

men in particular, because a lot of men never heard that from their own dads. Every chance you get, look at your kids and tell them how great they are. Not just how pretty they look or how beautiful they are, but tell them how beautiful they are on the inside. Because the outside can change.

It will change. Tell them what a great lady, what a great man, how polite they were. Encourage them in all these areas. And then when necessary, you discipline them. But I'm telling you, if there's balance in this thing, it's going to go a whole lot smoother than if you don't.

Hebrews 12. Let's look at a few verses in this and then we're done. Hebrews 12. And this is to children, but this is specifically to adults. Hebrews 12, verse 4. He says here, you have not yet resisted to bloodshed, striving against sin, and you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as to sons. And then he goes in this passage, my son.

Do not despise the chastening. And the word chastening means here the whole training and education of children which relates to the cultivation of mind and morals and employs for this purpose now commands and admonitions, now reproof and punishment. includes the training and care of the body. Whenever in adults also cultivates the soul, especially by correcting mistakes and curbing passions.

instruction which aims at increasing virtue, chastisement, chastening of the evils which God visits men for their amendment to correct them. So he says, my son, do not despise the chastening, that word of the Lord, nor be discouraged when you are

rebuked by him. And the word here for discouraged means to have one's strength relaxed or be enfeebled or through exhaustion to grow weak, grow weary, be tired out, to be despondent, to become faint-hearted. He says, don't get all faint-hearted and like, oh, I can't take it anymore.

Don't despise it and don't be discouraged when you're rebuked by him. It is a great thing that you realize I'm being disciplined. God's trying to teach me something. God, thank you for caring enough about me to come after me. And go, oh, well, he's just some wild kid letting go. No, he comes after us. And look at the next verse, verse 6.

And this phrase again, for whom the Lord loves, he chastens. The proof that God loves you. You say, well, I'm not sure I'm a Christian. If you're being chastened and disciplined, there's some proof. You're going through a tough time. God's trying to break you and teach you some things. Look around, say, what is the spoon in my life? And am I responding to his discipline and getting it? And if not, you know what? It's coming again. It just keeps coming.

And God says, okay, you got it? You're going to obey me? Maybe. Wham, here it comes again. You got it? And you say, well, I'm tired of getting spanked. Then obey. Well, I think I can take a little more. It's some kind of spiritual masochism. It's like, oh, this pain feels good. Do it again, God. Do it again. And he says, you know what? It's going to increase.

I remember with one and two-year-olds, you take a one or two-year-old that does something wrong and they're at a place where they know they've done something wrong, you can take their little hand and go on their hand. You've touched them. You've hit them and inflicted some pain. They think they're dying. You've done nothing to them. You know what? On a five-year-old, that didn't work. You've got to go back to the spoon. And it may be a little pop.

And all of a sudden that may work. And if that doesn't work, you know what? It's a couple of pops. Now you're chasing them around the house or something. You say, well, I'm tired of doing this. If you love them, you'll keep it up and stick with it until they get it or they're in trouble and you're in trouble because you're going to have a house that's out of control. And if God loves us and says that he loves us and doesn't discipline us, then his house is out of control.

out of control. And there is no discipline. There's just disobedience. There is no order. There's no control. Not that he's trying to control us, but he wants us to submit our will to his will, and this is the way that he does it. Whom the Lord loves, he chastens, and scourges every son whom he receives. And the word here for scourge is whip.

scourge metaphorically, a scourge, a plague, a calamity, a misfortune, especially sent by God to discipline or punish. And so you say, Father, this is painful, but I get it. And I am so sorry. And there's repentance. There's remorse. And you realize God doesn't want you living that way. He wants you living this way. And you say, God, you're right. I'm wrong. I get it.

Thank you so much for loving me enough to put some boundaries in my life and chasing me and discipline me and get my attention. I'm back. I'm listening. I'll obey. And he says, great. Let's keep going. I love you. And then we go for a few hours or a few days or a few weeks and all of a sudden we think he's not looking and go do it again. He goes, you didn't get it. Spoon comes out again.

Until what happens? There's more and more time spent in obedience and less and less time spent in disobedience. And then there's peace in your heart, in your life, in a church, in a family, anywhere. Now he goes on in verse 7. If you endure chastening, if you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons. For what son is there whom a father does not chasten? It's unheard of.

But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, we're all in this process together, then you are illegitimate and not sons. You say, well, I don't know what you're talking about. God doesn't discipline me. You know what? That's worse.

That may mean you're not even in the family. And sometimes what frustrates the fire out of Christians is they look around and go, well, so-and-so's out there and God's not disciplining them. They just do what they want to do. You know what? They may not be his kid. And they may be getting away with murder and whatever else they're doing, but the bottom line is, if they don't get in the family and get a part of this disciplining and teaching and nurturing process, it's hell for them forever.

Verse 9, Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the father of spirits and live? If I had a certain respect and fear of my own father, then how much more awe and fear and respect should I have of God the father himself and say, you know what?

I know you love me and we got this great relationship, but I'm not messing with you anymore because I get it. I don't want any more paddling pain in my life that I bring upon myself. For they indeed for a few days, talking about parents, verse 10, for they indeed for a few days chastened us as seemed best to them. And sometimes parents mess up. The worst feeling in the world is to be trying to do the right thing and spank and disappoint.

and a child, and then find out you were wrong later. It's like pulling bullets back into a gun. It's almost impossible. But you know what? Then you've got to be mature enough. And not too proud to go to your child and say, you know what? Daddy was wrong. And I spanked you and you were right and I was wrong.

I don't recommend you give them the paddle and turn it around. That's not a good thing. But you go to your child and say, you know what? I was wrong. I did the wrong thing here. And show them that you can be wrong in the process. He says here, parents, sometimes we do the best we can. We indeed for a few days chasten as it seems best to us. But with God, there is never, oh, I'm sorry, I messed up.

When God disciplines me, when he disciplines you, when he disciplines us, he is never wrong. He's never out of bounds. He's never just doing it out of anger. It is always, what did he say here? But he for our prophet. that we may be partakers of His holiness. What is He after? He's after that being set apart. He's after his kids not being like every other kid on the planet. God wants children that when other people see those kids, see my kids are a reflection on me and on my wife.

And the scariest thing in the world is to have your kids out there where you don't know where they are and who they're with and what they're saying. But you will know something about my children when you're with them and not with me. They will be a reflection. And God says, you're my kids. You're my billboard. You're my...

my voice on the planet. And when people see you and know that you are holy people, you're set apart, you're different. They're going to notice the relationship and the obedience in that relationship that you have to me. And everybody else says, well, I'm going to go do that. And you say, well, I'm not. I say, well, why not?

Because I don't believe that's what God wants me to do, and I've chosen to obey His Word and His will and not just do what I want to do. Well, that's whack, but they keep watching your life and go, you know what? It's going a whole lot better for you than it is for me. And that in itself is a huge tool to encourage people to turn to God and do His will. Verse 11. Last verse we're going to look at. Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful.

And guys, that is the bottom line. It's not any fun at the moment. It's meant to be painful. That's why it's painful. Nevertheless, look at the result. Afterward, it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it. And the sooner, and I think I've shared this before, the day my dad, my big sister, was about four or five.

And my dad was going to spank her, and I think he had his belt off at some point, and he didn't want that. I recommend a spoon. The belt's a scary thing. But the sound of that belt coming out is pretty impressive. That pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, you know. But one day my huge dad was going to spank on him, and she thought she was going to do something and get out of it. So she reached up and grabbed the belt out of his hand and ran. Now see, the great thing about that...

is that a five-year-old can outrun a six-foot-nine man for a little while. Her little heart's racing. She got away with it. But the problem with this story is that my dad caught her, and she would have been better off just standing there.

and taking what was coming. And see, we think, well, I don't like what God's doing. I don't want to go through this. And we reach up and grab the spoon out of his hand and say, I'm not doing this. And we think for a minute we got away. And God says, you know what?

You should have just stayed and gone through it because now it's going to escalate. Because now it's our will against his will. And you have a great example of Jesus himself in the garden before the day he was crucified. Praying, Father. If there's any way to get around this, so be it. But my prayer is, not my will, but your will be done. And Jesus obeyed. He submitted. And it saved us, literally.

the fact that he was willing to obey. And my encouragement to you today is if you're experiencing the spoon, to go with it, thank God for it. It may sound backward, but say, God, thank you for loving me enough to let me go through this and coming after me.

And let it be proof to you that you are his child. And if you are not his child, then get in this family. There is nothing like having a loving father who comes after you and cares enough about you to help direct you and chasten you and point you where he wants you to be.

and live the way He wants you to live. Hey, this is Richard Ellis coming to you from a football field about one foot from the goal line and that's how we feel at richardellis.com about what's going on in the ministry. AI scares a lot of people, it doesn't scare us. We are sitting on an opportunity of a lifetime where all of our messages, audio and especially video, can be translated into multiple languages.

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