S1E12 - Malec

Just a nightmare. So much glass everywhere, so much class. No, I don't know what's interesting is because then I didn't I didn't know as much about the technical side of filmmaking and the things you have to think about and all of that. But thinking back on it now, just the reflections alone must have been an absolute nightmare, nightmare for for camera department to figure out. Yep, yep, yep, yep.

Well shall we dive in? Let's so here we are dumb at Season one episode twelve, entitled Malik, Very Simply, very simply Malick, It aired originally on March. Written by the Lovely Michael Reese and directed by James Marshall, guest starring Allen Van Sprang, Maxim Roy, David Castro, John Core, Stephanie Bennett, and Caitlin Leeb and co starring Stephen our Heart. What a full house we have for this episode? What

a full house? And as for what we're in store for, well, what more can be said than All You Need Is Malik. On the eve of Alec and Lydia's wedding, relationships are examined. The Institute is in full swing as everyone prepares for Alec and Lydia's wedding, but not everyone is celebrating. As relationships are tested, Clary and Jay struggled to come to terms with their newly revealed past. Alec is confused with his feelings for Magnus, especially when Magnus won't give up

on him. Magnus, Clary and Jay search for Ragna Fell, a warlock who may in fact hold the antidote to wake up Jocelyn. Ragna Fell. I'm so excited. We also mentioned that Adam Kenneth Wilson plays Ragna Felt. Yeah, I was gonna say, yeah it is. Oh, yeah, you're right, Yeah, he is the ghost here. You're absolutely right. Wow, it's like you were in the show. So let's dive right in. Yeah, we can't really talk about any the book to screen stuff yet because it's all spoiler, so we're just going

to skip. Let's skip that for now, but fun facts we can talk about. Shot took place in September, which is still it still blows my mind that we were filming this such a long time ago. It's getting to the stage now where I get recognized for playing Jace and they someone goes, oh, you're Jace, right, and it's a bit like I was, yeah, many years ago. We're getting to that stage where I can actually say that Malick was a fan made couple of ship name for

Magnus Spain and Alec Lightwood. That's interesting. Was it surely from the books? Though originally that must have been where it came from. Definitely, all of the most of our ship names, Yeah, with the exception of, you know, some of the ones we created that we'll get into in season two. And Um, a lot of these ship names came from the book fandom Um. Magnus is talking about siblings who are attracted to each other. He says, I

want to know a couple in ancient Egypt. This is a likely reference to Cleopatra whose famous romances may have included more than one sibling, most famously and confirmed her brother, whom she married Gross I didn't know that that's grim because Constantine Film does not own the rights to the bain chronicles mentioned of in Mars, the musician from Perue who had a fling with Magnus bain In was technically

not allowed. So I wonder how we managed to get away with that, because people tend to be very on top of like when you make mistakes. I guess maybe because it was just a fleeting mention and we didn't discuss the character in any way, I think so. And

also because he's a historical figure. Um, I think, well, let me put it this way, if he really is a musician from Perue, you know, in the way that we pull in Cleopatra and the way that we pull in was it Diplow that we said was a or something Calvin Harris, Yeah, there you go, So, you know we if it was one of those folks, then obviously it's you know, it has nothing to do with the books, and it's a bit fair game. But if it was a book character that was created, that would be interesting.

But then I wonder, because I know that is, yeah, is it really? It's funny. Well, so the first thing I typed in a Marsu Peru musician. All it comes up with is Umasu and Magnus Pain. The first like twenty results are just that well, I mean it was Magnus beIN a real person. The shadow film will prevailed down. We know this, yeah, well, exactly during the wedding scene, the necklace of Lydia keeps disappearing and reappearing. This is

until she finally gets the necklace from Alec. That is hysterical and I'm going to keep an eye out for that when we're watching it. That's so funny. I've never known well spotted whoever spotted that that is. It's just it's one of those things that happened sometimes. Like wedding rings is another one that's always a nightmare, especially if you're married in real life. You forget to take off the real one and put on the you know whatever, the fake one. But that's interesting, eglid fans keep an

eye out for that. Um, we can't talk about book to screen as of yet, so let's just dive in. So, although there is one thing we can mention when Hodge shows the picture of It's interesting going back to the whole emassw thing in different book properties, because there are three warlocks that show up at a certain point. And another thing a lot of the book fans caught is that one of them was was Ragnar Fell, the other was Tessa Gray, and the other was Caterine a Loss.

Who are all warlocks from the books, particularly from the Infernal Devices, although they are mentioned in the Moral Instruments, And maybe that's so we've got to wear with it. I don't know, Yeah, I mean, I I don't know. I don't know how legality works with intellectual property, like because you wrote these characters, but they were in more

than one version of that stimulus. But if we're not allowed to use a version of the stimulus that includes those characters, then are we allowed to use those characters because they were in another stimulus or we're not allowed to touch them at all? Who knows the legalities of this? Exhausting, quite frankly. Anyway, shall we dive into the episode please. Let's so. The episode starts with a very cross Jase, so cross, so scary, grumpy, crumpy Chase. Yeah, I am

a crosspatch. I'm a crosspatch bunny today, and I think largely because I'm a crosspatch bunny. Cross bunny before a crosspatch bunny. Well, there you go. But yes he is crosspatch. You can tell because my jaw is doing that thing

that does across I'm doing the jaw clench. Yeah, there's been many occasions where because the other thing is because you're taught to do it on you when you're doing stunts like if you're falling or if you're being dropped, or if you're landing on your back with your front or whatever, they tell you to lock your draw into place so you don't when you hit you don't close your drawer in your tongue and bite your tongue. That's advice,

solid advice. I'm yet to do that, but yeah, as a result of that and constantly being crosspatch, jas has a tight jaw. He has a clenchy jaw. Well, we'll get Jason face massage at the end of this episode because he's gonna there's a lot more attention to go before then we have There are some smiles that are coming next, but it's a from an unlikely source, so we Alec and Clary have a little bit of a reconciliation.

So Clary is watching over her mother and this This is why I love working with Matt because he there's there's so much spontaneity in little moments and little things that he'll do and little mannerisms that he'll have. And I know you, I mean, you got to work with him so much. There's it makes it fun because you always know he's going to bring something and bound something in there. And this scene was the first time I got to have a real conversation in a scene with

Matt without fighting with him. And uh, it's you know, it's this really nice moment and it's sort of foreshadows this friendship that that Alec and Clary build because they're both stuck emotionally in different places right now and being pulled between different forces and there's an odd and they've both made mistakes and they've both made poor choices and and you know the fact that they're able to take a moment and acknowledge that it's a it's a nice

different color out of the both of them is Yeah, it really is. What was what was Matt like? Did you have a similar I guess impression when you did trust? Was it called trust? Yeah, it's called trust. Yeah. Well, what's interesting in that movie is the two of us were playing entirely different characters, and so it was a completely we We had become so accustomed to the sort of butting heads brothers sister lee character relationship. We sort

of had to go is there? Because he called me when he got offered the film and he's like, are you sure we can do this? Because I don't know if we can seriously look at each other in the eye and flirt. And I was like, no, no, we

got this. And it turned out to be so fun because after working with someone for so long, you work with them on something else and you automatically have a kind of technical shorthand of and especially with indie movies things you're always crunched on time and you're always trying to,

you know, make it work more efficiently. And with Matt, we're going, okay, so this is how we can do and then if we and if I stand and you go and okay, And even with the characters, it's just nice to have someone that you, for lack of a better word, trust and just can bounce things off of and know that you can play and that that other person is going to give you back the same sort of energy that you're putting out there. Um, that's so interesting that also I have another, I think, fun trust

bit of information. Yeah, Lucien, Lucien. I'm sure he won't remember me. British rights from Manchester or he's from up north somewhere. Yeah, so Lancashire, Yeah he is. He's from Lankshire. Solution was one of the first British people I ever met in l a and we won't he won't remember me, but I remember cracking up. We were testing for something together, or maybe just auditioning for something together. I can't remember that.

And it was just like the two of us and he went off and got a glass of water and then came back in and was like, you know when you drink water wrong and you're like choking, And it was like the funniest thing. I thought, it was so funny. You just put everyone in the room at ease. It was such a nice guy. And he like choked a little and got better and he went fucking I thought that was the end of me. I was going to

die there just from drinking some water. And it was it was just like everyone was just at ease from then, and I've always remembered him for that, Like he's a really really nice, really nice guy. So no, he was lovely. It was such a fun film because we had a whole cast of folks and and it was it was nice. Everyone was kind of down to play. And but we're not talking about that right now. We've got different issues to deal with it. We we do, we do. It's

not about trust. It's about Malick, and it's always about Malick. Magnus is such a great character in the sense because he's so all knowing and so wise and so beyond his you know, beyond everyone else in in his wisdom, but he still falls victim to very human vulnerabilities and tendencies. And when Alec was to see him in this next scene, he's clearly as sexy as he's ever been and he's going to drink in his hand. He set the mood and it just makes me so happy. Yeah, it's you know,

it's a fun it's a fun leading scene. Of course, anyone who's read the books knows. Any fans of our show that read the book, they know, they know where this episode is going, they know what's going to happen. They don't know how it's going to happen or but they know that sort of this new partnership is going

to spring. And I guess for the the audience, it's the audience that hadn't read the books, which I I really enjoy talking to those people because they don't have these sort of preconceived notions or these expectations of the show or the relationships. So it's really interesting to talk to those people and they go, oh, yeah, that was one of my favorite episodes because we didn't know what he was going to choose, like we didn't know that, And that's a real testament to the two of them,

Harry and Matt. Matt for showing this like fortitude in alec No, my decision is made. It's this is difficult, but this is my decision. I'm doing this. And then Harry with this like frustration with the sort of tempting and flirting and the understanding of what it's like to be a young gay man trying to live I guess in shoes that don't fit him. So the two of them do this this really wonderful like dance, and it's interesting talking to fans who didn't know how this was

going to end. Who say, yeah, we genuinely didn't know in this episode. We had no idea which way this was going to end. Um which is great. Good on you guys, and it's great, and we'll talk more about that when we get to the moment to which you're referring.

It's this been It's been such a nice arc over these last few episodes to see the push and pull and and and to see a lot of these vulnerabilities in both of these characters, and and kind of I think it sets the foundation for much in the same way that it sets the foundation for the parable relationship, the trials and tribulations you've been through, it sort of sets the foundation for the future of these two characters

as well, know very much. So. Um So, after our little fun flirty moment between the two of them, we we dive into a Simon Clary scene which she doesn't waste much time, does she bloody hell, like, just found out that the love of my life can't happen. So she's like, Hey, I know another date that I can invite to this wedding. Crikey. Honestly, good for Simon, good for you, mate, But I think what that actually is it's it's less about oh, one day it's gone, let

me find another one. And I think it more comes from the fact of Clari and Jace are both reeling because they clearly both thought one perception of this relationship and then suddenly going, oh, it's my brother, so no, that can't happen, and sort of pushing that away and shutting that door because otherwise it doesn't make any sense,

and and just needing some comfort. She needs some something that feels normal, something that kind of grounds her, especially since her mother is still stuck and we don't really know what's happening with that and could potentially be gone forever. At this point, you need someone who who knows you, and she's trying it desperately to still hang on to who she was and who she is, and some semblance of comfort for lack of a better word, and that's

Simon's always Simon, Poor Simon, always a bridesmaid. Until the end of season three. We'll get there. We'll get there for you, buddy, We'll get their buddy. Bless him. They like, is he paler in season one than he was in season two? Is that a change we made? So all the vampires are. They did the vampire makeup a little differently in season one because and you see it most

on David Castro. You see it mostly on him in his first episode because it was very white and then so it's one of those things like the Ruins and the swords. They slowly but truly figured it out. It's an interesting transition because he's got quite olive's skin naturally, David Castro has quite sort of olive colored skin. So it's that's that's the one for me where I see it very much, so, especially in those early episodes. But

I just noticed it in Alberto a little there. I was like, good buddy on the video games, you need to get outside. Man, you're like a little pale. I mean, we all got a little pale. It was try seriously, yeah, that first season like only saw the sun when I was when they decided we were going to film during the day outside. Actually, this is one of the very few episodes that we filmed during the war that I

filmed early on. You and Matt and Alberto had quite a few daytime outdoor scenes, but I didn't have very many at all in this season, and this episode we do. We went to that that house you remember, Yeah, we just gorgeous out. So what happens next time? Next we move into plan mode again. We need to get into planned mode. Ah how just Ted talk? Just Ted talks. So there are three people sat at a table at the institute who do not want to be sat at a table in the center of the institute, Jason and

Clary for very obvious reasons. And Magnus is in the one place that he does not want to be right now. He does not want to be surrounded by this enamoring young man's wedding plans. He does not want to see Alec after their previous conversation. So it's three people in a very uncomfortable state and Hodge ignoring that and talking

about the mission. Bless him, Hodges, and I just love how John Core approaches this because he's so excited to have information and to be able to teach and share, and it's it's like that teacher that always makes you excited to go to class and excited to learn things because they're into it. And yet everybody else is just Freddie foreshadowing again, Freddy foreshadowing again. Hodge is such a nice guy. Oh yeah, Hodges the best We love Hodge.

Don't you love Hodge. We all love Hodge, We trust Hodge, we would try by Hodge. We all want more. John Core, Um, I just saw the image that you were talking about with these three warlocks. Um. He actually he does an amazing job with the so the the screens that we use, those screens in the institute, those big screens and all of the iPads and everything. None of those were touch screen in any way, shape or form. They were all

just TV screens, that's all they were. So everything we did there was a graphic that played on the screen that we had to time with everything else. And John is one of the ones who made it look really effortless. He made it look like there at no point in I like, oh, there's that weird delay where it didn't quite happen right away. He always got that timing exactly

right and makes it look really really good. And what he's pulled up is the three of your of your warlocks, it's Katrina lost Ragna Fell and her name's cut off, But did you say Tessa Gray was the other one. And there are three warlocks and we're trying to figure out which one is more powerful than Magnus pain, and which one could have cast this charm the spell made this potion for Jocelyn that she drank and green and in a bubble when all green and bubbly. It's just

so much awkward in this scene. And I had forgotten how awkward the awkward because we got so far past it by the end. But it's you could cut that tension with that nice oh yeah, yeah, how's your doing? God? Yes, this is one of those days where it's like, oh, I was so sore. Yeah, not happy. Nobody's happy except for except for Hodge, who's just oblivious to all of it. Bless him. He's just living his life. Yeah, And then,

of course you just to make matters worse. It would be far too easy if Magnus Spain would have gotten in and out of the institute without bumping into the happy couples. Of course, and again credit to Stephanie because she once again is plays this kind of delicate situation in such a lovely way of trying to be gracious and trying to not make it awkward, and yet everyone is sort of arrested by the tension in the room. Yeah, we have more attention by adding more characters than nobody

wants to talk to each other. There's like eight people in this room right now, and four of them don't want to talk to the other four. And there's all these crossed purposes. Bloody nightmare, a nightmare. Good Lord, attention. That's enough, Thank God. The scenes over and we're done. Let's move on. Let's move on submission stuff. No more tension for me, Oh yeah, no more attention. Missions are never tense. Let's let's go out into the English countryside

and go out. Honestly, that's Jason's like wheelhouse, Like I don't think he gets tense, like watch him like this is This is something that Darren and I discussed this pretty fervently about how Jason's movements and the way he fights is like has this flu medity to it, so it has this um he's it's like walking or like breathing, like it's that's that is where he's the most comfortable. Um. And I can't remember if it was Darren and myself

who brought it up. We wanted it to be like you know how Captain Jack Sparrow walks on land and he walks like he's drunk, but when he walks on a boat, he walks perfectly, and that's because he spent so much time on a boat that he feels comfortable on a boat, and when he gets on land it feels weird that there isn't that motion, and we kind of wanted an element of that with Jace, where he is most comfortable when he's holding his sword, when he's

about to go into action, like that's what makes sense to him. That's all that makes sense to him. So I think it's funny that you say, like, you know, the battle fields never tense. It's always tense because it's battle, but like in Jason's head, that is that's like that's the norm, Like that's where I feel most at home. Is it is when I'm charging into you know, potentially certain death. Yeah, well it's pretty you know what to expect you're not going to get because that's where as

you said, that's where Jakes is comfortable. And it's the emotional vulnerability is not the physical ones that sort of put him off of his balance, um for lack of a But what's interesting about this, though, is we're dealing with a bit of both. Because of course you have the wonderfully quippy Magnu Spain who is just poking the bear, poking the elephant in the room as it were just poking it just a little bit. Goddamn Yeah, much to our chagrin that we did not film this in London.

I wanted this to be filmed in London. It was only four of us. Take us over to London. Let me have a little vacation at home, Seema peeps. There are beautiful fields and beautiful houses that we could have used for this, and they were like, nope, absolutely not. You hold fire in season three, will go to Paris. Um. We didn't know that yet, No, we didn't. But something I sort of want to set the tone because a lot of folks we know this, but the folks at

home don't necessarily know this. When we were shooting this scene, I don't know if you remember, we were out in this big field, which we hadn't done a lot of. During the day, we had this big crane shot, all

these special effects shots to do. We had a big, big day ahead of us, and of course, as is the fashion in September in Toronto, there was a storm front rolling in and literally we could see so much of the sky that Pierre are a d s our first a D was going, guys, we have we have thirty minutes before torrential downpour to get this entire scene and all of the shots and the crane shot and the all of the things that we needed to accomplish for this scene, which was a big scene and sort

of the catalyst for the whole episode. And there's a reason that we're talking so very quickly throughout this entire scene because they're like, all right, the three of you, just pump out that dialogue and get it done so we can move on. The reason there's no close you actually you if you the scene where we've disappeared, which just popped up and it's just you and you're like, okay, that's where are you doing your little like Velma from Scooby Doo thing? Um, you have clearly been rained on.

You were very obvious and rained on. If you look at your hair, actually you should you should do your hair like this more. It looks great with the little like the sort of the plot I guess down the back. Yeah, I mean, look, credit to Ryan Reid, who was our

hair department season one. He I mean, obviously we love Nancy Warren, who did the rest of the show as well, but Ryan sort of established so much of what the world was and also bless him that day he was out in the middle of that rain with a Beutane curling iron, just trying to keep those curls in my hair. It's so funny, isn't it. It's so funny. What is necessary for? Like, no, no, this is what we want your hair to look like. It cannot be straight, has

to be curly. Why it was a book. In the books, Clary has naturally curly hair. Yeah, and so we wanted to sort of obviously I don't have naturally curly hair, and sort of, you know, giving me a perm or a wig. That was kind of the closest thing we could do to have that sort of wild mane that Claire. That's fair, that's fair. If it's if it was book necessary, then that's fair enough. This brings us fairly neatly through the selective the selective fire too. This scene is so fun.

This is such a fun scene. He does such a fantastic job. I remember reading it for the first time and there's sort of two pages of dialogue before we get to the reveal of what's happening in this scene, and I was like, oh, that's so funny. We have like a schizophrenic warlock. That's such an interesting not funny, ha ha, funny interesting. Um, that's such an interesting take that we have thrown in a warlock who is battling, you know, with this as well before we reveal that

that's not the case. But it was so well written. And then he does such a good job telling this story without obviously without us there. Um really fantastic. And I think did I even say what was it in the script? I can't really remember, um, but I feel like someone wrote Jason Magnus lines in so he knew that what he was reacting to. I think you guys

might have done that on the day. Yeah, I think you guys might have spoken about that on the day because I think that was from Adam because if I remember correctly, Look again, we say this all the time. We have all these guest stars that come in and they're so flipp and fantastic that they dive in and they bring so much to these characters and they commit. And again we've had Harry who has been sort of our only main warlock that we've seen, so he established

what warlocks are. And then you have Adam who comes in and just takes it, keeps it consistent and does it, you know, to the level that Harry is doing it, but makes it his own and makes it unique and gives this It really speaks to the uniqueness of every Warlock because you know, that's that's sort of the mythology. Each Warlock has their own Warlock mark, and each Warlock is sort of a lone wolf in in their unique abilities and their unique physicalities. And and Adam just personified

that so well. But I believe that was a choice that he asked for. I think he said what would you say and what would you say? Just so he had something in his head that makes sense. But I had so much fun doing this first bit with the pulling him out of the portrait and the way that that I mean credit to our VFX team as well. That was so well because that the whole portrait I thing and people going in and out of paintings can be a bit. It's not always done seamless in films

and TV. And if I look if anything is done so often that there's a there's a like recurrent theme that it's not done very well, then you're like, this is a dangerous ground for us to stand on because it's already been done so many times to the point where sometimes it gets done quite poorly. Yeah, I agree with you. Real credit to the guys for taking something and sort of reinventing the wheel with it. Yeah, and

that's what it felt like. It felt reinvented because I didn't as I tried to watch this as a viewer for the first time, I didn't see it coming. It wasn't sort of spoon fed to to me visually, which I appreciate. I also I forgot the tie in for the Book of the White, and this is a tie into them the books as well, because we have the Gray Book, which is all the ruins in the Book of the White is this infamous spell book, and I

forgot that. That's why we had to find the Book of the White, because it has the antidote for the potion. That's right, Yeah, the Book of the White. That's well, yeah, that's why we're chasing down Ragna Fell. It's also I like this like fun competition that they have, like a similar thing between with the shadow Hunters as well, like who's the fastest, who's the strongest, who's the best shadow Hunter? Like Warlocks have that too, and Magnus says, why is

Ragna on that list? He's not more powerful than I am. And there's this cool, like sort of sibling relationship thing that they have there, which is really neat. So I think with Adam, which I thought was amazing. So I, obviously, being British, have a real ear for non British actors giving a British accent ago and the same vice versa with Americans and especially American actors. Listening to British actors trying to do an American accent, you can really hear

when things go wrong. And I he kept this up during the day and I was talking to him about England. That's how convincing he was. I was talking to him about England and eventually said something along the lines of like how often do you get back and whatever, and he went, oh, no, no, no, I'm from here. I'm from here. It's just the accent for the character. I was like, fuck me, man, holy sh it. Really, that's arguably the most impressive British accent I've ever heard in

my life. I was fantastic. Hey, if you can fall the briat, that's that's the sample of approval. Right, Yeah, he was so wonderful just in and so game with you know. I know they tried on several different horns with him, and there's a whole thing later on. You hear Magnus call him my little cabbage. And what that's a reference to is in the books Wrangner fellas green. His skin is supposed to be green. It is what he has that in the horns, which are his warlock mark.

And I think they tried him green, but they felt it's a hint of green in his in his makeup, but it's not green green. It's more like like a hue, a green hue. Yes, it's a it's a hue and a hue. And then of course we couldn't as soon as we get just enough information to taste our our victory, it all goes around. It's so close, We're so close. He thinks he knows, he thinks he has something that can help us. So close, so close. And then this

always bugged me. There are like two or three instances in shadow Hunters where I was like, man, this is how this person goes out? Really like this is this one of them is with me in season two and We'll get to that in season two where I was like, wow, really better about that? So bitter, I'm so upset they ended up being what it ended up being. But this one really pissed me off because this was a Shacks demon.

It was one little creepy critter that got him. It wasn't like some big, like elaborate and we're talking about this person is one of the most powerful warlocks in the world, the High Warlock of London, and he gets got by this, and I was just like a man, We've got to give him more of a but nope,

he got got by this. But it's also it makes it even more painful for Magnus because Ragner is a bit of an agoraphobe and doesn't let anyone in and doesn't trust anyone, and Magnus, he even says it, wragner Felt is the only person or I'm the only person in the world that wragner Felt trusts, and as soon as he takes advantage of that trust, it kills him. And it's you know, it's it's Magnus feels responsible and then even more Clarity feels responsible because ultimately it's all

for her and her mama. Yeah, really rough. U. This is a this is you know, we don't talk about this enough. Dying on screen is fucking hard, Like, it's really hard work to make it look convincing. The one thing that no actor has ever done that they have to try and recreate, you know what I mean is dying. You've never We've never died, None of us have ever died, so we can It's nothing. It's not something that we can be like, Oh, I know, vaguely, where to do this,

how to put this in? He the two the two my two favorite deaths on the show are Adam. That's a horrible thing to say, but there you are. Adam does an amazing death, so like cold, dead eyed stare into the distance, and we shouldn't really talk about it yet, but I know, and he had a good one. But we'll talk about that again. We'll talk about that. This heartbreaking scene is left off with a tearful Magnus saying,

just let me take care of my friend. And this is one of those moments too, where Harry Magnus is such a character that always has this composure for the most part, but we get these little glimpses with Harry of just how talented he is as an actor, and this was the first time I remember watching Harry do his close up because we were standing off camera for

the eyeline. And oftentimes, when you know you do an actor's close up, the other actor, the scene partner, will stand very close to the camera so that they when they look at other actor, it's closer to the lens and they can kind of catch the full performance. But we were standing and I remember watching the monitor while Harry was doing his close up and just being absolutely full floored by his performance. Yeah, so brilliant. So we come back to the Institute full of fire and Brimstone

because we have been betrayed by somebody. There aren't many people that knew where we were going, what we were doing, why we were doing it. It was all done in secret, largely to protect Ragna because he's a very secretive person. Also because we're at war and secrets are best kept secret. So someone in the Institute of Traders, Jason convinces himself that it is Lydia. Makes sense, It does it doesn't It doesn't it because he Jas doesn't really know Lydia.

They haven't really spoken or interacted sort of at all. Ja's just sort of sees her as like, you're from the Cleave. The Clave doesn't like me, like the Cleave is not a fan. They know that I'm good at what I do, so I have this reputation, but I don't follow your rules. So that's how he sees Lydia. So he has convinced himself that Lydia is the traitor um. And then I believe it's Clary who says, let me talk to her. You're too angry, let me talk to her. Well,

it's Clarion Isabel. Oh, it's both of them. Yeah, it's Clarion Isabel. And I think again, we see this, this sort of team up, and this these two women that are are going to become such a good team together in the future. This is one of the first glimpses we see of them working together. I mean, I albeit against Jason in this instance, but but working as a team to calm James down and kind of good cut bad cupping him and Clary taking a moment and going, look,

I'll talk to her. I'm the outsider. I'm Valentine's daughter. Let me take this is my responsibility. Let me let me take care of this. I'll do the human emotional thing. You're two, you're two worked up. Let me take a crack at it. Yeah, ironically too emotional to take on this task is Jace, Bless him? But and and then to that point. Then it goes into the scene with Lydia. Correct. I remember on the day this was one of those scenes. It was at the very end of the day, at

the very end of a week. We were running over time, we were out of time, and by the time we got to my close up, they came over to me and went, you have one take. Please hit your marks. We have to pull the plug after this take. I'm so sorry, which normally we get at least two, maybe three if we're lucky, but I sort of went all right. One of the biggest scenes of the episode. Lots of dialogue,

important story points. Let's figure it out. But you know, it's a testament to our our camera operators and our crew and everyone one because when it gets to the eleventh hour we can pull together and work as a team and make the scene great. And I love how

this scene is written. We talked about this a little bit in the last episode and quite a bit with Lydia, but it's it's so great when you have two female characters that are still put it odds, but they're put it odds in a way that is still mature, and it's it's never catty, and you know, it's it's testy, but it's human. And you have these two women that are having a real conversation and not just fighting with each other to have to pit two women against each

other as as you know, as the common case. Yeah, no, mature. Mature is a really good word. It is. It's mature. It's adult. It's an adult conversation to have. It's not bitchy, it's it's grown up. It's it's educated, it's eloquent, it's tasteful, like it's Yeah, these scenes, and especially the women in our show were written like like real women as much

as is humanly possible within a very supernatural world. And I think that's a real credit to the team we we had creating these women and then obviously the women who portrayed them, like it's you know, it's you can only write so far until you get someone on screen, and then it's their face, their body, their voice, it's them doing this thing. So you know, credit to you and Stephanie the bext she did a fantastic job. Well,

thank you. It's I think the most important thing is seeing the heart of both of these characters, and they both really are coming from a well intentioned place, but are in a rather difficult situation. I can't remember what said at the end of that, but I'm pretty sure we figure out, well, at least you figure out that Lydia is not the traitor, right, isn't that what we Yeah?

And how it ends up is actually a really nice moment because they fight, they butt heads, and Clary goes to storm out and then turns around and goes, how do I trust you? Because she genuinely she just goes, you know what, fine, if you're going to claim this, how can I believe it? And very smartly, Lydia says, well,

you're Valentine's daughter. I learned to trust you. Yeah, and Claire goes fair enough, but you know, in true, in true short, red headed, bad tempered fashion walks of Lydian goes, these people are my family, and I protect my family, so do not cross me. Fair enough, and then leaves it. That's fine, I'll believe you, but if you cross me, you're dead. Um. I think we missed an opportunity with this next scene. That could have been a really cool like Simon in a mirrored hallway doing like the dress

up montage of trying on different suits and stuff. I think we really missed, and I think alberts I would have dug that too, like a full like trying on everyone and then like clothes coming out of the water one by one. Whatever. The truth is, he looks fantastic in one everywhere, So that montage is a useless piece of footage, but it could have been fun. It would have been fun to see even Rafael go no, no, no, no, no, hey and try this, you know the whole let Raphael,

pretty woman who you know that? The guy who walks uh, speaking of pretty vampires, the guy who walks Isabelle into this scene in the background. I'm not sure who this is. I wasn't here this day. Dude looks more like Robert Pattinson than Robert Pattinson. I'm saying, like this is wild, like absolutely wild to me. He looks like facially lips eyes, knows his jaw line like that. If that's not Robert Pattinson, I don't know. I don't know what's what anymore. That's mental.

That's absolutely mental. Everyone checked that out. Yeah, we got our pattersons. Rob came in and did a day he listen, if we have Batman in the back of one of our scenes, I am so happy, so happy. Yep, I can die happy if if they had they had the Batman. I agree, I agree, Oh my goodness. But also this is a nice little, a little link to future Sissy because you know, it's it's one of the first times since episode one or two that these two have interacted

and you know, nobody's dying right now that they know of. Yeah, which is it's such a rare thing. I'm already dead. Simon is dead and therefore cannot be dying because he's dead. Well, what happens when vampires die? Do they die? They don't, They can't die. They just expire. It happens. How many vampires did you kill on the show? No? I know, But what do we goof into smoking? I know that,

but what will we call it? Like we we can't be killing vampires because vampires don't can't die because they're dead, dispatching them. Dispatching them is not bad. They just expire like a egg timer. There you go like an egg timer. They're just done. Um. We get a great scene, which thank god we do, because we get to see Adam again. Yes, Adam comes back as sort of this force ghost slash memory from Magnus and we just get to see this like fun relationship between the two of them. This like,

actually it is kind of caddy. It is kind of bitchy, but in like a very brotherly sense, in the same sort of way that Alec and Jace can be at

each other's throats, especially in later seasons. They can be at each other, but in the in the way brothers do, in the way siblings do, and you get to see this really wonderful and I one of my favorite things we do on the show is the lookbacks are more ancient characters and they can talk about like, oh, I hated this thing that happened in sixteen fifty or whatever, and the you know, it's that reminder of like, wow,

these people have been around for a listraal eternity. These people have been around for hundreds and hundreds of lifetimes and experience more than any other creature on the planet, which is really wonderful. But we get to see this nice dynamic between Harry and Adam again. Absolutely, and there's a nice tie in. Oh that that comes later because we flashed back to this a few times, so I'll bring that up later. But you're right, it's it's a really lovely scene. And I love that you describe it

as a Force ghost. I think that's that's kind of exactly what it is though, right, Yeah, we just can't call it, Yeah, a Disney property, so we're not allowed to say that. I mean, we can't now on this more so we can, I guess, So, yeah, did we? That's right? We had is he is? He's wearing a Star Wars shirt in episode ten? Yeah? Were we just allowed to use anything from Disney? Why don't we bring like life? I did it. I had a reference. I had a Star Wars reference in season two with Simon.

It's all coming back to me now, how many other pop culture references I managed to sneak in without anyone knowing? That's great, we do a few of them. So now we get into the bachelor party, Yeah, Alex bachelor party. Also, by the way, I don't know if is this what you were going to say about location? Oh? No, that's a good that's a good shout. I was going to talk about the music and just ask where they're supposed to be. Is this at the Institute? Is rent bar? Yeah?

I think she rented out a bar. Um was sort of the idea, which is just a sort of amorphous bar that we use for everything. So this was the vampire bar, this was the Warlock party bar. It is the same set. I think it ends up being like the sewers when we fight the Drevic demons, the like wormy demons in season three, that's here. Also, it's also the subway in in the beginning, and it's the boat basin. It is the boat basin. That's right when the boat basin, Wow,

we really did. And it's also the creepy Um. It's also the creepy dungeon where the Iris rouses demon is. Oh, that's right. And I think it was the dungeon where Simon was a serial killer and killed Fisk. Yeah, I think so, right. So yeah, it's amazing about this. Listeners who who maybe don't know, and if you do know,

I'm not being patronizing. I just would to explain to everyone knows, Um, we film an episode of a show in anywhere between Like I think we've got The quickest one was like six or seven days, and then the longer ones were like the pilot took like three weeks to film. Um so anywhere between that time. But the turnaround between episodes is days. If that, if you're lucky you end on a weekend. If you end midweek, then Wednesday you're shooting one oh three, Thursday you're shooting one

oh four. And the set decoration team, who are in charge of making sure that the sets look correct and everything's whatever, they have to turn these sets around within that time. So let's say between two episodes, we're using this location. The set deck team turned this from the hard Tale the vampire bar into this or into the dungeon or into the basement or into whatever it is the subway in days, and it is unbelievable because they

look like entirely different spaces. Is absolutely mind blowing. Anyway, so we move into the bachelor party. Is he being well? But it's it's true that you say that, though, because we were so lucky, because every time we walked into a new set, it was a completely full, immersive world. And I was always so grateful for our set deck team and for our set design and art department and everything that puts so much energy into every single detail.

I remember exploring sets three years in and finding something new that I had never seen before, some details, some thing I could play with that was just completely brand new. I did a scene with Alberto in I forget if it was season two or three in the boat Basin, and he had this monologue and wanted some business to do, and so he just looked around the set and found something, and then found a rag and a thing, and suddenly he created his entire scene from the set. We I

we had it. I had. The big one I had was in season two when they sort of redesigned Jace's bedroom or Jay Scott moved in the institute and was in sort of the spire of the of the of the castle and the church. Um and I remember walking in that day and everyone sort of knew me well enough at that point that they were like, Dom's going to touch everything, just so you know, Dom's gonna play with everything in this thing. So everything in there was practical.

The punching bags were were like hard driven into the roof so you could actually use them. The pull up bars hard driven into the roof, so you could use them. Like absolutely everything in that room was practical and from the ground up built with Jason mind. And that's such a such an amazing thing to have that this much

thought is going into these characters behind the scenes. Really wonderful. Anyway, we do, as Catwin mentioning, we get to move on to the bachelor party, arguably the best slash worst bachelor party ever, depending on what you were expecting. If you're expecting reconciliation with your best buddy and that your best buddy is going to be a best man and he's going to stand next to you no matter what happens for the rest of your days, then this is the

best bachelor party ever. If you were expecting booze and yaga bombs and strip because this is not a good bachelor party. But also maybe you have the wrong interpretation. Although the music is their music is great. Music is great music. The music is there also the word for best man that I still do not know, Sean Jean, I think never come across that before. Um, isn't it a shadow ANSWER's word? Is it? I don't think I

thought so. I mean they just put it on my script and I was like, all right, Um, let me skip to the end of this scene quickly and see. I think it might be so June. We're learning all sorts of things. Sugin yeah, yeah, God, how would you even spell that? S a u j I n Maybe let's see, Oh a rook Hue member serves in the

Heisian army as an archer. That doesn't seem right. This is probably another one of those words, though, Like even like parabat i. I remember talking to Cassie about the word parabatai because it's only ever really been written down, so I think it might even have been Cassie who said she always thought it was going to be pronounced pera bartai. I think, oh, yeah, remember, Maybe it wasn't Cassy, Maybe it was a fan who said that. But like,

it's another one of those things. If surgin is a shadow unter's word, which it seems to be, unless I'm spelling it wrong because I can't find it anywhere, I bet it's some like really simple word that I'm just spacing on and everyone's seeing me, like you idiot. It means this, or it means something really rude, in which case I desperately apologize. Oh as u g g E n E s s U g e n e s.

Oh yeah. A sugin is a term used to refer to a person at shadow Hunter's wedding who walks the bride or groom along the aisle as their betrothed welcome welcomes them to the latter. It's a shadow Unter's word, Oh no, let you go. Um so again. It's one of those words that we got to define it, like, we got to pronounce this word however we wanted to. But the portants of this scene is the apologies between

the two of them. You know, things got really dark between Alec and Jason, and I think they both knew that there would always be a reconciliation, but when it was going to come, nobody knew. So they were just wasting time that they could have had with their best friend and their soul mate during this time which they

didn't have. Um So, apologies all round and reconciliation, reconciliations of these two, which I as an actor was very grateful for, because you know, we worked quite hard at the beginning of making this relationship what it was and then to sort of tear it apart was actually quite harrowing. It was quite hard work to play like you have this disdain for someone that you really care about. So I'm really glad that we got back to you know us again before Jace loses his mind a little in

the next episode. Yeah, but to be fair, that's it's very similar in the scene with you know Lydia and Clary. It's very mature in the way that they both go about doing this, and it's but it's also very human because they're both caught in these weird situations with their love lives, and it's it's not something as shadow Hunters that they're used to talking about, and so the fact that they can because they are the one person in the world that the other can be vulnerable with as

their parabtie. So it's nice to finally see these two warriors and these two people who have had to just keep it together for so long go, I don't know what I'm doing, and I don't know how to feel or what's happening. This is confusing and I don't but I'm glad I have you and sort of reaffirm that bond that then carries through the rest of our series. Absolutely, and it's beautifully done. So credit to you guys. Thank you very much. It's very sweet. We should stop talking

about the scene the scene of scenes. We should, but first let me just mention one more thing, because we go back to Ragner Fell and Magnus one more time, and because this is sort of the catalyst that goes into the wedding, because Ragner starts talking to Magnus about Alec and about love and about all of this, and Ragner goes Wragner tells Magnus to fight for it. If it's worth it, if love is worth it, you fight for it, and that is sort of the inspiration that

Magnus needs to do what he does next. But it brought up an interesting thought that I wanted to run by you and see what your opinion is. I wonder if this is actually Ragner's ghost or if it's an element of magnus subconscious memory of Ragner. I figured it was a memory, yeah, because then it's, you know, Magnus convincing himself, and it's this is coming from within Magnus as well from and you know, whether or not Magnus is aware that it's it's his own subconscious that's going

to know. I can't I can't let him go. Yeah, No, I always had sort of figured it was his imagination bringing him back, and like the force ghost element was just a funny, like actual esthetic image to see. But no, I had always assumed that this was like Magnus talking to like what would Ragna do? Like what would Ragna say in this situation? And this is the embodiment of that which brings us fairly, neatly and finally to the

wedding of the century up until this point. It's the wedding of the century up until this point, which there's there's more to come. There's more to come. We when I say, the writers agonized over this, set deck agonized over this, costumes agonized over this, the actors agonized over this.

And then actually being on set, we spent two days just filming this one scene, which is so uncommon in the film and TV world, at least in this sort of TV world, so uncommon, um that we spend such a long time filming this scene, but had such a poignant weight to it, um and was such a big part of our story that it deserved that time. It deserved that weight, um. And what transpires is so I think some of the best acting, performing, uh, directing, editing.

Everything that was in this from you know, hair and makeup, costumes right to everything. Every single element of this was so perfect for what it needed to be and I'm so incredibly proud of all of the people that were

a part of it. And this is what I always go back to when I refer to the magic and the rarefied air and the lightning in a bottle that was our show because it was as you said, every single department cared so much, and when it came to these really big book moments, which we had several of throughout our series, there was a little bit of magic that happened when all of these elements blend did perfectly.

And you just have from from hair and makeup to wardrobe to the acting, the cinematography, the set deck that everything came together so beautifully to create this world and this image and it it we got to live it and it didn't feel as though we were doing a scene and didn't feel as though we were working to do this. It was happening, And uh, it's so rare that you get that and you get the time to

really do something properly. But you know, credit to the folks that gave us the resources to do that on the show, because these moments are important, so important, and it's I remember this happening. This, Like the reactions from everyone really tell the story of how much people cared about both of these characters and how much pride they have that theyre that they're you know, opening themselves up

to this. I remember my reaction and in my head obviously couldn't say this on the show, but in my head, I was like, funk, yeah, buddy, good for you, fucking great, and you can't say that out loud, but like, you know, yeah, yeah. But before we get to that moment, there's so much that happens up until then, because not only is there this excitement in the air, but there's a tension because everyone knows, you know, it's sort of the other elephant

in the room that no one's talking about. There's you know, there's the Jason Clary elephant, which is sort of a baby elephant, but then you have the grand elephant, that is everyone knows that these two aren't necessarily at least all of our our characters know that these two aren't necessarily in love, and they're potentially committing to h a bond that in the world of the Shadow Hunters, it's four lets you get there. It is to death Stylli's part because there are some ruins that are and this

is a carryover from the books. There are some ruins that come and go and some things that you have to re ruin on yourself. But the Wedded Union ruin is one that is permanent. So no matter or what you do, unless you're exiled and d runed, that one will be there for life. Yeah, it's a permanent bond, like the para a type bond, well, semi permanent. Mm hm. There is a moment between you and Albertos. Yeah, over over your shoulder. It's one of my favorites from him.

I just have to bring that out. Yeah I got you, buck you and yeah he does. He gives me a little thing and I'm like, good for you, man. That's that's that's really, that's what I would have done. That's great, exactly what I would have done. That's awesome. But that's the thing about the scene is there's all those little moments. You know, you see you see Hodge and Mariss talking, and you see you know, all the and there's there's the moment between um trying to remember the sequence of events.

But as we get into the wedding, yeah, we sort of dive in pretty quickly to the tension of like this wedding is actually in full force, like it's sort of it gets to that moment of like, does anyone object to this wedding? Does he say that? He doesn't

say that, right, does he actually say that? No? No, but she is putting the stelle to his hand, and then suddenly you hear the doors open and everyone looks and there's Magnus Pain, which is my favorite entrance by the way, because it seems like, I don't know, we should have asked me about this. It seems like he thought he was going to come into like the lobby and accidentally came into the wedding hall, and he sort of has this like oh shit, oh no, this is

I didn't think I would be like here here. I thought I would have an extra like thirty seconds to plan this through, and here it comes. It's it's happening in front of me, and it's so funny. I think it's such a brilliant thing because he's like looking down as well, and then looks up and He's like, oh yeah, so good. That actually, I think is the moment they figure it out. I think as soon as because he

I think so too. Harry comes in. Magnus comes in and sees Alcan, locks eyes Alex he's Magnus, and locks eyes, and neither of them blink. They just look at each other and don't really look around again. I think Alec has a couple of looks of panic later on, but I think I genuinely think that's the moment where they see in each other like I know what I need to do, I know what happens here, I know what

the next step is. And then Lydia helps solidify that. Lydia, being the hero that she is that you know she started off to the audience is kind of this bad guy, but really, Lydia is the one. Lydia is the first one to say out loud that it's okay, I accept you for who you are. I get it, go do your thing. She's the first one in our show to say it out loud. Everyone else, you know, whether they feel it or whatever, the first one who says it is Lydia. That's the except for obviously Magnus. But that's

the first person who actually says it to it. Yeah, well that's such a testament too, because it it's sort of not exonerates, but it gives Alec permission to still to not leave Lydia hanging. You know, he has then given the freedom to make the choice because he obviously is a good person and doesn't want to leave anyone at the altar because that's not a nice thing to do. But also, love in this world is is such a huge thing, especially this kind of romantic love, especially for

shadow Hunters. It only happens once, and they're all aware of that. Lydia has lost the love of her life already and in order for her not to put someone else through that, she sees it in front of her. She recognizes it more than anyone else does in that room, and it's it's really interesting moment. But I love how Matt and Harry play this because you truly, as an audience member, if you don't know what happens, you do not know if they're going to fight or kiss or

yell at each other. He looks like he's going to hit him. It does a little bit. If you don't know, you're kind of going, what's what's going to happen here? What's going on? And it's brilliant because even for people who know, even though I know what's going to happen, we got to see this for the first time. Do you remember we were live tweeting this at free Form.

It was the first time we got to see it, and we all cheered, and it finally happened, and we got to see how it was framed oncount because we watched the you know, the actual event happened over and over and over again, but we didn't know how it was going to be framed, what was going to happen, the music attention, We didn't know what was going to happen there, and that was the first time we got to see it, and we all, um, I would imagine

with you know, everyone watching the show all collectively cheered mm hmm. Well, and you always see things on camera, especially with Matt and Harry in the way that they played this relationship out. There's there's little moments in their eyes that you can't see you from across the room.

But even when Magnus comes in, when they when he locks eyes to Alec for the first time, there's almost a challenge that he kind of looks at Alec and goes, okay, I'm here, you're a move and and there's there's almost a whole conversation that happens between the cuts, and um, there's not a moment that happens with Clara and Jace way later in the series that we'll talk about that caught me off guard when I saw it back because I didn't even know we did it. But we'll talk

about that later, later, much later, much later. And I love that. I love how Maris to just energect. We got to talk about Maris in this moment, just the way she just interjects herself right in the middle of her son's relationship, of course, and Nicola does such a good job at it too. Simon's little speech, Ellen, is that what he says, Eline, that's it, Elane, his little speech there is my it's such a Simon thing, like

it's such a hymn thing to do. And then and this is also immediately makes it awkward by going and then they don't know what they're doing next, right, Yeah, like, thanks, we need to hear that. That's exactly how we feel. Thank you for telling everyone, and we get this. The end of this scene is sort of brought together and links into what's going to happen next Actually Jason accepting Lydia, You're always going to have a place here at the Institute,

which I liked that they put in. I liked that they gave us that like and I actually thought they were going to bring it back come season two and ended up not doing. But I liked that. Well, she got another job, which is oh, is that what happened? Yeah, she got her own show. She's so sorry, I gotta

go play soccer. Yeah. But but but something about the scene, as you mentioned earlier, are all the reactions, not only when the moment is happening, but then after, you know, even you see there's all the kids are happy, and everybody's doing and Isabel runs over and Clary's beaming and everything's going on. Clarie and Jays have a nice little moment where they get to reconcile and go, look, you know, we're in this together, so let's let's figure it out together,

because you're the only other person in this. But there's a there's a three shot of Hodge, Robert Lightwood and Marris's Lightwood at one point where you see Mariss fuming I mean, there might as well be steam coming out of her ears. Hodges trying to hide his smile because he's just you know, given the under under the brow thumbs up. And then you have poor Paulino as Robert, who just looks like he doesn't know what to do

with himself. He wants to be happy, but he knows his wife's gonna be mad, so he's just started avoiding every thing. And it's my favorite three shot because it's such disparate reactions altogether. Absolutely made me giggle. And what a kiss, by the way, kiss for the ages. Honestly,

what a kiss. Just brilliant. We move on from this sadly two A table full of magical shit, which I'm described script always playing with a dagger, table full of magical ship, which leads us to unfortunately the book is in the hands of Camille, is in the hands of mischievous, tricksy little mckeel, Camille mckille, Well mixed up there. That wasn't great mckeel. That's what I called her. That's how crazy she is. She's just all over the place. She's

all over the place. So we got to go find Camille. Well, we know where she is she's laughed in a coffin. Yeah, she's not going anywhere, unlikely to have else got her locked up. Yeah, but it's it's in her possession, so we got to go talk to her to figure out where it is leading to. Poor Lydia by hasn't even taken her hair down from the wedding. An unknown and unknown attacker comes at her from the dark like a coward and smacks her. Smacks her silly, but what but

why does that happen? Cat? Why would someone attack for Lydia the Mortal Cup? And who? Who would be so dastardly? But then it brings us to a really painful but touching scene that I remembered the scene, but I didn't remember the actual dialogue, and watching it back again, it's just a testament to our writers and how they thread

everything together and just create such lovely moments. Clary brings out the j C Box because it's something that she's hidden away, knowing that it's her brother's sort of putting away that part of the confusing, all the confusing news that's come out about her family, the fact that you know, oh yeah, I also have a sibling that died, so I thought now I'm now he's sitting around in front of me and knowing the pain of feeling abandoned by

your parents and feeling as though you were rejected by them, and Clary, knowing who Jocelyn is and having seen Jocelyn struggle her whole life, wants to give that almost as a gift to Jace and say, look, this is this is you. You were not forgotten. You were not the abandoned, rejected child that you always thought you were. Loved your whole life. I always thought it said j G on that box. If you look at it, looks like a G. John Nath stupid. But it's interesting to see the role

reverse this. Yeah, it's it's a little bit of a role reversal, but it is. It's interesting to see this. As you know, we've seen Jay's sort of shepherd Clary through this the whole time and bring her back to the ground when she's feeling lost and alone and abandoned, and we get to see Clary do that just even infantasmile for Jason this moment, even though it's a lot harder to touch that level of confusion. Yep, yep, yep. Um we end this episode, so then the Lightwood parents

come front. I remember, Yeah, we get angry Mum and slightly confused like from the previous times Dad, who's just a bit like I don't get it. But if you're happy whatever, then that's fine. I really like that. Again, that's such a real it's such a genuine like thing where like people of a different generation are like, you know what, I don't really understand, but also good for you.

I'm all right with it, And I love that. That was one of the I really loved that moment, and Paulino did such a good job at just being like this sort of behind the times dad, I thought was such a wonderful thing. That was really great and also a really nice moment for Alec to be like Earli, They've got my dad for now, at least I've got my dad. Yeah, I've got my dad. I've got my

sister and it's it's it's not. Something that I love about our show as well, is that they don't shy away from the difficult sides of these controversies and the difficult sides of these situations. And I think that's why so many people have connected to Magnus and alec story, because it was very real. You have you know Maris

who's saying some really really cutting things. Yeah, but we hear a lot of these kids talk about, you know, um, their experiences with coming out to their parents or whatever, and the Nicolo was their inspiration behind it because of the journey that Maris goes through, because of the lack of understanding initially, that grows into an understanding that gave these kids the courage to do, um, what they needed to do, which is really fantastic. It's a really wonderful

thing to hear. This leads us to finding out who our dastardly villain is justly the rat, the more old heartbreaking. Oh my god, and this is what this is. I think what drives Jace over the edge is that our friend, our mentor our teacher, the one person that we thought we could trust with anything, is a traitor, is an absolute traitor. I Hodge furious, absolutely furious Hodge, Why you bastard, you bastard? How could you? One book tidbit um that we actually changed is that what is Hodges using to

communicate with Valentine the ring that he twists. It's a sely ring that is used as a two way communication device. There are two rings that exist, and if you twist it one way, it's um done. And it's actually used by Simon and Clary in the books when Clary is with Evil j when Team Evil is happening and Clary's off and Clary is in her own mind, she has the ring and Simon has the other one, and that's

how they communicate. But so I end up having that in this because because we changed Team Evil, we never used that. Yes we did. Did you have the ring? I do? Oh? He did. Okay, that's the whole giveaway. That was the whole thing. In the seat, in the bone chandelier is the is the ring on my finger? Like I have to focus to keep it hidden? But yeah, I end up using it anyway for another day for now. Thank you so much for joining us on this wonderful episode.

Malick meant so much turn to all of us from the Shadow into this team, and I know meant so much to so many of you out there as well. So thank you for for coming along with us and allowing us to to revisit the wonderful birth of this relationship. It's so true and obviously you know dom you and I love what we do for a living, and we get a chance to tell these stories and do all

these wonderful things. But when you have a moment in a story that has a greater benefit to a lot of people and and a real impact that people can connect to and it it it does some real good

in the world. And I think Malick did a lot of good for a lot of people and showed Matt and Harry and the writers and everyone did such good job at creating this example of a real, grounded but also healthy relationship between two people and and how that affects the people around them and the relationships around them. And you know, we've heard so many stories of how it's inspired people, and it's um. I'm just so grateful to have been a small, tangential part of telling that story.

And thank you to all of you for loving it as much as we did. Until next time, everybody out there, Thanks for coming with us. By Angels. Return to the Shadows is hosted and executive produced by me Dominic, Sherwood and Katherine McNamara. Our executive producer is Lingley. Our senior producers are Liz Hayes and Diego Tapia, and our producers

are Hannah Harris and Kristin Vermilion. Original music by Alex Kinzy performed by Alex Kinzy and kath from McNamara, and the episode was mixed by Seth A Landscape h