Hey there, everybody. Welcome out to another episode of Redeemed Through His Blood. This is Scott Durfey joined by the beautiful Debra Durfey. What's up, Deb? Hi, friends. How are you, babe? I'm so good. Good. How's the motorcycle accident healing up? Oh, I'm cured. I'm just waiting for my motorcycle to be healed now. You know what I think is kind of funny about that? I think it's funny how many people at church
thought you wrecked a bicycle. Well, and the ones that are listening to the podcast are finding out the dirty truth. Yeah, exactly. That got revealed, I understand. At ward council. Ward council yesterday. I know, Tim told on me. Shame on you, Tim. Tim's got the intel, that's right. We love Tim. Indeed, indeed. Great week at Institute this past week. We talked a lot about really important stuff, talked about faith. We're going to be talking about that here tonight. Oh, I
love those kids. Aren't they awesome? They are beyond amazing. Literally such good kids. Yeah. You know what, Deb? We've been doing that Institute thing for a while. a few years, four or five years now. We started on Zoom. But it's so cool when we get, like we did today, we get these little wedding invitations. They're just so special. Taylor's getting married and he was one of our early students a few years ago and came several semesters. So many do. So many keep coming back
and we still have a number that do. Man, so happy for him and the many others. I tell some of those kids, I want to put you in my back pocket and take you home. I wish they'd let you. I love them. They just are so pure. They're so good. And they're so amazing. They strengthen me. And they've got the world in front of them. They're not without their challenges. They're not without their roadblocks. They're not without their weapons of rebellion, as we've spoken. spoke of and they
do it a lot more gracefully or something. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know either. But, you know, they're definitely prepared. And, you know, I like to think that through study in the gospel, especially the atonement of Jesus Christ, we become even more prepared. You know, the first so this will be episode eight already. The first seven episodes. But by the way, I kind of made a mistake. I put in social media that episode eight had already been released and it hadn't.
That was episode seven. Oh, I know. I got called out on it. Did you really? By Diane, my sister. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, she said. Good job, Diane. I know, right? Keep him honest. Which brings me to another thing. I'll come back to what I was about to say. I made a little bit all over the place right now. But for those of you who don't know, we do do a little bit of social media. We're trying to ramp that up. Our social media guy really is terrible at it. Rude.
That would be me. I know, but that's still rude. I wish we could find somebody that was willing to work for zero dollars an hour to kind of help promote it, Dub, but... I'm not that person. I just don't see that. I know you're not. I guess I have to be, so... Don't complain about the quality, sweetheart. Anyway, I didn't I know you wouldn't. Anyway, we do have that out there. So, you know, go out there like it, pass it around, send it to your friends. We'd like to get those.
So many people are being benefited by the topic, by the by the things that we talk about. And we're getting still a lot of great emails from people who are saying, Scott and Deb, thanks for being so open and vulnerable and transparent about your. crazy jacked up lives. They don't really say it that way. But but but but I think there's a lot of appreciation. You know, when we gather together to heal together, the spirit of God works within us collectively and individually
and in every other way. And I love that. And that's really what keeps us going for me. You know, I many years ago, 20 little over 26 years ago, I was I was I don't know, we call it rock bottom, right? We had, I had so much rotten stuff going on because of the path that I had chosen to put my life on and it was just difficult.
But I but I had a testimony. And when I had this, well, all this stuff is going on, even though I had a testimony that I couldn't get, I couldn't get healing, I couldn't get the spirit in my life to help offset all of the things that I felt like I had to drink over or use drugs over or, you know, whatever else. And I know there's others out there who can relate to that. And it can be any addiction or anything that we sometimes use to just change the way I feel. But it was
difficult for me. You know, I knew I had a problem. I knew that I couldn't fix my problem. And I kind of knew that Heavenly Father could fix my problem, but I just didn't know if he would. I think one of the things that made me think of that was whatever, you know, we do this podcast because of the way our lives have been impacted by the atonement of Jesus Christ. And I remember a couple weeks ago when we were teaching at Institute and there was a saying that whatever Jesus touches
lives. And I think about how grateful I am to be able to testify of Jesus Christ. I just love the fact that whatever He touches lives. I mean, look at the plants, look at our lives, look at our children, everything around us is just living. I love that, that our goal here is to touch, just give a little Jesus to everyone. Just that little. It's really true. It's like my dear sweet sister Beck says, we all need a little more Jesus. More Jesus. Yeah, well what does that mean? Well,
for me, it is a myriad of things. because I, you know, I mean, I love President Holland's talk on how when he was in his coma and then he came back and how he needed to pray more earnestly and testify. I have really put that in the fleshy tables of my heart. And I'm like, do I really pray fervently? Do I, do I testify at every opportunity that I can? You know, it's one of those things that I've really been able to self -reflect.
And I think as we move into our topic tonight on faith, faith is a huge piece for me of knowing that not only knowing that God can do it, but that He will do it. the divine gift of forgiveness in chapter nine. There is a quote in there that says, faith is not simply to know that God could do something. Let me start again. It says, faith is not simply to know God could do something. Faith is to know He will. And that has been super powerful for me as well. that how important faith
really is. Do I trust in God? Do I believe it or do I know it? Do I really, really trust that he will? Yeah, you know what that reminds me of in Alcoholics Anonymous. You know, you just said something about... I know that God could, but I don't know... That He will. That He will, right? That's from the book, from Elder Anderson's book, The Divine Gift of Forgiveness, actually. That's right in there. But there's another book that that's in, you know, in the big book of
Alcoholics Anonymous. It's often said, and this is one of the things that, you know, we often talk about in Alcoholics Anonymous, is that God could and would... if he were sought, right? That God could what? Relieve us from alcoholism, relieve us from all of the things, you know, essentially all of the effects of the fall, which show up big time in alcoholism, but that God could and would. I always believed that God could. I always believed he could, but I never believed
he would, not for me. Why would he for me? I had disgraced him. I had broken covenants. I had done all of the things wrong. Those black marks in heaven. Exactly. Yeah, exactly. But you know what, so where I gained my faith, and you know, when we talk about faith, I think it's important that we kind of put some context around what really is faith. You know, we read in the Hebrews 11 at one, it says, now faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence
of things not seen. So of course, I hope for this faith, but I don't, it's something that I don't, I have evidence, but I don't see it. And where this really came to fruition for me, Deb, was when I entered the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous in 1998. October 26, when I walked in there, that's when my real faith journey began. And I say faith journey began because I was at a point, it talks about it in the big book that we're at a turning point. And I was at that turning
point. I was at that jumping off point. It was one way or it was the other way for me. And I had to go the one way. And in order for me to go that one way, I needed to establish a relationship. A relationship with a higher power, a relationship with God. You know it's interesting that it makes me think of the articles of faith that we learn in primary. And the fourth article of faith is we believe in the first principles and ordinances
of the gospel. The first principles and ordinances of the gospel are first faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. then second repentance, third baptism by immersion for the remission of sin and fourth laying on the hands of the gift of Holy Ghost. But I think it's so interesting that the first principle and ordinance of the gospel, and we learned that when we were so little, I had a complete misunderstanding of faith. I think faith
for me was a belief, not a knowing. And so for a long time, I think my my idea of what faith was, was literally just, like the scripture says, hope for things. Just hoping. Yeah. Hoping. I have faith it'll work. I have faith that, you know, but then there's other things that I have a sure knowledge of, you know, of faith. It's like, I know that the sun is going to come up tomorrow. I mean, there's that. you know, type of faith. And I know that God lives. I know He
is aware and I know He knows my name. And I know that Jesus is my brother. So it's that when that faith becomes that action and it becomes that knowing, it's no longer hope for, but it's that knowledge that I think. And I would say that principle and ordinance turns that faith into knowledge. But why do I care? Why do I even need faith? And I think that this is, for me, where kind of the rubber hits the road on this topic,
is why do I even need faith? I mean, I'm not refuting that I do, but this is just the way my brain works. I need to understand why it's important that I do. Well, this isn't hard for me to understand why I need faith. This is all about a relationship for me. You know, faith in Jesus Christ is about my relationship with
Jesus Christ. I love, in the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous, in chapter five and how it works, it talks about how I... how Scott Durfee and maybe many other alcoholics across the world and humans maybe come by gaining our faith or why it becomes necessary. In the very beginning it says rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program.
So that's the first step is I have to completely give myself to this idea, to this this healing to this program of redemption. So do you call that faith? Well, let me finish. I'm getting there because I kind of do. And then it goes on and on and on and talks about how there are those who cannot and will or will not. And then it says that they're usually those who they are naturally incapable. of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty.
So first of all, I have to give myself to the program, to the idea. Second of all, I have to be completely honest about it. I have to be honest about what I can bring. I have to be honest about what I'm lacking in terms of my faith, in terms of my relationship with deity. Okay, in AA we say with higher power. And then it goes on and on. Our stories disclose in a general way what we used to be like, what happened, what we are
like now. If you've decided that you want what we have, and here's the third, or rather the fourth part, and are willing to go to any length to get it. So I have to be willing to go to any length. in order to gain the kind of faith that I say I want my life to offset all of the effects of the fall, including to help me through the repentance process, then I have to be willing to go to any length. And then it goes on and we beg of you to be fearless and thorough. That's
the fifth thing. I have to be fearless and I have to be thorough. That can be difficult. That can be difficult. We just listened to a talk yesterday about the second temptation. Right about hide right and that can be so difficult as being being being fearless and thorough and then and then finally It goes on and it says some of us tried to hold on to our old ideas and the result was Neil until we let go Absolutely.
So sometimes for me in order for me to enter into that faith I'm gonna call it faith space. I have to be willing to let go absolutely, of everything else that I feel like's fulfilling me or that's distracting me or changing the way I feel, all of the effects of the fall of Adam and Eve, including sin. The weapons and the rebellions. Yeah, all that. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Well, we also have to know that in order for us to have faith, that's the way that we enable repentance
and forgiveness. If we do not have faith, and in my podcast that we interviewed, I didn't realize that's what I was doing. I didn't realize that I, because I too thought that I could not be forgiven. I went through the process. There's probably those that haven't heard that. Give us just a 30 second synopsis of what you're talking about. My belief system at that time, I was 17 years old, graduated from high school, pregnant, and I knew that I had displeased the Lord and
I knew that I had displeased my family. I knew that I had broke every law or anything that I had been taught as a primary kid, a youth, and as... You know, I went through the checkbox of going to the bishop and telling the bishop and that wasn't a huge success at first. And I, I think it, for me, it was, um, yeah, I've messed up too bad. I it's. I did all the checkbox stuff so I should feel better. But what I didn't know at that time was that I really didn't have the
faith that God could make this better. I was in a predicament. I mean, when you're 17 years old and you're pregnant with a baby and you know that you cannot take care of this baby, I was still in high school. I graduated from high school at 17. when I had this decision in front of me,
I literally, I couldn't ask my mom, my dad. I mean, I went to, you know, some support groups and talked about, um, I mean, we, when, when I went to with a support group and I would see other girls that were single and, and pregnant, I saw some that kept their baby. I saw some that placed a baby for adoption and I had to make this decision. I mean, that's a really big decision. I have a little life that I'm bringing into the planet. At 17 years old. And I knew that I could
not be her mother. Well, and honestly, I'm going to probably cry because I knew she deserved a dad. Sorry. And I couldn't give her a dad like I had. And so I sought for um, looked into placing her for adoption and I wanted her to have a mom and a dad that loved and adored her like I did. And so that's, that's the piece that I just thought, okay, I have faith that God can take this baby and put her where she belongs. I had no clue
where she, where she was to go. And the interesting thing is I knew he would place her where she needed to be. In fact, there's another interesting story that goes with that, but I knew that God would put her where she needed to be, but I didn't know God would put me where I needed to be. Because I had messed up. That baby was innocent. I wasn't. I had made choices that got me into this predicament. And so it was hard for me to believe that God
made my sins as white as snow. And so it was an interesting process that I went through for decades. And I'll tell you why is because 18 months after I had that baby and placed her for adoption and I knew that she was, it was such a, a heaven. I mean, God's hand was huge into placing that baby. And within 18 months, I am pregnant again and getting ready to have a baby
with another man. And I, I honestly think the main reason why I got in that same predicament is like, because I truly believed I was ruined, I was damaged, I was not really forgiven. I did not have faith unto repentance. I really didn't. I mean, I knew God could put that baby where she belonged, but I didn't think he could put me where I was or where I belonged. And so it
took me decades to figure all of that out. So now that I have that faith to understand, And to know that, and I think that's why I openly share this story so often, because I see my same story numerous times and in numerous ways. I mean, I've talked to young women that have had babies and kept them. I've talked to women that have had abortions. I have talked to women that have had babies and place them and kept them. And so it's like, just know that it's not, not
all is lost. And there is hope. You felt that way, didn't you? Like all was lost, I mean. Yeah, because I was damaged. I mean, and I had the physical part of me damaged. You know, I had stretch marks and I had an incision because I had a C -section. And so I had the physical reminders as well as the accuser reminders saying, you're not, you're not. virtuous. You're not pure. You're
not clean. Even though I had gone through the repentance process, I did not have faith that he could heal me to that degree until decades later. My experience is, although it's completely different, it's pretty much exactly the same. In that, I go on a mission. I come home off my mission. I had done all these bad things before my mission in terms of drinking and everything like that. And then I come home off my mission and I start drinking again. Did you repent before
you went on your mission? Well, that's a tricky question, because this whole podcast is on repentance. And I didn't understand, I don't think repentance to the best of your ability, though. Yeah, yeah, I did. Yeah, that's what I was saying. Yeah, I really I really did. I mean, you probably went through the repentance process after your first baby to the best way I knew how. Yeah, exactly. The best way I. OK, the best way I chose how I think I was always looking for a shortcut,
though. Personally, I'm not I know you weren't but personally I think I was always looking for a shortcut I come home off my mission I hanging out with buddies again that I used to do bad stuff with and before you know it my conversion Obviously had not been solid enough because I'm back doing those kinds of things and I knew that
I had made Heavenly Father mad. I knew that I was a hypocrite, I knew that, and all this stuff, you know, I'd lived a double life, I had been living a double life, and I knew that he was just mad at me. I did not believe, I knew that he could, but I didn't think he would for me, Deb. God couldn't would if he were son. I didn't think he would for me. Yeah, because you knew
better. So what changed for you? I think for me, honestly, I, I think when you and I went to talk to our Bishop and we had, I, we had just regurgitated and talked about this is, this is where we're at. This is what we've done. And I felt light. I just, I was like, I've got to clean this up once and for all. And I think at that point, well, I did, that's when I read the miracle of forgiveness. I listened to it and
read it and highlighted it along. And I really, I just thought, yeah, it was confirmed that I'm pretty bad. I knew that I was not going to make it to the celestial kingdom for sure. But it wasn't until we started teaching the divine gift of forgiveness and that I really studied the atonement of Jesus Christ because what I learned is that I needed to unlearn a lot of things that I thought were true. And one of those main things is that I'm not broken and God was not mad at
me. And this was part of my journey in learning and growing. And I think that's why I am so open with my story is so that not another human goes through that pain and grief and that broken feeling that I carried for decades, which was so unnecessary. And so to understand that we're in a fallen state, And we are here to learn and grow. And I think that's why I always tell my kids now, when they have a bad experience, I'm like, the only thing worse than having a bad experience is not learning
from it. And I felt like I didn't learn from it because I did it again. And so my question to myself as well as my kids is, did you learn something? And I finally was able to say, you know what? I have learned. I have learned through years of study and prayer and like communion, like literally understanding my savior and his sacrifice for me. I think I finally am getting a grasp on the atonement of Jesus Christ and
what he has done for me. And just me. I mean, that's the biggest piece that I, you know, I remember hearing people saying, if you were the only person on the planet, he would still do it for you. And I really had to wrap my head around that because I was like, no, we would not. Like I wanted to argue it. Yeah. I don't know. For me, I think If I were to ask myself that same question, so what changed what what what facilitated rather a change in my heart
or my behavior and my attitude. And I thought about this before. In fact, I think that David and I talked about this in a podcast a year or so maybe two ago. But for me, Deb, it was the gift of kind of a weird gift. But we call it the gift of desperation. My life had come crashing down. I mean, there were still places where it could crash more. That's not the goal here though, right? I had done a fine enough job crashing it down without setting that goal. I mean, it
was bad. I mean, it was terrible. I had been divorced more than once. I had financial troubles all over the place. I was living a double life. It was just crashing down for me. And I knew, I believed in Heavenly Father. I said this before, I don't remember a time when I didn't have a testimony that wasn't the issue for me. Conversion was the issue for me. I had not allowed Jesus into my heart to change me permanently so that
I could maintain on that path. And that gift of desperation, I went crawling into a... place that I had heretofore judged, you know, Alcoholics Anonymous. I thought that was for homeless people who lived under bridges and, you know, people with needle tracks in their arms and, you know, and things like that. What I didn't realize is that place would be where I met really a true God for me. Because that's where I saw, that's
where I saw my desperation. And I saw him seeing my desperation and I saw him being willing to help me through that. You know, we've talked about the first three steps in Alcoholics Anonymous. Powerless over alcohol. My life's unmanageable. Came to believe that a power greater than myself could restore me to sanity and three made a decision to turn my will and my life over to him. That's
about a relationship with deity. And once I established that relationship with deity, Deb, it was easier for me to trust in a loving Heavenly Father and His Son through the Holy Ghost to redeem all that had been broken, all that had been lost, all that had been everything, right? So, I mean, that's kind of how that was for me as well. It reminds me of the story of Alma and Amulek. Alma 10, six, when Amulek says, I knew concerning
these things, yet I would not know. And I think that, you know, we grow up knowing what we're supposed to do, but for me, it was not really knowing. Like, I knew in my head, but I didn't know in my heart. And I think until my head and my heart, I think it was one of those things that it's like, I know I'm not supposed to do this. I know that I am supposed to do this. I know that I should be doing this or whatever. But until that heart is converted, broken, open
enough for him to change my heart. I think that's the piece that really I just allowed him to change me. And I think that's where, you know, Alma and Amulek, well, Amulek was also. Well, you know, and you started there Alma 10 .6. I'm going to read five. Nevertheless, after all this, I never have known much of the ways of the Lord. So Amulek's just introducing himself to us, right?
Yeah. Talking about his family and reputation of those around him, etc. And nevertheless, after all this, never have known much of the ways of the Lord and his mysteries and marvelous Then there's a period and he pauses. Then he says, I said, never had I know much of these things, but behold, I mistake. In other words, he caught himself. He's like, yeah, well. I didn't know.
Maybe that's not so true after all. I make a mistake, for I have seen much of his mysteries and his marvelous power, yea, even in the preservation of the lives of his people. And then that's where it says. I did harden my heart for I was called many times, but I would not hear, therefore I knew concerning these things, yet I would not know. Have you ever would not know? Yeah, I just told you about a polite time I would not know. I mean I knew, but I didn't know. I don't mean
that to you. I mean that to our listeners. So what is there in our lives that we would not know? Well, it's just like our favorite sin. We know we shouldn't be doing or saying or believing or whatever, thinking. Well, you know, and we know that Heavenly Father sends us challenges sometimes. We know that He sends us challenges through our children or through the births of our children or through physical challenges or
through all of these other things. And if we know and know, then we can have those things consecrated for our good. But if we know, yet would not know, does that make sense? Am I making any sense? Yeah, I think of that, that it's a quote that says, no N -O God, or K -N -O -W God. No God or no God. And I think that's the piece that faith really plays a huge part in, is really knowing that Not just knowing, but well, knowing.
Sounds redundant, but... And there's some more stuff in Alma I want to talk about when it comes to faith. But I think before we do that, I think we should spend just a tiny bit of time maybe just kind of talking about faith in the general. Then I want to come back to this experiences that Alma and Amulek are having and are going to teach us. But I have a little book here, Deb. The name of this book is called Lectures on Faith. I recommend ever anybody get a hold of this.
There's seven lectures. in each one of these lectures, and these lectures were done at the School of the Prophets in Kirtland, Ohio. At one point, they were part of the Doctrine and Covenants. They were later removed as part of the Doctrine and Covenants. But there's some really great, important things in here, and there's three main points, and if we can remember these three main points, babe, I think that they can
really help us to establish faith. So the first one is we need to have a belief or know that God exists. And then the second thing is we really need to understand the character, attributes, and perfections of God. You know, I had an advantage, I just have to say that, because I had a pretty amazing earthly father that, and I know I'm unique that way. I know for a fact I am. So for me to have an understanding of a loving, nurturing, father in heaven was not a difficult task for
me. My difficult, honestly, if I'm gonna be really transparent, it was more difficult for me to have a relationship with Jesus Christ because I had never seen a perfect brother. I have six of them. And I knew God was there. I knew God was, he had my back. I knew he loved me no matter what. Now, On the other hand, having a relationship with Jesus Christ, he was untouchable to me because I didn't know what a perfect brother looked like. No offense to my brothers because I think they're
pretty amazing. It was very different for me to understand and and then we also to me this is how I understood it you don't pray to Jesus you don't have have a relationship so I didn't know how to have a relationship with Jesus Christ. I didn't really have an understanding of what
that would look like. Well, what if our faith in Jesus Christ, and I know you're all good with this now, but what if our faith in Jesus Christ, and this is to our listeners, so what if that's the case, but our faith in Jesus Christ and our relationship in Jesus Christ should be with him through the Holy Ghost and because of and through the blessings that come through his atonement, right? It's a relationship with his atonement,
which is a gift from God as well. Knowing that he exists knowing the character attributes and perfections of God and then three And this is really the one this third one is the one that kind of puts the key and turns the key for me I need to know that the course that I'm on is pleasing to God If I can know those things then faith grows into that faith that we were talking about that faith of power as a matter and and You know, faith has so many different levels.
So many different levels. And I had no idea as a young, I had no clue what all of that meant. Yeah, I mean, there's just general faith, and there's faith in Jesus Christ, like we've talked about, and then Alma, I mean, excuse me, Amulek introduces us into an even additional faith, which it begins to really get us into this faith of power, Deb, in Alma chapter, 34, 15 through 17. Well, there you go. You're welcome. I wrote it down. It's not in my brain. Okay. It's faith
unto repentance. I love this chapter. This whole chapter is so... important about our relationship with Jesus, our relationship with his atonement, about his role in our salvation. Unless it talks about how unless an atonement is made, all mankind should perish. Do you want me to just read it? Yeah, go ahead. Okay, Alma 3415, and thus he shall bring salvation to all those who shall
believe on his name. This being the intent of this last sacrifice to bring about the bowels of mercy, which overpowereth justice and bringeth about the means unto men that they may have faith unto repentance. Okay, let's just stop right there for just a second. There's a couple of keys in here. 15. He shall bring salvation unto all those who shall believe on his name, Deb. Yeah, I have that highlighted. What does that mean? When we believe on his name. I mean, later
we're gonna talk about another faith. When we take upon his name. Which is faith in his name. Yeah. And we know that when we take his name upon us, that's when we enter into a covenant relationship, right? Yep. Okay. Alright, 10, I mean 16 rather. 34, 16. And thus mercy can satisfy the demands of justice and encircles them in the arms of safety while he that exercises no faith unto repentance is exposed to the whole law of the demands of justice. Let me just say
out right there. Therefore, only unto him that has faith unto repentance, there it is again, is brought about the great and eternal plan of redemption. And then in 17 it says, therefore, may God grant unto you, my brethren, that ye may begin to exercise your, again, faith unto repentance, that ye may, that ye begin to call upon his holy name, that he would have mercy upon you. Heaven only knows we all want mercy
upon us. And then I think, and we hadn't talked about this, sweetie, but I think in 18 and several verses thereafter, it really gives us an opportunity, perhaps, or a pattern. in which maybe we can gain some of this faith, right? Cry unto him for mercy, for he's mighty to save. Yea, humble yourselves and continue in prayer unto him. Cry unto him when you're in your fields. Cry over all your flocks. Cry unto him in your houses. And it just goes on and on and on. And it's interesting
that it doesn't say, say your prayers. The adjective here is cry unto Him. That seems to have a, that's a word of energy, has some energy behind it. It's more than just kneeling down and saying my prayers. This is really pouring my soul out. Crying. unto Him, so that I can have that faith unto repentance. Now, what is faith unto repentance? Let's talk about that for a second. What's faith
unto repentance, Deb? Well, I think, again, back to the divine gift of forgiveness where it says faith is not simply to know God could do something. Faith is to know He will. So I think faith unto repentance means exactly what I didn't believe is that I have faith that repentance will work and I will be forgiven. I mean, knowing faith, not hoping for it, but knowing. I love too, after it's done telling us to cry and cry and cry and pray and pray and pray and all of that, down
in 31, about halfway through 31. Talks about what will happen if we gain this faith unto repentance and we put repentance into practice, into our lives. Now let's just do this for a second. We're gonna come back to repentance in a few more podcasts down the road, maybe 11 or 12. We're on eight now, so maybe three or four down the road we'll actually be talking about repentance proper. But when we talk about the word repentance, Deb, how would you describe the word repent in a sentence?
To change, to turn away from those things that take us away from God. To turn to Jesus? Absolutely, turn to Jesus Christ. Yeah, to turn to Jesus Christ, right? So it's just about turning to Him. So we can use this word repent as it relates to our sins. We can use the word repent as it relates to any of the effects of the fall of Adam and Eve that we're feeling in our lives. Weapons of rebellion, depressions, anxieties, any of those things that we've talked about in
the past. If you will repent and harden not your hearts, immediately shall the great plan of redemption be brought about unto you. Immediately shall the great plan of redemption be brought about unto you. What does that mean? What's a great plan of redemption, and how does that look when it gets brought about unto us, Deb? Well, we're redeemed. Yeah, we're purchased. We're redeemed. He's covered us, right? Just another word for the atonement of Jesus Christ. He's covered us,
kefar, we sometimes say. Well, so I think that, you know, Amulek is a fantastic example of faith. You know, we have Alma 32, we have Alma 33, and Alma 34. Alma 32, the whole thing is about faith, really. One of the things I really love about Amulek, rather, is that when Amulek was teaching the people in 15 through 18, when he was teaching the people, he was about to call them to repentance. But before he called them to repentance, he taught
them about faith in Jesus Christ. Why is it important for us to understand faith in Jesus Christ before we get into repentance? Well, he's the one that purchased us. He's the one that sacrificed for us. And I think that's important for us to know that the Atonement has nothing without Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is the power behind the Atonement. And understanding that His power, His love for us, just understanding Him, knowing Him and knowing that He loves me gives me the
ability to trust Him. that he will redeem me, that he will pay for my sins, that he will offset through his atonement, through the blessings of his atonement, that he will offset the effects of the fall of Adam and Eve. And it's important that we know that. Before we can really begin a repentance process, we really have to know that he can and he will, just like we've been
talking about. Yeah, yeah. I think it's important to remember in Alma 32, in 27, where it says, but behold, if you awake and arouse your faculties even to an experiment upon my words and exercise a particle of faith. What's a particle of faith? Ye even if ye can know more than desire to believe. Let this desire work in you even until you believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my words. part right there is so powerful
in just asking for a desire to believe. If you don't have the faith, if you don't have, just ask for the desire to believe. Well, now you're really, what you're really talking about now is how can I increase my faith in Christ, right? Yes, absolutely. I mean, we talked about crying out. Of course, that can help us. So do that one more time. Talk about that. Say that whole thing one more time. And listeners, just remember that what we're talking about right now is how
can I increase my faith? in Jesus. Well I'm gonna back up into Alma 32 26 and 27 if that's okay. Now as I said concerning faith that it was not a perfect knowledge even so it is with my words you cannot know of their surety at first unto perfection any more than faith is a perfect knowledge. Now into 27 but behold if you will awake arouse your faculties even to an experiment upon my words and exercise a particle of faith." You know, we hear a lot about a seed. This is just
a particle of faith. Ye even if ye can know more than desire to believe, let this desire work in you even until ye believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my word. So I mean just having a desire to believe. Because I know it's not easy. I know for a fact it is not easy. In 28, now we will compare the word unto a seed. Now if you give place that, if ye give place, that seed may be planted in your heart. Behold, and it can't be a hard heart,
just for the record. Behold. Yeah, behold, if it is a true seed, a good seed, if you do not cast it out by your unbelief, that you will resist the Spirit of the Lord, behold, it will begin to swell within your breasts. And when you feel these swelling motions, you will begin to say within yourself, within yourselves. It must needs be that there is a good seed or that the word is good. For it beginneth to enlarge my soul. Yea, it beginneth to enlighten my understanding.
Yea, it beginneth to be delicious to me." I have to push pause here for a second because understanding faith understanding Jesus Christ's atonement this is where we start to see miracles when we have a desire to plant a seed and we start to enlarge and we start to swell and we start to enlighten we literally I I'm going to say I not we I get to witness those miracles. I get to see the change of heart. I get to see the literal hand of God in my life. And does that increase
faith? Absolutely. And does that faith become powerful and more powerful and more powerful the deeper and more you have? And that's why I testify is because of those little moments where I'm feeling so helpless and so hopeless and I have gone too far. And then when I look up and just go, just a tiny desire, get me out of this hole, get me out of this pit. And then just pleading and crying out and saying, help
me, please lift me. And knowing and seeing that he does literally because I kept my thought was I can't stay here. I am, I'm stuck. And I think that's the piece that the last one it says, enlighten my understanding yet it beginneth to be delicious to me. That's where we literally find our joy in that deliciousness of the growth of the seed and seeing the enlargement and the enlightenment and those miracles that come by that desire.
that desire to believe. I love all that. And then there are two more verses in that chapter that I kind of want to read. Number 32. So we're going to be in 41 and 42 here. But if you will nourish the word, yea, nourish the tree as it beginneth to grow by your faith with great diligence and with patience. looking forward to the fruit thereof, it shall take root and behold it shall be a tree springing up unto everlasting life.
and because of your diligence and your faith and your patience and with the word in nourishing it that it may take root in you behold by and by you shall pluck the fruit thereof which is most precious which is sweet above all that is sweet which is white above all that is white yea and pure above all that is pure and you shall feast upon this fruit even until you are filled and you hunger not neither shall you thirst.
I have a note in here that nourish means sustain, support, endure, and in the Hebrew language it means contain. I love that. Contain, that's interesting. Sustain, support, endure, and contain. I love
that. Well, you know faith's a big topic and you know, we just don't haven't had enough time probably to really get into all the ins and outs of it There's a lot of great stuff on faith faith in faith in Jesus Christ faith under repentance faith in the name of Jesus Christ faith is about a relationship establishing developing and maintaining a loving relationship with deity and that and our faith in deity comes as we Spend time getting to know him as we learn to love him deeper and
as we strive to Be perfected or be completed or converted through him all of these things come into our life Deb so that we can begin to fill the divine gift of healing and the divine gift of forgiveness in our life. Divine gift of healing from all the effects of fallen and the divine gift of forgiveness from our sins so that we can repent and fill the spirit of our Heavenly Father at work in our lives giving
us joy and happiness. I think it's important for us to well for me to remember also I don't remember which talk it was in general conference that they talked about. Are we giving deity, our best self or our leftover self? You know, are we giving him the first breath of, you know, our day or are we giving him our exhausted breath, you know, or our tire breath even from staying up too late, whatever. But I've thought about that a lot and I'm like, am I giving my best
self to him? Because he's given his best self to me. I just have another quote from the Divine Gift of Forgiveness in chapter 9, page 102. Faith is something that grows and as it grows you receive heavenly gifts, power, and the ability to do what you could not do without it. And that's basically what we've been talking about is we cannot do it without it. There's no way. We're not meant to do it without it. No, and he can,
and I'll let him. And I need to let him. Well, as we just kind of close out today, we just want to say that wherever you are and however you're feeling, you're welcome here. You know, Jesus isn't just waiting for you to clean everything up before you come to him. He meets us right in the middle of our mess. That's where his grace shines the brightest. So come as you are, broken, hopeful, questioning, searching. You're definitely not alone. And remember, we'd love to stay connected
with you. So if you have any thoughts, questions or stories you'd like to share with us, please just send us an email. You can do that at he redeems us at gmail .com. He redeems us at gmail .com. We read everyone. We try to respond to everyone. And those where it's appropriate, we'll share on the podcast as well. And if this episode touched your heart or any others, we hope that you'll share it with someone you love and care about, a friend, a family member, anyone who
could use a little more hope right now. Next week, we're gonna talk more about the Savior, how he doesn't just redeem us, he heals us, he lifts us, he transforms us, he converts us, he helps us develop faith, he helps us to see our way through difficulties in life, and he does it in our everyday lives. Thanks for being with us. And remember there is always, always, always, always hope through him because you have been redeemed and I have been redeemed through his
blood. Thanks for being with us everybody. We'll see you next time.