Our Unique Union (Part 2)

through every emotion. There was a period where Mommy woke up and cried forty five days straight, and one day our marriage came crashing down. I was failing miserably. I can't do this like this anymore. We came to the realization that we had to redefine our relationship. This is our journey to finding unconditional love. We're back at the Red Table with Will because episode one was not enough, so we're going to continue the conversation. Where was your

hardest time in our marriage? I think the turning point in our relationship for me happened when I turned forty. That's when I had a midlife crisis. Yeah, your forty birthday was my low point. The day after her thirty seventh birthday, I hired a team to orchestrate her fortieth birthday. I had hired a documentary team. I traced Mommy's family roots. Her fortieth birthday was gonna be my thing. It was gonna be a splash Mary J. Blige. Mary J. Blige

performed that debuted the film all of that. It was going to be the thing that lifted her out of this midlife crisis. And she was gonna be my deepest, most beautiful proclamation of love. And we did it. And I had found tapes of Jada's grandmother, and her grandmother had recorded these voice messages over the last like eight months of her life, and it was tapes that Jada had never heard. So Jada had to sit there and listen.

I understand thoroughly now at the time I didn't. But she's listening to these never before her tapes of one of the dearest people she's ever known in her life, in front of all of these people. So she's holding it together, she's getting it together. Then I had Mary J. Blige performing the whole time. I'm like the little boy that wants Mommy to say everything was wonderful. Right, and

she's having a really difficult emotional time. And then when we got back to the room, it was me, you and mommy and we were talking about the next day and they were things playing for the next day, and she said, I'm not sure I want to do anything the next day. You can just cancel it. And I said, well we can. Let's keep it and then tomorrow you can decide. She was like, I'm telling you now, I don't want to do anything tomorrow. And I was like, well,

it's okay, it's okay, we'll just wait and see. I just wanted to have intimate, just intimate time. And I was like, well, I'll cancel. To mar she was like, it's my birthday, right, And she's told me that the party was the most ridiculous display of my ego. Crushed, right, And to this day I know I was crushed because it was true. It wasn't a party for her. And when she called me on that, that's when I snapped.

And I'm sorry. That was the only time you ever heard me snap, thank god, And I snapped in front of Willow. Was the only time in her childhood she ever saw me snap. And I saw her look and Willow Star was crying and I was like, baby, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Just figure it out, you guys, please just

figure it out. Just figure it out, right, And I was like, and this is that was a display that moment of like me having the courage to just say no, but now I had to have the courage to unravel it and just realizing this next forty I gotta do it my way. This next half has to be directed by my picture for myself. I have to say that when you guys were going through that transition, I was like,

what the hell right, because everything was just changing. Well yeah, but I didn't know there was a need for change. There was so much that wasn't me, that I was living so much inauthenticity. I do think that there're a lot more people living lives that aren't true then because of their fear. So I understand, and there's no judgment. I did it right, and with some of that which you felt like you had to present yourself to the public.

I was much more conscious of public perception than Jada. Right, there was an idea. I think I was trying to live up to an idea for him. Right, I got some pictures I was crying so hard after your birthday that my eyes were looked so red. I took pictures of myself and I was like, I want to remember this. That was a difficult one for me when you stopped clapping when I did things in the exterior world that were great. Willow really broke it for me with with my hair. In the middle of all the whip my

hair stuff. She was on tour and it was she was having it was a great show and everything was amazing. It was like it was we were at the top of the world. With my hair. It's blade jay Z side is beautiful. And she was like, Okay, I'm done, Daddy. That was like, sweetie, you can't. You can't be done. You know, you made a commitment. She was like, but I got I'm finished. I was like, I'm no, sweetie, but you can't be finished. You made a commitment to Mr jay Z. He's no, daddy, you made a commitment

to Mr jay Z. Yes. You were like, Daddy, it doesn't it doesn't matter that I'm done. Yes, sweetie, it matters a lot, it does, But you can't be done. She came down the next day and had shaved her head ball. I was like, does she know what she's doing? Like that was a deep protest. What it did from me is I had a crazy realization in that moment I was building what I wanted for her, and she tried all of the different ways to say I don't

want that. I was like, I get it. And I saw for the first time what Jada had been saying the whole time, about hiding behind my ego and my dream meams and my desires and pretending like it's love. And I realized she didn't want none of the stuff I had built. The house was too big, it was always too many people here. She didn't want to have to travel theway we traveled. She didn't want all of her kids to be getting trolled on Twitter like. She

didn't want any of that. And that's why I stopped clapping. There was a decline from there. To have to let go of the picture, to have to let go of the dream was devastating. We essentially had to destroy our marriage. She was like, I can't do this anymore, and to me, that was it was over. But she divorce was never

even an option. I was like, wait, a man, hold no, no, no, no, no, Like when people I was reading in the tabloids that we were getting divorced and all of that stuff, and it was like it was never didn't see the divorce lawyer was like, that was never. It was never even to consider mine, Like, but was it for you? Because I had been divorced before, I wasn't getting divorced again, right,

I wasn't like divorce wasn't an option. There was a time when I was scared that she might know I'm gonna tell you like this, I put in too much period. What is most important to me is my family. You would think about the kids. I was thinking about our family, not even just our immediate nucleus, but we have such a huge extended family. And I knew that divorce wasn't necessary. Why do that? Why create all that disruption? I told Will from the gate, I said, let me tell you something.

If you marry me, know this, We're going to be together. We're gonna be under the same roof. You might be on one end of that joker with somebody else, with somebody else, And I always said that it's ridiculous. We're gonna be yeah, in this joke together. That's what we are gonna do. That's not what either of us wants. But I don't want to leave this table making people

feel like divorce is wrong. Sometimes that is what you need, right for whatever you need to discover about your situation yourself. But for me personally, I knew that there was no reason that he and I whatever, We just needed to get to agreement between he and I. I was devastated, even worse than a divorce. We we broke up within our marriage and got back together again. I had to rebuild. I had to rebuild with new rules and something way different,

something way completely different. The thing about it is that you really have to go your separate ways to figure out your stuff. You gotta be strong enough and understand clearly what it is you're in search for. You know what it is you want, what it is you don't want, because that whole time when you're when you're in a union, you're pointing fingers because you're thinking it's your partner because her fault. This house is great, exactly, This house is great,

this family is great. In a golden cage, you know what I mean, And so you have to get your life built for her appreciated. A golden cage is a beautiful cage. But you have to go your separate ways and get out of each other's way to really see yourself. So I had to go away gain my strength as Jada again, not mommy, not wife Jada. That's the big one. That's the big one. People say it all the time. I have to find myself. Yo. That's real. That's real talk.

That's real talk. Right. I took off for two years. Yeah, I worked on myself. I've read on marriage and relationships and behavioral psychology. I was not going to fail in this marriage, right, But I shut down for two entire years to see what what was I doing wrong? And it takes a lot of beating up on each other because really what you're breaking down is all the fantasies, burning away, all of your fantasies because that fantasy starts so young, yes, and you hold on too that for

damn life, because that's all you know. Right. Ultimately, to have a successful relationship, you have to be in a relationship with a human being, imperfect, flawed human being. Because what happens was our characters. We're trying to have a relationship, and if you're gonna wear a mask, then the person is trying to love your mask right there, trying to love the image that you're presenting. But that's not what you really need. What you really come to understand that

there's no right or wrong. Everybody's operating from a place of hurt. Everybody's broken, everybody's broken. And what I realized the idea that my brokenness created. All of my discomfort absolutely mine to the fact that I was broken, and I learned how to look fixed to the world. Will Smith is a character, right, but deep down inside I was an insecure little boy that wanted Jada to say I was great, right, and if she didn't say I was great, the dragon came out. But for me personally,

I had a lot of emotional maturity to do. I had just realized I had a lot of childhood traumas that I had brought to me that I wasn't aware of a lot of father issues, And you know, I realized that I had to learn to be a lot of things for myself because I used to think, well, if you don't need somebody, then you can't love them exactly. And if you're not needed, then you're not loved. That was a false belief I had. I can't expect someone

to love me more than me. You know, if you don't like being with you, how it makes you think somebody else wants to be with you if you don't love yourself, we expect people to love us more than we love ourselves. We expect other people to do the work for us. I definitely went through that with Will. I thought it was his job to make me feel a certain way. I had to break that fantasy. I actually retired. I said, Jada, you know what, I retired. I am no longer doing the job of trying to

make you happy. You know what, You are free to go make yourself happy, and you do anything anything you want to make yourself happy, and you bring your ass back here happy, just to show me that it's even possible. Yep, just fly delicate. You know. I was angry, but it's really that's true, And that's the thing I had to learn. I have to be the thing that I'm asking for, and if I can be it, then I can create it.

I would say, if there were a thing that was the most detrimental um to our relationship during that time, was my unconsciousness. The other side of that is the key to a relationship is understanding your partner's plight. Right, there's nothing greater for a human being than to feel understood. I had built everything I had ever dreamed about as a little boy. I saw this family, I saw this life.

I've been building this, and I was like, no, no, no no, what's important is how we're connecting internally, like how we're relating to heart. We're the complete opposite. These are the things that we had to break, Yes, come to new understanding and recreate. Will and I have decided to even throw away the concept of marriage. We don't even call ourselves marriage anymore. You know. It's a life partnership in the sense that we've created a foundation together that we

know is for this lifetime. This lifetime, we have devoted ourselves to each other in a spiritual sense and a spiritual sense, spiritual emotional. It's like, whatever she needs, she can count on me for the rest of her life, and vice versa to me. It gives us the freedom to create a different context, first of all, for ourselves and not have to live up to the expectation of what people consider marriage to Expectations are the mother of disappointment.

Oh my god, I can't Yeah, I can't do him and Now there's no fight, there's no struggle, there's no me needing him to be something or do something. There's nothing that could happen that we won't be together and love each other and love each other through, love each other through. And it's not because we're just saying it. It's because we've cracked each other's heads wide open. Yeah, right, And we woke up the next day and high fived

and kept going right. And I think that's the part that we set each other free right, And people really struggle with that. The things that Jada needs to be happy, I'm not going to agree with them, all right. I truly have learned the definition of unconditional love. And to me, that's what it's about. I love you, I support you. I'm going to help you be happy no matter what. I don't have to like it. Yeah, I describe it as the day the deal breakers are gone. We don't

have any deal breakers. I always knew I'm not marriaged material. What I am is right check. What you are is the best friend that I've ever had. Kay, You're the best partner I've ever had, and sometimes that gets lost any marriage. And I think for many years you and I oh man, I know, we really kind of tried to fit into the We tried. We tried really hard. What we have between us is family and friendship. You know,

it's a life partnership. We are in a union. No matter what we talk about any we talk about anything and everything. We could we could break a ray table, but from of the stuff we talk about real talk. To me, that's what being in a relationship. That's what I need. And I'm not saying that's for every woman. That's what Jada needs, you know what needs. When people say love, they mean it transactionally. Right. I love you as long as you do things that make me feel good.

If you don't do the things that make me feel good, or if you even worse, you do something that makes me feel bad, I don't love you. And I'm going to discount, going to disconnect myself from you. When you go to sleep at night knowing you have an unbreakable love and unbreakable friendship and unbreakable connection, that's how you want to go to sleep every night. Yeah, and that your love for the truth, for the truth. Yes, you are not who you think you should be for somebody,

and that has been the ultimate release and freedom. In my experience, the thing that everybody's looking for is not found in trapping a person to vows. And releasing each other from obligations and expectations has made all of the moments blissful. We did a thing probably about four years ago. It was like, Okay, here's the deal. We're only going to do the things together we love. What happened is we gave each other ten days out of the year that we would do with the other person. One vacation

in the summer. She'll come with me because I want to while out. I want to be the volcano I wanted. And she's that's not vacation for her, right, So but she'll go with me for those ten days, and then I'll come for Christmas and sit around and do the same stuff we did last year with the same where do we at all? With the same songs? Right? She wants to go on vacations. She wants nostalgia to do

the same things over and over again. And when I go tradition, no, I get it, and I'm there for ten days, right, But I want to go in an adventure. I don't ever want to go to same places second time. And we really gave each other the freedom to do the things that the world is my home. Anywhere I am, I'm comfortable, and Jada just doesn't that. She doesn't want it. It's not fun, it's disruptive. She runs around the globe of the soul. That's real time. Yeah, the internal you

got Lenny Kravitz lyrics like, but that's true. You do the external journeying and I do the internal Jarney. It took a lot of stepping of Will and I together apart together, a lot of understanding, a lot of communication. But it took years. It took years, and I would say we are just now getting to a place probably I would say the last year. Yeah, probably, I've had a lot of change in both of you in the last year. Last year has been amazing. The paradox of

it all is so crazy. The pain that Jada caused me was the pain I needed to survive to learn how to be happy and vice right, I've never been happier in my life either. So well, now that we've to to the table, are we concerned about all the beautiful rumors that will now stir up in the media. It's going to be alright, So let's all right, So hold on, let's clear some rumors. No, no, no, no no, it's not possible, but just to have it on record,

just think historical rumors. We've never been scientologists. True, we've never been swingers, never been never been swing People understood that that's a specific lifestyle. That's a really specific slide. We've never been swingers. What else? Gam what they what they're gonna say. It's really your friends that we're worried about. You shouldn't be worried about anybody at all at the end of the day, because people don't believe whatever they want to leave, and who knows, if you know it

might change and transition again. You know why I never got divorced. It's cheaper to keep me even um because I've never met anybody like you, and I knew if I wasn't with you, I'd be searching in vain for the rest of my life. Oh the word. See sometimes he says the right thing, the truth. Thank you for coming. We appreciate you, and I just want to say thank you for everything. We love you. I love you to death.

You have found something with this red table, in this space that I tried my damned this to build for you the space where you get to fully and honestly and thoroughly be you and to get all of the love and the praise that you deserve. When I see you on this Red table, it is the joy that I have always hoped you would have. Thank you. I always knew he was the best thing man ever. Oh my gosh, thank you. That means a lot to me.

I love you. On our next Red Table Talk, Will and I always being accused of being scientologists and this and being that. I was just caught up in that pain and also the pain of others. I was hurt, but Jada I wasn't even considering that she would be hurt. Damn. Get in all right, everybody, nothing nasty. I came on the Red Table. I smashed a smashed. They never had a guest like me. They might they might have to cancel the show because it's like what they're gonna do

after that. Hey, hey, red Table Talk family, let's head to our Red Table Talk Facebook watch show page. Join the conversation and become a part of red table Talk. To join the red Table Talk family and become a part of the conversation, follow us at Facebook dot com, slash red table Talk. Thanks for listening to this episode of red Table Talk podcast, produced by Facebook Watch, Westbrook Audio, and I Heart Radio.