Black & Latin: Racism Within (Red Table Talk: The Estefans)

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we're gonna be recapping whatever housewife is currently airing. Lucky for Tamera, we're gonna start oh my Gosh with Orange County. Listen to two teas in a pod on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Then those me and the Gloria Stefan. Here you are listening to Red Table Talk via Stephens Podcast, all your favorite episodes from our Facebook watch show in audio. They make sure that you know that you are the darkest one. Colorism,

the disturbing truth. We don't talk about my grandmo Let say, don't go outside and don't darken on my family. And I still get emotional right now because you think I'm a kid. Afro Latinos speak out about the discrimination they face within their own community because whatever it is, it doesn't look like me. Our culture secret exposed at the Red Table. A lot of us are very hypocrite. Why why there is racism? Don't pretend to like us and really not like us. Latino that is a term that

unites all Latinos, regardless of nationality or skin color. It's about a shared culture and a sense of belonging. But let's be clear, being Latino is not a race. There are black Latinos, white Latinos in every shade in between. One in four US Hispanics identify as Afro Latino and two thirds of Hispanics with darker skin colors report discrimination. Common yet racist phrases such as major rasa or improving the race encouraged generations of Latinos to value European features

and skin tone. One survey showed that of dark skinned individuals were viewed as lesson intelligent and therefore less worthy. Len go what case is self? This is what colorism looks like. It may not be something we want to acknowledge, but that's exactly why we wanted to bring it to the table. We cannot know what it's like to be in the skin of darker Latinos because we were born like this. In Latino families, you can have someone with very dark skin, you could have someone with very light skin,

and they can be brother and sister. That dynamic within the family can cause your family to treat you different. People looking from the outside to treat you different. Which is why we need to use this platform to amplify this issue because I don't know what that feels like. It breaks my heart to think that after Latinos feel racism in their own family. Because you think of racism as a general thing in society, we need happens in your own family is very difficult. Is that feeling of

being the trauma of being oppressed. As humans, we tend to get close to what makes us comfortable, and sometimes we treat different as less then, and that is one of the biggest issues in the world. This is something that needs to be gutted from the inside out because they're dealing with things in their life that we will never know merely as a result of the color of their skin. Here we go, girls. Caramo is best known as the culture expert on the hit show Queer Eye,

which I love. But what you may not know is that Cadamo's grandmother was Cuban. For most of his life, he rejected his Latin roots because of the racism he felt within his own family. Welcome to the table, baby, I am loving this sweater right now. Appreciate so much trying to be a little sexy and your grandma's Cuban. I'm inted helping Maka yes Ja Jamaica. Yeah. And she uh lighter, Yes, she she was, but she was lighter

growing up. I felt very embarrassed even today, to be honest, talking to the producers and talking to people every time they refer to me as Afro Latino or Latino. I get very uncomfortable still to this thing something it's very new. Your Latino family did not accept you. Not accept sounds deliberate. I don't think they understood what they were doing, but it was this subliminal, unconscious, internalized racism that was in them.

Do you feel like within your family, if somebody's lighter, you know, they'll joke and be like, oh, you know, because you're the darker one and I'm the lighter one. And that of course, of course, for me, playing outside as a kid was nerve wracking because my grandmo would say, don't go outside and don't darken up my family. Don't darken up my family. Don't darken up my family. So I would not go outside until after five pm because

then the sun would be less. And I still get emotional right now because you think, I'm a kid and I should not have to be thinking about not going outside and playing because I don't want to get darker. So that my grandmother doesn't say a comment. Maybe she even thought she was trying to protect it, and that's what it was, and that it was going to be better for you to be lighter. Her intention was to protect me to to try to say things that she thought was going to help me. But the impact is

that it destroyed me emotionally. But it also made me feel like I wasn't connected to my culture intentions. Impact is huge. My family is to say, oh, your nose, and my grandmother, even my mother would squeeze my nose. But it was because it's more My nose is more African, my nose is more black. And for many years I kept saying to myself, I need a nose, y'all. I did not know where that internalized hatred I had for

myself was coming from your drama. I mean, we don't realize it, but you know it starts with the family that people around you. You know, like those experiences are going to mark you for the rest of your life. I'm the only boy. I have sisters, and they range from very light to I have one sister who's the

darkenst and her treatment was the worst. The reason that I am the person on queer Eye that has the emotional and mental conversations is because I understand the trauma and damage where maybe and not to discount my sisters who are lighter, they didn't experience because they were well, Nita, there were all these things that were for me. I didn't hear those things as often. But you're gorgeous. Have you ever been told that you couldn't possibly be lat

you know, because you're black? Yes, it wasn't even a question. It's I meanly like, no, no, no, you're Jamaican. There's no Cuban and it's an easy way just to dismiss me and discriminate me. That's why I love what you're doing here, because there's so many people who are going to watch you hear this for the first time and say, oh, this is a problem. Maybe I shouldn't be making these comments.

And so what I love about this conversation is that for those individuals who are experiencing their mental health, their emotional health being damaged, this is a moment where you

can understand that you are beautiful as you are. Because it's a journey that I'm going on right now to love myself because of the internalized racism that I heard and experienced from my Latin side, and I started to say, I have to build myself back up conversations like this where I look at you all and you look like people my family and you're affirming me for the first time. It's like, Okay, I'm getting chills, I'm getting emotional. It's

like I feel included. You have to go through a process after trauma to understand it, to turn it into something meaningful, to then be able to help somebody else. You don't just live like this, go through trauma and then oh, sure, I'm fine, I'm unaffected by love to build that time, however, you change it with your sons. I tell them the skin is gorgeous. The darker it's beautiful. I want to make sure they hear it, and I realize it's important the language I have in my home.

I no longer allow other family members, cousins, aunt's, uncle's, anyone to make comments to my kids and me to walk away. It's important for me now to be respectful of my family, especially those who are older, but to also say, this is why that is hurtful, this is why it is damaging, and this is why I'm hoping we can talk about why you think that's okay to say, and how you changing that could actually make us a stronger. Fact because a stronger because they don't but they're comparing.

There's something I say to people all the time. Comparison is the thief of joy. If you want to steal the joy from your family, whether it's their skin tone, whether it's their education, keep comparing your kids and see if you don't steal the joy and the love that's in your home. And let's try to be better. Let's try to really think about what we're saying to each other as human beings. I understand that your boyfriend Carlos

is with you. Do we have him join us? Because I think it would be so relevant to this conversation. God like, beautiful couple it is. How did you guys meet on Instagram? I sat in to them the DM very quickly. He's a beautiful photographer and creative director, and so I saw his work and I was like, oh, I like this work. But then I saw his face and I was like, oh, I like updated black men,

Latin men, white men. I was with a man who for three and a half years he's Puerto Rican, and I not once tried to speak Spanish, tried to expose my culture, do anything, and with that person I could not connect because I was too afraid. This is the first time I've ever felt comfortable and embracing my Latin side being with Carlos um and it's and I'm getting pretty good at it, thank you. And it's only be because Carlos and I practice in practical tota and and

like h the only way no fear, you're jumping. But the fear has went away because he doesn't judge me to no cuentamario. I'll tell you what I think making the race better is understanding and not creating these barriers or even having to say their phrase in Mexico contacto as Latinos. We need to make sure we're looking at Wow. That's the first time I ever said we yeah, there you go. That's crazy. That was really just it. That's great. But and so we had to think about what internalized

within the Latino community. Are we saying to ourselves and believing and then passing on that is wrong about fo Latinos or black people period? What do you GUYSA we have to learn just we need to do better. We can't change what happened before we can learn from it and try to move forward. Thank you, thank you for being hi. I'm Robert sex Reese, host of The Doctor sex re Show, and every episode I listened to people talk about their sex and intimacy issues, and yes, I

despise every minute of it. And she she made mistakes too, did she heal everyone at her wedding? But hell is real. We're all trapped here and there's nothing any of us can do about it. So join me, won't you listen to the Doctor Sex re Show every Tuesday on the Iron Heart Ready r Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, I'm so, I'm Jacob Scott, Thomas Bertrand,

and this is the Loan Lobos Podcast. Every week we just are shooting from the hip talking about everything nothing at the same time, including topics like what people think about Latinos that don't speak Spanish. Basically what he said was, oh, you're a Mexican that doesn't speak Spanish. That's like a taco with no south side, like a taco with no flavor.

Like she took that. It was like, this was a year ago and I didn't get accepted, time sets and everything, and the email of her not getting accepted, and then a year later, exact design was on like a carvers you can buy, and she was like, this is so messed up because you can't do anything about it. Yeah, but she but she put on a blue up right exactly. It started off as like this posh you know online. So there was a time where I was like it got to the point where I was like, what are

you what room are you in today? Like what are you guys talking about? And He's like this one is just a bunch of people making helicopter noises. I was always way faster than my mom's. Shouldn't be able to Jackie. Listen to loan Logo starting September one as a part of the Michael du A podcast network, available on the Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Colleen with joined me the host of Eating Wall Broke podcast while I eat a meal created by self made entrepreneurs, influencers, and celebrities over a meal they once ate when they were broke. Today I have the lovely aj Crimson, the official Princess of Compon, Asia Kidding and Assia. This is the professor. We're here on Eating Will Broken. Today, I'm gonna break down my meal that got me through a time when I was broken. Listen to Eating Wall Broke on the I Heart Radio app, on Apple podcast,

or wherever you get your podcasts. When was a child, she felt she was discriminated against because of the color of her skin and the texture of her hair. Now, as the start of love and hip Hop Miami, which I also love, she's using her voice to speak up for black Latinos. Welcome at your Yeah, sharing the dove, sharing the love. Born Diana dan Ellis de Losantos got her start in show business at four years old, dancing in the popular Spanish variety series Sabadogan. We're both she

and Lily were regular cast members. People know me or I started off as Diana Losantos back when I used to you know, work at S Francisco, which, by the way, now that I'm grown, I don't know how you did it because that was a lot that why why why, I'll tell you, I'll tell you why. Being on that platform it was young, I learned a lot from it. I'm grateful for the opportunity. You know, we know that he wasn't a you know, the easiest cookie um, at

least not for me. And obviously no, no, you don't mean born that we grown now and there was many things that he could have done with his platform to help people like myself during choreographers, they never knew where to place me is gonna look awkward. He was one of those that also made a lot of those umgusto Joe because you know, no who's gonna go against the power, like okay, racist comments with racist Yet years ago we didn't have this car and the people have gotten away

with it. Because even if you knew it and I love all these great things, yes, but if you had the opportunity of going to sleep and waking up black, would you want to wake up black? Would you want to be treated as a black person? And this is where I come in where I'm like, okay, let's have real conversations. Okay, but you were the only black little girl and how many years? Remind me? Five years is a rate accomplishment. Come on, Londo, we've been here for

the longest time. There isn't a Latin country that doesn't have black people, perto Rico Cuba, every single place in the world. And that's the part that I feel that it's unfair. That's how built like everybody was like drama and we just try to cover it up, yo, But a lot of us are very hypocrite, and that's just the truth. You know what I'm saying, there is racism, do you racista? I would never would you want your daughter, your son to marry a black person? You know what

I'm saying. They're hoppy, but she's right. Not most people are not like most most people have the subtext of racism. Whether they tell you to your face, I'm not racist, they're feeling it in there and it's the truth. This is not to pain for anybody on this table specifically, it's for the people that are watching. They and it's the truth. And if you're racist, don't pretend to like us and really not like us. Do what We leave

the same thing with the notes. I've heard it all, and they make sure that you know that you are the darkest one. It's like, I see, I gotta tell me And don't get it twisted with this wig that I got on right now, the badness I got my curls. I embrace it. I played part of the game. I know what it is. I know that African American parents have the talk. Yes to Latino Afro Latino parents have that talk, or Afro Latinos still black, Yes, we still

have to have that conversation. No, but do the question listen to what you just told you Afro Latinos blood, You'll never if you walk by a street, you walk by a supermarket or whatever, there's always a security walking. Do you need anything, man, do you need anything? No? I don't. Why don't you ask somebody else? That's why to me, I'm so passionate about it, and I don't want to sugarcoat it. Being black, it's not being black in America, it's not being black in Cuba, it's not

being black, and it's being black in the world. Just see us as people, you know, Just see us as people. Man. What you said is so important. Feel the fierce need if somebody says something in aproperate to be like that is disturbing, severely inappropriate. And also I want to ask is it okay if I say something? Is it okay if I insert myself here? Because I feel like I almost have to use my voice. But I also don't

want to make anybody uncomfortable. Whatever you feel in your heart and in your spirit, you do it, stand behind it, and especially if you know that it's coming from a good place. None of us will ever feel some type of way because you're defending us, because you're standing up for us. We're grateful because no one does it. Growing up,

you never saw people like us select those. To me, it was life and I had the honor of being able to work with her the way she went through a lot of discrimination in Cuba and even when she had the opportunity having a major role. I've gone to auditions, but novels and yawn exactly, we have like too. They've told me we went. So then here comes apart where I'm more because people Latina. With all due respect, Jennifer Lopez COMOHI whatever it is, it doesn't look like me.

I have to agree with you. We have grown very much, really have we? How many black people do you see? How many black people do you see? How many black people do you see the covers of magazines? Do you see them in movies? No? You don't. So it's like, have we really evolved? You? For me and I started doing emotion when I hear you're talking was super impactful. You don't understand how important it was for me to see you on love in hip hop. If I would have had you as a kid, Jesus, but I'm so

thankful that I had you as a grown man. I know that there's not enough and there you still are tokenized in so many ways. But I have to tell you, even though you are that one and there should be more, I'm so thankful that you are the one. Thank you so much, seriously, thank you. I have to give you all the credit in the world as well. I remember one of the most important moments in my career was

performing with you on stage in the Americans. Like you, always make sure to give that credit to everyone, because it takes a team to make those performances happen, and within that team there were people like us. And even though that I was very young, I shall always be great. Thank you. But you know what's funny, I thought it was us, I know, sharing our African traditions and are such a part of who we are, and to me, that's celebratory. You don't know because how impactful certain moments

can be for people. People both are gonna be amount of the role models for the next generation. What do you tell them? You go first, be patient with yourself and love every part of who you are. And it might take a little bit longer because of the negati of things you've been hearing your entire life, But know that It's up to you to love yourself and to see the beauty even if your family, your culture, or the world around you does not make you feel like it is okay to love who you are and except

who you are. I would say I don't get the way, and I would say more, I don't get the way I see anything me. Embrace your neat dude, Embrace it, Understand it, see it as a power. God blessed you with melanin. Melanin is a power. Understand that the world shall come against you, and you need to be prepared for whatever is to come. Don't let anyone, anyone makes you feel that you're less than. That's the most important thing, because when you have education, you have power. What grows

in the forest trees, sure you know what else? Girls in the forest, our imagination, a sense of one and our family bonds grow too, because when we disconnect from this and connect with this, we reconnect with each other. The forest is closer than you think. Find a forest near you and start exploring. I Discover the Forest dot Org brought to you by the United States Forest Service and the ad Council. Raffie is the voice of some of the happiest songs of our generation Baby So who

is the man behind Baby Bluga? Every human being wants to feel respected. When we start with all good things can grow from there. I'm Chris Garcia, comedian, New Dad and host of Finding Raffie, a new podcast from my Heart Radio and Fatherly. Listen every Tuesday on the I Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts. Sacred Scandal tells the true story of a murdered nun at my high schoolm Blood. In two thousand one, Sister Michelle's body was discovered at a convent in Miami. She had

been stopped more than ninety times. One of my classmates confessed to the brutal murder and has been in prison for more than two decades, and his story exposes an even more disturbing truth. Have concerns that the Box and Holy Cross not really Caretholic. Sacred Scandal is a true story of one priest's obsession with power, corruption, and a massive cover up by a monastery in Miami. And as we've been trying to get to the truth about this case,

we got answers to questions we never even asked. And this story took us farther than we ever intended to go from Miami, Florida to the mountains of Ukraine. Listen to Sacred Scandal as part of the Michael Dura podcast Network, available on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I want to bring out somebody that gave you your power, Mommy Place. Amara's Dominican mother, Anna Oliaga overcame many obstacles to help Amra pursue her dreams.

She saw the discrimination young A Mara faced and taught her to love herself by confronting racism head on. The fact that you created to trio is important, timo control? Who's theseus? Oh like a young ANIMALA? No? No, no, no, no, no, she's she's bro. That pain that you carry is what's going to make a difference for the people you talk to. Because you lived it in your own skin. You have something to share that. Hey she did this. Look at this.

You know you're proud. Thank you for being here and being so honest and being that force of nature that you are. A woman. This is very hid. That's good, so they know it's real. It's real. On the right thad. Dr Elizabeth Horge Freeman has spent her life studying the effects of prejudice and racism towards after Latinos throughout the US and Latin America. Welcome Dr Freeman. We're so happy to have you in this free for all that I am just so excited to be part of the table.

You've been listening to their story, Yeah, I'm sure You're brain is exploding with so many and statistics and connections. Please enlightened listening to both Amata stories and Karamo stories. In many ways they resonate with the patterns and trends that we see across Latin America and across the United

States with Afro Latinos. Is the conversation about the journey learning and unlearning, right, so learning your history, learning to own who you are, learning to own your body, but also to unlearn some of the negative anti black attitudes that are expressed in families and seen in broader society. And even when we talk about family, oftentimes families are making decisions about who to invest in because they're thinking about who's the better investment, who has the best shot.

And there were a number of cases where you have mothers oftentimes treating their children differently based on what they look like and what that would translate into with differences and how children were eating, where they went to school, if they went to private versus public school. You also had a case where it wasn't just mothers. There was a father who literally gave away his three darker scant

daughters to raise his lighter scanned daughters. I mean, it was a it was a pretty brutal situation, trauma, and how can we listen to that discrimination and families dressers are away? So education is part of that, but that

treatment is connected to the broader social structure. Right, So this isn't about fixing families, It's about fixing our society because in so much of the conversation about discrimination and colorism, we focus so much on color, and I just want to make sure we recognize that it's not just color. It's hair, it's features, it's lit, it's lit, it's all. It's this constellation of racial features that shape people's outcomes.

And that's when the crux of my work is to understand and unpacked how that plays out in people's lives. What's the difference between race and this is a really great question raised. No, let me explain what race and ethnicity are both of these categories are first of all, constructed categories. Humans made these of goors, and what they mean actually varies depending on what country you're coming from. So I feel like I have to say that upfront,

these are not kind of objective categories. But when we talk about race, we're typically talking about physical features, whereas ethnicity refers to culture, it refers to language, it refers to kind of people's social experiences, and it's often connected to geographic area. The other question that people sometimes ask is how does nationality fit with this? Then if that's raised, and that's ethnicity, nationality is just about your legal identity,

where do you have your citizenship? Oftentimes folks they mix up all three of these terms. They don't understand that Latinos are a pretty heterogeneous group that consists of lots of different racial categories. Okay, so wait, we're so I am race for Cuban. Okay, so let's let's break it down. Are you a Cuban citizen? No America? So you are American American? Yeah? Okay, and then my race, well, your race, what is your race's part Lebanese parts? Yeah, let's talk

about physical features? How are you read here in the United States. I would cogor to say that you are white. You're white. You are white. I am white, she is white. We are white. Now your ethnicity, you're you're clearly Latina, right, this is this is part of what we're here to talk about. But even that category is interesting because some Latinos feel like, well, I don't necessarily want to be just subsumed in this Latino category because in some ways

that Latino ethnicity subsumes Costa Rica, Nicaragua, Dominican Republic. All these categories are just thrown into this Latino ethnicity. It's a convenience that we created. The issue becomes that folks don't see black folks as equal because they don't have the opportunity to see us possiming at the same level. Those are the game today, they are today. Yeah. That's by the way that I wish that we could continue

this conversation all day too. But the words I'm taking away from this communication love and unity and support for each other and allies. Thank you God, amo Amada, Dr Horge Freeman for sharing your stories. This is a tough conversation that we need to continue to have in order for things to change. So thank you for being here and for pouring out your hearts to us. And we want to end this red Table with a special performance by my beautiful Emily singing her song I just wanted

to be over. It's one of my favorites that she's ever written. In college, I had an experience with a friend of mine who was dark skin. We went to eat in a restaurant, got our food to then which the waitress came over and said, you guys need to go. You're not welcome to eat here. And I literally was like why, And she looked at my friend and touched

her skin, and um. It really made me feel the need to use my voice and put my anger from that experience on paper and try to get it to as many people as possible to show that not only am I an ally, but this is bothersome and we need to speak up as human beings. Mm hm ah ah. Forward dreams made believe moving on with something weird, to come to term with the absurd. He is from freedom, yet somehow disturbed. Fifty two twenty new gets are in numbers in between. When will the jet reveal its in

equating triumph with the color of a skin? I just find it to be over. I just find it to be to be thru. I just want it to be all by e, to be to be fru. Hey, it's me family, tree blue with lighter fluid on my dreams. I hide the roots aground me to this earth. I fear the only predetermined gives a bird. It's not too late to right their arms of fame. Forgetful Linz. The only Manda Lame increases sus Let's focus in Raise your girls to be my Tina lutherankays to be a by,

to be frue, to be's rude. I just want to just want to be fool chub woo mm just oh to be to be through, to be through. I want to be fool, to peace, to be through, to be through, to be through, to be through. M Thanks for listening.

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at my high school was brutally murdered. Getting to the truth has opened the Pandora's box of secrets, exposing abuse of power and a world of lies at when my mean monastery, I mean the woeves stabbed. I need plus times. There's gotta be something else going on here. Listen to Sacred Scandal on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Tanya Sam, host

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