Hey, rain Drops. Yes, so I finally got merch. That's right. You can buy your allegedly and my Voice mugs, T shirts, rain Drops, hoodies and T shirts all on Carlos Kingshop dot com.
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Your mugs all on Carlos Kingshop dot com. Welcome to Reality to King. It's me Carlos Kings, the King of Reality TV and one of the most sought after executive producers in reality television with over ten years of production experience. Twice a week on Reality with the Kings, we'll sit down with my friends across the entertainment industry, recap our favorite reality shows and revisit unforgettable moments that we are still talking and tweeting about.
Ray Drop.
She's here and, in the words of Caroline from Polta, guys, she's bad. I'm here with my friend, y'all favorite. She is the one who y'all love when we recap. She is Mike Virgin of Kelly Rippa and I'm her Marcus Filas give it all, casey baby.
Would we have a passionate marriage if we were together and straight? But I mean, I'm straight, but you're not so if we wait.
Those straight listen, I think at the end of the day, we have a passionate dinner conversations, We'll have passionate shopping experiences. You will be smiling from air to air for the rest of your life.
Would you be satisfied? Not sure?
Yeah, I have to tell you that as a as a girlfriend, wife, I hate when someone's like, can you come and sit down and rub my arm and like pay attention to me that I'm a girlfriend. That our wife who's like, I'm really busy right now, she's take a chase. You have to chase me, you know what I mean?
What's your sign, Kate?
Oh, I know with like a heisty's rising moon or something. So that means I'm like, I'm a fiery person, but can be empathetic.
Yeah, yeah, yeah no.
And the thing is, you are a woman who is so self assured about yourself. Yes, like you know you and no one else can tell Kate Kasey, Who the fuck Kate Casey is.
Back the fuck off? Yeah, you're damn right. That's why we're.
Getna lock so well.
So, Kate, we have a lot to catch up on, uh before we get into part one. Of the Real Housewives of Ors County reunion. I want to do some housekeeping with a few housewife franchises and just to get your thoughts on it. The first thing first, it was recently revealed that The Real Housewives of Dubai is on Paul's after two seasons.
Mm hmm.
Are you surprised.
No. I think it's a real snooze fest. But I also think that the industry is scrambling right now. No one's buying shows, no one's making shows. I think that we're probably going to see more stuff like Q three A twenty twenty five. They're still trying to catch up from COVID, you know, and listen, we're in a social media landscape where people create their own reality shows on TikTok for up to ten minutes. I have been telling my friends that work behind the scenes, and they think
I'm crazy. I would if you can't get a job on a TV show, I would have influencers pay you to create their reality shows. That's the future.
Smart like business model.
Yeah, that's what I would do. Or I would be you know, I would work with like athletes who to for them to curate their own media channels. Professional athletes. That's what I would do.
No, it's super smart because listen, kay, you're accurate at somebody whose job is to create shows, as I on my own production company. It is the sort of crisis that's going on to where networks aren't buying in volume like they used to, and you're seeing that with one program airing and then after it goes off, it's just a bunch of repeats, whereas back in our day you could watch the real house spots at Billy Hills, then that had the pump rules, then another show, then the
watch What Happens Live. You're lucky if you get anything to air after a show that comes on a nine o'clock It is a crisis. And when it comes to buy, what I have heard is the fact that it's a very expensive show, which.
Is no surprising anybody question.
Yeah, is an international show, unlike other shows in different cities where you have a local crew and it's not that expensive to fly a crew member to do pickups, to do interviews when the season raps. Imagine flying producers and a camera crew to the buy after the season raps to do interviews like it's not cost effective. Not only that the show unfortunately never met its mark. And I have to be honest with you, Kate, I haven't watched any of season two.
It was a snooze fest. Yeah it was snoozy.
Yeah, what what went wrong?
You think in terms of people not really being engaged with that show, I.
Don't think you felt like there were authentic friendships. I don't think their their stories were that compelling. I think they leaned into watch into dumb fights, and I wanted to see more about their culture. If you're going to go a different pocket of the world with the completely different viewpoint of lifestyle, culture, et cetera, like lean into that. I want to see what makes their what is their day like? Where do they go shopping, what do the
grocery stores look like? Where do they hang out? And they focused on like like Potomac. I felt like for many seasons it was just like fighting at a dinner table. I think they adopted that and they lost what really makes each franchise so unique and special. You know how you one time said to me, Real Housewives the Salt Lake City could be called Real Housewives of Sedona and
I wouldn't know any different. Yes, it's like that with Dubai and what a shame if you're going to go all the way to that part of the world.
No, it is so true. And speaking of Salt Lake City.
I haven't watched this season, so this week in Kate, one of my rain drops, tweeted me and said, you have to watch this season.
Bron When is killing it.
And I've seen clips online of Brama being great, and I was like, let me just watch it. I tried to watch it, Kate. In fifteen minutes, I cut it back off. And I think it's because what you said. I feel like that. Listen, this is my opinion. This is my opinion. When I'm watching Salt Lake City. I was watching an episode that aired two weeks ago because I want to catch up in at least bench three.
And it was when, oh my god, this is so bad.
Was Angie Angie k was throwing some like party whether it being was like the Greek.
Gangster something mafia, Yeah.
And then you had like this mafia guy walking to the door putting up wanted signs and I was like, this does not happen in real life, Nobody, Okay, I'm going to tell you what happens.
And then this the episode after this is why you're gonna hang on for just with one one finger on the cliff. Okay, Okay, Bronwyn is married to this older guy, and we know that Bronwyn had a daughter when she was like nineteen. That birth father said, I'm out. She had some meeting with the grandparents, and the grandparents and the birth father were like, we don't want you to have the baby, I think, sadly, a situation that happens a lot in this country. So she decided to be
a single mother. That birth father died I think two years later. She her daughter has never known anyone in the birth father's family. So because or So, she goes to the airport after the trip with Lisa Barlowe and they're sitting in at the airport. It's not filmed, we talk. We hear about this later they figure out that Lisa's Lisa's family is close friends with the birth father's family. So She's like, no, they're really good people and you
should get to know them. And Bron's like, really, because they have not helped me raise my child at all, so they can suck it. So, because she's frustrated, she projects her frustration with that family onto Lisa and that spills over into this trip they take to Palm Springs. Now you know how they do this when they join the show and they're like, we want to show you
how much money do we have. They take them on a private jet which they rented probably, and they go to Palm Springs and it says thirty thousand dollars a night for this big home. And she's got this older husband and she keeps telling us it's she's not a gold digger. They've got this real love story. But he's a total curmudgeon. And she and Lisa start fighting because of the projection issues, and he walks in and tells Lisa's husband that, you know, they got to stop fighting.
We're going to have to go. But there's a scene that's very Erica tom Girardi where Curmudge and husband goes into the kitchen and he's like, I don't like this. I don't And the way she looks at the floor, you're like, oh, there's a lot to unpack. Also should note they pull this pretty woman scene where they have a jewelry person drive up from la to the Palm Springs rental to show them two pieces of jewelry, one a pair of diamond earrings and a diamond necklace with
the price tag of four million dollars. Yeah, there's a lot of unpack You're like, are you a gold digger? What's going on with your marriage? Did you marry Tom Girardi? Why are you so angry at Lisa? Why did you get this rentaled? Can you guys actually reford this? Are you spending way too much money? And what's really going on with your husband? And did you do this al La Camille Grammar because you want a life after this marriage goes to put see.
Okay, So my thing is this lead with that as somebody who is a housewife fanatic. I am I'm not interested in this sort of like caricature of how you know, a mafia bodyguard pulls up the people's homes and least wanted posters on their door.
I don't think I think it makes you realize the angie it doesn't really have much. She just like she just can't be over the top outfits. That's it. That's all she's giving to the show.
I'm not interested. What I am interested is exactly what Kate said. So if you lead with that, you'll have.
Someone like Carlos King talk about your show on Twitter and on my podcast, because that's the ship that I want to watch.
Yeah, real story, personal.
Story, which is what you and I love.
Yeah, Victory's triumphs, pain, bitterness, regret.
Okay, it's okay. Because of you, I'm gonna tap back into it.
Yeah you know do you're gonna. I just need you to watch last week's Episode's I want to go back to square one. You don't need to. It's like a soap opera. You dip in and you go, I got it. I don't need to go you know what I mean? The General Hospital. You haven't seen it for twenty years, and you know exactly what's going on exactly.
You don't have to, like okay, So my mistake was I was trying to like watch previous episodes before last week, so like, no, it's like General Hospital. Just catch up and in two months it's the same shit.
Got it, same got it?
Yeah?
Okay, okay, So I'll watch that tonight and I'll report back to you. Now we have to get into the Real Housewives of New York City.
Why that's a born show too. I mean why I was seen with like Jenna Lyons in a closet with her girlfriend's mother. I can't see the girlfriend. I don't see any of her friends. I don't go to work with her. Why why is she on the show? What's happening?
I want to ask you this?
And what's going on with Abe and Aaron Ave and Aaron. I feel like they're going to be Slitzville. Uh, Jessel, I love j justl's a person, but I don't like her on the show because she's like acting.
They're all acting.
To me, it feels like bad auditions, Like all of them are auditioning to be on Merro's place.
It's over acting. It's horrible.
You are a woman who lives in Orange County prior to this show, did you have any idea who jenn Alliance was?
Yes? I did. I'm a nerd. I actually interview.
Well.
She also like she had a documentary series which was excellent on HBO that was more her speed. It was about her business.
So she needs to be a shark tank.
Yeah, this is not This is not the place for her. She also is with somebody who doesn't want to be on TV, just like the girl Braun went on Real Housewives of Salt Lake City. Like you brought your curmudge and husband who doesn't want a film? Why are you on the show?
And more importantly, why were they let on this show knowing that?
Thank you? Okay, can we jump? And then we need to jump for one second to real housewis Orange County Because Katie, I feel like that was a casting miss step, and I'll tell you why. Because she can't talk about the previous relationship with the ex husband, which sounds very volatile. So then it leaves room for people to start poking at your stories because you can't tell the full story because it's too legally complicated. I don't I think that's
a swing in a miss You can't do that. You're gonna have somebody to tell the story about, like a previous marriage which ended with children living in other states. You have to tell the full story.
One, one hundred percent. So let's get right in two bays.
Oh say so, if we're going to recap right now, Salt Lake City, I'm gonna watch last week's episode today Dubai. We're not surprised and we don't think the show deserves to come back.
Sorry, I love I love the girls.
Caroline Stanbury should move back to London and do the Ladies or a Real Housewives of DC excuse me, Real Housewives of London film or a show that they're filming. They're just going to be on HEYU because literally no one's buying stuff, So that's where it's going to go to. Hey you.
I agree with you, Kate. And when it comes to the Royal House wash of New York City, I strongly believe this would be their last season.
I'm gonna go with yeah, yep, last one.
And and let me know if you agree with me.
I think with the failure of this reboot, they're not going to reboot Jersey in this magnitude.
I hope not. I think it's bad.
Agreed.
Yeah.
At this point, Carlos King exclusive it kay Casey gets it first because the Royal House Wasp of New York City is Michael Jackson bad like horrible. This this reboot is not great, Carlos, Kate is telling the world exclusively. I do not want Jersey to suffer and I would rather live for another season of Teresa Melissa on Jersey.
Thank you, Danny Plagreno said to me last week, and I think he's right. What they should have done was keep leg see and thrown in some new people that may have worked. It's but whatever, Listen, we can't fix the world.
We can't fix the world.
But what we can't fix is what's going on on the OC reunion.
So let's get right into it. Let's talk about Katie.
Yeah, Katie is a mystery to me, and they did a great well.
Listen.
I felt like Emily Simpson was the host of the reunion because the way she sort of hijacked Andy C and his microphone and his que cards.
I don't know what Emily was on.
I don't know if Emily was told that she had to give tons of commentary or her job was in jeopardy. But Emily to me, and I like Emily a lot, and I thought, Jedda.
I'm gonna tell you what happened, she was insufferable. Go ahead, let's tell you what happened.
Wow.
I think that they all get mad when certain people get attention where they're like this fool. You guys love her and why so you think she got mad about the Jennifer stuff because she's saying he's totally fine, he got immunity. But she's a Dodo brain and doesn't really understand, and so I think Emily jumped in because she's like, oh, you're seriously never gonna address this. So it's like two things.
It's like Andy doesn't want to like go too into it too much because it's a legal issue that has that is off the show right right, So there's only so much you can do as a host. So we're gonna throw him some flowers. But Emily's probably also mad. This is what my assumption is, and I think I'm always right, is that they all get mad when the show airs and they think, oh, everyone's gonna hate that person, and then when they get praised, they're like, oh, no,
this shit's not happening on my watch. Because they've been on the show for years and they go through seasons where they're like, everyone's gonna love me, and then they hate them, and then they're like, you're gonna take me down for doing X y Z. But then we're gonna let this fool get get through. What the show is really about what happens off the show, And I think.
That that's what's happening. No, I can say to you A lot of people thought.
That Katie Jen and Shannon were going to be disliked this season Shannon courtesy of having a dui, Katie because she's new and she does have a voice. And Jim because you know, people think her boyfriend Ryan is like a scammer. And what's been interesting is it totally flipped the other way, like people love those three.
Because everybody hates cameras so much. So if you hate one person, then the pendulum has to swing back to the other side. But you know, if you come back next season and you don't take you take Alexis out, that changes everything up.
Was Alexis a flop to you?
Yes?
Yeah? Why? Uh?
The only thing that I think she brought well, I think in terms of like who is each person there, what's their singular story? And then how do they add value? The only value they had is creating a television situation where you see someone who has been on the show for quite some time literally unravel, literally unravel on camera. It seemed very nasty, pointed, mean and conniving to do that.
I didn't learn anything more about her personal story. I would have liked to have her say, wow, some of the things that I said when I was on the show, when I was with a seemingly misogynistic person. I do not believe in that anymore. I have found my own power. Never addressed it. She just seems like she just got a different relationship and took on that guy's personality. So
what have I learned about you? Where's the evolution? What our value did you bring to the show as a singular person and your evolution and as a cast member? Like I think half the people were like, why are you on the show. That's why I did like Emily because she was like, you're dumb, dumb, and uh, I'm not bringing I'm not here for what you're bringing. We need that.
Oh no, I know, I said to you. I loved Emily up until this reunion part one. I want to give her some grades part one.
Part one.
She did too much prior to part one, I said my podcast, there was like this sort of like protest.
She's right, She's always like that. Emily always shows up at the reunion.
Yeah, but I loved her so much this season because I felt like she stepped in when she had to.
I love me. She read Alexis birth filth.
I agree with you, I love it, she said, shut up, don't talk like I loved everything.
I listen. I like Alexus a lot.
I thought it was great that she was cast because obviously she's dating John Janssen, and I want I want to I want to see that story.
I believe two things happen.
I'll give Alexus some grace in the sense of she's a friend of and we are friend up to the show. You do not get as much airtime to tell your personal story, right, So she was out of deficit, so I want the world to know that.
Unfortunately, but she.
Had previously been on, so there's a history, so you have to address that stuff.
No, and that's why I agree with you. I And so my second.
Point agree with you is because she was a familiar faith Alexis should have came on and said, Hi, last time you saw me, I wait, you know a Stepford wife in suburbia and I was married to this guy and I I was I was in control of my boys. However, since then, things have changed and you're meeting the new Alexis and get to know me whatever. I also think too, it was too much of the Shannon thing. And that's the reason why I think Alexis and we'll see what happens this week.
In Part two, you know.
What it else makes me and you, I know you're going to feel this because you're from a big family. It's not fun to watch someone shit on somebody who's trying to get themselves out of a hole. We always say we want the best for every housewife. She's clearly really struggling. Why are we gonna be the worse for her? Why are we doing that?
Yes? And that brings me to Tamra Child.
We are just getting started. This is reality with the King and I'm Carlos King. Let's get back into the show. Tamar clearly listened to everybody, whether it was a tweet, me, the producer who said to her, you have to calm down.
Yeah, you just have to calm down. I thought tam did a.
Good job immediately apologizing as Shannon, because even Tamar was too much, and I enjoyed the fact that she said it immediately. The problem is this, Shannon has been on the show for ten years, and Shannon could see right through, like, you're only doing this because social media is right, you fulfilled And I don't believe your apology for a second.
Do you believe Tamar really is.
Apologetic or do you think she was trying to get in front of the story.
Probably trying to get in front of the story. Yeah, because I think when you're friends with someone that long and they've been through this unique experience, and you have a friend who is struggling and doesn't want to get help, you don't suddenly turn the switch off and then become
all zen and meditation. You just don't. There's too much anger resentment, which I think is a problem with the show right now, because you want to watch a show about a group of friends who actually care about each other, and I think it's to the point of no return with those two.
I think so too, And listen, I love Tamara and Tama's great for this show, and I think we all can agree Kate that Tamarra is needed for the show. I do think tamar went too far, and if I could offer some grades to Tamara, I said this to my podcast too. Obviously, Tamra and Shannon were best friends, and Tamarra has seen more things about Shannon, or no more things about Shannon than you and I could ever think of based on what we're.
Watching on the show.
But that doesn't make an excuse for yelling out your drunk and I don't care if you dislike Shannon or like Shannon. I'm not the biggest fan of Shannon, but I don't dislike her.
I love Tamarra.
However, when tamar yelled that at her across the table, I felt so bad for Shannon.
I felt horrible for her because.
Like you said at at the end of the days, it's humiliating and she's struggling.
Alcoholism is a disease.
It's a disease, and it's easy to say stop drinking. However, it's not that easy for a person who's struggling with that.
It's like saying, as somebody who's struggling with their weight, just go on a diet. What's your problem?
Yes, yes, yeah, it is. It is. Now. Speaking of the meeting, let's get into the k thing. Okay, So Katie, who.
I thought you meant me? I was like, wait, what, I'm on the show.
I'm sorry, Katie, to correct myself, Katie.
Emily Esquire decided to read up on everything that all these women are going through, and Katie is up next on the docket. So Katie is a new housewife where till this listen, as of today, I don't dislike Katie I don't love her.
I think she's okay. And the reason why I think she's okay.
Is that cast is so strong, and Katie does not do a good job at defending herself. She does have answers to everything. I think she my opinion, I think Katie is very prepared. I think her answers are so carefully chosen because she studied it the way Emily had to teach Shane how to study for the bar exam.
Right, you know.
You are mother and you are with your children every day, and obviously you have a great marriage to your husband. When a woman doesn't have well a mother, when a mother doesn't have full cousin of her kids and the son and Katie said, it's not me, and the son decides to stay with his dad. And it was revealed at this reunion Kate that Katie decided to.
Let her children be with their dad.
Because she said at the time she couldn't afford to have a lifestyle for them, which I understand too. What do you make of all of because a lot of people are like Katie, something else is going on to where this story still isn't making sense to a lot of people.
Well, I think that she is legally prevented from disgusting certain aspects of it, So that's why there are all these missing pieces and she can't address them. So I think she should have been actually been a friend of the show, because then you have the luxury of like going and participating in things, but you don't have to
crack yourself all the way open. And it doesn't seem like she's comfortable doing it, and I think it really makes it difficult for production to follow her because you're never going to get access to that piece of the puzzle.
Yes, and to me, it's such a strong piece to the puzzle because if you're going to bring up the fact that your daughter lives with you but your son doesn't, any person would be like, wait a second, you don't have your.
And the audience is mostly made out of moms, so let's to be honest.
Yeah, exactly, and so is this audience too. And that's the reason why listen, I'm not judging any situation, especially when I don't know the full details up. But it did raise the question, and when she gave the answer, obviously she was leaving things out. And you're right, perhaps there's a lot of legalities to it.
But outside of that, even.
The story, wait, let me put let me put it this way. If you have a cast member and they have a business and that business was sued and they were on the cover of Wall Street Journal and they were sued, and then they started to build another business up in their cast for the show, and you're like, holy shit, we got this person who was in the Wall Street Journal uxpose on the show. And then you start filming and that person's like, well, because of legal issues,
I really can't talk about it. Why were you hired? Yeah, you can't. It doesn't work.
Yeah, yeah, we don't. And and as as an audience, we don't care. The reason why we are invested in Shannon's personal story with John Janson Alexis is because we saw the history of all all the parties.
Involved and her and her credit. She bled for us, and that's why and that's why, Yeah, we're not down with Alexis. She bled for us.
One thousand percent, one thousand percent. Shannon was the MVP this season. She gave a lot to it. Yeah, she ran away from a lot of dinner tables, but nonetheless she bled for us. She was able to give us receipts and conversations about what she was going through and even the moments with her daughter. The thing with Katie that I'm struggling with is I just don't know what to believe. Let's get into the situation that happened with the police officer.
So bravo.
Docat has an Instagram post today with the slides and they did all the digging so people can go there and kind of read it. But the net is it was from over a decade ago, and you don't get her side of the story in the police report, so you don't the end The end result was they were sort of on the fence. They didn't know who to believe, so it was dropped.
Okay. So when she okay, so.
You're just as confused as I am. And with solves the problem, you will be in a perpetual state of confusion.
So let's let's let's let us talk about this Kate and stopping when I'm wrong.
So allegedly and there was in Georgia, correct, Yes, it was in Georgia, the state of Georgia.
So let's driving on the highway in Georgia.
Go ahead, Okay, Katie's driving, and she's allegedly texting while he's driving with the carpool kids. Yeah, a guide in another car sees this and pretty much yells at her to get.
Off the phone.
According to him, yes, okay, they.
Get in to a little she Katie's alleging that this guy is pretty much chasing her in the car, correct, right, right, okay.
But it was revealed that Katie followed him to his home.
According to the story, yes, and.
Then he called the cops because she was on his property.
That's well, that's what I gather.
And then the cops shows up, they arrested him.
Well, he was acting erratic, Okay, acting another part of it, So that there you go. This is like one of those things where you're like, okay, it's like a ping pong match and you're like, oh, okay, oh what are we all right? So at the end of it, if you go to the last side of the Bravo doc a Instagram, it's like, well, the charges were like were never there were no charges because the police could not make heads or tails of it, like who instigated it,
what happened? So that's my problem. But this whole thing is I can't go season after season trying to figure it out. I have enough documentaries. I need to figure out time jobs. This is too much.
I'm trying to figure out Dallas. Yes, exactly, go ahead.
She and she's just not very forthcoming, so it's hard. But I think it's a lot of legal issues that's.
A problem, and their lives are problem is the legal issues with her first husband, who obviously is not signing the release to be mentioned on the show, nor his son. The reason why the daughter's able to be mentioned on the show is because the daughter's are eighteen, so she's able to sign off her own rights to appear on the show too. So that's why audience Katie's daughters able
to do it, but her son isn't. Then you have this legal situation where look, Heather Debro said, you are you're used to falsely accusing somebody.
Do you know how long this man was in jail? Was like a few hours?
I don't know, because that's.
The other piece of the puzzle was seeing Jael for days.
I think what was interesting about it is she followed him to his home.
With her kids in the car.
And that's the reason why there are people who are like it's wild.
So I think that that's why the audience is frustrated because they want more information to figure out like what is really happening here, because we live in a time where there are questions about like legal issues, police issues. I think the audio house audience require or they want more information than they've ever wanted it, Like, you know, things may have happened in the earlier seasons where it's just sort of like it gets like kind of passed over.
The sophisticated twenty twenty four audience wants to know every single piece of the puzzle. And if you can't, then people jump to jump to assumptions that's jack me dangerous.
No, and it is, and it makes a lot of sense based on that. You know, when she talked about.
Her kids, and this was the first time we saw Katie get emotional, and it propelled Heather Debre to walk up to her and give her condolences what happened, apologize to her.
What do you make of that?
Do you think Heather realized, oh shit, this could go back for me. If the audience, you know, sees this as a minority woman who was profile by the police, or do you think Heather was sincere And.
Who really knows, But Heather strikes me as somebody who's like, this isn't worth it, Like, I don't even know if she's gonna be on the show next season, so why are we bothering? I think that's the way Housewife think. I don't think they think in broad scopes like that. Seriously.
No, I'm laughing because it's true.
Do you think most of them are like, Wow, I really didn't think about the cultural implications of blah bla blah blah. No, so like you're gonna be fire next season? So kissing ship.
What do you make of Katie's husband?
He's lovely. I've spent time with him. I really love him. He's a wonderful cutie.
He's so cute.
Yeah. I went to the beach one day and they were there, and I was walking up with you know, a lot of kids and a lot of ship, and he walked all the way out and picked up all this stuff and carried it all the way. Real gentleman, very nice.
Oh he's a great guy.
Yeah, really really nice person.
Do you think Katie will come back next season? Yeah?
I do. I do because I think real friendship is important for the for the loituvity of these shows and jenn Is staying because she's got these this crazy story chasing her and she's going to need a friend. But I don't I think she'll come back to Katy go come back to the show. But I don't know if
it's better. I feel like it may be better to have her as a as a friend of only because the story with her ex seems very complicated and if you can't tell it, I wouldn't put it out there for the protection of the other kids too.
Yeah, and and and and I think to not have the confusion between us and the audience. I think, Look, I think Katie deserves to come back as a friend. I'm listen, I'm just being honest. I'm not invested in her personal story. It's because it's it's it's it's not a lot that she's able to say because of legal situations. And I get that her husband seems like the nicest guy in the world.
I I don't want to see them argue. You know what I mean?
You know, you get the sensor like happy.
Yeah, and I yeah, and I and I and I like that.
And I think I think Look, based on the fact that Sutton allegedly told Heather that Katie used her to get on the show.
By the way, I think if you're on any housewb show, people are using you to get on the show.
Oh one, Just like Tammer said, jin you've heard it on the show. Look if right, if you're a housewife and somebody befriends you, they want to get on the show. But I don't think that's.
A bad thing. I think I think is playing chess. It's like, I want to be on the show. I understand it's my friendships. And at the end of the day, this is no shade Housewives. You also know bringing on somebody on the show helps you because your thought process is you have to be loyal to me because.
I got you on the show. That's the game that was played.
It's essentially like I am an executive member of a television or excuse me, of a company and I took a risk and let them hire you. And this, you know, this affects my job moving forward, So you better bring it and be respectful. Don't cross me because it stuck my head my neck out for you, because it could affect the way that I'm compt stated in the future. The opportunities I get how the audience looks at me. How comfortable filming is?
Yeah?
Yes, yes, And that's the reason why Jen was shocked that Tamarra came for her her first season, because I think Jen felt like, I'm indebted to Tamra and Tamra is the one who threw the napkin and Jin space and you saw the shock with Jen light I thought we were friends ocause of that reason.
Do you hear what you just said when she threw the napkin? Like they're acting like it was like World War three? She threw a napkin, that's song like dumb stuff in oca is. I couldn't believe that she threw a napkin. I'm like, what those are you serious? And the fact that she's surprised that someone crossed her, I'm like, have you ever watched the show before? Do you know what you signed up for? What do you think this was?
Like everybody goes to a duffy boat ride and wears scarves and has a cigarette extenders and they eat sharcuteries, Like, this is not what you're signed up for, stupid god.
So that leads me into Jin.
So Jen was in the hot seat because Emily Esquire decided to really take over the reunion and help Andy out by being the legal ego, understanding every single legality of Ryan's situation. So when it comes to Jen and Ryan, the girls seem to be very concerned about this relationship, and they think Jen is an airhead who doesn't understand that she's in a very bad situation.
Should we be concerned for.
Jin, yes, right, Like if I were a friend, I would be concerned, like why are you with this guy? And he seems to be the way he was joking in the season finale, like, oh, it's the like someone about the money his friend, the money launder. I'm like, you're flying too close to the sun. You're Icarus and you're flying way too close to the sun front. So I think she should have worked mission and get out. But I think she has been taught in her life that you should like have a man take care of you.
And I just think, you know, in the year twenty twenty four, if you're almost fifty years old and you have five children, you need to stand on your own two feet. And I don't know if this is the way to figure out how to do that.
I want to ask you this because one thing about you.
You're such a scholar and a deep thinker and a woman who understands a lot of women in the situations.
You live in Orange County.
You are a mother of five children, so you and Jen have similarities in that regard, right, What are your thoughts.
On Jin as a mother with five.
Kids, shuffling her children from house to house and still relying on her dad to give her money and now relying on Ryan.
To keep a roof over the head for her children.
It said so much to me in that scene where she's in Ryan's house. She hasn't paid the bills. She seems like, Oh, I thought my ex husband would be paying the rent, and like, why you're not together? Girl? Like what you First of all, she should probably not be living here. If it's too expensive, you have to get up and move. She confuses me because she's got all these bills that she has to pay, but she seems to have like a lot of nice clothing and
a lot of upkeep, which is very expensive. She's got the kids and they're at Ryan's house and she's in the kitchen with her parents, and she turns to her father and says, thank you, Daddy. D A d d Why da d D? Why think you daddy for basically bailing me out? Doesn't address her mom says to me so much like what, well, her father's taking care of her whole life. They have a marriage where the father is the some people I address that, and some people said, well,
he's the one that makes all the money. What the hell does that a couple in a marriage, The money is the same, The woman raised the children, that's the same. That was her job, same income, same tax, all same thing. But she only addressed her father. So she grew up in a home where dad goes out and pays the bills and mom raises the children and you have to
ask dad for money all the time. And she's still like operating in that same space like it's nineteen fifties, and I think that's dangerous in the year twenty twenty four, fascinating.
Do you think jen is going down.
Or maybe she has by the way, maybe she has issues with her mom. Maybe she feels like her mom pushed her to do certain things in life, and she didn't address her. But it was weird to do that on camera. I don't know. I feel like she moves through life. She she listens she's just different than me. I feel like she moves through life waiting for a man to tell her what to do, and I moved
through life figuring out to do it myself. Am I married, Yes, but I grew up where I always had to make decisions on my own, So I come from it from a totally different perspective. We grew up in a very different way. And I just think you're still living in like the nineteen fifties thing, and don't you want to show your kids the And maybe this is her way of doing it, is to be on the show and to be a TV personality and to make some income, like you have to share your children that you can
do things on your own. It's hard for me to watch because I don't have friends that are like that. I choose to be around people that are like, really independent and strong. And I just think she's like a Waffler, and Waffler's driving insane.
So is that the reason why you think?
If we look at the opposite couch and we see Emily Tamra and Heather tried to reason with her, do you think that's how they're feeling. I mean, obviously you are way more equipped to articulate it in a different way.
But do you think.
Those women feel how you feel and that's why they're struggling to get through to her.
I don't know. I don't know. It's hard to say. I just feel like that's my viewpoint. I think we all look through a different lens. That's that's the way I look at it. I don't don't, I don't know. Maybe Tamor is looking at like I was married to somebody like Simon who made me make like he made all the decisions, and it got me to the point where I'd just say I wanted a divorce while driving in a limo while being filmed for a television show.
I had to say enough of this. So maybe she looks at her and sees a younger version of herself, like two dependent on man. I don't really know the details of Emily's marriage. I'm supposed to interview her soon so I could ask her. But I suspect, you know, she probably didn't grow up with it. Didn't sound like a dominant father in her life. She had to like a single mother. Maybe I could be wrong, but she had to kind of figure out things on her own.
And Heather Dubro doesn't strike me as somebody who looks to Terry for all the answers.
No, this is a thing.
I don't know anything about your marriage, Kate. You strike me as Heather de bro in your marriage.
I yeah, yeahs.
Yes, your partners and I get the sense that you make the decisions. Obviously you run up by your husband, but I think he looks to you like you are the decision maker.
Yeah, I mean we in mind. You know, there are certain things where I'm like, trust me on this one, Like a lot of the school stuff with my kids, where he's like, are you sure, You're like, what are you talking about? I'm like, no, she should go to this school and we need to get them tested and we need to do that, and I, you know, kind of look to him for other things. But it's equal.
And my frustration and my hope for Jen, because I always wish the best for everybody, is that she gets a place where she feels equal in her partnerships, because right now it seems like it's certainly the one that she's in that she's hoping that he takes care of everything. She's admitted she didn't even have her name on a credit card until recently that's something that would I would hope that she would want her kids to see this. I didn't make the best choice, and I think she's
alluded to that. So here's my wish next season season after she really takes like charge of her own life, and she says two seasons from now, like I really was phoning it in for a while, and now I'm really proud of who I am, and I know my kids are proud of me too. That would be great, but right now I can't relate to her.
So Emily had a rehearth read calling her Tammy white Net stand by your man, right, which I was like, Emily.
I I don't know.
I give Emily a f at this reunion only because I expected her to be normal and I expect her to just be a little bit more present instead of like trying to like make fetch happen.
But I'll give her pass because she had a great season. So to say that to Jen, I mean, look, I think at the end of the day, this is where things are.
Jen's gonna stand by Ryan and that's just where you know their relationship is. Right Then Jen claps back in her at Emily and says, well, your entire in laws take care of you and and your situation, to which Emily did not deny in the moment she didn't which I watched OC and I felt like Emily admitted that, am I wrong case?
I think what's different, though, is I don't get the suns that she turns to him in bed every morning and says, so, like, what's our plan for today? What's our life like? Or can I have money to go buy this? I don't get. I feel like they're they're equal in the way they you know, they operate in their family. It's an assumption based on what I see
on TV. I don't know them personally, but yeah, I feel like jenn is like, you know, I really need this help for I would hate to be in a position where I'm asking a boyfriend like I want to sign my child up for soccer camp? Can you help me?
Yeah?
That's where I'm like, I want. I want her to have more because when you have let that financial stability, you have more control. I don't know, it's just worries me because.
That's the difference. So obviously, and I agree with you about Emily. I don't think Emily asked permission to Shane to spend money.
I think Emily just spends it.
I think Emily obviously has built this life for herself with her marriage to yes up the benefits of her husband being this extremely I mean having this extremely successful. Lets I can see of a family, right, and she reads the benefits of it, because yes, she is an attorney and she let us know thirteen times more times than Daniel Stopp got.
Engaged, so we're we're aware of that, right.
But she hasn't practiced law in a in a long time, unless I'm not seeing again, I'm seeing the subway sandwiches in the sauna that I did three years ago. But a lot of it is because you are definitely reaping the benefits of being in a marriage to where you don't have to practice law, and you're.
Age get that.
But also Jen did stand in the kitchen. She did stand at her kitchen and say or Ryan's kitchen and say thank you, Dad for bailing me out. So it isn't even someone bailing you out.
Well, see, so let's have a question, let's talk about it.
I feel like Jen Emily are the same person, except I agree with you. I think Jen acts permission I think Emily just does it, but there's yeah right, yeah, yeah, yah. And I think that's the reason why Jen looks at Emily like, girl, we're not that different. But I think to your point, Kate, I think Emily looks at Jen like we're not the same because you are with somebody who you have to ask permission for and at the end of the day, that's not your husband.
And do you also think the element of Emily's like you don't have a pot to piss in, but you've spent a lot of money. I don't think Emily has this like a crazy lifestyle. I think that's some of it too.
Fascinating.
This is why I love talking to you, because we break it down to a science in a very intellectual way.
I feel like people were listening to this and driving off the road. They were like yelling at you and me and the weed and whatever, like, what are you talking about? Yeah, listen, it's a jumble of emotions and observations, and you know, it's like a puzzle piece try to figure it out every episode.
Well, look, it's the reason why you and I both love oh see, and we're not into the other shows.
We talked about the top on this this particular episode because listen, you and I are obsessed with personal story and OC is doing a great job at giving us that and these women.
Listen, it's a great cast.
And the reason why the cast is great is because each woman is showing up being their authentic selves. And we may not agree with it or whatever, but at least they're being authentic to who they are. And you and I are able to look at that and say got it, whereas we look at the other shows we're like.
Of bad actors.
Yeah.
So with that being said, we have two more parts of the OC reunion and you need to come back on my show.
Well the other two. I'm putting you on the spot.
I'll be there waiting for Look.
Save here, all right, Kate. Let the world know they can find you, follow your support you. And this week you have an amazing guest coming us. So I want everyone to download your episode listen to it, because I am going to because I'm obsessed.
Director. I'm the director R J. Cutler of the Martha Stewart doc oh. I also Ashley Banfield from News Nation. She was on like MSNBC and CNBC. She ended up a News Nation.
Yeah.
So I have heard too. Okay, so listen to Reality Life with Reality Life with Kate Casey podcasts everywhere where you listen to podcasts. I've got six episodes a week. Also what to Watch List, I tell you what to watch each week. Go to Kateksey dot substack dot com. I also bonus episodes. You can find me on Instagram at kkseca, TikTok It's Kateksey, Twitter and threads at Kiksey. I'm basically like your best friend who's going to tell you what to watch.
And guys, she has great recommendations. So the Martha Stewart doc on Netflix is so effing good. If you haven't watched it, watch it before you listen to Kate's in to be with the director because you're going to see Martha in a very resting light and and and and it's such a well done doc.
And and Martha is Martha.
And she's one of those people to where you other lover or hate her, and I do think there's some in between. But I have to say she would have made a great housewife because she shows up as authentic as who she is, and I I love a woman who does that. And who's not trying to be what society thinks a woman should be. And I do think.
A lot of what she went through in her life had a lot to do with the fact that she was a woman who was And I didn't know this, Kate, she's the first female billionaire. I didn't know that she was.
I thought it was a Oprah truly truly self made, like self made.
So listen to Kate's episode with a Director.
I know I'm going to and make sure you guys listen to Reality Life with Kate Casey. She's an iconic, legendary podcast host that's been for so many years, and she also does unscripted shows, documentaries everything I.
Do, all the sports docuseries too, Yeah, what athletes on? And it's good stuff.
No, it's great stuff. Kay. I love you.
Thank you so much for popping on.
And she'll be back next week to recap part two it of the Real House Vice Orts County Reunion rain Drop.
I'll catch you on the next one. Bye. Thank you for listening to Reality with the Kings.
New episodes drop on Tuesdays and Thursdays, Share, comment, follow, and subscribe to Reality with the King wherever you get your podcast visit Reality withthe King dot com and be sure to follow me at the Carlos King Underscore on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, and Yes Baby, my YouTube channel where you could get all of my visuals, Baby, my expressions, Yes, and don't forget Tweet me your thoughts and hot takes about this episode using the hashtag reality with the King.
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