Welcome to Reality with the King. It's me Carlos Kings, the King of Reality TV and one of the most sought after executive producers in reality television with over ten years of production experience. Twice a week on Reality with the King, we'll sit down with my friends across the entertainment industry, recap our favorite reality shows, and revisit unforgettable moments that we are still talking and tweeting about.
Hey, rain drops.
On today's episode of Reality of the King, my girlfriend is back, my sister from another mister. I love it when she's on. You guys loving when she's on. She's everywhere my love. Give it up for the amazing punt intended Kate Kasey.
Hello, I'm so fired enough, ready to talk, so excited.
Should we just die right in? Because I felt like, well, let me just start here.
Obviously, we're gonna recap the latest episode of The Real Housewives Ability Hills. You and I have the best spirited conversations because sometimes we're aligne sometimes we're not, But at the end of the day, it's the best conversation ever.
I really enjoyed this episode, you did.
I enjoyed the I think the previous one. More, Okay, that was more in my style, where it's just like you get to go to someone's house and you meet their weird parents and then you figure out, like why they're such a weirdo. I love that more. This episode felt to me like I also like it, but not as much. This is like almost like a workplace comedy. They don't realize they're in it, but it's a workplace comedy.
Yes, it's like the Office or something. Yes it is.
Oh god, why is his name? I'll have a brave part. The lead actor Kate from The Offense.
Oh, Michael Scott, No, that's the character. Oh well yes, but yeah, the actor Steve Carell.
Thank you, Kate, Steve Carell. Sutton is Steve Carell.
She's She's definitely not most observant of oneself, that's for sure.
Yes, it was fascinating, but let's just get right into it, because the beginning of this episode obviously is the continuation of the previous where Sutton is an Augusta Georgia and I along with you, I want to say, me and you do agree on this, Like, Sutton is obviously a very interesting character on the show. We don't get a chance to see her children because her husband unfortunately won't sign off for the kids to be on the show.
But wait a minute, aren't they over eighteen?
Are all of them over eighteen or the some of.
Them at least two are?
So are they just not interested?
Probably? I think the daughter may be graduating from college. I think I read that she's going to go to law school or wants to go to law school, so she might be like, this is not my vibe.
Yeah, yeah, no.
And I think the other goes to maybe the Citadel. I think he's in a military academy.
Oh Wowow do you have to say, I do look at someone's kids and and if they're as you know, as successful.
As they seem, you do have to give it to some and then her ex husband. I mean, they do seem to have raised successful kids maybe and maybe wise for them to, you know, keep off the show to maintain their anonymity.
Similar to but it sucks for us.
But it sucks for us. I know Erica Jane too. You have to say, props her. She seems to have raised a very successful you know. I was just say, they all kind of seem to have raised really nice kids.
Are good, Yeah, even like Mauricio and Kyle great parents, the kids are great.
Yeah. Grsel seems like a really present, about understanding, empathetic mother, So props to them.
Yes, what are your thoughts, Ariba, I want to get your thoughts.
Oh, a lot, a lot, I have a lot start. Definitely a product of her generation. She even says it, and I when she said it, I kept thinking about my own relatives. I think that women that are well women. I think both men and women that were born to parents that were in the war or out of the war are much more cold and detached because that was how they were raised. They were not coddled. It was very much like keep like my own mother would say. If I ever cry about anything, my mom says, there
are other people have more problems in the world. Keep your chin up, keep moving. And I think that Sutton was born in a home like that. I also think Reba's interesting because she's a therapist. Sometimes I find therapists are interesting characters because they're so great with their own clients, but not so much with their own kids.
Like kn' is still a bastard and her mother exactly.
And then the added component of Reba's definitely in deep grief because of what happened with her husband. I think that she is confused by her daughter because her daughter seemingly, I think, in her eyes, has had a great life. She had every opportunity in the world, was a successful, successful ballet dancer, was married to someone with an abundance of money and resources, and lives a very nice life. And she what I got from her was like, what
are you complaining about all of those things? And she's a woman of a certain generation in the South, so the scenes that she has with Garcel are are so jarring. She is so dismissive of Garcel, like that one scene where she's sort of dismissive of her and then Kyle walks in and she's commenting on her beauty. Yeah, very painful to watch.
Yes, it was painful for me to watch. Listen.
Riba is a woman that obviously grew up in an era where it was in the South, no less right where it appears.
And I'm not going to call her names because.
We're not here to do that, but it doesn't appear that she may not have had the best interactions with people who are black, right, And it was jarring for me as a black person to watch it because I was sort of like, I felt uncomfortable watching it, and I felt uncomfortable for Garcel because to me, I felt like Garcel was trying so hard, so hard to have a connection with her, and Riba just wasn't here for it.
She just wasn't here for it, even saying to her when Garcella is like, look, your daughter wants you to say you're proud of her, and she's like, well, I don't think that's any of.
Your business, and look, it may not be. It may not be, but.
I also think there's a way of telling somebody to mind your business that didn't seem so hard. I just felt like that was one example in addition to tons of examples in her treatment towards Garcel and what I will hope to happen at the.
Reunion and this is me just being honest.
Garcel has talked about Dere's microaggressions. I need for Garcela to talk about Rebus and if that's not brought up, it's it's going to be an issue. Because when it came to Dorry saying all Garcila, you're attacking me. The line was divided in terms of whether people thought it was microaggressions or at the end of the day, the reasonal reality show with women and housewives attack each other what Riba was displaying to me and to the world.
And it's funny because.
A lot of my white friends text me and said, I just want you to know I feel uncomfortable watching this right. So my hope is that Garcell can talk about dreads microaggression is that she said she had we have to address ribus.
So I wondered too if there was some sort of interview that they did with Sutton where they asked her about that, how her mother was kind of cold, not kind of absolutely cold to Garcel, how that made her feel. And I wonder if they didn't include it. I would be shocked that they wouldn't ask her about that. I mean, it is so obvious. Why why would you not? That's like the first question I would have, like, where was that?
Do you know this?
Kate?
On the after show, Sudden revealed that Riba returned the gift back to Garcel.
Did you know that?
I did not know that.
So the spark that she gave Riba, Riba returned it back to Garcel.
I want, like, is Sudden afraid of her mother? Could can't she say something to her like this is one of my closest friends. How dare you disrespect her in my home? Nonetheless, is she like afraid of her? Is that what's going on?
It appears to me that this not to be a psychiatrist, because I'm not. But one thing I was told and I would love to get your insight because you have five beautiful children and I.
Want to get your thoughts on this.
A woman once told me that a girl's first bully is her mother.
It's in some cases, right, huh.
It appears to me that because Sutton was also to her dad, possibly there could have been some jealousy there with Sutton and her mother. Not and listen, I'm not blaming Sutton at all, because a child should not should not be blamed for how their parents treat them because the child was did not ask to be brought to the world read.
But it is very cold to Sutton.
And like you said earlier, your mother was like, girl, wipe them tears. There's other people who have bigger problems, and I think that's okay to no.
I see, I see my mother and Reba trust me all you do?
Oh?
Yeah, that is that's how I was raised with somebody who is very cold and detached, extremely cold and detached. Yes.
What is her advice then to Sutton as as an adult woman who is now, you know, a mother and was able to you know, have children and maybe look at some of what your mother did to you as a way of saying, well.
I'm going to be different.
Well, you can't ask some money who is devoid of interest and introspection to suddenly gain some It's impossible. The only thing you can do is set your own boundaries. So you need to say, you know, in my home you will not do the following. This is not acceptable to me. But you can't expect her to suddenly have some introspection and insight because it's it's just never going to be there.
Yeah. Yeah, and that that appeared to be evidema.
Look at the very end, she she told her daughter, I love you, with the resounding applause from Cogre and Garsel and listen for me. I appreciate the fact we were able to go to Augusta because I strongly believe that we're eating reality star if you want to understand them, and I and I felt it was very hard to connect to and as a viewer because we don't see her children, we don't see her ex husband, we don't
see a sibling, we don't see a family member. So we finally got a chance to see Riba, and I think after seeing that, I'm not able to understand a lot about Sutton. I had a chance to meet her recently. She was lovely, very kind, very nice, but I always felt that as a viewer it was just hard to connect to her because there wasn't enough to deal with. And I'll ended with this, Kate. It reminded me of how Kenya Moore Atlanta Housewife as Harold did us like
the best villain that Alance has ever seen. And that season we went to Detroit and we went to her mother's home right and Kenya knocked on the door and we heard her mother say lock the door. And that that scene, one hundred percent of the audience said, I now understand Kenya.
I actually have always felt a real connection to Kenya because there is something that is deeply painful about the rejection of a parent for me as my father, but for her to go into pageants was her way of This is the part that I absolutely related to and I think a lot of people do. When you have a parent that is dismissive abandons you, sometimes you go on the other side of the coin where you try to have incredible success because you're chasing the acknowledgment of
a parent that never will give it to you. You just won't. And that way, I think that there is a common thread with Kenya and Sutton. Sutton's never going to get the acknowledgment that she wants. The one thing I did think was in her own small way, was that her act of like an act of her own empowerment to have them come to Augusta the camera crew, but being selective with just two women, so instead of
having the total ensemble cast. Her relationship with Garcel and Garcel having time with Reeba may have been fewer and far between, but was that her like an active defiance against her mother too, Like I need you to spend time with this very close friend of mine. I don't know.
Listen, I I can pick up what you're dropping.
I think it was I have a friend, she's black, she's successful. I really like her, and I want you to spend time with her. Because I never thought about that. That's why I love having you on. I think Kyle coming along with listen, I always thought it was weird, like you guys aren't that close, So Kyle coming I
always thought was weird. But I think Kyle was used as a buffer to make her mother feel more comfortable, like I'm going to bring my black friend and I'll bring my white friend, so that there seems to be some balance. I do agree with that one thousand percent. I think Son was very, very a thought acol in her attempt to try to get her mother to really see her life. And look, I think I wonder if Someding regrets having her mother on the show.
Because I'm not the only person saying this, You're not.
Everybody is saying like, look, Reba appears to have a lot of things she needs to work on when it comes to the way she treats people.
And she's a therapist. You know, I have a relative who is a priest, coldest person I've ever met in my entire life. That is always what shocks me, Like, if you're not an empathetic person, why are you a therapist? Why someone hating children and being a teacher? What huh? Am missing something?
But I never thought about that because I think people are listen. I'm glad you're reminding me. Is a therapist?
Yeah, but Riba needs to see needs to see a therapist.
But I think they typically do. They typically do. I only know this because I watched a show about therapists, and they typically do. I would love to know who all of her clients are. To her clients all look like one kind of person.
Mm hmmm mm hmm.
I think so if you can be so cold to your daughter's friend who was nothing but lovely, lovely, and then to add insult to injury, you return the gift. It's a scarf. I mean, it wasn't like it was like.
This, like so rude about it, like what am I going to do with this?
It was like a liberachi, you know, sort of like artwork that that's a little bit like, of course, like not her taste.
It's a scarf that.
Obviously give to your cleaning lady, give it like give it to the mailman.
But to listen, I'm gonna move on from it.
There's a message to me that was sent by her returning it back to Garcel. I think I think that sent no pun intended. I think it's sent a very strong message.
To me, Yeah to me.
Okay, now speaking of strong messages and a strong drink. So here we are listen. Derry is having a Fourth of July party celebrating America, and everything is done in red, white and blue.
She's getting things together.
It's early and she arrives Dery in typical three fashioned pun intended. Is it her closet getting ready for you know, getting gland ready? And Sudden is there for a long time, but then Kyle comes.
They go in the backyard.
Garcella is there, and then a conversation ensued about whether or not Sutton has alcohol in her drink, and Duri made a common like it's suthing. Of course it's alcohol, and Sutton lose this her shit and cost her a bitch. Yeah, and Dereise says, I would like it if you don't call me a bitch in my own house, and then Sutton leaves.
I mean, kay.
We have a lot of pactages from there because there's so much more that happened afterwards.
Yeah. Well, here's my question for your audience, because I have not known many people that have alcoholism or a loved one with it, so this is a question I have. Is it strange? Because it seems strange to me that
Durak the season has talked openly about Pek's alcoholism. She suggests that a sponsor was the one that suggested that they get separated, and she's been flippant about the possibility that PK and Kyle part of their friendship is based on their shared sobriety, and then makes flippant comments about Sutton and her drinking. Is that strange?
I love you so much because as if you were.
I laughed at the moment because to me, it was like feeling funny, and that's why we watched these shows. But then, Kay, as I kept watching it, I swear to you, I thought about, like, wait a second, you talked about your husband and his alcoholism and the things you've seen, and you know, we talked about how the
retold everybody with an earshot PK was an alcoholic. So even if it was a flippant joke, I think, look, knowing what you're dealing with, and then to even use that as a joke, I did find weird after I really processed this moment because of what we've been seeing and largely one of the reasons why a lot of people do feel bad for duree Is because of what she had to experience with PK's alcoholism and having a
sponsor and all those things. So if you think for a second that something does have a problem, and listen, no one has said she does.
I want to be that very clear. But if you feel like well drinks.
A lot, one would argue be a little bit more sensitive if that's the case, based on what you're dealing with with your husband.
Yeah. Well, I have one friend in town, and I remember I said to her, I don't know, about six months ago, something like about her ex husband. He said he I noticed, he said he doesn't drink. And her response immediately was, that's really his story to tell.
Amen.
And so when I watched those scenes, I thought of my own friend and that response, And so it's strange to me that Duriek doesn't have a little bit more empathy or says something like that. So we have a little bit more contexts.
Yeah, I agree.
Agree, I said the same thing when she when she told both for the first time, I sent this podcast. That's not your story to tell people, that is PK story. Just like when a woman is pregnant it's not anyone else's story to tell people.
You know, this woman's pregnant.
Sutton obviously had a strong reaction, and I want to get her thoughts on it, not to diagnose Sun either. She did say that she's sick of it because they tried to perpetuate last season in the season before that, that she drinks a lot and.
That it messed her up. These are her words. It mess her up.
You know, people are gossipping about it, and she's uncomfortable. I understand where Sun is coming from if that's not if because she feels that way and she said it now the remay and I have known that obviously, but I too would be upset if you're trying to make jokes about me and drinking. Anna Marie was on my podcast last season and she made a comment that about Sutton, the cass make comments about Sudden and her drinking, whether or not she has to.
Her coffee cup whatever.
Do you think something was right for having that strong reaction based on they're constantly perpetuating these rumors with her.
Well, I mean, it's hard to say, because it's that's how she feels. I think that what I'm missing from Sudden under read is a little bit more explanation and there, and they're in the moment interviews or they're confessionals. It's like if alcoholism is a touchy subject in her own space, so in her own interview, I wish that she would talk a little bit about that why it upsets her, because there's there's some freedom in being able to express
yourself if it's just the one on one interview. So I think if I had a little bit more of that, and if I had a little bit more from Derey about her marriage, because it just feels like it fell out of nowhere, Like she said we're better than ever at the last reunion, and then all of a sudden the season started, she's like, you know, I don't know who he is anymore, but she doesn't explain it in
those solo interviews. I think if I had that element, I would be a little bit more maybe understanding and less confused. So I think both of them just feel it feels very disjointed to me their personal stories this season. I don't feel like I have really a great grasp of like where they're coming from and where they are right now in our life.
Yes, because the thing is this DERI and I agree with you.
They don't do the best job at explaining what's going on, because let's have a real conversation, Kate.
They hide stuff from us.
Yeah, like dere MPK issues did not all of a sudden happen right doing the break.
You guys have been hiding matter.
Issues because you wanted to once again perpetuate that you guys were good.
Same thing of Kyle. I love you some, Kyle.
Clearly you and maurisil have had tons of issues throughout your marriage that you neglected to share on camera.
So that's why we're confused about this.
I should have included her in that too, all three of them. I wish that you know, all of them would kind of say, by the way you could see in two sentences, I haven't always been completely honest about the status of my marriage. I have felt at times uncomfortable really revealing how I feel personally because I wanted to protect my children, or I wasn't really willing to admit the things that I've done in my own marriage that was not of support to a partner who I
now understand was completely disconnected to me. Whatever, I just need a couple of sentences and I think that's true of Kyle Dory and Sudden. There's a real disconnect. And and I say this because in fairness, I've said that about Eric past seasons. Yeah, you know, we've taken Erica to task for that, So why are we not taking them to task for it too?
Yet?
Listen, one thing about the Beverly Hills Housewives, and I love them all. The show is not known for personal story. Let's have a real conversation. True, you know, it's not known for us seeing the cracks of the relationship. You and I always talk about Needing Leeks being a great housewife because she always showed you the cracks early on, right with her father. Your favorite scene in the world of Atlanta was going to Athens and her meeting her
father on the park benches. You saw the cracks in her relationship with Greg unfold to where you know, you saw the hierarchy change in terms of she's the breadwinner and he's not identified anymore as a powerful man.
You get to see some of these things with Belly Hills.
The unfortunate thing about Belly Hills to me and I love the show, Unfortunately we get the end result and we don't get any backstory.
We can't. We're filling for divorce. Hold up one fucking second. I didn't see one argument. Think about it.
Of all the divorces from Beverly Hills, we were never led up to that moment occurring the way the way the way we were with Tamer Judge and her ex husband in the limo, like we we saw the build up because we saw that we was saw with Vicky a don my love bubble. My take is it was like he's a good guy. Though Vicky, we don't see
that on Beverly Hills. So again to your point, when sudden has this big reaction, I want this son to explain to your point in interview, look, when it comestant drinking, that's a sense of subject for X amount of reasons or I need more. Because to see Kyle and Garcel run after her, I understood Garcel doing it because they have that friendship. The Kyle things surprised me, and maybe
it's because they just left Augusta. But in Beverly and Kate, you know more about that world than me, sister, I think I'm on both side it terms of it's a bit uncouthed to leave the house.
Oh, the house party.
Well, but it's also uncouth to wait have someone wait forty minutes at your own party, you know. I always say it's the small things that say so much about somebody. That's why I'm like, like, bo Is, why are you talking to Dree? Seems to me so absolutely selfish an in her own world, like the fact that you would invite people and then not even come down because you're inherent makeup. It's like we're going, not going to the oscars. You're still in a little scene here, like what are
we talking about? Although I will say I still can never forget when she's talking about PTSD from the robbery and PK is like like, get over it. Do you remember how weird that was? Too? Yeah, like if someone broke into your home with a gun and like what weird?
Yeah?
Yeah, I'm like are we on planet Zorb?
Like?
What where? How do we get back to Earth? What is happening here?
Weird child? We are just getting started.
This is reality with the King and I'm Carlos King. Let's get back into the show. So did you did you think it was hypocrisy? Because when Kyle left the Red No, it was it was Bozy Ban yeah, when Garcia garself. When Kyle left, Bowsey bent the whole pamp event, and a sudden was like, who does Kyle think she is the fucking queen? I'm paraphrasing, Yeah, but something pulled the same move Kyle clocked in.
This is when it becomes a workplace comedy. They don't realize where they're in a comedy, but they're in a comedy because it's all employees pissed each other. Because why do they get to leave work like the retreat early? Why you know that's all it is. Yes, that's just power dynamics of like on the show, they don't it's not really about real friendship and feeling distant or any of that. So that's a workplace situation, right.
Yes, yes, let me tell you something as a as a reality producer. Okay, when it's an ensemble show, nobody meaning a cast member does not want to feel like another cast member has one.
Leg up on them.
Whether that's they get to behave this way and get away with it, they get to leave early, they don't have to talk about their personal story.
So when you guys see something in.
The previous episodes, complain about Kyle, I hope you guys understood she wasn't complain about Kyle within the within the confinements of this quote unquote sisterhood, there was more so Kyle is the og.
Why does she get away with certain things?
She gets away with not explaining to us about more game, she gets.
Away with leaving a party early and can take the.
Because Cole admitted this that after she left, she took a few days off of work because she had to get herself together, So Suton was complaining about that. So when Sutton decided to give Kyle a taste of her own medicine by leaving, I did find it strange that Again, I'm pretty sure Sudden when she was texting somebody my belief could this happens to me when I was a showrunner on Housewives. She's texting the producers allegedly like I'm out of here and don't fucking stop me. Yeah, yeah,
it's Kate's right. It's a power dynamic. And what you guys aren't seeing that I can explain to you is the barbecue had nothing to do with how much Baka Sudden had her cup and had everything to do with the power dynamics of how these women feel about each other, and that's the reason to me why they slightly broke the fourth wall and Kate, I can't wait to get the thoughts on it, because I know you caught it too when Kyle and Garcil was chastised by Bows and
they gave it back to her and they started talking about like, why are you her mouthpiece? Why why all of a sudden are you standing up for her? That conversation, guys, was about the alliance that they all have and they're finally addressing it.
Yeah, absolutely without a question, you know. Coupled with that, I have a question for you because I was thinking about this when these cast members join these shows, because you have the privilege of meeting them oftentimes before their first season or even like in their early seasons, and then you see them kind of transform into different people
the longer they are on. Are there any actual cast members that do have introspection after watching themselves on a show, or do you find that they get more and more selfish? Because what we're asking for as an audience member and a lot of the scenes is for someone to have a moment while they're filming to go, wait, you know, I am being ridiculous, or at a reunion saying I watched that scene back and I realized how absurd I was being, or how I had not really given that
person the benefit of the doubt. When I watch scenes like that, the one that you just mentioned, it seems like they're getting exponentially more selfish and in their own minds, it almost seems impossible for them to have a level
headed conversation. So my question again is do you find that people who join these ensemble shows do they become exponentially more selfish and less introspective as time goes on, or is there are there exceptions to the rule where there are actually cast members that go, yeah, what was I thinking?
It's rare to have a cast and saying, oh shit, I looked at myself. I I look crazy. It's on me it listen. Unfortunately it's rare. What happens is they blame editing and it's like, okay, so we put words in your mouth, or like, we really have so much time on our hands to sit back and say, how can we make this scene so interesting that this person can be seen as a villain and this other person to be seen as the victim. Nobody has that time to do that, so like, I want to start there
with you. It is rare, unfortunately, for a reality star to have a little bit of introspective.
Moment of saying I look crazy or that was the nicest moment. It is rare. Does it happen? Sure? Unfortunately.
What happens more is they don't double down on.
It the next season. What they do they become a recluse.
And that's the reason why you start to see reality stars play up to the cameras for the fans. I've said this once, and I'll say it again, and you and I should do a separate episode about this. Social media has ruined the reality star for sure, because they're afraid to say anything and fear of getting canceled. They're afraid to say anything in the fears of having a TSUNONYMI of negative comments.
One of my examples will always be Diana Jenkins.
Who was on the show two seasons ago, who I felt like was being her authentic self, which at the end of the day, that's all we could ask for, whether or not you liked her agree with her, that's why we're here. We're here to watch these episodes and judge them based on the episode. We're not supposed to judge their behavior outside of the show, because I don't give a shit.
I care about what habits on the show.
She is somebody who Obviously I've never seen this any for any housewife.
The way Diana Jenkins was.
Negatively bullied by social media, I've never seen anything like that for any housewife.
I'm being honest with you.
A lot of these housewives and reality starts are afraid of that happening to them, and that's the reason why you see them being safer. Duri is an example of somebody who I love the first two seasons because she was herself. Whether you liked or not, she was herself. She got negative comments and I felt like she became a recluse, and now she's getting her power.
Back, and that's the real dey we're seeing.
I don't know if that's the real deate we're saying.
I think it's I think it's the real side of her. As it relates to her being fed up, I think she yeah, how she she's Derey has realized this in my opinion, as I'm watching her, I need this job. I'm going through divorce. I will be a single mom of two kids. I lived a certain lifestyle. I can't go all the way backwards. Dart is like, these women aren't really my friends. So I'm going to just be brutally honest. I'm not gonna play it safe anymore, and I'm gonna cast shit out as I think it as
I think it. That comment with about something there last season would have thought it but never said it.
Derie is now saying things how she.
Feels in the moment, and she's unapologetic about it. Now when it comes to Bows defending her, I want to get to thoughts on this. I feel like they're all mouthpieces for each other. I Likeell his mouthpiece, Bows is dereyed and and and Taddy Mellercount was Kyne.
They all had it.
I don't understand why. And then Lisa Renda was Erica James. Let's let's let's not act like this mouthpiece is new to us.
Yep. Well also, and circling back to your original question about that moment where you know someone's running out and then you know, to your point that obvious alliances on the other side of it, you side of it, the crew side of it. What are the messages, what are the conversations that you know you're being pulled aside because I'm assuming it's like, why aren't you showing Why aren't you showing that side of her? Because the burden is on your team because you have seven stories you're trying
to tell and how they weave together. But then they become less in the moment and trying to understand and connect with one another, and they're so in their head about the mechanics of the game, which is the alliances and how much camera time and why does she get to leave and I can't? And how much am I being compensated if I have to be here longer? So
what are you experiencing on that other side? Are you getting the text in the middle of a scene, like does someone go into the bathroom with their phone and say, this is straight bullshit? She's about to leave when you didn't let me do that and I I'm not going to stay right.
Yes, you'll you you will get a text message, you'll get a phone call. The funny thing about being a reality TV producer, and this is back in the day when I was a we call it a field showrunner. So for my audience, it's when you're an executive producer. You're the showrunner and you're in the trenches like you're on set for the for the for five months. I obviously have graduated from that because I have a company, so I have a team who do that.
Right. Well, I love you, thank you, baby.
But my experience as a showrunner on these shows, you bet your ass. If a reality start leaves and she is able to go home, oh honey, you would not hear the last of it. These reality stars keep score, are bad and.
They notice everything.
They'll notice if Carlos King is talking to one five minutes longer than somebody else, why does she get all your time and attention. I'm like, well, she had a question that require a longer response. They noticed everything. They do not want you to treat them differently. They do not want any and let's be clear they they're right about that. Producers should not treat cast members within favoritism. Right now, there are cast members who need more attention, right,
you know, based on what they're going through. Right I'll give you an example when Nini Leaks was going through her divorce from Greg Leaks. This was during season four and I was needing Leek's producer Kim Zoziak's producer and Charas so hints me in therapy.
Okay, that is just that's one book.
That's one book.
That's my book, the Trifecta and me being responsible for them as a producer.
Wow, Nini was going through divorce that season. Nini needed me more. So I was there for her more.
I remember constantly having to, like after a scene, stay with her at her house and like sit with her in her bedroom and just talk because because she needed had a tough day. Whereas Charae was fine, like Sharay had a great season that season.
She was funny and she didn't need me as much.
But you have to understand that they're all watching that and what the good thing with me is I've always was able to explain, like, girl, she needs me more.
You know what she's going through. Okay, got it.
But if it's something so minuscule like I'm leaving because she pretty much said I had a drink, that's the ship that they don't like. And I appreciate this is me. I appreciate bows. In my opinion, bo saw that Okay, this can blow up.
In terms of a higher situation and favoritism.
Let me make this about is the retome because at the end of the day, these girls don't see it that way because they're filming. It's like camera crews, right, they don't. They don't look at this as I'm in this woman's home. Is too many production crew members around.
Also, Boz has worked in corporate America. Yes, so she has managed people. So this is another element that's fascinating. But if we just froze that scene for a minute, just freeze, freeze all the players, okay, and then the camera would pan out.
Uh huh?
Would I see a producer in the foyer or in the driveway or on the front porch with one of the cast members going you better get your ass back inside? And would I also see a cast member or maybe I'm just imagining this is what I would do outside, maybe outside of the house at the window, gesticulating to a producer like this shit is not working. I want to go like, is that the stuff that's happening on the periphery? Uh huh yeah, okay, so okay, yeah, that's the show I want.
Well, that's the show I love. That's the real show. So I'll tell you what I would have done. This is what Carlos King, as a former showrunner, would have done in this in this case, and this is a true story, and I will tell you one story of pod I did.
It to in a scene on on Jersey.
I'll tell your Jersey s Okay, that's a good example. If I was a field showrunner on Beverly Hills Housewife and I saw Sutton get up because she was mad that dymade a comment about her drinking, right, which to me isn't the the It's not the most hurtful negative thing to say that. That is like explosive. That's my opinion. But I'm not, of course diminishing how Sutton feels. Right,
this is just me watching the show. If I was there and something it's like, I'm leaving, I Carlos would have said, while something was hiding near the bathroom, did you peep that, I, as a producer, would have more than likely been in the bathroom and said, come here, Yeah, what's wrong?
I would have said something. Is it that deep? If it is, tell me.
I just think you're able to articulate yourself and explain to her, because again, my audience sudden, they're not going.
To understand unless you explain it to us.
How about you do this, how about you say I'm leaving, but before I leave, let me explain to you why I'm upset and why I need to get out of here.
I would have done that, like explain it to her, can you give me that?
And ten times out of ten she would have right, because because again a reality star would say, I'm just being honest.
Here, two things would have happened.
She would have said, Okay, that makes sense, and number two, okay, good, I'll look good. I'll look good to the audience. I'm just being honest.
Okay.
Now my example on Jersey, Okay.
That infamous scene.
Season two, the country club, Danielle, Jacqueline, Teresa.
Yep, this is when Danielle got chasing the country club.
They're at this plash fashion show. Right, it's the first time in the season that Danielle staalb, Jacquelin Laarreta and Teresa July's are the same room.
And by the way, those fashion shows, I kept thinking, now, especially as I get older, the madness of the crew, because it's so wild. And then you have Kim, who is I don't know, she's sort of like a friend of the show.
She's a friend.
He's in the middle of it, and you're trying to get everyone's point of view. That just seemed like complete madness.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So again to your point, we're filming this for two hours because of the madness you just described. The fascist Show's over with and Teresa's like, did you like it? I said, the fast show is fine? I said, would you like to talk to Danielle? And she said, oh, you know what, Carlos, I actually do.
Oh wow, Okay, I actually do. Because let me tell you something. I'm just being honest here.
Teresa Judas is one of the best reality stars I have ever worked with.
Ever.
Does she easy to work with?
Teresa Judais is one of the easiest women to work with.
She gets it and she lives for reality.
So she's because the thing Teresa new, Let's let's have a real conversation, Kate. This is Teresa's second season, so obviously, first season she flipped the table.
It could have changed since then, though she may have.
Well, I'm gonna say, based from my experience, right first season, she's the face of the show.
After finale, she flipped the table.
Yeah, Teresa obviously got Harold did and people loved her, so she gets it.
Second season, She's like, let's keep this train moving, you know what I mean, Like like.
Oh, yeah, yeah, I'm on the magazines.
Yeah, Teresa understood Danielle's here and we're not going to talk to each other.
And I said, Teresa, talk to her. Do you want to? She said yes. I said, we'll talk to her.
Where is she? Carlos my producers say to me, she's in the bathroom. I said, okay, there's there's a chair by the bathroom. Talk to her where she comes out.
Okay.
So that's why when you watch an episode, you see her Theresa casually sitting by the bathroom just waiting because she's like, I want to talk to her.
I'm like, well, talk to her. Did and listen to Danielle stops credit. This is why I missed the old days of reality.
Yeah, because they all understood, like, we're not going to be at this. It's the first we all got it. That's why Danielle said. Daniell could have easily said I don't want to talk about it. Danielle understood with Teresa said hi, Danielle goes, you're talking to.
Me and yeah, yeah, but that feels like it's becoming more and more impossible.
It's because social media. A lot of the reality starts today. They play up to their fans. Yeah, and they don't want.
To be real. They want to be strategic.
It's strategic and that's why that's why Salt Lake City is so fascinating to watch, because I think those women are like we Those women get it. They just get it. They get it. So I would have done that with suthing. What did you think though about this whole conversation because the deepness between Dewy and Kyle towards the end of the episode, right Derey obviously doubled down on Kyle, saying that she doesn't know anything that is going on in
her life right now. Kyle think its defensive and says, you all know I'm separated, but I feel like we need more, and I feel like Durit is like I I want more, and yeah, it's just it's I love Kyle's with my favorite housewife. I think Kyle's having a season, a challenging season because the audience wants more and we're not getting it, Kate, We're just not getting it.
I listen. I don't know her personally, but I can definitely look at footage and make my own assumptions, but I think a couple of things. I don't think she and Durrey were ever very close. I think it was like a show relationship. Yeah, And I feel like Derrey has this suspended belief that at some point in time
they were very deep, close friends. But that speaks to so much to me of the relationships that duri has in her life, which are probably a lot of Durrete talks and somebody else is sitting in the same room. I think that Durret or excuse me, I think that Kyle and PK were far closer friends because PK would be at their house all the time, probably complained a lot about Dreet and their marriage and their finances and
things going on. And I think Kyle knows too much, and when you know too much, you can't unsee things
or unhear things. So I feel like those scenes where it's like, are we friends, I don't think they were ever particularly close, and I don't think there's any chance for that now because Kyle knows too much, and I think when she says throughout the season, I don't know who you are anymore, I think it's because she's used to Durete just sort of like shuffling her feet behind, not really saying anything, and she's sort of like, oh, now you're a TV star, Like, wait, what's going on.
I think that Kyle personally probably is in this very weird vortex because she's been married all this time. I would assume it's hard to get divorced when you've been married that long and you have that much financial connection. Yes, so she's probably trying to unravel that, the fact that he's probably dating and dating younger women, which is a whole head trip. Right. She's lost her best friend who died by suicide, which will take an infinitement amount of
time to walk through grief. She's got daughters that are older, and we've seen and seenes they're very connected to their father. The blessing, by the way of Mauricio's show on Netflix was to see his point of view of his life, and he's super connected with the daughters. I don't think I would have known that had I not seen that show, because that's not really shown on Beverly Hills. So she's also like struggling with now they know they all work
with him, they all want to spend time together. Where am I in this family? I'm on the outs. I think she's struggle because she has some sort of relationship with Morgan. I don't know if it's either like a friendship or romantic, but it seems to me that Morgan does not really want her to discuss her at all on the show, obviously, and she feels like, this is a big part of my life and I'm not able to discuss it, and I am I've got a responsibility to the producers to be have a certain openness on
the show that I really can't do. Am I supposed to do this show anymore? But she may need the show for her own career or financial setup, et cetera. I think these are all the moving parts that are going on in the background and why we're frustrated because I don't think she wants to be honest about a lot of that. But the reality is if she were, I think people would be more empathetic.
Listen, the reason why we about you loved or hated her, right, Monica Garcia, the moment you saw the dynamic with her mom, Yeah, true, and she was open about it. You were like, okay, got it. Even when you think about someone. I want to give one more example, Giselle Bryant. When you saw when you see her relationship with her daughters, it gives you a different point of view of her. You're like, Okay, there is a softness there the way she loved her dad.
You know what I mean?
You see it that, Kyle, I agree with you. I think Kyle wants to do it. I think when it comes to Morgan, I agree with you too. I think Morgan said to her, this is too much for me. Yeah, and respectfully, Kyle's like, you know, sign up to be on the show.
Got it.
I think Kyle and Mauricio, because I watched Buying Beverly Hills two on Netflix, I think they both set each other down and said, this is we have to be on the same page.
What we're going to tell the audience. Yeah, and they're not going to give us any more than that.
Like ever, and I think Yle knows that this show has been her second win in her forties when the show FIRS happened, and she is arguably the face of Billy Hills and she's NBC's darling right, she does Peacock Movies, Halloween. I think in Cole's defense, she wants to, but there's two people in her life that she made a commitment to and unfortunately she's unable.
To do it.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
So with that being said, Kate, at the end of this episode, we see the comic attraction of Mauricio kissing another woman.
Yeah, where do you think? Where do you think? Excuse me? Things are going to end up from here now for the rest of the season.
I don't know. Well, first of all, I think that there is a part of Kyle that really wishes she still were with Mauricio because she loves the family unit and she feels like she's let I think she's a people pleaser. I think she's even admitted to it where she feels guilty, and that's the burden of a reality star. I mean, Craig and Page probably feel this too, like where people see you as this couple and she feels like she's let people down in addition to her own family.
But I think there's too much damage there, and when you're married that long and your finances are co mingled, I think she's stuck in limbo. And I think if she were more honest about that, people would really get that like I'm stuck. I don't know what to do. So I feel like she's sort of on her own island. So I can't expect, I think, the rest of the episodes to see any moment of like real and deep connection because I think she's just so closed off from
the world. Yeah, bos, I just think it's hard for me to understand how she has the capacity to be so patient with dreycause I feel like Git lives on her own planet right and bos seems so like down to earth and grounded and has so much more life perspective because she worked in corporate America too. That I'm just waiting for the moment where Boz is like, I can't listen to this anymore. I cannot listen to this anymore.
I would love to hear a conversation between Garcel and Sutton about what happened in Augusta and that means how that made Garcel feel like I really would love that, And then Erica, I feel like I do like the moments where she seems to offer some like some like tell it like it is moments, but I still want to know what's going on in her life, Like I feel like, yeah, like what's happening with the lawsuits, Like,
how do you feel do you feel incredible pressure? Do you feel like you've lost connection with people because of it?
Like?
I think I would like to see more deeper stuff, but I have to say my favorite thing still is when we get to meet people's parents, because I feel like Origin tell me so much about somebody. The last part of the Origin story with Sutton is that I found it hilarious how much she complained about her mother when there are so many characteristics that are exactly the same. In many ways, she's like a watered down version of
her mother. She's she's got zero filter. She can say things that are very hurtful, Like there's so many things where I'm like, girl, it's you. It just reminded me of the Heather du Bro episode when we met her mom. Yeah, yes, wonder Heather feels like this all the time. And like Heather and Sutton said something similar, which I feel like
is so common for a lot of people. Probably with your parents too, where you complained about your parent and then it's like, okay, but that's what I was raised with. And it's very hard to untangle things that you saw as a child. And we tend to like duplicate things. We'll water down versions of her parents.
Kay, you always cook baby. Let the world know they can find you your podcast. I always have talking to you for your intelligent point of views.
Oh thank you. Okay, Reality Life with KKC podcasts everywhere we listen to podcasts. Sign up for my what to watch list of what to watch each week in unscripted TV, so documentary series and unscripted I've got a great list. It comes out every Monday. You can get it at katekc dot substack dot com and please join my Facebook group Reality Life with Kateksey because we talk about great podcasts, great books, great everything that you can think of, movies.
It's really smart people who have just the most wise observations. And I have to say your audience in particular, believe it or not on Twitter because a lot of people put Twitter down. The rain drops on Twitter are some of the most observant people, really just incredibly wise reality TV observance.
Ah, thank you for that.
And they love you, k they really do. And my range as on Twitter are super observant.
Thank you for that.
My sister from another mister, I love you, Kath. Reality like with kkse wherever you get to podcast is that it's an amazing, amazing, amazing, amazing, thought provoking podcast. She talks about everything under the sign, not just reality TV, just like documentaries, true crime and director's guests.
And we'll just tell you two things that you have to listen to it. Well, Number one, you have to watch a true crime doc series this week. It's called Fox Hollow Murders on Hulu. It's four parts. It's about a serial killer you've never heard about. He lived in Indianapolis and a lot of gay men disappeared in the nineties in Indianapolis because he was killing them. He had a big property and his wife would go away for the weekend. He would go to a gay bar and
bring them back to his home. Years later, they would find bones all over the property. So what's crazy about this series is now in present day, they have new owners of this property and you get to go with them to the property and the place is haunted. Crazy stuff happens there. It's like almost like Amity Bill Harp. So alcome Fox Hollow Murders. And then Saturday, my episode, I have a woman who was her dad was a guru Bookers.
Reality li KKC.
Yes, well, thank you, my love, and I'll catch you on the next one. Thank you, Thank you for listening to Reality with the King. New episodes dropped on Tuesdays and Thursdays. Share, comment, follow, and subscribe to Reality with the King.
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