Same Crime Next Year

ten years in prison. And lastly, some new possibilities in the John Benet Ramsey case which we never thought we'd see the day. And also my favorite case of the day is who stole Teddy's iPhone in Aspen. Guys, welcome back to real time crime. I'm Leo Lamar and I'm with my wonderful co host Hetty Mellencamp and sometimes did me Tree. I sometimes good to see you guys, nice too. Can we just start with fannie pack Gate because I'm really we really need to dig into this crime, Okay,

I'm so upset about it. The crime that you were wearing a fanny pack. That it was very it was very on trend fanny pack. It was anyway, it was very expensive anyhow, so obnoxious, but it was very cute. It was very excited. I went to a place with only humans that I personally know, private area. We were all tested, just to give everybody you know it's going to come at me for this. We do karaoke, We're

all having fun. I am seen with the Fannie pack on my body the entire night up Tom I departed at We know this because my husband has a phone call into me telling me it's time for us to go. So we go. We walk from where we were and askemen to our hotel, which is not that far. We may have, you know, done some husband and wife type things. And then I fall asleep and then I wake up the next morning and the Fannie pack is gone. It's nowhere to be found. There's no Fannie pack, there is

no phone, there's no nothing. And then here's the final piece of the case that really makes it a lot, is that I had the phone at a charge when I went out. I barely used the phone, which would probably take up what ten percent charge. The phone was off in the morning off. So there's a couple of things we thought were going to happen. One I left it in the restroom like maybe went to a last

potty break. But that didn't happen because then I talked to the owner, went to the place, looked through everything. Not there. Two is that it would have fallen into the snow on my walk home, but I I we did my steps the next morning. Not there. However, maybe the people that come and dragged the snow pushed it in and then that's why it killed the phone and it was off. What do you guys think? I take a couple of things, karaoke in a Fannie pack? Was this? So?

Is there a time travel machine in Aspen? And also husband and wife type? Yeah, I mean you guys would argued about picking up after yourselves. Question it was going to make the vet. No. I didn't nag him about who was being the kids up from school. I mean, you know something that takes around two to three minutes figured out. So you gave him a neck massage? So yeah, correct, So I gave him the neck massage. But then I was too booked up to plug in the phone and

do all those things. I have a philosophy, Yes, Teddy and ted it's ed I'd just be like together, it's ted, okay, fine, Team Ted got drunk. Yeah, in between coming home from karaoke and getting home from karaoke, thought the fanny pack was still on, but fannie pack had slipped off. How it was. Yeah, but when you're drunk, everything's tight. Like everything's tight, you know, Like, but I mean the lengths that I went. I even called the police department, reported missing.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here? Is it possible? What did they say? Is there any video footage? Stores like to see if anything walking? I went to the front desk of the hotel I was staying to see see my entering, like the levels. I went to to find this because not only was my phone in there, but my phone is also my wallet. So I had my VAX card, all my credit cards, my license to get home, all the things. And are there any credit card charges? None? It's probably somewhere in your we love.

Are you sure you're not wearing it? Did you look down? It's not on right now? And I bribed my kids. I said that each paid them a hundred dollars each if they could find the Fannie pack. Hilarious, impossible. I would have loved to have heard the police when you called the report you're missing fanny pack. But is it possible that your husband doesn't like the fanny pack? I thought you were taking your stuff out of it and

like threw it out. Absolutely not, because what he had to go through during the hours in which I had zero phone and now I have Cruise's baby little phone here. Um, it's not worth it to him. He would have just had handed over. Okay, So did you see footage of yourself at the hotel walking in with the Fannie pack. No. They were like, we can't, We're not pulling this out. I was like, I was like I was. I walked by the outside to go to and they're like, okay,

I found a Fannie pac Man. Judge Leah rules this uh fanny pack left in the snow in the mean streets of Aspen. Go back in the summertime, just as the snows melting in there. It'll be well. The other crime is that why would Apple or whoever it is take this long to send me a new one. I'm not like eight days out. Another girlfriend of mine just ordered her phone and she was like, oh, that's a

weird I didn't get it yet. This was yesterday and then she checked the tracking and it was delivered five days ago and signed for by someone who does live at her house. So you've got to be careful when the package arrives, by the way, you should be tracking it. Speaking of packages arriving, Speaking of packages arriving, the Potito parents have found like a petition. Wait, I'm so sorry, Teddy, so we got to talk about your crime, but we

didn't get to talk about I'm sorry. I do sound such a good transition that I like, I didn't want to miss out on the opportunity speaking of you know, I'll let you use this exact same segue in a second. Okay, great, but I'll just say one line, speaking of packages arriving, Leah might be dating someone. It's a crime that you haven't told us. I realized that I don't have my regular phone number, but I know, I just wanted you

guys to have authentic reactions when I told you. Also, I'm really upset that both of you gasped and that hold on. But I need to know something. This is very important. Does he have a head shot? What he hates Instagram? No, I didn't say does he have Instagram? I said, does he have a head shot. No, No, he's not an in front of the camera personality, so he's behind the camera. So he works in entertainment. Yeah,

you know what, I'm a true investigator. I'm more concerned that your segue to this was don't you want to hear about my crime? Lee is not the Segway person. It's me. That's my job here. He gets to sing the crime song at the end. I get to do. Do you think we should move on to real crimes or each other? We had we had like a week off and we needed to catch up on all the things. You better send me his picture. Oh you know, I'm texting you immediately after this texting on the new number

feels left out, That's fine, you have all right? Can we get into Brian lounge? Because we thought we were done with him? But I'm real interested. All right, tell us what you got? Teddy? Okay. So Brian Laundry's parents want the FBI to hand over his notebook and his parents have asked the FBI to hand it over they found that was found near the skeletal remains, the attorney says, and had been hoped that the notebook, which was submerged underwater for weeks in a dry bag may yield clues

about the death of Laundry's girlfriend, Gabby Petito. Steve, our favorite lawyer, told The Independent that Chris and Roberta are trying to recover the notebook as part of a formal proceeding to administer their late son's estate. Okay, so here's my problem with this one. This is still an ongoing investigation too. Where's the van? What's the update the last I heard that that is at the FBI. That's part

of it. And also, before they get that notebook, the Potito should at least be able to get Gabby's belongings back, which they have not been able to get from the Laundries. So I just think it's so odd that the only thing that can help them carry out the proceedings and finish their son's estate is this notebook. Yeah, what does he have in there? There's a part of me that's they're like, um, can you guys just not get to the final page. Make sure you read from the front.

But if you don't finish, we'll take it back. I know. I just there's they're not in a position to be asking the FBI for anything. Oh, I asked them for stuff. They sat on their hands, well we think they sat in their hands, well, the hand that they were feeding into the garden. Correct where Ryan still hiding allegedly, But Aslee, what what are they trying to figure out? The things he owns, what his last will and testament? I don't know.

I don't get it. I think it's a control thing, and I think that there was maybe something in there and they want to make sure that there was. It's like it's like the clock is always ticking. Well, what about how this hasn't even been formally connected. What about the Gabby's death hasn't even been formally connected to Brian yet?

You know, I think that this is one of those cases, much like the o J case, where no one will ever think that it was not Brian, Like everyone will always think it's o J, whether or not he's publicly guilty, and of course he did lose the civil suit, but publicly he's free. So I have a feeling it's the same thing. I think him committing suicide made it easier for people to not be able to connect the two because there was no questioning. But I mean, I still

think he killed the other two women as well. Allegedly. I fall into that too, because there was over the break, there was a couple of reports. There was one that they had played pool together the girls. What we missed us? He was too busy losing my phone and I was too busy dating. That's gonna take up some time. You got some got some stuff to catch up. And I

understand packages were delivered Dmitri. Gosh. There was a there was a report that they had perhaps played pool with those two girls in that bar, and so in my mind, I was like, okay, so that maybe they got in a fight, then he did something to them or something like that, and Gabby got upset and was like, I'm gonna I'm gonna say something. And then this thing's just unarrival. You know, when you commit a rhyme and someone else knows and I don't. I don't know. I've never a

minute a crime. You lost your Fannie Peck. You're a Fannie Peck. Yeah, I think that you are the crimer, the crimer. It's amazing what we've all. We've gone a little while since we've been gone, all right, I've clearly gained brain cells since then. So but the other exciting news, why don't you tell us about Gilaine Oh, convicted baby of federal sex trafficking charges for role in Jeffrey Epstein's abuses. Let me just say I did not think i'd see

the day that this title would be real. I know it's thought that she would get out of this somehow. Anyone else well I I the fact that she give any names in order to get a lighter sentence was slightly surprising to me, But then also not because she's one, well, not yet. I don't think she's going to I don't really think she doesn't want to get accidentally murdered. I I think that she would like for the security guards

near her to not be conveniently napping. So I think that she's probably maybe that's the only reason she hasn't talked yet. But in good news for her, her lawyer confirmed she could get the COVID booster before going and back into the How nice. Okay, So here's what happened. Okay, British socialite Lane Maxwell. You already know how obsessed we've been with this case and surprisingly how little media attention

and coverage there has been around it. She was finally convicted Wednesday of five federal sex trafficking charges after a jury concluded that she did play a pivotal part in recruiting and grooming teenage girls to be sexually abused by her close confidant, the wealthy financer Jeffrey Epstein. She was found guilty of five of the six federal accounts she was charged with and faces up to sixty five years in prison. So this is why I think that she

hasn't spoken yet. The judge has not yet set a sentencing date, so I think that there's still time for some sort of deal. But okay, that's just speculation on my end. Ever, a few names, every name she gives, take her like two years off. I mean she'd have she'd she'd be negative years in jail. Then the list is so long. I don't think she's going to give

up names. I think that she prides herself on having these high end relationships with people, and I think she will she'd rather I don't know, because it's not like that will do anything for her. She wrots in jail. I mean, the list is so long, it's gonna go far. I mean, she's going to pull out like a CBS receipt. It's gonna be like Sir Isaac Newton. It's like, what these people at the same time period, but while she was in jail, her husband dumped her. Oh wait, yoga teacher.

I love by the way, love love love that they felt the need to let us know by a yoga teacher, because it's like adding insult to injury. It's like, yo, it's by someone who's super flexicle. So you know, you know, it's like, Okay, we got it. Can you just say father, I mean not father? Oh my god, this is a child show. I mean, is it a child show? I'm just kidding. Obviously not. It couldn't be less appropriate, less

appropriate than than her crimes. She was convicted of conspiracy to entice a minor to travel to engage in illegal sex acts, conspiracy to transport a minor with the intent to engage in criminal sexual activity, transporting a minor with the intent to engage in criminal sexual activity, conspiracy to commit sex trafficking of miners, and sex trafficking of miners. She was not found guilty getting over COVID thank you. Of enticing a minor to travel to engage in illegal

sex acts. I don't know how that's odd, um so I guess they wanted to go willingly, which carried a five year sentence, so she would have been in prison for seventy years. And as the verdict was read, apparently she didn't even look behind her, and she just poured herself a cup of water and drink it and kind of talked with one of her attorneys, and you know, like you said, she asked if she get the COVID

nineteen booster. She only looked back at her siblings who sat in the front row before she was led away, and one of the victims, Virginia, she did not step forward. Um she wasn't she wasn't named in the case, but she did step forward early on, and I think that she was stated saying that she will remember this day always, and finally there was some sort of justice about all the young women who suffered at her hands, in whose lives she destroyed. So they know that Maxwell did not

act alone. They're hoping that others will be held accountable. And I guess we will just see how this plays out. But this was a really long road, and I mean, I'm just I don't know how this is going to play out. It makes me nervous, honestly, And do you guys think that she so her secret husband, the one that it didn't emerge until court papers in that they

were married. Do you think she gave him all that money because remember he tried to free her with they at point five million dollar bailed package, very casual amount of money. That's yeah, you know what if if my secret husband doesn't have it like that, I'm not going to marry him in secret. Um. I love this this this quote though, which Um, she has been behind bars for five nine days now. It has put a terrible strain on the marriage the inside. You think, what about

the charges? Yeah, what about try sixty five years in jail? Would that put some strain on their marriage? That's why you think she's gotta she's gotta cough something up. I mean, I'm not satisfied, like I'm satisfied that that she's been found guilty, But to me, that's the first step. If this doesn't go further down and more people that committed these crimes, you know, come to come to light, then

it's it's not a success. But sorry, I just feel like they're letting us know what's important to her secret husband because they identify fight she'd been behind bars for five and forty nine days and to put a terrible strand in the marriage. It's like he's just drawing little lines on a board, counting it every single day she's not there. And then they made it clear that he's

now with a yoga instructor. It's like, we get it, we get what's important in the relationship, but she Do you think that her husband should be guilty by association? That's the thing is that we don't know how much he knew or did not know. Did she hide all of her secrets from him? Why did he wait to break off the marriage that he want to see if she could get off because if she could, then they

would continue their marriage happily or whatever. Did he actually have no idea and once he found out she was this monster, he didn't want to be with her. Um, we don't know, but we will stay tuned and we'll keep you guys updated as we find out additional information. If what's your take? Do you feel like he's guilty

by association? Do you feel like he knew? I feel like if he ended up with her, remember she was like giving those ted talks and that's where they met when she was working with that big company, and he ended up leaving his wife for her, allegedly. And I think my guess is he probably had an idea that things weren't on the up and up, but he had no idea the magnitude of how bad things were, because remember,

Jeffrey Epstein had already gotten in trouble. But what I've also learned is Glene appears to be a quite a good liar and quite a good manipulator. So maybe it wasn't until things got real with her going to jail and everything that he started realizing, Wow, potentially married a monster. Okay, you know what that kind of feels. It kind of checks out because it feels a little bit like a succession. The relationship between Shiv and Tom. I haven't seen it,

so I can not pretend if you'd like. Thanks sometimes, Dmitri, Yes, I'm familiar. I like to think he's not as big a moron as Tom, but who knows. You just don't know some people, you know anyway? All right, um, teddy, we're waiting for an amazing segue. Well, in that sentence, another sentence was changed. Oh my god, she does it again. Truck drivers sentence reduced from a hundred and ten years

to ten by Colorado governor and fatal crash. Colorado Governor Jared pull Us on Thursday commuted, let me try and then you got it. You got this college. I know it's the reading part um. Colorado Governor Jared pull Us on Thursday commuted the prison term of a truck driver who was sentenced to a hundred and ten years after a fatal accident in two thousand nineteen, reducing the sentence

to ten years. I know we talked about this last episode, but Roguel Aguilera Madros killed four people on April two thousand nineteen after he said his break failed on the downhill grade on Interstate Interstate seventy eastbound outside Denver. Prosecute argued that he acted recklessly and made a series of poor decisions before the wreck. Police reduced his sentence by a hundred years, saying in the letter Thursday that the life sentence was inappropriate for a tragic but unintentional act.

While you are not blameless, your sentence is disproportionate compared with many other inmates and our criminal justice system who committed intentional, premeditated or violent crimes. I really never thought i'd see the day. I mean a lot of people spoke out on this, and I think that that is what helps when people are speaking out. When I mean all of those truck drivers coming forward saying they weren't

even gonna take that route. Um. One of the main questions is do you guys think it should be less than ten years or do you think ten years is fair reasonable? I think four people were killed car crash and he was speeding, so I don't know if it was a downhill speed situation, but he was speeding. I think he was going eighty five or something, which apparently truck drivers are only allowed to go forty five on the UM. Yeah, in that area. And there's a part

of me that thinks he was a little reckless. Um, we don't know why he was speeding like that. He was reckless. And and while I think it's clear from watching the videos his heart is in pain and he really did not mean to commit these murders, it's like it's still happened. It's hard because it's clear he's not a murderer. You know, he didn't like plot people's for something. But but it did happen. But it did happen, and it was a massive tragedy for people's lives were taken.

It appears the family there is at least one family that agrees that the sentence should have been shorter. I think that he can still live a full life. He's only twenty six years old. He'll be thirty six when he gets out. They'll probably even less than the sentence more let's and he's still going to be able to raise his child, you know, like he has the opportunity to continue living where the people in the accident that died are not. So I think it may for good

behavior if he goes in. I imagine he'll be out in less than ten years. And that's a heck of a lot better than and that's that. But are we gonna agree on Kim Potter guilty of manslaughter? But you should probably tell everybody about this. So Kim Potter was found guilty of manslaughter, and Dante writes death and everyone was waiting on this trial. This was another big trial

that everyone was waiting for the resolution on. So in case you don't know about the case, a suburban Minneapolis police officer ak Kim Potter said she was confused by which side her handgun was on, so she confused her handgun for her taser, although her handgun was already in her hand at the time it happened. Um. And she was finally convicted of manslaughter Thursday. And I mean essentially what happened was it was a traffic stop. There was

an altarction, um. And now she faces about seven years in prison under the state's sentencing guidelines, and prosecutors are saying that they are going to seek a longer term. She's being held without bail and the pending sentence is going to happen on February. She had been free on a hundred thousand dollars bond posted like in April and when she was charged and she was three. She was free three days after she killed him, and a day

after she quit the police force. So as I'm looking at the story, by the way, I'm remembering what it felt like to be present when this was happening in real time, and I remember how heartbreaking it was because before there were all the facts everyone was talking about. You know, how could you, as a longtime officer forget which side your taser is on and which side your gun is on your train for so long to know the way of each which side each is on, so

you don't make fatal mistakes like this. And I remember waiting to find out and hear that she actually was holding her gun and it was pointed at him. So for her to say that she, Oh my god, I can't believe I mistook my gun for my taser. It's like you don't shoot a taser. Well, she was yelling taser, taser. I mean, even her testimony and where she kind of breaks down all of it. I was looking for a cheer to drop. Yeah, she doesn't want to go to jail, but she even said in the moment, I'm going to

go to jail. Right, she knew she was going to go to jail. I mean I googled. I googled, I googled what a taser looks like, what some tasers look like versus guns. Also, I mean, I've never I don't have a taser. I don't have a gun. I don't know, And I mean some tasers are in the same shape as a gun. However, if this is your job and your I could decipher the difference in a picture. So this is your job and something you've been trained to do. Unless you are so beyond deathly frightened. I just don't

know how you could make that mistake. And there was no reason to be frightened in this because she he was just trying to get away. He wasn't trying to right, And then she tried to say that the other police officer looked afraid. I was like, no, he didn't let me ask you guys, this is it a matter of she just got she got confused and shot and heated in the moment. Is that the thing? Or did she shoot him and then realized later, oh, I gotta come up with an excuse, and came up with a taser excuse.

It feels like it happened so fast, and she didn't mean to shoot the gun like she she meant to shoot it, obviously. I don't think she meant to kill him. But then the second she realized she killed him and she's like, oh, no, it's my taser. I meant I thought it was a taser. Yeah, I don't know, because also you don't shoot a taser, you know, don't you well know, there's I looked this up. So there's some tasers that are like this, like like this with like

two little things. And then there's some chasers that look like a gun. Yeah, but then do you shoot it and it has ranged to hit something and the hangover when what's shot him? And it came out on like a cord and it's stuck to him, and then he just kind of pumped the There are shooting types, all right, I take it back. Well, maybe you know what, maybe maybe she didn't think about a taser. All I know is that we need to make a transition, and you

guys are making it very difficult for me. I'm trying to keep us on track here, and I only think it's fair that I'm gonna gip the transition and get right into it. I don't think I should cover the Elizabeth Holmes recap. I think it needs to be used. Since you embody her in so many ways, why do you think it needs to be me. I can't believe I was found guilty on four out of eleven federal charges. I didn't even do anything wrong besides fool everyone and

steal all their money. So yeah, that's what happened, Elizabeth, Elizabeth, we didn't know special guest, Elizabeth Holmes, that's this week. Unlike Gallen Maxwell, my husband didn't leave me just because I was guilty. He had a baby listening, Okay. Elizabeth Holmes, former CEO and founder of failed the blood testing startup Thearapis, was found guilty on four charges of defrauding investors, capping off the stunning downfall of a former tech icon icon.

She was found not guilty on three charges concerning defrauding patients and one chars of conspiracy to defraud patients. The jury returned no verdict on three of the charges concerning defrauding investors, and the judge who was presiding over this case is expected to declare a mistrial on those charges.

We'll see. So the charges that she was found guilty of were one count of conspiracy to defraud investors as well as three wire fraud counts tied to specific investors, and she faces up to twenty years in prison as well as a find of t K plus restitution for each count. So she left hand in hand with her partner, Billy Evans. Also, I just wanted to go back. Glen Maxwell's secret husband never came to even one day of

her trial. M Yeah, back to Elizabeth Holmes. So she left hand in hand with Billy Evans, her mom and her dad were there. She was part of a fifteen week trial. It was a really complicated case, and they read the statement out loud the courthouse by a spokesperson, and they let everyone know that she was guilty in a large scale investor fraud and she will definitely be

sentenced for her crimes. So the jury of eight men and four women determined that she was guilty on accounts pertaining to investors, but none of the accounts that pertained to defrauding patients. So that's interesting because that lets us know that they actually genuinely believed she didn't know the technology was failing, but she did mislead people in investing in a product that was failing. So maybe it's they don't realize she didn't realize the magnitude in which it

was failing. But when you hear all of the people that worked with the product what they said, they repeatedly would go to her. Yeah, I don't know, it's it's kind of odd. I mean, the jury, you know, was reached a standstill on a couple of those counts. And I think it was a really difficult case for a lot of people because it was so complicated and complex and she's very convincing, and there are a lot of

parts to this case, But I don't know. I think what they were tasked with determining was whether she was this well meaning founder who made mistakes as she built her little startup that became a huge startup, or whether she intentionally deceived investors and patients in order to help herself and her company succeed. So, I don't know, what do you guys think. Well, we haven't gotten how long she's going to be correct. I think it was twenty years,

but not I think that's estimated. Yeah. So, I mean, I I think at at least she's getting something. You know, for a while I was worried that she wasn't gonna be held accountable for any of her actions. Yeah, so I think this is a start. You know. I don't think she's one that's gonna really go back and like think about what she did. Like she doesn't seem to have that remorse or anything like that. But we're just gonna have to wait and see how long the sensing is,

see what ends up going on with her husband. I mean, and the sad part is that she does have a child, and you know that's gonna be a hard thing for the child to grow up knowing. M Yeah, but we have to take a little break and then we come back to talk about John Bennett. I can't wait. Okay, so we are back. I was the one who said, I really want to talk about the John Benet Ramsey case.

I am. I have been obsessed with this case for years, for years, but I have to say that looking back into it now as an adult versus when I saw it all over the news stands as a kid, it's so different. So those of you who don't know, which I'm sure big majority of you do. John Benet Ramsey was an American child beauty queen who was killed at the age of six and her family's home in Boulder, Colorado. A long, handwritten ransom note was found in the home.

Her father, John found her body in the basement of their house about seven hours after she had been reported missing. She had sustained a broken skull from a blow to the head and had been strangled. Grew up garrotte garrot What is it? I think we're just gonna pass on the pronunciation. Okay, we're gonna pass on the producture was found tied around her neck. The autopsy reports stated that John Bennet's official cause of death was asphyxia by strangulation

associated by cranio cerebral trauma. Her death was ruled a homicide. The crime is still unsolved and remains an open investigation with the Boulder Police Department. Nineteen six December twenty three, Ramsey's host a Christmas party at their Boulder house. About thirty people attend, so a lot of people in the house getting their DNA everywhere. On December, the Ramsey's family attends a Christmas party with family friends outside of the home. After they get home, they put John Bonet to bed

and this is the last time she was seen. Five fifty two am, Patsy calls the police to report her daughter, John Benet has been kidnapped. She claims to have found a ransom note on the stairs that she was getting up. Six am police arrive at the Ramsey home. Officers conduct us search where they do not find Jean Benet. Then another police officer arrives and has the father go search apart, which is sooth the family friend. With the family friend who was at the party, they go down to search

and where's the first place they go to the basement. Also, the first police officer that came in walked right to the door of in front of where she was being, where she was, where her body was, didn't open it, and then turned away and went back upstairs. Yeah, I mean to continue on so many things. Um. December, the County Corner determines John Benett died from asphyxiation. Her death

is the first officially ruled a homicide. On decem investigators announced that they have taken hair and blood samples from John and Patsy. They also announced John John Benet's adult have siblings are out of town during the murder. So after the police officer was like, go hunt for your own daughter in your own house, which already is odd. Um,

they then tampered with all of the crime scene. Yeah, they picked her up, picked her up and brought her upstairs and covered her with a sheet, and it's like already okay, go on, multiple people touch her, It's all right. January three, investigators proclaimed the ransom note found by Patsy was written after the killer arrived at the Ramsey home because it appeared to be from the notepad at the house. It's also a very long ransom note, and some words

are misspelled and some aren't. So which is by some words I mean the exact same words like business is spelled wrong ones and correct ones, like there are words that I repeatedly spelled wrong, like don't judge like your um, honestly, to be honest, I'm judging. Yeah, you said not to judge. But but like business, you either know how to spell it or you don't. Don't misspell it at the beginning in So that's a state of panic, right. And also they later found a note that there was someone who

had practiced writing the note correct um. Then February thirteen, District Attorney Alex Hunter announces that they formed an expert prosecution tax force, vowing to bring the killer to justice. Forensic expert Henry Lee and DNA spashals berry Check both involved in the O. J. Simpson defense team. So they're never going to bring the murderer to light. Yeah. March seven, according to the handwriting analysis, John Ramsey did not write the ransom note found in the home. The same analysis

did not rule out Patsy. On April nineteen, one of the investigators working on the case officially named John Bennett's parents as possible suspects. April thirty, investigators conduct long waited

formal interviews with both John and Patsy Ramsey. I'm gonna stop here for a second because something I didn't realize until now is that in the media anytime, I mean, this was on the cover of every magazine constantly when this was going on, the magazines came forward and said, or somebody came forward and said, let me repeat this. It was found out that the magazines were sold more

any time they said that. The parents didn't. So they're saying that part of this maybe a news media, you know, kind of circus, and the media just kept driving one storyline because they wanted to drive sales in their magazine, not necessarily what was going on. Because I remember when I was younger a thinking it was the parents, and then I thought it was the brother. So the Ramseys

are again interviewed. This time is kind of like the Amanda Knox case, where it's like they just wanted to believe it was her even if it absolutely was not right. So then they interviewed the brother, Burke Um and then later on, like years past, he goes on and does a Doctor Phil special, which did you guys see it. Okay, look, this is again kind of like the Amanda Knox situation. He seemed to be unbothered. He was like kind of smiling. I just think either a, if he's not guilty, that

he was numb to all of it. It had been so long and it's like how many times can you produce tears and you just it's like so much time had passed, and maybe he's just been through the ringer and he's like whatever, b he's uh like just kind of unwell, like he's an awkward, uncomfortable person, and that was just like an uncomfortable face. Like I know that when I get uncomfortable, I laugh and it's like time like brand that's something ill. So that's my excuse. What's his? Well?

My son sometimes like when he doesn't know what to do, or he like smiles like he's like so maybe that's what was happening. We don't really know, but it was. The other option is that he's guilty and that he's

right because of the pineapples. Yes, okay, but either way, John Bennet's brother ends up filing a In December of two thousand sixteen, John Benny's brother files a seven hundred and fifty million dollar lawsuit against CBS, a production company and seven investigators involved in a TV special that aired in September that accused him of killing a sister, and uh he reaches a settlement. The current update is twenty five years after John Bennet Ramsey's killing. Investigators have tested

almost one thousand DNA samples. In a statement marking the twenty five anniversary of the murder, Boulder Police said they actively use new technology to enhance the investigation and checked regularly for DNA matches in order to solve this case. So, thanks to huge advances in the DNA technology, multiple suspects have been through the system to check for matches and as updated, over seven fifty referenced samples with the latest d A technology. The Volder Police Department works closely with

cb I and future DNA advancements. So that leads me to believe that they found d n A that was not anybody else's not the parents, not the brother, not the family, friend or whatever. Right, so they must have some sort of d n A that they're trying to match to somebody. Well, so they went back and forth on it. You remember this this like like I'm sure that there's new evidence present because of the technology. But

they went back and forth. They first said no one in the family committed it because they found DNA in her underwear. That because they also thought that she was sexually abused before she was murdered or after or somewhere in there. Um, they were saying that there was DNA in her underwear that was not from the family and from not from the family, right, And so they apologized to the family, saying, oh, we're so sorry that we

blamed you. Um, you're all pardon And then they tested a bunch of other underwear from the same company and found that there was traces of DNA in all of the underwear, even when it was prepackaged. So I know, so then they said never mind, you might still be on the hook. But then they came back. So it's so there's always this new DNA question. And I was really in the Glenn Meyer theory. Teddy, were you there.

I was partially with the Glenn Meyer but then especially because as he was dying and had dementia, he would just make a shrine to her. But there's honestly, like twenty men that did that. There's the photographer, there's Santa there's like, I mean, it's unbelievable. And then Jehn Mark Carr, who was actually arrested. Yeah, so wasn't he let off because he actually was found that he wasn't even in Colorado,

But I don't know. I mean also things like loose Smit said he was the like the head investigator originally had never lost a case or something like that. Um, he said that they said, in order for somebody to get through that little window in the crate and all of that, they would have had to be technically like a small person, and he was like a tall, grown man able to get in and out. I watched the video of it happening. I just think there's so many

inconsistencies in the story and what we were originally told. Well, we were also told that Burke was sleeping at the time of the nine one one call, and there was also another mysterious nine one one call from the house, but they hung up earlier that earlier that night, and you know, she woke up, she was still in the same clothe she was wearing from the night before, and she was a known perfectionist, and you know, the letter specifically said do not call the police, and she immediately called.

So in my mind it's like, you know that there's no real threat because you wrote the letter. But that's that's one option. The other option was that Glenn Meyer was waiting in the basement and once he heard her call nine one, he killed John Bennet. And he had a key to their house because he was renting out a room in the basement of their their friends who lived in the same neighborhood and they often walked the Ramsey's dog, and so he had a key and he knew and he had met John Bennet, but that his

DNA was not found on her either. There's also the idea that it could have potentially have been the housekeeper because the housekeeper on maybe it was the day before Christmas Eve, had asked for money from Patsy. Patsy said no. So they were saying, maybe she was described Aldo, this is something she and her husband had done. Nope, no DNA from them either. Um. Then they even tried to reach out to this woman's sons like it It's it's one of those things where it's just there's so many

different caveats to it. Even the fact that she had she had undigested pineapple with the only fingerprints on it that bowl were Patsy's. No, no, were Burkes. And so there's a theory that well Burke apparently hated John Bennet, especially because she was the baby and with like in her bed in, like smear poop on her presence and all this stuff, and they had a huge rivalry, and a lot of people have a theory that perhaps they were fighting over the pineapple there's a late night snack,

and he accidentally killed her. There's theories that he hit her over the head with the flashlight and didn't mean to hit her that hard. Also, the tool that was used to exphyxiate her was half of a paint brush or something that came from inside the house. Patsy Um. Patsy's paint brush was part of a handlebar to the

axphyxiation tool. So I don't know, I think that you know, it seems like also a lot of people knew not a lot of people, excuse me, not a lot of people knew that the amount of the bonus that he got was add eighty thousand dollars that year for Christmas from his work. And also these are very wealthy people who are They're super affluent, and they have a lot of affluent friends, and they have a very specific community

and also hold a lot of power. Um. So a lot of people were saying that this is also why a lot of the investigators quit on the case, because they felt like they were just getting so much heat for handling it poorly. The crime scene was completely contaminated because they kind of let John do whatever he haunted, and he kind of got too much of a say

because he was such a powerful person allegedly. Um, the fact that the ransom note had almost the same exact amount of money he got for his bonus is also very telling that it's someone who knew. I'm going to say also in a final note on this, I think there are a lot of people who believe that the case is too cold to actually find an answer at this point. And to those people, I say, I disagree. I don't know. If you guys remember the Melanie Road case in Bristol, this is like the case was solved

thirty years later because of DNA advancements. I mean, there's there's a ton of stories that I've seen of old cold cases being solved because of DNA advancement, so it is possible. I think it's possible. I hope that the true murderer comes to light, whether or not the person is dead or alive. I just think that everyone wants an answer, just closure, resolution. Yeah, and especially I mean, it would be better sweet to find. This is the twenty five year, this is the anniversary of her death.

This this holiday so heartbreaking, It's beyond heartbreaking. But yeah, let's keep let's keep digging, guys. Um, I think that's all. That's all we've got. We're out, guys. I really missed y'all. Oh my god, I really missed you guys too. I've really missed talking crime with some of my favorite people. But you guys should call in and announce how excited I am about next week's episode. I know I've already done all the research. I'm so obsessed. Did you watch

the show yet? I did? Okay, So for those of you that are obsessed with watching Netflix crime documentary Crime Scene, the Times Square Killer is out on that sex right now. It was trending number four last time I checked, so you know it's hot. We're gonna have the director on next week. We are so excited. To talk to him and this is I'm just so excited about it. So make sure to go watch it so that when you listen to what he has to say about it, we can all kind of just sit and on our heads

as he talks and just take it all in. And then so I'm giving everyone homework who's listening. A little bit of homework is good for the soul. And until then, leave us a voicemail. You can call in live at eight six six one crime. That's eight six six twenty one crime eight six six to any one crime that's eight six six twenty one crime eight six six two one two seven four six three. If you've got any questions, comments, concerns,

cases we should take a look at. Next week we'll also dive into one of our voicemails from one and I think that's this has been real time crime. I'm Lee Lamar. That's sometimes Dmitri and Ted and Elizabeth Holmes send us been to your boyfriend, gotta go bye, love you guys. It's real time grad. It's real time grod. I mean, is it actually real time crime? I'm solving anything?

Or is that just the thing we say? It's a thing we say got it, Okay, See you next week for more real time crime, only on I Heart Radio