Hippie Hunting w/ Sascha Ciezata

Yeah, from the five to the six we be in the mix with that rare candy paint job on the whip. I need food for the kids, money for the rent. Fuck a lock down baby. I can't do that shit now. I'll never vote because I'm fucking broke and either way I know the police ain't gonna leave me alone on a plane by the physical and rock me. Crypto told me I should be in the. Glock way. So I packed up my piece and I'm sliding slide. Because we might get caught up

in a riot. Middle finger Trump, middle finger Biden fucker, left fucker right as you riding see it. Those rocket in. No politics baby. We just talked. From the birds to the bricks. We be in the mix with the rare candy paint job on the web. We with. Okay, I'm pleased to have Sasha Cesada on here. And he wrote a how do you say that? Do you do you write these? Do you draw these? I know nothing about comics.

I don't what would do with like, I guess he's the author of a of the Hippie Hunter, which is like a graphic novel noir centered around Paul Tate, the father of Sharon Tate. Very, very, very fun read. I've been seeing your artwork on X for a long time just coming up there. So it's really nice to see it like kind of put into like a a narrative and stuff. So that was that was really cool. But I mean, I'll ask First off, your appearance on the Bret Easton Ellis podcast.

Not only am I jealous, but it was actually really good. And I'm a huge, huge fan of that show. And so since you know, he he had a pretty rough last year, like just personally and stuff. If you, if you've been following Brett Ellis's life and stuff, it was he, he perked up a little when you came on, which was nice. Like he really just had like had that, that interest that he had that and then the detachment. Sometimes he gets really detached when he's in a, when he's in kind of a sad mood.

And I felt him perk up. So I was, that was really cool. And you, you got a bunch of feedback on it, positive, something negative. But I I think a lot of people listened and liked it. Yeah, no, I've, I mean, I've known Brett for like 20 years now. Like, you know, we're we're we're, we're friends. And actually, I haven't seen him in a few years. I haven't been back to LA since like 2021, I think so.

So yeah, this is kind of a good way to reconnect with him, you know, and I'd never been on the show before, so, you know, it worked out. But but yeah, he, he, he's, he's had a pretty rough man the last year or so, you know, But, you know, he's, he's, he's, he's bred. He's always like that. He's always kind of like very, you know, I don't know, medicated. Like his. Like his books. I mean his. Books read that way a lot of

times. Too it's it's it's like meaningfully, strikingly funny, also kind of a malaise to it, you know, and it's it's like watching the world burn around you and you have a few jokes about it A lot of times like that's kind of his his it's like a shed a lot of his books like a shedding of an exoskeleton, you know what I mean? Like constantly and, and just kind of the, the, the, the voice he he puts in there during that is always, is always great.

But you wrote, you wrote the hippie hunter and that's one way to get Brett perked up. You talk about the Tate Labianca murders. The guy can go on forever about that stuff. And, and as can I, I mean, I don't think a lot of people understand. I mean, everybody knows what those are. But but I'm a Californian. You're a Californian.

When the weather starts getting nice, I immediately think about the Manson murders, which you shouldn't, but for some reason I don't think about them in the winter, right. You picture a hot, sunny Laurel Canyon and freaks all the time and so, So what Was that a similar way to why you wanted to start doing this? Was there a similar feeling to that? You know, it's, it's funny, I, I started that, I started this project back in 2018 and that's when I was still living in, in California.

And I mean, yeah, I mean, I agree with you. Like I grew up at the beach, so, you know, it's like always hot and sunny there, you know what I mean? So it's like, yeah, it gets a little hotter in the summertime, but it's like always like 70° at least, you know what I mean? It's it's, but I think the thing for me like the like the real like kind of interest that I took in the in that kind of story was, you know, you have a character who's, you know, a

military man, right? He's going undercover to find his his daughter's killers, but he's going into like this hippie subculture, you know, and I found that like a really interesting dichotomy because it's like you, you've got this like, you know, very like, you know, Cold War soldier, very anti communist going into the belly of the beast of the hippie subculture, you know, and, and like what that what you have to kind of do, you know, you have to give up your, your, your

ethics and your, you know, kind of your ideologies and you have to, you know, pretend that you're something you're not to try and find this, you know, these killers or whatever. And living in California at the time during the first Trump administration, that that was a very like, it was like, it was a feeling that I really felt like because, you know, you're kind of like behind enemy lines, especially living on the coast

like I did. Yeah. So I like, I really identified with the character in that, in that way. And that's that's kind of like a like a lot of like what this is about. It's like kind of like that, you know, living in that ideology that you don't agree with, but you you're surrounded by it and you have to kind of like play a role. You know, it's that's kind of how how it came to fruition, you know? Interesting. So, so, So what, what makes you so when you're you're going

through that? And I think a lot of people listening to this can relate to that. Just that kind of mask that you wear the like the almost putting plexiglass, COVID plexiglass in front of your personality a little bit because you're like, look, guys, if I tell you it literally 1 percent, 1% of the iceberg of what I'm thinking right now. It was our nuclear warfare at this dinner or whatever that we're at.

But you know, that brings you to, you know, one of the darkest times in, you know, at least California pop culture history and and really just California history of the last hundreds. So I think that's interesting going from there to there, right? Yeah, I mean, you know, it's that that's the other thing. I, you know, I'm like, I, I, I kind of went down a rabbit hole when I was doing research for this. And I, I, I, I got an account on this website callednewspapers.com and you

know, it's just, it's a library. It's just like a full like online library of like media from like it goes back to like the 1800s, you know, and so, you know, I started going back to like look at like old LA Times coverage of of Manson and Tate Labianca and all that kind of stuff. And that's something I wanted to like infuse into it, you know, like taking the media from that era. You know, it's, you know, it's interspice into the into the

book. But you know, I like to me that almost gives you more of a feel for the for the era itself then then like the way people are dressed or like the way, you know, the way the city looks in that period. Like, especially when you're reading something like material, like I feel like, you know, you look at the like the ads and like the newspaper headlines from that from that time and you get you get a much more sense of like time and place.

So that was definitely something that I tried to, you know, that I am working into it. I mean, the rest of the book is I'm still working on the, you know, the next volume and the next couple volumes, actually. But yeah. How many do you think? How many do you think it's it's going to be total? How many?

Like just? It'll be 4. So the, the second one I'm, I've got the, I've got the first draft down to the second volume and that's, I'm hoping to get that published in October. You know, I'm doing an Indiegogo campaign to kind of raise funds to help me, you know, get it, get it finished, get across the finish line. And then, you know, I think that I think the next two volumes will kind of follow quarterly. You know, that's kind of the way

I'm mapping it out. Yeah. So, but I think this is a good, you know, good introduction. Absolutely. Where, where do you, where can people go get it right now? So. It's available on Amazon and then you can, if you wanted back on Indiegogo, You'll, you'll also get, you know, a physical copy and you can get a digital download. And that campaign runs for like another two weeks. I think so. Cool. Either one of those, yeah. Yeah, very, very cool.

Yeah. I mean, I've been fascinated by, you know, it's something I always knew about. You know, Charles, you just know these, like, loose names, Charles Manson, Roman Polanski, you know, J Sebring, just these. And you're told like it's all connected. And then there's people who are like, no, no, no, no, no. It's connected, connected, connected. There's these layers of of everybody has their own theory. I think a lot of them are kind of correct.

But like there's just a couple things that like we just don't have access to to actually corroborate them. But I love hearing, I love hearing how these murders can really just like reinforce a political ideology. Whereas if you're on like the right wing side, it's like that's a bunch of drugged out hippies doing disgusting stuff. And look what it leads to. We told you look what it leads to. Which to be honest, that there's a lot. A lot of that is true in my

opinion. Like it's just a lot of. That, that's kind of, I mean, that's kind of what I talk about on Brett's podcast, because that, that was kind of like how, how it was to grow up in Southern California. Like, you know, Manson was the ultimate boogeyman and for Gen. X, you know, my, my generation, like, you know, in high school and stuff like that, that was always a dark cloud over

everything. It was always like, you know, it was kind of a, a cautionary tale for, for our generation, you know, and it was like, I, I feel like yes, like on the right, like the, the murders were kind of used as a, as a way to kind of keep, keep us in line, you know, like stay away from drugs, you know, stay away from the bad elements, you know, because this

is what could happen, you know. Yeah, and and then you can you put it with the I now I read Dave Mcgowan's weird scenes inside the Canyon. Have you? Read. Yeah, I've read that too. Yeah, good. Which is definitely more from you know, my biggest critique of it is the maximalism of what of his connections where I'm like, come on, Dave, come on, Dave, like I don't you did not exactly. You got a little lazy with like you.

I like he'll tell you some really, really good information to go and that's why we don't have communism. You're just like, well, what like, you know, like it'll be like. But to be fair, I think both theories have a little bit of have both have a little bit of credence to them. Whereas, yeah, it was a massive drugged out hippie degenerate thing that was seen that was happening from a bunch of people who ran away from their military

families. Now, again, we might talk about the maximalist of maximalism of all of them having these military connections. It is fascinating. But a lot of times it's like you're running away from your military debt. Sharon Tate being one of those people. And, and you have, that's a perfect place for, you know, in the heart of culture in the West, in, in the West of the United States to do a drug running operation. And you're not going to do that with just a bunch of lowlife hippies.

You need some big heavy hitters in there moving drugs, which I think could have been aided by some government stuff, you know what I mean? I, I genuinely think it was a massive, you know, what are you 5 hours away from Tijuana? You know, and, and stuff like that, Like there's, there's it's

very easy. And then I have a scary paranormal theory, which I don't want to, I don't want to get to quite just this yet, but like the the, but you know, like, what do you think about the whole McGowan thing with that?

Well, you know, the volume 2 is actually it's kind of set in Moral Canyon and it's very much, very much, very much follows that theory like that, that you're talking, talking about, you know, military industrial complex, you know, Lookout Mountain, the Air Force Base at the top of Laurel Canyon.

That was a film studio like that, you know, that features into it. You know, I, I, I don't want to, I don't want to give my theory right now because it's part of the but but yes, it, it, it I definitely, I, I definitely think that there was, there was some, there was definitely some intelligence work going on. And there, there's definitely some government involvement, you know, I'll leave it at that for,

for that. But but yeah, so I definitely get into that in the next book, you know, but I, I definitely agree with with that. But I'd like to hear your, your supernatural theory because I, I haven't heard it. I haven't heard any of those really. So we're. Going to get you right back to the episode, but I just wanted to let you guys know of a few other things we offer at rare Candy industries. We have a sub stack with free and paid subscription options.

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episode. I'm into paranormal stuff, I'm into cursed, I'm into cursed land. I'm into the cursed land thing. I'm even into the fact that America could be built and, you know, look the way like I'm not doing this like epic, like genocide, colonialism thing. But what I mean is like when there's a lot of bloodshed, the

land can. I think the land carries that bloodshed and we do have free will as humans, but like if you're put in a weird environment where there's just nothing but bloodshed and stuff like you could be a little more prone to that. So now we what what I like about what McGowan does, my favorite part of it is he goes into like the history now. It's very disjointed and I wish he was more linear in telling the story. I like like the I just would have been a lot nicer but he.

He. He. Talks about Houdini living there. He talks about Dohini the oil guy and all these really weird things that are happening about like the you had like like a one in two or one in three chance of back in, you know, way before the 60s of dying of like unnatural causes out there. And this is before hippies, before, you know, before the 60s drug era and stuff. Like you're from a pioneer days.

Right. And and then the tribes that were there, you know, you got all a lot of bloodshed happening in these hills. And I just wonder if the land is just cursed. And what if there's stuff in Laurel Canyon happening right now that we don't know about? Like what if there's another another thing happening? I don't know what's happening in Laurel Canyon. Right now, you know, it's pretty. I actually actually lived in Laurel Canyon for like a few

months. This is like, wow, God, this is like 24. I like, I used to live in New York. I lived in New York for a while and when I came back to Lai didn't really have a place to live. So it's kind of like bouncing around Airbnb's and stuff. And I wound up getting an Airbnb in Laurel Canyon, actually right down the street from where the Eagles lived. Oh, the where the where the girl where the young ladies were laying on the grass. Outside, yeah, it was, it was Kirkwood Canyon.

It was right up the street from the, from the Laurel Canyon Country Store. But yeah, it's a it's a very weird place, man. It's, it's got a very heavy vibe. Very, you know, I, I guess heavy is the best way to put it. Like it's just, it's just a very

strange place. And I, I, I stayed there for like a month, I think, and because I just kind of wanted to experience it, you know, because I was, I was just like, you know, little Canyon. It's like, so there's so many things attached to it. You know, it's got such a legendary, you know, history. And yeah, I definitely, definitely felt some darkness up there, you know? And so, yeah, I mean, who knows what's going on nowadays up

there. But but yeah, a lot of those canyons, Benedict Canyon too, you know, where, where the murders took place, you know, that's where, I don't know if you ever watched that show The Jinx that was on HBOA few years ago. It was about the the serial killer. I'll try to write that down. I can't remember his name. He was like a really wealthy guy and he he was anyway, he was like murdering his neighbors and

stuff. But anyway, he lived in Benedict Canyon. Like, there's a lot of like really dark stuff going on in those canyons, you know? And I think you're, you know, you might be on to something about the cursed. I know you know, I I'm a very big believer in free will and accountability too. So I hate like saying a lot of these things and be like, well, they just live there and that's why they did it. No, it draws certain types you. Know what I mean? Oh, it's like, it's like a magnet.

Yeah. Yeah, it's like when people go to Alaska and they're like, wow, you know how many murderers are hiding out in Alaska? It's like, yeah, they're drawn to it because you can hide there, you know, and, and like, and guess what? They're freaks out there. And then Jodie Foster comes and finds you and it's over, guys.

No, but the, no, the we were in the, you know, I, I think the other stuff too that McGowan talks about in that book is the like the underground, that like weird underground place. That's I think I'm in between Laurel Canyon and Benedict Canyon or something. It's like that big underground, like concrete, like bought where the Aryan Brotherhood would meet up down there and stuff. And it was like the largest

private land. It was like one of the largest private land, unowned land in Lai always thought that was strange. Yeah, well, I mean, there's always been talk of, and I, I actually kind of go to this in in in my second book too, a little bit. There's always been talk of tunnels underneath the Canyon. Yeah, spoil your entire book, please. I'm done. I'm kidding.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, no, no, but, but there's always been talk of like these canyons under or sorry, these tunnels that run through the hills going back to the Prohibition 'cause, you know, there there was, you know, gangsters bootlegging liquor in the hills. And then they would use these as tunnels to get it to the, you know, clubs and restaurants on the strip. So, yeah, there's always, I mean, I, I, that's never really

been confirmed. I mean that, you know, there's, there's always there, there's talk of tunnels underneath the Playboy Mansion, you know, So, yeah, I mean, I think there's a lot of stuff that we we don't know about too that are, you know, we're not Privy. To apparently there's rumors because like Manson was, was, was big in tight. Charles Manson was big in tight with Dennis Wilson, who lived in

the area, I think. And like there was thoughts that like Manson would use that as like, I mean, in his mind, there was going to be a race war and they were and he was going to orchestrate a big race war. He was going to win it no matter what. He was going to win it. And then that was going to be like a congregating area for the people who saw the real, the real world or whatever, whatever Manson was trying to do. So I was like, I don't necessarily want to find out that that's not true.

I think that's fascinating. I'd love to. I'd love to just leave that like where it is like I'm. Like, yeah, a little a little ambiguity, you know, certainly helps for fiction. You know I. Love it exactly that's why I'm a fiction guy man like in the end so the with the with the other thing too. The First off, I, I fully will will not be swayed against the Playboy tunnels because I think if any man was going to build a tunnel somewhere like with sure male testosterone will it would

be in the Playboy mansion. Like you would get that done. You'd get that done like, no way. No, I agree. You'd get that done. So the, there's a pretty cool, you know, Paul Tate doesn't seem to like the hippies very much in your, in your, in your, in your book. I, I, I think it's fair to say he's not big into the hippie scene. It's he he says, you know what? They're looking all every which way from for who killed my my daughter. The police don't really know what they're doing.

They're following all these bureaucratic laws in place. I'm going to go. It's he kind of goes like it kind of has the tone to me of death wish and hardcore like those movies like kind of together. And the hardcore effectively feels like Paul Tate trying to find his thought. Because I mean, hardcore feels like it's very much inspired by Sharon Tate because she does Valley of the Dolls where where her character does pornography, pornography. So it it always feels like those

are tied together anyways. And it kind of it kind of feels that way. So what's your feeling like? Did you, you're a little bit older than me, but do you you hung out? Did you know, like hippies? Like just California hippies at the time? Like, yeah, I mean, my parents were hippies. You know, for for all intents and purposes, I grew up, You know, I was born in Orange County, San Clemente.

Kind of kind of in the, in the shadow of of Nixon, you know, my, my father used to run a restaurant down in Saint Clemente and Pat Nixon used to come in and, you know, she used to hold me as a as a child. And, and so, but you know, they, they were, you know, they were all about hanging out at the beach and playing volleyball and smoking pot.

And, you know, that that was that was kind of the the milieu that I grew up in, you know, and then, you know, we moved up to Manhattan Beach when I was younger, you know, or sorry, a little bit older. But, you know, their friends were all hippies and, you know, some of them worked in Hollywood, you know. So, yeah, I'm, I'm very familiar with the boomer hippie aesthetic, you know, and, and, and like Paul Tate, I, I kind of resented, you know, now.

Yeah, You know, it's weird. I I have a thing where I'm like when I hear people who aren't actually around, those type of people just criticize it from afar. I'm always like guys, come on, like there's a lot of cool stuff. Like I like, I love California. I like the California melting pot aspect. Like when I was a kid, like these weren't Laurel Canyon

hippies. Like this was in the 2000s and stuff, but you'd have people wearing hippie stuff, but they would be hanging out with guys like the wigger types. And I loved that aspect where it just didn't matter. It actually was post racial California. It actually was what we strive to be for. And so I've always heard when people go hippies is bullshit. And the thing I hated about Mcgowans book more than anything was he pretends that the music, it was like a garbage.

And I'm like, you know, yeah, I don't know, man. Like like these. I think some of these guys were a lot more talented than and you need them to be not talented for this to work. So it's kind of it's kind of I didn't like that. But also when I'm around hippies for longer than like a day, I wanted, I wanted, Yeah, I want to. Yeah, I want to redact. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I get it. I get it. Where are you from?

Norcal then or. Northern California, San Jose, CA, OK. So yeah, you're, yeah, you're right, You're right. Santa Cruz is right down the street. Santa Cruz is of 30 minutes away, Hippie Bill I And there's right wing hippies in Santa Cruz. Like you'll go in the hills and there will be a guy that looks like the teacher from King of the Hill with like the long hair and stuff in the tie dye. And he'll be making his own soap with a Gadsden flag behind him

and guns everywhere. And he'll be like, yeah, I'm a hippie. And you're like. Yeah, I, I think you get, you get a lot of that too, you know, closer you get to Oregon as well. You know, it's, it's, there's actually like a very strong, like right wing hippie contingent in, in Nor Cal that, you know, I, it's more inland. It's like the, the coastal is where you get like the really liberal ones and the insufferable, you know, burnouts from, from that era.

But then you, as you go inland, you get, you get the more conservative and kind of what you're talking about, you know? Yeah, it's so I, I've, but like when I'm around them and I've been around them like I, you know, know, some people and like you'll stay at a house for like an event or something. And no one wants to just do unorthodox things. Like you're just like, can we just do normal things? Like can we just be normal and like smoke some pot together and

just chill? Like, can we, can we just do that? But they, you know, it's just all the like those, you know, talking to hippies sometimes where they have that like vapid look in their face and you understand why everything looks like and and you you understand every time why these Co optings of their movements happen. You're like, I could tell you something right now that could blow your mind and you would believe it and make it your whole personality. And that's what like hippies

back then. That's why they got infiltrated. And we were talking about inherent vice where I thought there was somebody, I think that had a massive misread about it. It was on XI was like, I don't you're not you didn't understand what was happening in that movie.

And I hate being the media literacy guy, but it is important that this person was saying that, you know, Once Upon a time in Hollywood, Quentin Tarantino's movie does a really bad is really mean to the hippies, whereas inherent Vice, it makes the hippie lifestyle look cool. Really. Doc Sportello has a lot more Paul take to him in that in that in that movie and novel than than people would like to admit. It just looks really cool because Paul Thomas Anderson can't make anything that looks

bad. So like, of course it's going to look cool, you know? Yeah, I think, well, I, I think what I, you know, I, I, I can't quite remember what the argument was with that, with that tweet that you're referring to. But I do remember thinking, you know, inherent Vice kind of shows you the, the, the, the, the dark machinations of, of the hippie movement or what was behind it.

And Tarantino is only interested in surface, you know, he's only interested in the image, you know, So it's two different, it's two different takes on, on that era, you know, So I, I, I don't think one is right or wrong or one's better than the other. You know, they're just, they're approaching it from, from two different angles, you know, but, you know, I, I think inherent vice certainly has much more, you know, definitely in, in, in common with the hippie hunter.

And that it's, you know, you're kind of seeing like the, the, the invisible hand at work with a lot of this, a lot of this stuff with it, with the hippie culture. Whereas, you know, Tarantino is again, he's only interested in the Hollywood, you know, the surface, you know, the, the, the image of it, you know, he's not so interested in that and, and the kind of the, the machinations of things, you

know. Yeah, I think that's perfectly said because like, you know, the the the Paul Thomas Anderson, you know, he's, he's, you know, the, the whole idea of inherent Vice is this guy is, it's the end of the 60s and we're talking about a crazy. I I believe inherent Vice takes place actually in 1970, like right after the. Yeah, I think it's right. It's like right on the cusp. And we're talking about it. We're talking about a decade of.

I mean, it starts off Bay of Pigs 1961, Kennedy assassination, 1963. I mean all of these things, all of. These. Yeah, Yeah, everything. Yeah. Everything, I mean, what I mean, you are if you think, I think we're in like crazy like end Times Now, like the 60s with if we had modern social media coverage of the 60s, people would think the world was literally on fire.

So, so when you're looking at this hippie guy who spent all this time kind of never collecting money from anybody, does he's like, oh, free this, free that. But then he sees that everybody else is like compromised kind of or he's like actually just guys, random guys that I see on TV are hired to do this and do that. And it's really just the end of an era. And it's realizing like, oh, this couldn't be for the rest of my life. The, the we have no rules. We have no structure.

Somebody with structure will come in and ruin this. Will impose it, yeah. Yeah, that's. You know, that's that's very much pinch on too. You know, that's like yes, but that's definitely a kind of what you're saying is like, you know, this can't go on forever.

I think that that that's kind of like the the melancholy of a lot of pinch on books, you know, is like, kind of like we'll, we'll, you know, we had it really good for a while and then it it kind of got away from us, you know, and and it got Co opted and yeah, it's I love, you know, Pinchon, it's funny. Pinchon, you know, he used to live in Manhattan Beach in the 60s and I used to live down the street from where his his old apartment. It's still there.

And, you know, that's where he wrote, I think lot 49 and he wrote, he wrote some of Gravity's rainbow there. And, you know, I just I loved I used to walk my dog past it all the time. Just be like, that's where Pinchon lived. You know, it's like so cool. It's so. Crazy how he just exists like and nobody, there's no, nobody has like sightings of him really people. And he's he's a guy I feel like I would recognize like I'd like. He's a very strange looking guy.

Like a guy. Yeah, he's very, yeah. He's total recluse, you know. Yeah, I just wonder, like, I I don't. And The thing is, I don't. It's classic. It's like his novels. It's all his novels seem to be centered around a conspiracy theorist, a guy who's seeing all these things happening. But then he he goes on this long journey, loses everything around him and everything and then still doesn't really get the answer. That's technically, that's kind

of what Lot 49 is with a woman. And and you realize you're like, I don't want to know about Thomas Finchon. I want to be able to. I love the freedom that I Thomas Finchon is what I want him to be, you know, exactly. You know, that's why I get some. If there was a tell all documentary, I'd be scared to watch. I'm sure I would watch it, but I'd be kind of disappointed, I'm sure. Yeah. I mean, he's, he's kind of, you know, he's so enigmatic.

It's like we were saying earlier about, you know, what you kind of, you kind of invent your own fiction about him, you know what I mean, which is, which is what's what's cool about that? Because they, you know, especially in this day and age of, you know, knowing everything about everyone and they're always 24/7, you know, on your screen, you know, a, a character like that is, you know, I mean, doesn't exist anymore, you know? No, it's very straight. It really bothers me.

And I know the irony of someone who puts a camera in front of his face and says his every thought into it saying this right now, but the the the we can't have rock stars for that reason. People talk about me too. People talk about all of these things. There's also an element of I would love when you would just to see when like, OK, let's take Don Henley. Like Don Henley's a very famous guy. You know, you'd see him good looking guy, Stevie Nicks, all

these things. But for the most part, there would be a publicity thing when his new album would come out. And then you'd be like, oh, Don Henley. And you were able to imagine all these crazy things Don Henley was doing. But nowadays the the Don, I mean, there is no like rock nowadays. But let's say there was, you know, a new rock star is just going to have his phone like this and going like, what's up guys? It's Tuesday. Working on my album right now. And then you're just like, just

let me know when it's out. Just let me know when it's out. It's the, it's the, I call it the end of mystique. You know, it's like, and I, I feel like we, we've like, I don't know if it's possible, but I, I feel like, I feel like there's a trend now, like where people are kind of like getting burnt out on being online all the time and like sharing over

sharing everything. And like, you know, I think that's again, that's why a lot of our culture suffers is like exactly what you're talking about. They're like, there's no mystery there. There's no mystique there. There's nothing that like intrigues me or intrigues an audience to be like, Oh, I want to pick that up or I want to listen to that, you know what I mean? It's like, I want to know what's going on with this, with this person, what they're trying to

say. But you know, when it's posted on X everyday and you know it's easily accessible, it kind of ruins. I mean, it certainly ruins celebrity, you know. Ruins it, ruins it. Ruins like processing of, of complex art, whereas like if you you what immediately what someone will do is if they watch you guys talked about it on Brady's now. So you watch Mulholland Dr. and you go I don't know. I don't know what happened. So you're going to go on and

you're going to type. We're trained this way to go Mulholland Dr. explained. Yeah, somebody's thoughts about Mulholland Dr. which they might get the crux of what the movie is. I mean, it's it's once you watch the movie a couple times, even once, like you can go, OK, I know what this is. But you, you, you kind of like, no, chew on it, sit with it for a little bit, watch it again, watch it again. You knew there was something intriguing about it, but you didn't quite know how to explain

it to somebody. But everybody has this maximal. I need the answer right now, right now. Or, and and that really shuts down your faculties, in my opinion, and your processing ability. And that's why I love fiction, because it takes me away from my phone. It takes me away from. If I can put it away, I can put it away. I'm a. 100% with you man. And I. And what are you reading right now?

What am Oh my gosh, I am reading right now Libra by Don Delillo, another 6. Another six that right here behind me. It is damn good and and so I love that because I love Elroy's American Tabloid. So like that just pairs like it's just a total different tone of the same kind of story and just kind of self reflection of the characters and the different style. So I'm reading that and then I'm also, every night before I go to bed, 10 pages of Gravity's Rainbow till I'm done. Oh nice. How far?

How far are you into it? 80 pages, 80 pages. I mean, it's like I have to sit there. I have to sit, I sit there and I reread pages like I just go, there is no rush ring to finish this book. And we are going to do a we are going to do a four part episode. I'm doing with Bernard T Joy. We're going to be doing that throughout the year. Like, but I'm just like, I love, I love pinching. I would never recommend him to anybody. Yeah, because it's I can understand why anyone would hate him.

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, yeah. It's it's, it's not for, it's not for the normie tastes. Usually, and it you know, you you gotta, I feel like I'm a pension character a little. I think you have to be somewhat of a pension character that he would put in there to, to truly enjoy it. I think like I feel like I would be a weird radio DJ guy that like Thomas Pynch, sure. I would name like like Tom Flabbergast or something.

And I like DJ who, you know, actually has a military family history that he you know, and and is taught to play records at a certain speed. So where, you know, I just like, I feel like I could be one of those guys And and it's the I love being dropped into his weird little world, which can be frightening at times, but also like this is so cool. Similar to inherent vice. I mean inherent vice. I think he really gets that. Oh, yeah, yeah.

But I, it's funny. I, you know, I, I tackled Gravity's rainbow a few years ago, kind of like very similar to like how you're doing. And I think Brett did the same thing as like, you know, I just, I would kind of read like a chapter every morning. Like when I'm like, you know, most, you know, I've got, you know, I've got my coffee and like, I'm most, I'm most cognizant, you know, like this time of day. And it was such a pleasure, man, It was so good. It was like, I just got to savor

it, you know? And it's like, like you're saying, like I would go back and reread stuff, you know, no rush. And I think that's the best way to read that book. You know, it's like you really got to, you really just got to like indulge in it, you know? And you know, I think I, I think I got through it in like 3 months or something. But yeah, it's, it's, it's daunting, I think to the, to the normie, you know, who's like doesn't really know what they're

getting into. But like, if you, if you're like you, you like, you love to read, you like, appreciate literature. It's, it's like one of the best novels ever, man, you know? And well, and I find to me and I look, I'm all again, I, I could easily hit this roadblock upon all roadblocks. And I plan to I, I've, this is my probably my 4th or 5th of his book. So I kind of understand, you know, the, I understand that if you can, you can read 10 pages and go, I have no idea what just happened.

But then 10 pages later, you're like, oh, you know, like, like, yeah, there's this again there. They, they do a good job. Actually, his subreddit is actually pretty good because there's actually people discussing chapters and not in this. Here's what happened. It's oh, actually right here. I was thinking this, this, and

it's actually very interesting. It's actually like good for some reason, just not that Reddit. It's not that like Reddit tone of. Like I don't know, I don't use Reddit. I I had to look at it for an episode because I read V&V is tough. No, I I've read V2 and I couldn't tell you. I couldn't tell you one thing I remember of it.

It is. It's AI think it's very good, but it's it that I found that so far to be tougher than the beginning of Gravity's Rainbow. No, Yeah, no, no V Yeah, VV is very impenetrable, you know, It's definitely not the place to start, you know. Because I was like, what happened? I was like, I straight up like I read the end of V and I was like, what? Like there's a, it takes you into like a whole mythology, you know, mythology thing at the end.

And you're, I'm like, OK, I just need to let me know. Not I'll interpret it my own way, but like, what happened and what happened? Yeah. So it was like that. That part's tough. But I, you know, and it was weird. The first page of Crying of Lot 49, it's, I didn't think I spoke the same language as him. I was like, I read it and it's, it's very flowery. And it's just about a, a, a guy having a, a statue drop on his head and he dies and he's the

executor of a will. But you're just like, is this English? And then after a while it's like, can I, can I shoot this intravenously? Can I, can I, can I consume this? Can I have this like Howard Hughes, like, pumped into my blood all day? Like, oh, good. Yeah, No, I, I think lot 49 is this most accessible. I think that's, I think that might have been the second of his that I that I read. And that's my favorite.

That's my favorite Pynchon book. But it's so good, you know, because it's, it's, it's a very like, it's a pretty simple story, you know what I mean? It's like, you know, it's, it's a, it's like a detective story basically. But the, the, the language isn't too, you know, I guess it's not too inaccessible like some of his other books. It's very short and it also kind of like kind of takes place in Manhattan Beach, like in the 60s. I mean, it's like adjacent, but so cool.

You know, I read a lot of that into it also. I think that's probably why it's my favorite because it's like you can tell like when, you know, Pynchon was working in aerospace. I think he was working at God. What was it like? Not not Raytheon, but like he. Was at Boeing I. Think Boeing. That's right. He was at Boeing, you know. So he, you know, he's, you know, cool down Rosecrans to Hawthorne and where the Boeing building is.

And like, I know where that is, you know, so it's like I I see all that in that book, you know, I think that's probably why part of why it's my favorite. But. That's cool. Yeah. I, I love authors. Like because I have Steinbeck up here, because I love those and like, you know, say what you well, people will be like, oh, that commie, I'm like, I dare you to read his shit and think it's like just communist bullshit. It's fucking great.

And like, I, I, I and like East of Eden is my favorite book of all time. So because I just because you, I can drive, I can tell you take you through the locations. They don't really change either. Like it's weird like you go down in like the Salinas, all that whole 1 area code and you're like, this probably isn't that different from when he like lived here. It's kind of it's kind of strange. And then you'll see like gang bangers though in like Steinbeck town.

You'll see like a gang banging Mexican guy walking into like some 1937 E of Eden market. It's like it's. Supposed for real. It's a Thomas Pinchon thing, It's. I was going to say it's. Like a contest? Yeah, sounds. Like a Pintron book? Yeah. It's so funny. I yeah, the lived in area. Like I know people that live in Texas. Larry Mcmurtry, right? Like Larry Mcmurtry will take you through Texas, the real Texas, the the Texas that people find boring. But he finds so much life in it.

Like I love like I love authors that do that. Yeah, yeah, No, it's especially LA authors. You know, I like, you know, Chandler does that, Brett does that. You know, I love that. I mean, Joan Didion, it's Elroy, you know, I mean, there's so many great, you know, LA authors, but but yeah, and you know, I read some of that too for, you know, kind of the vibe

for the hippie hunter. You know, I read a lot of Didion, you know, read a lot of Chandler, you know, trying to trying to infuse it with a little bit of darkness, a little bit of a little bit of, I don't know. Yeah, the seediness, the seedy noir of. Noir, Yeah. Noir tone of of what you did.

Here it comes. But also kind of like the dread, you know, like there's always like a dread that's kind of like in the percolating in the in the in the corners of sunny Los Angeles that I, you know, kind of want to try and capture so. Yeah, that that's Brett did that so good with the shards. I I read I was like, Oh my gosh, like I I haven't read all of his

work, but it's my favorite. Like I truly like was like this is OK. I I think if it came now again I I haven't even read American psycho that's coming up. So I. Think you haven't? You know, yeah, I know I'm missing some of the core stuff, so. I I I do it for a treat. Yeah, I and like, you know, because I love rules of attraction, love less than 0 and I love the shards. I love the whites I and I. And so I, I'm gonna, I, I'm gonna get into all that stuff this year probably.

But the the the shards, I was like, man, the dread of this is so good, especially of that age, that age when you like it's, it's you know, what he does in that is he takes these kind of like minor quibbles that you have with people you think are game seven of the World Series when you're young and you realize they don't matter at all. At all. At all but. Then something there is a killer happening which adds like actual real life ramifications to the story like and that's what I

love. Like you don't I, I and you know, he, he, he, his marketing of it I thought was masterful, but I also think it takes away I, I don't think people can call it as good as it is because it's like a podcast book, you know, like, because he serialized it on a podcast. Some people don't like, treat it like literature. I, I feel like I'm like, no, this is a book. It's, I have it right here. It's a, it's a huge book.

I like I I loved it personally. Yeah, no, I, I, I, I, you know, I probably need to reread it. It's been a few years since I read it. I I think, I think the thing I love the most about it though, was that it's really about a writer. You know what I mean? It's about writing fiction. It's about how writers create the reality that they, you know, in their head that they exist in and they put on the page. You know, certainly it's very

Chandler esque too. It's it's, it's definitely got the Raymond Chandler kind of noir elements, even more so than than, you know, less than 0. I feel like just in terms of like capturing the city and like the, you know, the era. But yeah, I need to, I need to revisit it. I, it's been a few years since I read it and I, I've, I, I liked it. I was, it's not my favorite of his, but you know, maybe that'll change if I reread it again.

But you know, it's, I think you're I think I think you might be on to something too about you know what the way you kind of serialized it on the podcast because that's how I ingested it. Me too. First time. And then when I got the book, you know, and I I read it and I, I told him I'm like this, I'm like, this is different. This is somehow different than the podcast. Like, it's hard to describe.

And he's like, he's like, well, yeah, you know, they had to be edited and all this kind of stuff. And it's so, yeah, it's like two different experiences. You're right, you're right. No, I, I, I did it twice. I read it twice, but through the podcast, like I, I, I was like, I, I know somebody on Reddit put like or whatever, like I put serialized all the episodes that, that the chapters are on. So perfect. Like that's I think it, I think it might be on his Patreon how you do it.

And like, and I just did that and it's cool because like half the time it's like Amanda Melius is coming up after this. That's kind of fun. You know, like I got like, it's actually kind of like, it's surreal, like maximalism of the podcast. Right. Because, yeah, because he used to do. He still had guests on after that. That's right. He would do it as like the monologue and then he would have the guests come on.

Yeah. It's like a three hour, a three hour episode or a chat, 2 chapters of the shards and then yeah, yeah, Anakachian, you know. Like, yeah, but it was kind of, I mean, that was kind of perfect for the COVID era though, you know what I mean? Because that was like everyone's stuck inside or whatever. And. Yeah, and him reading it too, like him reading it is really cool because it's such a personal time. For him. Yeah, and he's just, he's just such a good speaker.

So you're just like, oh man, this is, this is, this is good. And I, I, I haven't actually read. I bought a physical copy just 'cause I want to have one, but I, I haven't read that. And I feel like that's going to be the same. So I think that's why it's not considered. I'm sure it's considered Canon amongst B EE fans but I'm like I think it's it's a secret third thing. Yeah, you could. You could be onto something with that, you know. Yeah, 'cause I. So you actually so you actually

haven't read the book yet? Not the actual no. I haven't picked the book up and read it. We covered it on here and stuff. But I I read it through his unedited OK. So I'll be, I'll be interested to see if you have the same kind of reaction that I did to it then, because it's it's, it's, it's two different experiences. Wow, and for and for some reason, like reading it didn't have the same impact. But I think it's goes to what what you're saying is like, you know, it's not his voice.

He's not reading it to you. It's like it, you know, it's pretty, it's more produced, you know, the, the, the podcast version and then you get to the book and the book is definitely, I mean, there's definitely some scenes that were, you know, cut out, there's some things truncated and it's, it's, it's just, it's a different reading experience. So you'll be obvious to hear what you think once you read it.

Yeah, no, absolutely. And and when you when you said about less than 0, less than 0 to me is and I don't know if he meant to do this. I just think when you're that young, you just are what you read. And I I think even when you're older you are too. But like the Didi, I mean the Didion play it as it lays like in less than 0 have the same exact tone to me.

Oh, absolutely. I mean, there's even like if you read Slouching Towards Bethlehem, there's even like passages that he straight like just cribbed, you know, I'm bored. I'm bored. Yeah. Have you read Slouching Towards Bethlehem that? No, I've only read the White Album and play it as it lays, but I love her, yeah. OK, yeah, you should. You should check out Slouch or yeah, Slouching towards Bethlehem. It's a, you know, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's an

essay. It's about, it's about San Francisco in the 60s, about the Haight Ashbury. And it's all about, you know, she's kind of embedded with these hippies, you know, and but it's like lesson, you know, reads like lesson 0, that very flat kind of tone. And it's, you know, vignettes, you know, I think it's like about 15 pages or something. But it's the the end is just one of the most, I don't know, like devastating, devastating paragraphs I think I've ever read in about about the 60s.

It's it's like, I don't know, I don't want to give it away, but yeah, you should. You should definitely definitely read that. Yeah, no, she, she's great. And, and what I, the first thing I ever read from her was her essay about like driving and traffic from the White Album. And I was like, wait, a woman is like this, obsessed with like, driving. And the intricacies of driving

like this is phenomenal. Like, you know, plate is it, ladies is Yeah, it's all driving, driving, driving the freeways of LA. Yeah, cuz like only men talk about driving in that way. And it's like, and I was passed, you know, the the weird, the weird fly over intersection by the 395 and you're just like, yeah, like, no, I've never heard a woman and talk about that. You know what I mean? Like, unless you're there, unless you're physically doing

it at the moment. But like this is just somebody who like and and again, LA is driving is half of your life in LA because you're just sitting in traffic. So, you know, like. It's the culture, yeah. I don't think people realize how long you spend in your car. That's why the best scenes of Once Upon a Time in Hollywood are the driving scenes, you know, and, and just those side shots of Brad Pitt in the car and stuff. And you're just like, yeah, cuz that's LA is driving.

It's not a walking city. I mean, you can, you can, you can walk through. To it, but it's nobody walks in LA like the song says, man. Yeah, exactly. It was funny. I meant to, I meant to bring something up about the right wing hippies. I have a an uncle who grew up, I don't know exactly where, but they, him and his wife had like an apartment.

And they used to like see The Beach Boys performing as kind of a party band, like together it would just be like The Beach Boys. And then they became these massive fans. These are like our hometown legends, these guys. So they grew. They grew up in Hawthorne. Then it must have been Yeah, I know it was a. Smaller, that's where. That's where my dad grew up. And oh, interesting. He didn't go to the same high school as The Beach Boys, but you know, they were. Yeah, they were around.

They were around. They were just, they were part of the scene growing up back then in the, I guess that would have been the early 60s, yeah. Yeah. And then they saw that one time they talk about this and you never know, Boomers like to mythologize and lie all the time and I let them. So I have no idea if some of these things are true or not. They said they saw Jim Morrison just black out in some bar in like Santa Barbara once, which I believe. I mean, that's not out of out of

the question. My dad has a Jim Morrison story also. I think it's just part of the boomer, you know? I think they heard it from somebody and then they're like, that happened to me. Yeah, you. Know maybe he was stoned and he did, yeah, who knows? But yeah, they all, they all kind of like you said, they love the mythologizing. And I'm glad we, and you know what, I'm glad we can't Fact Check him. Like I'm just like, that's fine. Like you, you get that, that's you've earned that, that right.

But I it's like the boomers on the East Coast that say they saw Springsteen in a bar. You're like, no, you didn't. You did not go to the Springsteen bar show. Those bars hold like 100 people. People you didn't. Stone, Tony, you know, yeah. Yeah, but so they were. They saw Jim Morrison, you know, beach. Boys, I lost you again. OK, Am I back? Yeah, you're back now. Yeah. Jim Moore, you know, said Jim Morrison. The Wilsons, all these people have all these stories and

they're just right wingers. They're just Republican like. But they've always have been through the 60s that they didn't have some radical phase. They're just been like Republican. I'm like, that is the nuance. There's a nuance of California that people just don't know. I know people like this, that they're just like, they go to Coachella. They go to all these things, but they're like, yeah, I'm just like, I work in finance and I'm

a, you know. I'm a. Yeah, I'll look in, but I'll wear like a feather cap or something like I'll put on. The Indian headdress, you know. Yeah, they don't care. They don't. They don't care. Like they just, it's like, it's so strange, you know, like there's always been that type of like of, of person, you know, where they're like, they're going to like a Vietnam protest rock show and then they're like, let's bomb Vietnam. Like they're saying that at the same time. Yeah, it's.

It's it's, it's kind of that I don't know, it's something very California about that though, you know, it's like there's, there's no real concrete. I don't know. I don't know what you'd call it. Like not an ideology, but like there's no real like anchor, no to to a lot of that, especially in that era, you know? Yeah. You just, you just and, and, and look, Nixon's presence was, was huge for that time. You had a Southern Californian. Oh yeah, absolutely. And president.

So, you know, I, I can see that. And then like, you know, my, my uncle had a small business. He's not. He's like taxes, but whoever's taxing me less, that's my politics. Like, yeah, you know, he also had the governor. He also had Governor Reagan too in that period, you know. Exactly.

That's, you know, Reagan was a big, he's actually going to be, he's going to be featured in one of, in one of the I think probably like the third book, but you know, taking because he was very anti hippie, you know, like he, he, he kind of went to war with them, you know, with Berkeley and, you know, setting the stage for the 80s, you know, and, and when those hippies grew up and then he was their president, you know, it's kind of interesting too, when you look at it, but.

Yeah, yeah. I, I mean, I, I find I just because nowadays, like you see, you know, when you go on the Internet and I see somebody who's like, I, it'll be of a certain issue. It'll be like, well, I think X about that. And then people just go, you're communist left wing. This they, they put, they attach all these things to you when you just, when you give one opinion. And I'm just like, my uncle could tell you like 7 bands he liked. And then they'll be like, oh,

you're the hippie libtard. And they're like, no, no, I mean, literally you would call me the biggest fascist. My uncle Don, you call him the biggest fascist of all time. Like if you actually heard his thing, it's just, it's just funny. Like there's this. It's why when I hear critiques from people who didn't live in California, I'm like, maybe you're cut and dry. Maybe you guys are cut and dry in these other states. I've only lived here, so I don't know, but that maybe.

But people out here, there's just so much like free flowing, even non hippie people, like they just, you know, you'll see a guy driving a Tesla, you know, or like a like a big lifted truck, but it'll have like Democrat stuff on it. And I'm like, what's like it's so it's there's a cognitive dissonance. I don't maybe that's not the right term, but there's contrast. It's a very much a state of contrast.

I think and that and that again, that's another thing I kind of I think I try to infuse in the hippie hunter as well as is is taking that, you know, those dichotomies that shouldn't, you know, shouldn't come together, but they still do somehow, because it's all just kind of in the air out there. You know, I guess it's, it's definitely a very California thing, man. That's. I'd be, I'd be remiss to not talk to you about your, your

artwork in here. So I don't know enough of the, of the style of how to call things what it is, but I like, I like the, the style, the smokiness of it. Like when I was reading it, it looked very smoky. It looked very hazy and stuff. And, and I, I don't know, I did not grow up reading comics or any sort of panelled stuff like that growing up. So, but it read, it read very literary to me, which I liked. So it was, it was easy for me to for me me to kind of process and stuff.

But like you're drawing like what would you know? Have you always been just somebody who's drawn or was this something you picked up later? Do you have inspirations for these these comics? Yeah, I mean, I, I, you know, I, I, I spent most of my career in animation. So, you know, I always started, I started with animation when I

was very young. So I like I've, I've always been an artistic, you know, and kind of, you know, you know, made that my career for most of the most of my life until, you know, COVID happened and then, you know, things kind of fell apart. But, but yeah, I, you know, like visual storytelling has always been my thing, you know, and, you know, I, I love graphic novels. I love comics. But you know, with this, I wanted to do something that wasn't so, I don't know, so comic oriented.

Like, you know, when when someone says comics like I, you know, I think of like superheroes, I think of fantasy, I think of, I don't know, you know, just fantastical stuff. And I was like, well, you know, maybe you'd try and do something like you're saying, like a little more literary something a little more, I don't know. I don't know how to quite describe it. Like not not so you know. Sensible. It's grounded, it's grounded,

it's grounded in reality. Yeah, grounded in reality and, and grounded in history and maybe a little more, you know, thought provoking. I I don't, you know, I don't want to get you pretentious about it. No. I know. I know what you. Mean that that was kind of that was kind of the, you know, the the thought going into it. And there's, you know, there's some, there's a there's an artist named Darwin Cook, who's he was, he's a comma guard. He's dead. He he passed away a few years

ago. But he his style was very like mid century, kind of, you know, minimalist, stark, you know, style of artwork that that really influenced this. And, you know, I really wanted to kind of lean into like the mid century vibe of Los Angeles that I love so much and and kind of infuse it into the story. So that was part of it too. Part of it was just like, I just want to draw like that architecture. I just want to draw those streets. And you know, I want to, I want

to draw the tiki bar. I want to draw the Chateau Marmont. You know, it's like just stuff that I love visually that I just, you know, I wanted to put on the page. You know, that's part of it, too. Yeah. There was a Roman Polanski cameo, right? Yeah. Yeah. I like, I really like that one little Yeah. That was a good, that was good. I like how you did that. Yeah, it was, you know, I know you did. The Polanski episode was. That was like a month ago right?

Two parter, yeah, but. Yeah, and I, I, I couldn't remember. Did you, did you address or did you ever watch? What? We did not talk about that. I have not seen it. You have OK. I was just curious because I, I, I don't know, like a few years ago I'd come across that and I, I watched it and I was like, I mean, it's not, it's, I don't want to say it's bad, but it's like a very strange movie.

That's all I've heard. All I've heard is bad things about it. Yeah, I mean, it's, I mean, it's, you know, it's, it was, it was, you know, three years after after the murders. But it's it's funny. I was thinking about it today. I was like, it's almost like White Lotus in a way, because it's, you know, it's about like this like American girl that ends up with this like Italian resort. And it's like all these, you know, lecherous men and like, you know, eccentrics and stuff.

And I was like, yeah, this is kind of like Polanski's, like White Lotus, you know, in a weird way. But, you know, I'm not recommending it all. But I was just. Man, now I'm going to watch it. Now it looks like shit. And like the the the actress, I forget her name, but she's like, she's like nude the whole movie. Like she's literally nude like the whole time. It's it's, I don't know. I think my, I think my guest Cody had seen it and was like, yeah, it's not, it's just not

that good. But like I but hey, there's not like a reason to watch sounds. Like, well, yeah, I was just, I was going to say if you like, if you want to be like the Polanski completist, you know, you definitely, I think you definitely got to keep that one in there. His bat, his bat is so bad. I like and I he's probably in my opinion, the most interesting filmmaker ever in my just in my opinion. I think, I think just the stuff that he, the, the stuff that happened is crazy.

Like, you know, and, and just the, I thought he got real. I thought he stayed pretty damn good throughout the 80s and 90s. Like, and I thought he evolved and I thought he made great, great films with and nobody and nobody ever wanted to stop working with them. Like it was just, it was great. Like I, I, I love it. But like the bad stuff is like, wow, this is like, dude, like your misses are so bad. But that's, that's just who he was. He he thought he was big. He was just big, big, big.

Like, yeah, you know, I but I, I, I find his his greatest works in my opinion. Like they are among my top films ever like. What? What's your? What's your #1 Chinatown or? You, you kind of have to speak objectively and say Chinatown like cuz if I try to get weird like I love Chinatown, I can watch it anytime. You can put it on all the time. To me, The Tenant is the creepiest, weirdest movie. I just, I find that to be so. I find it to be this like flu.

I feel like I have the flu when I watch it. Like it's just so odd and I keep thinking about it all the time. I love Bitter Moon a lot. That was a new revelation for me. I love Death in the Maiden I think is fantastic. And I just, I, I love all of those Rose. I mean, it's tough to beat Rosemary's Baby. Like I actually like that more than The Exorcist in terms of classic horror. Just to me. Personally, it's scarier to me. It's like. Creepier.

Yeah, like the Exorcist, I don't get scared by that stuff a lot like, yeah. Did you? Did you watch? Did you watch his Macbeth? I I not for the episode, but I have since and it's I I I actually like it. Like I think I think it's pretty good. I I was I was expecting to be like, Oh God, this is boring. I actually liked it. No, I I liked it too that that was actually his first film after the murders and. Right after.

Yeah, his right. After and there's there's there's a lot you can read into that, you know, but I think it's probably. By Playboy. Put on by Playboy. Well, I, Hugh Hefner I think, produced it. Yeah, yeah, It was put out by Playboy, which is very it's there's always so many just odd

things happening around the guy. And like, you know, he's in every like weird, weird scene and he's very prominent figure in Laurel Canyon. There's people like he never talks about doing a bunch of drugs, but like you're always, he's just constantly around people doing drugs and stuff like yeah, it's just and and you know, he was had had his proclivities. Absolutely. From the five to the six we've been without making me pay your

job on the way. I need food for the kids, money for the rent of a girl like I've been. Anyways, you talked about COVID kind of stopping something in your, in your, in your life The, you know, can you, can you get into any of that? I'm always fascinated by people's COVID story. Well, so I was, I was a creative director and an, an animator for a, for a, an education website that was kind of based at Stanford and working remotely. And I've been with them for about like a decade, you know,

about 10 years. And, you know, COVID happened. And then, you know, like Paul Tate, I was very undercover with that group because, you know, there were, you know, Stanford, I mean, there were, I know we're talking like, you know, hardcore. They had their own misinformation observatory that was erected at Stanford that just now got defunded, which I am aware. Yes, but the COVID kind of gosh, how do I put it?

I guess it kind of like removed my camouflage, you know, and, and, and, and, and I think they, they never really, never really came out and, and said it, but I, I think they kind of became aware of my, my worldview. And it was not, it was not an amicable parting, but but yeah, it was, it was unfortunate. I mean, you know, it, it was just when I, I think it was bound to happen sooner or later anyway, just because of the way

the the culture was percolating. But but yeah, COVID, COVID like really just kind of drove a stake through that, you know, that that was, you know, like I said, that was like a good ten years that I was, I was, I was doing that and I had like full creative control and. You know, was making good money and it was just, you know, it was it was kind of a kind of like blew up my life in a way, you know, which is, you know,

but that's the way it goes. I guess it's it just, you know, the vaccine thing came into play and sure, you know, I wasn't, I wasn't having it. And then, you know, they kind of let me go like not long after that. So I think that was kind of the final, final straw, you know, But, you know, I, but it's funny though, 'cause like, you know, I look at it now and I, you know, I look at all the stuff that Doge is doing with like, USAID and all that.

And I'm like, you know what, these guys were probably like, these guys were probably getting funded by USAID and they were probably siphoning federal money from something for, you know, 'cause it was through Stanford. So I, you know, who knows? But yeah. Yeah. So, you know, the way I look at it was like, well, you know, maybe it's a blessing in disguise.

You know, you. Figure you figure like anybody who it doesn't matter what side of the coin you are on COVID, it doesn't matter if you're wiping your groceries down still in 2025 it was an accelerationist thing like this thing accelerated a lot of kind of brooding things like like where if you had a friend group and it was like for a while you guys could kind of if you were just milk toast on social media and they were just blah blah blah, blah blah like talking all their

all their stuff. If you just kind of pretended to not care about anything, yeah, it could be civil. Now, when it comes down to like getting a shot, like I would have people ask me in public and they say, are you going to take the vaccine? I go no. And they go, why I go, it's none of your fucking business is why I'll be glad to explain to you, but I know you don't. You're not going to listen to me. So I'll say no, I'm not going to and I'm not participating in

your humiliation ritual. And and and if you consider that the condition of our friendship, then we're not friends. Yeah. So, and it sucks when you have a career attached to it because when we're talking about money, we're talking about things that are very much akin to you. These are your things, but these are attached to their view of you, which is really, really psychologically my It's Polanski. It's a Polanski film. It's like very mind bending hands grabbing out at you, you

know? Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, I, you know, I, I lost, I lost a lot of like, like really good friends from over the vaccine stuff. You know, people like people I grew up with people who, you know, I, you know, I had AI had a close friend who, you know, his mom had passed away about a year before, you know, and I was like, you know, in the hospital with him. You know, the, the, you know, before she passed, she had

pancreatic cancer. And, you know, a year later, the, the vaccine thing comes up and then that, you know, we had a big falling out. And I haven't talked to him since. You know, it's, it's, there's a lot of that though. You know, it's, it's, I'm not alone in that. But no, but you're right. It, it, it really it just, it kind of, I feel like the first Trump administration was kind of like the, the initial. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SIM simmering, you know, and then the COVID thing just boiled over and that that was kind of like the ripping the Band-Aid off moment where it's like, OK, this is this is, this is what's going to separate, you know, a lot of people from their pasts and from their, you know, what they're what they grew up with and friendships and relationships and careers. And it was definitely, you know, the fault, you know the fault

point, you know. Yeah, well, you, you have a bit of a less than 0 moment where you realize you're like, oh, this, these aren't my friends. This isn't where I want. To. Be all right the I think it's still recording, but you got me now. Yeah, you're back now, OK. The, the, there's like a less than 0. Like it's, it's just like when you, when you take it back, you're like, these aren't my friends. These aren't my, these aren't

who I'm going to be around. And there's that shocking realization of the ripping the Band-Aid off feeling where you're like, this is going to hurt. This is going to hurt. And it does hurt because deep down as AI, we were the more principled side. And I feel fine saying that. And it would have taken a lot for me to disown my friend. In fact, I dealt with their Lib tard bullshit the entire time. And I didn't disown them right like we were. We allowed them to do it.

We allowed them to do it, to say all these things to us. And then the minute you don't play the Simon Says game with them, yeah, it's over. I that's the part I still can't get over. Yeah, I mean, you know, Brett, Brett writes about that in white. Yeah. Oh, yeah. You know, I'm, I mean, I'm one of the people in the, in the final chapter that he, you know, we have dinner. He writes about, he writes about one of our dinners that we had. We're, you know, we're talking about this because he, he

experienced this too. You know, it's like that. I think he questions, sorry, he posits the question in that chapter of, you know, where, if, if they, if they don't agree or if they can't accept my, my, you know, my opinion or my world view on this, you know, where they are friends to begin with. You know, it's like, I forget how he phrased it, but it, it is very true of that era. It was like, you know, have we have we really been friends this whole time?

Or is this, has this just been a, you know, a facade? Because I kind of went along with the, the, you know, the herd, I guess, you know what I mean? It's I don't know. Yeah. It's like he he phrases it better than I'm, I'm mumbling about. But, you know, he, he, he covers that in that book really well, I think, you know. I used to be able to argue with my friends politically all the time. Like it what? No matter what I believed in, like we, you would have a thing.

And yeah, it could. I'm not saying it would never get heated, but it would get heated. And guess what? Tomorrow we'd hang out and make fun of, make fun of that argument that we had. Yeah, You know what I mean? Like like. Like that, that unfortunately those, I don't know, I mean, I, I, I think, I think the tribalism of it has, has finally hardened at this point. It's like we all know which side

we're on now. Whereas back then it was still kind of like, well, maybe we can still kind of play in the same playground and you know, kind of pretends like we can get along. But, you know, I, I think those, those days are, are, are not

coming back. Well, and that brings me and everybody we have people on that have their own publication stuff that they're trying to do independent of the current construct of media, you know, like publishing houses are they're they published certain authors, certain looks, certain nationalities, certain creeds, certain sexualities, but they're not really thriving. You know what I'm saying? Like they're not, you're not seeing, you're not seeing the

novels fly off the shelf. So I do think it opens an Ave., even though it's a little bit harder, but I think it's a more fulfilling to publish your own stuff to do all of these things. So I mean, do you anticipate getting, I mean, what you wrote a book that'll scare people away to begin with, because it's, you know, like people will read it and go that's mean to the hippies, you know what I mean, or that this guy's right wing or

something like that. So that might insulate them away for but like, you know, do you anticipate coming in, you know, if this gets as far as you want it to go? Do you anticipate having to confront these types of people again that you lost during COVID? Because just that's putting art out into the world. A lot of art people are completely gone. Yeah, no, I don't, I don't know. I, I think if anything, I'd, I would have to confront, you know, the, the, the real Manson

fanatics. That's a good point. You know, that's a, that's a, that's a real, that's a very, that's a very real thing, man. Like it's, you know, I, I didn't, haven't really reached out to like any of those people, you know, those websites and stuff, 'cause like they're, they're very protective of their, their, you know, the way they see it and the way they, you know, and like, you know, I, I do have Manson enter into the narrative not until like the

third book though. So, you know, it's, it's not really about him, you know, it's not, you know, I wasn't really so interested in, in the Manson family and the, you know, the murders themselves and, and things like that. You know, I, I, I, I was more interested in the kind of the peripheral. But but yeah, if anything it like, you know, if, if, if this, you know, starts reaching those quarters, then I'm, you know, I'm sure I'll have to pick my

battles with those people. But it whatever, you know. Yeah, like, like, and the reason I bring that up is it's really funny is like we have an audience, you know, but like when you put something out on YouTube, the audience, it's like anybody can stumble upon it. We did an episode on Prince. So like anybody who types in Prince episode can go read that. And there are people that just go like, I don't like what you

said about Prince right there. And it was like, maybe I made a joke about like black people or something, you know what I mean? Like it was just something like in a four hour span, I was like, oh, wait, I don't have to deal with this person, but I'm like, that person has access to what I do. That's kind of interesting, you know what I mean? Like you kind of forget for a while, like.

It's just, yeah, yeah. I mean, I, yeah, I, I, I was having a conversation with a friend of mine about that the other day, because he, he's a, he's a screenwriter. He's got a film. He did a a movie a couple years ago that was like became a really big hit and it's kind of got it like a cult following now. So, you know, we're kind of talking about that. He's like, yeah. He's like what you put it out in

the world. You know, people, certain people will attach themselves to certain characters or they'll attach themselves to certain things about it and they'll they'll kind of it'll kind of take on a life of its own that you you would no longer have control over. You know, I haven't reached that stage yet with this. I mean, this is just came out like a few weeks ago, obviously.

But, you know, I I don't know. I don't see, I don't know, I, I, I think I was trying to do something more along the lines of a hero's journey with this as opposed, as opposed to making it more about specifically about the Manson thing. You know, I mean, it's like, I see, I see this character more as like a knight, you know, kind of a, a chivalrous, you know, knight in shining armor type of, of, you know, hero or like that, you know, the, the lone detective of, of Chandler.

You know, I see it more as like, you know, like just kind of like mythical storytelling in a way, as opposed to trying to exploit what, what the, you know, the, the world that it takes place, you know, not not exploiting the murders or, you know, exploiting the, you know, the family or anything like that. You know what I mean? It's like it, like it, it's, it's set in that world, but it's not, it's not focused on that. No. No, you know what I mean.

Most certainly, Yeah. Well, it's very, it's very good. I, I, I, I, I have to say it's a very, very good first issue. Happy to have have read it and I will definitely be following up with the subsequent volume. So, Sasha, thanks for for joining. I I really appreciate it. Anything before we go anything, anything more you want to tell the audience about the hippie hunter? Anything we talked about. No, just you know, the Indiegogo site's still up. We've still got the crowdfunding

going. I think another two weeks. Of course, by the time this episode comes out, I think it'll be be over in like a few days. But it's still and then it's it's available on Amazon and you can get it on paperback, you know, for for a nice Pulp Fiction price of, you know, 10 bucks or so. So it's a good place to get it. And then, yeah, I, I've got a, you know, I've got an Etsy shop too. If if anybody wants to, you know, buy some paintings, you know, I've, I've got that.

It's at cultural drop on Etsy, OK. And yeah, I think that's about it, man. I'm sweet, sweet. Looking forward to more episodes of Rare Candy and. Yeah. I'll have to probably have to check out your your gravity's rainbow arc. Yeah, that's, that's a that's like a year of project. It's like like something I'm trying to like get done. If you're kind of see how far I can take the fiction stuff. And you I now you recommend. I think it was you that recommended to me a long time

ago and I didn't forget. And I will write this down. The Ask the Dust novel. Was that you that recommended? That to me. Oh yeah, John Phant. Yeah, yeah, I, I have. I have a copy. I've been meaning to add that because it's so so slim and small, but I haven't. You you haven't read it yet. I have not, I have not I I, I remember when we were setting this up. I'm like, I think this is the guy that recommended Ask the Dust to me. I always remember book recommendation.

I always remember who told me about a book. So you're gonna. You're gonna love it. Yeah, I won't. Guarantee you I will, yeah. Yeah, John Fan he was. He was a big, big influence on Bukowski. Oh yeah, nice, nice. And and when you when you read that, you'll, you'll, you'll see it right away. Very. Cool. That's yeah, that's another another talk about another LA book that's like, you know, definitely captures Southern California.

Definitely, definitely. Well, yeah, guys, so all the links that that Sasha was talking about going in the description of this episode. I highly recommend everybody check out the Hippie Hunter Volume 1 and then, you know, keep in touch. We will put this out to where you still have an opportunity to donate to the indie. Go go and and get this, you know, get this stuff going because it is important. It is important.

You guys have noticed the guests that we've had on on this on our free episode feed have been people that have tangible products to put out in this world because I'm tired of complaining about their not being there. So yeah, on that note, guys, everybody have a safe week to catch you guys next time.