Rap Radar: Babyface

Did you see that guy UK rapper Extraw there Central Sea? Yeah? You was there down. We was there for Essential see Urban Plauz in New York, tore it down, International rappers. I saw the industry people there, like I feel like they're trying to do business with the boy. You know what I'm saying. It's all the industry heavyweights up in their backstage. I was like, whoa, Okay, you's got the hot end right Orlandos and the Kazes and the David Allies and all that. And then yeah, we saw NOAs

Man NASA mastercare Guard. Man. I loved it. Man. I don't know about you as a kid from queens yourself. I wonder what did you think of rapper Nas finally tearing down the garden? Man, I loved it. Man, it was dope, you know to see Nas and that, Like, first of all, I remember when he did the Nazi is like video outside of the Goddess and now he was actually inside. Um, it was a great show, you know, and um it was built like a Katie three show, and those it also had, like some of the B sides.

I'm not gonna lie to the we love Katie three. That's my only great is that I think that it's a little bit too early for some of those songs to resonate in such a big arena, you know, even though we love the albums um in this Cannon, but I love those B sides songs that he performed. At one point, he did um Hot Boys remix with you know Miss Elliott Q Tip, and I thought that Eve was gonna I mean, I thought that Miss Elli was gonna come out. I have recorded that. I was like, oh,

that's one of my favorite Nas verses. But yeah, he was wrapping alonger the video. I heard you out there he sided out of breath. Man. Yeah yourself, I was like Wow, that was dope, man. But you know, get your mama clip shot up. Word. So it was great to be in the building. And you know, Nas is a legend. He definitely deserved you know that, man. I was really happy to see him. Yeah. I just felt like he poured Haart soul and your bus sweat and tears into it. Like I never really see him go

all out for a performance like that. You could tell he was geeked ye to be on that Garden stage, man, So which is you know, it was incredible, man. I mean obviously I saw Jay do the Garden and that was crazy, but you know this felt different where it felt like, you know, this wasn't a retirement, was more like this kind of a celebration of what this guy's like,

you know, contributed to the culture. You know. It was pretty pretty crazy to see him kind of run through those new records and then like you can't really mess with the nineties in the classic catalog he has. It's really insane. Yeah, thirty years in the game, man, it doesn't even feel like it. That's what I'm on that two man. Thirty years for me too, beat out man,

somebody going away the man, it's guys. We inspired man, We inspired each other man, these guys from the nineties men sticking around, man, because you know, right now, I feel we got the hot podcast. Man, were a little hot street right now, right we got a young boy, we got Yaddy. The Yaddy thing went well. Everybody was rocking with that episode. I felt, yeah, and Yaddi was a great conversation man. And I was kind of bummed because he dropped his interview with Drake, like over the

same day, Yo, Yadi, Man, what you're doing kids? Daddy try to battle us? Man, he try to interview Drake us. Is that what he's trying to do with the scot attack. I was like, oh my gosh. But you know, everything worked out the way it was supposed to, so it was it was a great conversation, man. So shout out to Yadi. Somebody said a little boat that's something to goat with the ship with it. I don't know, but I still put out Drake interview against anybody, man, you know,

God bless man. I thought he's done these kind of weird, like fake kind of interviews since the pat Rapper It Up podcast. But you know, no disuspect but to Rapper it up out. Yeah, that's a high standard. Man, at that the interview we did with him many so that's that's the bar. Still, I feel like, you know, I mean, anytime Drake speaks on the record, it's obviously enjoyable to people. So I'm not mad at that. But yeah, like you said, with it, if y'all even give it's a little more

round to breathe, I would appreciate that. But you know, well you can't. You can't knock a little boat though you can't knock him. We definitely set the gold standard with that, and I think today's guests set the gold standard for the last what forty years? Man man listen to legend I remember. So we ties set to see we did it like in Hollywood at this apartment you know, shout out Laura the hyper House team. She always picks

out dope low coals for us to do interviews. And we got a couple of locations we use a lot like it's one it's like in a Hollywood hill. So you know, we get somebody like baby Face, you know that you want to do some high end ship. So we picked that spot. So I rolled to the spot and I get to the set I'm on time, and everybody else is up in there, y'all up in there pumping baby Face music, having a party, like y'all was real respectful to God. Y'allways there mad early, like all

set up. I felt like I was running late and I was on time. Man, geez. Yeah, Man's iconic. Man, I'm a big baby Face fan, you know, and just like running through his catalog, you forget how much songs he's written or produced. It's like, yo, it's overwhelming. So you know, I met baby Face a couple of years ago with La Reid, but just to have him in this setting, I never had a conversation with him like how we did, so I was super excited. Man. Yeah, now I was dope. I mean, what happened on my

side was my wife Dan y'all. She had did a thing for when he Houston's movie, which came out in December, and it was a panel with her and baby Face and another writer, and so I met him there in the first time, like I met him back in the day. Maybe I don't remember, but that's definitely A met him to chop it up with him and his new manager, his new manager, Rika Um. She's super cool. So I met him that day and then we just stayed in touching,

and then we saw him at the Rock Nation brunch. Yeah, and I feel like we all saw the bonded because we got kind of stuck at the at the big table, at the big J and B table, He's like, yo, faces like running the party down. Man, he's just I think he was gonna leave, but now he's got, he's in. He's in the spotlight area. Right. He was next to Hold the whole night. It was so dope. It was like, yeah man, it was he was like maybe maybe you

just like trying to get the DJ to play at Sunshine. Yeah, actually went to the DJ's like Yo, you're gonna play Sunshine or nah, like come on you miss is the opportunity. But even let that SunShot off. Yeah man. But I think we had great opportunities with baby, facing great moments with him. And I can't wait for everyone to listen. Is here it is right now? Man, any minutes to beat out. This ain't no little short rap right out of you. Man. We got it in with the legend. Man.

I feel like we we touched on everything right pretty much. Yeah, the old inda new like you gotta think this is a guy who's working with Sisson, you know, on her new project. Yeah. Hello, he just out right now. Yeah, he was just a Super Bowl as well, and he's on tour with Nita Baker. Like baby Face ain't resting

on his laurels. The guys still working. Yeah, and his manager Rika got him out there the right way, and I appreciate her for like understanding, you know, how important we are of the culture, and like, you know, he's very gracious with his time. You know, I feel like we could have had talked to him even longer, but you know it was really super cool, right, absolutely, absolutely, Well let's get into it then, right, let's get into it. Man, the legend baby Face. Man, its feels so special. Man

went on it to give this to you right now. Man. Kenneth baby Face Edmonds on the Rap Rate Off Podcast. Yeah, yeah, Rap Rate Off Podcast, Elliot Wilson's beat out. What's up baby and I'm feeling fantastic. We both fans today. Yes, we got the legend baby Face. Kenneth Babyface emands out there, man, how are you good to me? Doesn't legend man baby Face already having a busy twenty twenty three. Already many's been been different. It's different back outside, face, back outside.

I guess I came outside a little bit. Yeah, where we starting congratulations on a Grammy nomination. Thank you, Ella may keeps on falling, like how many? How meaningful is it to have a Grammy nomination and be recognized all these years later? That's I mean, that's a cool part. You know, I didn't see it coming. Wasn't that I was looking forward either, So when it happens, you know,

you appreciate that much more. It's an honor, you know, to still be thought of and still be that like you can still do it, you know, so I'm good with that. It was important with that Girl's now our project to connect with this new generation of artists, right, Can you speak about that process of Yeah, I think it was definitely Girls Night Out. That the whole idea of that was actually, you know, I'd like to say

that that was my idea, It wasn't. It was actually Rica, my partner, Rica, Rica the Genius Rica, and that she came up with and she said, you know it was after verses. I did verses, and you know, everybody was talking about that, and then I seem to pick up a lot of fans from there, and so it's like, how do I keep on connecting, you know, because once you still be able to, you know, write music and do things for to stay stay relevant to a certain extent.

And that seemed to be the best way. It was a great idea, and then we got out these artists and the differences. Say, I did Exhale all by myself with all the women, but this one we actually collaborate together. We wrote it together, so I was able to get a sense of them and also work with younger producers too, so that it um, it really was a whole collaboration project. Yeah's awesome, you said, We like today's female artists are kind of more clear on what they want to say

and how they want to express themselves. Clearly, yeah, everybody people in general today, but you know, definitely the female artis they really kind of have a sense of what they're not gonna say and what they're gonna say, and that's refreshing. You know, can't put words into their mouths. I can only suggest something, you know, in terms of

how they how they might approach it. I think the biggest, the biggest difference on this project with each one of the arts, I was able to kind of like kind of dig into them a little bit deeper, so they artistically they put push themselves a little bit more in terms of not just lyrically, but also as they're in the room performing, you know, going places that they wouldn't normally go to because most of the producers and people that they work with, they don't know that they got

that in them. And I think you wanted to bring light to them too. Like I think it with this project, it seems like, you know, you obviously have had the accolades and sell this amount of records, but it seemed like success for this project. To me, it was almost just the execution of it right and seeing the impact it had right. No question, it didn't even matter how

big a guy. It's a question of shining a light on a lot of these girls that the light wasn't on necessarily, and to show that there's so much talent out there and and all different. It's not like you gotta this girl's not The out office is full of the same kind of things which one of these girls had had something to bring to the table different. So that's the coolest part about it project. I think, right, you still have a lot to say too. Man, you

got your own stone right now. Matter of fact, yeah, that's just I was talked into doing it because I say, well, you know, you're doing the Super Bowl, you should have some kind of something about the streams out every day. So we put it out for that reason. But other than that, you know, wrote it about actually about two years ago, and so um and uh so it was

kind of sitting there. It's good, the good feeling, good, good love and you know, more traditional R and B. And I have a number of fans that were like, even though they liked Girls Night Out, they were like, give me the old stuff, give me the vintage. So this is kind of given some vintage baby face at fact right, as a matter of fact, I was doing that. Do you sit on a lot of music like that? Probably a lot of things I throw away and don't and don't revisit it. So your face, you don't have

no throwaways? Man? No, Yeah, I got a bunch of throwaways and stuff that I just don't you know, I think it doesn't and I like my engineers, keep up, you need to put this stuff out. But now it's it's different. It was for its for its time, and so I gotta leave it there so you stay inspired with that, Like if you ever suffer with writer's block at times, like how do you seem like you just of course you know you have writer's block, and when you have writer's block, you just don't write simple just

walk away from it. But you get inspired by everybody else and by music that you're hearing, you know. I always like, I do listen to what comes out and then and somebody directs me to someone that's that's happening whenever. Then I listened to it, and it seemed like there was a good while where I wasn't loving a lot of things, um because it was all kind of the same, sounding the same. But even even and I was, I try to understand it and why why everybody liked it?

Because I didn't want to be a hater, because you find yourself in that position, then then you will aid yourself out of out of a period, so you won't ever be able to hear it when it is good, when it does feel good, when it doesn't self. Yeah, you say that, like I think I try to do that too, Like sometimes because I've been covering hip hop forever. But like if it's a young record hits off and I don't get why it's hitting, I try to figure out.

I'll try to understand what the connectivity is, right, Yeah, and it's it's sometimes sometimes it's it's a simple lyric, it's just so stupid that it works. Are it's just the feel of it. And sometimes things are just so Sometimes things just so bad that they're good. Yeah, they're a common denominator you experience, as a lot of songs say, it's like a a certain thread. No used to be when songs were more traditional, but not anymore. It's today.

It's it can be the simplest thing, you know, you know, a kick and a you know, high hat and the right thing put on top of it. It's it makes it go. If it's it's a catchy does a stick, there's a stick with you, and that's it works with the particular genre and people, you know. So it's not like it's not necessary for everybody. There's there's a lot more pockets of music now where everybody's not necessarily all

on the same thing. There's everybody can have a career, you know, and and do well that might not have anything to do with radio true, but they can still survive and and do just as good. So it's uh, it wasn't like that before, but now there's all kind of there, there's all kinds of pockets. I saw something you said that newer artists tend to uh post the record behind the beat and set up on top of the beat like a lot of the older artists do.

Like you, can you give any examples of that that we could may not be as knowledgeable as you like, as hard as it's hard to say, like when I work with Lucky Day and Huck is really good at it too, but and Lucky's lucky can go both ways. But but what I was able to learn because when we did a remake of Ken I Love with with Earth, Wind and Fire and so, and Philip came in and saying, and it was and then we rewrote on top of it, and and the verses that we were writing on top

of it was completely different. But had a had this laid back just kind of feel that that felt like today and I started to understand it better and it felt really good. Um, And that's the that's the thing is that um, I imagine while we were doing it, I imagine Maurice White being in there and just really kind of getting it. Like I totally hear where you're coming from. So it's like, um, it is something that's you know, how to how to put this something you

have to learn. It's not something that you can just when you're growing up with it. It's now, yeah, but if you growed up doing something else, then you got to learn it. Is it almost unlearning it in a sense too, right, because to a certain extent, Yeah, yeah, I think that's really kind of it. The rules don't apply, you know. And then for a good minute, I couldn't necessarily really feel a difference, especially when I would do it.

I couldn't feel the difference of how you know, when I was like I thought, I thought I was on it, but you know, and then finally it started to you know, I started to come together and then even and I had to kind of do that with this project with singing with the girls because I didn't want to tell

two nineties and ahead of the beat and everything. So I so I was able to kind of figure that out, and and everything I played for them, played for the girls made sure that they were cool with it as well. It was really. I wasn't trying to do anything where I was just trying to like, Okay, this is it, this is how it goes right, you know. It was uh total collaboration. Yeah, you would definitely carry on tradition at the Super Bowl man, like you mentioned formed America

the Beautiful. Yeah, I kind of decided to not trying to be too new on that, just peace through a little baby face links in there in the end that might as well tried. You ain't got no other shot to do it. But as policies you alwa wasn't still kind of nerve racking or like that? Oh yeah, yeah, I was nervous as hell, wow, because you know, it could have gone wrong, could you could have gone terribly wrong,

and then that's all that's all they'll talk about. And it is you know, it's patriotic song and so you want to be respectful with it. Um and as a question of just trying to deliver it in an honest way, yeah, And that was that was my biggest thing, is it's trying to deliver it that way. And I knew doing it with acoustic guitar would be my best bet. I'm not a big gospel singer. I wasn't gonna be riffing and some runs. I wasn't gonna be my gay. I

was gonna be whitney. I was gonna be any that I just had to be, had to be myself because I had I tried to be those things, and I don't know I even tried that. So um, I just kind of went the most honest way I could approach it. And so the nerve, the nervous part was, you know, when the click comes on and when you're playing for all the backgrounds and everything that you start, when the songs will start, because if you start wrong, then it's a long day. I showed it was a song that

you heard a thousand times. Probably did you rehearse it? Showed we showed yourself playing it as as a child, right as a teenager. Yea, I played it. U. That's the only other time I played on stage. But yeah, I was like like and as a sophomore and h Me and Darryl Simmons and Sky Manual Officer we did, you know, did harmonies with it? So not the same version. Isn't it crazy that many years ago this guy jay Z, you don't really know who he is. You jump in you do a hook for a song called shot Yeah,

yeah you in and out. And then many years later, you know he's involved with this and he's fucking you to play super Bowl and pays me the favorite back Fromally because that's payback paid for it. Just got a way for it. This was much better than any verse he would have given me. So because when we did do that, ACTIVE was telling him when I went in with him, I didn't know who he was. Uh, andre Relle kind of pushed me, yeah, you need to do that, and it was Frankie Barreley song. I was like, why

am I doing this? He said he wanted you, so all right do it and he said, yeah, I know you didn't know who I was, but it was cool. I still did it anyway. So um, and so that was that long ago, and so you know, full circle, you know he was. He certainly made the decision, which was an unorthodox decision in the sense that I wouldn't have been the normal choice for it doing that the politics in the past, I just know what the that's just the reality of it. So it was definitely, um,

a unique call and I appreciate it. You know, you ended up we end up holding quarter to the main table with the Right Nation Project. We all had a good time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, my stay longer than you intended. But yeah, I actually had been intended to go in and out, but I was sitting with the King, so you know, and it was great. We had a great conversation, So it was fun. Well, you're performing with the Queen, miss Anita Baker currently on Yes, Yes, she's so good.

She's so good. I watched the show we performed last night, and that was our first show on Valentine's Day. Yeah, and man, you forget, you know. I mean, there's always the hits, but the thing that goes beyond the hits is that real artist that can go up on that stage and really make those things come alive. You you understand why she is who she is. She's amazing and so great to have her out there, and I'm so

glad to be out there performance with her. Yeah. I saw something he said a lot of the success of uh Was It, Tony Braxton was like originally the intent was a lot of those songs were for Anita. There there were two songs specifically written for Anita that she turned down. Yeah, I don't feel bad about it told me about the story about love should have brought you home.

Love shoud have brought you home and you mean the world to me was the second one that was written, maybe she should do this when instead, but um, your love ship brought you home? Was that was We wanted a Nita on the project and she said we didn't need her at all. I mean, it's only the first show I saw. Ushra came out right yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a good kick in it with him, you know, reconnect h she came back, he came back stage that we said hey and stuff. So we see each other

every now and then. Um, yeah, that was like the first night for the show, so it was you know a little bit of trying to get it together. We go. She was just incredible and it was fun. Crowd was great. It was Atlanta, Yeah it was. It was sold out. It was a great night. I saw something one of the earliest show you did. I think it was over overseas that this is still party of sellers. But it seems like you just stunt and say, hey, I'm about to do a half hour of just hits that I

wrote for other people. That's that's that's a big part of the show. So because I do go through a medley songs, and so I gotta go through the guy songs and I gotta go through the girls songs. So that's like and beast half the show. So it's a fun part because it really checks everybody down memory Lane and everybody get up in party. I get to I get to get my Bobby on. I get he's in

the choreography a little. Right. We were talking about the Bobby thing to go back, like I think like we all loved New Edition kind of going up, but it was like something about when that Bobby record hit that don't be cruel, Yeah, it'd just be kind of kadis phenomenon. It was, it was watched it in real time. It was like when Bobby was let go. I think that probably a lot of them probably thought that was it for Bobby. And yeah, Bobby actually put up a single

called Girlfriend. I don't know. I think it might have been a whole album, but it can't say mad. It's a little it was a little made. It wasn't fully there, yea, it wasn't all the way there, but it was like, you know, I mean a girlfriend, I forget something something like that. I remember, I remember what made me decide to want to work with him. He was we had just met with Little Silas over MCA and he was saying, you got should work with Bobby, and I wasn't completely sure.

Then when we got in the car driving, Bobby was doing this live show on kJ LH and he was singing girlfriend and he started singing and he went for a note and he didn't hit the note. And then he goes, I didn't want to sing that song anyway, man, he's crazy. And then I want to work with them for sure. So when it came the chance to work with them, these songs that were some of the songs had been sitting around for a while, UM weren't really um, they weren't written for him for se They became his

Don't Be Cruel was definitely written for him. But Rock with You was written before and Roni was written way before the way before. Every little step was written, every little step was actually tried to place that on Midnight start Wow. And so so Bobby ended up getting these songs that were when he when he took them and when he his voice got on them, there's this magic that happened. And when he worked with you know, Teddy Riley, and that my prerogative. It's like, so to be a

part of that. Bobby actually, to be honest, Bobby leaned towards Teddy Riley more than he did with us. Yeah, it was saying there was some resistance at first, right, Yeah, definitely because Teddy was like the you know, Cheddy was killing. He came out with you know, key Sweat. You know when when I heard I won her, I said, oh, it's over. How are we gonna ever do anything like that? That's that felt so proud. It was like, oh, it

changed my life. And there I was like, oh man, it was just so it was so new and so just and so like there's no way we're gonna ever be that funky um. And so you know, our version of it ultimately became you know, you know every little step which was still up song. Yeah, you know, um and um, even with Don't Be Cruel. So it was he just had this thing about him where he the rawness of Bobby. There's an honesty that was in it. Yeah,

and that's that's what it was. So that honesty. And then he was also you know the first first one to start rapping with his music and so that that brought it to another level. So it put him on a whole nother thing. And so we sat there and watched that happen when he did the Dumpy Crew video. And then I remember we were out on the road somewhere in South Carolina or North Carolina. He was touring

with New Addition I'll be Sure, I'll be Sure. It was headlining New Addition and Bobby Brown, and Bobby was opening the show. And I remember we got to the show late, didn't didn't get to see Bobby go up, but walked out on the side of the stage, and while New Addition was on the stage. Now, while I'll be Sure was on the stage, Bobby walked on the side and even though we shore was on the stage, all these girls saw Bobby over there. They were freaking

out that Bobby Brown was there. And I was like, oh, it's getting reay, it's getting ready changed. And probably a month later that tour went from I'll be Sure being in the middle of New auditioning open I'll be Sure and Bobby Brown was headlining. Wow, we shuffled it. Never seen that, you know, he was he was electric, he was explosive. The way he performed when you see things that he was just a performer and he just it was just excitement. So he was lucky to find us,

and we were lucky to find him. Yeah, at the right time, it's just the right time. Well, I mean, you have a string of hits, like, you're one of the most iconic songwriters and producers of all time, and you wrote everything like but the Bible but what I want? I was like, how does a person become a great songwriter like yourself? I don't know if there's any I don't really have an answer to it, other than I always used to just like the right songs all the time,

and I wrote a lot of songs. It's up too that, you know. It was the process of trying to figure out what people liked. I remember sitting outside Benny Medina's office trying to pedal some songs too, and I sat out there for a couple of hours and finally got in and played him stuff and he's like, no, I don't hear anything. And those were early pieces of things

that weren't really that good yet. But but it was that process of going through getting denied that made me like, Okay, I'm gonna work a little harder and try to figure this out. How can I be more commercial? How can I make sure I got a good hook? How can I make sure that it matches whatever the artist it is.

And that's when I think when it started to become more alive, when we were actually able to get the artist and work with the artists and then then actually shape it that way, because otherwise it was just kind of just songwriting and not every person, producer or something would be able to figure out what to do with it to make it match whoever that artist would be. So where you're like good in English when you were growing up in no I like doing poetry, write writing poetry,

and I was like writing songs. I started writing songs when I was in sixth grade, right, So, Um, but I was I was a very average student. You know, I sucked at school. I will not show you my report, Garter. But do you know when the song is gonna be com a hit? Is there a feeling to it? Nah? You know when something feels good to you and you hope that it catches and hope that everybody else hears it.

But there's there's no real answer to that. Um, everybody you can always be a Monday morning quarterback and say I knew that was gonna be, but you never know. And I still I stand with that. There are some people that maybe knew you know, um, when you're hot and when it's when it's groove oriented. I'm sure there are times and people are just like, Okay, this is one,

this is one, and um. But I've always been kind of superstitious, and I always say, now, I'm not going to say that because as soon as you say that, it won't be. Yeah. So I think do I think of like your songs like a singular song that kind of became its own phenomenon too. I think of boys the Man into the Road? Yeah, yeah, like and I think you have put a photo on ig like what your kids saying? The house behind you is where you wrote the songs? Can you speak about that? Like? I

always wonder what you like? Where where are you actually creating these songs? Like where's where you writing these songs? I mean like there's a lot of songs all over Hollywood We're Wow that were created in little places that I was like that we were living in, like, um, in some apartments, I know where Can we talk which was on Burton Way and Maple the apartment there, um, whipp A Pill in Hollywood on Millner Street. Also wrote the Bobby Brown's On Our Own classic. But I think

overall just writing in general. Um, like with the End of the Road, that was a place, a little house that I got just to go there and have a space to write it. It was really just for myself. That was really kind of listening going to the movie to when we range watching it and then saying, okay, they need they needed song from voicing man. They really wanted to solve form voicing man. So I wanted it to have a really kind of sounding and just started,

you know, thought of the situation. I wrote it for a particular scene that it didn't go on the scene that I wanted it to go for it, But that's where the inspiration came from. Yeah. But also it's about a break up and you were going through a break up at that time too, right, situation No kind of I don't know, it wasn't it didn't factor into it.

I'm just thinking, no, I don't. It's like there was a complete for like, like my personal life, many times, there's a complete separation of me writing other than me writing something like kids. Yeah, but other than that, writing personal stuff, I usually like, damn, I'm not gonna kept

a separate and they're gonna put those two together. But you could certainly read from them from all the sad songs I've written and love songs I written over the years, but it was never really on the basis of that.

I always at least that's what I'm gonna tell myself. Yeah, we think this big part of that song to me is like you know, but I think a lot of times, especially with you, also like we credit you for writing songs, but how active you also are as a producer of the songs, like almost a decision there to like drop off them to go a cappella at the end of the song. Yeah, to me as so much of a key of why that song they just they just sound

so good, you know, and they were. I mean, I I did the demo of the song, and when I did this song, it was it was one song that I thought was really good. I said maybe I should keep this from myself, and obviously didn't keep it for myself. I think that's one time you know that where once they got on it, it was like it was it was made for them. Yeah, and we only had one day to record it one afternoon wow, because they were out on the road and they came in and when

we started working together, we could tell. I think at that point we could tell with Boyson Man myself that we kind of connected and that we would probably be able to work together in future because there was just something that was kind of magical with us. I feel like sometimes it's Boys Depends somewhat underrated, right. I feel like this generation like they'll praise Joda see which were dope. Also when I feel like Boys the Man doesn't fully

get the the credit they deserved. Yeah, I think the issue with that it is a culture question because m Jodas is very far more cultural in that since Boys the Man, they became very big pop U Jodsy never became that um, but culturally they were huge so um.

So it's a question of flavor sometimes and Boysmen get they get overlooked, even on something like even with their first album, there were a lot more urban things on the first album that people have intendency to forget because they became so big with the Motown Philly and then at that particular point they became an America's group and uh, and then into the road kind of like blew them out. Yeah. So so it was so they were suddenly not ours

per se, right, Yeah, they weren't. They became not necessarily a black group and uh, but just pop and and I think there there's the difference. And they have they have love songs that are big pop love songs. But your sound is so tailored for the specific artists, right, But when it comes to production, you don't sample, right, you know, he don't do remixes either. So all the production that we hear from from all these classics, these are just from scratch. Yeah, I mean initially the demos

would be done and be fair. Um, a lot of the things were done with LA in terms of of course the production, the earlier stuff. You know, we were doing things together than I when we when we separated and I had to kind of do it myself. But I had always I had always been doing the demos anyway. It was something that was kind of like, I guess, learning on the job all the time. When we first got our chance to produce our own album, we were scared because we didn't know if we really knew, you know,

we always were under the depression. It's like really difficult, and it's like you gotta be way smarter than producing stuff, when in fact, it's just a question of you know, what you hear, you know and doesn't feel good, doesn't feel right. And once you trust that, then you know, anybody can any But if you have that, if you have that ability, then you can go make magic happen. Wow.

That's like where I've always said, like p Diddy, Puffy, it's always been underrated because, um, you know, he didn't play any instruments, but he knew how to go in there. He knew when that stuff felt right. He wouldn't let it come out till, you know, untill it came out right.

So and you have these other producers that would help create those tracks and stuff like that, but he was like that dude, that was like yeah, you know, And and the proof is in the pudding in terms of how much how much success everybody had afterwards, not that they didn't have it, but it wasn't the same kind of success. So I give him much credit for that.

And I ended up working with him on this album, this last album he's working on it, and and I actually got to see him work and produce and I understood it. You know how he can inspire you and get you to, you know, give me this, give me that he does that. He does it way better than I do in terms of trying to inspire you to really go there. Yeah. I had a lot of respect from him after that. No, but yeah, because he's working on more of an R and B type product, Yes, something like that. Yeah. Yeah.

So what's it like being the goal to producer from the late eighties all the way up to like the mid nineties, when you're like the most sought after. Um, you know, it's not someone's go to at this point. There's there are people that My blessing is that there are producers, and there are artists that still want to work with me today, and people that are and literally you know, really want to get in the studio and

chop it up. That doesn't that's not normal and because of and I think part of that is because I try to not be stuck in one particular genre. And I've done a number of things, you know, from from Boys to Man to Tum DOWNA to a Barber Strits and to Fallout Boy to Eric Clapton. You know, so doing that and coming from the basis of being a musician first, I just feel like you should your ears, should always be open and always be ready to try anything.

Your musician so shouldn't be afraid of it and shouldn't get so stuck in having your sound or anything. Some people would come to me for my sound, they would like to like for me to do backgrounds on things. That's how it was with mcdonna, That's how I was with Eric Clapton, and then that's kind of like how I would push the whole baby face thing sometimes the background or going back to Ronie like yeah, you know.

The funny thing is that I think that's really how I got my gig with the deal to begin with, because I was really good at making four track demos and doing backgrounds, really good at that, and so I was actually hired from Jeff Cooper and Midnight Star said can you please come down and help us produce the deal? Write some songs for the deal because you do really good four tracks, so why don't you do that and you can help with the deal. Helped them get a

record deal. I wasn't even in the band that and so that was kind of my thing and I always was good at kind of making doing backgrounds and doing harmages. How did two occasions change your life? Two occasions was that's a song that there's a number of people that were writing it as a piece of a song, and D actually came up with the I Don't Think of

you in two acases? I said, oh shit, and uh no, that was actually du de Bristol, the lead of lead singer of the deal and the talented talented guy D with like sitting come up with the hook and seconds and so he took that, and it's just with a couple of things I was starting to put together. And the funny thing about two occasions is that I don't know that we knew what we had when we were

putting it together. We definitely didn't um And there was this moment where we were doing the song and D was supposed to sing the whole song and Carlos wanted to sing the song, but actually we had it for D to sing the whole song. But we were out here in California on Highland and Franklin the other apartment over there, and we were at Solar Records, which is uh later became the Emnos building and then became Now

was Dian Warren's building. So we were there and we're working on the song, and then d was supposed to come in, and D said, I can't come work on the song because I need to go back to Ohio Coac Cincinnati because I got a Halloween party I'm throwing. So he went to go to his. He was famous for his Halloween parties, so he went back and gave

his Halloween party. So it left it to where I had to do the bridge and and Carlos, who did Diverse, got on got to be able to reverse, and so that was like how I ultimately ended up on two occasions, it was supposed to be d and then we did the fake live version. I think that was kind of like where baby Face became baby Um, because I had a song I called I Love You Babe that was out at the same time, and um, it was okay, it's doing okay, but it wasn't, and I was confused.

I didn't know who I was trying to be. You listened to that first album that it's it's everywhere everything, It's everywhere. So you got new audition songs, you got it's just like how old are you anyway, and so when that song happened, I Love You Babe happened, and then then two occasions, this one thing happened in the

summer where we were we were touring. This is like I said, this is the birth of the baby Face Bootsie again even me the name, and that was like that was fate too, because we couldn't figure out a nickname for myself. And then I walked in the studio one day he said baby Face and that was it. There's more to that, but anyway, so we were on tour in Indianapolis, Indiana, and we performed. We performed that night and we would do the whole show, and I think we had had a good reaction to the songs

and stuff like that. But then I had some wisdom teeth that were impacted and I had to have my wisdom teeth taken out. So they decided rather than just taking the two others, saying we need to take all four outs. So I was like messed up. And we had a show maybe the next night or two nights later in Louisville, Kentucky, and I couldn't go on, and so my brother Melvin, he took my place and saying that night. Then we had another big show a couple of nights later in New Orleans at the Superdome. Yea.

So it was like forty thousand people whatever, and they were like, you know, you really need to go up, that's it, but I can't. I can't. So what we decided to do was, um, they did the whole show and then at the end of the show, de goos So one of our members, baby Face, he you know, he couldn't make it out here tonight because he feels really sick, but he feels so bad about it, he wanted to come out here and try to do this last song for you guys, and so um, so, welcome up,

baby Face. And I walked across. I have this white suito and I walk across the stage. I'm imagining I'm walking like Luther. And as I'm walking across, but I'm in pain, and I'm like I was actually in pain. I go down and sit at the piano and started Doom Doom, Doom, doom. The whole place explodes just with that. And I always remember we played in eighty two eighty three with Luther and the Barge, and we get killed

every night because of it. As soon as we finished, they said, next up is the barge, and the place would explode. And we were always looking for our explosion, but we never would get an explosion. And so when I did dom Doom Doom Doom, Um, the whole place exploded and I started saying and that was like the birth of baby Face. Um. And then I played sick the rest of the tour, The show must go on, I played, so I just wait till the last song and come on. It was. It was a nice little gimmick.

But then you build with tender lover it right, so that's your second It's no crime, whip the pillson as I get home. Yeah, what was the whole process putting that record again? So that was I was starting to because of, you know, two occasions, all of a sudden, I'm starting to say, okay, so that's who baby Face is. A romantic guy, you know. So I'm starting out to try to write things that makes sense there. And but sometimes it was it wouldn't be like it's a crime.

It is completely different. Yeah, um temple. Yeah, it was like a whole different. Sometimes I would end up doing tracks that would that weren't necessarily what everybody else was doing, but it was just music, so I would just do it, and that was That was one of those things. I remember. Michael Jackson liked that track It's No Crime. He liked It's no Crime. I don't like what's on top of, but I love the group. Thank you. He talks about working with Michael michaels like I love it. I love

it exactly. I dig real deep, now, deeply. You obviously didn't dig deep enough for the the top part on crime, but it's okay. I'd like to check. He didn't say that, but that's what I'm listening. You didn't have that joint with Michael, right like the way Teddy had remember the time. Now, yeah, Eddy, I worked with Michael. I did, uh, did a couple of songs here and there, but never got that one.

Never um that one that you know, I really wanted and um, but I went with them a couple of times and really kind of hung out with them a few times where we were just kind of like we would just talk and it wasn't even about really recording anything. So and to me, that's just as precious to me in that sense to be in that been in that position. But like, you know, Teddy clearly clearly did his thing with Michael and made a made a stamp. You know, people mean, I know you as a kid, like that's

when you interviewed Michael Jackson as a kid. You you scammed your way through that, Like yeah, ido yours. It's an interesting thing because I you know, I was I would watch how Michael. Michael was magical and Michael had this ability to like to make people do anything he wanted to him to do and um, and I was like so excited to meet him again. And as an adult. Before we met with Michael, we went to Line Richie's

house Brenda Ritchie and Lionel was there. The Linel talked about doing We Are the World with him and we were like the next day, we want to get on a helicopter go out and visit Michael and Neverland and Lionel goes. You know, just be careful, just to watch out for him because he's you know, he's a sneaky he's sneaky, little careful and he gets you doing a bunch of stuff that you don't want to do, and so you know he'll pull you in. He got that charm.

He'll pull you in, so I approached it without him. Now, I ain't gonna let you get me, you know, So I acted a little bit more Indianapolis than I normally would have. I didn't fan out on him, you know, with Lionel's warning, and I think because of that, Michael, we were always end up being cooler with each other because of the because I didn't I didn't fan out on him, I didn't praise him, and he just saw.

He always used to say, you know, you're funny. We've got the same sense of human because we're from India. I was like, yeah, maybe, but he was. He was great. He was, you know, a very sweet person. I think that we were. We were just lucky to have you know, worked with them period. And and I just got so much respect for those that you know, really worked with him and really got really great stuff. The name that nobody wants to mention, but R Kelly, did you know,

Yeah you're not alone? You know, Yeah, that's a great copyright. There is that this instance. It's the rest of you, like even like go back to your bet like even your first album, like it's a cover song of a stylistic's like you covered James ll like like to me, someone who writes great songs like yourself, you really appreciate other great songs on the question way that's different great songs great writers. I was never jealous. I was never

even competitive with any other writers. I always respected their work, even with Teddy and and when we were doing the Bobby album and I could see Bobby clearly leaning towards that, I said, I get it, you know, that's what it is. So I was never it was never a it was never a competition thing to me. And I think I got that a little bit from just Jimmy jam and Terry Lewis because when we met them, they were so

nice and so supportive. I was like, so that's how you're supposed to be, because I wanted to beat them and to run into Jimmy and Terry who were just the nicest people in the world, and they were like, don't underestimate what they did and the sound that they created, and nobody, nobody could do it like them. Nobody ever came out doing Jimmy the Jimmy and Terry sound, nobody

ever captured. They owned that, and from the Janet stuff to to other things that they've done, um and to come from the time you thought that was you know that they would have been they would have been that, but I guess ultimately that was Prince. But so when they came, it sounded so fresh that they came with

their own thing. So, but they were a huge inspiration for me as a as a writer and a producer, wanting to be like them and half the reason why we got La and Baby faces Jimmy, Jemmy, Terry Lewis we need a cool name, So La Baby why did the all partnership and at that time of ninety three or so, like, that's something I cannot talk about at the moment, uh, but I will talk about it later in a document doing a documentary. Yeah, nice, Yeah, I

remember that was a big thing in the industry. Was just like because you think about it, like there was people get fascinated because there was never no decline right like you guys were No we still you know, um, the actual working together and producing together. That that's the only thing that ultimately changed. Yeah, but we kept kept the Face going and I kept on writing for the Face as well and the artists that would be there, and we were able to build in that way, I

think interesting enough. I think it was probably the best thing that could have happened, because I think that La was destined to become an executive and ultimately go to the places that he that he went to, and I was destined to, you know, would come over a writer

and a producer and go down that road. Even more things might have been different, you know, had had it gone another way, I might not have ever got to Madonna, I might not ever got to those kind of things, those kind of projects, they wouldn't have ever happened, and so I would have been able to grow as a producer, writer. You guys remained great friends and like you I've seen you say before, like you don't think also, Elie gets

enough credit for what he's achieved as an executive. As an executive, he you know, he accomplished a lot of things, um and um, and you know you gotta you give give credit to where credits do. I think that my goal, my my thing has always been a writer. I've always been a writer from the get go. Um and uh, more of a writer than even an artist and so writer, producer, artist, that's kind of like how I put things, you know,

and somewhat of a hip hop head. You know. I mean hip hop is celebrating his fifty years year this year, and um, you're old enough to see its growth, right and growing up in Indiana, like we're they're artists or groups that you the songs that you gravitated towards and its inception, Well, you know, we were. I was hip

hop happened? Who started happening? Actually when actually when I was in this group called Manschott is a guy named Reggie Griffin who's the leader of the band, and he it up leaving Manchot a little earlier and he ended up working with this little group called sugar Hill Game, a little something I was like, and he started doing a lot of the music for them, so like he had jumped out a way earlier, knew that that's what

the possibility is was for that. And I remember when we were in the deal, we had this little group open up for us, and we're like, what are they doing? Is this even work? You know, they was wearing their datas and they had their hats on, and of course, you know, three months later they was way above us. It was rundow, you know, but they had opened up for us. I don't know about that, and wasn't wasn't judgmental with it was just a question of didn't didn't

quite understand it? Yeah, Um, And then it's it's interesting I think, Um, I think that I often imagine had I grown up to day, what kind of writer would I be? You know? And depending on where I grew up in you know, I grew up in New York, you know, what kind of how influence would I be? And at a different time, UM, would I lean towards

it hip hop? You know? I mean, I'm to this day, I still look at like, I love Drake and I think that Drake is like, Um, I'd love to work with Drake when we just do a classic song because I think it's phrasing and his and um, his lyrics and everything. I think I think it goes beyond just you know rap so to say, and um, and I like the tone of his voice, so I feel like there's even in that. I feel like I hear emotions

and stuff in his voice. So as a writer and a producer, even for even even with hip hop, with rap, hip hop for whatever you all call it, Um, they're the same thing applies the emotion and the feel good and and there is like you know, from whether it's Drake from a little baby, you know, to a baby face right, yeah, you know, these these vibes that I hear when I when I hear it, it moves me. So I often think, thank how would it be if I I was actually growing up today? Who would I be?

How would I be? You know? And how depends are what part of the country you come from. But you also signed one of the greatest rap groups of all time, Outcast.

Outcast was on the face and to be honest, that was La signing and I wasn't as involved at that point, but nevertheless they were on the face and they um, you know, Big Boy and Dre you know, that's like to this, to this point their heroes, you know, because they came, they came completely different and honest and which it always seems to go back to that how honest

are you? And how how real does it feel? And those those are the those are always the same ingredients and every kind of every genre of music, it's how real does it feel? Man? You did get on the Jazzy Bell remix though, Yeah, that's cussing on that thing. Well, you know, to straighten up your still applause you'll have to You'll have to play because I forget these things sometimes I do, like a lot of songs I do.

I remember being at a concert, um, and I think Drew Hill was playing, and um, I heard some music, heard something that sounds from me here, and it was a couple of songs that they started playing, and I forgot that I had even written the songs. Wow. And so sometimes when certain things come on, I've it's been so much that I've done over the years, I really kind of forget that I even did them. And that's not trying to like I ain't trying to flex or anything.

I'm just saying I when I do something, I do it, and then I'm done with it. It's like when I write something, I write it, then I forget, forget it. On the keyboard, I have to learn learn it all over. And fortunately I don't do really difficult chords most of the time, so I can usually figure it out again because I'm not really so much a piano player as it. And I played. I played to write songs, you know, and then once that's done, then I moved on and suffe.

So how does it feel when you get calls from like little Wayne, have you on the song comfortable? Well, that kind of just happens, you know. We did that. I did the song with Kanye, did the course and everything and uh and then little Wayne found it and did it, so we weren't in the studio together. It was great too that he that he loved it and he didn't did it you know. So um, A lot of the a lot of the things that are things

that are you know, attached with the hip hop. It's like either they find a song that sampled or something, you know. And that was one course I did. It was fun. I would probably do more if I got called, I'd probably do more courses. I love to win you, Yeah, for sure. I love when you were for real connected for their she goes it was like your first time really being produced by somebody, right. Yeah. That was And for Rell was I mean, Forrell was amazing and I

was that was. I didn't mind going in there and doing that because I wanted it was a learning experience. I wanted to learn from him and see how he

does what he does. I was amazed you know that what he did it from you know, and it just it just minded me of how you know, it doesn't really so much matter how how much equipment you have are whether you have everything in the the world where you can afford everything in the world, it's all about your creativity and what you can and and and how you hear things and what you can work with with what

you got. And that was clearly a sign of like I knew that Pharrell was going to be, like he was already kind of big, but it was gonna be much bigger than it was. We had a conversation with baby Face Ray. Yeah, and then he told us that you guys had a conversation. Yeah, yeah, what was that initial in action? It was it was one of those interviews that you know, somebody said you should meet baby Face Ray and and and so we just kind of

talked to each other. You know, he's from Detroit. Yeah, And I listened to his music and I listened to his vibe and you know, I like it, like laid back vib you know. Um. And I just talked to him about the music that he you know, that he writes, and and what is it about what inspires him? And it's the same thing that inspires us all and he just writes real stuff, you know, and real things that happened in his life, and you know, UM, it was very cool here from his perspective. UM, And once again,

it's honest. And I think that. I think that whenever you're dealing with musicians and you're dealing with with artists, UM, there's always a connection that you can always make and even even in working together, you can always read the connection as long as there's honesty that's there. You know, you never know whether a big hit would come out of it, but at least you know the art's going to come out of it. Right. What do you make of this long standing connection to this? Can we talk record?

It feels like that that's kind of become like, um, the biggest record in a different sense. Yes, how timeless has become. Yeah, time has been kind to Can we talk about UM? Shout out to he had Tevin? You know Tevin. You know we met Tevin right before he was signing, right when he signed with Quincy, so even before he actually sung Tomorrow, and he came to our studio.

Bennie Medina brought him to the studio and U and brought him in and I think we were like, oh, we want him because he could he could sing, Because we asked him to sing a couple of things and what he's saying, he's he's uncle Rutha Franklin respect. Then he sung Superwoman yeah, and I'm like, whoa that voice? You know? And so it wasn't until obviously his next album a couple of years that where Quincy actually called me and said, I would love for you to write

something for Tevin. And I had one song I had already written. I had written it in school, and uh so I just kind of like, because I've written on the guitar that I took it and rewrote into the song called I'm Ready Yeah. It was hard too, yeah, And so I recorded that first and sent that to him and Quincy loved it. Then he said I love it. Can you give me something else? I need a couple of other things. And that's when you know, I wrote

a real can we talk with? Kevin had him in mind us got into the studio with another young new artist or Scissor. She's still knew, I don't know, but she's on top of the game right now, the game right, but snooze right that was supposed to be on it wasn't. There's still two songs Okay and there's there's another song that exists. I want to say the title, but um, but I hope that she will finish it. This a

couple of things she could do. Finish it because they was supposed to be on a girl's night out right and and maybe she'll she'll grace us with that one day deluxe album or so. But um, yeah, this news was written there in Brandon's way and in two songs. She wrote two songs. Scissor is incredible. I've been around a lot of writers and a lot of artists, and to watch her work and and her how how unique she is in her own artistry, I just don't haven't

seen that. UM. And she's serious about her craft with the songs very she's very serious and and she's uh, but she's an artist, she's you know, she's like also very um not always secure, I think, and which artists are like that can be like that many times. But she is uh because she's incredible. I don't think. I don't think she has any idea how incredible she is UM and how talented she is. UM. I think that she's uh, she's she's one of the best that I've seen.

It's dope, like your connection to the newer generation, like it's sold happen in you know, with even with the album and like versus how that kind of reinvigorated the career and brought it to a new set of new set of generation, news set of eyes. Yeah, and he said, Andrea Rell cur and courage you to do Yeah, the versus what was your connection? Me and Andre had been

friends for years. We connected just really but by him having Uptown and LaFace and we used to have discussions about who was going to be bigger Mary Jay and between Tony Braxon and he'd be like the real versus he was like it was all that back in the day man, and we were like the we were like the black excellence and he was he was he was all about the hood and that's in culture and you know, and so he respected what it was. And so we were like we weren't We weren't competitors. We would just

talk about music. I would always talk with Andre, he was I would I played him the Excel album when I finished to get his get his opinion on it. And I played him the Mary J record when I finished it um to get his opinion because I was not gonna cry. I was very proud about it. And I remember sitting at the Four Seasons and my white range Rover playing for when he listened to it and he goes, nah, this ain't it. Wow. I said, what

do you mean it's not it? He goes this, you know it's a nice record, but you know this ain't married. Mary's not this hip hop soul. She ain't old, She don't you know, she ain't got no kids. And let's just say this don't make no sense. It doesn't make sense to her story. And then I said, it's not supposed to make sense. It's for the movie. And I said, and Mary is the voice of everyone. You know that

she's gonna she's speaking for more than just herselves. She's speaking for every woman that's ever been in this position. You know, I disagree, And uh, I was right, and you both. Secretari, Yeah, she didn't write that. I wrote that. She was like, you sure you want to say, Secretary? Yeah, secret Well, you mention like the way they excel soundtrack when you know you did, And so food contribute to the Bodyguard. Why do we have like movie soundtracks like

that anymore? I just don't know that they connect the same way anymore. Music is completely different. Um. The way we consume musicum with the way we don't watch movies the same in music, you know, connects the same. It's it's it's just so much out there, so much more information out there that no one guides you any particular place, and so it's it's so much more individual at this

particular point. I always kind of make this point where where you have like Kaylani, who's like out there selling arenas and you know she's not like doing big radio records. You don't need to, right because she's got her fan base and they love they know, they sing every word, and you know it is um is a pure sign of them where the artists can be in control and it's not about labels or anything. It's really about the artists at this point becoming more and more about that.

And if you just happen to hit it, hit it right, you know, it's a different day. There are far more artists that are far more successful than they were in the nineties, that are making far more money for about things and they don't need the record company money. They don't need you know, those things, because they can make it so many other way. So The one thing about you know, um just you know, social media and everything, is that it's that it does. There are opportunities that

come with it. It may hurt us in other ways, but to a lot of artists it's great. All right. What do you think about this recent trend with like a lot of your peers selling their catalogs. I know, La read so it is a few years ago. I think if you can get the right dollars for it, then yeah, you do it. You know, Um, we're in a crazy times. We don't know what what's coming. And then if you if you get the right number and makes sense in your life, then I don't I don't

think it's it's terrible. Some people will not sell it, and some people will, you know, so you could write more song, especially those that are young enough to where they can keep on, stay in the game and just do it over again. It's not something that you're opposed. No, no, why would impost to somebody making money? You know, all right? Someone buying something? Who I did? We we built the face to sell it, you know, we're One of my earliest experiences with your song was on an old school

uh medium TV on Family Matters. Remember get cool. Yeah, I know, and it seems like on social media so kind of taking on the life of his own that particular song. Yeah, I didn't. I didn't see that to wait to after it had been done. In the time that happened, I had no idea that it happened. So that's crazy. Um. I mean there are there are certain moments like that that you remember in TV that that used to be powerful. I mean I did the uh you are so beautiful uh um Martin and Gina's wedding,

that's right. Oh yeah, yes, and many times I would be asked to seeing you are so beautiful people's wedding. That's tsion. But yeah, there there have always been moments like that, you know that we don't feel the same way anymore because television is such a you know, everybody's looking for a viral moment and U you can't. You can't create them. Yeah, that's the one thing that's and I think that's the good thing, because you can kind of create it, then we're all in trouble, you know.

So it keeps it, It keeps us guessing, you know, keeps it honest. Yeah, are you gonna recreate the magic? You Madonna? Hers. She's going on tour this year. I don't know when when Men and mcdonnad did that song take About It was another one of those songs that was not a traditional McDonald's song. Did very well. Um we got actually one of the American music word for it. Yeah, and it was crazy when we performed it on that show.

And I remember being so nervous and because I had on some really white pants, my leg was like shaking like that. It's on YouTube. Yeah, well you won't see

that leg ship, but the leg was shaken. And I remember coming off the stage and saying to her, I was so nervous, and she said I was so nervous too, And that hit me like, WHOA mcdonnad's nervous, because it was just a different kind of It's so different experience, and to this day I can't The one thing I'll say is that these moments that happened, that passed you by,

you almost don't realize that even happens. The one thing, the one thing that I can say about as it relates to the amount of the catalog that that I have in terms of all the songs I've written, is that I was never stopping to say, to smell the flowers or smell the success. I was like, okay, did this, Okay, now go back and work more. And so I was working throughout at the high points when when it seems like it every week was like a you know, top

ten song or whatever like that, I wasn't. I wasn't focused on anything, but just still just the music and not so much like I want to get another top ten, I want to get this. It's just it was writing for writing's sake and enjoying that process. So when I remember when I see things where I see me on the American Music Wards with Madonna, are performing Change the World with Eric Clapton on the Grammys, those those memories aren't clear as the memories that I have for growing

up and and working towards doing all of this. Once you got in, Once I got into it, then that's all I was doing. But the years prior to it, um the deal years, and which I would say, those really fun times with with with the band and stuff like that. That stuff I can clear memories and clear stories that come from it, but not so much with the um when I've got when I really got with the really big artists, not as clear because I was still in work. Moth n what else can we look

for it for to this? You know, Um, I'm just uh, we're actually trying to put together a deluxe album for Girls Night Out as well, and and I think that I'll be out touring as well and just look at some other kind of projects that you know, there's a lot of people that have been hitting me about doing some work, which is which is fun, and so I'll figure out what things I want to do and just kind of keep doing doing the same thing in it. That's the that's my blessing is that I'm that I'm

able to at least do it. You know, people are still interested, you know, right, so we're still interested in the music. But before we get out of here, what are the five baby Face essentials? I know it's difficult essential, it's essentials. Like there's too many songs and that's not me trying to flex um, but there there are so many moments and and there's probably songs that you know that weren't necessarily big songs, but things that you know,

kind of touch me. And um AT's while working with it. Read the Franklin That's why I'll read the Franklin like that hurts like hell on the Excel thing. That's like one of my favorites. And that's the number one in your heart. Yeah, because the way she performed it and and um, because she just came in and just killed that thing, and that was a special that's a special moment, a special memory. Doing the XCEL project gets it's a little cloudy in terms of some some of the details

with certain things stick out. Working with shot Guy, working with UM, with Patty LaBelle, Um, because working with Brandy, when I worked my classic because those were like done in my house, Um on what the street was that let's get the street, the street, I'm spacing the street right now. It wasn't Carrollwood. Um, there's a little house that I had. And so the studio was in back of the kitchen. There was a kitchen and then had

a little studio in the back. And so I mean Patty would come walk through the kitchen, she's she's like I might cook something for her, come in there, and and then and everybody came in there. So because that that whole time period, I had Madonna coming in there, I had Whitney coming there. We did we wrote come on me there had uh, Brandy came in there, and Brandy like, you know, I listened to Brandy prior to it, and I, you know, wrote the song specifically for her

in the in the movie. But the thing when she came in and started singing, I was like, yeah, my mouth was just wide open. I couldn't not believe in. Then she did the harmonies and I was like, it was just unbelievable. Brandy is I think she's one of the most underrated singers. Let's say all time. The voice she is incredible, um and that voice is just it's um,

it's glorious. And I was I couldn't believe it. When I did that did that song with her, I was like so happy, you know, when she was doing it. And it's not like I was thinking, oh, this is a hit or something like that. I was just thinking, this just sounds so good and feels so good. And and so when that whole project was done, you know, and I turned it in. That's the first time I turned something into cloud where he had no notes. Wow. Yeah yeah, perfect school, perfect school for a score. Yah.

It was so yeah. So that whole project was incredible, and working with a number of those artists that made it made it fun. And Mary j you know, went to New York and working with her and I was like, she's like mister face, that's what she calling And Whitney approved it. So yeah, Whitney was she was down for Mary for sure. A couple of people she wasn't down for.

It seems working like that as well with Beyonce. When when I worked with Beyonce that was in New York, um, and it was Beyonce would come in the room but just kind of writing music. I didn't I work with Beyonce through working with Stargate before and then end up doing it you know myself. She would come in the room, she'd come and check out what what it was, what we had written, and then she would um walk out

and say see whether she liked or not. And then I'd hand it to her and she liked something that she'd taken. She go singing, then come back and then we do it that way. Beyonce is another one of those artists who best way to say, is Beyonce, UM, what a voice when an artistry? UM. I'm proud of who she has become. I'm proud of how she carries her her stardom, her um being the queen. Um, I'm proud of who she who she ultimately became. I mean,

you know, um, it's not a secret. But Darryl Simmons he actually found it when they were kids and he had signed them up. So it's it's fun to see where this little girl and I hadn't met him then, you know, but it's it's great to see where her story and her journey and jay Z and his journey and where they ever become. You know, they're they're the king and queen, you know, and I'm proud of them. You know. Yeah. My last thing is I was just thinking you were saying how two occasions was kind of

like the birth of baby Face. I feel like something about when when can I see you? Oh you're going out the guitar Like that was more like this, that's the baby Face. Oh baby Face is a superstar? Like yeah, that was that was a continuation. It was because I wanted to go back to I wanted to go back to where it started because I started playing acoustic guitar and that was where I wanted to I wondered if

that could work. Yeah, you know, you think of how afford the cooling You sounds and that sounds the same album, right, So that was I'm glad that it I'm glad that it did work because it allowed me to well, actually, it's because of when Can I See You? That I worked with mcdonna. Madonna she loved that song, because of When Can I See You? That I were with their Clepton because they loved that song. He loved that song

as well. So, um, that was a great decision for me to pull out the acoustic guitar and show that and show that side of me, you know, and all that Teddy. I just knew there was nothing I was gonna be able to battle with when he when he played that, Um that remix last one, Yeah, yeah, it's like two gonna be how you how are you gonna beat? That?

Was that fun? Looking back on it, I knew the first like you didn't really know what you were getting into, Like getting back out of that, how do you feel about the whole I was nervous as hell throughout it, um, and it was it was difficult to sit there and um, look at a camera, uh yeah and act like that

that ain't me. So I was so so it was weird and it was weird to be nervous about it when you when it's just the camera, you know, at the same time, but it was it was a moment and it um I think because of that moment, it's kind of changed my life. Yeah, and reminder important you all to us and more contributions to come. Thank you absolutely, legend baby face. Did you coin the term tenderroni? We

went to debating that before you came. No, no, no, no, no. TENDERRONI was It was a it was a term that that existed, the Tenderni song, I'll do that, We'll do the last. I think we'll finishing with it. How did Tenderroni happened? So we were in the deal, we were down in Miami and for some reason they didn't let us on the show in Miami. We were hurt. Yeah, we were destroyed. And I think they tried to book us at some little skating rink the same night because

it wasn't nobody in there. So we got in the bus and we had our tour bus and we parked outside of the concert Wow, so that way we could pick up girls when they came out, you know. And so we had d stan in front of the bus because he was like the good looking guy and he stood out and he said, hey, you know, we have a little after party at at our hotel. And they got, oh yeah, we the deal. We're supposed to be on

the show. But you know, honesty, something happens. And then so all these people, these girls came by, and there's one girl in particular that came on the bus and nice, sweet girl, and she gets on the bus and she d invites them all. So I'm sitting downstairs waiting for her, and I have to sit and wait because Darryl Simmons has got somebody in the room. We were sharing rooms. He said, give me some time, so I gave him time. So I'm sitting downstairs and this one girl comes in.

She sits down and she's like talking to me and nice. We're having a nice conversation. I was a nice guy. I didn't do anything. So as we're talking, d comes downstairs and grabs her real quick. And when he grabs her, takes her upstairs immediately, and I'm like sitting there by myself. About ten minutes later, she comes down. He goes, I can't believe it. You know, he like, you know, he said, you know, start tried to kiss me and stuff, and

I said. She went to his room and said, you know you like that you came here and like, you know, not like that was cool, but you know, you shouldn't have shouldn't have done that, she said. So she goes, yeah, yeah, yeah, right, and stuff like. So we're sitting there talking and stuff, and then we end up going I get tired. Finally Darryl comes out. So I get tired, so I go up to my room and saying I'm sorry, I'm tired. I got to go to the room, and she says, can I go up to your room with you? I

said okay, So she walks up. We talk. She invites me to go out the next day and see the city. And then finally her friend was leaving because her friend was seeing Carlos the thing. So they start to walk out of the building and as I walk her downstairs. As I'm walking her downstairs, d walks out and sees me walking with her and goes, this ain't cool because it's a Jacobi and Jacoby was back in the days when you're in a band, you watch you spend all

your time watching all my children. And there was a character called Steve Jacoby and he was still and Everybody's girl. So the term was Jacoby Jacoby and like this, this is this is just getting too far. We gotta have a meeting. So we had a group meeting about Jacoby's. I was being accused of pulling a Jacoby. And so we were sitting there in this meeting, and he was saying,

you know, it's this Jacoby. Stuff's gotta stop because you know, you know, face was up there, you know, with her and and and and I had pulled the girl and this. I said, wait a minute, no, no, no, this was this was not a Jacoby. You know, first of all, she was a Roni. And and the truth about a Roni, she's a sweet old girl and if you treat him right. And I saw that these lyrics. Was kind of hit me right at that moment. Wow, and so um, I immediately I wouldn't even baby face then, I was just kinny.

And so I immediately after that meeting, I went to my room and wrote to Darroni. Um. And that was in like eighty two eighty three. That song did not get to Bobby Brown too, yay, wow, So and it stuck around that long. So so and so the word to Darroni it started way back then lasted and then RONI and then so I remember Keevin Campbell saying because when he said, when we say Roni and can we talk, he says, that's that works too old. Nobody want to I want to say that as I trust me it'll

still work it. So never you gott anke a song about Jacoby's Jacoby, I know that's a that's a funny thing. Jacoby. Will you alleger face, thank you. I appreciate you guys, Yes, sir.

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