18 - "In the Name of My Father" - Book Review - podcast episode cover

18 - "In the Name of My Father" - Book Review

Jul 25, 202455 min
--:--
--:--
Listen in podcast apps:

Episode description

In this episode, we provide a book review and analysis of Ahmad Massoud's recent memoir and bestseller on Amazon, "In The Name of My Father: Struggling for Freedom in Afghanistan." Ahmad Massoud's book is a compelling and insightful piece that reflects on the struggle for freedom and democracy in Afghanistan. As the leader of the National Resistance Front, Massoud articulates a vision for a liberated Afghanistan, free from the grasp of the Taliban and other terrorist groups. The work delves into the principles of democracy, decentralization, and pluralism, emphasizing the importance of equality for all citizens regardless of gender, ethnicity, or religious beliefs.

Ahmad Massoud emphasizes the promotion of a rational and moderate interpretation of Islam in the Muslim world, advocating for a religious framework that supports rationalism, peace, tolerance, and coexistence. This aspect of his work underlines the importance of harmonizing religious beliefs with the principles of modern democracy and human rights. This book is not just a political manifesto, but also a personal narrative that intertwines Massoud's experiences and aspirations for his nation's future, portraying a deep commitment to the values of liberty, justice, and human rights.

Watch Ahmad Massoud's interview with Shawn Ryan here: https://youtu.be/RudLmL9kCSY?si=dl2yHWa_7laKS8pk

Sign the petition to support Massoud's testimony before Congress: https://www.change.org/shawnryanshow

Support the show

Transcript

Speaker 1

in the name of god , the all-compassionate , the all-merciful . Uh , welcome back , uh , dear listeners and viewers , to another episode of the radio resistance podcast . Uh , it has been a while and we want to start by apologizing for our absence .

Both Zobair Jean and I have been caught up with some offline work , but we are excited to be back and we'll be discussing some very important discussions . We'll be having some very important discussions Today . We're going to be discussing a topic that's very close to our hearts and it's incredibly relevant to the ongoing struggle for freedom in Afghanistan .

We'll be discussing the new book by the National Resistance Front of Afghanistan's leader , ahmad Massoud , titled In the Name of my Father , struggling for Freedom in Afghanistan , published by Republic here in the USA .

So this book it provides a very deep insight into the legacy of both his father , ahmad Shah Massoud , and also the continuous , the ongoing fight for freedom in Afghanistan today , and also the continuous , the ongoing fight for freedom in Afghanistan today . The foreword by Peter Bergen .

It sets the stage , highlighting the ideological and military struggles that have shaped Afghanistan's recent history , and Bergen emphasizes how the late national hero of Afghanistan , commander Ahmad Shah Massoud's legacy of moderate Islamism continues to inspire many , if not most of Afghanistan citizens , even with the Taliban back in power today .

And then as far as the structure of the book is concerned , the book is meticulously structured into six parts , each of the parts delving into different facets of the Massoud legacy and the current resistance . Powerful preface and an introduction that truly sets the tone for the narrative . And then part one .

So part one addresses the global implications of Afghanistan's struggles . Part two reflects on Commander Ahmad Massoud's personal and familial sacrifices , detailing his childhood and the impact of his father's martyrdom . And part three , it goes more into his formative years and his training , many details which we have never even heard of .

And then part four focuses more so on his philosophical and strategic insights , particularly his views on what he deems as rational Islam and also the role of women . Part five highlights the ongoing fight for democracy , women's rights , and also includes a critique within this broader scope of rational Islam .

And finally , part six , the last part , last but not least , discusses the broader struggle against extremism and terrorism , concluding with a very strong and powerful call to action for the sake of freedom . So , Zubair John , let's start by discussing what was your initial take on Commander Ahmad Massoud's memoir .

Speaker 2

I guess my initial take was the sort of personalness of the book is what stood out to me .

Right , that's how , that's what made me enjoy the book , made me , you know , connected with the book because , uh , you know , I read it fairly like , I finished the book fairly quickly compared to other books that I've read it , because it's so engaging and I think that the , that human , human side that um is portrayed right , the , the style that this memoir was

written like consistently throughout the book , is it keeps you very , um , interested in all the you know , uh , personal , uh , elements of his life . For example , uh , elements of his life .

For example , commander Massoud talks a lot about , you know , the relationship that he had with his parents , right with his father , and then he mentions his , you know the current relationship , the upbringing of his .

Speaker 1

You know his mother .

Speaker 2

And as well as his relationship with his sisters . Uh , he mentions his you know , relationship with his , his wife . you know these bonds , you know what the the struggle that they all have been through together , right um , uh , where people , uh , may think that , oh , he may have came from a place of privilege , but in reality it's a real struggle .

He's a real person that went through a journey that many people could relate to and could empathize with , due to having to , you know , leave his country and having to travel in different areas and go through his schooling and his military training .

But at the same time , again , those anecdotes with his family members and all the you know there's funny sides to it and there's sad parts to it , and there's , you know , there's there's funny sides to it and there's sad parts to it , and there's , you know , kind of exciting parts to it .

And I think that's what kept me engaged with the book , that I think that's what made it unique to me . That's not just you know historical facts or you know the political critiques , it's it's just while that's happening , there is that personal side to it .

Speaker 1

That's kind of what .

Speaker 2

I , I guess , enjoyed most .

Speaker 1

Absolutely , I completely agree with you , zobarjan , that perspective on the personalness of the memoir . It is what captured me also the most . Just like yourself , this is probably the book I've read fastest . Just like yourself , this is probably the book I've read fastest .

And Commander Ahmad Massoud's ability to convey that human side of his story is what truly sets this book apart from any and all other books on the same subject and matter . One of those parts that you touched on that really stood out to me was how Commander Massoud describes the emotional weight of carrying on his father's legacy .

I mean , this can be seen throughout the book , especially in the opening chapters and then when he discusses the immediate aftermath of his father's assassination . That was profoundly moving Reading his words describing the grief , the responsibility , and then you know the determination to keep fighting for Avalon's son's future , as you mentioned .

You know the portrayal of his childhood and his formative years in panchayat valley . Um , that also did strike me as well . Um , and then , just yeah , how commander shares . You know his father's teachings weren't just about military strategy but about compassion , resilience and unity . Um , these lessons truly come to life through those anecdotes .

Right , it makes , as you mentioned , the reader truly feel the weight of those experiences . Yeah , this narrative isn't one just about sacrifice and struggle , it's about hope and vision as well .

Right , I think Commander Ahmad Massoud did just a terrific job at painting a picture of what Afghanistan and an Afghanistan that can be , that could be one where democracy , human rights and rational Islam thrive .

His reflections , as you know , you mentioned , they show that behind every political or military action , there are real people with real emotions driving those efforts . Um , but yeah , moving on from this theme , uh , or this part which we both do agree , is you know what strikes the most and what captures readers the most ?

Which , by the way , dear viewers and listeners , commander Ahmad Massoud's book is available on Amazon and it currently is a number one bestseller in the Arab and Middle Eastern biographies category . It's been a number one bestseller since its release in multiple categories and on multiple occasions . Did want to just mention that .

We will have the link in our description section , so please do . Whatever we say about the book isn't going to be enough . You do need to order yourself a copy , but , yeah , moving on . So , rajan , what do you think about Commander Massoud's views on what he terms , what he coins , as rational Islam ?

Speaker 2

Yeah , I think this was one of those , what you mentioned earlier , like those themes of the book right where it's mentioned throughout , not just like one little chapter . It's something that keeps coming up like twofold right .

One in the sense that obviously Afghanistan has been plagued in recent years and this is a recent phenomenon right by extremism like radical Islam groups that hijack Islam .

So , particularly in our times , the Taliban , right From their first era in 96 to 2001 , and currently in the last three years , we see this hijacking of Islam , this abuse of Islam , where they carry out their oppression in the name of religion in the name of God and his prophet . So I think you know one of the ways that .

Speaker 1

Commander .

Speaker 2

Massoud you know in in its nature and just rational in its approach . So yeah , he , he goes through this in in different areas . There's , there is a sub chapter on it for rational islam . Um for let me just read a little part , just so it would do a better job than me trying to explain it .

But , like starting here , a careful reading of the Holy scriptures shows that Can you share the page number please ? 162 .

Speaker 1

Yeah , page 162 .

Speaker 2

Top of the page it says a careful reading of the Holy scriptures shows that Islam is an eminently rational and moderate religion , contrary to the vision of the Taliban and extremist groups . Islam is not a religion of hatred , but of tolerance , love , acceptance of others and encouragement of dialogue .

The rationalism of Islam is not an ethnocentric definition or a duplication of the Western concept , but a stance of promoting social progress and therefore a modernity for the benefit of humanity . You know , I think that right there , you know , summarizes what you know , what rational Islam , I guess , is pursuing .

But he goes into way more detail with the specifics and the technicalities in regards to . He brings up examples of the past where considerable scientific advances were made by the original community in the early centuries of the Hijrah , with great research in the fields of mathematics , medicine , the arts , philosophy and astronomy .

Al-kharizmi was one of the pioneers of algebra . As early as the 9th century , the astrolabe was developed by muslim , and measles and chicken pox were cured thanks to the works of the Persian scholar Al-Razi also in the 9th century Al-Biruni calculated the Earth's radius and predicted the existence of another continent to the east of China , namely the Americas .

This golden age of Islam . One of the hallmarks of that golden age was this championing of rational Islam , not a literal approach . That was not what the golden age of Islam , that's not how they flourished . There was no extremist elements . There was no literary interpretation of literal interpretation of the texts . It was a rational approach .

And I think that this is something that you know . A lot of the world , actually the current , the modern world , is lacking on right .

I mean , when we see all these different terror groups and we see these , you know fringe elements that are kind of trying to be flag bearers of the religion , but they're doing it in a way that's completely contrary to pick up this kind of responsibility to revive a moderate Islam . I think that's a noteworthy thing .

It's a very noble cause to say that we want to reverse this trend or this , I guess this plague , this cancer that's been brought , imported to our country , to Afghanistan , and we want to fix this by promoting and teaching what is rational Islam . And this is not something that wouldn't .

I don't think this is anything that wouldn't , it wouldn't be foreign , because this is the original teachings of the indigenous people of Afghanistan , right , just without I know I kind of dragged this on for a little bit , but to touch on imam abu hanifa , right , who is the founder of the hanafi school of thought , the largest legal school in islam .

He was originally from modern day afghanistan and these are the teachings that have been , unfortunately , um kind of uh , twisted and forgotten actually .

And , yeah , people use his name in different parts of the world in teaching this movement , right , the Hanafi school , but they're doing it in a way that's not representative of the actual , the original teachings of Abu Hanifa in the times , in the areas of Bukhara and Samarkand and Balkh , which are all located in , you know , near present day Afghanistan or even

within present day Afghanistan . So I think , yeah , to go back to those teachings and to emphasize on this rational approach , I think this is something that's necessary and this is something that you know jurists of their religion would actually appreciate .

Yeah , anyway , kumail , let me pass it on to you what do you think about that whole theme of Islam throughout the book ? Or rational Islam ?

Speaker 1

Yeah , no , thank you , zubair John , for sharing especially those excerpts . I think that could be very useful for those who are tuned in listening or viewing . So Commander Ahmad Massoud's concept of rational Islam is indeed profound . His father , the national hero of Afghanistan , kemal Ahmad Shah Massoud , he had a deep appreciation for poetry and the sciences .

As far as poetry , particularly in Persian and French right , I that this , this intellectual and cultural richness , is what significantly influenced his understanding of Islam as well . And this can be seen in the book . You know there's a , there's a chapter in I think it's actually still in the part two of the book .

It's a chapter , a Taste for Poetry , where Commander Ahmad Massoud shares experiences of , together , along with his father , together along with his father , sharing just anecdotes of how they would spend time together , reading poetry and learning .

Yeah , and this must be said , you know that , commander , the late commander Ahmad Shah Massoud , his love for Mawlana's poetry , which emphasizes love as the essence of Islam . This is particularly noteworthy Rational Islam , as described by Commander Ahmad Massoud . It promotes this balanced interpretation of faith that values reason , but also compassion and inclusion .

This stands in stark contrast to the Taliban , as you mentioned . And there was another . I made a bookmark here .

It's on page 35 of the book , where where , commander Ahmad Masood , he says that the Taliban , moreover , imposed the most violent dictatorship against the various sects of Islam Shiaism , sufism as well as the moderate and rational Sunni schools of thought and the name of their extremist interpretation of Islam that contradicts the principles and teachings of the religion .

This sectarianism is everything we've been struggling against for decades . So you know how I see things , zubair John .

I see that both the late Commander Ahmad Shah Massoud and his living legacy son , our leader , commander Ahmad Massoud , their approach aligns , more so with scholars like Chirik and poets like Mawdana , who argue that , you know , the core of Islam is about love .

Well , that's what I took away from the commander's reflections on both his father's you know intellectual pursuits and their shared vision for this rational , loving Islam , this multidimensional religion that's not just strictly , you know , canonical and iconoclastic , yeah , but this Islam which truly provides a powerful counter-narrative to you know these extremists ?

Yeah , a powerful counter-narrative to you know these extremists , yeah , and and well , considering you know , uh , this profound interpretation , how do you , zubair John , think that this shapes Commander Massoud's broader vision for democracy and freedom in Afghanistan ?

And this was one of the other themes that we wanted to discuss , the struggle for democracy and freedom being a theme that can be sensed and felt from the beginning till the end of the book .

Speaker 2

Yeah , yeah , well , since we're still on I mean , you asked about how it ties in with that , right , since we're still on this subject of rational Islam , I'm going to make the connection here .

I think I'm going to read one little excerpt here where Commander Massoud says what I call rational Sunni Islam , which stems from the school of Bukhara and is based on Hanafi jurisprudence and theology , proposes a rationalist interpretation of religion . This does not mean that we do not accept or tolerate other sects of Islam .

On the contrary , we believe that all Muslims , whether Sunni or Shia , are believers and members of the Muslim community and our movement is not restricted to Hanafites . We stand up for all the citizens of Afghanistan , but we also oppose the radical and extremist tendencies of Sunni Islam .

So I think this idea of kind of you see how he says that , yeah , although it is the specific school , is the specific legal school , is the Hanafi school and it's a rational approach . He says that it doesn't mean that we oppose other sects .

It's this kind of tolerant approach and a pluralistic approach that , from a religious aspect , it also translates to the approach that Commander Massoud or , in this sense , the country itself would have towards the sense of politics , right ?

So pluralism is one of the main things that democracy kind of pushes for , right , the equality between people , the idea of , you know , having a fair chance between different parties , different sects , and these are the kind of overlaps between the religious approach and the political approach .

It's not in contradiction to each other , um , when I think to answer , I guess , your question more directly , I don't . I don't think that the political approach , that the quest for democracy , um , it doesn't contradict the , the original , uh , nature of the people of Afghanistan .

Right , some people might think that , oh well , democracy is this foreign kind of idea that was imposed and the people don't want that . But it's like , no people in the world oppose having equal rights or oppose the idea of having representation in in government , or you know it .

It really , if you look at the teachings of islam , the idea of shura , right , the idea of counsel , and and even how the original , the companions of the prophet , you know , made their decisions , it's based off of , you know , really , voting and consulting with each other . It's a form of democracy , right ?

This isn't people just look at the bad elements or the bad actors . You know , the bad actions that certain democracies might have carried out , you know , but that doesn't mean that the concept of democracy itself is flawed or that it's incompatible with being religious , being a Muslim practicing Muslim or living in an Islamic state .

You can do both , and you know , a lot of the successful Muslim countries in the world actually are , are are practicing this , it's it's . They have democracy . It's not a dictatorship , it's not a brutal tyranny , and at the same time , they are , you know , practicing Muslims , and Muslims carry out every aspect of their faith , and I think that , so I .

That that's my take on , you know , the quest for democracy and the political aspect of Islam in . Afghanistan .

Speaker 1

Exactly , zubair John , this vision for rational Islam . It seamlessly aligns with I think so too with the broader goals for democracy and freedom in Afghanistan .

There is no contradiction by advocating for a faith grounded in reason and compassion and , as Commander Massoud we see , he paves the way for a society that does truly value human rights and inclusive governance , which is a part of , as you mentioned as well , but it promotes that a environment , a political environment where democracy can actually thrive .

His approach rejects those extremist ideology and , as you read from the book , directly from the book , the aim here is to foster a culture of tolerance , which is essential for those democratic principles which are also Islamic principles , are also Islamic principles to take root , and this vision is the most , I would argue , the most vital for Afghanistan's future ,

aiming to create a nation where freedom and human rights are respected . If you don't have any more thoughts that you'd like to share on this theme , subairjian , let's perhaps shift our focus to another crucial , okay , another theme that was very vivid and vividly seen throughout the book was in regards to women's rights and education .

Commander Massoud , he places significant emphasis on this . So , yeah , what are your thoughts on his stance regarding women's empowerment in Afghanistan ?

Speaker 2

Well , I think , from based off of what I mentioned in the beginning right , that the personalness of the book I think that's what comes to mind right away is how Ahmed Massoud himself , right during his childhood education , was instilled within him and his siblings at , you know , from a very young age .

Um , it was something that was taken very seriously in their household , his , his father made that a point of emphasis . Obviously , his mother , uh , the , the way that , um , that his mother valued education and , at the same time , each one of his sisters .

He mentions the stories about how they're all I think he said they're all studying medicine or different fields and how this was not something that was taken lightly in their family to give this up or to to not um , you know to not study , to not be educated . Uh , whether he also mentions his wife as well , how she's on , you know a firm believer of this .

So they were raised in their , in a household and also just from a background where education , whether it's for girls or for boys , men and women should have that equal right in seeking an education and seeking , you know , further goals and careers and things like that .

So I think that when you grow up with these values , it really shows what your policies are going to be if you were to be the ruler , or you know , the leader of a movement or the ruler of a country .

So and this is in highlight in contrast to like , for example , to the Taliban where they grew up in you know Pakistani madrasas right In tribal areas where they didn't see women , you know , growing up the Taliban were in these sort of boarding schools in in tribe , in the tribal belt , sort of boarding schools in the tribal belt , just being all they saw was a

mullah who taught them a narrow , you know twisted interpretation of Islam . And they wouldn't see , they didn't really have the chance to even grow up , to have a full childhood with their sisters , with their mothers and the things that they were being taught . Anyway , they were taught that the women should stay at home , that girls shouldn't have an education .

So , you know , obviously groups like the Taliban have no concept or no understanding of education and women's rights and we have people who also are from Afghanistan or were actually from Afghanistan , that grew up in the country , that have the values of Islam and the cultural values in Afghanistan .

But education was always part of that and women's rights and participation was always part of that .

Speaker 1

So yeah , that's just kind of my take on the question yeah , uh , absolutely , um , uh , I think , uh , I mean , I fully agree with you , uh , and we can see that in the book , that uh , it , these values , that value and that commitment to education which you mentioned .

It was instilled by both of his parents , right about the late Commander Ahmad Shah Massoud , and we're familiar with his legacy , but those anecdotes in respect to his mother as well . It's a powerful testament to his vision for Afghanistan , the fact that both he and all his sisters were raised with that strong emphasis on education .

And then Commander Massoud's advocacy for women's education . I think it's the most direct challenge to the Taliban's oppressive policies . We can see that he clearly understands that educating women is crucial for the country's development . Empowered , educated women can drive societal change . They can contribute significantly to the economy and foster a more equitable society .

We can see that this is the commander's thoughts in his memoirs . This stance on women's rights and education isn't just about the equality , but it's about building a more stronger , more resilient Afghanistan , and so this is laying out the groundwork right for a democratic and free society where everyone does have the opportunity to thrive .

Yeah , yeah , shifting gears a bit . So , rajan , let's maybe talk about something . I just opened the book literally , and you know we did intend on discussing this theme as well .

But , um , it's I , I just saw , uh , something in relation to this as well , but the mistakes that were made by the islamic republic of afghanistan , uh , over the past 20 years , commander Massoud , you know he very justly in my humble opinion , and very fairly , you know there's no blame . It was our own fault to a very to an extent .

But , yeah , what are your thoughts on Commander Massoud's analysis of these mistakes ?

Speaker 2

Well , yeah , I think that that kind of critique of the previous governments in Afghanistan , that's also something that throughout the book it's kind of mentioned in different parts . Right , because you know that's something that many people constantly ask about , right , like what went wrong in Afghanistan , how did the Taliban take over again ?

Like , how did this happen ? So obviously , that is a very important aspect of the context in Afghanistan , of the historical , you know what went down . But I think that , like you said , he does take a very fair and balanced approach where it's not just because it's not just kind of critiquing one side or putting the blame on one side .

Where , you know , we do see that happen often , like on in social media and then in different articles that are written . Sometimes it's kind of , you know , we don't take responsibility for a lot of things that happened or we're in denial , denial that how could you know this president have actually fled or did the army actually do that , whatever right ?

So , uh , if you want , I can read this one part that kind of summarizes it um , and he says um , but serious mistakes , most of them , were made from the beginning . This is on page 180 , by the way , one cannot blame a single side .

There were certainly serious shortcomings on the part of the international community , but also and firstly on the side of Afghanistan and even many among my father's companions .

So he mentions the international community and then he mentions the Ghani government and he mentions the Karzai government before that and things that could have been done differently , and he even mentions , he says , his father's companions Right , there's no hiding the fact that certain people , who may have been familiar with his father , did things that were , you know ,

unfit , that were in betrayal to his teachings or to his policies , his legacy . And at the same time , again , it's not just blaming everything on America or blaming everything on one of the governments that were in opposition to him or whatever . So yeah , that's kind of my my take on that .

Speaker 1

Um , if you wanted to add more , please go ahead come on no , to be honest , zelaya , john , that was a very comprehensive um analysis and you know , I I agree it is a theme that from the very um start of the book until then , it's also it's a sense and scene . Yeah , throughout the book You've covered the key points .

I think it's clear that understanding these past mistakes is crucial for moving forward and building a more resilient future for Afghanistan . So let's now shift our focus to another one of those significant aspects of the commander's memoir , and that being Pakistan's role in Afghanistan's conflict .

So you know , commander Ahmed Massoud provides a candid analysis of the complex and often adversarial relationship between Afghanistan and Pakistan , between Afghanistan and Pakistan . He also highlights how Pakistan's support for the Taliban has destabilized the region and prolonged the conflict .

He also calls for a strategic approach to dealing with Pakistan , one that involves both diplomatic efforts and international pressure , one that involves both diplomatic efforts and international pressure . One thing I found quite interesting was a part in the book I don't have the page number here right now , I'd have to look through it .

I didn't bookmark that , but it was a part of the book where Commander Hadmasud mentions how the people of Afghanistan have never had an enmity like enmity towards Pakistan , rather , it's more so the other way around . I would love to . If you have it , zubair John , if not , I will find it , we will find out . I don't want to misquote our leader here .

I think that was a very , very important part of the book as well . So , yeah , it's through this excerpt I think one can see how there's a true emphasis on the need for a comprehensive regional strategy to achieve real and lasting peace and stability .

It's very important to understand this perspective because it acknowledges these external factors that influences our people's internal struggles . Right and yeah . So , zorajan , as I find that quote , could you provide your thoughts on how do you see Commander Ahmad Massoud's analysis of Pakistan impacting the overall strategy for Afghanistan's future ?

Speaker 2

Yeah , well , I think that he keeps it honest right where from the historical aspect of Pakistan's involvement in Afghanistan , he starts from the beginning and goes throughout .

Right , pakistan at certain times played a positive role right in our positive role in our war against the Soviet Union and that jihad that the entire nation of Afghanistan unanimously participated against the threat of communism .

That's where Pakistan , for example , played a very positive role in being that kind of base where the United States was helping the people , assisting the people of Afghanistan through weapons , and then it was brought in through the corridor from Pakistan . So that was a good positive role .

But then , after the war , after Afghanistan defeated the Soviet , Union it's Pakistan's role kind of changed right . They started to take a more sinister role . It was due to , you know , selfish reasons of the ISI specifically within the Pakistani state , so that's also mentioned .

He consistently is mentioning the meddling of the ISI , basically Pakistan's secret service and their army within Afghanistan , you know , backing extremist groups such as Gulbuddin Hekmatyar who destroyed the city of Kabul and a lot of the surroundings as well .

As you know , after that , when he failed to be their man , their initial backing of their project , which is the Taliban , and this was , you know , he keeps it honest that throughout the years , it was always the Pakistani ISI that was backing this proxy group for their own interests , for their strategic depth , specifically to counter , I guess , their paranoia of

india , and but at the same time he does mention that it that some of the afghan governments also played a kind of counterproductive role in in throughout history towards pakistan , which kind of instigated them to have some of these policies which were not justified obviously , such as their support towards the Taliban .

He said that you know , for example and we see that today that there's a lot of this instigation of like irredentist kind of policy that we're going to take your land or we don't recognize this border and we were going to destroy this .

That country , pakistan , and this gets puts them in a very insecure position and again , it's not justified to back a terrorist group that they wouldn't support in their own country to come take over afghanistan . So he , he critiques both sides and he says that although this you know , there were bad policies and they're currently .

There have been bad policies that the pakistani government has taken . The people of afghanistan don't have an actual enmity towards the people of Pakistan . That the eventual goal should be , you know , peace and good neighborliness and good diplomatic relations .

Speaker 1

I found that excerpt . Did you find that part you want to read ? Yeah , yeah , you know it was at the start of chapter three and I think that it's just very eloquently said and put Commander Ahmed Massoud is speaking about . Well , the chapter is titled the Lion of Penshun , the Taliban , and he's speaking about the 90s .

And this paragraph well , I'll start from this section . It says at the time , Kabul was in the grip of a civil war between various factions , a war fueled by many countries , Pakistan in particular . My father and I have never and will never consider the Pakistani nation an enemy .

The Pakistani people share many values with us and throughout the 1980s and 1990s , Pakistanis were hospitable to our people . However , the Pakistani government , in particular the ISI , is to blame for providing instability over the past 34 years .

We continue to believe that Pakistan can change and that we can build better relations with this country , relations based on our shared cultural and religious identity and on equitable economic interests . Um , I found that to be very insightful and it goes , you know , perfectly in line with what you were , uh , just sharing as your analysis .

Speaker 2

Yeah , because , uh , you know it's you can't have , you know , especially when it's your next door neighbor .

You don't want to have an enemy there forever , you don't want to have hostile relations forever , because then you're never going to have peace in your country because they will always be funneling in these fighters , right , these , that those madrasas , those camps that will always be active , those shuras will always be active in those tribal areas and it's like , until

those are shut down and until that ideology , that project is completely brought to a stop and those fact , those terrorist factories are essentially shut down , we're never going to actually be a stable country , we're never going to be at true peace , because they're just going to keep respawning from there and being pushed into our country due to whatever paranoia and

whatever insecurities that they have there , which again , sometimes it is pushed by our politicians or our government and it's a destructive and a counterproductive policy for us to engage in that .

So he's saying that we should have this kind of neutrality , but at the same time I think one of the things that he mentioned , you know , as he's criticizing Pakistan throughout the book , the policies . Let me read one more excerpt and then we can move on from this .

I think that he says I've already denounced the double game played by the Pakistanis in the last 30 years , who criticized the Taliban and helped them at the same time . Right , he says the trust deficit will persist as long as Pakistan avoids taking action to show otherwise .

And I think that's the key , that you know that mistrust will always be there between our nationalists , our population in general , due to the realities that our people experienced for five years . That was all enabled by the you know sinister and destructive policies of you know elements within the Pakistani government .

So I think that until you know they prove otherwise , that things won't change .

But if they do prove , if they do show that you know they hold out that olive branch or they show potential for change and turning their back against the Taliban and and saying that you know what we're done with this , because the backlash that we're facing from this Frankenstein that we created is too much .

We realize that this is a mistake , that door should be left open , that if they decide to change policies , then we welcome that and we welcome a future of neighborliness and of cooperation , of peace between both countries , and I think that that's in the best interest of both Pakistan and Afghanistan , if obviously the right decisions are taken .

Speaker 1

Thank you . Thank you , zubair John , for that insightful reading , truly , commander Ahmad Massoud's analysis of Pakistan . It's an essential and crucial dimension to understanding the conflict and crucial dimension to understanding the conflict .

As we wrap up our discussion on Pakistan , you know , as time is running out too , I'd like to highlight an important recent development that underscores the growing international support for both Commander Massoud and the National Resistance Front of Afghanistan .

Commander Massoud recently sat down for an interview with Sean Ryan , a former Navy SEAL and CIA contractor , now known mostly for his amazing , thought-provoking podcast , the Sean Ryan Show . The Sean Ryan Show , and in this interview , commander Massoud shares much deeper insights , both from his book and discusses the ongoing resistance efforts against the Taliban .

This interview has been key . It's been one that's not only shed light on the current situation , but it's also been able to garner and rally international support for the resistance movement . Another very important and significant outcome of this interview is a petition which Sean Ryan started on changeorg , and this petition has already reached nearly 200,000 signatures .

It's continuing to grow . It's a very important part of raising awareness and rallying even more global support for the cause , or listening . We do highly encourage for you to watch both watch the interview or listen to it and also sign the petition .

More importantly , do please sign the petition , because your support it truly can make a difference in this fight for freedom , and it's only by standing together that we can amplify Commander Massoud's message and contribute to the broader struggle for democracy and freedom in Afghanistan . I just realized I didn't mention what the petition is about .

I feel like I've been talking a lot . Zoya John , do you think you can summarize what the petition is exactly for ? Do ?

Speaker 2

you think you can summarize ?

Speaker 1

what the petition is exactly for Sure .

Speaker 2

Yeah , I just wanted to say that , yes , that episode with Sean Ryan interviewing Commander Ahmad Massoud was amazing . I think everyone should take a listen . I think it's at like nearly a million views . Definitely listen and subscribe to that channel . But the petition is very important . It's basically .

What it's calling for is that the US Congress is inviting Commander Ahmed Massoud to come testify before the US Congress on the subject of the US government currently funding essentially funding the Taliban regime in Afghanistan . Right Nearly $40 million minimum is being sent to Afghanistan per week .

The estimates range actually closer to even $80 million per week to the central bank in Afghanistan , which is controlled by the Taliban .

So , commander Massoud , it's important for him to come and explain the situation in Afghanistan and to tell the US population that our tax dollars are being sent in the millions to support a terrorist regime that is obviously oppressing the people of Afghanistan , holding back girls from education and yeah that this is unacceptable .

So his story and his case needs to be heard and he needs to definitely be here in the US to make that case .

Speaker 1

I read an article just today I just pulled it up right now as well , zubair John , as far as that figure , that number , this was an article in which an NRF member was also interviewed and I believe yeah , it was published today 293 million in US aid may have ended up in Taliban hands . 193 million in US aid may have ended up in Taliban hands .

This is from CIGAR , the top US agency on Afghanistan . Reconstruction is the source for this . So that's very alarming , very concerning , yeah . So , as we conclude today's episode , please remember that every signature and every voice matters in this fight . Thank you all for tuning in .

We are excited to be back and we look forward to more engaging discussions in the coming weeks . We do have some special guests lined up for y'all . Please don't forget to follow us on social media and share your thoughts on today's episode and , until next time , stay resilient and keep the spirit of resistance alive .

Transcript source: Provided by creator in RSS feed: download file