REMEMBERING ALAN: Ben McCormick & Peter Thomas | ENCORE!

and on call

Welcome, welcome indeed to the start of 2026. I can't believe we've already just steamrolled through January and we're almost looking at February. I mean there's not even enough time to play a song like Elton's song January, and perhaps we should sing it. along, you know, all of us together. But um it's almost uh an encore in itself because we're already on almost to February. It's been amazing.

Some exciting news. You've probably been hearing that Elton John has confirmed that he's going to be back in the studio in April to do a new album. Well, we can't wait to uh hear that and of course to have a lot of fans on the show to critique it like they did in April of last.

So now on the show today, a real, real, truly a real rebrand. We've got Reg.world, that's the new URL. Please remember it. Please share it. Uh remember our new email address, which is contact at REJ.world. We've got a new theme. As you can hear as well for the show. So encore uh chats with Elton fans and Elton collaborators over the years. And uh season five, I can't believe this is the fifth year now that we've been doing Radio Elton John.

And I'm also delighted to uh tell you that we have two distinguished guests, uh both fans of Elton John, and uh a very special episode we're looking forward to today as we remember the wonderful Alan McCormick.

So today we have, uh first of all, his dear son, Ben, who's on the show. So that's Ben McCormick and Peter Thomas. Okay, welcome, welcome. It's lovely to have you on the show. First of all, Ben George Peter, hello. It's an absolute pleasure. No, absolutely brilliant. So how you both been keeping? Did you have a good start to twenty twenty six?

Well, what I c what I can remember of it, yes, after a long, long Christmas break. Good for you. Yes, lovely, thanks. Excellent, excellent. How about you, Ben? Yeah, very good as well. I mean we're I can't quite believe we're almost at the end of January already. Um so yeah, twenty twenty six is flying by. But yeah, very nice, thank you.

Excellent, excellent. Now, um Tom uh uh Peter rather you're you're joining us from obviously from the UK, fr uh from your lovely abode. Um and and Ben, you are somewhere else. You're somewhere pretty warm and exotic, aren't you? Tell us where you are right now. Yeah, well it's actually not that warm at the moment. That's another story. Um yeah, so I'm in Saudi Arabia at the moment. I I started a job out here, um

back in August last year. So I'm out here working for a university. Um but yeah, not not as warm as you might think. It's a it's a sort of brisk sort of thirteen, fourteen degrees and Down to about four or five degrees in the evening. So um yeah, yeah. This is not T shirt country, is it? Oh my goodness. It's not T shirt country. No, not not at the moment. It will be in a couple of months. Um th th it'll uh it'll warm up again. But uh no at the moment it's um

It's it's it's a it's pleasant. It's but I'm not gonna start complaining about the weather. It's uh certainly better than the UK. Well at least it's drier probably, I suspect. Less rain. But uh definitely, yeah. But but three degrees at night. I mean, you know, honestly, um

Um it was about seven and six degrees in London uh overnight, so um I think you should come back here. It's warmer in the UK right now. I know, I know, I know, I know. And and the v well we get a bit of variety. We complain, don't we, in in the UK about the weather, but here it's oh, it's blue sky again.

Oh, it's not raining again. It gets a little bit boring, to be honest. So no, you you're quite right, George. I'll be back in the summer. Uh not not too long, back in May. We're looking forward to catching up. Now

Tell us what you do in in in Saudi. You you've you said you started a new job there. What what kind of line of work are you in? So as an education, I I work as um I mean I wear a number of different hats in my life, but um what I'm doing here is is basically teaching English. Um I've worked overseas previously. I used to work in in Malaysia. Uh and then yeah, as I said last year I I decided to

spread my wings again, um, get out of the UK for a little while and and yeah, so I'm I'm working here for a university. Um they've just actually gone into the top hundred uh globally. Um so they're they're ranked as the

Yeah, the highest ranked university in the Middle East. So it's um a really, really good time to join. Um and yeah, I have a had a really, really good time so far. I mean it's uh one of the good things about this line of work is you see so many different cultures and meet so many different people and Um yeah, it's it it it's been a really, really good experience so far.

Right. Well, you know what? Next time you're you're seated with your students, you need to say, hands up those of you who are Elton John fans'cause I'm sure there are some I'll try I'll try it. You never know. You may you may you may you be maybe quite uh surprised at just how many there are and w how impressed they will be to know that your dad your dear dad was so m closely involved really with the with the Elton John story and and that's something we want to

uh obviously unfurl uh today and fly that flag, quite honestly. So let's talk about uh to uh about Alan in i in just a moment. But before we do, Peter, um you you knew um Alan McCormick um And m all the fans knew him as the guy who bef before the the internet was even invented was already selling mail order.

um uh uh you know, products, merchandise, records, CDs, etc. of Elton John and everything Elton John. He was very much an expert. Um he did posters, I think. He may have done T shirts, but we'll no no doubt Ben will verify that. And uh it was called Elton Rap, wasn't it? Or wrap it up. Uh from Wrap It Up. Yeah, that was it. Wrap it up, exactly. That was his store and it was international. It was everywhere. Pete Peter, what are your what are your memories of of that, of Wrap It Up?

Well, I I think the great thing about Alan and Wrap It Up was he joined together all the collectors around the world. You know, we we were all a bit of a disparate group, I think, before then. Yep. And of course he he he started when collecting it was a bit the early days of serious collecting. Yeah. And he joined everyone together. And also, of course, he sourced a lot of his material from the collectors who'd who'd found it over the years.

So when I first uh got to know Alan, God knows how many years ago, um, you know, it was well, it was a bit of fresh air really, because, you know, he had he had such a great wealth of knowledge about Elton.

Um and we could share things and and I mean Alan was just a lovely chap, you know. I you just immediately felt, you know, connected and uh we had many many lovely times together and long conversations on the phone. You couldn't have a ten minute conversation with Alan on the phone. It would be and my wife Joe would come in and say, Still on the phone to Alan. And I think it's a real shame that he hasn't seen things like the jewel box come out and all those demos because

To be honest, uh a lot of the work that he did and I did with him, I think triggered these these releases to be done, to be honest. I know Rocket wouldn't probably say that, but We we got them out there, you know, people talking about them and we did podcast we you know, we just discussed things. Um, and I think that sort of stimulated the interest in those early demos. And we were both very interested in the very early stuff, you know, the s late sixties, early seventies.

So I I think all of those things sort of have benefited collectors all round the world and I think it's stimulated the whole the whole industry really of re-releases, to be honest. You know, that's a very good point. I'll I'll bring Ben in here in just a moment, but uh it I reflect that for for many years Elton John was really just a juggernaut or a locomotive. It was a factory. Pumping out up to three albums a year.

And uh it was always about you're only as good as your next album. Uh you're always thinking about the next album, even though you've just released one that got to number one.

you know, that competitive edge that was going through the mid seventies and everything. And then eventually, um, into the eighties, there was a bit of a you know, it things went a little bit quiet at the beginning of the eighties. Then he then he had that big hit with I'm Still Standing and suddenly everybody was talking about it again.

Then things um, you know, went into the nineties, again coming off the gearbox a little bit, and then suddenly there's the d whole thing with uh Diana, Princess of Wales, and suddenly he's back in the headlines. And then since then he's just been carrying on and it's been pretty much an autopilot and he's very much he's more than just a pianist and an entertainer, which is generically speaking what he is.

He's a he's a celebrity and he's almost music royalty to some. So with all of that, um which has consolidated over the years. Throughout all of that, the the main sort of artery that's of blood that's been going through his career has been one of let's what's the next big thing we've got to do? Not that he's got to prove himself, but be he he just enjoys doing something new. He likes to be active. We know that.

But um but now it's a time for reflection. And that's the the amazing thing that we're finding is that He's now uh very much. uh uh uh he he and and and obviously David and his archivists and others around him are trying to piece together

that whole legacy and find the bits and pieces, the missing bits, the bits that people used to ask questions about. Well, whatever happened to this? Why didn't you release that? Et cetera, et cetera. So as you say, the jewel box is a very fine uh example of that, but not the only one.

Ben Ben, what are your recollections of of of Alan sort of really being a champion for the unsung hero of music, the big catalogue of stuff? And we know, I mean, Peter's been on the show before he's told us that. We've probably only seen about half of Elton's material actually ever released to the in the public domain. And there's another fifty percent there isn't out there.

Uh, you must be incredibly proud of your dad's contribution to that narrative and and to w to having worked as as Peter says with with him as well. Quite very much so, and obviously hearing the lovely words that that that you and and and Pete have said it's I mean, it's actually coming up for ten years. Um since he died. It's t it's ten years next month. And I mean, he will be bowled over that, you know, here here I am and here you are speaking about him. I mean it's um

And obviously for me and and my family for him to still be remembered after all this time is is wonderful. But um yeah, I mean I mean going back I guess to my experience, I mean, music Well, I mean I've I've I've been into music for as long as as soon as I could breathe, basically. So as you can imagine, you know. Elton John was a as a was a big part of my life growing up, but but music generally. Um, you know, dad was a a a self confessed.

vinyl junkie and and would s I mean, when I was very young he was he was a travelling salesman and um, I think probably to relieve himself from some of the boredom of of selling children's clothes. He he he knew where all these record shops were and he'd go in there and he and he'd he'd just he'd just buy records. Um So for me as a sort of two, three year old kid who was hugely into music

to have a father coming back, you know, with all all of these records that, you know, I was and I was allowed to use his equipment and play it was was amazing. But I mean that Elton John was always He was always there, you know, that that was played in the house. And, you know, I always remember he had this I think I used to call he had these two boxes. There was one called a special box where he put

good bits and pieces. I think from different artists. Um there may have been some Elton stuff in there. But then there was also a very special box, um, which was own only Elton John stuff. I think and it was full of seven inches, I seem to remember. And Yeah, I mean obviously the the the quality of stuff that was in there, you know, he he would buy stuff and never play it or you know, play it once and

um and would never ever play it again. So I learned very quickly, you know, as a as a as a as a young boy, very, very into music that music was something very special and and vinyl records was something really, really special. And, you know, he he would always

you know, teach me how to handle them and and things like this. So I mean I have to I mean I music's always been a big part of my life and without question the biggest influence on that was my father, you know, not not in terms of He didn't play an instrument, you know, he wasn't a a creator as such, but his passion

for all types of music, I have to say. And um his ability to just stamp, you know, he was never one to say, well, I love Elton John and you need to listen to Elton John. He had an incredible breadth of of music taste and was and was just passionate and was so encouraging. I think that's a really that's a really important point, Ben. And I think why I and and so many other collectors um connected with him that he wasn't a one he was a one he wasn't just L

He had a very broad knowledge of music, and that made him a very interesting person to talk to, you know, and you you learnt so much from talking to him about his knowledge about stuff. And it it I mean, I'm not saying that, you know, uh the fans that just like Elton, you know, are not as good, but it does make the person more interesting when they've got all these interests in all these other forms of music. You know, it's a good point.

I think that's a very valid point indeed and it's a very encouraging one because um when you think about it, uh, how can you really appreciate Elton John if you only appreciate Elton John

Think about that question. You know, if you don't allow music from other from from the the the origins of music, it could be African music, it could be jazz which I remember the the late great Chris Rea once called the the the musician's music and I can see why he said that because of the improvisation and the interpret you know, interpretation that you bring to music.

Um, you know, unless you love that soul music, classical music, which of course influenced Elton, unless you appreciate all these other kinds of music, you can't really get into songs like Tonight. The greatest discovery or others, the orchestrations, the build up, the crescendo

You don't understand why it's important into that song. It you know, Elton could've just come up and just played one note and said, That's chopsticks for you And I th I think that's probably why Dad's'cause it I mean he collected I think the the really serious album collecting probably started I mean Pete Pete would probably be able to put a timeline better than me, but I think probably around the sort of mid to late eighties it became much more of a serious thing.

Before that, you know, he was collecting bits and pieces from you know Pro Rock Acts and I I know Genesis he was a he was a really big fan of. But I think the thing with Alton John was it was the variety. He was not a one trick pony. You know, this was the artist that could do your song and then do Saturday Night It's All Right for Fighting. And then obviously later on, you know, sonically, certainly when I was growing up, you look at some of those albums from the eighties were

vastly different from what he was doing in the seventies. So I I think it was probably Yeah, that versatility that I think really attracted um Dad and and perhaps made the collecting a an even more serious thing because he was an artist that clearly, you know, had a longevity way beyond um Absolutely. And you know, it it's it it's so so lovely to hear that. And and you mentioned Genesis. And do you know what I actually remember him talking about Genesis to me.

And I didn't think it was disrespectful just because he wasn't talking about Elton John. I thought it was very um you know, it was very it was encouraging uh and it was inspiring because, you know, here was somebody who was saying, I'm a music fan. ultimately, and music comes from different places. And Elton himself has composed thanks to a myriad of other musical sources over the years. If anyone just says no he he he it was all just Elton, well I'm sorry, guys.

Ladies, you're gonna have to have a reality check there. Elton is a genius. It's true that he went on, I think it was Wogan, uh uh BBC Wogan many years ago. They gave him um uh instructions to a microwave oven manual and he was able to play immediately a tune that worked with it. Of course it was a nineteen twenties style ditty, but without any intimidation, right there in front of an audience and the presenter

He he just put it together and he bashed it out. So yes, we know he's a genius, but everyone is influenced by something. Yeah. One of Elton's party tricks that, isn't it? I always m he the first time he did it, I think, was on the Bruce Forsyth show. Oh really? Yeah. Yeah. And he's done it probably I reckon he's done it three or four times.

Over the years. Yeah. It's it's obviously a little thing that he likes doing, I think. Right. Pi Peter, your next assignment after this show is to go back to all those uh three or four occasions where Elton did this. And find out, was it actually the same ditty that he put to all the words? Yes, it could well be. Well it's a very a very sort of generic Elton type of song. You know, it's uh yeah. But uh No, I think they were different, but yeah, I should do it.

I haven't looked at the uh the Bruce Forsyth one for years. That was in the must have been about the mid late seventies, I think. Wow. Absolutely amazing.

So Alan de uh Alan, so uh uh so february twenty sixteen, is that right? That's when we lost him, Ben. Correct. It was, yeah. Yeah. So just yeah, coming up for ten years next month. Absolutely. Now we're recording this of course in in late January, but this will be available to Platinum subscribers on the thirty first of January and then a week later, uh sat the following Saturday, I think it's the sixth or the seventh of uh of February.

It will go on silver, which means everyone can hear it as well. So um what a poignant time that we are. Uh commemorating uh this this this moment as well, a decade, you know, without Alan. Um I mean he was a great friend to me as well. Uh I mean we we would have loved to have also someone else on the show today, which um Dale Berryhill, who's known to many fans. Now Dale uh wrote a book about Bernie Torpin.

He became a friend to Alan and also to myself and and in two thousand and two he flew over from the USA, uh, Dale, and j joined Alan and myself on a three way organized uh tour of Elton and Burney landmarks. So on that Saturday, I think it was in july two thousand and two, It's all those years ago now. We we hired a mini bus for about sixteen people. I was the driver. I tell you, I've never driven anything that long. I nearly uh clipped a car as I was trying to park it. Uh

Didn't realise, oh yeah, I've got forgot the how far back the rear wheels are on this thing. But luckily, no scrapes. It went back to the rental company uh intact. Um, but great fun. So on that Saturday, remember we went around London. So we went to Pinnah, Northwood Hills, and you know, a number of other places. We also uh went into town, into Islington, where of course um Elton and and Bernie had also worked and written uh music.

So we went into all these places. That was the London half. And then the next day, the Sunday, we drove up the motorway to uh to where Alan and and indeed you, Ben, were living, which is Lincoln. and we visited Bernie Torpin's various abodes and and his school and and where he got married and, you know, we saw the the the marriage uh uh you know, registration and so on.

So it was an incredible two day event and it was very much Alan, uh obviously a local expert, and Dale, uh who'd worked a lot on b Bernie's material for a book. and was obviously a seasoned fan himself of Elton's. Uh the three of us, we just combined this and we put this together. We had a lot of great times doing that. Um a we made a lot of friends who've remained lasting friends over the years, Gloria Cunningham, Hesi Korkaduri,

Um, I don't know where all the fans are today, but I know I've heard so much feedback from them, they really enjoyed it. They said it was well researched, well done, you guys. You you've put this together. This is quite a a an amazing thing. And we we may very well do it again in the future, we'll see. But um I'm thrilled to bits that Alan was part of that. Peter.

I remember uh him telling me about it. I missed it. And I mean this is this probably says something about Allen. He said, next time you come up, he said, I mean I I didn't know the Lincolnshire site, so I've been to London. Sure. And he said, I'll take you, I'll take you around Lincoln and show you all the places.

You know, and that that was how generous he was. He just came up and we went out, we spent the whole day looking around. It was just lovely. And we ended up in a nice pub which Bernie had drank in and I it was just a lovely, a lovely time to spend with him. Um and something fell out of that, and that was uh a few years later that we're connected with it. Um we we found out uh a person was selling some acetates in Lincolnshire near where Bernie grew up.

And um so we made an appointment to go and and and see person. And that that we thought they only had two or one or two. And when we turned up, uh the chap arrived and it turned out that his wife I think it was his wife or his sister, was an ex girlfriend of Bernie's. And she'd been given a pile of acetates. Yeah. Um, at a uh and we said, Well, why did he give her all these acetates? And apparently she went to a party with him.

and uh took some albums like you did in those days and to play and somebody somebody stole them. So Bernie, in terms of trying to make up for it, gave her a load of these aspirations. And they were you know, these were they're rare stuff, you know. Absolutely. Um I mean some of them have come out now, slow fade to blue. Uh Miss You, uh Baby I Miss You and a few of those. But um the one that Alan loved, and that's his favourite f uh favourite, was uh watching the plane.

Now, Watching the Planes has come out on the regimental Sergeant Zippo, but this isn't that isn't that one. This is a piano demo of Watching the Planes. And I think of all the early Elton uh material, that was definitely Alan's favourite. And uh so that was a lovely find to you know to to I mean it was

Well, not quite luck, because we knew somebody had one, but to find all these others and there were Caleb Quay demos and it was an amazing collection that had sat in this person's house since nineteen sixty eight. And and when did you come across it? When when would that have been? Cool, that must be fifteen fifteen years ago.

Wow. Absolutely amazing. And the pub you mentioned, I I I remember we were visited as well, and I think it must have been the same pub that Alan took you there. It's apparently the the place that was in that inspired Bernie Torpin to write the lyrics to Saturday Nights All Right for Fighting.

So Yes, I've read that. Yes, yeah, I've seen that. Yeah, maybe. And we we did an uh an article back in this was one of the first things that Elton John Well did when we launched in two thousand two is we we did this tour. Uh so it's almost like a sort of opener book for the website. And um uh I'll I'll make sure that the link to that article is included in the the the write-up to to this podcast. So uh folks you can come to Elton John World and

find that article to be up at the same time as uh as this podcast. Right. Um so I think at that point we should actually play some music. Uh it's a bit a bit somber, but perhaps it fits the mood. Uh and in a moment, Ben will tell us why he chose Crystal. to heaven.

From his 1985 album Ice on Fire, that's Cry to Heaven, Elton John. And that ominous tome that you hear at the end of that chime. Uh a very powerful song, uh chosen by Ben McCormick for today's programme, Cry to Heaven. with all the geopolitics that's going on at the moment, uh lyrics like, uh, I saw a black cat uh tease a white mouse before it killed it with its claws, l seems a lot of countries do the same thing before they go to war.

um seems so on on target and so uh so relevant today as it was, gosh, forty forty years ago when that was uh when that was composed. It's incredible, it's forty years ago. Um I think I've done my numbers right. Um, Ben, tell us why did you choose this song for the show? Yeah, well well, I mean, George, you posed me the most difficult question I've had this year for sure, which is pick pick a top three Elton John songs'cause I mean, there's so many great ones to choose from. But

Yeah, I always loved that track and I and I always thought it was really underrated. Uh I you know, I I'd I thought before I even missed the top forty. I I checked before we we came online and and didn't even get in the top forty in the UK, which is um

Scandalous really, but no, I I uh the lyrics are great um in that track. I mean you yeah, you y you gave the the key line there. But the other thing I really liked about that track is the way the the piano and the the bass works in particular, the way the the song builds, you obviously starts with the piano in the first verse and then really builds up and

Um, yeah, the what I don't know who who's on the bass um in this track.'Cause I know at this point he was probably working with with different um collaborators, but loved the bass work, loved the piano work and his vocal is fantastic. I think the the vocal performance um is really, really strong. So yeah, that was um

Actually it wasn't too difficult to choose that one, I have to say. That al always a favourite of mine quite a heaven. You know, r really good trap. Yeah. I mean with over five hundred songs, even And it sometimes they all enter into sort of our subconscious and we we think of three songs that we like and then we think, Damn, why didn't I think of that one?

You know, it it because as you say, an underrated song. But it did get a bit of an airing. I have to say I I confess I remember in eighty five, um Elton went on a chat show, it may have been Wogan, I'm not quite sure, but it may have been Wogan. And he performed Cry to heaven. And we did, I remember. You remember right. Help me out here, Peter. Is is am I on the right lines?

Yes, definitely. About eighty five, I think it was. And he definitely played it on I think I've got a video of it. Right. And what did you make of that performance and and and was that the first time you'd heard the song? 'Cause I think it may be the first first time I'd heard it. Yeah. I think it came out right as uh when it was released, I think. So yeah, yeah, it was uh yeah, I mean it's a a very striking song. Um I mean I must admit, I would not have thought it.

uh thought of it. Uh but and until Ben's chosen it, I think, yeah, actually it is a great song. And this is the trouble, isn't it? There are so many. But um and I think the other problem is is that the very common songs that you've heard so many times. you know, you sort of get blasé about them and you just think, oh well, you know, I've heard that a thousand times. But they are still fantastic songs.

You know, and and that's what's difficult to step back from, isn't it? I think in you know, I I kind of feeling that like in twenty years time when You know, we've all moved on. Try not be me from this earth. Um don't say that. They'll probably look uh look back at this, you know, some of these songs uh which are are common to us now and maybe not so common in the future, and they'll they'll realize how great they are.

I think that's a good thing.'Cause that that period is maybe I I mean you guys are probably better qualified than me to speak about it, but uh I don't get the sense that Ice on fire is seen as, you know, one of his great works and And perhaps that sort of mid to late eighties period is is maybe a bit forgotten. Um but uh I really like that I love that track. I think you're right. I mean two low for zero was quite a big peak. Um

um Ethorium again. That was a real resurgence in in absolutely popularity and in the charts. But then the following albums did sort of you know, go down in in popularity. I think the I mean the eighties was a real struggle for most of the seventies art. The the artists that start in the seventies all struggled in the eighties, I think. And El and Elton was surprisingly, you know, there.

And the ricochet after that. Absolutely. And it's become one of the firm favourites of everyone. Uh I'm still standing and everybody knows the song. It's an international. Um but you're right, two years later comes out uh Ice on Fire and I remember on the back of the sleeve um of the album they there was a black and white picture of uh Elton sitting down in a hat, I think he had shades on, reading a newspaper.

Um and next to him I think was Bernie. And that was uh the photo was taken in Paris, and I think it was La Le Magot, which sounds like the two maggots. Uh but it's actually in French. And uh exactly. I mean, who put them up to this? It must have been one of Elton's ideas of uh of a a bit of a folly. I uh let's see how many fans actually read what it says above above us on the uh on the on the name of the restaurant. So they were outside

uh th this this famous restaurant, which when you go and see it in in Paris, actually has a slightly different name. So I think they actually changed the title. Some somebody might want to write in, if you do, please do contact us, contact at reg. dot world. That's R. E. J. dot world. Um and um

Uh I think maybe for marketing reasons or uh legal reasons they had to change the title uh slightly. Or or maybe it was Elton's idea of of humour. I'd love to know the story about that photograph. But it is The reason why that restaurant and that that particular spot is so important, it's where the conspirators met all those years ago to plan the French Revolution.

So that's that's where the the the ringleaders would meet and discuss tactics about how they were going to beat the Huguenots and get rid of the monarchy in France. So it's a really important spot. It's it is a landmark. It's a lovely restaurant. Very good food there if you ever go folks.

gr uh great, great, great grub. Do enjoy. Um so anyway, um but the great album that it was, Ice on Fire, yeah, some people would say not so so big. It was in the shadow of uh Too Low for Zero. You're quite right, Peter. But I think it was also a very political album, uh, Ice on Fire. I mean, there were other songs which had political connotations, obviously Nikita, which was a a certainly a big hit for Elton from that album.

um and the the the the storyline of a of an East German border guard woman that he will never see again because all he was allowed to do was flash his passport and not show any emotions. And the video was was well timed to to capture that mo that sort of checkpoint Charlie moment.

Um, so I think that w it was quite a political album in in some many ways, but but now that you know, I I think I'm gonna after this show, I'm gonna put it back on the turntable and listen to it because it just seems such an appropriate album for these times that we're living through. Yeah, definitely.

It's a fantastic one. Okay, well we're not gonna play another song, Ben, that you selected, but only because for the reasons you've already explained, everybody chooses Rocket Man. It is a standard, it is a beautiful song. It's it's a great Gus Dudgeon production. Um I think

I think you've probably heard it enough o over the years, George. I think so. I think so. Although although there are some pretty good covers over that over the years, including on the uh uh the duet album that Elton put out in what, nineteen ninety three?

Um there's a there's a really nice cover of that in there. But you're right. I mean we we've heard it so, so many times and the fans always say, Yeah, but what about, you know, other things, et cetera. So we're not gonna play that, but I did want to ask you why you chose Rocket Man. Yeah, I well I sort of ha I I sort of had to choose it really. I mean going going back to dad's well, going back it's it's really dad's funeral to be honest with you. Right, right.

W m m mum, uh my brother Chris and me, we we all said, Well, let's let's pick a song for the funeral and um that was the the the pick that that I made and I s I recalled like the probably the I don't know why, but the last conversation I'd had with him Yeah, couple two, three days previous to it to him dying, um, was about that song. And when I listened to it, um, you know, when deciding on okay which which song will be appropriate, the lyrics just seem so appropriate. Um

for for him, you know, there's that great line, you know, you're I'm not the man you think I am at home and and all of that, which you know, was was was very him. Um And it's a great song. You know, it is a great song. We can hear it a hundred times, two hundred times, three hundred times. People will be listening to that song in a hundred years from now. No absolutely no doubt about it. It's a it's a fantastic song. So I really had to choose that one. That was um

Yeah, that had to go in there. Yeah, while they steer their uh their motorised flying saucers. Uh as they'll be doing in a hundred years' time. Rocket man, what's a rocket? We don't use rocket propulsion anymore. Didn't anyone tell them? Yeah. Something from the yester years. But wonderful, wonderful. Now you're right. It is a timeless classic and I'm sure you're you're absolutely right. It will remain uh uh so for for many years to come. Um now uh

Alan, one thing that Alan was really good at was I think uh that he was just so very genuine and so honest about things. So if he didn't like a certain Elton song, he would sort of whisper to me and say, It's not one of his best ones, is it?

You know, he would have that attitude and um uh he was always very he was always very funny. He wasn't one of these people who come into us to the room and say, Hey, look at me. He wasn't sort of the the guy who wanted to be the the the figurehead of the party. But but when you got chatting to him, he he was absolutely brilliant and so funny as well. We had so much so much fun.

So, um a a dear friend to to myself as as well as to Peter and it's so lovely to be able to connect with you as well, Ben, um, at such an important moment as well. And the timing, we we I know we've been hoping to talk to you for a while, but I'm glad that we chose this as

the the timing'cause I was actually going to say, when would that anniversary be? And you've kindly answered it that it's literally just around the corner. Um Now uh i w what happened to all the as every fan's gonna wanna know, whatever happened to the to the stock? What happened to all the stuff that he didn't see? No, I I'm I'm don't joke. Of course. There's been a lot of heart attacks now, as you said that.

Yeah, I can confirm there was no definitely no skit. Definitely no skit. Even at the very end when I was dealing with cassette singles that nobody wanted and all of that. No no there was no skit. Well, I mean I I'll I'll bring Pete in here as well'cause he was obviously a a huge help with that. But um Yeah, I mean it was obviously there's a there was a big responsibility because we knew I mean dad dad kept

does that the business side pretty that was his domain, you know, he had his office, you know, outside the house and, you know, we weren't really involved in it. I mean, I I helped out from time to time if it was needed, but that was it was his baby. It was his thing. Um, but I think it was probably always expected that um j th when the time came and that he passed on it it would probably come down to me to um to to to deal with the collection. So I

Yeah, I left my job in Malaysia and and came back for a year. And um I mean I have to say the fans were absolutely amazing. I mean the the obviously on c'cause dad died suddenly, we we weren't expecting it. Um it really was one day he was here and the next day he wasn't. So it w it was a obviously a real shock to everyone and Um, you know, there were even orders left hanging that unfortunately hadn't been passed out and

The response from the fans was incredible. You know, emails coming in. Um, you know, you've already said that, you know, he was a a great guy and so honest and so fair and lovely and would talk for hours on the phone. So it was lovely to see that and You know, I basically made a pledge to the fans that, you know, probably within a year, eighteen months, um, we would sell the collection. I don't think there was ever any desire on my part or or or mum or my brother to

hang on to it for years. You know, we and we were also aware that he had a a real standing in the in the fan community and that he had incredible recordings and in incredible pieces of of of vinyl and everything else that would have a much better home.

um in a in in a fan than in an attic or in a cupboard that nobody's gonna go to. So yeah, I think it was I mean Pete you might be able to correct me here. I think it was sort of twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen we um yeah, um Pete came down for a a couple of visits and was immeasurably helpful um in uh yeah helping me understand that what were the valuable bits and

Um what was worth this and what was worth that. But yeah, perhaps I can bring you in here here, Pete, as well. Yeah, it's always the problem I think with that. I mean I'm I'm thinking about that now with all my collection and making sure that when you know it's who's gonna look at look at it and sort out

what are the you know, the stuff that's worth fifty P and goes to the charity shop and which stuff is is priceless and um and that was my role really to go through Alan's stuff and sort of I mean obviously he had he's what I would call the the valuable collection in a special box and we knew that those were were collectible. Um and I could get a rough pricing of those. But then there were lots of other things all buried in

was was becoming friends with Ben. I mean, you know, we had you know, and it was lovely. You know, we just again we connected and we had a gr I mean, yeah, it was a sad time, but it was a great time going through it and talking about the music. And of course out of that we were talking about then's dad and you know and and um and how we connected. So it was an it was a lovely time for me, you know. It was. And it's amazing how Elton, just collecting Elton

connects you with people that you never have met before and families that you'd have met before. And I think that's true of a lot of hobbies and interests, isn't it? That you know, you you you get more from it than just the actual thing that you're collecting or you've got an interest.

But I mean there was some super stuff. I mean, you know, non Elton stuff, you know, we found a Genesis album, didn't we, that was worth, you know, five, six hundred pounds or something, you know. Um and you could have easily sort of gone, Oh, that's a pound, you know. Um, you know, so

some of the the rarer stuff as well,'cause that's my my thing. And I and of course a lot of them I knew he had'cause we'd found them either together or or we'd, you know, played them, whatever. Um, I think one of them was the child acetate of the demo of child that he had. Um, I mean and I can you know, he had like I I think he didn't when we went through, but he had like two copies of the Warlock Sampler album, you know. I mean, how many people have got one? Let alone

Two back then. I think he'd already sold them by the time we Ben and I went through it. But I mean stuff that went through his collection. was stacked. And it was first. I mean, y we don't live in a huge house by any means. He had a small office and Uh good for a good year or two, you know, after he died, even you know, even in one when I was in the thick of of selling everything.

you know, you'd you'd open another cupboard upstairs and oh there's there's a whole lot more stuff. You know, you go into the attic, oh there's some more posters here and I mean it was The momentum, I have to say, through'cause I think it was about twelve months. It was a it was about a year. A twelve month sale of thousands of products. Hopefully when you opened those the belated cupboards, it wasn't at the point where you found acetates and you thought, oh, they're only a pound.

Um because be beta would have been uh having kittens, I think, at this point. Um so luckily uh everything was catalogued, everything was safely stored, its value, its true value was was was respected. I think that's really important.

Um and you managed to to sell all of that. Now the th the thing people wanna know is did you keep as an Elton fan and uh or you know, uh no a music buff yourself, did you keep any of the items? And if so, what is the most treasured item that you you've kept back from Allen's collection? I I did keep a few things back, but to be to be honest with you, nothing particularly valuable or special. I mean my I I am a collector of vinyl as well. I mean strangely that

I've always been into it, but it really kicked off as a passion when I was selling my dad's collection. I kind of thought, oh I've got enough money here to buy all the records that I wanted to buy from Woolwoods when I was about five years old. So that's basically what I did. So my thing was always. I'm not too interested in the or this is a a market value reporting I just think. Yeah, it's a sentimental value, not the

And something in really good condition. Um because obviously that's difficult to find. Um and I think probably one of Dad's maybe many USPs, but certainly one of the one of the big ones was his stuff was in pristine condition. It really was. Um so yeah, I I I there was a few seven inch Um that I that I kept in my collection. Um there was a Yellow Vinyl, Goodbye, Yellow Brick Road, which I which I kept. I that's pro I guess that's probably the most special one'cause I think that that album

If you were to speak to my mum and my brother, you know, that that album was played when they when they renovated their first house that they bought. And so, you know, I I think that was an important one to to to keep back. But um yeah, I mean the the Elton John section in my

seven inch vinyl boxes is is actually quite significant. I mean, I w uh there's no way I would term myself an Elton John fan on anything like the level that that you guys are. But there's a lot of stuff there and I and I think that again that probably reflects his longevity and I I I guess I had the benefit as well of I was born in nineteen seventy nine. So There was a lot of

A lot of his work was already done in the seventies, but then I couldn't grew up with him through the eighties as well. So it was th th that period. Yeah. Um

And what did Dad do apart from l wrap it up, what what did he do in his life? Was he an engineer? I seem to remember he had some interesting career. do you remember yeah so Well yeah, prior to To wrap it up becoming Yeah, full time business and and yeah, and a and a and a full time endeavor. I mean he he designed and built houses. Um That was it.

Right. Yeah. So when I was growing up, I think it was five or six houses in the Lincolnshire area, um, that he that he designed and built. And so yeah, I mean that was obviously a huge

A huge passion for him as well. Fantastic. We we really are out of time, so you might be cut off in just a moment, gents, but I just wanted to put one final point to you, just really to give you a plug really. Ben, I know that your dad will be very proud of the fact that you've also continued yourself as a songwriter and composer. You've got a special name.

It it sounds very French. Serge something. Go on, give us give us your name. Yeah. What's your stage name? Well okay, so for my solo releases, yeah, I I release under a pseudonym Serge Louie. Um he's on YouTube, he's on Spotify, et cetera. But um he sounds a j he just sounded a bit more interesting than Ben McCormick. So, um Yeah, I I do some bits. I mean, generally my work is as a producer, so I'm I'm uh launching a uh singer songwriter this year. Um

She's currently based in Lincoln as well. Um so that's really my work. But yes, my solo stuff that I release it's is under surgery. Fantastic. Well we're gonna play out the our show now uh with one uh l uh song that again you chose. Uh it is Benny and the Jets. Okay. This is a song that you chose. I'm not gonna ask you to justify it. I think it's a a brilliant song.

Although it's predictable, um this is a version uh by a young lady who's who's s singing it. It's very rare to hear Benny and the Jets performed by by women generally, I have to say. I'll leave you with one small fact. I don't know why no one on this show has ever gone for Candle in the Wind. That's one song no one's ever selected on the show. And we've been doing it for five years.

That's a breakthrough moment there. I'll leave you to just state over that point. Gentlemen, it's been a thrill a thriller minute to have you on the show. Really has. Um Ben, stay in touch. You're a lovely bloke. You're and a real you know, it's great. I I'm sure Dad will be very proud of

Everything that you're doing. Uh thank you, George. Well, thank you for inviting me. It's l lovely to be on here. It's great. And Peter, thank you as well for helping to to fill in on so many of the stories and give us your colour and perspectives on Alan McCormick, uh who's dearly missed by all of us. So with that it's a pleasure. So we're gonna play out now with uh the song that I mentioned, Ben Benny and the Jets, and this version is by Sarah.

Well, my thanks to Ben McCormick, the son of Alan McCormick, joining us on the programme today on Radio Elton John, and also Peter Thomas. And I'm thrilled to also announce that um he's made history uh being on the show today, Peter, because This is his third time on the show. Now, technically, Wayne Martin did join us for his third attempt. Uh that was for the uh Brandy, Carlisle, and Elton John album critic last year.

But for technical reasons Wayne couldn't actually join us on that day, so it still stands at two and the the record has been broken. A trio pi by Peter Thomas. Well thank you for joining us on Radio Elton John, the first of season five, the fifth year we've been broadcasting from Radio Elton John, Reg.world. And let's uh catch up again in a month's time.

This episode of Saturday Night's All Right for Podcasting was presented by George Matlock, Executive Producer George Matlock, for Radio Elton John, All Rights Reserved.