#24 - Lamar Steiger - The Cattleman and Walmart

Hello. And thanks once again for joining us for episode 24 of practically ranching. I'm your host, Matt Perrier and today's guest is Lamar Steiger. Lamar works as a consultant for Walmart and several other companies in the beef supply chain development. Uh, Lamar advises them and advises ranchers in ways that we can best supply folks like Walmart and other stores with a consistent high quality product. I E beef. And hopefully continue to grow that market for high quality beef.

Well, Lamar, thank you for joining us here on Practically Ranching. I appreciate you being here today. Tell us where you're coming from and what you've been up to so far this morning.

Hi, Matt. uh, it's good to be with you. and in my office in Bentonville, Arkansas. I've lived in Bentonville since 1970. Came originally down here from a ranch in Wyoming. And this morning I had coffee with a great friend who is, uh, part of Pioneer Bible translators, and he uh, raising money to translate the Bible world.

wow, that's great. As many times as the Bible has been translated, you would think that we were there, but, obviously, there are some parts of the world that still have yet to see it in their language.

They are, within 25 having every translated largely due you and I are on today, amazing, technology that we get to

technology, Well, I guess proof positive that, as much as sometimes technology seems to be from the devil, uh, that we can use it for good.

Absolutely. I think

think about that often. You're exactly

People are figuring out how to good. You're exactly

That's good. good. Well, speaking of doing things for good, give us a little history about your life and, and I guess specifically as it pertains to, to the beef industry, but, um, us up to today and, or at least the last several years. And then, uh, we'll drill down a little deeper on what it is you've been doing here. Most.

Okay.

Well, uh, as I mentioned, we were, our family was originally

northeast Wyoming.

my grandfather,

had bought a, uh, pretty good size cattle ranch in the Black Hills back in the early hundreds. And then my

my dad Wasd, going out there.

Wisconsin every summer. And after World War ii, he took it over and my one guys in the country to use, uh, technology and the beef He was a original founder of, uh, Beef Improve, or not beef improvement, but the predecessor to beef improvement. The, uh, God, the initials, I can't remember, but he

Probably the B C I A.

that's.

that sound familiar?

You're exactly Uh, uh, and then he was one of the first guys to use, uh, ai, uh, artificial insemination.

And, uh,

used, uh,

our way

and,

and.

and siminal way back in the early sixties and kind of played around with all that and decided he liked the char cattle

Was

his horned herford, uh, herd. From that to Charle, we moved to, uh, he was in a really bad farm

in

1966, he

his, stepped in back

stepped in, tripped, and fell into

step,

at the base of

the wow,

he survived and, but his knee and his, uh, a really hurt After that, the cold weather pretty hard on him. 1970, we moved south and bought a little ranch outside of Bentonville, Arkansas

Arkansas and started to build our ranch here

Arkansas, just about the

and all kinds of Walmart.

was almost what they

you can today. I, not this same ranch

he bought for 50, almost Matt and, um, and, uh, have

years'. Watch.

uh,

Walmart,

and my,

your father-in-law

one of the senior executives at Walmart and so kind of

had a, had a front row

as him. He also owned, owned a black Angus ranch, uh, Jack's Ranch, which is

sure.

And I ran Jack's ranch during the eighties and nineties and, and I

travel with him, Walmart,

And, uh, he and the team built Walmart. And,

and then he

retired and traveled the world, consulting in retail. And,

and,

actually helped a young man or man my age, young man, uh,

and we're gonna go with that.

in the early two thousands, a guy named Greg for, uh, in merchandising and retail. And when Greg became uh, CEO of Walmart, US in, uh, the early teens, 2013, somewhere in there. Greg

asked me to come help,

to

uh, Walmart.

with their, uh, their beef

Supply chain

And so I,

um, to say that I was a rancher

who

got involved the supply chain,

beef. Uh,

but now I say

of a

supply chain

who happens to have a as And I have really and been privileged to have this door to the entire beef supply chain from genetics all the

the way through to the counter

the, the frustrations that those of us who

with both

are,

are often

same frustrations the folks that are trying to sell our meat for us. And so it's been fun

to have that.

big, wide view of the entire which I don't think a lot of us really have.

I've learned that, uh, both personally, just how. I know about the other aspects of our industry. Um, but I think any, anywhere you go in the beef industry, there's, there's varying levels of understanding, and that is in each segment. Um, I've, I've mentioned that Amy and I got the opportunity to go to the certified Angus Beef, uh, annual convention or conference, uh, a month or so ago.

Yeah, you're exactly right. But, but on the other hand, I mean, there's so many of us in the cattle few hundred thousand and, and sometimes you see different data on how many people own 50 cows or more, and or 700,000 for sure. There are a lot of folks that are

Very

and

progress. Very much.

ranchers who really want to produce what customers want to eat. And uh, one of the early

Beings that I had, now's

one of 'em who's not a meat guy, but he's a grocer executive, that he's like, Lamar, I of another that produces a product that don't want. And that teeth get the products, the way that the customer wants

from, And there's so much of

produce in this business that what the customers are asking for. Uh, but yet because com, those different interests, different incentives for different parts and different segments of our supply chain, it's in their best along the supply chain to, to do things that are not necessarily in the best of the grocer and his ability to sell his or her ability to sell, sell the meat the customers want.

So when you talk about producing things that the consumer, the customer doesn't want be specific, what is it you're talking there?

I is, and I've worked with with Walmart for quite

town. I've also

been exposed to grocers worldwide and, uh, and

you have the chance

to

to the

a folks that are in that end of the industry. And I think the one the most obvious that's so

the hard to

to

try their out.

the size of these carc. And so, you know,

know, when I take a Walmart

to a uh, a sale, an auction for bulls, is pounding

the table

His desk

up there and he's pounding it and Hey, look at the size rip on this by.

d. It's huge. Like,

This is fantastic what you live on.

Well, the, the American

Americans' love

huge rib end, uh, steakhouse. when I city and I get to go to one fabulous steakhouses, then

by golly,

hoping that my tomahawk and my rib is so impressive that I take a picture and put it on Instagram. But yet

the grocer

consumer, the consumer that's out there beef, uh, from the grocery after week after week, can't afford. A rib that's that big that rib is cut so thin. And

what the problem is

the grocers is that this ribeye will come in so big

So that, uh, order

meet that that particular grocer, and Whole Foods or an heb or a

likewhatever,

all those know what price point their are willing to pay and at what price point it goes over that they're not willing to pay, which is really hurtful to their

therapist. Sure. And

in order to meat is sold by the pound, then what they have to do is they have to have their case ready facilities cut that ribeye thinner and thinner. And call it, uh, Matt, I call it cooking abuse, is that, there are a lot of folks that take a stake home I have been to my friend's houses, Throw a steak on the grill and I'm like, Holy smokes. Like, let me take that off now. And I, but you kind of hold your tongue, right? You don't, you don't get into another guy's grilling

be, be, be respectful. Lamar

yeah, there's a lot of, there's a lot of cooking abuse that goes on, and it's especially that way on thin, thin cuts.

Right. So you know the thes

the, that want at, um, at, at a Walmart and other mainline grocery stores are a lot smaller

the

that are coming off. competing interest and, and incentive is

Pack

they make bigger carcasses,

Sure, sure. They get paid more

then all throughout this entire supply chain, we buy and sell our cattle on weight. And so, uh, and so until the incentives are changed, you know, then it's just a real frustration for the grocers. When they have to figure out what to do with these ribs that are too big for the tray. Like Walmart doesn't have butchers in their, in their stores.

I not only

customer not buying it retail, but then the, the

is the tell.

it down on day three or four in the store. And so they're taking a loss, beyond the fact that it didn't sell a retail. Now they have to take a loss on it to get it, to get it sold. And so it's just this continual cycle of, of, just dysfunction really.

So from a retailer's standpoint, you would say that the number one, or at least one of the drivers of things that consumers don't want are bigs?

Yeah, So, and that speaks to, uh, bigger than just

Yeah. Big carcass. We would love to have.

in the size.

Okay.

in the size. And you know, one, one of the merchants told me that when we high, when we buy shirts, flannel shirts, that we order x number of thousands, hundreds of thousands of larges. And that company does not ship us extra smalls and extra larges when we order large

right.

And so it's this, it's just this real issue that we have with inconsistency in the size of our,

This your size in quality,

of our product. And so

the merchant

puts in

in an order with with,

plant partner. And the I'm sure is trying their best to fill that order, which would be a

will rise

a cut of steak that fits in

aray the

then

as those cattle come

and they're all different sizes and they're all different, uh, different, uh, consistencies and, and then, and

It's, and

all,

then those packers have

best they can to fill that because

our industry

so, broad and and wide

on

kinds of different sizes, all kinds of different types of cattle, all different ways that fed It's

really

to meet the consumer's demand. And,

far of.

recently I was with some grocers that were

We're talking about

this time, uh, of uncertainty

in the I

Customers that they getting a of beef. And if

if they're we

then they a cheaper protein next time and

probably

the recession is,

Is I

whatever. economic that we're in, uh,

This,

straightens out. Because,

uh, if theyre gonna pay.

for beef prices, then they, uh, fully expect to be fully satisfied with a great cut of meat. And when they're not, they just switch out.

Yep. It's the market and it's what we should expect. I mean, if we're consumer focused, we need to realize that yeah, they're gonna vote with those dollars. And it's been really good, the fact that they voted with those dollars over the last decade or two and proven that they want premium beef and they're willing to pay a premium price. When the economics turn down and or when, um, when we miss the mark on what it is they're expecting, then yeah, there's, there's gonna be a consequence.

Yeah. Um, opt, oftentimes when I bring this up about the size of the ribeye people and just, this happened to me last week, when I was traveling with some, uh, and some folks from New Zealand and, and

we were in New York, but they were like,

why don't you just cut the ribeye, off the ribeye, and then you'll get

But now that is,

can get it can get it thicker. But

can get merchants Tell me

if a rib doesn't look like a rib eye, uh, and the lysis cut off, they switched to pork.

that. Wow. And so

customers kind of when they see it, and, uh,

want. They can't,

interesting, Matt, I

they just,

customers can't explain to us what they want, they

look at a shelf

meat and they can pick out the one that they want, but they really can't articulate it as what it is they're looking for. But if it

me looks like a rib. Uh,

and, uh,

and merchants that I've with tried,

to cut the

a box if

cut smaller so that they, they could cut it thicker and, and ha and, and hopefully then provide that customer with a better eating experience. But customer

customer just, uh,

abandon that product. together,

Yeah. I remember. Retail meat, consumer purchase data. I can't remember exactly what they call this, but basically they interviewed consumers, asked them what they wanted to buy, and then mapped that over what was actually in their cart and that they actually purchased at the at the counter, and it was rarely the same. You know, they'd say one thing and then they'd go do another. But that's interesting.

Yeah, I the big supermarket chains are, are not the place to convince customers of new products. Uh, you know, and, and they can do a little bit of that, but, uh, but if we're gonna reeducate, let's say, or, or not reeducate, let's just say educate customers

Uh, about

I think most 'em are uh,

educated. And I said, That's not thes. I, that's our fault.

an industry.

And, uh, if we're gonna do that, I think it's

as you said, with restaurants and butcher shops and,

then once,

gets popular, then the mega grocery stores,

take that. So I think the trik knit

example you know,

30 years ago, Tri-tech school thing,

only happening in California and, Oklahoma Rancher who had moved from California and he always did this tri-tip thing, and it was like, Oh, this is so awesome. This is so much fun. When we'd go visit him, and now, you know, I think.

it's probably,

anywhere and everywhere you have Tri-Tip, that's a long process and it doesn't solve the problem that the merchants, the grocers have today.

Yeah, as an aside, the flat iron stake is something that's interesting to me. You know, that was pieced out I think as part, as part of NC b's, um, new product development, gosh, 20 years ago. And, and that was one, at least on a regional scale. We've got Dylan's stores here in Kansas. They're owned by Kroger, but Dylan's would have probably once or twice a month they would feature flat iron stakes and I mean at a good price and they would sell the tar out of them truckload after truckload.

And I think that's one example. But in general, think that that every, all the merchants in all the restaurant,

They had to

they during the pandemic. simplify.

Sure. Really had

simplify your supply chain and, and things and upcoming

and things. You try, I'll

on ho

probably talk on hold,

as we come out of all that and they get their labor situation out, and, and all maybe we can get back, back to that, but just goes to show that even with developing new products from our existing carcass, that when push comes to shove and when ti things get tight, customers kind of have their basic And uh, and they may have things outside of the basics that they might go to at a butcher shop or at a restaurant, but when they go into a Dylan's or a Kroger, Safeway, Walmart, they, they pretty well

And that makes sense. I, I think some of our listeners that are listening to this podcast on back of a horse or in a pickup or something else would say, Yeah, I get it. I mean, you look at input prices and, uh, drought and some things like that. We're, we're going back to basics in a lot of, uh, a lot of the management techniques that we're using in the cow calf and, and feed yard world as well. Just, just to try to make sure that we can do as much as we can with, with, um, with what we have.

Yep.

So let's go back after we have figured out that consumer. Preference on, on ribeye size, let's say for instance. and like you said, if they make that major purchase of a ribeye steak, get it home and it doesn't meet their expectations, they may trade down. What is the next level after, as you said, consistency of size in the ribeye, for instance, or all any of these cuts of, of of beef that they're buying? What's their next level of? Did we meet expectations or not?

Yeah, and this one is, I think, interesting. It's, I, I.

Interest

work with grocers and merchants. I'm not, I'm not at the front table, but are at the front counter. But I do note the next thing that I hear them talk about a lot is, uh, and what's really important to, like my friends at Walmart, is the eating experience. And so eating experience would, would probably, uh, I think

I

are talking about the tender. And a taste, which is enough marbling.

Part and,

and, and in there with, uh, something,

I don't want to be

critical

critical, the,

chain because

I think,

Matt, like your family and others that are in the genetics end of this business have done

done an amazing job,

over

uh, 20

of really improving the eating

Really

for,

vast of,

go through the supply chain that was not there. And it goes to intensity that you've done and in, and those of us in the pure bread business have done with, uh, with genetics and EPDs

adding to

and

really

the pencil on the number of that, uh, that.

than, uh,

and, and even better. that has really improved the eating experience across the board. Uh, and doom and gloom. I don't want to come across as saying that's what the customer or the, uh, the grocers are saying,

but it's when that,

not, when those pieces are inconsistent that fit the eating experience that, um, that the customer asking the merchants for.

and quite often that that eating experience, like you said, it's, it's based off tenderness and taste

Yes. then again,

and then actually the Yeah. Yeah.

somebody, somebody can cook a meat well or not, know? So, um,

not well

another factor. Yeah.

especially, uh, yeah. Especially not when it's a half inch thick. Yeah. And, and I've heard it said before, I think we all have that quite often for that consumer that's not able to cook it just Right. Marbling is not only a taste attribute, but it's an insurance policy. If you've got enough marbling in there, they can go a little too far, they can get to one 50, or hopefully not one 60 degrees doneness. And it's, it's not gonna be complete shoe leather.

and then the next one I would add on there is price.

Okay.

so when you have price, eating experience and uh, and size, then

Those three things, Heather

customers, uh, choose our product over pork and they choose chicken

goes, and that I watch the industry.

my entire and especially in the last few years, I really am a big believer that we lot of the problems that we're having of bringing, uh, the carcasses up through the chain

about all the way

grocer with It's that the, the

industry that when

the ones that figure out how to get rid of the, the, uh, like if you look at a bell curve, you, you kind of both ends of the bell curve and you those cattle that fit the upper two thirds choice.

and that's

really

really clear.

customers, whether they shop at Walmart or heb, that's where of do their bread and butter. Beef upper through thirds choice. Now, you might buy prime when you're night. Like I have some really good friends that I, some young men I mentor in their thirties, and they'll find that, that, uh,

that Maha occupants,

a blue tray at Walmart, which is Prime,

they'll send pictures

me and they're having four or five of their best friends over, and they're gonna have this big state cookout. But third's choice is kind of the middle of the bell curve of what we, what we really want. And

in order to

with the, the, the,

the not

And to know which ones are the ones that are better is we really, just hoping that we as an industry will start

about,

uh, the

tools that's taking in order.

track data. And, and what that really starts with is e i d tags or, or there's some new technology that may be out there where they can photograph individual cattle and,

And so we make

I've,

recognition if the,

are working on that. and whether it's nose i d or whatever, is, is

it's, we an

need to kind of go back and, and that if we can

in

Track cattle and then add to that genetics that are in that cattle eventually.

in

way out there and I know it's really hard for a lot of us to, to get our minds around,

those are

that are gonna help us to narrow down the outliers that don't appeal to the customers. And, um, you know,

thes when we, when I

around the country and speak to groups and I talk about individual ID and all, it reminds me of when I traveled with my father-in-law, Matt, in the early eighties, my father-in-law came up with the idea for the barcode. And he was a senior Walmart executive. He was president of Walmart and he he

He up with it.

and he got together with a supplier that made Hoy.

They went

MIT and they told those scientists at mit, we don't know what we want, but we want something that we can track items individually by the box.

to and

and

uh, they rolled back

out, it's very familiar to what I hear about e i d Well,

recently or ized

pay for it. Well,

something else get was,

on that off. We don't, There's all these obstacles and challenges to, to individual idea of cattle, but

But the win on

on on was that were unimaginable in 1980. When he traveling the country. And by sheer force of his was a big guy with a big By sheer force of his big personality, he really drove barcode. And, and him standing in line with him at a ski lift and he said, Someday, uh, you know, you're through a ski lift line and you're gonna do a barcode. And we were like,

my wife was like,

that's the silliest thing, you know, I've ever heard. he was a visionary for this. And so

just

think we're just a, a dec few decades behind the rest of all supply chains, every supply chain in the world is becoming where they can either track and trace it by lot number, uh, like, like a pallet of lettuce,

where.

Track and trace it through the box, through a barcode and now the QR code. we as an industry, if we

Figure out how to

it will pay long term. Now, it may seem painful, just

It's like the folks, the folks that

Kleenex for Walmart or producing paper and they were like,

towel, we're not gonna go.

the expense of putting a barcode on this box. Like, this is not,

We're just

And he was like, No, you will.

not gonna, I think

we don't, as an industry, Matt, embrace getting a handle on what our supply chain really is and fixing the problems along the way,

I think

it'll be forced on us by the grocers. And the grocers will in

our supply chain

we're gonna wanna know

than we know.

And that starts with track and tracing. And I, I, I think I on a rant here, but I just think it's so important to solve the problems that we were talking about at the grocery end.

Well, don't apologize for the rant because as I've said before, that's where the best discussions usually take place, at least on this podcast. And, and I think any place else, if we're really honest. so you mentioned the logistics challenges of, of, let's just narrow it down to R F I D because everybody knows what one is. A lot of people are at least using it in some way, shape or form or, or familiar with it.

and I understand the issues with what we're giving up and, and that there's, there's fear number one, and number two, it's kind of like privacy, right?

the right. I don't want

to know And

So I think the difference

in,

now is that we need to do that.

and the difference now is blockchain. And I think if you think back four or five years ago, every newspaper article had somebody financing a blockchain company. And it was exciting and it was really cool and this was gonna be great. And then all those companies got a bunch of money and then they kind of had to try to figure out how to make it work. And so it all went not completely silent, but you just don't hear about a lot.

And they're,

process of, of tracking and tracing leafy vegetables, fruits, that kind of stuff. And

it actually

of works. is a blockchain would allow a rancher identify the cattle, to identify the

data points that are important

and to such a way

way that their privacy

and protects their, uh, the integrity of their information how they to other ranches and all. And that that all is part of a block. And block is a, is and then permissions are giving given to use certain amount of different ways along the supply chain. And

so I think new way and

I'm not a and if my son was on the. Podcast, he could explain it a lot better. But the, the, uh, challenges we've been talking about doing for like most of your life and most of my

right.

this supply chain is, are,

Have been

uh, legitimate challenge to ranchers. And so I think this new technology with blockchain where you can share needs to be shared, but keep private who you are

new private

your own data that you don't want then on the other, Of that, then

then supply chain could

data back to you in a block where you get the actual, you get a lot more information on how your calves have done.

where you,

not shared publicly. That's just shared in your block, in part of this big supply. And then can make

of monuments,

uh, by getting rid of the bottom 10% of your

cattle, and really know.

which ones are the ones to call and which ones are the ones you think maybe we think we should call. And so I and, and it might be that you find somebody for a podcast, uh, that's a blockchain, um,

technology,

can kind of, uh, kind of explain this a little better than I.

well, I think that 30,000 foot view is, is probably best for right now. But that gives us, that gives us an idea, uh, up to this point for the most part, with the exception of a few programs. If, and let's just talk about Carcas data. If a cow calf producer wants to get data back on their pro, on their steers that they retained ownership on and sent the feed yard, that's about the best.

Yeah, I think to the basic probably both. my son, who's the blockchain guy, he's, he says that uh, being in a blockchain will be your permission to do With a supply chain. And outside or outside of

system, light chain

will be, cost. I think eventually down the road.

there've gotta a bigger

of participating,

what that is with, uh, with whatever technology and

keeping that you have to order to be a part of a supply chain. And,

And so,

the, the, you know,

just so.

the barcode. There's a cost

Barcode's, the

There's a pro all that without that today, you don't get to be a part of a supply chain. I mean,

mean, there's, there's, that's your a product,

uh,

in Hardboard box builder, which, which

manufactured

without a barcode.

it. Right? And and so,

I think that'ss

cost, is the cost is worse by not participating in a supply chain and not trying to get on board with trying

figure out

how to get the customers what And

so there's a whole nother factor

that plays into this, is that the American consumer not only wants premium,

that they want the grocery

They want their

store that

where from, and they want them to know

bes all

steps along the as far as what it, what was done everything from humane

handling that.

to be the, your ranch is BQA

could, could

part of the information in that. And how,

how else would

kept up through the supply chain that you as a rancher, were b q a certified if, uh, we're not recording that in some way in a blockchain or in some way along along the and consumers, uh, they wanna know the animal,

are they, Well,

wanna know,

uh,

the animals know what if they've had growth hormones. They wanna know all these things. And,

hormones

want

necessarily all the way

individual ranchers, Matt, they wanna, they, what we've discovered is that they wanna know that their that their grocery store knows. And

and so,

uh,

so the.

are trying to figure out how do they build the trust of their supply? Um, so that they can look their, their customer in the eye and they say, We know that our animal were blank. Uh, let's say Sid, they did not have, implants. Which,

whether that's

or a bad thing or not

good. Yeah.

What customers, customers want, right? And, and,

uh, every

that

manufacturers any

probably

probably product that they would to one

but customers want it in another way. so,

you know,

smart

grow or products

customers actually want.

As you're describing this, the whole thought of consumers not necessarily knowing the individual place that this animal came off of, but know that their supplier, Walmart, Costco, Dylan, Safeway. Knows where it came from and that's enough. Uh, I chuckle because number of years ago, 10 years ago, I think Amy and I got the opportunity to go out and work with a small, but a very progressive retail chain called St. Stu Leonards out in, um, New Jersey into New York.

Yep.

Yeah.

um, when a grocer has a high level of trust, for instance, like St. Leonard, and I've been in a, one of those, a couple of those grocery stores, and just last week

week I was in

was able to go

New York. I think you,

high end uh, in the, in and around that,

that area and those

customer. They have such a high level that grocer, that the in a lot of ways doesn't have to, to claim a lot of attributes.

Risk to like, there was no,

that I visited last week had a antibiotic. I mean a, uh, yeah, a never, ever

no benefits in

chain.

there. Nobody was making

at the

the reason they didn't have

that claim for never, ever is already have trust of their customers and they know their customer. Now

if you think about grocer

Walmart who has

500 grocery store,

They

didn't have grocery store,

1990, and they, they

got into the grocery

business and

by the

they were the largest grocer in the,

in the country.

And

You don't go to

stores in 12 or 13 years with high

Not

Probably the number one. weren't enough

What? Enough? Yeah.

Uh, then Walmart doesn't hire a union, and so most of those butchers are union. And brought

in case ready,

the United States market was not probably case ready, but Walmart did it anyway. And, and, and

So have 400

meat, but not a very good reputation. And when uh, my friend uh, New

Zealand than my

had trained, when he took over Walmart,

father-in-law

he was like, Okay, we're building a better reputation so that our

ation trust. Well, since they maybe,

such a good o or as one of the executives said, we had a well-deserved bad reputation in beef. was 10 years ago to 8, 9, 10 years

well, I remember the Thomas E. Wilson specs and so I would say there may be a little bit of just a quality benchmark that they raised this time, because that, that stuff wasn't very good.

And they pumped meat all. But it, it was a different time. It wasn't the foodie,

Different. That's true. Yep. Sure. So, you

was a different time and you had a different customer base and all that kinda, you back and beat up merchants who did things for a reason and they were able to make it

work. They wanted

build a better reputation to meet. And so since they

to build

in meat,

and they started

a lot of. A attributes that people knew And so one of the first things Walmart did was they sent the word to the Packers that they wanted Angus Syd, and had in the

contract say, being decided it. Part of the reason

that is,

uh, you know, I grew up in c

business. I'm

i, people to me all the time know why does the expand this well?

If

Are trying to narrow down

inconsistencies in the product and you have 4,500 stores, there's so many more Angus cattle than there

the, so we narrow down city

choosing one breed.

and so they chose

Angus, which has a great thanks to the American Angus Association and c a b,

And, and so they started

in their, in their black tray program, which is upper choice, was years ago that they for Angus

hired and then,

uh, we

we brought in a help

in, uh, supply chain, uh, for 500 stores or a few stores down in the and they they said, Okay, not only in non hormone added because

But the customers

telling them. That

was important

them.

to them, so they're tracking

those sales all the way through. They're seeing like, do respond to non hormone added? And, and they'll, they, they make their decisions on

they make so,

things that customers are telling them.

uh, And so, know, you could, things, their attributes,

or is that what Walmart kept increasing their attributes actually now have a pretty good reputation in

actually, I'm on airplane all the

I love to ask people where they buy their meat. And more and more, I'm sitting next to people that are like, you know, we tried, we were, we were at we tried this Walmart black tray and it was really, really And I'm just hearing that more and more, and I know that's anecdotal, Matt. I mean it's, but Walmart analyzes more data probably than anybody maybe except the US government and they, they the pulse. Of the American in beef and in everything they sell every single day

they, they know.

what price points consumers will pay. They know what price points they won't

They know when a product is

to snuff that consumers don't buy a second time. They might buy once, but they buy again. Uh,

Know that

consumer is unhappy and they, they, they

obviously unhappy cause they bought my team three weeks in a row. They went

weeks beef.

dunno who you're

but they can kind of track you based on credit card use and stuff like that. But they're not tracking individually who you are. They're just tracking, know, buying habits.

Well I would say if they went six weeks without buying beef, that would add to their unhappiness. So, uh, we need to find a way I and the other, uh, the other humorous thing, I thought as you were saying that the only entity that may look at data more than Walmart's federal government, I, I think Walmart probably is a little more accurate with their at least interpretation, sometimes from the data points.

I think they're trying anyway, and they, they, it just, it's just so, uh, so cool for me, Matt, as I've been able to go and be behind the door, a lot of these Walmart meetings that and Sam guys were focused on It was

was like, what can we

So to, to

to help customers save money?

they can live better. And if

But look at the Walmart slogan

they about maybe eight or 10 years ago,

that they went back and

all of Sam Walton's speeches and they watched him on the, the old and all that they of pulled out what did he talk

The most talked about saving. So the people

live better. to today, and there's young buyers that are. In the middle of a meeting and they're like, So how does this help the consumer? What the consumer?

doing, they ultimately are so focused

the consumer just brings me great pleasure to see that here we are. Walmart's a 60 year old company and they are still singularly focused on the customers

Yeah. And that's, that's the thing that gets lost. And I'm not gonna turn this into a Walmart commercial, but I do respect, um, that's the thing that gets lost. Walmart gets such a bad rap on so many different levels. But what they did was basically stymie inflation once they came in and kept consumer goods, in my opinion, largely from, from increasing, in fact, decreased costs of that. Now, did it make it harder for the mom and pop retailer?

Yeah, so when

when weve put together, uh, uh,

together two, two supply chains for their beef. And

first

with this, Pursuits and it's, uh,

sponsored by

Farms, a big Angus outfit down in Texas. And, and, uh,

uh, over and

the senior Walmart said over and over.

They were

with the number of slots the supply chain the disconnect from the rancher to the grocery. And

over and over.

The senior VP at the time was, uh, was a guy, a really good merchant,

Scott Scott all

over said, We want the ranchers to win and

He wants

win. And,

novel concept.

the frustrations that the grocers have with the supply chain are the

Very

that ranchers have. And

So they're pretty committed

their two supply chains that they're, one is developed and one that they're just developing, uh, where they

and bought

a partial ownership in the sustainable beef plant up in, uh, up in

in Nebraska

as they're

they're really,

to having everyone along the way make enough.

that we

can

help take out the

in the supply

fluctuation, so,

and know, over and over again, I've witnessed here living in Bentonville, all kinds of different supply chains that have the same issues that beef has. You know, that well,

Who's gonna pay for, How are we

these added costs? How can we for this?

require,

uh, here in Bentonville that sell everything from, you know, shampoo to Coca-Cola, they just are moan and grown about the fact that they have these added cost when there are these things that were

they'd

the consumers to do

do a better job with the,

product at a great value. And, uh, and those are the same folks that are still making just as much money or more money than they ever did because efficiencies

efficient

more than

paid

The cost of doing these programs. And a little it's gonna be, I, I believe, and, and, and

it, folks around this,

uh,

they the same

your permission to be in a,

thing in,

the, in the

in the chain.

to be, uh, a to participate in the technologies that are out there and their technologies are

I, And I really think

the technologies will get better and better

that, that we're gonna figure out the

cost

lowers trade.

And, and I

I was at the, A summit

Francisco. I think

think that was last March. I think it was

this

just last March. And it's The number of brilliant people

for

have helped develop Google who helped develop,

Microsoft, they've and all that. Were at this meeting in San Francisco they're looking at agriculture and they're saying, This is the last great There's, I guess there's two

Great class, great

mining. And

agriculture are the of the,

to be

be digital

and the digitalization, the technology embracing of

a really, really smart people

are developing

that it's all this

this new tools that will

help us

do a

better job

and tracing and improving our supply at about, at we can afford to implement it at. And, if you

you just look at the way the industry is right,

then you're, you're gonna say, This doesn't work for me. This, this is really hard.

you

if, if you'll join those who are trying to be visionary

they're trying be a part. I mean I want these to

part

a part of

consumer in the 20 and thirties we

be in 30 too.

years from

Your life. We could really have,

hard, hard situation for the be, for beef

you know,

tackling

start.

the different, uh, all the different parts of the, interest

Activists

tackling our industry for one part or another. And, and like, I'm

not to sit around and them

is

win, Like, let's

the technologies and the supply chains that help to answer their, their, some of their, some of their frustrations with the beef business are legitimate. Some of them are not legitimate.

answer. But

I'm willing to go out be fight to try to help the beef supply chain to win 10 years from now.

Yeah. And Amy and I talk a lot about telling beef's, story telling farmers and rancher's story. And we try to do it, uh, as, as producers in this industry, but. It's ironic that it may take technology to help us better tell that story and to reward that story with, with dollars for doing the right thing even better. And I think that's what this program and several of these types of programs and, and technologies hopefully enable us to do.

I'm what I call, I call the Excel generation. If group of new young, uh, owners and managers, uh, and, and some of 'em aren't so young, but. If you kind of had the excel in junior high and high school, uh, it's second nature to you and you're more data driven. And those are many of those in the ranchers that contact me and say,

Hey, how do I become artists

of this or some sort of

Things cause

like the way. doing it, it's not gonna work, you know? And so unless we just wanna keep mortgage in the ranch against the

Added value

the, the billionaires are bringing when they, when they come in ranches and they set the value at some huge amount, and you just keep, you know, you just keep mortgaging that, a very sustainable or, or exciting way. a living.

No, it's not. And, and that's, that's one part of competition. Competition for land and resources that, I haven't, I haven't had to deal with nearly as often as we have in the last 10 or 20 years.

So bottom line, like, I'm really hoping that we can form digital partnerships, digital cooperation. I'm not, I'm not interested in vertical, vertical integration. the way that, you know, a lot of us have seen the, the poultry industry go to and other, other industries is I think number one, the capital involved in the beef is so huge.

Oh,

not worried about anybody controlling any big part of it. You know, uh, the numbers involved with just two supply chains at Walmart are just numbers that get the attention of the senior leaders and the board of directors. It's like, how much are we doing? Like, what is our commitment here on capital? And a

Lot of

have a lot of ways that they can spend capital and Walmart and I'm just so proud of them. They've chosen to invest a huge amount of money in our supply chain trying to figure out how bring

the.

the customer that the customer wants week in, week out.

Well, I appreciate that and, and, um, we may have to have you on again, because on my list of, of thoughts that I would cover here, one of the question was, again, from the producer's standpoint, is having that amount of capital from Walmart, healthy or scary, um, for the beef industry. And, and again, we may, we may have a two hour podcast on that question alone.

And, and you it's kind of the way the rest of the

Seriously. I know I know, but we've always been cowboys Lamar.

I know, I know, I know. We, I just really hope that we start, we to improve our, crops where people, we're producing the products and again, I think we've done a lot in the last 20 years and it's largely due to families like.

Well, I appreciate that and, and I think we will. I, I think that, uh, what we've seen in change is, is only the beginning and, and we've learned. I think as an industry to adapt to that, it's never easy. It's still not, and, and probably never will be, especially for folks in our culture. But, um, but when the other option looks as bleak as what it does to opposing that change, uh, I think, I think we'll figure out a way and, and probably be better off on the other side because of it.

Yeah. Well, thank you for having me.

You bet. You bet. Thank you Lamar.

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