High voltage takes center stage in this season of Hitachi Energy's Power Pulse podcast. We promise to bring you great content from the brightest minds in the business. We'll discuss challenges, opportunities, and all the hot topics any high voltage enthusiast or anyone interested in sustainability for that matter, is sure to enjoy. This episode of the podcast is dedicated to all sustainability officers.
We'll talk about how we can decarbonize the existing power grid and discuss some solutions available. Companies in the power industry are becoming increasingly committed to reaching a sustainable future, sooner rather than later. This is also a priority for Hitachi Energy, so we invited Christian Cingolani along to talk about the solutions available to decarbonize the grid right now. Christian is an electrical engineer who also holds a master's in management.
He is the current sales and marketing manager for the European region at Hitachi Energy having worked in the company for over 25 years. As an engineer working in sales, he’s analytic and motivated by competition and KPIs. Welcome back to Power Pulse. I'm your host, Sam Dash, and today I'm speaking with Christian Cingolani, the marketing and sales manager for high voltage products in Europe.
Hi, Christian. Hi, Sam. So, Christian, I hear you lived for one month on an isolated island in Brazil with no electricity. Is that right? Yes. Have I heard that right? Yeah, that's right. This, I would say almost in another life. Tell me a little bit about that and if that experience impacted your choice to work in the energy industry. Yeah. That's a good question. Yes. This was, I would say, long time ago, more than 25 years ago.
Traveling in Brazil, I found together with some friends a very nice place, a nice island, quite isolated. And the idea was to spend some few days and then finally I stayed one month. Yeah. Definitely. It was a very nice experience. I still remember that month, and I would say, yeah, this part with the electricity and the energy and the easiness in the day to day life, yes, I think it has some impact.
I like how you seem to have experienced both ends of the spectrum, and probably a large area in between where you lived off the grid and now you're working quite intimately with the grid, right? Yes. And so you've come in from Sweden where you're based. Is that right? Yes. That's right. I'm based in Sweden. But you're originally from Argentina. What has this trajectory been like in more detail? How did you end up working with Hitachi Energy?
Yeah, well, around 25 years ago, I started in Hitachi Energy at that moment with previous company name. I like it very much from the beginning to work in that environment. Really from the beginning I saw that, let's say the potential of the electricity in the, let's say, energy matrix of the countries - ok, this really the future. And then like 20 years ago, I got the opportunity to spend some time in one of the main manufacturing areas, let's say, of Hitachi Energy. It was in Sweden.
Also, my plan was to be there two years and then it has been more than 20 now. Yeah, right. For family and so on. And then I established and I'm located in Sweden. Yeah. Which do you like more, Sweden or Argentina? Is it a hard comparison? It’s difficult, yes. Yeah. Yeah. You know you feel like part of both countries and both cultures. I come also from my family with quite international background; relatives, parents living in different countries and so on. Yeah. But yeah, difficult.
Yeah. So Christian, as I'm sure you're aware, this industry is not known to be the greenest, the energy industry. So tell me, how can high voltage equipment be sustainable? Thanks Sam for the question. I think I would start first by maybe clarifying a little about the concept about the life cycle assessment that we use nowadays a lot. Life cycle assessment, or LCA, is methodology that is accepted by the governments and the industry to measure the impact in the environment of our operations.
When we manufacture a product, for example, what's the carbon footprint from the moment we extract raw material, manufacture, transport, operate and even dispose equipment at the end of the lifetime? Right. One part for Hitachi Energy has been very important is that we need to keep the total carbon footprint at the lowest possible level. This means that we are not only talking about a change or replacing the SF6 gas with another gas.
We also need to keep the carbon footprint lowest possible level. And one important area in this LCA calculation is the total amount of material you have in your component. So to answer your question, Hitachi Energy’s strategy has been to replace the gas. At the same time, keep the size and the quantity of materials of the equipment to minimum possible. So nowadays our portfolio has the same or very similar footprint and size of equipment.
Yeah, I can imagine that's a big part of the puzzle is not increasing the amount of materials that you need, not increasing the scope of the project. Exactly, exactly. And this is connected, let’s say, also if we talk about the carbon footprint.
Now, just to go a little more in detail in this area, a carbon footprint is an index that is used in the energy, in the segment to measure the impact of greenhouse emissions that we have with any kind of operations, and also is usually reported in quantity of tons of CO2. So in this way you can compare what you are manufacturing, you are doing if you are not really increasing the quantity of CO2. Right. And so you just mentioned carbon footprint.
What carbon footprint does this equate to in your typical substation or SF6? Yeah. Well just to compare, you know, carbon footprint is an index that we use to compare a little greenhouse effect. Yeah. Of an operation or for a product; in the case of SF6, just to give a comparison, one kilogram of SF6 is equivalent to almost 24,000kg of CO2. Right. So the impact is quite high.
What we have done in Hitachi Energy with our EconiQ portfolio, we have found a way to replace this gas by other type of gases. But at the same time we are keeping the footprint, we are keeping the size and the quantity of material we have in the equipment. So in this way, really supporting our customers in this decarbonization journey.
So in the grids that currently exist, if there are no SF6 leaks, assuming in some perfect world there are no leaks, is SF6 still bad for the planet if it's completely contained? Yes, you're right, SF6 is contained in our equipment.
So in theory it’s not released to the atmosphere and also Hitachi Energy and in general, the industry has really developed very good solutions during the last year to really keep this gas sealed and contained, to really minimize the possibility of any emission to the atmosphere. But we need to remember that SF6, although is a very good gas from the electrical point of view, has a big disadvantage that is the GWP, the global warming potential.
So when you compare this with CO2, that is the most common greenhouse, SF6 has an equivalence of almost 25,000 compared with CO2. So even if it is contained, it's just much higher risk of something to be working with than say, some of the gases that are involved in the EconiQ portfolio. Is that right? Yes, that's right, that's right. And that, I would say that this in some way, the beauty of the EconiQ portfolio is this, that we have combined the possibility to remove the SF6.
These solutions are available today and we can help customers in their sustainability journey. At the same time, we have kept this footprint that we discussed before to the minimum possible level or carbon footprint to the lowest possible level. And has it been difficult to create that availability of the EconiQ portfolio? And is demand increasing more, and will that be difficult? Yes, definitely. I mean, this is the result of several years of R&D work in Hitachi Energy.
But nowadays we are having a, I would say, quite complete portfolio. It keeps growing. Yeah. So I believe this has been a long journey, but now we are coming with a good solution that is available today. So the possibility of removing SF6 exists today and without increasing the carbon footprint of the substations. Yeah. So you're matching demand and are at a place at Hitachi Energy where you're able to grow with this pattern of pushing for more sustainable solutions. Is that right?
Yes, definitely. And the demand is growing, I would say rapidly in several regions, Europe, North America and all around the world are becoming more and more demands for all these eco-efficient products. And this is where Hitachi Energy comes with a quite comprehensive portfolio. Today, we can develop products from 72 up to 420 kilovolts, soon up to 550 kilovolts. And we keep developing.
So the vision is to really have a complete EconiQ portfolio in the future where customers can choose depending on the type of application they want. Yeah, it's developing swiftly it sounds like. Yes. So, do different regions need different solutions in regards to sustainability? Can you tell me specifically what sustainable equipment is needed versus what is available? Yes, definitely.
I would say that this look for sustainable and eco-efficient products, products with a minimum possible carbon footprint is a megatrend that we see the whole planet nowadays. It is true that the different regions are moving or different countries are also moving at maybe a little different speeds. Could be maybe a different demands, but we believe that this a trend that came to stay.
So that's why we are developing portfolio to reach all these regions, different types of specification, customer demands, etc.. And in terms of the relationship with your customers, do you find that a lot of customers are coming to you, asking for you to help them decarbonize, or do you find that they're sort of back-footed and you're having to seek them out and try to convince them?
I would say that you can find a little different situations, but it's clear that customers are more and more interested, are coming with more and more questions, suggestions also to ask. Many customers they want to work together how to find different solutions to decarbonize. Because we are not talking only about the removal of the gas.
There are other areas where we can work together, minimize the footprint, the size that will at the same time, you know, reduce the carbon footprint in transportation, civil works and so on. So there are different ideas. Yeah. I wonder if you can talk more about that because we haven't heard as much about that aspect of things. We've heard about people talking at length about replacing SF6 with the EconiQ portfolio.
But what are those other areas that you mentioned where businesses can be more sustainable? Yes, I would say that if we talk about the important concept that is the life cycle assessment, that is where you can measure the impact, the carbon footprint, let's say, along the whole life span of equipment, since we extract raw material, manufacture, transport, operate and even dispose the equipment. Yeah. It's very important that we keep this carbon footprint as low as possible.
Yeah. So Hitachi Energy’s strategy has always been, ‘okay, we need to find a way to replace the gas. But we need to keep the size and the footprint as small as possible.’ So this is very important way to keep the product as a eco-efficient as possible; not to remove the gas, but then at the same time increase a lot of material used for the product. So when you say footprint you're talking about the carbon footprint.
So not only the size of the equipment, the land that the equipment is taking up, but also all the different aspects of servicing that equipment or getting those materials to create that equipment and sustain. Yes, that, that's right, that's right. So can you share with our listeners a sustainability success story that you've encountered lately? Yeah, definitely. There are now several nice stories.
For example, customers in the UK where we are together with them, we have implemented a solution called retrofill where we replace SF6 gas, but we keep the same equipment. The customer doesn't need to change the whole equipment. We change the gas, plus some small accessories. But the main part of the equipment remains. Yeah. And this is a very convenient way, let’s say, for customers to develop their sustainability strategy without the need to replace the whole switchgear.
That example of the United Kingdom, how long has that process taken from inception to being completed? Yeah, from the beginning until we managed to finalize, we say it took several months of work together with a customer. That's much shorter than I expected you to say, actually. Yes, yes. Of course you have the R&D process before when we developed the whole concept and so on. This took several years.
Yeah, yeah. The R&D. Then with the customer, once we identify the project, this retrofill, is not a solution we can apply for all types of products – it’s limited nowadays. But I believe it's a solution with huge potential. Now if we can help customers just replace the gas without replacing the whole switchgear, this is one. Are there any other instances that stand out as recent success stories? Yes. Let me bring another two examples.
One is in Denmark, where we see that all customers have basically switched into non-SF6 breakers. So nowadays we have more than 100 breakers installed in the country and they are basically moving out, let's say from the traditional SF6 and going hundred percent into eco-efficient products and live tank breakers. Yeah. The other good example, we have a customer in Germany. We are planning to deliver soon. I would say in a couple of months I would say the first 420 kilovolt EconiQ GIS substation.
And just sort of paint a visual for our listeners. What does that look like on the ground, you know, is there a fleet of trucks that bring this equipment in? Is it on a train? Do you fly it in? How big is it? Yes, in the case of Denmark, we are talking about relatively small products that are being sent by truck.
In the case of Germany, there we are talking really about a big substation will be in a building and we are talking about many trucks going from our factory in Switzerland to deliver the components to the customer in Germany. And helping to assemble it there in Germany. Is that right? Yes, going to be assembling in Germany, and we're going to do it together with the customer and to train them and also assemble and complete the whole installation.
Yes. So there are a lot of different components involved in one of these jobs. The travel, the training, the testing, etc.. Exactly. It's a quite complex substation and switchgear - 420 kilovolt, complete with all types of accessories. So yeah, very interesting and looking forward really for delivery and put into service this first 420 kilovolt GIS EconiQ. I'm looking forward to circling back to you and hearing how it goes. Very good.
We are very proud to be part of this journey together with our customer to deliver the eco-efficient product. And when you deliver a product like that, what goes into that delivery? Not just say in Germany, but all over the world from start to finish. If you painted a picture for our listeners, what does that look like? Is the equipment being delivered by trucks, by plane, by train? How big is it? How many people do you send along with this equipment?
Yeah, in the case of Germany, I would say it’s quite complex and complete switchgear equipment that will be installed inside the building. We are talking about several trucks leaving our facilities in Zurich, just some meters from here, going to Germany. Together with these, we send several specialists because it's not only the installation, it's about the training and the operation of the switchgear. So it's a complete team participating.
So in that case, you've had to send the equipment over, but also you've had to have training for how to use the equipment and you've had to test the equipment to see how well it works in that setting and that context. Is that right? That's right. Especially with the new technology, of course, the customer wants to do all this part of the work together and verify that everything is on site and in place. Right.
And for example, with your story about the UK or any other customers that come to mind, really, what's the most common obstacle or challenge you hear from customers in terms of what's getting in the way of them making this transition? It's a good question. I would say that during the last year, we saw more and more interest from customers to go into this eco-efficient production portfolio.
But during some time, it has been a little unclear with the regulations and laws on what's going to be allowed or not. Fortunately, now, recently, the European Union has released a regulation where clarifies already now what is allowed, how it’s going to be in the future handling of SF6, how the customers need to start moving into non-SF6 products. So this is really helping now because it has clarified and has really confirmed that EconiQ is the right solution for our customers. Right.
So that regulation has provided some focus and I imagine also some support - light a fire under everyone. Exactly, exactly. Well, thanks so much for joining us today, Christian. You've helped clarify the importance of reducing carbon emissions in daily operations based on society's need and in line with the strategies you described. Thank you Sam. You're welcome. Thanks for tuning in to this episode of Power Pulse. Until next time. And that's it for today.
We'll be back soon with some more great content. But, before you go, remember to give us a follow so you don't miss an episode. Thanks for tuning in. See you soon. This episode was brought to you by Hitachi Energy. Created and introduced by Bárbara Freitas-Daniels. Content and script writing by Cassandra Inay. Guest speaker, Christian Cingolani. Hosted by Sam Dash. Produced and edited by Creative Chimps.