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It's been five years since Disney remade its animated classic The Lion King as a photorealistic blockbuster complete with Beyonce songs. Now, led by director Barry Jenkins, The Lion King has a photorealistic prequel. complete with Lin-Manuel Miranda songs. I'm Aisha Harris. And I'm Stephen Thompson. Today we are talking about Mufasa the Lion King on Pop Culture Happy Hour from NPR.
Joining us today is journalist and author of We See Each Other, A Black Trans Journey Through TV and Film, Trayvell Anderson. Hey, Trayvell. Hi, hi, hi. It is a pleasure to have you here. Also with us is culture writer and critic Shmira Ibrahim. Hi, Shmira. Hello, everyone. Always glad to be with you guys.
It is great to have everyone here. So the first Lion King came out in 1994 to colossal success. It won two Oscars, spawned a hit production on Broadway, even launched a pair of TV series. The film... tells the story, in case you are unfamiliar with The Lion King, of a young lion named Simba who gets caught in a power struggle between his father, Mufasa, and his conniving uncle, Scar. Five years ago, Disney released a remake of The Lion King, this time using digital...
animation so photorealistic, it's hard to even call it animated. The film was a massive worldwide hit, which leads us to Mufasa the Lion King. That's a new prequel in which several Lion King characters gather to hear the story of Mufasa's rise, as well as the origins of his rivalry with Scar. The voice cast is turned over quite a bit in just five years, Aaron Pierre takes over the role of Mufasa, Scar is now played by Kelvin Harrison Jr., and even...
Zazu has a new voice as John Oliver gives way to Preston Nyman. But a few familiar faces and voices return from the 2019 film, most loudly in the form of Timon and Pumbaa, who are still voiced by Billy Eichner and Seth Rogen, respectively. Lion King was directed by Barry Jenkins, whose previous film work includes Moonlight and If Beale Street Could Talk. Mufasa is in theaters now. Travell, I'm going to start with you. What did you think of Mufasa colon The Lion King?
Well, we should first say that I think the bar was pretty low. Fair. Let's set the table here. Let's be clear, okay? The bar was pretty low compared to the first one. The 2019 first one, not the 1994. Correct. Not the fabulously animated version that we all love from our childhoods on VHS. But the 2019 version. Many of the takes on that one was that it was soulless and lifeless. And for me, Mufasa the Lion King.
actually really worked, okay? I loved Barry Jenkins' little razzle-dazzle that I feel like he infused to the story. Lin-Manuel knows what he's doing with a song, okay? If you want to go far, we go together. So good so far, we go together. And I should know, I saw it in IMAX 3D. Oh, okay. So you were in the safari. I was. I was one of the characters. I was a lioness myself. And so that might have also influenced. I really enjoyed it. I left it, you know.
humming some of the songs. I cried twice. I really enjoyed it, Stephen. All right. How about you, Shamira? So, similar in the sense that... The bar was definitely low, right? I remember watching it in 2019 and feeling like, I think I'm watching Planet Earth. Very National Geographic. I will say I was pleasantly surprised by the work they put in in five years to make that sort of animation work.
look a bit more realistic. And when I say realistic, I mean, one of the things I struggled with in 2019 is that the humor and the emotion could not really be captured in the animal's faces quite well. Yes, yeah. That's a real flaw with the first. Yeah, I think that they really worked to find ways to bring character in the animations, which is a testament to the work they did. Lin-Manuel could write the hell out of a song. But for me...
I found that there were too many references to the 1994 film to a point that it was a little bit distracting. Oh, here's this callback. Here is this shot-for-shot recreation of something that we saw in the 90s, but it's supposed to be a... prequel so i guess this is supposed to be foreshadowing that i'm watching in 2024 right you know and it's like okay how many ways can we integrate the chords of circle of life right into a song right They call me.
We even open it with the Disney montage of the opening title screen with Pride Rock around it. It's like, okay, I get what we're doing here. I think the new things that they added... were interesting. I think that the excessive reliance on nostalgia was a little frustrating because I don't know how younger people will resonate with that. But I did generally enjoy myself. I wasn't mad that I watched the movie. I just wasn't elated. Shamira, were you just so glad to know how Rafiki got his stick?
Because this movie will tell you. As someone who is highly committed. to weird niche pieces of lore, that did not bother me. You know? Period, okay? How did this rock formation get exactly this way? I will say this. I do think... You can see Barry Jenkins touch on it. It's like multi-generational story of trauma and healing and Pan-Africanism all wrapped into a Disney bow. I get what they were going for it. I just wish that certain ways that they developed the plot would help sink.
those points a little better yeah how about you Aisha I always wanted a brother Stephen will you be my brother I always wanted a brother I always wanted a brother Just like you That has been stuck in my head for the last 18 hours, however long it's been since I saw this movie. I love that song. Look, I am a Disney person. I have been very... disappointed in the last several years after having this sort of return to form that we briefly had between Moana, Frozen, Coco.
Those were good times for Disney and music. And I'm so glad Lin-Manuel. I mean, granted... That means he wasn't involved with Moana 2, which we've already talked about on this show. And that movie suffered for it. But I'm glad he was involved here because this movie, I think, really soared.
because of the music for me. I agree with Shamira that the animation has definitely gotten better. I think especially the nighttime scenes looked really great. And there are a few underwater scenes that I just think are absolutely gorgeous. Yeah, to your point, Stephen, for the last 30 years since I saw that 1994 version as a child in the theaters, have I ever wondered how Rafiki got his walking stick, how Scar got his scar, and how Pride Rock became Pride Rock? No, I haven't.
And those were the things that had me rolling my eyes. But overall, the bar was low. I enjoyed this more than I thought. And I do think that... The only reason why I had any hopes that this might be good is because Barry Jenkins was involved.
And I feel the same way about this as I did about Barbie, where it's like you have Greta Gerwig, you have Barry Jenkins, like, you know, they're going to try and bring something more than what another director might do, even when they are going big blockbuster, whatever. It's quite interesting to see...
how this movie plays with an audience who may be less receptive to what it's trying to put down about, you know, fighting for each other and the Pan-Africanism that I feel is happening. We was lions, okay? When we were lions. It's fun, but again, mixed feelings. And Steven, I'm so curious to hear how this played for you. I think the bar was low and the ceiling. is low the ceiling for how much i could fully embrace a prequel to an unnecessary remake but technically
they're showing off and bless them for it. It is a gorgeous film to look at. There are so many Barry Jenkins-ian close-ups of... The lion's wet eyes, you know, that are just really beautifully rendered. I agree as much as I have dunked on Lin-Manuel Miranda and kind of the omnipresence of Lin-Manuel Miranda. The 1-2 of Moana 2 having lesser songs and this movie having more vibrant songs.
I take back every moment in which I've made fun of Lin-Manuel Miranda's tropes. You don't know what you've got till it's gone. You don't know what you've got till it's gone. He's such a talented songwriter. And there are several songs here that are not only catchy, but... tap into the mood and feel of the film in really effective ways. I will say...
One thing that hasn't come up yet. I had a conversation with our producer, Jessica, earlier today, and she referred to having, quote, CGI lion face blindness. And I cannot co-sign that point hard enough. I could not tell these freaking lions apart. Well, there were the white lions and then there were the not white lions. Oh, the white walker lions?
Okay. You could at least tell the good guy lions and bad guy lions apart because of the kind of silvery white fur of the bad guys. But scenes where it is really necessary for the one lion to be like. Yes, Mufasa. Because then I'm like, okay, that one's Mufasa. And I think that not only speaks to a little bit of a design flaw for as technically gorgeous as this film is, but it speaks to...
One of my central issues with this film, which is the voice casting. I was waiting for us to get into that. Yeah. We are now a couple of generations removed from the 1994 film. And obviously, James Earl Jones, who played Mufasa in both the 1994 film and... The 2019 film James Earl Jones Has Died was not available for this film. Robert Guillaume, who played Rafiki in the 1994 film, he has died and he's been replaced. We're now on our third scar. You have Jeremy Irons in the first...
You have Chiwetel Ejiofor, who brings kind of more of a menacing approach to the character in the 2019 film. And now he's played by Kelvin Harrison Jr. You're getting to the point with some of these things where it is... getting harder and harder to tell just based on voice what character you're even listening to. And I kept getting pulled out of the film because of that. I wonder, though, if that is... I think it's important to note, right, that how...
folks will respond to this movie is based on what we're bringing to it, right? Because I didn't have a problem differentiating the voices. Maybe that's because I'm more familiar with those voices, right? These are actors that I'm familiar with. I didn't have that issue of maybe this is also the IMAX 3D. You were in it.
When they're staring at me, I'm looking dead in their faces, right? But I do think that that CGI lion face blind, that was very much present in the 2019 version. And so maybe everybody just needs to re-see it again in 3D.
Step one, 3D. Step two, would it kill them to use name tags? The other thing I will say, I've said this before, but I try to go into movies for the most part as completely... unknowing as possible like I I had no idea Nico Noni Rose was in here playing Mufasa's mother and then Calvin Harrison Jr. who's American actor is doing a British accent and then Aaron Pierre who is
who is playing Mufasa, is a British actor doing an American accent. I'm familiar with these actors. Your ability to discern. But yeah, they didn't pop out for me. I mean, I know Anika Noni Rose out of nowhere. That's just me, though. That's very personal. I am ashamed that I did not recognize that afterwards. I kept trying to be like, I know this voice. And then, of course, I was like, of course, it's Tiana.
it's not a dream someday we'll go To your point, Aisha, about just the voice casting, I am so curious the thought process behind Barry Jenkins' casting because he essentially had accent swap, right, between... Aaron Pierre and Kelvin Harrison Jr. And I personally did find that despite the improvements in the film, like between 2019 and now, I... Thought that was a miscast. Like, Aaron has such a rich tenor to his voice, and it really comes out. And I think that him trying to focus on...
playing that nondescript American accent really limited his ability to really play around with his inflections because he's trying to keep kind of the cadence of intonation. Similarly for Kelvin Harrison, who's trying to do like this British received pronunciation. thing that kind of works you know but he's from New Orleans and you can
It definitely comes in and out sometimes. He was giving Oliver sometimes to me. I'm like, well, okay, I don't know. He's doing it the best way to do a posh accent, right? You can kind of just hear the cracks in it. Can we talk about... way this is framed. The Princess Bride style, gather around and I will tell you a tale. Yes, exactly. Princess Bride style. And as we've already mentioned, Billy Eichner and Seth Rogen are back. Simone and Purple are Albert and Costello.
Well, they're turning into Olaf from the Frozen movies. Thank you, Olaf. You are supposed to be the side dish. Not that they're the entire thing, but... Their whole bits are very much, they are the commentary they keep talking about. Why are we not in this story? All this meta stuff. All this meta stuff. And it felt like it was meant to be more for the children, which I guess is fine. But for me, I was just like, this is.
I'm not enjoying this. This is too much. Like one or two scenes maybe, but like we keep jumping in and out and in and out. I do wonder if it... plays that well for people who don't know the original text. There's so much... Who doesn't know the original text? Sorry. New people are born every day, Aisha. There's so many times they make references to things that happened in the 1994 movie, which I'm like, kids are...
watching this, they're probably not going to pick up on that, which is fine, I guess. Kids don't have to get everything, right? And speaking to, like, me and my media group chat, I guess, I'm just wondering what those moments are playing to, right? I don't know. I feel I'm obviously the only one who really liked anything about this.
That's okay. I don't mind being the lone wolf. It worked for me. I was like, oh yeah, that's the same thing that happened in the original one where he grabbed his hands and let him go. That happens multiple times, yeah. Those callbacks actually really worked for me as somebody who is, right, super familiar with the previous stories. And then I think we also have to note, right,
I don't want to say this is a kid's movie, but, you know, the idea, it's coming out during, you know, Christmas season for a reason, right? It's meant to be something multi-generational, right? And I feel like that is the goal of a movie like this.
on the point of the voice acting as you pointed out Steven we have three different scars it's like the evolution of the inflection but also it does play around with kind of some of the Culturally accepted canon of the character right people tend to accept that like the original scar is someone who is relatively queer-coded. Yes. You know, he's really saucy, really creamy, you know, really kind of condescending, but not in a...
Well, yes, in a malicious way, he's literally evil in the movie. But, like, in a very, very... But also playful. But also playful. Like, prepare for sensational news. Exactly. Like, really laconic. Not only did the way that they played Scar, just like... And the voice inflections totally changed for this movie. But also, they... ultimately kind of reject culturally accepted connotations by making the chorus story a love triangle.
I just find that curious because that's clearly an intentional choice. I don't think anybody who's over the age of 35 does not know the kind of commonly accepted view of like Scar as a queer person. Right. So I'm just wondering. Yeah. I didn't. feel any specifically strong way about it. But I think given the Disney of it all, given the hashtag in these times of it all.
Whether we should kind of sit with that a little bit about the choice to make this a triangle. But I think what's so interesting about this is because we get so much more of his backstory here and we learn that the reason he.
apparently became who he was is because his father, Obasi, who's played by Lenny James, is like... basically a toxic male lion who's like emotionally abusive he has an obsession with like eugenics he keeps talking about the bloodline the bloodline we have a podcast in 2024 so like he's pushing him to want to be king to secede him as king but like taka is like i'm not really that interested in this daddy like why are you
pushing me in this way. And I think it's interesting to trade the queer codedness for like this other version of Scar. I guess maybe it doesn't have to necessarily be another version, but it does feel like the line doesn't track. Right. And the way that you would expect it to, because you have that, which leads into the love triangle. I feel like there is a lot to unpack there with what I think Barry Jenkins and the entire movie is trying to say about like how.
evil men are formed and it feels very much of a time of like 2024 as opposed to just like coding him as queer Like we did in 1994. I don't know. I'm still trying to unpack this. I think that's a generous take on what's going on. I don't expect them... to necessarily write the character as queer, to kind of turn subtext into text. But I found having his heel turn be motivated by jealousy over a woman...
felt like kind of the least interesting possible origin story. To me, it was more than the turn being about jealousy over a woman. To me, this is a story about Black men. Okay? This is a story...
This is a story about Black men and Black fatherhood, okay? And you have a Black father telling his Black son, this is who you are supposed to be. That Black son is like, but that other... black boy over there who's getting to live with the women, who's getting to hunt, who's getting to learn all of these skills that I'm not getting to learn.
more interested over there. But the Black father's like, no, you got to do this. And over the course of the story, yes, there is this introduction of this love interest, but ultimately it's a realization. My father told me that I was supposed to be a certain kind of lion, and I'm actually not that kind of lion. We are seeing the character go through a number of realizations about, you know...
how I've been using a reference from Lotto on Netflix's Rhythm and Flow. I'm here for a lot of reference. And she keeps, it's a competition show, rapping competition show. And one of her ways of talking about authenticity, she says, it's not on you, it's in you. And for me, different men are figuring out how to navigate and deal with masculinity and what they've been told. The father spent the whole time lying on his back.
And he was happy with that. You know what I mean? Yeah. Especially because that's Barry Jenkins' like, right? Like it's... Black masculinity, the trauma that's passed down multi-generationally between black men, that is like literally how we've come to know him as an artist and as a director. So I do think...
Those were themes that they intentionally chose, right? I think two things can be true. I think they made that very intentional, directional choice. And I think it works for the most part. Although I think the core problem is that in the third act, at the point we get to the conflict, it doesn't really...
developed well we kind of jumped straight into the conflict after one quick scene and I think that should have been explained more but I also think that Disney intentionally shied away from queer topics because of two reasons one Because we've seen Disney's issues in Florida. I think that's been kind of very widely discussed. And two, because of...
the known industry fear of just dealing with backlash from fans on talking about issues around queer people, trans women, race-blind casting, and so on and so forth, right? So I think that is also a part of that conversation. But I do think Barry probably chose the best path forward.
to something that is true to him. And I think it works. I think you all make great points. And I agree that it didn't come out of nowhere for me. I do feel like it was built up to when he ultimately does turn on Mufasa. But I guess it comes down to, for me, what are we supposed to do with all of this new information? Does it actually make the original Lion King, the 1994 version, a richer text now that we know all of this? Does it have to?
It's something I struggle with just with the concept and the idea of a prequel. It's like I admire what Barry Jenkins is trying to do. Again, he is trying to elevate this and make this more complicated. It just doesn't, for me, make... the 1994 version and he...
feel any better. In fact, like, there's some things I just wish I didn't know. I don't need to know. You can act like you don't know. You can act like you ain't seen this movie and still, you know, love the original in the way it was. I agree with you, though. I don't think it... adds anything to the original text. But I also don't think it takes away anything. True. Right? I think it's another offering of, you know, this piece. We ain't never gonna see no other version of it.
Lion King like this. Okay? We ain't getting this ever again. Yes. All right. We want to know what you think about Mufasa the Lion King. Find us on Facebook at Facebook.com slash PCHH and on Letterboxd at Letterboxd.com slash NPR Pop Culture. We'll have a link in our episode description. Up next, what is making us happy this week?
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It's cuffing season, the cold months where we might look for a warm somebody to cuddle up to. But dating isn't always warm and fuzzy. And this year, there were so many big debates about how we love. On It's Been a Minute, our Coughing Season series will help you answer some big questions like, what is the ick really about? Or is it okay to date for money? To find out, listen now to the It's Been a Minute podcast from NPR.
After the election, the economy feels like one big, huh? Good thing there's the Indicator for Planet Money podcast. We take a different economic topic from the news every day and break it down in under 10 minutes. Topics like the home building shortage or the post-election crypto rally. Listen to the Indicated from Planet Money podcast from NPR and turn that into an ah. When it came out in 1843.
A Christmas Carol was a sensation. And Charles Dickens became a legend. Some people would consider him the originator of Christmas or the inventor of Christmas. The past, present, and future of Charles Dickens' A Christmas Carol. Listen to Thuline wherever you get your podcasts. Now it's time for our favorite segment of this week and every week, what's making us happy this week.
Trayvall, what's making you happy this week? So I have a song recommendation. It's a song from Sade that she released recently. Oh, everybody knows it. I love this. Speaking of Young Lions.
Yes. The name of the song is Young Lion. It is a song that she released sort of as an apology to her trans son, apologizing for not being the most affirming that she perhaps... could have been as his parent is part of this compilation of songs that came out by an AIDS organization that wanted to bring attention. to trans awareness. And so I think folks should check it out. The song is called Young Lion by Sade, and it's available to stream everywhere.
Thank you, Travell. Shamira Ibrahim, what's making you happy this week? So I am taking my talents over to TikTok. And there's this great account. by this young screenwriter based out of Compton. I think his name is James. I'm assuming because the TikTok account is James Earl 333. And... I see Shrevelle already nodding. You already know what's up, right? And he has been slowly building out this universe of just...
Really explaining like the nuances of having a complicated big black family and all the nuances that come with that. So it started with a viral story of two twin aunts that were throwing a birthday party, broke up and were throwing two competing birthday parties at the same day.
one on a boat and one in the backyard of their family house. It has since expanded to this rich text of family lore. So enthralling, but it's also, it's entertaining, obviously, but what I really love about it, to be quite honest.
is that I think sometimes we talk about black families, it's always this like really binary examination of like working class black families or upper class black families and like a very firm distinction. And what his storytelling really shows that a lot of the average black families are like all that at once.
all interact. They all connect. They all try to find things. So I recommend the TikTok account. It's James0333. James is a great storyteller. Wonderful. Thank you, Shamira. Ayesha Harris, what's making you happy this week? Well, the legend, Dick. Van Dyke has been all over the place lately. He recently turned 99. He appeared in a Coldplay video for a song called All My Love. I never thought I would actually enjoy a Coldplay video, but here I was.
has led me to start a rewatch of the Dick Van Dyke show. I love this show. It's one of those shows that I grew up watching and have since gone back several times to revisit. Although I don't know if I've ever. actually seen it all the way through. It's a good show. Newsflash. Newsflash. Of course, this is the show where he plays Rob Petrie, a...
TV show writer. His wife is Laura, played by Mary Tyler Moore. It's just fun. It reminds me that Dick Van Dyke was the most limber. Did he have bones? I don't know. You can't tell. So, yeah, the Dick Van Dyke show is what's making me happy this week. And you can find it streaming in a lot of places, including Peacock and Prime Video. Nice. Thank you, Aisha Harris. Vigorously co-signed. I, too, grew up with that show and just love it.
So in the last month or so, I've embarked on a mission to completely... overhaul my experience with holiday music. And if you, like me, desperately want new holiday music instead of the same cardboard garbage every year, one of my favorite new Christmas songs in ages just dropped a few weeks ago. one of my favorite singers, Maddie Diaz, and it's called Kid on Christmas. This year when I wish I could just feel like a kid on Christmas.
Look, I will say this every year for the rest of my life. If your holiday song is telling me to be happy, I will be sad. If your holiday song leaves space for me to feel a little bummed out, I will feel better. I will wholeheartedly embrace the spirit of the season. This song to me does that.
Again, that's Kid on Christmas by the great Matty Diaz, and that's what's making me happy this week. If you want links for what we recommended, plus some more recommendations, sign up for our newsletter at npr.org slash popculturenewsletter. Brings us to the end of our show. Shamira Ibrahim, Trayvall Anderson, Aisha Harris, thanks so much for being here. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. This episode was produced by Liz Metzger and Lennon Sherburn and edited by Jessica Reedy and Mike Katzen.
Thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from NPR. I'm Stephen Thompson, and we will see you all next week. Since the beginning of women's sports, there's been a struggle to define who qualifies for the women's category. Tested, from NPR's Embedded podcast and CBC, takes you inside that struggle. Listen to Tested, the series that was named one of the 10 best podcasts of 2024 by Apple, Vulture, and the New York Times. It's season 20 of NPR's Embedded podcast.
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