Thank you for listening to Depictions Media Radio. Welcome to Policy and Rights, the show about Welcome to Policy and human Rights. Welcome back to Policy and Race. Here in Depictions Media Radio, I'm your host, Michael Cloggs. I'm going to share with you a conversation that I had with a friend who actually resides in Bay Road. He was born there, he grew up there, and he is now
watching his beautiful country being tore part by war. Of course, having lived there as many years as he has, he has also watched different factions of warlords and civil war also affect his country as a child. Sam Ra Ballon is a filmmaker who makes documentaries. As a matter of fact, is how we first met was on a documentary shoot where we were recording an economic conference that was supposed to bring about a new economy UH for for people that would that would join all the people around the
world in a spectacular way. We heard a lot of ideas and to this date it has been a struggle to actually find a way so that everyone can have equality, not only financially but also politically. So that is the the hopes and in ideas of uh Samer Sammer's documentaries and the work that he does, and one of the
reasons why he recorded a young lady. At the time when he first met her, Mariam was twelve years old, and we're speaking about her now nine years later because of what is happening in Lebanon today, that the Israeli Defense Force has crossed the borders in an invasion into Lebanon, and they're saying that, of course their goal is to stop the Hasbalah and to stop others, the others from
trying to harm their country. And as a result, whenever there is a war, and you're gonna hear Samra say this also that it is civilian population, not the combatants, that pay the highest price. It is the civilian population that takes the blunt force of military actions and this particular war, even though there are rules of engagement that say not the tax Savilian sites and not to attack civilians at all while those rules are in place, while
in combat those rules may be ignored. So we're gonna hear I'm going to share with you this com rotation I had with him just a couple of days ago, as he's trying to himself find an exit strategy out and also help Mariam find an exit strategy for herself.
So why don't we listen in on what Salmon and I talked about, and as we talk about the war in Lebanon between the Lebanese government and the Israeli government, and as we talk about other issues and tools that are used around the world under the guise of hatred. So I'm here today with with Samura Bayoun and he's actually in Beirute right right now, trying to You're trying to exit to what is it the United Kingdom or France?
Is it?
Well?
Uh, my my closest friend and I are looking for a legal way too, uh leave Lebanon permanently. I have a Canadian passport, she does not. Uh, So we're looking for the best option to just leave the country.
Yeah. Yeah, and that that seems like a wise decision at the at this point, m So, I mean, this this wasn't wasn't happening in a vacuum. This was could have been foreseen, couldn't it. Well if relad deciding to cross the border and send troops.
Well yeah, we we We've been going through uh, various collapses or whatever you want to call them, for the past five years. It started with the with the economic collapse in twenty nine and towards the end of twenty nineteen, and then was followed up with the you know, the COVID lockdown and the Beaute explosion of August four, twenty twenty. And you know, we all this time, we just kept on saying, you know, we'll just bear it out and bear it out. Eventually things will get better. And things
don't get better than October seven happened. And you know, we we thought it was just going to be a limited thing. And here we are a year later. There's really invaded Lebanon, and you know, things are a lot worse, much much worse. We're the Lebanon. Most of Lebanon is being bought. The South is not livable anymore. It's more than one million refugees in the south, and these little Beanese refugees. We're not counting the Syrian refugees or the
Palestinian refugees back from the fourties. So yeah, uh.
So, And because because they rooted itself is a big city, you know, it's not uh, some small town or something like that. So I guess everybody's trying to get to uh to be rooted for that reason.
Well, the Bay Route, yes, it is a big city, but there are other places where refugees are going. Uh as far north as a B which is like almost near Bay, that's really far north. There are a lot of communities that have sprung out throughout the route, uh, you know, from here, not just in their roots, is what I mean. Where they're helping out with the refugees, providing food, some even providing shelter. But you know, resources are already stretched because we're in the economic disaster here
to begin with. And uh yeah, so we're helping out as much as we can.
But yeah, yeah, yeah, because uh, I know, the the United Nations and the who have have had maybe not so much in in we're in Beirut specifically, but I know in Lebanon they've they've had had outlets there to help people because of because of the economic collapse and everything, and then and then the explosion at the Port of Favor Grace mm hm so but it at this point though, I mean, they're talking about all they started, they've up
started UNIFIL and all that kind of stuff. But how do you have a peacekeeping mission if another country is just outright attack.
UNIFILL mostly are there as observers. They can't much interfere militarily on either side. Uh. They're there to observe that the whatever resolutions like seventeen oh one and the other resolutions are implemented, and to provide assistance when they can, but they pretty much have their hands tied. They can't do much of anything.
Yeah. Yeah, yes, I mean, well, well both both countries are you in nations, But it's it's like, well, i mean, how do you how do you say you're going to do have a peacekeeping mission when one country is just outrighty being attacked and the other one is is doing the attacking. It's like it seemed like the politically the solutions are being put forth are forgetting that the real people involved.
Yeah. Absolutely, But that's true of any time of any war that happens, or any kind of aggression that happens. It's the civilians that usually ends up paying the price either way. And this signds no exception. The toll is especially high on the liber East side because we don't have any kind of advanced systems to defend against missiles or airplanes, or we don't even have an anti you know,
anti anti aircraft protection system. It's non existent there. So yeah, we're we're like, how how should I best put it? Like the attacker is extreme severior superior force, like disproportional superior force. When it comes to you know, what's happening on the.
Right, he's focusing all, well, the Hesbala has has all these arms and are they are they truly organized enough to to defend to defend Lebanon if that if that's where they they were the the effective army, you know.
Well, they're not an effective army. They're not an army. They're they're not an official army. It's what I should say. They are a militia, like many different militias that existed during the Civil War hesball and specifically was born out of the Ammal movement. The movement was a movement at least when it started as part you know, before the Civil War and the movement to you know, you know, empower the disenfranchised southerners of Lebanon who happened to be
mostly Muslims, uh. And you know, then the Civil War happened and everything went to hell, and all the political parties became militias that participated in the war along with the warlords, you know, the head of their parties, who are now, by the way, our current leaders, our current elite, are politicians. Habana was an offshoot of Amman and it only came into existence after the Israeli invasion of Lebanon and specific in Deir Routes all the which they hut in nineteen eighty two.
Yeah, so they're not really a governing party at all.
No, we are divided amongst eighteen different sects, and each sect has one or two of its own political parties, and they're always they're sometimes at odds with each other, but in essence they're all in cahoots with each other. And you know, because of how corrupt they are already in their warlords, how less corrupt that teach or work warlords or whatever. So they've been robbing the public resources or at least dividing them among themselves and their cronies.
And this is one of the reasons why we've we've reached this economic collapse in twenty nineteen. And you know, husband as part of all.
Of that, and it was one of their storage storage units or whatever that may have initiated the the ammonium nitrate that was at the at the port.
Well it's not per se there storage festility. It's more it's a storage facility at the port. There are several parties that are in charge of the port and the several you know of the cronies of the political parties that have been a benefiting a lot from the port, of the records, of the books kind of thing, you know, money, bribes, whatever.
So uh, I prefer looking at the facts as they are and in in my view, the port explosion, this whole fiasco, this whole mess is just a it's just the result of that corruption and you know, compounded negligence and incompetence of the people that have been that are running the place. Uh. Yeah, so because because if if we I can't see with the facts that this can be blamed on one party and you know, none of the can be absorbed of this tragedy because they're all guilty.
They all had a hand, they all knew about it, nobody did anything about it.
Yeah, you shared with me a video of of of a young girl. You you have a probable exit out of out of the country. What about the people like her? They don't have a way out? And you know what, how how do how do they actually find help in safety in all well.
Well to to talk a bit about Madam first, Madam used to be what is what that she was? She's still alive, but she was a flower, young flower cellar in the streets of Hana. She's a refugee from Syria. She has no documentation, no no league to travel papers, specify or even to that effect, identity papers because they fled Syria when she was young and she doesn't happen.
And at the age of twelve, she was selling flowers on streets of Beirut and everybody knew her in the streets, and you know, when it came time I wanted to do something about refugees, I found her and we had a conversation and we shot the Spittal documentary and it was all about her hopes and aspirations for the future. One of her aspirations was to go back to school. I tried my best to help her get back to school, but that didn't work out because there's no funding. Nobody
will take her because she's undocumented. YadA, YadA, YadA. I mean there's a lot of corruption there as well. We talk about all the aid money that comes in from the United Nations and the international community for the Syrian refugees. A lot of that money is pocketed by the same politicians.
Politicians I mentioned earlier. I heard at that time people telling me, oh, but you know, the United Nations is paying for them, and all the children can go to schools, but you know they don't want to be fact is that only fifty percent of children had enough funding to go to schools. Yes, there's a proportion of them that don't want to go to school. Their parents won't let them go to school because they're benefiting from them in the sense that they're child labor. Put it blunky, as
it's the case with Maram. But she had her family had the will to actually they wanted her to go and get educated. But Maram's story is I mean, there's more to it than that. We shot this documentary in twenty seventeen. She was twelve at the time, and two years later I wrote a script and my students we shot another film with her at this time, a film,
not a documentary because abandoned. It's about the citizens a very gender biased citizenship citizens law in Lebanon which prevents women who marry any foreigner to pass on their citizenship to their children or their husbands. This law was put in place mostly because a portion of the Lebanese population feared that this will upset the balance of the sectarian communities and thus the balance of power. So obviously, naturally they go after the women. If a woman marries another man,
that means that's it. You know, she has a follow the man's religion. So it's okay for impermissible for men in this country to marry foreign women, but you know, and pass on their citizenship and not for women. Ah. The reason we chose Madam for this part is because at the end of the documentary she says that one of her wish is become an actress if she ever
gets to Canada. Canada does not on the on the table at the moment or since then, you know, for various reasons, because she's undocumented, that there's no way to take her out anywhere. That said, you know, coming to now, there's a harrowing story about Maramus I we'll talk about in a bit later, but I like to answer your
question first. I mean the fifteenth if I if I remember the correct number, the fifteenth Amendment or clause of the article of the United United Nations Universal Declaration of Universal Human Rights stipulates that people should you know, humans have the right to move about anywhere they like, right within the borders of the country. And it does say,
you know, change one country to another. But that is not the case because of the visa system, especially Western visa system, which let's say, favors people of the same in a type or color of skin or background, let's say, and not Arabs, not people of Asia. And it's much harder for someone let's say from Lebanon or East Asia to get a visa to Europe or the United States
or Canada. So there there's a bit of maybe uh uh, inadvertent racism that happens there, but it's prevent so in my in my opinion, this is a documentary that I will be working on at some point, but you know, trying to show how this entire system of visas, uh, the way it's structured, the way it discriminates, is a violation of human rights. So even even even in the Denese person with the Libanes passport can't easily see my
friend that I told you about. She can't just go with me anywhere right now, I my can Egan password, I can travel anywhere I want, and I turned down. I haven't signed up for the evacuation order, you know, for the evacuation process that's happening right now for Knadians because I can't leave her and I can't leave my mom alone here. I can't take them with me, right So that leaves us with trying to find a means to do this more legally, which is why you know
we're aiming for in the UK or maybe Portugal. We're studying the matter, We're consulting with immigration experts and all that. Madam, on the other hand, has new favorites. She has no passport, she has as if she does an e so she she can't go apply for a visa to begin with. Uh, you know, she can't go back to Syria to get her documentation.
You know.
You know, the situation where is not pleasant either for Syrians who escaped there, although a lot of them are going back now and there's some class It depends on which side of the sense you were on, you know when this sold the bacles started in Materia. But Madam's
story run deeper than that. I mean, she was here as a child back in twenty sixteen, she was twelve years old, and eventually I lost contact with her in twenty twenty when the pandemic happened, and it so happened that a few weeks ago we finally reconnected by coincidence, and it was a good thing that we did, because we sat down and she told me what had happened
in the past few years. So apparently she at some point during the pandemic she went and reported her father for sexual abuse and he was sent to prison for three is not more than that. I mean, after he got out, he was deported, but then he came back into Lebanon and issued a lot of threats to her. So the family, her brother and others in her family decided to marry her off because you know, then she'll
be under the protection quote unquote of another man. And you know, she she got bailed as well, because that's part of the whole thing. And you know, she doesn't necessarily like the veil, not doesn't agree with it, but she accepts it because you know, she has to maintain that within the community. So theoretically speaking, she's protected from her father because she's married now, she's nineteen. She got married two years ago.
Right.
So, yeah, so there's that happening. She is hiding from her father and you know, if he does finally he might do who knows what he do. Yeah, so's that added to the story. And I've spoken with her and I've talked and she is a very wilful and strong young lady who you know, uh, wants to get out of this community that she is in because she understands that the only hope she has too self actualize herself and her dreams is to be away from the community and away from the family and to make it out
on her own. And that's why I'm looking in two ways in which, you know, see if anybody is willing to help her, right.
Well, I know we we shared the first piece she did on her on her I spent honestly, I spent most of the of a day just sharing with people in hopes of trying to find somebody who will be willing to step up and help and help her because she has. You just expanded on what was already a pretty amazing story about an amazing person. But I want to go back to a second there because one of the things with the US election, the idea of allowing immigrants into the United States who are from Arabic countries
has been politicized there by either side. It doesn't matter which side of you of people are going to vote rather a Democrat or Republican, both of them are public are politicizing the idea of allowing people into the country and what types of people should we allow into the country. And that doesn't seem to be overt racism. That seems to be pretty out there and upfront. Uh, if you're an Arab, we're just going to be racist.
Towardia unless you have money and lots of it.
Yeah, exactly. Uh, which rolls out a lot of a lot of the Lebanese people.
Right, Yeah, pretty much. H So the Libaneses can be resourceful, but yeah, I mean pretty much. It puts the Lebanese into that category, especially now because you know, there's this war with Israel and you know, sort of suddenly everybody in eleven on the terrorists.
Right, That's exactly what. There was a a post on x that actually said, alway, is that why we have so many so many terrorists in our country? And you had both Canadians and Americans timing and on on that one. Yeah, but I'm hopeful that at least you will find your your yourself will find a way along with with your family, you know too, to save grounds.
So h again, I mean it's easy for me to leave any moment I want, because as long as the airport is open that is, can even passports. But yeah, not PTOM, Yeah.
Yeah yeah, but how do you how do you kind of how do you leave loved ones behind like that? Right?
Mm hmm. I mean I'd like to go back to something that happened when I was living in Canada, when Stephen Harper was Prime Minister back then. You know, he put a moratorium on sponsoring parents to come over, you know, to integrate parents of immigrants. So there's a for me, that's just another layer of the racism that exists in the system integration process.
Yeah, as far as the racism is concerned, it doesn't matter which political part, and it doesn't matter the the the country for that matter, because Republicans and the Democrats, they they find equal number of ways to block people from from either moving about the country or or coming into the country, you.
Know, statistically speak uh and you know, according to research and studies and whatnot, and influx of immigrants is very vital for the economy.
Yes, I know where I'm actually sitting right now in British Columbia, that the municipality itself is trying to get more immigration in because they want to grow the municipality into a metropolis.
Mm hmm.
And then you hear the grumblings of people that, oh, they let these criminal types into my neighborhood, and it just simply means, let's put it this way. I live and I live in an upscale neighborhood myself, and I was out walking around the beach one night and I got stopped by the police. What are you doing here? Then I lived here, It's like, yeah, it's like profiling.
It's like it's like, oh, and I don't know if it was it was another neighbor who just saw a person with with colors or your skin walking walking along the beach and they decided to call the police, or if it was just somebody the cop itself became himself with just driving past and said, why is that dark skinned person walking along my beach? I don't know what, but profiling and uh, And both countries are are pretty good. Because I have resident I'm able to reside in either country.
On that on that topic, uh, I mean, I've studied the issue of migrant communities and how let me let me paint the picture, because there are a lot of parallels with the Native Americans, how they're being treated they are the indigenous community, and how you know, other people like constins for example in Israel or even in Abanon. So you you allow, in the case of North America, for example, you allow these immigrants come in and you know,
at first date, what are they going to do? You know, some of them are lucky enough to have a job, right, it's wonderful, but they start at the very bottom. That's unless unless they're really build engineers or something. Or I'm not going to say doctors because I know in Quebec, for instance, unless you're certified from Quebec, you cannot be a doctor. So a lot of doctors end up working as taxi drivers. Right, So economically they're restricted in maybe
not overkely or directly or anything like that. So what what else can they do other than you know, live in similar communities and help each other out. And and from that because of the oppression, because of the uh inequality, social and economic inequalities. Uh it is only natural for these communities to resort to crime quote unquote or band together and form massias. I mean, we've heard about the Italian mafia, the Hyasian mafia, degree mafia, the whatever mafia.
Of all these different communities, they're they're they're called after a certain people's name, like the you know, nationality for a reason, and those those reasons are well documented and studied. And you know there in the case of Palestinians, and I'm going to use the example of Lebanon because I know more about it. Uh. And I'll draw the parallel
here with indigenous communities in North America. Uh. Pat Palestines were kicked out of Palestine in the nineteen forties and they some of them came to Lebanon and then they were put in camps and not given any rights. They're not allowed to work, they're not given work permits. A lot of stuff happened under the table. Yes, right, great.
They're not allowed to purchase property. They're supposedly only allowed to live in the encampment, but you know, some of them do, especially those with money who get out and do other things. But they are restricted restrictions. I mean, put a people like that for we're talking about the forties, right, it's more than fifty years now. These people still live in camps in really ugly conditions. They're open sewers. There's a lot of population density in these camps because fifty
years they've populated, they've grown right as a population. Ah. So my point being, you know, when you treat people like animals long enough, and you know, call them animals and warn't about them all the time, and you deny them their rights and you know, completely oppress them, what expect them to do in the right.
Yeah, good point. Let me ask you this because because we're we're we we are officially talking about Israel and and Lebanon in the Middle East. So and I will tell everybody listening that if you look hard enough, that you actually can find the United Nations footage news footage of UH people being interviewed as they were being forced
forced out of of Palestine and into areas like Lebanon. Uh. They can say the Samber talking about and you and some of them, the people interviewed, they're saying, they're saying, oh, well, we hope to be able to return back to their home in Palestine. And one of the porters did ask the question will they ever be allowed to return? He say, oh, no, they're going forever. This is this is now becoming a Jewish state, which leads me to the whole colonialism thing.
I mean, it's it seems as though when they created, when the UN created Israel, that that they have somehow or another perfected this whole colonialism thing. That leading back to fourteen ninety two again that they've perfected this this thing and they just forced people, force one one group of people out and put another group of people in, as.
Happened in North America prior other places as well.
So it's is this is this ongoing thing that Israel has a right to defend itself as a country. Are they trying to expand their borders?
Well with with how they keep letting settlers encroach on the West Bank and you know they haven't been doing that in Lada because of security reasons, but you know they're taking over much more land. And these these settlements are many of them are illegal and internashionally they're illegal, yet they're being allowed. We in Lebanon, at least on beside Lebanese side, there's always this thing where we know that you know Israel wants more of our soil and
the water from the New Townian River. I think there are some interviews with some Israeli that kind of point to that as well. I mean, at this point, more than fifty sixty years, that past Israel exists. It's a reality. To be pregnatic, it exists. Uh, there's there's no way you know that, you bet. I do not advocate, for example, the reverse of what's what's happened what happened to the Palestinians just to kicking out israelis to make room for the Palestinians.
No, No, I don't think you need ever say that.
No, but uh, Israel at this point, Yes, when they say they have a right to defend themselves, I agree with that, mm hmm. But you know, uh, the best way for them to for you know, defend themselves is to make things and to resolve the issue of the Palestinians. And two, yeah, you know he can't, uh, you know, keep beating everybody around you with your superior weaponry and all of that, and then when they fire something back
at your or stand up for themselves. Not that I in any forum or shape agree with the tactics or or the you know, the entity for example, I do not agree with the tactics or ways of doing things in anything.
October seventh. Should should not have.
Had no, I should not ever that was that was the real most stupid thing. Yeah.
Anyway, and and and the two hundred missiles being fired. I guess it was a week.
Ago, uh on Tuesday from it?
Yeah, tes Tuesday. Yeah, you know, No, that's not advocating for peace either.
Yeah. I keep hearing this. We we're firing all these weapons, but you know, we don't want to work, Like, Okay, what are those things falling on us? You know what what does that indicate to us? You know, the suburbs of their are are completely demolished, that's talking. You know that they they like entire blocks at this point where there used to be building. There's nothing but rubbles at this point. And you know, they don't want to walk. But either side, you know, I mean I can't I
can't speak for the other side. But in any event, Uh, what's happening right now, in my opinion, is just uh, the patriarchal societies of the region are just you know, in a the same competition. That's the best way I can put it. I mean, here is not any who. At the United Nations General Assembly, the Lepan side had secured even what he called an agreement for sease fire, and apparently he indicated that he was for that as well. And then suddenly he goes up on the po and declares,
you know, we're never going to stop. We're going to keep on bombing. When they bomb, they collapse six buildings. They bomb the hell out of six buildings. That's the only time I actually heard the bombs from where I was living. They're that's strong. They collapsed six buildings. Just to get the head of whoa how many people were living in those buildings? They say, okay, Hasballa using cibilians
as human shields. But the last time I checked the you knew that convention doesn't say that if they're they are siblings being used as shields, then you can shoot at them.
Right. It doesn't say that at all, you know. And of course, yeah, there was another question to the Israeli you and ambassador to to the United Nations, is like, are they going to roll out targeting nuclear sites in Iran? And they won't answer that question. Mm hmm. But you say you don't want a war. You don't want mass destruction.
You know that's a scary fault.
Yeah, it's it's it's we like you and I were were, we're filmmakers, we're podcasters and advocates for human rights, and we we're like but all you, the rest of you big government people are are are advocating by your actions, we want more war mm hmm.
And there's as doubts. Uh, there are other dimensions to this as well, uh you, other than the human factor, the human cost, the human civilian cost. Because I really don't care about the fighters or the leaders on any side, because they all collectively brought us to the situation here where you know, we have a humanitarian crisis and so on and so forth. But here's talk about bombing arounds oil facilities as well, not just nuclear ones. We'll forbid that they do the kind of fallout we'll get if
they do bomb the nuclear sites. But you know, I'm thinking, Okay, in the past few years, every year has been declared the woman's fear ever on date. We have a climate crisis on hand, and here they are for what reason other than you know, oh, look at us, we're strong. We're going to bomb each other's oil facilities and burn more oil and you know, increase the carbon outside uh emissions around the world. And yeah, we want peace on
both sides. They both threaten each other that they go after each other as well.
So yeah, that's that's that That isn't a excellent point. You know, we we have.
All these Yeah, ineftably, the entire world is uh, it's going to be the victim of this world.
In your mind, we could be some of the solutions. I mean, since we're we're at this, why don't we try to solve the world's problems in one podcast?
Right? Well, I think first and foremost, all nations should clamp down on their weapons manufacturers, the companies corporations that manufacturer weapons and you know, make a profit out of selling them to other places. Uh. The only outcome of such a business is to make war and in order for them to make more profit. So that that is
the first thing that I that comes to mind. The other thing that comes to mind is, you know, stop beings or nations to stop being so uptight about you know, visa control and security and you know it more security. Then maybe maybe make any I mean, the solution to all our problems is all our problems are at hand, They're available. You know, it's just the will to end poverty, to end hunger, to I know, I sound like a hippy at this point, but you know, honestly, the solutions
are there. It's just nobody wants to take that action because oh the economy, oh my political base, you know, you know all of that. It's this capitalist structure that
has imprisoned our mind into thinking. You know, there's no way of operating or or or or functioning as economies other than you know, being benefiting from more or in the case of the United States, for example, the privatized prison system, which you know, these these these are corporations that are profiting from crime by you know, uh let's you know, they won't make any profit if there's no crime and people are not going to jail. Yeah, uh uh.
You know, I'd like for the world nations, especially the Western nations, to stop paying lip service to you know, just for political points and electoral games, uh to you know, lip service to the environment or human human rights. I mean, yeah, we can talk about how abusive uh So the Iranian, Afghani and Chinese regions are in terms of human rights abuses.
I do not discount that at all, but maybe they should look in the Western countries should also look in the mirror and see where they are going wrong as well. I mean they're not Yes, they're better in many ways, but they're not completely absolved of being human rights violators. And one of one of those systems is the visa system, in my opinion, one of the great human rights travesty.
Yeah. Yeah, I don't think there's any any country there is completely absolved of human rights violations in one way or another. It's it's not the absolution, it's the willingness to to work towards fixing the problems that we're all seen as equal. Mm hmm, yeah, excellent, all excellent points. And I do wish you a safe exit out and I hope that your young friend I have. Of course,
I keep butchering her name Marion. Actually, yeah, it is something it's something about about the the you uh you having the the the accent of the region versus my American accent.
I like everybody usually butchers my name too, so that's it's it's a given. But you know, I want to go back. You know what the name Maron actually means in Arabic, it means aspiration. Well, yeah not, this is what this girl has.
Lady, A lot of the beautiful name to give give a person, you know, m hmm yeah yeah. So I wish you well and and well we will stay very closely in touch. And my hope is is that we uh that we find another documentary to do together, because that was how we first met. The show has been produced by Depictions Media. Please contact us at depictions dot media for more information.