Law Abiding Citizen

Welcome to the podcast everybody, I am your host James, it's another sick ep of Polarize Pod, we're on a revenge tangent this time around, it's law abiding citizen, you clicked on the episode, you know what the deal is, last week we did Punisher, the week before was unhinged, these men are ANGRY and they are getting their vengeance, on the world at large in their minds it seems like, um, and this movie, let me get those numbies for ya,

look at me, I don't even have those numbies, it's 26% by the critics, it's 75% by the audience, you know what that means, it's polarizing baby, we talk about polarizing movies, I gotta bring that up, what this whole shindig is about, what this whole system is built on man, is about those numbies, and there's these two sides that disagree with each other on every single movie that we talk about, it's those audiences, it's those critics, we talk

about the movies that they disagree on the most, sometimes audiences love it or critics hate it or vice versa, they're always disagreeing and we try to parse it out, we try to litigate if you will, all in code, all within the code of the polarized law, that we, the kings of the polarized kingdom lay down, and it's enough, enough of me, this is not a solo act, this is a two piece, much like this movie, but whether me and my co-host disagree or not

is yet to be seen or heard, but let me bring him in, he's uh, he's getting his, taking his shackles off right now, he's uh, he's coming in and uh, I got his nice steak on the, his $75 steak on the table here and his mac and cheese, asparagus, seem asparagus, and he's uh, he's ready to go, he is the great brandini!

Yeah, yeah, yeah, here I am, ready to talk to those numbies, talk law abiding citizen, talk to hander, we got a Jerry B episode again, really close to our last Jerry B episode, so I'm pumped to be here, I'm pumped to talk about this, this whole series of- Another F Gary Gray movie too! Yeah, I was thinking about like our, so like crossovers in this movie to what we've done, so we've done an F Gary Gray before, because we did Men in Black International? Correct. Right, your favorite. My favorite!

Give me more Pawnee! Yeah, give me more Pawnee! I have it, I have it on, you gave me a Pawnee, uh, what do you call those things? Pop, doll, I don't know, neither one of us are really collectors of them, I think they're called like pop. I kept it in the box for a bit, and I was like, that's what you do right? You keep it in the box, and then after a while I was like, I don't want this box, I want to play with it! Yeah, right, get, yeah, you gotta pull it out.

Get this box out of here, get this goddamn box out of here. Get this pop doll, whatever it's called. And so yeah, he's chilling, he's over there somewhere. My favorite character in film. Yeah, we know this about you. Your favorite character. I wonder how I would feel about revisiting, I don't think I ever will. Yeah, I have no relishments. I'm curious if I was in a bad mood.

There's certain movies that you wonder, you're like, oh, I kind of like this now, maybe I was in a bad mood, but there's something about Pawnee's face that just like kind of drives me insane. The pop doll is cute though, but I remember his face in the movie being upsetting and annoying overall. Well, cause and also too, the movie did that thing that I think you would agree that we'd both hate is where it like tries to be self referential and be like, isn't it so cool that we're doing this?

Or, you know, let us introduce your new favorite character X, Y, and Z. And you're like, who's that? Like forced in comic relief and just that, just comic relief. He has some bullshit arc, but he like, it's pretty much at the end of every scene. He's like, well, that just happened. Hashtag random. Yes. Hashtag random for sure. What a great, yeah, absolutely. Oh, I mean, it's cool when you hear it like in a lethal weapon or something like I'm getting too old for this shit. I don't know.

So there's like, there's cool ways to do, we're Bond movie fans. Like there's, we should know when, when there's a one liner that works or doesn't. And I think, yeah, Punisher was full of it last week. I'm curious. I'm just jumping all out. And I'm wondering at the end of this, we should, we should rank our movies that we've done throughout our for the revenge series of ours. For sure. Yeah. I agree. We shouldn't.

Yeah. This whole series is fascinating because now it's like the tropes are really dialed in, right? Like now it's easy to expect between Punisher and this one. I mean, it's, it's the beginning itself is identical in some ways. Right. It kind of makes the whole crux of it all. The first thing, right?

Yeah. And it really does make unhinged you more like unhinged uniqueness really is starting to come out because yeah, the Punisher this, and I don't know about the next movie, which is called revenge, how that's going to be. But yeah, next week. Sorry. I forgot. Great. Fantastic. Yeah. So we're finishing off our series next week with aptly with a movie called revenge. Excellent. I know nothing about that movie.

I was thinking even like the few that we watched, the difference with unhinged is that the movie language itself was telling you that this is a bad fucking dude and we should not in any way like him or, you know, if you are, there's some people that we, we saw reviews of that were empathizing with him so hard that they thought that he, I don't know, he's borderline in the right or like, you know, kind of just, yeah, it's the main character

like, yeah, he's just kind of, but it's, I think those are more like rare, rare opinions in what the movie language itself is telling you is like, this guy is like, yeah, uh, a slap. It's like a slap, a monster. This guy is a monster. But in this one and well, the Punisher is a hero in that movie. Uh, he's taken out, he's just classic sense of the vigilante, the term vigilante and he's just taking, taking swift justice on his own and eating sardines with a knife and drinking bourbon wild turkey.

Um, but this one is, it's just interesting that interesting is a good word for this movie. Yes, it is interesting. Thank you. And just like how it feels about Jerry, old Jerry Butler and his character is like, is he really quite a rollercoaster? I know he's the bad guy, but does the movie know that he's at certain points? Cause it's like, yeah, get it. Like it's the music that's playing and shit. Like sometimes it's like, is bad ass.

Yeah. Oh my God. They're cause he's, he's so like ahead of everybody. So he's like, he's the more intelligent character. He all of his, his motivation really, it isn't until like, I would say the like middle ish half of the second act where he starts like actually killing people that didn't need to be killed. Right. Maybe it's like, yeah, it's like around there, like middle of the second act, right? Cause like before that it was, he was killing bad guys. Right.

So it's pretty much a Punisher's sense of, of motivation, but his methods, especially the first guy. Cause you're talking about the first guy as you know, whatever your, whatever your opinions about if someone deserves, someone deserves to die or not. And there's a public, there's the, I mean, there's the execution scene as well, lethal injection. So it's like, we don't even have to get into that, but like the methodology, we can, we can. This movie would want us to, wouldn't it?

I know when the fucking pieces are. The, the methodology at which he does it is fucking brutal and intensely like, yeah, like to the point where it's, it's seven, but as if, you know, you saw Kevin Spacey the whole time and it played like some rock music or something occasionally, you're like, huh? And it's, I, it's cause it's got some, it got some, it's got some like wanting to be almost like a Fincher thriller sort of vibe. Oh yeah.

Very like, or, um, Nolan asked to, I'm at odds with that a little, a little bit. Cause it's truly horrific. A lot of the things that happened in this movie and it's far more like horrifying. A lot of the totally very gruesome stuff. And it, yeah, and it, it's so, it's so weird to start the movie and it is very clearly like he is a victim of a kill of his, like he's the victim and he's getting justice, but very quickly it goes, Oh, but this is how he gets justice. Wait a minute.

This is not a good guy. And then, you know, also too, there's just all these little things start getting, yeah, no, not even little things because right off the bat. Yeah. It just seems like, Oh, this guy's really fucked up and crazy. Like we got to watch out for him and doesn't make sense. Like yeah, I, it is so weird to think about the killings that do happen in this by Jordan. Um, and like the order of it seems like kind of like off.

Like that, like, you know, kind of P putting it like chopping this guy up into pieces should have been like a, I don't know. Should we, should I got east into it a little bit? Yeah, that was not, that was like a real introduction to the new Jerry B Clyde or whatever his name is I should know.

Um, yeah, who we didn't really even get to know at all 10 years prior aside from a, you know, bringing you into an extremely, you know, well, first it's a, it's a, you know, a naturally, uh, a scene that any, any natural family could relate to where you, you got your child making a bracelet and you're doing a little sovereign. You know, it's, it's what they do. That's a tinkerer. He's a tinkerer. Right. He's teaching his daughter to tinker.

They're tinkering and then it goes south really fucking quick. And so the tinkering, like I didn't pay too much mind to it because I was like, oh, he's just like a handy guy. Like he's a handy dad and you know, he's like doing kind of like crafts with his daughter. But then you start to realize like who Jerry B is.

And then you're like, oh, that's why he's tinkering is because he's like this crazy, crazy undercover spy agent guy that revealed to me was really like wild, but at least it kind of validated how like methodical and complex right off the bat, his murder spree is like, you know, 10 years to prepare. I appreciated that time jump honestly. Me too. Because, because that to the benefit of the plot to his character, you don't really understand.

Don't get what that means and what it takes, but at least it's better than the Punisher where it's like he gets shot and then he washes up on a beach and then the montage happens of him like creating a car and getting guns and then you just get it. But this was like 10 years has passed. So who knows who this guy is anymore? Yeah. And what he's been festering on. Right. Oh, God. Yeah. It's such a weird. This is such a weird movie. Like the movie, it's so like, it's stereotypical.

It's so stereotypic, like stereotypical, like off the bat of like this perfect idyllic family that's just having, you know, this blissful moment night and at home. And then they all just get rounded up and murdered brutally. Like, and then what does, what does he say? Slow knife stabs. And both of them. And then you, I mean, thank God you don't see anything with the kid besides the kid being taken away, but you can't fight fate, which is high.

Yeah. Just very, very deep to, I mean, I guess this may, that's, that's his thing that he says to people as he, as he kills them. This guy is like the worst guy you have to like make the person that he's about to dismember and torture in the most heinous way, the worst dude to even feel any sort of like, oh, he's doing the right thing here. Cause if it's anything less than that, then it's, you know, the, I'd be a lot harder for people to, I'm not even on board. I'm not on board.

Like you just know, even the worst person does not deserve a fate as that is, that has given that. I don't know if that's a hot take or not, but I'm sure there's some reviews of people that just love this movie. They're like this mother fuck. And yeah, he fucking killed a child. I understand, but it's, uh, yeah. And murdered his wife. Like, and yeah, did it. And he was going to rape her too. Um, yeah. But I mean, that's shocking how quickly we got into that. That is the cold open.

Yeah. Like we're in minute three and it is family murder stabbing situation. Yeah. And it's, yeah, it really, I was like, Whoa, okay. Buckle up. We're, we're shooting off like a rocket in this movie. And you know, F Gary gray, like is, I'm starting to get a sense of his style now. Cause I've seen no fair amount of his movies and yeah, the guy is really such a like action stylistic, you know, all like a kind of, yeah.

Michael Bay ish like ask, um, you know, some interest in like a lot of camera swings, um, a lot of like establishing shots that are moving relatively quickly. Um, man, and visually in this movie, like the Philadelphia stuff at that as a character, I was consistently blown away by this, like the rooms that they were in and whatnot because they just were insane rooms. Like every room seemed to be enormous, like a giant cavernous place. Every almost everywhere that they go.

It was like a lot of court, courtrooms and kind of like the like very official places and even like, yeah, that table at the end I'm thinking of is, is, was very ornate that whole room of like, Oh, it's the top brass meeting on this floor in this war room of sorts. That's like, Holy shit, Philadelphia, like shit's shit's getting real or is yeah. Or maybe it's just like the, it's from the beginning of America. It's from when that table was made or some shit. Which is a long time for us.

Okay. We're a little baby country. It's a long time. We're a baby country, but it is one of the oldest cities in America. And yeah, it like, it shows because there's so much like European and like Roman influence in the architecture where yeah, there's just these, a lot of columns, uh, these big ornate buildings with statues on it. And really, really honed in on that one statue. I'm not sure who that is. I should, I know. Yeah. I should know too. The guy with the hat on top of it.

Yeah. I was like, Oh, look at that guy. That guy's cool. And he just sits on, he just seems so high up to like that guy. And the, yeah, that statue is like above like skyscrapers. It looked like an RGO. I immediately had to find out where the city was because it just was, it had so much like character to it because we got like, you know, there's abandoned warehouse buildings, a lot of stuff on the street, a lot of like shots of Jamie Fox walking around the courthouse and the courtroom.

And then also to man that room where Jerry B is like meeting Jamie again to like do that negotiations and stuff. It's like this massive cage room. That was enormous. And that was really blown away for me. That was like, why is this guy so, I don't know. I was like, what is this room? This is a cage match of interrogations for this thing to exist. And what was outside of it? Nothing. It was just this, yeah, big empty and just a cage and then like bars on that. I'm outside of that.

And it felt like Magneto should be inside of that or something. That's what I'm saying. Or like that room that dude, yes. Like there's so much Michael or not Michael Bay. There's so much Christopher Nolan kind of stuff like that, where, yeah, that room reminded me of like in Dark Knight or Dark Knight Rises, like Dark Knight Rises where Scarecrow is like the judge and juror and he's in that room. And it's like this fucking enormous courtroom. And it's just like where I can't remember.

There's like shit that's just stacked up to the ceiling. And it's just so crazy to conceptualize a room that is that large. Yeah, it's a lot of like leather and wood and it feel things like feel important or like the stature seems elevated a bit just being. Yeah. And those are I and I'm this cool conversation because I didn't really even fully resonate with that when I watch it. But now I am. And that's that's that's great.

And yeah, you met I mean, you mentioned F Gary Gray and that's somebody that I guess I didn't fully that didn't resonate with me watching as I watched it. And I realized what he directed after. And yeah, I think it's kind of like hit or miss with me. Like there are certain movies that I with him that I really enjoy.

And in like the Italian job, especially where I feel like it's it's honing in on this momentum that I think he tries to strive for in my mind, looking at his movies where there is a real energy from scene to scene that I think does work overall in his career. When I look at his his body of work and yeah, and he did a lot of music videos as well. And that's just like a lot of a lot of people. Yeah, like a lot of people. Michael Bay included, right?

We talked about that big movie or music video guy. Yeah. So yeah, it's it's got a lot. It's a lot of momentum. I'm glad that you brought that up because this movie is not slow. Trying to think of it because I feel like there was yes, there was a part in particular that really like this movie moves.

Yeah. Yeah. It's the part where OK, but one part in particular, I really it stood out to me because I'm like, I feel like the plot just came to a screeching halt when Jamie Foxx and his like lawyer friend, I don't know what her like where she sits and and things like, you know, obviously they had that moment where they're like, who's going to take this case?

And this whole time he's just bitching and moaning about and making a point like I don't take cases that I don't win and we heard about his fucking 98 percent win rate. I know you think you mean beat up, beat up. Right. Like, OK, yeah, Jamie. But they're like talking and she's. Getting to anybody saying like a lot of people are now dying. It has this is this really worth it? And like making him realize like you have a family, I have a family.

There's all these people that's lives are at stake and the more you push at this, the more he's going to fight back, obviously, because he's shown that that's what he's all about. And they just have this like very slow kind of meditative moment. And I'm like, wait, why are we having this moment now? Like almost towards like this like really close to the very end of the second act. Like, yeah, ramping up to be like crazy going off.

It does pick up again because the cars start exploding and that that whole scene is really something else because. Oh, yeah. That too. There's a fucking robot. He's got a robot. The robot. Oh, my God. Who's controlling this thing? Who is his associate? What is it? It's like a stamper from House of Cards talks about how, yeah, he'd like that. Yeah, that that part and reveal again of him being this like crazy super secret agent. Was really shocking because there's nothing in the movie.

At least maybe I might have missed it, but like nothing talked about him being like this is what he's always been. Because we were just like, you know, to your point of like having the 10 years, like there's just an assumption of like, OK, so he is planning in those 10 years, this whole thing. And it kind of made me think of like, OK, maybe he's like mechanically inclined because we saw him working on the soldering shit and he's just had a lot of time to figure all of this stuff out.

But yeah, it was so weird to then find out like, oh, but he's like kind of always been doing this and which was yeah, it was just kind of a weird thing to just turn to the dark to put all that energy towards this one thing for 10 years feasibly is he and he rearranged all of his whole life just to prove this point. And that's where it runs into the problem of reverse engineering. Some of those things to work in his benefit, which exactly was speaking of the dark night.

You know, that's what people have criticized some of the Joker stuff in that movie about how would he have known some some of these things were going to happen or skyfall. I was. Yeah, I was going to say that. That's the other way. Well, is that that's the one where like the train comes like blows? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I was thinking of that one as well. There's all these doors that have to open in order for Silva to like get like change costumes, move to another place.

And then stuff is also like happening simultaneously for a bunch of people in order for them to get to a particular location where they meet their demise. And like, yeah, I don't know. It's. It's so. Oh, yeah. Reverse engineering is a great use of that because they are like that.

I mean, or description keeps you in the palm palm of your of their hands when that stuff works well and you are it's it's such like a fine line to try to cross or like saying, you know, just staying in that pocket of being able to keep the audience guessing, but have them know just enough to to care what's going to happen next. And I in some ways, this movie does that really well. Yeah, and I and I see why people like it for that reason, because there is constantly one.

He's always one step ahead. You're wondering what he's going to do next. There's something that they're always kind of questioning with him of like and they react like, oh, we'll put him into Max security and go, oh, that's just what he wants. That's just what he wants. And that that kind of stuff is satisfying.

It's just again, my my beginning point and my kind of issue with this movie is kind of the language about it and how it views Jerry Butler and doing all of this stuff as as interesting as it is and as and for that matter, like Silence of the Lambs in a lot of ways is something that this this movie is kind of trying to be like. And yeah, like Anthony Hopkins in that in a lot of ways is like an interesting character. But in no ways like, are you like on his animal lector's side? Never.

You're amused with him. You're entertained with his sick fuck attitude and how he handles certain things because he is so like high class, but he still feels this does these fucked up things in this in this way. And so that juxtaposition of those two things is fascinating. But I think there's this weird thing with Jerry Butler in this movie where it's like the movie is like, yeah, you want to see you want to see this fucking child murderer get chopped up into little bits.

And you like I'm glad you don't see everything, but you get really close to like the the the tip of the knife, like a razor blade to the penis actions. Right. But it's also really bizarre to how he they juxtaposed the chopping up of the body and then the recital back and forth. I was really shocked. That was unsettling. Really? That's the those are the two things that are like. Yeah, either at opposite spectrums or like, but have similarities. It was so weird.

The language I was being used there or like what it's trying to say by saying like. This recital him missing the recital. And that's another thing I really want to dig in with you. I'm going to take a break on the back to back because you get it. But oh, no, I was I was just going to say that before we move on to anything. But yeah, I was trying to figure out like, are they just saying this is happening at the same time? Is this the only parallel?

And then when they open the curtains at the same time for both, I was like, oh, they're trying to say this is the same somehow of like conducting an execution, conducting a recital. It's like, oh, and I imagine like in the editing bay or whatever, they're just kind of like, yeah, this is so good right now. Like we got the music, which is diegetic to what's going on with execution in a way if we if we juxtapose it together.

And the guy that's like orchestrating the whole execution and yeah, that was but continue to do your next. Oh, it was it was mind blowing to me as well and did not work in the way that I thought they wanted to for me. Yes. Yeah, totally. The so that OK, this concept has happened a lot in and some of the movies that we've done, you know, because we've talked like it.

It happens and hook, I guess, you know, but the concept to me of a father missing a six, thirty, seven o'clock recital, you know, probably like middle of the week, whatever, because he's so wrapped up in work is a very weird concept to me because. If you were like you have a job and.

In reality, I guess is what I should say is you can schedule to go to your daughter's recital at seven o'clock on a Wednesday like your especially if you're a lawyer, like the courts are for sure done at five o'clock like that's, you know, since it's a government thing, like there's a like hard stop on like litigation happening after a certain period of time.

And every time like there's so many movies that do this where it's like, oh, this father so like wrapped up in work, Jim Carrey and Liar Liar, Jim Carrey and Liar Liar. And it's so the boss is ready to be heard that you just it just now comes off so like corny and not unrealistic that a guy whose daughter has a recital can't pencil in an hour and a half like at night to go to a recital.

And then also to then then that like set me off on a track of like him being involved in so much stuff in this movie to where like he's an attorney. Oh my God. He always bringing that up to the first one. Like crime scene. And he's like involved in every fucking thing like he's always in the car. I just put in my notes, Jamie Foxx is so involved. Exclamation point. He's like every step of the way, there's like not even people that are like responsible for doing certain things.

It's just he is there. He's just there doing all of it. And at no point is like, man, I really got to go see my family there. He's just like, hey, guys, what do we do? I mean, yeah, we're getting in this car and driving to this place and we're going to go check out this thing. And it's it's almost like he was a detective. Oh, yeah. He's an attorney lumped it together. And the guy that was with him, who I like that actor, but he called me.

Yeah, he was just kind of utilitarian and not like he could have served a much bigger purpose as the detective finding these things out and reporting to him as he's, you know, trying to spend time with his family. But he's I guess it just it shows how much of an asshole he really is that he's not going to be there. But it's such a tried and true stereotype of missing the recital that it's it blows my mind that even in what is this, 2009, this movie came out.

Yeah. Like even then, that that kind of stuff is like, yeah, so family dies. Father misses daughters recital. Like I don't know, just all those things are just a sinew of stereotypes to to apply to this thing. But, you know, the the the mono E. Mono nature of it is really what him being there for everything caters to.

But when we're talking about the cage match, which is kind of like, I guess, one of the iconic scenes of this movie, because we stumbled upon YouTube, where it's like five million views, just the interrogation scene or whatever the them. But at that point, you're like, OK, so I guess he's right. You see, representing him.

It would have been nice, it would have been nice to have like, like there was just barely one conversation, I think, between him and his kind of like mentor guy, whatever he was about him. He's like, OK, I'm going to go for it, whatever. But like, there could have been more attention of like, fuck, like why? Like do I have to be the one that's going to do this right now? Like, yeah, if any of you would need a lawyer to deal with this shit like he should. I don't know. I don't know.

I'm no expert. I'm no expert either. But I'm just a law abiding citizen. I think it's that kind of stuff that I lean towards the critics that talk about the absurdist nature of this movie, because when you when you think about this just a little bit, it starts to fall apart of like, yeah, why isn't there more people involved in this story that are like, that's their job?

Like, yeah, why isn't there more of a detective that is like more present, more active in the story that is like finding out all of the stuff that Jerry B is like kind of set up in the world? And then also to yeah, that's such a good point of like. Jamie Foxx is an attorney. Why is he doing the things that he's doing? Because yeah, what is he? Who is he representing? He like, I guess the state, but like, that's not really how that becomes a D.A. later.

Like he's just pursuing it in such a way that he's chasing down leads like he's the there when Jerry B gets arrested, like he shows up and see and see some whole whole hog arrested. That's that's he's like he's like, this is all part of my plan. I'm going down naked. Right. Yeah, he writes that down. He's like, I'm going to get totally nude for this part. But he shows up for that.

And there's like plenty of other instances where it's just there would have been a conversation before or some sort of tension built up of like, hey, man, like, I shouldn't be a part. I should be witness protection with my family. Like what else do you need for me? Like I'm a witness in a lot of ways because I represented him previously and I can give you information, but I should get the fuck out of here too and go witness protection with with my family and get out of here.

But he just takes the onus. And then the and then the detectives themselves are so distant in this movie that for a period of time, I was convinced that they were on Jerry B's payroll somehow. Right. I was like, not doing anything. Yeah, they were just they were following whatever Jamie Foxx. At first, they kind of had that like is or I don't know, the FBI, they were the FBI. They're like, yeah, fuck you. We know we're doing that. By the end, they're like, what should we do next, Jamie Foxx?

We don't know what to do. And then they find the tunnels and yeah, but yeah, none of that makes any fucking sense. Like, yeah, I mean, there's a momentum, like obviously, it's Jamie Foxx, like and and you know, you know, he's the second lead in this movie or the lead in the movie. And so you want him there.

But yeah, it just really, yeah, suffer speaking from if you think about what's going on even a little, you're like, oh, this doesn't make any sense why he would be doing the things that he's doing. So interesting. Yeah. And then we talked about the opening. We talked about the interrogation like his his issue. And like, do we want to talk about anything like anything like what his actual issue is with with everything and like why he wants to bring the whole system down? Oh, we got it.

Yeah. I mean, the main the yeah, I mean, the main guy who did everything is getting off for like because some of some DNA, it's like a DNA fuck up, like it was an inclusive DNA sample or something like that. So this one guy's DNA was for sure didn't actually do the slow stabbing and the murders itself was was an accomplice. I don't know. I don't know a lot of the terminology, but he's going to be the one that's going to be done. So and he gets executed later on.

And then the guy who actually did all this can get like five years for kind of whatever, like informing kind of. And he's like, this is their best deal. If we want to pursue it further than it could, none of them could get any justice or any any punishment or any any any sort of time. And so Jerry B is naturally emotional and upset about it because he watched it all happen and we all watch it happen.

And then he sees Jamie Foxx shake the hand of the of the of the dude that did the dirty, the real dirty, the worst thing like you could possibly do. He's like the worst guy in the world is this guy. And yeah. And why did he have to take that picture? Why did he do? Oh, no, you're you're my cut out. Oh, you got too excited. Did my my my cut out, didn't it? Yeah, yeah. I was OK. I I do a lot of hand gestures. I smacked the wire away from as long as you can hear me again. That's good.

Why did they take that picture is my question. Like why is that picture even a thing? Why would he why would he shake that guy's hand and take a picture? Why would there be like a photo op for that? Right. Absolutely. No sense. And why Jamie Foxx as a lawyer would agree to that? Like it's the game. He fucking says it makes zero sense. I mean, the language of the movie is saying that Jamie Foxx is part of the system. All he cares about is his own like name.

He only is he's doing whatever it takes to just win cases, whether it's the right thing or the wrong thing to do. And then that is like the foundation of like the you know what the thesis of this movie is that the justice system doesn't work for people. It works for. Yeah, it works. Against people, really. Like it doesn't care about people, I guess, is bureaucratic bullshit. That's like a it's a it's a it's a swamp and Jerry B is going to clean it out.

And it's all you got to go through these yellow this yellow tape to be able to get anything done. You got to buy by whatever this this fucked up system is. And he gets he sees from afar the picture. Ten years pass by. He harnesses that rage and propels it forward. During the execution, he mangles the. Except the like serum. Make it even worse than before. And we have this it's going to be a certain order. And then I think it like went in the wrong order or something like that. Right.

He was so vague. Honestly, he like at one point he's he just said he's like, I just made it more or like I did it spicier or some. I don't know. Yeah. Some some bullshit line where he's just like, yeah, I just made it worse. But we talked about this right before we started recording of like that's and when that scene was playing out during a shit over saddle.

It was like my mind my mind was just thinking this just seems like from my from what I know of of executions and and lethal injection lethal injections is this is kind of the reaction and a big fucking issue of of even the idea of you know, yeah, of capital punishment and like it's actually people and this what was perceived on film seemed almost like an actual accurate portrayal of what from my knowledge is what actually happens to people when they

insufferate and not only that, but it actually doesn't even work fucking sometimes and and and like, come on. Oh my god. Right. Which is so funny because then that is supposed to be like a clear like it's a clear indication or it's supposed to be a clear indication that something wrong happened. So we should be like, oh, what's going on? But yeah, I too was like, yeah, isn't this like kind of how it goes? I don't know. Like what is what it almost illustrated of like, it's gruesome.

Yeah, but you guys decided to go again, miss your daughter's recital to go watch this guy get executed. Like, why you don't need to be there? There's no requirement for you to be there. Because he's not. What is he's the prosecutor? He does. Does he need to be there as a pro? Like and then he sees the defendant or whatever that guy like buried alive later. It's like, is that incumbent? Like I don't we I just whatever. I don't know.

But it's it just it seemed like in within the movie language, it would even it would have just made sense as it played out normally. And him not having no involvement in it was unnecessary because it was kind of like, oh, this guy is taking the fall because of this. This system man within what the movie is telling me is like, oh, this system is not even pretty portraying the truth where this guy probably should have gotten maybe five years because he didn't agree. He wanted to just rob.

Not just it's awful. But he as far as like the guy that told him to stop raping her. Right. I think was that guy right? He was telling you know, he was telling he was he was implicit in all and so whatever whatever you feel about it. Yeah, he's so bad. It was it was switched around almost where this and then maybe Jerry B wanted all of them to fucking get to stand and he just wanted them all all done. So, so wherever you lie on that.

But within what it was saying, it's like, oh, for this guy to get even a worse punishment or like to be to take the fall for this other guy is kind of fucked up in its own way. And the fact that somebody who witnessed it and saw in front of the very eyes can't express that to other people, the jury or whoever the judge and and everyone there in the courtroom and have that make sense and be truthful and have the proper measures be taken.

You get that frustration from Jerry B. But again, his methodology and everything he does after is we've already talked a lot about the I mean, the dismemberment scene is fucking insane.

And the way that he gets there is, you know, it's kind of the Italian job of it all where like that kind of stuff is kind of like, oh, it's like thinking one step ahead and this guy is always in and these, you know, these con men or these robbers or something are always got something up their sleeve to be able to and he's kind of represents that too.

And in a horrifying way, but to the movie, it kind of seems like, yes, sometimes it's kind of like this is what you want people and the same with the Punisher is just like, yeah, you want to see these awful people like it fucked up, get tortured. Yeah. This is a torture porn. Yeah. Oh, dude, for sure.

Yeah. And then, you know, we start getting into, you know, the plan, Jerry B's plan takes off once, you know, at this point that we're talking about really like from the execution on Jerry B's plan is an action and really he is like systematically killing everybody who was involved with the killing of his family. And that also includes like the judge, a lot of death. Yeah. Yeah. And everybody involved like, yeah, the prosecutors, the judge, the cell phone explosion to the head.

Oh, my God. Brutal. I was. Yeah, that was very shocking because it just comes out of nowhere. Like, yeah, there's not. And it's like, it's fucking brutal. And it is very much like post 9 11 kind of weaponry and someone who feasibly like his character was in that war and knows about, yes, maybe cell phone bombs and he's a tinkerer and he's Jerry rigged this robot thing to do his dirty work as well.

But there's like from from that portion on, it's just like death, like crazed murder, death and then reaction to that and then Jamie Foxx coming to him and being like, what the fuck? And then him being like, well, give me this and I'll give you that. And then he gives him that and he's like, oh, it was too late. And then it's kind of like that that back and forth through this chunk, the middle chunk of the movie.

Yeah. I mean, the bulk of the movie is that it is very much somebody getting killed, then Jamie coming to Jerry B being like, tell me where who's next getting killed. You know, we're going to lock you up. But, you know, give us information about what your plan is, whatever. And then, yeah, he gets like the bed. There's that thing. You know, he also it's man that scene to where he's going to get post like bail posted. Oh, my God. He starts reading the judge.

And then that was so wild because he like makes a very clear case. The judge is like, I'm actually inclined to be like, yeah, I'm on board with this. What you're saying is totally true. And then he just like fucking braids her. And then she's like, no, you know, no bail and moves on. And then, yeah, you got that whole porterhouse from the restaurant and you got to get the asparagus and him eating the asparagus. Oh, my God. Oh, it just is like a slow like crunching on it.

And then there's also a lot of like hand like eating, eating meat with their hands in prison. It's so disgusting. It was something up there with it was like a toilet. They're like dismembered in this. But you know what still stands is them eating with their hands. And it's just like a lot of like sloppy and this so many just had shit. Oh, it's just a total. Nobody's using that spork, man. He's yeah, I guess. I know. Yeah, right. And the spork bit.

And then, yeah, you like quickly realize the reason that he ordered the porterhouse is because it's got a bone in it. And then he uses that bone to kill, I guess. So that would be the third guy that was involved because there's three guys that killed his family and was so he wasn't even involved. It was just a means to get to maximum security. Oh, right. I think it was random. You think you just that was that's just another pawn in his game.

No, no, no. I mean, if anything, I think that's what a character like said that. And that is oh, gotcha. No, yeah, I thought the other day, so it was like it was purposeful, like why that guy was with him for some reason for a second, too. But yeah, the rant that seemed too random as well. There had to have been a reason. And I believe it was just to get to maximum security where he had all of his tunnel network locked in. Oh, yeah. Yeah. The little prison toilet door. Yeah. Crazy.

This whole yeah, that's a reveal. I mean, that's that was what do you think of that reveal of him being his own accomplice? I mean, again, like we're so this movie for me oscillates between like that kind of stuff is has like a level of like not fun seems like a weird word to use in this. But like entertaining, like, you know, action packed, like exciting, whatever. And yeah, so there's a oscillate between that.

And then, you know, because he's got this very intricate tunnel network that he's got going on with all these like little rooms that he had. It was almost like like like an anthill. He's got like all these like they kind of like go off into all these places. It was like some texts like just sitting there and right for whatever. And it almost made it look like a doomsday, a proper thing, which is why I said there was like, oh, he's got the supplies. He's been building up for 10 years.

Which was from some industry that I think that's where the screeching halt happened for me was when he goes to the library to look up all the records of industrial properties bought and sold within Philadelphia. Totally. And he's like comparing the numbers between that and whatever it was. Right. It was trying to plus that up so much of like the records, the industrial property record. We got to find and it's like, I'm sure that's plenty of what lawyers have to do.

And I'm better calls all is great. And there's there's actually not what lawyers do. That is what like a lesser legal student like paralegals do because paralegals are about getting all the information and then compiling it. And then a lawyer is going to go through the process. Fox does it all, man. He's so involved. You got to get those hands dirty. I mean, we talked about he just he literally becomes D.A. He can do everything. It's so indicative of who Jamie is as a person.

The guy can do everything. And that's true. And in this movie, he does literally everything. Yes, every single part of this like the situation. And every single one. Oh, yes. The opening one. Yeah, totally. Did you know, Brandon? And this is something that I theorize as I was watching it of like, hey, this would be pretty good if they switch switch roles, they switch parts. That is actually how it was originally cast. Oh, interesting. Yeah. OK.

I was crying for me because I was like, I could see the boat like them playing each other's parts. And I guess later on, I figured out that Jerry B was like, like, Lauren, I don't know if he went to law school or if he was interested in becoming a lawyer at some point, too. And he produced the movie and it's whatever M.D.B. trivia was inconclusive about like whose idea was it of them switching parts. But it was originally the other way around. I thought that's really fun.

And it was like another movie like that I saw recently. However many years of longing, three thousand years of long is that? Oh, yeah. Yeah. The blank check guys are listening to them and they were saying how like maybe someone else had brought this up to how that could have been switched. They could have switched those roles about like till the Swinton being the genie and instead of Idris Elba and I could totally could have worked as well.

Oh, my God. I love thinking about that shit like departed or something. You know, I don't know. Right. Yeah, because Tilda is such a ethereal looking person. Like she can always be like the alien type character because she just is like she is so androgynous and has such striking features and just like that long neck and that, yeah, very like piercing eyes. I love her. Yeah. I mean, she's fucking awesome. Oh, but speaking of which, I wanted, you know, I'm obvious.

It makes sense why we just jump right into this because this movie is fucking ridiculous. But like I wanted to just talk about since we do this movie podcast, like we have the Oscars coming up and, you know, you now bringing up three thousand years of longing. I'm just curious if when it comes to the best picture nominations, like, you know, what one movie are you pulling for? What movies have you seen and really liked?

You know, that kind of stuff, because, yeah, we're we're we're about to about to have that happen. I like most people have seen a fair amount of it, but I haven't definitely seen all of them. This year is interesting because I feel like I've been kind of off the ball. Is that how you say that? I'm off the ball. I used to be on it, but I've been like off the ball about like watching like the acclaimed movies of every year. I'll see us like a little smattering of of a few.

This year, I think I'm really prepared because I'm looking at it and I've seen a fair amount. I've seen Top Gun Maverick. I've seen everything everywhere. Seen Banshees, seen Triangle of Sadness. I haven't seen that. I really want to see that. You should see it. Definitely worth seeing. And that's cool. It's on this list, too. And I've seen Elvis and Tar. I haven't seen Tar. I wish I could see Fableman's. I will see Avatar. I might check out Women Talking. Sure. I will.

I'll probably check out All Quiet on the Western Front. I've seen All Quiet on the Western Front and it is. It's one of those like really competent movies, but I like. I came out of it. I don't know. Maybe it's it's it's hard to say if it's like where I'm at in my life, but it's like really violent and brutal. And it got very like exhausting and kind of. Yeah, I don't know.

I like at a point like halfway through, I got numb to it because like I'm sure you can imagine like most of the people in the movie die and a lot of them die relatively soon. And you know, and it's like they're in the shit pretty quick and it is fucking brutal. People are like fundamentally like to their DNA changing as people because of war. And it's very morose. But it's it looks good. Sounds exactly like a fucking Oscar or like a biopic or biopic or whatever.

Like it's those are the ones that are going to. Yeah, I mean, not that they're all bad or anything or they're all good. There's a certain style of like a war movie as well. It's and that's based on a book. I mean, it's yum, yum, yum, yum, yum. Yeah. So I mean, I would recommend it because of the visuals for sure. But yeah, it's it's a tough watch. But yeah, I mean, I get why it's there. But I in no way do I think it has a chance of beating some of these other ones out. Right.

And yeah, do you want to do what your what your bets are and like what you expect is going to win and then what you think should win? Yes. So I have a sneaky suspicion that the Fable Men's is going to win. But I think every everything everywhere all at once should win.

That is like I I'm you know, when I talk about that movie to people, I'm like, this is the movie that we need to champion like as much as we can, because we want movies to be more like this, like by validating it, by giving it awards, even though it like. It means not a whole lot, but that also means a lot like it's I think it's just a really important thing that we really make sure that everything everywhere all at once is.

Yeah, it wins stuff because we definitely, definitely want more movies like that. It's wonderful to see a movie that's not based on an IP, an action movie that has zero problem having moments of like calmness, stillness, introspectiveness. And is a wonderful, wonderful hybrid of action, comedy and drama. It's I just I can't say enough wonderful things about that movie. So that's what I would like to win. But I don't know. For some reason, I just have it.

And then also Banshee's of Anna Sheridan, right? It's like really great. It's just like hands down, like fucking awesome. Maybe it's not for everyone, but like, I don't know. I have a hard time. Like if you're over like 30, I have a hard time like not thinking that you're like you see this and be like this movie has a lot of like what I you know, what I'm thinking about, what I think is like interesting and can be funny if thought about it in a particular way.

So I'm like, I mean, I hate to be not not like changing any sort of opinion here or being on any sort of other wavelength, but I am on your wavelength. I'd almost say that I would like well, I definitely would like everything everywhere. It wants to win as well. I love that movie with my whole heart. And it was one that I made a point to purchase on Apple. Apple kind of trying to build my library a little bit. I was very proud to own that one. And I'm very proud to like show it to people.

And I watched it with my brother-in-law and we have it was it was the best time. And I remember seeing theaters and the people's reaction in theaters. And I was so glad I got to see it in a full house. And there's certain moments in that movie that elicit reactions. And it's so to be able to you're you you are a composer, you're an artist, if you're able to take a whole audience. And I watched it happen when I was in the theater of like, you are laughing your fucking ass off right now.

You are in the throes of action and adventure almost. And now you're bawling your eyes out. I'm like tearing up just thinking about those parts. Five minutes or like especially, you know, like the climactic moments of that. And it's a movie that I would definitely like to champion as well. And I think it not only should win, but will win, baby. I'm thinking it will. I think it's and I haven't seen Fableman's and a lot tomorrow, I think.

Yeah. To kind of get ready for that, because it's supposed to be really good. You know, I've been watching it too. I wish we could talk more about it on going into the water because, you know, it is a movie that most people are like, oh, it's really great. It's you know, has. Yeah, it's it's a wonderful movie. So yeah, I am. You know, I think it's an awesome to you, by the way. Banshee's rips. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's weird.

Yeah. So I'm I'm probably said this on this part, but like I am not a big fan of Top Gun. I get that we saw it together. Yeah, I get that. We did. And I get why so many people like it. It's not that I can't see it. And it's one of these movies where I'm like, it just really doesn't make sense why people like it.

But I mean, a part of me feels like that at times when I like really think about the movie, because like, especially when I think about that fucking dumb two football game that they play, it just makes me so mad that I did that. It's like such an iconic scene from the first one, them playing volleyball where it's like machismo. You know, it just is so neurotic. Mastinimo erotic as well. That's why we like that, too.

Yeah. But then, yeah, to make that fucking Tom two football game drives me so fucking nuts. But yeah, I remember we were both just kind of like they're going to invent a new game and like the thing with Tom Cruise is if I was on the beach with Tom Cruise and I just rolled up, he's like, hey, you want to play? I'm like, oh, you go. You guys just playing some football. He's like, no, it's this new game. Let me tell you. And then he just explained it to me how he explained it to in the movie.

I'd be like, oh, that sounds fun. Sure. Why not? But in the movie, you're just kind of like, why did you invent a new game? And the funny thing, too, is like, I feel like I like leaned over to you when we were watching and I'm like, what are they doing?

Because they don't like up front say that because like the first movie, it like cuts to like they have if I remember correctly, it's like them like not succeeding at something together as a team and then cut to this where they're like, we're going to do a team thing and whatever. And it just doesn't explain what's going on. And it was so jarring. You got to escape room. Oh, my God. How funny would that have been? But yeah, like at first you're like, oh, they're playing football.

And then like another football comes into play. You're like, wait a minute. What the fuck is going on over here? Then there's like they're not keeping score. Just like kind of rattle modernized it just like the movie. So fucking dumb. That drives me nuts. Let's go play the game. Let's try it out. Yeah, let's try it out. I'm sure it's a blast. The same way you got me Pawnee. I'm going to like surprise you at a beach trip and we're going to play two football with Tom Cruise.

You're just hiding both of them behind your back and you just pull them out. You're like two footballs? No. Well, yeah, I mean, yeah, I want the Elvis, too. I want to talk about that because I do not think that that's Boz Lerman's best movie. It is really like we've we've definitely talked about how and it was funny because I was listening to another podcast and they brought this up.

But they brought it up in like the the host and the guest in two ways where the guest was like, I liked Tom Hanks performance. And then the host let that person like elaborate on that and then was like, that is the part that I liked the least of it. And then to get into it. And then it's so and we've talked about that particular thing about the movie is like. It was so close to being ruined for me because of him. Yeah. And because I like the way the movie looks.

If Austin Butler wasn't so fucking amazing, then yeah. Right. Yes. Like if he wasn't so good and if the movie like yeah, like that aesthetic, you know, Boz is such an aesthetics guy and the movie looks. Cool, so a lot of a lot of the leather stuff still work for me. I think I wish they would have gone harder into his demons and not tried to like.

Lionize him and make him like such a such a big time and like, yeah, and yeah, maybe he was that as well, but he wasn't just I don't know, like I think some of some of his own faults would have been more made it a little bit more interesting for me and them trying to ruminate on that a bit more. And I understand that. Yeah, and that and that could have could be me even. No, I think that's what it should have been by just the Tom Hanks sort of performance was a real issue for me.

And I'm convinced that like that stone scars guard would have been perfect for that role for for my mind. I'm like, man, if that switch could happen, just get a or what was all the Willem Dafoe or like somebody else. Oh, yeah, sure. You know, somebody that's like.

Scarier, more like aggressive, just a lot of a lot of stuff that, you know, but again, so the person who thought it was great, it was interesting to hear that perspective because they're like, oh, he's such a like he's such a villain, he's such a character. And that and it's almost like the liking him in that movie is because it is over the top, which is a Bosler man thing.

And so you kind of like give it the benefit of the doubt of like he is a caricature, because that's kind of what we're doing here. And it just to me is such a stretch because you're like, do you really enjoy anything that he's talking about any of his motivations? And I get that you're not supposed to really like what he's doing, but I don't know. There's just yeah, it really fucking doesn't work for me.

Yeah, I'm trying and I'm trying to think like there's aspects of like the lady killers and his character and that that is kind of funny. Oh, yeah, that movie doesn't really work, but he is kind of interesting to watch in it at parts. But he's. And then maybe that's what they're playing on, where he's like attempting to be likable and he's and there is like a charisma to him.

And I think I agree with you, whereas the little bit more menace and believability for people to say they like that performance, it just makes me think that they like seeing Tom Hanks play out of character or something. And I even like watching the terminal recently and you were witness to me going through a hangover day after a Red Hot Chili Peppers concert. And I watched the terminal, which is a pretty good hangover movie, but it's not the best movie overall.

And his performance, I found an issue with that, too. Maybe that was so recent after Elvis was just kind of like, I don't I don't get it with this kind of this kind of stuff. Like why is he why is he casting this this kind of shit? Yeah, exactly. Some people like it. So I don't know. I guess I should go fuck myself. So no, no, no, no, because you're I mean, I agree with you. So I'm not going to tell you to fuck yourself. I think you're on on base with that.

Because yeah, like another thing that was like his, you know, being described in a more like positive light is he seemed like a Bond villain, which has Bond villains are very like, you know, have have a tendency to have like this nondescript ethnic accent and are like really. Yeah, like over the top and so and yeah, I like a lot of the Bond villains for sure. But yeah, I just in no way did I make that connection because I was so distracted by this.

Yeah, this on nondescript ethnic accent and whatever. That's who he was rocking. I don't know. So it's like not really. Yeah, it was very distracting. And but there was a lot of I don't know, there's a lot of fun stuff about that movie, too. And now I'm thinking of like Babylon and but that's not on this list, so we can't get into that. But that's a movie that's worth watching. And I'm curious about your opinion, Brandon, whenever I because that's a movie where I'm like, oh, you did see it.

I like it. I kind of like it, too. Yeah, I kind of I kind of fucking like it. Yeah, there's a lot of stuff in there. It's weird is like this stuff that I don't like, I'm not really sure how I feel about it, but it makes me want to watch it again. I don't want to like it is. And I were like, we should watch it again. And which is a long movie so much because it's such a long movie. Like to have a feeling coming out of it.

You're like, it's just yeah, like now having watched it, it is definitely a better movie to be like, oh, I want to watch the like the scene where they're out in the field and there there's all the, you know, movies being shot stuff like all of that is like awesome. Or the the party in the beginning where there's just nude people everywhere and everybody's in costume and it's so frenetic. Everybody's just like, you know, getting taken around all of these places.

So many believable, believable and messy. Awesome. Awesome. Awesome stuff. It's awesome. I like that. You know, I just about there's so much meta textual qualities of it that a lot of times I like I kind of. Crane or like I go away like I but then this one was kind of a beautiful way of doing it. And I'm a big singer to the rain guy. So I love all that stuff. Yeah, I do get though that Brad Pitt in it like I don't know.

I guess I can understand some people not liking his character, I would say, like because he's you know, I don't know. There's something about Brad Brad Pitt's character in that that I get that is a little like. It's I don't know. How do I describe it? Because he's all. He's trying to hold on to power and his like attitude about things can be like. Very vain and I don't know. Yeah, there's there's something to that.

His take down at the end of his care and or I shouldn't get into too much spoilers or whatever, but I thought there was a monologue directed towards him that I thought was a pretty and delivered by an amazing actress as well. But I forget her name, but I thought that that was pretty sufficient to sum up the makeup for that. His arc as a character and who he was and who he's been throughout it all and his attitude and the casting of him, I thought was was pretty good.

But yeah, it's it's that's that's one I we could do a bonus app on. That would be fun to talk about. Bring Carl along. I have to take a law abiding break. OK, so we'll come back and do. Yeah, we can go through any like final notes and then some reviews and. Going to Mary, I will see you in a bit. Bye. And we're back. I know you missed us. We have returned. Don't worry. The authorized kingdom overlords have come to reclaim the system for themselves. The boys are back in town.

This is our town now. I was looking at some of my notes before we move on to some final thoughts from both audiences, critics and us. Let's see that one of the opening things for there was like interesting names for all like in film companies, production companies that I've never heard of and like one of them was just called the film department. Nice, simple, straightforward. Love it. Mm hmm. Law school is economical. I was looking at some of these lines.

There's a lot of like line like there's like the way they say it, there's like supposed to be so much meaning and weight, especially how they say it and the timing and how they do it. Law school has got nothing to do with law. Get it. Just like get a jury to like you. That's all that matters that whole back and forth. It's what you can prove in court. All that stuff. Why shake his hand in front of people? Yeah. Recital. Pulled some ancient strings. That was a line. It's strange. Yeah, it's.

Oh, I've never heard of that before. And then when he was at Ames, the guy that he's like he first calls with like the deep voice like this, he's like coke on the table, bitch on the floor, life in prison. Three strikes. I had to rewind that one. He's like strike three. And he immediately starts shooting at the cops as he's leaving. I thought that was like this is the worst guy. No hesitation. Like a bunch of cop cars. He's got a revolver with six.

He's got a six shooter and he's just like, blah, blah, blah. He just started shooting and the guy's like, or Jerry B's like, you've already you've already shot yours, throw it away. And he's so down with like having his little guard. He's like, hey, it's my guardian angel. Yeah, this is working out pretty well. People's attitudes during things like Ryan is also.

Yeah. Darby's ring tone is so funny to me because it's like another like this is a bad guy thing where his phone when it rings, it's like some metal song where it's like. And Slayer plays later on the speaker as he stab in the dude or whatever. Oh, yeah. Check out the speaker. He's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, every time his phone, he's like the worst guy. He's like doing every drug on this on the table. There's a woman. There's so many drugs. And it's just like him there, too.

And it's just like this mountain of cocaine. He's got crack like kind of sprinkled out through it. And then he looks on the TV and his buddy that helped his accomplices like just got executed. He's like, wow, this guy is the worst. He laughs. He just laughs at the TV. So Ryan drugs, so many drugs. The warden had those. Oh, what's it? No, no, you go. The warden had a spork just like in his jacket pocket. I thought that was interesting. He's just like, I've got one spork ready to go.

You're getting a spork. We'll give you the steak, but you're getting a spork. Little did they know the bone is what is the is the dangerous. I was confused at that for I was like, what is he using? And that makes sense now. Justice should be harsh, harsh, especially against those who denied it to others. Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. You don't you don't name your friends or they stop doing you favors. Right.

That just sounds kind of benign, but how they say it is like, oh yeah, that's what that's what that's one of yours. That's one of yours, Jamie Foxx. Don't you know? Um, so what the when they go to meet Stamper, he's like, oh, who are you going to see? He's like someone who does some nasty shit so we can live the American dream. There's a lot of weight given to that, but I'm like, you just said nasty shit in such a way that like made it mean something.

He does some nasty shit so we can live the American dream. So fuck you for asking. Yeah. Car bomb, cell phone bombs. He's like a post 9 11 terrorists. He's a terrorist. He's a fucking terrorist. It's crazy. Easily. It's going to be biblical. That whole like where he'd like they pull him out of the prison just so he can like whoop his ass real quick. And then he gives that whole like line almost looking directly in the camera seems like and at the end he's like, it's going to be fucking biblical.

Like I'm tearing this whole system down, baby. Um, that scene at the end is cool. We just briefly mentioned it that flame like slow mo. That was a cool, cool shot. I wonder how they did that because yeah, I don't know. I don't know how they did it. Where do you is it like they superimpose him into it? Yeah, it's possible it was like an actual explosion that they put him in or because the fire seemed pretty pretty good and real. And that was like a cool like final moment.

And then it almost seems like he immediately leaves after doing that whole switcheroo and placing the bomb and assault and locking it. And it seems like he goes like immediately to the recital, which I thought was such a funny like tiny thing of like there was no like recovery of him after he just committed these things or there's no like tense sort of again like tense conversation that you would have after that with somebody who would like, yeah, I just we did it. That was good or whatever.

Like how do we feel about this? It was just like, and he made his daughter's recital the end. Goodbye, folks. See you next time. Very abrupt, yeah. Which, by the way, there is a supposedly a law abiding citizen to is like a sort of thing Gerard Butler to produce or it's going to be Kurt Wimmer returning to write the screenplay. This was this is an article May 21st, 2022. After more than a decade, law abiding citizen is getting a sequel. Yeah. And so what is this movie web on movie web?

Per deadline, it has now been revealed. Law abiding citizen to is officially a go. Butler, Butler, who also served as a producer on the original, is producing the sequel alongside fellow returning producers Wimmer, Lucas Foster and Alan Segal. Riverlight Films Village Roadshow. They're all there. A director has not been named and it's not clear if the plan is for great a return to the director's chair. But Wimmer is pending the screenplay for the follow up film.

No plot details have been revealed. And it's not entirely clear Fox or any of the actors. So this is just the most nothing article. But supposedly it's happening. Let's see what the critics have to say with the 26 percent. Let's find out why they are so icy on this one that we'll find out how just just how spicy these audience members are as opposed to the icy, they are spicy. Let's start with A.V. Club. Scott Tobias, a 25 out of 100.

He says a flagrantly ridiculous thriller that tries to retrofit saw to function as a mainstream, semi respectable vigilante picture. It's interesting to think about that in context, right? That's kind of how people think. I just saw like, yeah, the guys like, yeah, I'm ironically giving people, you know, this confronting them with their own mortality because they have wasted their lives and I'm going to be the harbinger of like. Right. There's a justification for all of it.

Yeah. And it's interesting when how people side with some of that stuff. Like, yeah, right from time, if you've heard of it, Richard Corliss, a 30 out of 100. Butler has the show your part, but his impersonation of the tragic hero is undercut by his weird resemblance to soupy sales. You start hoping that Shelton will kill somebody with a custard or puffer fish to the face. Who's soupy sales? I got to take a look. Soupy sales. Doopey doopey sales.

Poopy doopey sales, Milton Sutman, known professionally as soupy sales was an American comedian actor, radio television personality and jazz aficionado. He was best known for his local network children's television series lunch with soupy sales. It's such a time Paul. It's such a thing that a time somebody writing a time article. Yeah, this guy lived from 1926 and he oh, he died the same year this movie came out. Interesting.

And he reminds me the movie didn't work because you remind me too much of this clown from my childhood from New York Times. A.O. Scott 30. Where's its preposterousness with a certain pride? It's about the cat and mouse game between two very smart guys and it's perfectly happy to be as dumb as it wants. Yeah. Rolling Stone, Peter Travers, 38. Geez, did the surprise climax have to be this eye rollingly stupid? Okay Peter from NPR, Mark Jenkins, a 40.

We're supposed to be odd, but a more reasonable response is to giggle. How does a Kevlar kevlar tie kill? And if it can, why hasn't the CIA sent a Kevlar scarf to Osama bin Laden? When was this one written? Hello. Wow. You think that would work? I guess I guess he wears scar. He wore scarves. Yeah, I just, it's just weird to describe like a hijab or whatever the like the the Muslim rap head wrap would as a scarf. It's just kind of weird.

It kind of like what an interesting take Mark Jenkins of like, I'm going to I'm going to throw a zinger in here and make it topical. Yeah, you know, it's like God, that's bin Laden. Well, if you put Jerry, the fictional character that Jerry B is playing on the case, and he probably could have done it. Oh my God. That's what the second one should be about. He just like gets recruited to seal team six. He like got out of the prison cell.

We'll do one more and then we want to audiences Entertainment Weekly Owen Gleiberman 42. Clyde is meant to be nuts, but too often it's law abiding citizen that checks rationality at the door. I'm kind of I'm kind of on that on that wavelength, I think. Yeah, I'm feeling that that sentiment. Let's see what the audience spicy audience with the 75. That's pretty spicy compared to 26. I have to say, and I do have to pull up these numbers. We love the numbies here.

There's 15,500 reviews on Amazon Prime. 82% of them are five stars. It has an average of 4.7 out of five. It is spicy this movie, like people people really like this movie. And let's see what they have to say from Ravin Rowe five stars. Extremely good film. Well written has good reasoning and is about morality and justice. The film leaves you thinking about what we all think about the judicial system in the States. Gerard Butler is as good at his character as always. And so is Mr. Fox.

You do not. You do need to really concentrate on this film. I do not write many feedback reports, but I just had to had to this this time the film was so good. All I can say it's the best film in a long time. That said, I like Gerard Butler and anything I watch. Nice eye candy and and with good morals. Yikes. OK, well, this character has good morals. Morals tortured into the number demand. Yeah. Let's see who else has something to say. What do we got here?

We got from Socket's Sumon five stars extra extravaganza piece of movie. This movie exposes the cracks within our justice system, which seems so infallible to the naked eye. But when looked closer, every law made can be exploited in such a way such that it can hinder the meaning of true justice and what it stands for. Jamie Fox delivers a scintillating performance as one of those who are bound by the limitations of our justice system.

This movie is a whole lot more than just a vengeance thriller orchestrated by Gary Gray as Gerard Butler forces us to consider reconsider whether we can trust our government to deliver justice without any imperfections. It is one of the best and original crime thrillers I have seen up there with Zodiac and Seven. Both feature joints. Yeah, right. We'll do maybe like two more from Jennifer Baldridge. Five stars. If you believe in moral justice, this is a good movie.

He was a law abiding, law abiding citizen and moral person prior to being tainted by trauma and a horror inflicted unpin his family. That's what unpin when the system he was brought up to believe in failed his murdered family. He had nothing to lose. What do you think happens next? I really appreciated appreciated his character. I didn't like all the bloodshed and lives taken because it removed his moral compass being the OK of the film.

These people so concerned with the moral compass in this revenge thriller. Yeah, he gets revenge like he can't argue with that. And and yeah, and I'm. Handsome from Provocad, Provocadave. Five stars. The film was fantastic. The bad reviews are crazy and unfounded. The ideas and creativity were phenomenal. Gerard Butler and Jamie Foxx were work brilliant together. And the storyline is so crazy. And to be honest, so unbelievable, it has you trying to work out what happens next before it happens.

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yeah, it's I mean, you nice little reading reading from that. I think I know there's like it's interesting when people take on the justice justice within their review of like, you know what? This is a good time. Like K for now five stars titled Understandable Motivation for Wanting Real Justice. And they say the justice system is in serious need of repair. And this is clearly established in the film's beginning.

The problem is and will always be it is administered by flawed human beings. Good movie. Well acted. Vengeance is mine, says the Lord. Left with him, there will be no mistakes. Oh, it seems like something they like leave on all their reviews. That's a call. Right. I was thinking like, very ordered like a toaster from Amazon. I'm like, good toaster toast things evenly. Vengeance is mine, says the Lord. Left with him, there will be no mistakes. Signing off. Oh, silly.

Yeah. So I mean, I think people audience really resonate with the Gerard Butler character. Right? Yeah. Yeah, for sure. He's going through and what his whole purpose is and what he's trying to do. Naturally. So that's the whole the crux and the point of the movie. But I think it's interesting in this movie. Yeah. And that's where I think of like Silence of the Lambs or something where maybe not as much so. But Jodie Foster's character is so good in that movie.

But a lot of people really think of Hannibal Lecter and who that is. But it's just it's strange with this one where I think that vigilante is with this one and Punisher is. And for that matter, Unhinged, that's a little that's a little different. But I think it's kind of a nerving for me sometimes. Like seeing how seeing how people react to some of these movies that we've been talking about is like endorsing things that are upsetting to me.

And I get that the movie is trying to make you have these conversations and trying to make you react and question systems and what you can do with the power. You know, if something were to happen to you and like the worst thing in the world, like the and they put that on the character, which is naturally like a good driving force for a main character of like the imagine the worst possible thing fucking happening to you and how you would react.

And you can as a writer go any sort of direction with that. And with this one, he turns himself into a fucking monster. And I just argue against how I've said this the whole this whole podcast about how it feels about its own villain and its antagonist. And I think that's the biggest failing for me is. And that's why it just makes me think again, like these.

And you don't know if you can call it a Fincher clone, but it's like it makes me think of how good Fincher is with writing that line of being fascinated and interested in whatever fucked up way with Zodiac or seven about what this person is doing. And there's much more of a mystery around it with this one. You know who it is the whole time. But it makes those things interesting in a horrific way or even. Well, sorry, what's the show on Netflix?

That's so fucking good to by Fincher about all this. Hunter to for that matter, where and it's dealing with a character like Jamie Foxx or something in Minehunter where he's doing his due diligence to to find out about this person. But it is centered on his reaction of it. And this is so much a centered on Dr. Butler and Jamie Foxx. And although he's in all of it and everything, I just don't I don't care.

And I say maybe this is why people's reaction is to this, because he's not that interesting of a character either. And he makes weird decisions and is very weird. So involved in like an assumed sort of way that you don't actually dig into why he's doing the things he's doing. And it's more just about everyone reacting to Gerard Butler. So I don't know. Yeah, it's I can I can see why people are into it in a weird in a weird way.

Like and for me, the things that I did like about it, I'm just going to carry on into my review. Yeah, please. And it does have a momentum like a lot of F. Gary Gray movies do. And it and it and it just and it is a it is designed as a thriller. And I know I've said that like it's much more horrific to me, but it is I think successfully designed as a thriller is like all the beats and notes of it and everything.

He knows what he's doing in that sense, even if it is kind of off for me seeing it that way. I see that it's like kind of like the taken element of it almost too. But the things are so heinous and the violence is so brutal and intense and not eloquent eloquently handled or delicately handled some of that stuff. And to include that sort of stuff in your movie, you kind of have a responsibility to know why and how you're you're putting it in there and what purpose it serves.

And to me, it didn't really serve the purpose that I would want it to. And it served the purpose of like, you want to see this this fucked up guy. He's the worst guy. No arguments there. He's the worst fucking guy. But like, it's almost like you want to see him go through this and all these people that fucked his day up. Like it's it's there's like a satisfaction that the movie wants you to have over it.

Man, it's but I find this very hard to give like a numerical score because I was overall like entertained kind of too. It's weird. It's weird. I'm saying all these like criticisms and everything. But like I am overall like entertained. However, I don't think it's going to get a full fresh from me. So I'm thinking like a 58. I'm thinking like a 58. Totally. It's like almost fresh. Like I'm almost fully bought in. But then it's like it just kind of fumbles the overall like ethos of it.

And that's a big that's a big part. But it's like it doesn't have time to ask questions. It just goes. And that's kind of like for an action thriller. It's just it's just an interesting thing to make an action thriller about and the directions and choices that it makes or would make it entertaining. But also there's there's a fault to it. And I hope I expressed my point well enough. Yeah, my case rests. Yeah. So, no, I mean, I'm it's it's always so funny.

You know, being the second person in line for the scores when what's going to happen is going to be the case, because I'll just say now I'm going to also give it a 58 because I was going to give it a 56. But I think it's it's it's. That happens to me, too. Or I'm like, oh, it's so close to mine. You know, it's all just it's so close to mine. And there's like.

Yeah, especially the last part of your review resonates with me that this is effective in being an action movie because it cranks along, has a lot of shocking stuff, has a lot of like thrilling elements to it. But the second you start to think about it more, it just completely falls apart.

And fundamentally for me, like because, you know, it's great that we've brought up the Fincher like kind of like analog or like similarities, because in my mind, in a Fincher movie, why they're so successful is the the the villain or the enemy in a Fincher movie is a representation of what the like the id of them or the like if the main character audience surrogate were to give in to it like more carnal or more like vicious, extreme desires that could be

unlocked, which is always so interesting in a Fincher is like there's that weird line of like the main character potentially becoming the villain and really writing that line because the villains almost like what they're doing is sucking that person in and like almost transforming them to be like, well, if you were to just be deep down what you really want, I am that.

Yeah, it's like the Nietzsche quote, was that Nietzsche whatever like looking into the darkness, the darkness, you become all that shit and overall villains in general to be empathized with a villain, you can be a good villain. It's just it's yeah, it's delicate balance as well. Well, for sure.

And but this movie doesn't do that because never in this movie is Jamie Foxx getting to the point of siding with Gerard Butler, or there's never any avenue that that this movie travels down to that would have been interesting to you. Yeah, which would have made this movie far more interesting because then it's like, yeah, he's he's seeing what Gerard's doing and like him being successful and getting justice.

And as a lawyer, that there's that is kind of his role as well as to like get justice on people. But this movie is not not well enough to do that and to effectively convey that concept, which would be make this movie far more interesting. But yeah, like, again, I'm going to give it a 50. Because I think it's really there's a lot of exciting stuff in it. And yeah, I will also say, too, it's now like really locking into the reviews into these revenge movies.

It is forever interesting that these movies serve a purpose for people to be like, I like it when like justice gets served hard and brutally, you know, taking matters into their own hands. Yeah. And I think it's really important that people take matters into their own hands and fuck the government. Yeah. Because that that feeling resonates with people.

I'm obviously with certain people more so where borderline is like sociopathic or like really bizarre to like, again, to empathize with somebody that is totally fine with not totally fine because I mean, it somewhat justifies because his wife was killed. But at what point do you go like, well, he chopped a person up. He killed the lawyer woman. Like all of these things, it's just it's really heinous and inexcusable. So it's like all those people in those cars. Right. That was that was a thing.

Yeah. Yeah. It just is unsettling to them think that people are still like, I'm on his side of that. But it just again, it's with all these vengeance movies, like with people siding in unhinged of like, yes, I've been in a situation where somebody is so self-absorbed thinking about themselves, cuts me off. And what if I were to like really like stick it to them? And then same with the Punisher, right? Same situation.

And a lot of these characters and for that matter, like Tyler Durden or whatever, like they have these interesting ideas of like, oh, man, I've thought of just throwing everything everything away or whatever, living my life this way. And then you what's interesting about the movie and how it plays out is you in some of the good ones, you see that come to fruition and how it doesn't fucking work out. It's terrible. And it's awful.

And then it's like, and then people just stick with that carnal idea of like, oh, that's a cool edgy thing. I know you almost have to like forget about that. Like Gerard Butler gets exploded in this movie, right? You know, it's but you just kind of push that away. And you go like, oh, no, but the fact that he's killing these bad guys to get revenge on his family is good. And I'm only going to hone in on that is really one sided. But yeah, so that's where I'm at.

Before we fully wrap it up, I wanted to do because it's been a minute. I wanted to do a round of our singular magnetized. And if I recall correctly, I can't remember which one it is, but it's it's either 21 or 27 points if you are a waif, if you go over that by the difference, right? Like you're going to give a score and then the movies are going to be another score.

And then the difference between those, if they add up to, I think last time, last time you did it, like if the whole difference adds up to like twenty seven or something, it was a twenty seven or twenty one. I can't do whatever you do. Twenty one. Sure. We can lower it and make it more difficult. Let's do twenty one then. And I'll try to remember that that's how we will do that. So three rounds. Yes. So I have three rounds. Seven. Like I can do. I can afford seven a piece almost.

You can afford seven a piece. Yes. That sounds right. That sounds like that's what we did last time. I feel like that works. Yeah. But yeah, so this is magnetized. Let's do it. So kind of, you know, in line with a little bit of this movie, the first movie is Die Hard 2. Die Hard 2. I don't know. Die Hard 2. I've never seen it. This is yes, it's. This is 1990. Danny Glover's in this one. This one has got. I'm thinking a predator to you, I think. I believe this is the one where. Oh, here I can.

You know what? I'll read you the synopsis. This isn't going to help me at all, but I'm just curious. OK. You know, a year after his heroics in L.A., Detective John McClane is mixed up in another terrorist plot, this time at Washington Dulles International Airport. He was in an airport. Gotcha. The South African politico and drug profiteer Roman Esperanza is arriving in U.S. custody.

McClane takes action when the treacherous ex-colonel seizes control of the airport and threatens to crash every inbound flight unless Esperanza is freed. This is tough. I'm Johnny. Yeah. 72. I'm going 72. 72. And it is 70. Oh, nice. Wow. That was a shot in the dark. I feel like I was like, there's no way it's like super high, but I feel like maybe not super low. People probably so high on the diehard life. That's cool that critics were into it, too. I feel like they'd be like, I know. I know.

Right. Yeah, I feel like, yeah, unless you're James Cameron, I feel like it's hard to make the so yeah, you know, get you a high. Add an S and make it a money sign. That's all you got to do to make a good sequel. Hell yeah. Diehard. How about diehard? James, get out of here. You already made aliens. Go on. You can't do that to everything. All right. So two, you're you're yeah, you're in a good spot right now. You're looking good. All right. Looking looking good. OK, next movie.

So this is, you know, in line with the Oscars, the directors of Everything Everywhere All at Once also made another movie that is magnetized. And that is Swiss Army Man. Swiss Army Man. Yes, Paul Dano, Daniel Radcliffe. Soon to be best picture winners. Yes. Featuring a dead man farting on the on a beach. Uh huh. Lots of farts. Lots of farts in that movie. Lots of body humor. Yes. Not crazy. I was not crazy about that movie. No. Yeah. Uh huh. Me and Ray. I'm wondering. That's interesting.

People agree on it, though. I think it's just surprising when people agree on anything. But I think especially in the movie that's very weird. I wonder where it could be. Yeah. Something that most people I feel like I've never seen. This is tough. I'm almost going to say in the same range, but. I'll do. This 7070 is it 70? Is it? I'll say 75. I know it's not different than much different than my last guess. OK, 75 it is 72. Oh, I should have gone with my last guess on fire.

You're playing with me. I was like, oh, is it going to be this similar as last 72? Damn. Hell yeah. Like what? Minus five now. Yeah, yeah. Only five. In the bag. In the bag. I'm not really the best for last. Even in this game, even one movie could fuck you. So here we go. Don't fuck me. Brandon, don't fuck me. I told you not to fuck me. OK. Save the best for last. Southland Tales. Oh my God. My favorite movie of all time. I think everybody should see it. It's funny. We're like viewing.

Yeah, we got to do an episode. We got to do at least like a commentary or something like that. That would be a lot of fun. God, this is just watched recently too, and it rips so hard. Yeah, last time we did watch it together, last time I saw it, we did a digital viewing party and you convinced me to buy it on Amazon Prime. I mean, this is not going to be the last time I watch this movie, so I might as well do it. It is incredibly rewatchable.

Every single line somebody says in the movie is completely bad shit and so funny without even intending to be. It's delightful. I'm going to think of another movie that has so much meaning ascribed to everything that happens but actually doesn't mean anything. It means nothing. Yes. It just doesn't add up. Besides like a Joe Dorowski movie or some shit. That's a lot more visual, but you know, whatever. So Southland Tales.

Damn. There's another one where I feel like it would be polarizing, but then to find out people agree is very surprising to me. I'm going to find out it's 75, but I'm going to be it's just going to be my last guess. I'm going to say 63. 63 for Southland Tales. The score is lower. 41. I lost. I fucking lost. I should have known it was panned. Damn it. I was really. Why would people give it that high of a score? It's not a fresh movie is it? Damn. All right. That's fine. Southland Tales. Fuck me.

Southland Tales. Fuck me Brad. I told you not to fuck me. What was it? 41? 41. Damn. Yeah, I should have known. That's funny. They agree. Like both audiences. Isn't it so funny that that movie in particular. This is confounding. It was so fun to read. I mean, it was so funny. I mean, it was so funny. I mean, it was so funny. I mean, it was so funny. I mean, it was so funny. I mean, it was so funny. I mean it was so funny. I mean, it was so funny. I mean it was so funny. I mean the time being.

I mean the time being. But I was like, oh it was a good movie. Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was a good movie. So you had to like, find that out because again I just like, watched it like last week. And then I looked it up because I was like trying to figure out like a person playing in it or whatever. And then then I saw the score and I was like, Holy fucking shit. It's a magnetized movie. We're racking up our list for our next podcast or parallel podcast. So funny. But yes, unfortunately. That's OK.

I'll take it as a strike. ticket. If I'm going to lose, I want to lose on South and Tales. That's on some hotels. Funny. Well, yeah, we talked about our next movie already earlier. It's going to be titular, the titular revenge, which is the, you know, the theme, the titular theme of our most recent movies. This is from 2017. It has a 93 certified fresh by critics and it has a 58 by audience. I love getting into the ones where the critics like it a lot and the audience hate it.

They're a little bit more few and far between. If you're more new to this podcast, that's kind of been the trend we've found is there's I feel like there's more movies that audiences like. Critics are naturally more critical, so they're not going to like as much. So finding something that they like and then something that really upset the audience is is not as common. So I'll be curious about what this is. I don't know much about it, so I'm going to read the synopsis here.

I had no nothing about it. Jen is enjoying a romantic getaway with her wealthy boyfriend. And should we not read it? Should we just be surprised? Let's be surprised. You know, that's all we know. Jen is enjoying a romantic getaway with her wealthy boyfriend. That's all we're going to find out. I hate when trailers tell me too much, so I won't tell you too much either. I just caught myself doing that. If you want to reach us anywhere, we're doing this live on Twitch.TV

slash Polarize Pod. You can join us there. It's typically Thursdays right now, but it's it's it's all you know, we're pretty fluid here. We're we're just having a good time. But if you want to join us, you can jump on the chat and we can maybe read your messages loud. If you're good. If you're not a Jerry Butler trying to rig the system and use it against us, then you'll be OK. If you want to send us anything on Twitter, it's Polarize Pod as well. Polarize the pod at Gmail dot com.

This has been a blast. I feel like this is a great app. Brandini. Great app. Anything you want to share with the lovely people? I believe next week we're going to be doing our podcast. Yeah. What am I doing? Yeah. Prod pod. Check us out. We'll do a live stream. It's going to be on Sunday, which is the 18th, 19th. Yeah. Check it. We will be on the same channel currently as Polarize. It's a podcast about music producers. We're doing Barry Gordy next.

Motown Legend. Yeah, we've done Diplo and Todd Rundgren. It's it's fresh. It's new. We've we've been doing it with our good friend Corey Hart. Where's the sunglasses? We all wear our sunglasses at night during the record. It's great. And so that's large. And yeah, we talk about music producers, their effects on pop culture, their their careers, their who they are as people. It's been a lot of fun and interesting to get into a side of music that to me, I don't know as much about.

I'm not sure how much other people know about. And it's fun to learn things and share them. Pretty much show and tell. That's pretty much what all podcasting is, is just show and tell, isn't it? And we're happy to show maybe less show more tell. Just tell. We're happy to tell you everything we feel about this movie. We hope you've enjoyed us and we'll see you next time for revenge. We love you all. Goodbye. Bye bye.