Episode 199: Feed Bloat

Podcasting 2.0 for November 1, 2024, episode 199, feed bloat, hello everybody. It is a brand new month, and a brand new board meeting. Podcasting 2.0 is ready to go, where we discuss all things podcasting, what is ahead, what is here, now, and sometimes we look over our shoulder. We are indeed the only boardroom that has no agenda to follow or key decision making authority. I'm Adam curry here in the heart of the Texas Hill Country and in Alabama, the man with the plan,

So I've got so much crap in here in this room now it's just I the reason we couldn't rip in a timely fashion is because I had so much like, it's just chaos you've

been living in that room. That's why you've literally, I know Melissa. You don't have to call me Melissa. I know he's living in that room. Am I right?

Sleeping bag under the desk? Yes, you

know it's really bad when you know that you've been working in your in your office too much at home, when your wife puts the kitty litter box in your office to try to stink you out. Yeah, you're screwed when that happens. Yeah, they're

trying to smoke you out. Yeah, you're like, oh

no, oh no,

I'm coming out. Brother, no, I've got, I bought, I bought this car play Android Auto device, and that's set up in here. And

what exactly is that? Because I have CarPlay in my or no auto Android in my car, and now you have a device for it. How does that work? Yeah,

okay, so this is like, and then grab it. Okay, it's, this is an Amazon special. Oh, because it's got, it's just a white box that says portable, wireless car stereo. It's like the generic peanut butter container. This is white, and it just says peanut butter and black, yeah, so, but it's, it's just seven inch like a wide screen, 16 by nine format screen, uh huh, touch screen with and it's got Android Auto and CarPlay, oh, and on on it, so it's like a head unit and

but now, do you connect portable? How do you connect it to audio through a Bluetooth or a J really?

Bluetooth? Yes,

that's pretty cool.

It's only 50 bucks. It was 499

that's not even 50 bucks. It was not even $50 that's interesting. And does it have? Does it come with velcro to put it on your dashboard?

It does not. It comes with a little sand, oh, and a suction cup. Perhaps it's not a suck it's not a sucky stand. It's, it's the it's a, like a, I don't know, I forgot what. It's some kind of other stand. It's not the sucky one. Like,

well, how does this, how does it stay stable in your car?

Oh, wait, I was wrong. It is the sucky stand that I

thought it was new. Show title, sucky stand.

This stand sucks No, it doesn't.

It's just, what are you doing?

I'm putting it back together. I'd put it all out of the total out of the box so I can put it back together. This says it has wireless CarPlay, Android Auto, screen mirroring, car stereo with backup camera.

Is it also a dashboard cam? It

says no installation fees.

I think that's your VMI podcasting, 2.0 no installation fees needed,

yeah, free estimates.

Your insurance will pay for it.

Yeah. So I've got this thing in here. And then there's also, there's also this my Android phone that I bought off, you know, to have a test thing with. I've got commentary, by the way, on it, on PWAs, yes,

and maybe I'll talk about that right now. But maybe I should say that what is happening here, what is happening here is Dave and I have been working on this project for a couple months now, and it's starting to ramp up, and we're so in it that when and I was getting ready to start the board meeting like I only want to talk about our stuff,

So it. Yes, I guess we'll, I guess we'll talk about it. So the I'm trying to find the link to this thing that I bought, so I could put it in the board room. There it is. Okay, I got it now. Yeah, so the car, there's a, there's a PWA aspect to this thing we're making. And there it is. There's a, there's

Google. Yeah,

so the so and the Android apps. You can set it and it works on the lock screen, yeah? But as soon as you push to Android Auto, it just nothing reads. It

doesn't, doesn't, doesn't exist, yeah, yeah. Because so

CarPlay has, CarPlay has this notion of a Now Playing screen. So if there's media playing from somewhere. It doesn't matter where, where it's coming from. What happens? Okay, from? Yeah, yeah, you can it'll, it'll just have now playing sort of like a default home screen that you did you land on right and or a widget.

We have no controls. No, you

have controls. Yeah, you have controls too. No, it looks beautiful. It looks just like your phone lock screen just on your car, huh? But Android Auto has no equivalent of this. Yeah, it only understands apps, and if the app doesn't, if the if the app is not published through the through the Google Play Store, and have all the and have like the, we call it the like permissions, or, yeah, whatever manifest, or whatever for for enabling Android Auto, it just doesn't show up. You

Apple, would be the hardest guys ever. But no, it's actually quite, quite easy. Yeah,

we got, we got, we got Apple for free, and Android's been the pain in the butt. So I don't know if this so that's what I discovered. If anybody I believe me, I have Googled every permutation of this that I can possibly imagine and come back with zero answers. So and I even went so far as to put, uh, put the Android Auto interface on the phone into what they call un or developer mode, where you can, where you can, quote, unquote, enable unknown Apps,

extra features that are not the undocumented features.

Yeah, advanced, you know, advanced, otherwise known as normal mode. Yes. And I enabled this thing, and it still doesn't work. So that's horrible. If anybody has some some work around some top secret juice, tell me, hmm, I would love to know about it, by the way, true fans, speaking of PWA, is true fans enabled offline playback. I would love to know how they did that, because that sounds super hard and as a PWA, now that I've had a little bit of dabbling in the PWA universe,

I can't notice that because I've removed apple from my life.

No, yeah. Well, you, I will, I will notice it for you. It tends to get bogged down, so that sometimes, like tapping and moving things just doesn't work and you have to reload the kill the app and reload it. But true fans seems very immune to this, and so kudos is all I can say. Now,

are they still working on native apps. I mean, I know that Sam Sethi threatened it, but I don't know if he actually started on it or not.

I haven't heard any update on it. I don't know. Let me check my email see if you send an email

the true fans update of the week, which includes inline images and and headers and subtitles is always a it's an interesting read, but I do have to sit down and take my time to go through it. You

need a cup of coffee. Yeah, you do. I don't see anything in here about the native apps in his latest update. I love these updates, by the way. Yeah,

I wish everyone update like that,

straight up. Me too, because

I need more to do during the day. A lot more.

Yeah, that's anyway, so that's, that's the that's the latest in my adventures in PWA land. Well, yeah, it'll be, it'll be fun to talk about things in the open. Because I think it's like, I think what we're doing fits in so nicely to everything with podcasting and podcasting to Dotto, I think it just, I think we're just kind of slotting this thing into a lot of open spaces. That's what it feels like. What

I've been so part of what I've been doing for this project as I've been experimenting with live which has been really, it's been so good to do that again, and especially since you can put a live item into your RSS feed, what a genius move that was. And and when I look back and I have to keep reminding myself, we've been doing this for 15 years. You know, doing the podcast like no agenda, doing the podcast

I've been listening to your live stream and to your test stream, you know, for a few days now, and it's just, it's great. I love it. Thank you. I love it the like, just the the mix of various things that that that come on. It's like, it's amateur, it's amateur radio, but done by a professional. If that makes

any sense, like, I know how to do it. I just can't quite get there yet.

It's like, you know, you you know, yeah, you know how to do it, and you're tinkering with, yeah, yeah. It's like, you're tinkering with it to get it to be what the thing your vision is. And it's fun. It's fun to watch. Like, I think that it's, yeah, yeah. I'm

learning a lot. I'm learning a lot. And it's basically, I think, three I can't even get my wife to listen to it yet.

Oh, really. I think it's awesome. It's great.

I love it. She actually said this morning, now, how do I do that? How do I how do I find this thing? So, who knows? You know, I've learned, you know, if you push people will never do it. And yeah, by the way, my family barely listens to any of my podcasts. You know, Tina listens to Noah. J. And she never listens to this. Of course, you just nerds. Just some nerd I know. Did you do your nerd show? George? Did you do your nerd show? Yet? Her own podcast that we do, curry

for a second time after doing,

oh yeah. She's like, You never listen to the show. I was there when I did it. What are you talking about? I know. I know it was good.

I don't have time to listen to this show for a second. Well,

sometimes right after, right after the show, I'll take the dog for a walk, and I will listen to it while I'm on the walk, you know, just to I always am sampling stuff, you know, just to make sure the sound is good, the interaction is good. You know, that kind of

stuff. I've listened to this show maybe six or seven times when I when I was like, I was worried that I didn't like that I was confusing, or that didn't or I said something wrong. And I'm like, did I say that? Right now, I'll go back and listen to see, like, right did I make a mistake? But like otherwise, man, I don't have to

realize well, and all, all props to Dr Scott. I love the chapter work that he does on every single project I'm involved in, and he does it for many other people. I appreciate it so much, because I can go, Hey, what were we talking about? And just go in, click, hit the hit the chapter. And I'm always delighted when I see all the different images that he's chosen for stuff, because, you know, there's, there's a lot of

I just realized that I didn't put true fans on this Android phone. Oh, and I need to test it to see if they've somehow gotten some kind of juice. Wouldn't

surprise me, if anyone's figured it out, it's it's the true fans crew. Oh yeah. True fans crew, sounds like two Live Crew does? Live Crew, two fans. Crew, yeah, kind of good. Just before we started, I saw that David from hyper catcher, which, of course, yeah, what have you seen? This

came back in with a vengeance. He sees me doing some coding.

What exactly does this do? It says podcast mentions, right? Set keyword alerts for your favorite podcasts and get notified when they are mentioned.

Yeah. I mean, it sounds to me like a a way to to, like, find topics mentioned in podcasts that you're interested in. Like to get an alert.

Let me see. So get started. Get started. Okay, for free, for free, sign in with Google. Okay, nope. I like, I like the logo, though, but I like his, his hyper gum logo. I'll sign in with Google to free. So I think what he's doing, choosing, oh, so, okay, so it costs my AI powered analytics. Ai powered analytics basic support, five projects limit access to basic AI tools. See what does this do? So if you so you brand alerts. There's a lot going on here.

I'm signing in with Google. I'm about to tell you what it does. Okay, let's see. I

mean, look, I like the idea for sure.

Oh, check your mode. What?

Oh, you gotta check your email for a code.

Well, it's it's this. Now it's sending stuff to my Android phone. This is gonna be

a problem. So the keyword alerts for your favorite podcast get notified when they are mentioned. So how is he checking all podcasts for mentions? That's gotta be quite the quite the job.

I think he said he's not okay. I think he's somehow he's doing it a different way. No, okay, so I logged in. It says Search Credits Remaining too, and it says Search groups. So I click Search groups, search podcasts. Okay, podcasting. It Out of maybe, search, um, no, I didn't do anything. Okay, I don't know what this is. I liked your search group name.

I like hyper gum. I like the idea. I like the logo. It's a piece of gum, basically like, like a gummy the hyper Oh yeah,

okay, here it is. So I searched pod news. Pod news weekly review. So I'm gonna put that. Oh, okay, so you pod News Daily. Uh, no agenda. Let me search for that so you can build a group of podcasts, which is what I'm doing, a search group named Dave's stuff. Enter a search term. Okay, Dave, all right, so I'll search for myself.

I think that's that's illegal in Alabama, isn't

it? What it says you have insufficient search credits. You

got no credit, right for more credit. Give me credit. Man, just give me credit. Give me some credit. Give me some credit. Man, I need a credit. I need a credit. Man, please give me some credits.

But I see what it does, but I don't have any credits.

Okay, well, maybe we'll have David on soon. Dave Norman on, well, he can explain what I do. Yeah, bring him on the show in the board, in my book, yes, in your black book. So I've identified, uh, something that's presenting to be a problem. No, no, yeah, you may have seen some of these emails go back and forth, so apparently, there are some nefarious actors who are duplicating RSS feeds and and

and is it all coming from the same people?

No, it doesn't appear to be coming from the same people. It's not widespread, but it's, it's like one of those things, like, ah. So you know, what typically happens is, you know, you search for something, you see there's three different feet, three different versions of a podcast. And then there'll be an, of course, an a cast feed. And that a cast feed will have a different email address in it.

We could put some sort of some sort of alert in where there's a if there's like a title collision, a brand new feed with a title collision that has a value block. Maybe there

you go. Throw flag on the play. Yeah, yellow card. So the thing that that kind of bugged me is vigilante TV appears to have done that.

Well, I thought they were legit. Yes, what I thought,

too. But someone reached out to me and said, This is not legit.

Isn't that? The Hive people? Aren't they a hive group, I

don't know. Let me see if I can find the email for a second, because I was very disappointed by that van t let me see lantee. Here we go. This was Hello. I recently switched to a fully podcasting, 2.0 compliant act. I noticed something. Couple of podcasts I listened to seem to have lightning addresses listed for donations, but never mentioned this or listed as a way to support the show is able to confirm that one of them so far never set this up and doesn't

says that's a peer tube instance that allows uploads of random videos to comment on peer to. So this may be somebody that went in and created a Rando using the vigilante TV service, in pure tube instance, and created a channel of that name and is now uploading the content just to get a feed in there. By

the way, shows have anchor, not a cast anchor. Typically, I

knew what you meant. Yeah, right. So this, this, this may not be that this, this is probably not the vigilante TV people themselves. This

is people. Oh, okay, all right.

We should probably, you know, I should probably, I just sent myself a note so I could remember to put in a couple of alerts in here. Okay, yeah, well, I'll start watching for that, because that's not cool now, bastards. Yeah, by the way, Franco responded my four I forwarded him that that,

yeah. What did. You say extortion letter, yeah.

He says it looks very scammy to me. On their website, they mention as a pod, as their partner is the Italian podcasting Association. The President Giulio guadino guardiano is a friend of mine and a good supporter of open podcasting. Let me check with him and report back to you. Okay, yeah. So be thinking, Well,

I mean, so this literally went to my spam folder. And not much goes to my spam folder, yeah, let me see it was. Who were these Jim oaks? What was their name? Again?

License sync, lice. License sync, yes, like all one word like

Amazon licensing, then dear podcast index team, we are writing to follow up on our previous communications protocol

it's basically, and then they attach an invoice for $7,000 yeah, come compliant, you know, yeah, yeah.

The fact that it went to my spam is probably because somebody marked it as such somewhere along the line.

It's like things like this. It's like, well, you know, this is, this is obviously bull crap. But then you you always have to wonder, okay, is it enough to just tell them to go away, or is it, or do we have to actually get a lawyer to draft a threatening letter? Well,

we have some, yeah, we have some lawyers who'd be happy to draft a threatening letter.

Yes, I'm like that. That's the only problem with stuff like this, is you're like, come on, you know?

Oh, well, it's what it is. It

is, I have a note. James has had to fight this battle. He's

had several things like this happen to him, right? Yeah,

yeah. One, one guy, I think, got pretty nasty before they finally quit. Yeah,

yeah. He's like, Oh, you're using this or that. So I did get a note from salty crayon. I hate to do this to you, but we should probably just go through it succinctly, percentages versus shares in

block splits, no, no. You want to push it off again. What like, what,

I don't know, percent. We just, can

somebody just look, find the old, the old time that we talked about it? We can just lay late, like the chapter and episode number. It's

probably a good idea. I think sir Dean Anonymous is, is is doing a Bing? It.io for for podcasting 2.0 which actually is not, it's clip genie.com Yeah, I think so.

Clip genie.com was a product that,

yeah, no, it's a product, yes.

But is that what powers being? It not? Yes,

yeah. Thank you. Clip powered by clip Genie, exactly. So that would be, and what is this? Stephen B had a, what was that transcripts? She had a transcript search. Well, there's steno.fm, steno.fm,

um, am

okay. Well, here you go, podcasting 2.0 All right, lot of broken images on that page. Okay, so splits. I'll just do search splits. Let's see what?

Oh, Lord, that's gonna come back with a billion results. No, maybe episode 149, scrape my JSON. Is that it? No, I just, I just thought that was a cool title

percentage, let me say no,

what would be a term that we would have used discussing that that would be like rare pain,

pain, pain, search for pain. No episodes found with pain value. How about fees? Maybe fees

respect the splits. Discuss this, splitting the tab, splitting the tab, maybe that might have 91 that seems awfully long ago, but maybe

split splitting the tab. That's a standard.fm is pretty as though it's now it's searching for stuff. We'll find it here. We'll find it, we'll find it. We'll find it. We'll put it out there for you. Salty crayon. Yeah,

I mean, we, we spent, like, literally, an hour talking about it. Yeah, we did. And when we lost half the half the border, they killed. They never come back. They died. They died. Yeah,

all right, we want to talk about

brother. Let's see. I've got, yeah, Daniel, I see you trying to bait me in. I'm not taking that bait. Stop it. Name. Let's see Alex.

Well, Alex has worst episode to date, to be honest. Well, could you just give us the episode number? If you remember, it was the worst one. What was the number?

Yeah, it stuck out in your head. And must be the word you must know about.

That's the one. That's the one we need.

Let's see that. Well, I mean, you want to talk about the the L, 402, stuff that Russell,

yeah, yeah. I'm happy to see him working on that.

Yeah. Um, so, so Russell's trying to build something around the idea of pay Walling, uh, content. And he's settled on on the 402 method, the L 4o T,

which I suggested as the l sat. I suggested look at l sat. And this is something similar, but different.

Same idea. Yeah. I mean, with l sat, you you challenge with a you challenge the API call with a 402 response. And for HTTP status, 402

is authentication required. It's a payment required. Payment required. Okay, yeah.

So you, you respond. So the idea is, you, you make a call to an end point. So some HTTP endpoint, that endpoint, that endpoint responds with a with a with a status code of 402, and then you you know that you have to make a payment in order to retrieve the data from that end

point. So they renamed it, l 402 l4 oh two.org. Got it,

yeah. L, which makes a lot more sense than LSAT, to be honest. So Alex says maybe episode 146, the So, the, so, the idea there is, is pretty straightforward. You You know, you would, you can conceptualize this as you know, you would try to download a an episode of a podcast, or an audio book, or whatever this content is you would try to download the enclosure. The CDN would respond with a 402 saying that you're

Alex gates have something already worked out with this proof of payment stuff? Yes,

the JS the the JSON payment token, JpT idea in that, and that's that work. That would work perfectly fine in this, in this workflow, the issue he's trying to do, yeah, the JpT and the issue he's trying to do, but, but Russell's trying to solve this for Fiat as well. The the JpT is, it would work for Fiat, but it's not going to be supported by like Apple and Google and these Fiat payment platforms, the So the issue here as described up until now in this this is a discussion 670,

Yeah, that's a pretty big thing to miss.

Well, it's, it's so you can so the ideal solution and. This is what, and that's the way that Russell is dealing with this. Is he's saying, Okay, I'll build a service that will allow doing this with with a third party link out but, and then I'm gonna and then I will do the book, build something that does the bookkeeping, and then there will be payments that are processed out to various parties at the end of the month.

far as you'll have to kick back the 30%

Yeah, you got, you've got, you've got, I mean, you've got to, you've got to do that. So the, you know, the the ideal issue is, if we really would truly want to do this, if we truly want to, and see, okay, this is not, and, by the way, this is not how Spotify Open Access works. Spotify open access, which is what this is all being compared to Spotify.

right? So you still need the OAuth from the app side, right? You're gonna

have to go to a website or some other party, pay for the content, then link it to Spotify through an OAuth handshake that so, but what everybody wants is not that

I understand what we want, but the rules of the of the app road are just different.

They are and so, you know what? What everybody wants is an in app payment flow where it's just kind of like but, and you're done, and that's so, but in order to so the only way that I can imagine that that works is in a seamless way. Is if the RSS feed returns a 402 and a 402 can include a response body, some some HTTP statuses. The spec says that they don't that they're just a status code. They don't have a body. The 402 can have a body. So if we can return the body, the 402 body with in

That point isn't easy just to build in the Apple Pay and Google Pay. SDK, I mean, you're going to pay for it anyway. You're going to pay the 30% anyway. That's

what I'm saying. If that's exactly what you just read my you're Yes, that's what I'm saying. If you have, if you're having to do all this and still pay 30% then it's better to just have it as an in app purchase. Yeah, and don't and forget all the bookkeeping and record keeping and all that stuff. So if we could return something that has, uh, every possible payment method in it, and then the apps can choose

Yeah, no, I'm with you. It seems like a lot of work for something that you could do in a different manner. What

is and that's the problem with the app stores.

So we need more lawyers,

because, because if, if James is, you know, James is saying, Well, you could do all this with stripe, but you can't. It's, and this is what we talked about last week. It's, this is not a tech problem. This is a politics problem, right? And, well, let me take that back. You can, but it's, it's, it's intense, apples, apples, policies are intentionally difficult, so that nobody will do it right. You're now, you're now by by law or not law, but by by by policy, you are

think we need to go much further than we need to spend time on other things.

I don't mind. I love the idea. I love the idea of enabling this, because you think about it, you could give back. You could give back if you're returning a payment, an object, if you're returning a JSON object with various options for payment. One of them could be bolt 11, and you could make your payment and enable content of the content download, right? But

you still need to keep your books and pay 30% to Apple.

No, I'm talking to so, no, I'm talking about like, I'm talking about so things off platform. So I'm saying like, if you, if you always return all your options. Then the the app can choose the specifics that are best for it. So then it can say, Okay, well, I'm an Apple app. I have to use Apple in app. Purchase. I'm an Android app. I have to use Google and purchase. I gotcha, I'm curio caster. I can use lightning, right, right,

It becomes a lot easier when you're not an app, right,

right? Yeah, yes. Nathan says Spotify is getting around this by never mentioning or leak linking how to pay for open access shows, yes, it's exactly right, right?

You don't do that in the in the in the in the content itself,

right? And they don't take a cut the the that's part of the rules in the App Store policies. Up until recently, you were not allowed to even

Whoa. Boost. Thanks. Tim F received what he's got three boobs. It's a three. Boom, boost. Oh my.

Up until recently, you were not allowed to even say in the app that there was an alternative payment method. Yeah,

this is so lame. Yep, and

I want to do this. I want to make it happen, but we got to do it in a way that makes sense. You need to

do that on your own time, Dave, because I'm falling asleep.

Okay,

move on. Phase eight.

What you got? Big man. Hey,

listen, big man, I got phase eight. I see that you're you got a plan. You got a plan for phase eight. Can we want to hit the hit the hot name space for a minute here. Just do a little bit of a little bit of hot name space.

Please hit it all right. Hello, Jennifer, and now it's time for some hot name space talk. Yes.

I'm awake now. Hot name space, hot.

You really, you really dug out that? Yes, because it

was real. Man, yeah, I like me some hot name space talk on a Friday.

Dig it out. Digging it out.

Yeah. So James, location tag changes,

yeah, this is good. This is, I mean, he fought it for years, and now he's relented. He's given in. He's given in to optional ways to use the tag.

Okay, he's melted into the void. Yes, so here's what, here's what I'm thinking for phase eight. These. I think these should be fairly straightforward. He said James's location tag changes consist of the following, and these are enhancements to the existing location tag. Change to location tag. He wants to add a rail attribute. So that's like short for relationship, a rail attribute to say, Okay, this

right? This was the big question, yeah, yep,

yep, and I'm and then he's got another, another proposal, where he's sort of pre calculating the, what you might call the the relevance of the location, so that you don't have to so that makes it easier for the apps to ingest it. So this, it's already got all this sort of like relevance data about, you know, these things are in this location or around this area, and then, and then the last change is just having

did know that. Actually, I had no idea. Yeah, it was like the 1889 or something. Yeah, sure. Yeah, that was cool. Well, they

had the stuff

back at the world fairs. I mean, they don't do those anymore. Do they the world's fairs? No,

but that, like, I read this. Do you know the book Devil in the White City? No, I don't just finished reading that about three weeks ago. Great book about the world, the Chicago World's Fair of 1893 and man, that's those things were nuts. Well,

I remember in New York, which, of course, was featured in Men in Black. They had the all those structures out there near the airport, which was also the site of one of those early world fairs. Sir bemro says, Seattle Space Needle was also built for one of the world's fairs. That was cool.

That was cool. Ferris Wheel. The Ferris Ferris was created as part of the World's

Fair, and now all we have when it comes stuff like that is house of the future. Yeah, home of the future. I've been to those. It's such a scam. I know James went to one, and where was it? He was one of his travels. He was he wrote a piece about it. And they're always a scam, because they had one in the Netherlands, home of the future, and all it is is just Phillips and, you know, and Braun and all these other home goods companies who just put their concept models into this

It's gonna, it's just all refrigerators. They're gonna order your milk for you and stuff

like one day, baby, one day, one day, one day. It's gonna happen. I know it's gonna happen. All of a sudden, my refrigerator will know that I'm out of milk, will automatically order it, and the man will come in and put it right in my fridge, right where it belongs.

Pfeiffer, the Ferris wheel at Six Flags St Louis is not the one from the World's Fair. That is fake news. Fake News. The ones from the one from the World's Fair was exploded with dynamite after the st Louis World's Fair. Awesome. Why dynamite? I had no idea. Why not, but that's how you rolled in 1903,

did somebody say, boom. They're like, what

are we going to do with this thing? Absolutely,

so that. So what else is in a is that it for eight No,

no, there's also Nathan's follow tag. Ah, yes,

explain the follow tag again.

Well, I've got a I've got so I've got a couple comments, though. So Nathan's follow tag is just a way to is a way to list out all the various places that a podcast can be found on these different platforms. Yes, and the So originally it was, let me read. It's kind

of an outgrowth of episodes.fm or comes from the same Yeah. So. Same feeling, same vibe, Yeah, same

same milieu, million you gotta get along, yeah? Matching feeds to their corresponding URLs and third party podcast apps can be tricky. The follow tag would allow podcasters to verify their presence on various platforms by providing an array of URLs and linked in a linked JSON file. This is particularly useful for locating shows on platforms with no public lookup method, or identifying shows with common names, like real talk in platforms that only provide a

I remember this, yeah, yeah. Then now it's an external JSON,

yeah, and that's, that's what I that's what I think is, that's what I think is the problem here that. So I understand why he did it. He based it on feedback, saying from hosting companies, saying that, well, that's gonna bloat the feed a lot, and we're sensitive to feed size because of bandwidth costs and that kind of thing. To

feed bloat, feed below. I like this term feed bloat,

and which is understandable, but there's a couple of things I just want to talk about around this. And I think, I think Daniel J Lewis was right, because, I mean, he

said, what

he said? He said, we've not talking about, talking about whether, you know, like bloating the feed with stuff. He said we've not consistently followed that logic. For example, wallet switching is in the feed instead of episode metadata, Jason, where it logically belongs with chapters. And I think, I think he's right that the So, for instance, pod love chapters are now in the feed or in the XML. So basically we have, we originally kept chapters out of the XML because

not. The reason why. Why? The reason why is for community based chapters so that you can have external chapter creation apps that can be done outside of publishing or republishing the feed.

Oh, I'm sorry, What? What? You're right, what? What is the what's the other one that has a transcript? Yeah, transcript. That's that one is originally was, was in a separate file to keep it from bloating the XML,

but it's still in a separate file. No, it is, yeah. It is, yeah.

But what I'm saying is, like, we some things. So my example of pod love chapters that's originally people hosting companies did not want to put that in their feed because it bloated the feed. Would rather have it in a separate file, but now, because Spotify supports pod love chapters, everybody starts putting pod love chapters in the XML, yes. So I think Daniels ride that the logic is not, it's like it's not being

if I may, I would say that feed bloat is also important for podcast app developers who, in many cases do parse a feed. And you know, if you're choking on five feeds that are, you know, 20 megs, because there's all kinds of stuff in it, I can see where that could possibly create problems.

Oh, for sure, yeah, for sure. And yeah. And Nathan says he the difference. And this is what I was going to talk about. Nathan the you know, you have two separate you kind of, they kind of have two separate feature concepts here. Some things are are you can just think about this and say, Okay, this is a feature that would be in every single feed, like title or description or image, things that are going to be in every

item of universal desire. Look at that girl. Look at that girl over there. She's an item of universal desire.

This is odd name space time. So if it's like, if it's like a universal want, where you can imagine, and that's what this is like. You can imagine that every platform is going to want to see this data, because it tells them where all the I mean, like, pod page. Pod page wants this. Yeah, they're going to grab that data from every feed that has it. They're going to want every link, pod news, us. Everybody's

yes, I'm with you. Affirmative, Captain, I Yes, I'm with you. So

that's, you know, that's fine. That's why, that's why it seems to make me ultimately, if that, you know, it's whatever I don't, you know, I'm not gonna die on that hill. If, if everybody, if the hosting company, I mean,

it's really not that huge. I mean, when it comes to the follow stuff, it's pretty limited in scope.

I don't think it would be much bigger than chapters, right?

Well, but, you know, again, chapters, the reason for chapters is for external editing purposes. No,

no, I'm talking about pod love chapters, the ones that are in the XML. Um,

no, no, yeah, not real. It's not like a transcript. It's not, it's not. I mean, look, I'm You're right. I'm sure that they, the hosting companies, look at everything because of bandwidth, but whether you're pulling it off their server as an external file or in the feed. I don't really, I don't really see that as a difference in the bandwidth, because it's still, you're still serving it. I'm looking at it more from the aggregation side. It's like just a little bit of extra data.

I mean, initially, initially, you're going to have probably not very much, like, if you, if you left it out of the feed, when the when you first implement it, if you leave it in a separate file, you are going to save bandwidth, yeah. But over time, as people start realizing this data is there and start downloading it, then stuff will happen with it. You're just not gonna say. I don't think you're gonna see much savings. No, I don't know. Well, I

like that. I like this is a good tag. I like it, but I think it's a good tag.

Yeah, I will ask for

valid, ask

for more feedback. Valid tag. I've, I've declared this ballot.

Let's take a breather. Sure I have this is a great track. This is from Texas boy. In fact, he's right down the road in Austin, Texas, and I think we were trying to get him for the boost to Grand Ball live December 16. I'm not sure if that's gonna happen or not. And I played this one on boosted Graham ball, a new booster grand ball this Wednesday, one o'clock central time. This is Abel James. This is the Voodoo Queen on podcasting 2.0 remember to boost and let me know about

every bedroom. We're the Voodoo queen. This cold sweat is clinging to my bones. She's like Tiger. It gr and I'm trembling because I know she's sharpening her claws. Lord, I can't escape this tangle If she eats. No, no, I used to laugh. Used to laugh at magic, but now I do believe my eyes are red and my body wakes up bruised and blue, she can't be tamed. There's nothing I can do when she's standing up. That witch is bruised, Lord, I can't escape this tangle where she breathes.

Dance. Abel James voodoo Queen podcast in 2.0 and just like any any boardroom when the band's on stage, everybody's mulling around talking to each other. Hey, man, why don't we offload that to pod ping, we can do this. We can do this. You guys are not even paying attention to the band. The band is feeling bad.

No, I was, it does. It counts, though, that I was like jamming while I was as

long as you were playing air guitar, it's okay.

Air drums. What is the, by the way, what is the etiquette? The texting etiquette around, like, when you reply to somebody around, like, Ha versus haha, versus hahaha, like, is it is Ha is just, if somebody says something funny and that you just say, Huh, oh, okay,

here's, here's how I look at it. Okay, if I'm surprised because someone made a remark that was like, wow, okay, you, you pointed something out to me that's ha, capital H, and then a, lowercase a, exclamation mark, ha, ha. Now, now I now, instead of doing an LOL, if I'm really happy about something, then it's a hahaha, I've added that to my dictionary, actually, so I can type in just a couple of has, and then it automatically auto corrects. Usually no exclamation mark.

This makes sense to me, because sometimes I will send you something and you will come back with a with, like, an A nine character string, hahaha, with an exclamation point, and it's super fast. I'm like, I know you didn't have time to type that,

especially not on my cat s 22 which is still my daily driving jam, baby. I love this phone. I love it.

I'm like that thing has real buttons. You can't tell you can't hammer that out real fast.

It's a great phone. It's a great phone.

Nobody uses Rafflecopter anymore, by the way,

okay, Boomer, no, no one uses that. No one uses that anymore. Thank you, Dr Scott, for boosting. Abel James, by the way, Suzanne Santo is onboarded, I think, into a value for value. Oh, nice. Yeah,

you, uh, you played her. I think you were the first one to play her. I think you played her.

I've been, I've been working her for two years, trying to get working. Like, come on, girl, come on, get it together. Uh, yeah. Open Mic is, uh, he's the one organizing this whole. A antones thing. So I'm just the MC slash host. You want

to talk quickly about the, about the nasty API bug that that I fixed, yeah,

yes, that would be good one, because, I mean, yes, it was a nasty bug, a nasty bug.

So Adam alerted me that one of the, one of the that he was getting a random episode from, from just a he was getting an episode, he was getting an episode from a Rando podcast. Rando, yes, just and I was like, he was like, okay, it

wasn't even a good podcast. It was some wonky podcast. It was not the right, no,

it was dumb. It was dumb. And so he's like, Well, I added these podcasts to my collection here, and and, and it all looks fine, except I keep getting this random this episode from a random podcast that I've never heard of before, and the podcast was delight, the life of JB,

die, life of JB. Exactly. How does this even happen? Yeah,

l, y, F, E, of, J, J, a, y, b, like, oh, like, okay, so I started looking in. The first thing that popped out to me was that the the feed ID in the in podcast index for this feed was 25,000 to 25 000, mmm. Now, now that's a suspiciously round number, yes

for a Rando podcast. Oh, what are we drinking?

Oh, this is a montane grapefruit, peach, sparkling water.

You're gonna die so early.

This is zero calories or no sugar.

Oh, yeah, natural flavors, yeah, all natural Yeah. All natural flavors, which is code for chemical

the No, it's m, O N, T, A, N, E. So I'm like, okay, 25,000 that's pretty unlikely, right? So start look at what the the end point that I was using to get these episodes was the episodes by feed ID, using the new using the new parameter on the end of newest. So if you tack newest onto the end of that call, what you can do is you can give it an array of feed ID of podcast IDs. So let's say you say you could give it like five podcast IDs, and then you can also give it a max parameter. So

Oh, only a month. Okay, is because

that's a fairly new parameter anyway, so, yeah, nasty bug. As

as we've learned, my whole existence in life is to break things that Dave built.

And you're and you do that so well, I

mean, like you, it's amazing.

I don't know how you do it.

It's why there's two of us, brothers. It's one of your magical abilities. That's my superpower. Before we thank some people. I did just want to ask you, since I kind of have I tuned out from the thread a little bit, what is the problem with comic strip bloggers, podcast, not updating? Can we help this man?

What is it? Did it happen again? I

don't know. It's always like, I mean, he's using some, what is he, I'm sure he's using some free host somewhere.

Well, he's using red circle. And they use, they

use pod ping, pod thing, yeah, because he's like, Oh, it's like, I have 15 episodes on red circle, but only 12 in the index. You suck. That's, I mean, not literally saying that. But he always comes across that way.

He didn't put it through a chat, CSB to calm that down at all.

That's just my I just hear him that way. So that could just be all on me. But it seems like, yeah, yeah, comic should. Blog has a podcast. We records nature sounds, his lightning and stuff and thunder.

He says, Is it unreliability of ping pong that can only do so bad.

I said, when I read I'm like, What can we help this man? Is there anything we can do?

I don't understand why that's happening, I really don't, I'm, I'm gonna have to, I'm gonna have to dig in.

Has he somehow been automatically de prioritized in the index parsing system?

Not that I know of. I mean, well,

look at that's something wrong with the ping

pong, all of the, all of the feeds from pod ping enabled hosts. They're all deep power test, and they don't pull right. We just wait for the problem with, I

think red circle is if he uploads things too fast, or maybe they're not, they're not pod, they're not ping ponging enough. Seems like they don't seem to slurp the things. Slurp,

yeah, that's, that's, uh, Brian of London's thing where you can look up a feed URL to see how many like when it's been pod pinged or ping pong. From

now on, his ping pong, ping pong and pod ping Hello, oh.

Eric PP just got the boost bot to ping it, so make sure there's crap flying around. I don't even know what's going on at the time. I didn't know you could even do that from boost, but nonsense. It's

amazing. It's amazing. All right, we got to wrap this up. All right, thanking a few people who boosted in live. 12345, from Dr Scott for voodoo queen. Great tune heard on Friday. 11 slash one episode. 199 podcasting. 2.0 podcast with Adam curry and Dave Jones. Yes, we still don't have all podcast apps sending off that information, which would be great so that, so that someone knows that this was a boost for for a certain song. 1776 freedom boost from salty crayon. Howdy

We do. We have no one. We have no monthly or, excuse me, one offs on the pay pals, but we do have some. I'll just go ahead and read the monthlies, and I'll read the boot the boost. The monthlies are. Cameron rose, thank you, Cameron. $25 nice drab. Scott $15 thank you. Dr, Thank you, Chris, uh, Chris Bernard, Dick, $5 uh. Michael Kimmerer $5.33 Pedro gun calvis $5 Kevin Bay $5 and Chad Farrow, $20.22

row of ducks and thank you. Those Sustaining monthly donations. Those are really important. Those are great. You know, it adds up. It adds up, it really does Yes, thank you so much.

Oh, Franco, just emailed me back a more extensive thing. Oh, okay, I'll forward this to you.

We're going to jail. All right, Italian jail. Italian jail.

See you guys later. Let's see. Let me sort my thing here. Okay, but boo. Boost from curry, 8008. 808. From fountain. He says, I'm back. Baby, nice, surprisingly, normally, surprisingly normal sized Brazilian booties and pretty New Zealand landscapes had me distracted for a while. Is the secret project on? Okay, let's see, is the secret project an app dedicated to your favorite person ever, Rachel Maddow, thank you everyone.

Close, close. Even more favorite than Rachel Maddow, which is

hard to do. Yes, thank you everyone for all your hard work. Thank you curry. Thank

you Chiron. Good to hear from you brother, glad you're okay. Glad you, uh, you extracted yourself from Brazilian booty.

He's got Chiron is a fun guy to hang out with. He's got some great stories. I'll bet Chad F 3333 to pod verse, he says, re listening to see what I missed since I had a heart attack during this episode, what Chad f are you for real? Is that for real? You just kidding? You're gonna have to. You're gonna have to,

yeah. Are you alright?

Yeah? Me freaked Yeah. Freaked out. Don't

make jokes about this man chat, if his typing. I can see that in my in my you

can see when he's typing, yes, yeah. Oh, sat boost,

yeah, oh yeah. That was interesting. So he did send a million SATs by accident. He fat fingered it, but his Alby hub restricted that to 50,000 so I still got the TLV record in my helipad, which said, Here's because I get 1% split for the so I can get the live boost. So it still came through as a million, but the payments basically didn't go out because of the restriction on Albie hub, which is a good thing and protect You're saved by I would have refunded you, Brother, no

Yeah, comes your blogger, the delimiter, 22,000 SATs. Speak of the devil fountain. He says, howdy Adam and Dave, today, I invite your audience to the podcast. The podcast gauntlet hosts Mike Wilkerson and Brian insminger Throw down. Discuss Rise and shine in podcasting. Join Mike and Brian as they uncover the Art and Science of Successful podcasting with real world tips, tech insights and cultural deep

what is the name of his podcast? Again, I want to promote CSB podcast. Let

me see, it's honestly kind of generic, and I forget, Oh, hold on, we

should be able to find that. See, CSB

made it. Let me see, I think it's kind of a generic name, like, uh, great stuff, or something like that,

great stuff, or what

it's like, something like that. You know, he doesn't really real talk.

He doesn't he that's funny. He doesn't have it in his in his profile, or anything. What is know it? I've

pinged it so many times.

What is the name of that show? Comic, sort of blogger, hmm, okay.

CS Oh, it's a CSB field. Is the name of CSB?

Well, hold on a second. Let's go check it out. CSB field, because it's field recordings. Let's see what he has here. CSB field recordings, let's listen to the most recent episode.

Recording part podcast by CSB, rain

drapes the Iberian plains anew. Silver drops adorn the morning dew as chat GPT palm trees sway beneath the gentle rain, nature song unfolds across the terrain. Oh, I gotta pee real bad. Now

it's killing me.

That's it's an interesting idea for a podcast. And now, here's winds of Iberia. Oh, cool. And there's Iberia. Now, here is his neighbor's drill. I. A

boost garbage there's one of a garbage truck. Oh,

this isn't a garbage truck. You can hear moving the mic too. That's great. It's great. That's what podcasting is all about, baby. I'm telling you, that's fantastic. I love it. I love it.

I don't understand why it's not updating, though.

He has high priority now, on the on the bug, on the bug list, we'll ping pong the pod ping and figure it out. Brother, we'll take care

of somebody just ping pong him in the boost. But Ellie, like three times a day, somebody be on call.

All right. Brother, Dave, we'll be back next week. No,

no, we will not. Oh, I am gonna be gone Friday.

Can I ask what you're doing? I

will be in the forest in the me and my son are going backpacking.

Oh, can you, can you record some sounds as a special episode for CSB?

I will. I'll send it to him as a field recording. Excellent. It's gonna be, it's gonna be the new, like, it's in the sipsy wilderness, which is in North Alabama. It's, it's like tons of of audio potential. So I will send you the field recording. Okay,

thank you very much. Boardroom. Thank you for being here. Itbr in the boardroom. We'll be back in two weeks with another episode of podcasting 2.0 Have a great weekend. Dave, so cool. You

podcasts are cool. Do you hope you have been listening to podcasting to point oh, visit podcast index.org for more information.

Go podcasting. We like pork in the morning. You.