Episode 140: Shim Theory

podcasting 2.0 for July 7 2023, episode 140 shim theory Well, Hello once again it's Friday, a brand new month and welcome to podcasting. 2.0 The official place to find out everything that's happening with the now and the future of podcasting. That's right. We've got everything in podcast index.org The namespace all the rumors happening at podcast

Total cluster today just like cluster. Yeah, everything is everything that could go wrong has gone wrong today.

Oh, I'm sorry. What? What? What is the problems? I

usually go. I usually do show prep before. Before I go to work. Okay. Yeah. On Fridays, because you know, the day jobs on Fridays are hard. Sure. I get it. But this morning, I wake up and immediately have a call from the office.

Oh, I hate those those mornings. You know, that's not good. What wasn't working? What wasn't working? What three,

three hours later, I finally get it solved in just like okay, I've now got a scramble. It's yeah, it's just been it's been like that whole day. It's just been that kind of stuff. Then I was trying to prep a clip for the show. I got one of them. But I had another one that I wanted. And I had to resort to recording do a screen recording on it because I was on a different machine than usual. And God Almighty I could not get this thing converted to mp3. I finally just gave up. I mean,

Nuff said Nuff said Mac, please. I used to be such an apple boy. I was so I love Mac's I defended them everything. Man I have the original Newton I stood in line for it. I was a junkie until they screwed up my USB audio interfaces. That's when I got pretty mad and then they screwed up Final Cut Pro. That's when I gave up.

It's a disaster. The Mac is a disaster. Everything that you want it especially when they do when they went to Apple, you know their own processors. Yeah. It's just so well I live in theory, I lived

through the Motorola to Intel switch that was actually an interesting period. They had that really funky laptop, the black one with kind of the rubbery feel to it. And yeah, and then that was their whole thing is like, Oh yeah, we're gonna have all the operating system for work and

I hate Macs with a passion. And the only reason I have them at home it was a conscious decision on my part. I was like, Okay, I'm gonna work my day. And my, my day job work is 100% windows. On on the user side, its own server side. It's a mix of lots of stuff, Linux windows, you know, but on the user side is totally windows. But these kids coming out of college. They all go through college with MAC's Yeah, a lot

interesting you know my my daughter's here visiting with her boyfriend slash fiance.

Oh, yes, yes, yes. Yeah. Congratulations and getting to see her Yeah,

well it took them three days to get here with canceled flights misconnections it was quite a quite a nightmare. Especially because it's all happening during no agenda. I'm getting right he's literally calling me from the customs you'd like they're gonna send me to the little room unless I can prove you know that I haven't returned. Little room is not good. When you come into the country people I've been there the little room is not fun. But he's a he's a producer

Am I gonna there you are weird Yeah, what happened? I don't know.

You're streaming video again aren't you?

Yeah but that's been going for a while.

Whenever something's wrong I always blame OBS

there was no OBS this time I did I did get C I have h top running so I can make sure that I'm not frozen that if if as long as the bar graphs are changing I know I'm not I'm not I'm not in a boot situation

state of affairs when you have to have each top running and know that you're on the air. something inherently wrong about that.

You're like Dave Dave

let's start off today with the bang I was reliably informed that today is the second anniversary of the booster gram which just started Yes Two years ago on this date and I believe the first official booster gram was sent from curio caster if I'm not mistaken.

What was the first official booster gram?

Oh, you know, we should not we should know what it actually is. I don't know what the what the text was of the first booster gram. Oh, that's huh. I should know that. I guess. Maybe we should immortalize this Yeah, we need to know that. Yeah, maybe So Steven became me posted in the chat room while we play our celebratory booster gram jingle the very best remember this one is I will lose them across the land die there it is. Let me see. It was Sir Chad Pharaoh who? Who

first Don't click it Don't click it.

Oh no. Here it is. value m sat 1000 M sat so cheap boost message sent from curio caster tip jar colong Really? I've changed Oh can I can't see that. Oh, I've changed my mind so much. I can't even trust it. My mind changed me so much. I can't even trust myself. Wow, that's a very much like a Mary Had a Little Lamb kind of thing.

Oh, yes. Cuz

I love that it actually says message sent from curio casters. Tip Jar. Wow, I squash that pretty quick. Didn't I?

can tell that's old.

And so we've gone from this

is fantastic. This is like, yeah, we need to make an NFT out of this.

And ordinals Sure. Everyone knows Yes. I'm gonna put this I want to put this into the into the show notes. So we can immortalize that.

Do you find that so fast? Stephen? Oh, my gosh. I mean, this is from 2021.

Isn't that cool? was first was the Grammys it actually from the date? Is it from from the actual date to July 7 20. Oh, wow. How cool is that? Well, so today, I just view how we've moved ahead in two short years. scissors are sharp, no rounded edges today. Steven B changed everything. Cool. Yeah, he changed everything. He took out the most of the production elements of the value time split from

always good to always get the signal from you, hey, you know, Steven bass number,

and no one has his number. And I always forget to ask for his number. You know, it's like,

genius on his part, by the way. Great, great call.

I can't say I can't say it's a bad thing. You know, I'm posting on Twitter. I'm posting DMS everywhere I'm sending an email like, this thing's broken. It's really when

every podcast. We've never live, this is

true. Anyway, a very interesting way of surfacing remote items as they pertain to value time splits. Really very focused. Well, not just focused on music, but it'd be really interesting a very cool implementation for music. And, and along with that, you know, Austin has been talking to the wavelength guys and so now they've gotten a fire under there but all of a sudden, and there have you seen any any action from them, but they putting stuff into the index? or

and interpret it as they are getting getting geared up? Like they're, they're getting ginned up and ready to you know, I mean, like, like that they feel that they feel like things have come along or about to come along to a point where they want to go full, full

bore, like Yeah, that's that's the feeling I got to

I know that that's not very clear. No,

I think it's that they are possibly considering doing configurable splits, maybe maybe not.

did say that they said that in the blog post that that's on there. Right that that's on their roadmap. Yeah.

In addition to that, I think they're going to use people tag tag. And you know, so I'm getting ready now because you know, I said what I think so we have pod freight curio caster pod friend pod vers pod versus value time split now I think right? It's it's still in beta is that being full full blown mode?

Pod verse is I don't know if he released it yet.

Okay. We'll have found and all this coming this month I think by the end of the month, so I'm getting my music show ready. And I'm very excited about this um, you know, coming up with you know, go back and forth you know, I would initially said I'll do the wave like top 40 But I I'd like to

Market conditions don't affect that.

No, evidently not. So this is what I've always thought would be cool. I see. IPFS podcasting. Now. You know, if you if you put a 1% split in your value block, they'll they'll pin you, they'll scan you. I mean, people are starting to use this kind of, I've always called it the podcast or the podcast creator API. You know, you don't really need to do anything, but just have to know how to put a split into your into your value block.

Yes, the plug is the plug in model, the podcaster plug in podcast, API. Exactly. Yeah. You just plug somebody in your valuables

are working. Exactly. I love it. Now. Here's what I want to talk to you about. So the by far the biggest. I would say the biggest opportunity for music is we've talked about this before SoundCloud. And SoundCloud does not enable their RSS feeds by default, but they have RSS feeds with enclosures. If you do a search on the podcast index, you'll just do for SoundCloud. You'll see a lot of results. I don't know how many, but there's a lot of results for SoundCloud

yeah,

the enthusiasm is so much I have to backup so doesn't splatter me in the face.

Man, I don't like the shim part. I mean, I know what you're saying because we went down this route with with transcripts to

write but I see the difference here

why like? Yeah, yes, no, I see what you mean. And I see what you mean because your day

we're not asking for any remote information. We're not hosting anything. All we're doing is setting a bid in our database. Right just and that would be I guess the only way to do it unless you know people start bugging their their hosting companies like SoundCloud to make that a feature.

See that? That's what I that's what it should be on the obvious. I mean, let's just go again say that I mean that they should have an option there absolutely, absolutely. Make this music in the feed itself in like the we need a Shem theory.

Title. You know what I mean? Yeah.

We need a shim theory this here under these circumstances. It's an under certain under conditions. X X Y and Z. That's when you shim Yes, yes, if x y if x, y or z do not obtain don't shim.

So the the reason why I thought this was, we have not come up with a shim theory yet. The reason why I thought this was acceptable is because this is an onboarding specifically to enable value for value. And value for value music

So yeah, I mean, Steven B says it ends up hurting wavelike, who's already hosting music and Wallace? Yeah, I mean, that's true, too.

Well, hold on it. Did. I mean, did the shim not hurt other people who set up value blocks?

Well, the shim exists, like the shim existed before the shim existed before anybody did vote me like it literally was the true truth strap. And so that that continued, because it was very for a long time, because it was almost impossible. Honestly, we could probably get rid. At this point. We almost could get rid of podcasts or wallet.

Yeah, no, I'm in total agreement. But before we go, talking about that, the four to eight minutes. I mean, the difference here is we we really don't have a big pool. I'm going to be able to do five, five episodes of my show. And I'm out of wavelengths songs. I gotcha. Yeah. And if I'm, if I know I can do it, because if I do a call out to everybody, if you

There's some there's some stuff here. There's some stuff.

Anyway, why it's so interesting, because I think that we're at the point where, if you think about the Okay, let's go back to my original premise. If you think about the, the podcast or plugin, labs now have the ability to offer so many more features, through, you know, the basically plugging in lightning splits, that they will far surpass what hosting companies can never do to make any sense. Yeah, so the only thing this is going to hurt all hosting companies long term

Another another not opposed to shim, I'm just I want to make sure that you can shim and vary in different places, and an own make sure that the shim happens at the proper at that at what we would all consider to be the proper place graders like, which

is why I said it would be like podcast or wallet or through the because that's where the original Shem was put.

Right? Yeah. So there's this is there's a few different ways you can do. You could do this, like initially, it's going to be very much a trickle. I think we can agree with that. Right? I mean, we're gonna get there's not a whole there's not music is not flooding into the podcasting.

But this is, okay. This is why I'm suggesting it because I believe that if I can say you can self host through music side project, you can use Wave Lake, and I don't know where wave Lake is with their splits, you know, they I saw the blog post. I'm not sure what this topia is doing. But if I can say, Oh, you already have the music on on SoundCloud. Click this bit, go into this go into this app, whichever one it is, I'm going to use fountain as an example. Because you know,

Couldn't they just like, Okay, you take the amount lunch bumper, I'm gonna play devil's advocate. Sure. So you have that amount of work, whatever, you know, X amount of work this is that you just described is that that actually probably is not that much more work, or the workload is not probably much different than if you just grabbed your music and re uploaded it to wave Lake.

No. Well, yes, that's correct. And I can certainly do that is wavelength prepared for that? Do we want to put it all onto one host? Do we want to make it will they have I'm not a big fan? Or dystopia? I mean, I see nothing from dystopia.

There's stuff in there. I'm looking at a feed right now. I mean, it's got a place got the medium tag in its there is to me, we've I don't think they've been they haven't been as vocal about it as as wave Lake. But I mean, it is. I'm just thinking, if if we if you start if you start doing a music show, and in then you know it because like, Okay, well, if you want your music here, you're gonna have to take grab your 25 tracks, that you upload it to SoundCloud.

Absolutely, I don't think it's the same amount of work. But I absolutely agree that that is a perfectly good path for people to go down. I was just trying to make it a little faster. And bigger with more because people it I truly believe it's easier for people to say, Oh, I have to do this, this and this. I already have everything up. Now, it's a new feature, which I think would ultimately I mean, the alternative is I just go and bitch and moan about SoundCloud

They did for sure. Yeah.

Where's that system is already set up. And maybe they can implement the API, the Partner API and get it going quick. I mean, that'd be fantastic.

The point I was starting to make a while ago about how this would be a trickle initially, is I don't mind instead of creating A a shim mechanism in the Partner API. You know, where I wonder if it's enough to just say, you know, okay, you, you onboard yourself through, be a fifth of a fountain or whatever, and then just let us know. And when wolf flipped the bid for you, and I just put it in it, and it's it's manual initially. And just to get the thing off the ground,

why would now that's, that seems like a worse idea to me. Okay. I mean, why would we be flipping the bid for people? We know, I mean,

I'm concerned about it. I guess my bigger concern about the shimming is that once you create, once you create this, it's very fuzzy when you turn it. Dave, Dave Winer has as good advice here, you know, he always said, he always said you never take a feature away. Right? You're you always add, you don't want it, but you got to be careful what you add, because you, you don't, not that you can't take it away. But you should never, you know, quote unquote, should never take it

We don't need an answer, per se right now.

I'd rather have some real I would rather really push like this. If you've if you've uploaded your stuff to SoundCloud, and it's music like it's actually music.

Yeah. Which I think is 99%.

And you and you give a crap about it. Like meaning that you meaning that you care, you didn't just upload a couple of tracks five years ago and don't and don't think about it anymore. Like if you're if you're an active participant in in getting your music out there for people to hear. And you've managed to upload it to SoundCloud. If you're probably pretty. I mean, you're probably technically sufficient enough to

mean, no, I mean, no disagreement, but I just don't like the idea of relying on one company.

I don't either. Yeah, we need to we need at least two. Like, I'll talk to the Asha. Talk to the dystopia go, we need to have more than podcasts anyway, we need to do that forever. Like, I can reach out today.

No, sure. We're Devin, I am being very clear about it. I would like to get everyone on SoundCloud to be able to be available for playing in podcast. That's, that's truly what you know. So there's people who are already in the index, and they can't be played on podcast because they don't have the music bitset I can find him and I can find some. But it's not the same thing. They're not you know, they don't show up in the split kit. You know, this, all these things don't work

Well, you know, one thing that we did when Alex and I did the the long, multiple months of AI, detailer, machine learning detection of music in the index, what we saw was that, yes, there's tons of music on SoundCloud. But so much of it is like, remix. It's like, House Trance music type, where it's just the it'll be like one track. And I'm not denigrating and saying this is not valid. I mean, it's just fine. But it'll be but there's just so much of the same type of thing. That's

Well, where you need to get out more. This is not your kind of not mine. No, no, I agree. But not my kind of show. But this is I'm listening to what Kevin's doing here. He that's, you know, that's that's his music. And so I can't you know, that almost goes back to what is a podcast, you know, what, should we just cut off a cast? Because this shit? We don't always we don't we don't consider it a show.

I'm not really trying to not make that type of argument, I guess. Because I'm thinking about, that's just not the type of show I don't I don't think that's the type of show you want to make.

No, no, I don't. But I know that there's going to be other people who will there's going to be people who are doing entire five hour dance party podcast, why not? You know, and they're just mixing all of those different tracks together. I'll tell you what, why don't we Why don't we bring in some other board members and get their opinion on this. These people are very smart. I agree. I think it's time to bring in our board members. They are very major podcasting 2.0 contributors.

just to weigh in. On the last point. I have a buddy. Actually, the official detox music guy, he wants to do a dance party show, usually value free value. So he's actually big into sancha, too. So I mean, maybe get him to talk to them and modify their RSS feed. So you don't need the shame in the first place.

He has poor with I would say as poor that he's a customer. He pays 20 bucks a month. I mean, that would obviously be the way to go. But we've talked about it. You know, we've we've sent out messages. I mean, I don't know if they're, if they're, I mean, to me, it's like I don't even know how they're surviving. SoundCloud. I don't know, I have no idea what

Yeah, and, you know, there's also we forget about band camp as well. Yeah.

I mean, well, obviously, this would work for a whole bunch of already existing music services. That's, that's so I'm not just talking about SoundCloud, but the capability for someone who is a musician to say I want to do this. I've already put it into that they have to, they have to have an RSS feed with enclosures, they have to put it into the index. But then once you're serious about value for value, that's one you have the opportunity to set the flip the bit that that

Yeah, I mean the execution there's no issue issue there.

Sophocles, perfectly as clearly one. Yeah, I

think attribution like even if you're not into the whole Dj Mix that thing, just attribution to songs is a big is a big issue. And that's why, like, if you do a DJ set on Spotify, you can't just publish the whole thing, you have to divide it into a whole album playlist and, and give credit to all the different artists that are part of that mix. So

now I'm talking more about that the concept of a Shem for the medium tag your thoughts on that? Oh,

well, I don't know how valuable would be without the value for value and integration. And I think we can do that automatically. They would be good to have the information to reach out to artists. But that's,

I'm not quite sure what you're saying?

Well, it would be good to just understand just to have the data there, even if, even if it's not all value value, but it would limit what you can do with it without the value value automatically. One

was okay, my specifically my proposal is, if you want, you can put your stuff in the index. And preferably that would be if it's music, you want to find a way to make that music. But if you want to put your existing music that's on an RSS feed into the index and value for value, that then the Partner API would have the capability for setting the medium tag in the index so that it can be used with value time

That's that's a hard one.

Yeah, that's why that's why we asked you the hard question, brother.

Yeah. I mean, if, if they have to opt into it? Yeah, I don't see the issue. I mean, it'd be, it'd be just one step below moving to wavelet. And some of that might be in both wave like in SoundCloud as it is.

Well, Nathan G said in the chat. He's like, in this goes back to something that you envisioned that the whole reason really you made the remote item tag. Initially, Alex was he said, Nathan said, What about a service that generates a new RSS feed filled with remote item tags, pointing to SoundCloud feeds medium equals music and his own pay for Facebook is an

which I'm not a big fan of in general. But it right, it can do it. But you know, then you get into the what was the damn service called? Feed burner feed burner? Yeah.

Well, and one issue with that is yes, you can do playlists that way. But I would not recommend doing play it like a remote item that points to another playlist isn't supposed to have a remote item with a good if you don't, I mean, because there would just be a whole mess. So I mean, you could pull it off, but I would not recommend it.

It could also be in podcast or wallet, I guess. They could go claim their feed and then set the bit themselves there

was not the same as doing it to the Partner API.

Yeah, yeah, it is. It is, as this I keep going back to this idea of I don't want to make people dependent on things, you know, like, I did it for the value for value, because it's literally like nobody, nobody's ever going to do it. But we're so I guess my trepidation was we're so close to the medium tag. And it's such a simple tag that I feel like with a little bit of like, you know, marketing or or, or, you know, selectively applied pressure, that, that we might be able to flip out and

I mean, I'm with you on that. I'm with you. I think that's a whole bunch of things came in succession for me, where I heard this really disappointing interview with the interim CEO of Lipson saying, you know, well, market conditions don't allow us to add any more namespace tags until 2024. I'm like, holy crap, how bad is it?

That doesn't make that that's just weird. No, maybe

it was bullcrap. I don't know. Mark and also and also, you know, we just, you know, we have these apps coming online, but we have to proceed we have another problem or another challenge, I should say. Is right now pretty much the only feed generator that does this stuff is sovereign feeds. So there's a whole nother issue. You know, and and we're well it's not true. We the split kit kitten takes care of a lot of

But Alice is anybody publishing music on no agenda to

the rubbish. But the problem is there's no medium equals music without extending that in some manner. There is

what you say done.

Oh, the lightning plugin does supplied an RSS feed that allows you to set the music tag, I've got a couple bands set up self hosted already peer tube, and you can listen to him on ln beats, they show up properly, still need to do some refinement on the mp3 information and encoding optimally for audio only. But we're most of the way there,

well, why don't we do this? Why don't we table this. And, you know, fountain is definitely going to target artists to, to onboard them. And, you know, for now, they'll

Yeah, yeah.

We're great at marketing. Maybe we just let the market well, we just let the market ride and see how wave like does, I'm just impatient, honestly, I just see this whole universe of people who want to, we want to do it, and we just have to go find him.

But when fountain that's the thing is we're fat fountain is where the Bitcoin people live, is like that's, that's where they're going to live for. So when fountain comes out on that side of thing, and when fountain comes out of the gate, with with support for this, then people will understand what's required. And that that really may move some blockers on the needle Samba, if we wait until if we will wait

or anything for that matter. What right might not be around for 10 more years, it'll be almost 70 Are you kidding me? I'll tell you what, we have a lot to talk about with with Alex and Don about the peer to plugin about the stuff you guys are doing with streaming and I actually have a couple questions myself as it pertains guy and I'm delighted to hear that the plugin will do. Man Don, you are making a lot of noise brother. Sorry. public shaming, just like who is that? I'm looking at the

Oh, that's well that's okay. Yeah, there is a I heard this and it reminded me as the first or second time I was on the show, when you were playing Rage Against the Machine in the pre show and it just gave me the kind of vibe so that's why I picked it.

Well, for those of you who are listening if you are not listening in pod friend or curio caster and perhaps pod verse, please switch for this and boost these guys after the fact or go back and listen to the show again, because it really makes a difference when when musicians see Satoshi showing up and they start to get value it really sparks something and gets them really excited. So here we go. Hopefully everything switches automatically I now have activated the riot in

always do

face

it again right to see this through the live show no to it again

ACL is being used you?

RIGHT IN PROGRESS heads up here on podcasting 2.0 that works quite well and split kid automatically defaults back to the podcast or block after the song is over Nice.

Oh yeah cuz it ended immediately like the artwork went back

that is sexy man I liked that and I was looking at the heli pad and Steven B was boosting from the split kit even though I didn't publish anything so I guess he knew but I guess he knows how to get that and it comes in as heads up so it shows me the title yeah that's very cool and I saw you boosted Dave

I did nice the Eric PP has been making pull requests on Hello Pat he's he's changing some stuff so Oh, yeah, I'm really appreciative of that. He's He's going in there he's he's making the making things better.

I am I'm by the way I'm taking suggestions for the name of the music show. Oh, if anyone has any boosts that to me. And I'm going to get started pretty soon I'm probably going to start before fountain comes out so I can kind of get my feet wet and get it going and I'm not quite sure I'm going to have an idea of what I want to do but I I want to do a variety of music. And not in you know, not just the wavelength top 10. But there's other stuff I want. And I actually I'd love to be able

Are you? So are you going to do this? What What kind of schedule Are you going to be on? You're just going to do it whenever you get enough stuff in the hopper, I'd like to,

I'd like to do it weekly. But my rule is always you got to do it weekly, you got to do it more or less the same day more or less the same time? That's, that's what I'm hoping for. Because I need more podcasts in my life.

To date. I mean, daily source code was not regular for a long time. And you still had tons of listeners. Yeah, that's

true. That's true. But I and I considered just resurrecting daily source code. But that feels wrong. For some reason. Just this is new. This is a new thing. It definitely won't be daily that will just confuse people. It always did. Yeah. Anyway, I'm excited. I'm very excited about this stuff. And it's going to unleash a whole new category of podcasting, podcast hosts will, will want to be a part of this. And I would say, you know, look at Sovereign feeds for an

Yeah, yeah. And we, in order to make this more palatable. For apps, though, we need some sort of solution for this socket issue.

Well, that's for the live stuff for the live stuff. Right? Yeah,

man. But I mean, that's, I feel like a live event I live is a big component of this. Oh, you're gonna have a lot of people want to listen live?

Yeah, that's where you get the boost to? Yeah, if you if you really want to do some value for value, you do it live. People love live shows. It's just the fact they love it. They love the pew pew, which I turned off during the songs. Hello.

Alex, what? Like, do you have any? Do you have any strategy for that on no agenda tube as far as like how you're going to communicate, you know, changes with the with the value time split? I guess just WebSocket? Or what are your thoughts there?

Yeah, we'll probably so Stephens got a experimental tag in his in the sovereign feeds feed already. It's like live values. I don't remember what it is exactly. But it's, it's using the Socket IO, Socket IO protocol. And we'll probably just get together I've been going back and forth with him, since he started will probably just document that schema and implemented in in the same way. So and that would be done via a plugin either either donkey with lightning, or I'll probably make

how do you do this? The question really, I guess, for for both of you had, how do you figure out when you have a when you have a function out late? So let me try to explain this so that people understand and then you can correct me if I'm wrong. And then I'll ask my question. The peer tube is a is a sort of is a core, it provides a bunch of core features and then everything additional, like RS like RSS feeds for podcasting, 2.0 and the lightning value, boosting that

Yeah, yes or no, for the most part, without getting too technical, I had to add to upstream the RSS changes we did for the podcast RSS feature for peer tube because that modifies some core functionality. But what I did it in the process was I made it I get I give I give plugins the ability to modify the fields and add extra features to which is how Dan's lightning plugin is adding the value blocks.

Okay, so that's what you upstreamed is the ability for plugins to make those changes.

Yeah, along with it with a default podcast RSS feeds that has the medium Miko video and in the live items for live stream. Okay, so

now with so let me see if I understand. So starting with Pierre to version 5.2. The default RSS feed that you get is a better quality feed, and it's got the median in there.

Yep, it's got the medium, it's got a live item, it's got alternate enclosures, which will probably expand upon a lot. It's also got the activity palette for cross F comments. So it's got the, it's got all the basics, you need to talk about packaged application.

That's excellent. So when you have a situation like that, like, like, Don, when you're looking at it thing like the remote, like value time split? How do you figure out whether that's going to be a, you know, something that you put into your plugin? Or if there's overlap with some other plugin? And like, is it just a crapshoot? Or how do you figure out how to put that in? Don Kimberlin (Errhead): I usually just try to implement it first, myself. And then if somebody else better implemented

Dave, maybe you can just explain to people who are new to this exactly what peer tube is when you because you've been I mean your knees deep in this and and I've only scoffed at it. Because I love because I love now I'm just not a video guy. But um, now I'm seeing that there's a lot of cool stuff we could do with this not just video, obviously, but just explain what's going on with it, what the experimentation has

Yeah, I mean, I'll just I'll give a nice deep in using it. There, you know, Alex's knees deep in actually doing the work to get the podcast in 2.0 stuff in there. But I it like me peer to peer tube is open source, self hosted video, you can spin up a peer tube instance and high level overview here, spin up a peer tube instance. And self host videos for multiple users. I mean, it's basically YouTube at a bar,

what do you need to self host? What what are the requirements?

I mean, just out of the box, all you need is a server. But then if you have if you are going to do it in a sort of a better, like more efficient way you would do it like an Alex, you can explain this, you have your setup. You could you can offload your HLS chunks to object storage in and do it better like that. It's sort of like having the peer tube, the peer to software does the transcoding. And the UI delivery

Yeah, and that's that's really for when you get into larger instances, like no agenda to where you have a lot of users and a lot of video, you need to start doing a lot of that. But if you're just doing this on your own, you're just using a small, probably two core gigabyte RAM VM. And you're good luck to mine. Yeah, yeah, even for live streaming, it's where if you want to do like, if you want multiple resolutions when he lies to me, alternatively p 720. P, then you need a lot more

Alright, so is this something that I can set mo up on because he's been wanting to migrate away from YouTube Live and have all the same functionality obviously with the with the booster grams as as the super chat functionality? Can he just point me set up an account point stream yard to no agenda tube and what else does he need? Does he just need a lightning address that to make it all work?

Yeah, lightning I mean, nobody's obviously isora particularly works with you on node two. And Don can speak more to that. But yeah, that's all you should work with anything that produces RTMP. Which stream yard does. So yeah, we're fine.

Yeah, I set up a guy with a live streaming system with a $50 a year. EPS, it doesn't take much nowadays. Oh,

nice. And now with the with these streams, this is one of the big things. Can you rewind? Can you go back and or start at the beginning? Can you do that kind of stuff?

None. Yeah, it would break some of the ways it does. Peer to Peer bandwidth sharing, which, honestly, if you turn on low latency doesn't matter anyway, which I think a lot of people are going to do. But if you haven't, if you haven't saved the VA, then it will save it just like on YouTube, and then on the RSS feed as well. So.

So, Alex, when you're the peer, that's the part that's one part that I that I didn't attempt to describe as the peer why it's called peer to peer to peer part of it. That's is that's done through Web. Web torrent. Is that right?

It's a modification of web torrent. So it's okay. Well, yeah, yes, I'll just say yes. Because it's complicated.

I guess you don't really have how often do you get the benefit of that? I mean, in the real world, you would only really

get it if you're having if you start getting hundreds or 1000s of people. At that point, yeah, you may or may not be interacting with a child much anyway.

That p2p only really kicks in if there's a lot of people watching at the same time, which is mainly live. The peer to node is what really helps with the stored videos. So if you're watching it, no agenda tube animated on no agenda tube, you're getting like one eight, that video data from no agenda tubes, object storage, and the rest is coming from other peer tube servers that are sharing that redundantly.

Cool. Yeah, and just to explain some numbers here, when you talk about live streaming, I think I did some numbers for Dave, the other day, we were talking about Bitcoin in Amsterdam, if we were to do a traditional attendee to p stream would be like 6000 kilobits per second. That's roughly 4000 users without any p2p bandwidth sharing. But what do they say? That'd be like, $15 an hour? Or something like

that? 1350, I think is what you said.

Yeah. So the cost isn't as high as it used to be. That's what Linode object storage costs. So it depends on their layer a

little bit higher. Yeah.

Yeah. But, so just looking at the service, that is no agenda tube. How do you have the setup? So if someone wants to use no agenda tube for live, but also for the recorded stuff that stays up there or live in his later, retrievable through recorded? Do you have a put yourself in that value block immediately? Or by default, so that, you know you're getting? You're getting some some value for the service? What is the I mean, I know

Yeah, by default, using Don's plug in every feed, I know generative has a I think it's 20%. But for no genyoutube Right now, which is probably high, but we don't really get anything anyway right now. So I'm going to lower that to if if I believe it kicks off, but I'm also considering having a separate service that isn't free for everybody. So

yeah, that probably makes no probably makes sense to because it means that whole thing of whenever you kick off something that's free for free forever, you know, open registration, that kind of thing is just such

everybody always wants. They all want. Once free.

We disable open registration, was it last year. So now now you have to request an account. So it's not just something that's good.

Yes. Yeah. Well, I haven't heard back from the email Chris over at MC one Amsterdam, with the specs we talked about, and just I was going to get back in touch with him, but he hasn't emailed me back. So I don't know about that one yet. But I mean, as far as like it at that level, and with I think he said, you know, they're expecting roughly 1000 online streams. I mean, that's, that's really not too. That's

Yeah. And if you're doing a conference, you're turning on high latency, you're doing as much bandwidth sharing as you want. Because you're interacting. Yeah.

That's true. Yeah, that's true. Talk about that, too, because you, you have the you have XMPP. Now, in the, in the in the rooms, is that still only on my room as an experiment? Or is that everywhere?

That is on all of nogen YouTube live streams. But it's done through the through live chat plugin. Through a lovely French developer. I think his name is John. And he's adding support for the RSS feeds in his next version as well. So with any, anyone who who live streams will have that automatically under generative and

we need to finalize that then.

Yeah, yeah.

What apps what? That of course, the using the web page works perfectly fine. What? What apps currently work well, with with the peer tube stuff for video.

The only one that I know that works is pauvres

against guru works to Alex.

Okay. Yeah. catches it needs. It needs support HTTP Live Streaming? which not many do because they don't do video. So and then I don't even think Padre supports the podcast chat tag yet. Okay, so you basically have to go to the website if you want to interact.

I spoke to Jason every podcast guru the other day. And he, he's, he's totally on board with, with, with XMPP. And like to put that in, and they they also support video which they, they they don't get. They fly under the radar a lot because they they just came on board with the value for value, but they have they have video support. And they're, you know,

Let's check it out.

Yeah, so we'll have to, we'll have to formalize. I'm just making a note, we need to go and formalize the chat tag, because it's not a complicated tag. I mean, it's basically just social interact with a couple of different attributes. Yeah, I

realize I've been telling so many people on no agenda, like, oh, you get everything in these apps. Go ahead. And but there's no chat. The only one has chat is curio Kassar, I guess, to pod versus chat as well.

I think it does the old version, not the new version.

What's the old version? The that was the attribute on the live version tag. Okay, so what I'm using I think you're using both now. He's just so I'm, I'm by? Yeah, well, go ahead.

Yeah, I was just gonna say Nathan G asked in the chat. He said didn't someone mentioned switching to broadcasting that alongside the ice cast brokers? So what? Let me just talk about that for a second. Because we spoke with Jason, about that the other day when that puck has guru, and I was telling him, we're talking about life support for socket,

forgetting pod fans and all the stuff we're talking about? I think I have the thing that pod fans has everything working

properly probably says so. So Sam submitted a PR this morning and it's literally every tag.

tech guy so amazing. He defends value for value like like, like a warrior. I'm doing it I really love Sam for that.

Me too. The only thing we have. The only thing we need for pod fans. I think they're really dependent on this and we probably need to talk about is the authorization tag. Yeah. For onboarding there. Yeah. In in trying to get that done. I was in the chat in the discussion thread this morning on it trying to get that.

Mother, she's at the GitHub GitHub threat thread that I stay away from. Yes, it is. Yes. Yes. Dangerous for my health. I missed the email addresses, it was so easy. Just want to say that's all I'll shut up about it. I missed it. I didn't need enhanced private privacy. I was fine.

The. So yeah, I've got to basically write something up. That's more formal for this. Here's the way this here's the way this this works. Just to run through it again, because there's seems to be this. There seems to be this misunderstanding. Got, I don't want to call it a misunderstanding. maybe I'm misunderstanding. So I'm just going to throw this out there. There seems to be this, this thing that comes back that these this flow can be intercepted.

Oh, so unique is no one said.

Well, Mike Hayden at Red Circle said it could be and I thought James was saying that too but I miss maybe I'm misunderstanding. I don't know Now could it be fished? For sure, but everything can be fished. Yeah, I mean like, you know, unless you have two factor authentication like you can if you have a man in the middle scenario, you can get fished all day long, but I'm not. But we're we've got to set that aside because that's not we're not we're not solving that here.

All I'm hearing is some people saying Why don't you just do Oh auth which I have no idea, which is easier

to see Oh, office, if people want to do Oh auth that's fine. But we don't need to write a spec for that. But if people want to do Oh off, if, if let's just say if rss.com wants to do Oh off the go. I mean, like they can just go do that. And then they can just say here's how we're going to pick they can publish that themselves and say, here's how we're going to do it. If you want to verify here, you can do it. And maybe other hosts adopt that same format? I don't know. But that

can just, I can just put it into the appropriate field. And I can put the token into the appropriate field in my feet, and it would work to Right.

Right. And with the authorization flow that I described earlier, what what can happen is you can say, all right, there's an all three pot fans could make this decision. Pot fans could do this, it could say, I see an authorization tag in your feed. Therefore, I'm going to kick you over to auth to verify at the at the hosting company. Or I don't see an authorization tag in the feed. Therefore, I'm just going to

All right, let's Let's just touch on a few others that might know that everybody's asleep. And we just touched on a few other things. Loving transcribe.fm Which who set that up again?

Nathan? Nathan Yeah, gathright.

hurting a little bit because of the speaker support issues. Because man, I don't want to screw up Martin's pod friend the way he's implemented, you know, the person tag in the, in the transcripts. And so we know almost no matter what I run it, it confuses me with multiple speakers. It doesn't it's apparently it's a lot more challenging to identify speakers consistently than I thought. Cuz I really love the speed of the service is outrageous. I mean, I'm waiting sometimes for an

I don't I mean, I would is, is the speaker recognition. Is that just slow it down? Is that what they don't do? I don't

know. I don't know. It's I mean, I'll tell you what otter.ai they transcribe and then you have to wait after the transcriptions on you have to wait Wait for it to do the it does the speaker stuff later.

Okay, so that must be Yeah, it must be. It must

be hard. I mean, it slows down. But I mean, it's not accurate. That's the problem. It's not accurate.

Alex, what do you think about like? I don't? Do you think there's, it's possible to do transcription like a transcription plugin and peer to?

I think there already is one. I just don't know how

there is one slight. I tested it, it did not work well on podcasts longer than like, 1020 minutes. And the results were really inaccurate. But they're working on it. And it should be coming along better hopefully. What Don? Do you know, like, was that running on server? Or was that calling out somewhere else? That was running on server, it downloaded everything it needed and ran it directly on the server? That was part of why it was having trouble.

hey, that's where the podcasts or plugin comes in. I've just from, from what I understand sovereign feeds will have a way to just be you know, it'll just work. It'll, it'll talk to transcribe.fm and pop it back. And then it just kind of there.

Yes, pretty. That's, that's a rad idea.

I just, I just, I really don't want to do away with the, with the speaker tags. Because that's so cool. And pod friend, I think other people will do that. Looks so good. The little, little chat, chat bubbles with our heads. Yeah, it's really it's a fun experience. Just look at like, wow, I can hear these guys speak. And I can see their heads. It's I don't know, it's something hypnotizing about it.

In the the person tag admission, talk to Oscar about that the other day. That's, that needs to be in there as well. Like, yeah, that needs to be a higher, a more broadly supported tag on the on the app side, because still, I don't see very many apps. Showing that information. And, you know, Mark Martin uses it to great effect with with the transcription and putting it right there prominently on the

That's what she said. Hey, I have two more things on my list here. The one is just because you know, I do the triage on info dot podcast index.org. I have been enjoying the API Dashboard. Thank you very much.

I've had a fixed a couple of things in there, too.

Yeah, I tried to reset someone's feed and it didn't really do anything. Or maybe there's no real way for me to know if a reset is done properly. And I don't know, people do show up and they just they just throw stuff out there like this, this that. Right, wrong. You know, it's like, oh, man, I really do think I'm a mind reader. So I'm not always sure that I'm doing the right thing for people but I have I

Yes, I saw that. Yeah, keeping

this one. But I love it. I love I love it. Other than just some feedback stuff. I'm not quite sure if if everything's working properly, but I'm happy, happy to have it. Some dude named Josh showed up and he I just want to read his note. He says, Thanks for this awesome project. I'm attempting to create a neural network based ad blocker for podcasts, your database is invaluable sources, annotate training data, like why that's interesting. I don't know if I'm a fan of that. But I

You can you can just hit the skip button. Yeah.

That's what everybody does. We all know it. Everybody does it.

You just skate read through those jokes. Yeah.

And I want to mention that I heard something very well, not concerning, I think is the dumbest business decision I've ever heard. Spotify. See Since they know they're scrambling for revenue, clearly, Spotify Premium min, but members can no longer pay via Apple's App Store. Because they, you know, they, they don't want to give up the 30% cut the the App Store tax. So people's premium subscriptions will just

Man? I don't there has to be this stuff like this has to happen. There has to be market movement away from apple, the apple walled garden of 30%. That that tax day. There has to be because my understanding was they were charging. So it's like non is like nine bucks a month if you if you went and subscribed directly on their site, but it was like 12 bucks a month. If you subscribed with Apple Pay because of the tax.

Same same thing that Twitter did, I guess? Yeah. Which is another mess. Because people are the things are changing very quickly around us all these models of payments. They're all breaking.

They are breaking. I don't know if you saw this. This was very interesting to me. Perhaps the most interesting thing that flew under the radar, the heard of a company called Media math. No, I have not. medium medium medium math file for bankruptcy. The demand side platform medium math file for

What does MediaMath do?

It says they're a demand side platform. I think that means they're one of the bit they add digital ad bitter, like DSP platforms, where, where the bidding takes place. For digital, like a service, like where there's like this dynamic auction system at ad surf time. If I'm not mistaken, this is their valuation. Let's see. They had raised like $600 million or

So they owe it to all the ad companies who were serving ads that they basically were Booking and Scheduling for the advertisers.

That's right, it says the bankruptcy will have a wide ranging effect on the advertising technology industry with many well known companies being owed more than a million dollars. The top five include Macknight at 12 Point 6 million PubMatic at 10 million snowbee at five never

even heard of these companies. Are these the companies that just snooping on me and throwing ads up everywhere.

Yeah, and ads with 3.4 million Yeah. Wow. This feels like the whole ad serving DSP digital. Yuck. Is like about to blow up.

Sorry, I'm laughing

No, I mean, it's hilarious. Wow, I mean,

this whole thing is falling apart, man.

Yeah, yeah, Nathan. Nathan says a programmatic ad bidding platform Sirius XM owns ads with AD Wiz and MediaMath owes them three and a half million dollars. Oh, yay. This thing is about to blow up.

That's not good. What's this clip you got here? Do you thought this was the

new this is the new FTC influencers guidelines. This is like they released this a few days ago. They're cracking down on social media influencers. That on how they have to disclose their sponsorships. And in advertising.

I thought you already had to do that. I thought I thought that was like a prerequisite that you had to let people know.

They did. But the guidelines were vague. So now they've like beef them up and give him some juice. You wanna you want to listen to this nice young lady explained it to him of course.

Hi, I'm Amber Lee. Attorney. Mission.

Okay, this is my attorney. Shoot, I'd fire her for that voice. You can't represent me You don't sound like a bulldog.

Hi, I'm Amber Lee, an attorney at the Federal Trade Commission. Do you recommend or endorse things on social media? If you do, here are some tips to help influencers like you comply. With the law, whenever you endorse a product, you have to tell people if you have a relationship with the brand. So if a brand pays you, or gives you free stuff or discounts Wow, tell people about that relationship. When you promote anything from that brand. Make sure people will see and

Wow. So if you're an advisor to accompany you need to disclose that too, I guess.

Yeah, there's a bunch of they have this like what we call like a fac that tells you, here's what you need to do under certain circumstances. Like, it's like, Can I do this? No, can I do this, here's what you got to do. So this was they'll see this guy ran it down, he says adding adding hashtag or hashtag add or hashtag sponsor or similar disclosure in the caption of a tick tock is not enough, it needs to be overlaid in the video itself. D influencing

If I'm looking, I'm looking at what they're saying that I'm not, I'm looking at their their rules. ftc.gov/influenza. And, you know, even if it's a family relationship, you've got to disclose it. I mean, so even if you just have a phone call, you kind of got to disclose that. Really? Yeah. And do you know how big this market is? I was reading habit here from McKinsey, I guess McKinsey would

Whoa, that's so much bigger than I thought it was me to me the entire music industry is what 5 billion?

Well, we're chipping away at it. It's 4,900,000,000.

I mean, that, wow. That's

as big man.

It's kind of shocking and

that have to come after podcast pretty soon, too. I mean, they're only talking about social media. But this it's got to be the same. You have to have the same. The same rules for podcasting, I would presume.

Yeah. The word podcasting did not appear in any of the new guidelines.

No, of course not idiots. There's your loophole. I'm doing a podcast.

Well, there's your there's your A incentive for other services to call themselves podcasts. or YouTube. There you go. yourself a podcast. You're not a social media influencer. You're a podcaster.

Man. Yeah. So, so I need to ask, you know, what is this? This peer tube? Is that a podcast? Because Todd Cochran wants to know.

I mean, technically, it's not an audio file in the enclosure. Yeah. It's just a text file.

A text file. Oh, man, I love those guys arguing. It's so

that's what, that's why the medium title is valid. Like, I see people who have things that they call podcasts on YouTube and Oh, good. They're not always maybe they have not really RSS feeds. But the medium is the podcast. And then that's kind of where the whole idea started. Which is why we're here today. I

love that go medium tag.

Yeah, it's it's crazy. It's critically important to go where we need to go.

I'm with you, brother. Let's do this. Let's thanks some people because we got been getting a lot of boost coming in during this during this lit lit version of the show. And I want to thank people appropriately. We have a white mic is what he's called. A white mic booster to booster grams or 3333. I guess he's coming up with names for the for the show true audio party, tap tap into the party to audio party with redundant word party. But what but what did from pin number

what is it

I don't know it just says Dave Jones so maybe just he just put you in there I don't know what he's using but your wallet receives something I'm sure boop donation to eight double oh eight from I am Mr. Robot just noticed the animated logo and fountain live for this episode definitely is the first one I've seen would love to see it implemented more five by five in the GIF. Yeah, that's our beautiful, our beautiful lit arch which is indeed animated and works. We love it. Courtesy

We got one. Baller Pay Pal. Oh, right. Yeah, we did. From the [email protected]. Ben and Alberto, in the gang of $555.

Dude, thank you so much. rss.com. Man, keeping us going appreciate that so much. Appreciate your

location, location, location. Thank you, Adam, Dave, and all other contributors to the location tag from your [email protected] they released four tags supported now things look better look this up. Location liasons episode and season so they get there. They're coming on there and they're rolling them out.

Nice. Steven B just sent a suggestion. For name, which I'm going to first see if it's available for I mentioned it.

Only send a send in boost. Boost form.

Yeah, hold on. Let me see if it's available. What do you think of boost bangers ball?

I like it. I like boosts mayor's ball. That

boosts bangers ball might be cute. We could also do boosters ball but boost bangers ball kind of fits with me a little bit although I want people to think it's only one type of music. True boost bangers my wife registered it just in case you never know. John the list even thank you very much. Good one good idea.

Let's see here. Okay, I guess Mr. Graham's Thank you, Ben and Alberta. Appreciate you guys. Yeah, thank you. I guess Mr. Graham's 3333 from harm head times to no note thank you hard hat. Oh, there's Blueberry. Blueberry said oh, he said he sent his animated GIF to me. Nice. Sorry. I couldn't get his in before the show. No, no problem. I've I was gonna I was gonna send him his 100k sat bounty and ran out of liquidity.

Chris? Oh, yeah. He gives us all the inside dirt on the strike on the pending strike. Which by the way, if UPS goes on strike, this is going to be a problem in America.

Yeah, Mirka is going to cease to exist

will be a problem.

UPS Chris and 2222. And he says thank you for that. Thank you, Adam for constantly telling the truth.

My pleasure

to see DS last and 777 He says I love These meetings. You too are doing the Lord's work. Well, thank you these last Expo RIT A resume XORESME xo XO Resnick so resume.

Resume. I don't know.

10,000 says no, no, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So resume, Chris from Jupiter. Jupiter broadcasting that Chris Vickery says a monster satchel a huge satchel Richard, it has to be huge to fit his social Richard 111111 fountain. Very nice.

Boost. Thank you. Beautiful

boosting for that road duo talk. I'm also keeping my eye on it near tax time.

Yeah, I set up my whole duplicate system. I got everything everything is now in duplicate. But you know, the duo was 499 all the other stuff my MIDI keyboard by Yeah, I got another mouse I got another mouse pad I got a regular your wireless keyboard of course I hook it all into the what do you call it into the surface, which I take on the road, which I also updated. It's always fun when you open up a Windows machine three months since the last time you use it. It takes about three

I'm beautiful. Get it? I'm gonna have to get it. It's a

beautiful box. And I'll give any if you want my my settings, we're happy to send them to you.

Yes, absolutely. I'm gonna have to get it because I think I'm going to start a new podcast at some point. Oh,

are we are we breaking up? Are you cheating on me?

No, this is an open relationship.

I don't know if I'm poly? I'm not so sure. A poly podcaster

or you don't want to be in the lifestyle? No, I

don't think so.

No, this is not this is not that kind of fun. This is a solo operation here. Oh,

what are you going to do? When do you want to lift a little tip of the veil?

Oh, it's just it's nothing big. It's just something to read a ton. tons of books like I just finished the technological society by Chaka law. Great book, Fantastic book, big book. And as I'm reading these books, I highlight a lot a markup a lot. And I'm like, you know this. So take a deck of book like the technological society. Very dense, very thick

I like that. Yeah, that's kind of what you do on signal you send me little blurbs from from some of your books.

Yeah and then like I could thread it like it's a way to get through and hit the all the highlight the cliffnotes version of a book in in Episode form over you know over a few weeks

into that I'd subscribe for sure. Count me in count me.

Well, I need to do I need a road caster do Oh,

yes. Yes. Then count me in.

Okay. Brian is bigger. 500 says that's a fun song boosting Thank you Thank you. Be mozzie Brian mozzie through fountains and it's 3333 says go podcasting podcast your uncle Uncle Laurent sent us satchel Richards go podcasting.

There you go. I'll do it.

remake. remake. Rhema King. I don't know these names. Remaking Oh, here it is remaking Eden. Oh yeah, remaking Edison 5000 SATs no note that that one. Made my eyes crossed. Jean been 4096 a 4k killer boost. Said they said the new XMPP enabled boost bot that also post activity pub sounds really nice. And he sent another 4096 Thank you. GMB. Alex. What exactly have you done? What did you do with the with the boost bot as you hooked it into the room on or the channel on no agenda tube?

Well, that's kind of the beautiful thing about XMPP and activity buffers. It matters. You don't really hook it into the room so much is you have an account that you connect to the erection PP server and it will post it whatever room is in the feed. So whenever a push comes in, it listens to l&d. It finds the XMPP room and the chat tag and it posts to that room. So that's all this.

So you just you took, you can boost byte code and just written in added that in there.

And the benefit of that versus IRC is you don't need an account on every IRC server. You just have one account

Okay, and that's Ivan's code Yep. Python

I don't think he's I believe it's running in his his yet so we'll have to help him with that. Okay, so I run it myself.

Oh, killer awesome. We got Jean bean again with 10,000 says boosting the tunes and podcasting 2.0 from pod verse while flying home for vacation. Oh, post 5000 SATs from Nick it says good too and one of the better V for V tracks as the 3333 from I love sushi says test boost from pod verse we got you I love sushi. Bill Prague. Think he's a hot thing. Bill's a hive guy. 5000 SATs they found he says not sure

yeah, we've we've thought of that and we're just crossing our fingers and our legs.

Yes, right. Anonymous 10,000 says he says coupon coupon codes are bullshit. Okay, bad career advice. Chad says hello Richards through Felton. He says boosting for the protection of listeners from the homeliness of their favorite podcasters on jump 13579 through pod verse he says boosting from pod verse did it go through? Did it go to the

There you go three and one nice

through found he says I truly believe that value for value will change the world digital content creators of all sorts music podcasts art written word in their audience are going to learn why this is important. It's a win win for both sides. Both feel better after the value exchange added a V for V presentation at a Bitcoin meetup last night in the excitement is palpable. When combined with programmable money, it is such a is so killer. A cover the philosophy of this all in the

right. Yes, yes. Yes. I'm sure you heard about it. It was kind of interesting to see. Larry Fink douchebag think ESG Fink of Blackrock on what was that? The Fifth of July. So it was right after? Right after Fourth of July, obviously, on on Fox Business. He was interviewed for about 15 minutes and he was just say he was singing bitcoins praises

that the ETF thing I think is is a much. It's a big deal. Well, it's actually a big deal.

I mean, I don't know if that's good or bad or whatever. But I have I think

well, let me see. I don't know if you remember this as well. That's a stupid thing to say. Of course you do you remember all this stuff? The Z and I'm serious about that. Because you remember you have a clip memory. That's crazy. Yeah. Do you remember about a year and a half ago on this show? You played a clip from Larry Fink talking about Bitcoin. And your comment at the time was that you thought that these dudes like him? Were in the background? building their own

horse? Oh, no, in fact, think it was this one. It's quite it's

still a very small market. And it can move in very large increments with small movements of money. And so it's not a market for the for the for the calm. I understand the enthusiasm.

When you were talking about maybe

the Murata. This asset category is so small relative to other asset The category and the preponderance that is being discussed on Bloomberg and other sources of media tells you that, you know, people are fascinated about it. So I would say Business Media believes it's going to have a huge future. But but let's bring it down to the investor side, everyone is

fun to watch. So that was June 24 2021. I have 45 seconds of him from this earlier this week. And also I do believe the role of crypto is it is it's digitizing gold in many ways. It's instead of investing in gold as a hedge against inflation, a hedge against the onerous problems of any one country or, or the, for the devaluation of your currency, whatever country you're in. Let's be clear, Bitcoin is an international asset. It's not based on any one

in that earlier that earlier thing, it's clear he said we need to we need to, it could be a store of value. We need a broadening of the market. That's what the largest that's the ETF. I've seen ETF

Yeah, well, at least is recognized as something real. Yeah, we see it as real as real value.

Borlaug. 10,001 sets the pod verse, no note, thank you for log, and we got the delimiter comic strip blogger 30 3015 through founding says, howdy, Dave and Adam. Are you seeking intelligent, provocative conversation on the topics shaping our world? Dive into the unrelenting podcast, your weekly enlightenment with hosts Jean from Texas and Darren from Chicago area from sorry, they again, from politics to technology and societal issues, they fearlessly tackle it all

CSV, man it's so nice. He's promoting all these other podcasts and I think that's very commendable. Very nice of him.

Let's see. Did you get drips gots? 123456 I did.

I did a few more that came in just now. Steven B says boost bangers ball was cotton gins suggestion credit do and then TJ the raffle 70,000 SATs. Thank you very much TJ exciting music talk today I want to help even more but as a recovering musician and struggling just to survive I'll boost when I can. Everyone supporting and working on P 2.0. V four v music Thank you see people excited.

I don't know what this is a Boris Celski. He sent this notice that you really want to go the kim.com path

kim.com path. Oh, is that about influencer stuff?

I don't know. I don't know. I'm not sure what he's talking about those decent 10,000 SATs but I don't know. I don't

know for sure. We got 1000 SATs from our Davis 87 book talk weekly with Dave Jones dynamite. There's your name book talk weekly.

book blurb not blur. But blur.

Beautiful, beautiful.

Oh, we get the monthlies. Yeah, we got it. We got a few of those may run down. We'll see. We got Cameron Rose $25 Thank you, Cameron. He's been with us for a long time. Scott Jalbert $12 Chad Pharaoh. Thank you, Chad. $20.20 Mark Graham. $1 new media that's Martin lindskog. $1 Thank you Martin. Joseph maraca $5 Jeremy new $5 and Emilio Cano Molina $4

Thank you all very much this is a value for value product the entire project is value for value if you ever wondering if this stuff works just sit here and listen to the boosted gram and the donation segment it does people like to support things that they're a part of they'd like to be a part of the community and you can be they are with booster grams with Fiat fund coupons as well we've got the chat room we've got the you know the podcast index dot social this started from zero

The Dave Jones brand was epic.

So you know, it's because we pushed and we pushed and we and we asked them we said here's the value return it to us and people do in many ways, but the three main ones are time talent and treasure go to podcast index.org down at the bottom you can find two ways to send in your your donations or what we always really likely to see you do is get one of those podcasts apps ditch the legacy ones go to podcast apps.com

that was me that was through see I have put my clipboard on. On this radiator.

Oh okay,

that was mouths making radiator noises Don may be cooking on his servers that could be he's in the server room literally while we're podcasting

so to make up for feeling bad Alex why don't I play after we end the show? Why don't I play your buddy There The Official detox music guy cuz I got it lined up. I got it in the split kit might as well right?

Yeah, show legit shout out to Jameson.

Okay because he's gonna go and talk to the SoundCloud people so he's going to change SoundCloud mind, I'm sure. Anybody else any any other things we got to do before we get Oh, stop. What is this? What is this? No, this isn't that this? I can't believe this. This is I mean, I've seen some Richards in my day.

How many Richards is it?

We just got five Richards plus three, eight in total from Stephen B. Play 1 million. No. 111,111 SATs a massive satchel of Richard's Holy moly. He says Enjoy your summertime pizza party from everyone who used curio caster. The LM pay wallets are now officially closed out.

Damn, Stephen. Whoa. swinging his riches all over the place.

I mean, slap my Richards in my face. Man. That was beautiful. Oh, man. Thank you so much, brother. Oh, there you go. What else do we need to say about the value for value model?

So that's a close out on Elon on his LNP Yes, it is. Yeah. Okay, sweet. Because it will. I guess we'll talk about that next week. Because we're gonna we're gonna start trying to phase out Elon pay. Yeah. Because we it is costing us almost 500 a month. So that's, that's expensive. So there's not much usage going on look this morning. And the usage was like, Yeah, last thing, the last sets that came in, were from like, June.

Okay, we're really close. Well, thank you, Steven B and everyone else who boosted in stream sets. You also gave that to that value to Don and Alex who are both in the in the block in the live block for today as well. And they'll go into the into the block for for the episode. So that's very much appreciated. Thank you so much. Thank you, chat room. You all have been very kind to us today. Don. Alex, thank you very much

Yeah, just just don't just want to make the ecosystem better. So Don Kimberlin (Errhead): then we know they can the world better and protecting free speech.

They're so humble. I love these guys. Brother Dave. Thank you, man. Thank you for keeping me on the straight and narrow. You're right We're just gonna do the only shim we're gonna use as in the title today alright everybody coming up right after we're done we'll bring you official detox music when I can be be make sure you boost and we'll see you next week here on podcasting 2.0 You have been listening to podcasting 2.0 Visit podcasts and die for for more information

it's bigger than I thought it was.

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