Episode 120: Chop & Drop

Oh, podcasting 2.0 for February 3 2023, episode 120 We got the chop and drop. Friday once again, are you ready for the board meeting? That's right. It's the meeting you actually want to attend on a Friday board meeting of podcasting. 2.0 everything going on with the incredible namespace with the index podcast. index.org. But really, everything that's

discussed during the week in podcast index dot social. I'm Adam curry here in the heart of the Texas Hill Country and in Alabama, the Sultan of scissors to run with say hello to my friend on the other end, ladies and gentlemen, Mr. De Jones. You jinxed me 100%. I mean, what do you mean? You were talking about biting the inside of your mouth? It's like during the intro, I've got some granola and I just rocked to the roof. I don't know what Oh, my God, it hurts. I mean, like, is there

blood? Yeah, holy crap. I don't know what I just did. I have these temporary chompers in the front, top and bottom. And, you know, if you don't pay attention, like if you're talking while something's in your mouth, or I'm leaning a little bit to the left hand side, then I can just kind of like nip the inside of my lip. And of course, the minute you do that, it gets thick. And then it's just primed. It's just a target. Now it's a target. Even talking, even talking. I can

feel it going. Come on, come on. You want to bring it a little tighter. But the Pope, exactly are they doing brother? I'm good? Yeah, yeah, it's been. It's been kind of a crazy week. But yeah, I'd say in general, pretty good. A lot of stuff going on a lot of information, that information coming out everywhere and new information. And I had a couple of questions for you, actually, before we because we have we have guests in the boardroom today. I'm very excited about that. We do

we do? We do have guests? Yes, yes. They're there in the lobby. A couple things from from the GitHub that I've been reading along with that, I think it's important to update everybody on they need to go and see it if they don't understand it. The first one is I believe we now have a clarification for what a fee is in the value for value model. Is this is this a clarification from me? Yes. You're going to say that's correct, sir. That is correct.

As we do and what was anything changed to clarify this? Or? Or is it? I mean, can you give me a synopsis of how what a fee is versus a split? And how that is calculated? This is one of those things that have been perpetually difficult to explain. Yeah, that's why I have to I figured I put you on the spot for it. So that somebody posted an issue and said, you know, like, what am I've got? I've got to split concept thing. I've got it down.

But what is the fee? How do I calculate that it's not clear from the dogs? I mean, I'm not sure that there is a way to make it super clear. This is one of those things where it's like, no matter how you explain it, the language just won't. It just kind of always gets in your way. Well, why don't why don't we start with who would use a fee versus a split. Any service that wants to just have a straight percentage,

regardless of what else is in the split. So if I if I run a service, and I and let's just let's just make up a hypothetical service here, where you're gonna put me in your split. And for that I give you back. Let's just say stats. I give you back, right? Yep. Perfect. Perfect example for contracts as an example contract. Yeah. So So contracts may say, if you want to use our service, we charge a 1%. Split. Yeah. Okay. The splits are, the way

the splits work is they're based on a share model. So you, if you have three splits, they don't have the, the split attribute that is defined in each split destination. That number does not have to add add up total up to 100. So you can have a split with 150, a split with 25. And in another split with 20 with us, give me an N and another split with 75.

You've already lost me I don't understand. Yeah. So like if you the the when you're defining your receipt, your value recipients and the value blog, you have to put a there's a required attribute called split and that's just a number and it does the number those the number doesn't have to you have to eat 100 the number of all of that together doesn't have to equal 100. So if you had three splits, and one of them was 171 of them was 20. And one of them was 90 percentages.

Now these that's the thing, they're not percentages, that those three splits equal add up to 280. Yeah, so you're you're not, you're not working, the splits are not vase 100, the splits are just rent a rent or just whatever numbers that you put in there, that when taken together, represent the shares amongst each. So if you take that those three addenda, in that example, added up to 280. You now you take that 280. And you've figured out what the percentage of each split number

is of the 280. So you're just you're taking too you're taking whatever the total is, of all the splits? This is Common Core, right? Or is it modern monetary theory? I'm not sure which one it is. It's both it's post modern monetary theory, the obvious question will be in a moment, like, why not just I mean, what I'm doing in sovereign feeds is it all adds up to 100? To 100%? Because that's easy for you as a human to do that math on the fly. Correct. So but there's a few reasons why. There's,

there's a couple of reasons why this is better. Not the least of which is that if you, if you get those numbers wrong, if everybody expects just a base 100 calculation, and if you get that number wrong, and it adds up to 103. What do you do? Like, it's now you're now you've completely you're out of spec, and there's no way to sort of recover from that and figure out

what they're supposed to be. So this gives you doing it this way gives you flexibility to, to add up to whatever value and the the app can still make a calculation and enrich and come out with same results. Because you, you take your you take whatever number it adds up to. And you consider that as your as your 100. And then you figure out the percentages based on it makes like, it's like having shares in a company, you know, a company can have, you know, a million million outstanding shares.

Well, who who owns 50% of the company, you just figure out who's got 50% of that total of the total outstanding shares, this is the same way who somebody gets 50, you know, somebody's getting 50% of have to add, then they have to have, you know, they have to have the 50% of whatever to to add 140. So, like that's, that's the way that you do it. So since it's a share model, there's no clean way to just define a percentage. With regards to just a service that wants a percent a flat, A

flat fee. So if those are in the in our example, let's just say contracts wants to charge 1% for their service. If the shares are always fluctuating, and it can be any number, you can just put a one in there because that one as a once as a split with one, because one doesn't mean what you say, doesn't mean anything. Well, hold on, hold on. Maybe this is not a good example, contracts,

doesn't have power to do anything. In my feed, or in my split, I as the producer and the creator of the feed have that power. Right, right. So I still, I'm complete, I understand. No, I really don't understand I don't I seriously, I don't if so just from my perspective, and maybe we're talking on two different planes here. Maybe we're talking under the hood, and what the podcaster sees. So on the podcaster and for this episode, there's as 5% for one guest 5% For the next guest 5%

For Dred Scott. There's, I think, some percentages for sovereign feeds, which I put in there, which is not taken automatically. And, and I've put in 1%, for my user on fountain, so we show up in the activity there. And then whatever's left over, goes to podcast index, which is at this point, like 58%, in my mind, and it adds up to 100. And that's how I do it. Wow, who's doing this one ad that you speak of?

It? I don't know who's doing it. But that's the way the way that you do it is valid, because it it it's still just share based. It's like so you're you're just taking 100 as what you want everything to total up to what shouldn't that be the requirement? No, no, why not? Because, because if if if you recall Word that always adds to 100. Yeah. And and one of the number and it

doesn't, then it's, then it's broken. Correct you do it, if you do it based on a share model, then even even if it doesn't, if you've fat fingered something, and it goes in there wrong, it's still people still get it still functions. Like, imagine if you've broken if everything is a percentage. And then you expect every split be a percentage of 100. And something goes in there wrong. And it actually adds up to 103. What is the app supposed to do

what my app does? It says you cannot go further. You've done it wrong. Right. And see, that's what you're trying to avoid. You try you don't We don't. We don't want that. We don't want this the strictness of having to do that no interest because it breaks things. Okay. All right. So like if you if something as of 203 Was

it? Well, then let's let's but just for simplicity of for simplicity of explaining this, I would recommend not starting off with Well, you got 180 You gotta write what you know that all that already got me out. already fell on the floor. So, right, okay, so let's just say it all adds adds up to 100. Now, now take it from there to the fees. Okay, so the well, the see if you That's That's it, that's important, though, is important that it doesn't have to add to

100. Because otherwise the fee, the reason the fee is there doesn't make any sense. I understand. Yeah, let's just let's just take that case to make it easy for me. Okay. So then the fee, if you the fee attribute vehicles, vehicles true means that whatever this split is, you want a total what you want 1% to be taken off the top after the calculation is made. So what you want is you want to say okay, I want 1% to go to Daniel J. Lewis, by AP would immediately reject that, because of Daniel J.

Lewis, who was at no does not compute. Yes. canvasback just spread. Okay. I see. All right. Now. So this makes sense. I recommend we never talk about it in this way ever again. Because this is that this is what I'm saying? Like, yeah, is it possible to discuss it? No, no, no, here's No. Oh, it's not boring me brother at all. It's money. And it's important here, here's how I understand. Let me just see, maybe we can cut corners. So we're going to say

that I have everything adding up to 100. And now we have the app that is that is that that person is using takes a 3% fee. So now it's 103. But what the app is going to do now under the hood is going to make a share model and recalculate that. So it's all it comes down to the that's your how many outstanding shares nothing that nothing at all that the user has to even know about. That's just under the hood. Right? Right. Yeah. Well, yeah. So you know, the, it's all on our system anyway.

Yeah, sure. But I thought there was a difference between a fee being a part of the entire pie. Or in something being put on top. Yes, so the so the way the way that the spec is written, you take you take all the shares, add them up, and then okay, so whatever the payments gonna be, somebody sends a booster gram, and this is boost gram is 1000 SATs may got 100 and make it 100. Okay, okay. 100. So, this grams, 100 sets and you got, you know, you got three splits you at you take that wonder sets,

you figure out what the share amounts are. So you fit you calculate the percentages to figure out how, how much eat split gets done, you you have those numbers ready. Yeah. But then the before you do, before you do any of that. You take whatever, if there's any fees listed. You take them in order and you say okay, 1% If there's a 1% of the split in here, you take one set it off the top, send that split and then the now you're down to 99 sets and so then you recalculate everybody's

split shares based on that. Okay. So the fee is a request to say hey, we want we want recalculation of the whole recalculation right. Yeah, we want to fee off the quote, quote, unquote, off the top In, that seems important, because there's really no other way to if you don't say, where the fee comes from, then you don't know. Like, there's no, it's just up to the app developer. Basically, there's the spec is written with the, with the goal, to at all

costs. Don't, don't leave the spec ambiguous so that the app can make a mistake. Got it. And because it goes, you what you don't want is people bitching at the app developer that they that they screwed him out of out of some kind of payment, like, Oh, you didn't do it, right. And bla bla bla bla is like, okay, even if even if there's some quibbles about how it's done, you want it to be just as rock solid, clear as possible when it comes to doing the math in the app.

Right? Totally agree. So we just need to never explain it the way you started off to people who are because people who complain will look at that and go, Hmm, that just No one No, I didn't I get it. It's, it's a weighting. Which is important. Because you're adding you're you have an external factor that is unknown, that is a fee. And you want to add that in, to then go back and recalculate everything based upon the new amount. And that's

how you can count up to 103. Or, God forbid, 110 or whatever, then everything is recalculated, got it to V COMM The to V comes through in the in the boost with the sphere with the full thing, the full number with it with the original number. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's honor system, but then the service could say, you know, hey, you know, you're, you're not really you're not doing what we asked. And, you know, they they could say, you

know, they can make an issue out of it if they wanted to. I mean, I doubt anybody would, but I mean, at least it's there, they could check the math if they wanted to, to make sure people weren't right. Not ruin him or whatever is there. I've heard talk of people saying, well, there should also be a split that is just based on a number of Satoshis is that in there somewhere? I don't know what you mean. Can you explain that?

So instead of fountain saying you activate this service for 1% you activate this service for five sets? Oh, I see just a straight straight upset static amount Yeah. There's no no there's no function in there for that. That just doesn't seem to be I don't even see how that's doable it wasn't it was a conversation on podcast index dot social. And and I initially thought Oh, that's interesting. And then I thought no, it's a very bad idea. And you would be crazy to do that.

Yeah, the flat fee just seems like it would break well not not just break it's like why take a flat fee when you can get a percentage I mean, you're always gonna get one set can only be more now just because it was just a conversation. Just want to make sure that that didn't show up and that died on the vine just just like we did just like coil Oh yeah, no, I don't like dancing on graves. But man that went fast. We were I don't know is two and a half years is that fast?

Well, no, we were talking about the web monetization and it had to be jammed into the value block we had to do it I gotta do it. Everybody's gotta be in that we want to take Visa MasterCard and two weeks later, coil bids farewell. She's dead. Well, no, actually they've updated the page coil bids farewell but not goodbye not goodbye.

Huh? Well, I don't understand this because if you look at their page, if you read the statement, it says what is going to happen to my wallet and it says something like your inner Ledger Wallet will continue to function you know because your inner inter Ledger Wallet provider is not going away or something like that will coil was the only wallet provider so it seems like a distinction without a difference. Well I'm glad everybody took the money Yeah, good job. I

mean getting the job every but now I feel kind of stupid. Now we could we should have taken 85 grand that would have been good. We could have put that in our pocket. Yeah, and implemented something and take it right out two weeks later. I'm not accusing anyone getting PPP PPP grant. Yeah. I mean, congratulations to to Peter rights for coming into the wire getting I hope to check. Yes, one other thing from the GitHub, because it's just been

fascinating. And I read along with everything, not that I understand everything, but I saw ROI even show up in this one. And now this is the ln URL addresses or I guess we're calling them lightning addresses, which I think are two different things. I think it's worth yet again asking you for a little explanation if you can of what is happening there. Wow. Sorry. Should I not do this so close to the weekend? No, no, I'm fine. I'm good. I'm being amusing myself. Yes. Go ahead. Ask away.

Well, what is it? What are we using? And what the hell was it for? The so there's there's asking for an attribute. I'm assuming this is switched on that Brandon Belinda first stab at changes to add L L and address. I think this is a this is an request for an attribute to be put in. So that you can put in an L an aligning address, instead of just a node ID right now, so that you can Yeah, so what I understood was, this is like the get Alby address

where it's known URL. And, and if you test so for instance, although it's not set up, if you use the lightning address [email protected], it would actually resolve to, you know, slash known URL, dot whatever. And then it would have a file in there, I think, a JSON file, and it has my, my node, my Node Details. Right, so that you don't have to look up. If I had

the custom key custom value, all that stuff is in there. And it's just using that, too, as a shortcut to all of the details that you would need for your lightning wallet to either yet to be added. add someone to a split. So that it looks like it looks like and make sure. So I thought I thought you were a little more in the loop on this. If you don't know what it is we can just skip it.

And it will I know that the I know that. There were there was a suggestion to add an extra attribute that was that would handle an address. A lightning resolved address through the dot well known. But it looks like what Brian has done here. I didn't see this before it looks like he's proposing. Did it just did it just be in the spec to resolve it. If they see it. So like it would still it would still go into? No, that's I'll have to read over this. And there was no

way. I'm sorry, I didn't. That's why I asked him like what exactly are we doing? And I saw Roy chiming in about how that relates to ln URL, which is really worth it. I got it. I got I got this. I guess this is this is the extra attribute. This is what I thought it was. I misread the pull request. Yeah, this is the extra attribute. So he's, they're proposing that there be either an address attribute or an ln address attribute. An ln address attribute would would be

the the resolver. Yeah, and I mean, I don't I don't really have. I don't really have a problem with that. I guess the only thing that feels awkward to me is that I'm generally uncomfortable with attributes that only exist based on a different attribute being set to a specific value. I hate it when that happens. I'm so against that stuff. I knew you would. I knew I knew if I threw that out there. You'd

be on my side. Always. Yeah, so like, if you have type equals lightning, method, keys associated type equals lightning, then all of a sudden, you have the possibility to use this extra attribute ln address. But if you have type equals list, I don't know something. Take something else. A Mineiro or some some i Let's just take some other crypto crypto. Cryptocurrency in ln address as an attribute doesn't make any sense. Because there's there's nothing there that fits what

that is. So you have an attribute. And while it is optional, which is fine, but you have this attribute that only depends on the value of a different attribute in order to sort of activate. And that's, I mean, it's not the end of the world. It's fine, but it just feels a little that doing that always feels a little bit awkward to me. Well, I'm wondering if we can have a difference? Well, here here's my here's my question. So if I have Adam add

to get albie.com or Adam mccurry.com is make it easy. And that's my lightning address, which means that you can use that to resolve my node ID or whatever details. But will it also be my Ellen URL address? I believe no. Because that would be very confusing. Yeah. Yeah. I wonder if the I wonder if the way forward here is to is to just write this back so that there's an expectation that if the address is formatted in a different way, that it's a

different thing. I mean, sort of like the way that if you have, you have different Bitcoin wallets and based on the prefix of the way that the hash is, you know, which wallet address type it is, whether it's seg wit or piano, or whatever, like, you kind of know, is you're looking at almost like looking at a header to determine what what you're dealing with. So I mean, it could be something as simple as if it has an add symbol in it, which is not in A, which is not in a lining address, excuse

me, which is not in a node, ID. It's got an add symbol. Try to resolve it as a as a as a lightning address. But I don't know, I'm gonna assume Yeah, anyway. So this is why I bring it up, because it feels very confusing. ln URL is used a lot. And we spun our wheels forever on the Ellen URL mafia to get it all into the spec. Thanks, guys for not developing anything after all that noise. So annoying, because you know, upfront, it's they're just doing

it to say it and a habit. But Ellen URL is a payment mechanism is extremely handy. And a lot of people use it. So we think it's a bad idea. If, if you have the same concept [email protected] to pay me like a Venmo address. And then Adam mccurry.com to resolve a my node ID. But if I don't have a lightning, an ln URL attached to that, then that's going to fail. And so it has to either both work or your, as you said, be a different identifier.

My, my, I guess the thing I would want the most. And and I'm not sure if this is just me being idealistic would be that whatever happens on this shouldn't even be need to be in the spec. That this should be well, I mean, we're getting off in the weeds here. But but the API involved would resolve this on its own on its own because like that the Okay, so Elena for the for instance, LM pay, the LMP would do the resolution of

that. And so in the address field in the split is just whatever it is just whatever it is, it's either a node ID or a lightning address or whatever. But then, but I understand that that that puts, because it here's here's what I'm imagining I'm imagining is to cast thematic cast, thematic does all

of its stuff on in app. And so cast thematic is going to have to resolve potentially a whole bunch of lightning addresses ahead of time, it's already having to make a lot of web requests, a lot of API requests to do these payments to begin with. If we then hit it with a value block that has nine splits in it, and all of them are our lightning addresses, then cast a

man is going to have to resolve not do nine lookups. And then nine more API requests, like you're talking about potentially 20 API requests, and web resolutions, the these are no longer even API requests. These are general get requests for various web domains. I would say you've answered my question sufficiently that this is not ready to be set to be put to bed, there's a lot of thought

needs to go into it. And I would say for the splits that I see a lot of comments in the in the chat room, we are late, by the way, for those who don't know, now available on podcast addict pod verse, we are let the place for your comments on how you want to do splits is in the GitHub. And all of this comes to mind because I was not paying attention. I was just going along with the chatter and I'm very sad about something that got put to bed and I think fucked up my life and other

people's life. The Lord Jesus help me witness. We spent horrible, yes, it is horrible. It really is. You know, I've been taking over some of the duties of the day to day when people are asking for feed changes, feed removal, mainly the feed removals is a big thing. And what I'm doing is I'm handling the incoming, I'll make sure that it's you know that I see it's legit, and then I'll my answer. My final answer will be we'll do this within 24 hours and I copy BCC you on it and

then I know it'll get done within 24 hours. There was a huge thing. We've got to get email addresses out of feed for the spam. I mean, James Cridland got a lot of spam it pissed him off. I've always said I liked getting the emails. And the My email address is still in my feed. But now we have a situation where I know Buzzsprout has removed it. So I'm getting people asking for a removal of feeds and I have no

way to authenticate them. I used to be able to say, could you please send me this request from the same email that is in the in the feed. And then I then it's close enough for me to know that I can authenticate you as the owner of this feed. Now that's gone away. Congratulations. Because no one's using the text field, I have no mechanism to do a text verification. And I don't know what to ask people to do. I want you I mean, I should I say,

go ahead and put something into your feed into a show notes. I mean, it's so antiquated. And I'm kicking myself because I just laughed at it. And I didn't think it through. And now that it's been implemented, you know, here we are. And I know that Buzzsprout is getting a lot of the there was the James did a story about it this morning. Oh, there's all these customer service requests. Yeah, we know, we can't find an email address in the feed. So I think we blew it. blew it on this one. A made

made by life harder. For no good. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. No one cared about that. Not about me, specifically, but I'm customer service now for podcast index. And I can't authenticate people a bit. I bet our guests have thoughts about this. No, before we get to our guests, I want to hear Hallelujah, Amen. That I'm right about this. This? I don't know. I just don't know that I agree with it. I don't know that I think is so I have I have people saying take my feet down. Yes. So if I can't

authenticate that person, what do I do? How do I authenticate that they have the right to tell me to take this down? We need we have to solve this with software. I know. But my point is, this guy does read lazy piece of crap. And oh, no, no, no, no, no, this, it's no, you're not a lazy piece crap. My point is, this got done, rammed through by a relatively small group who did not consider all the players, all the people involved. And granted, hand on my own bosom. I didn't think through what that

would mean to me. In fact, because it was only about spam, spam, spam, but it turns out, you can't sign up for lots of services, and they want to authenticate you through email address. And so that now puts a burden on customer service of companies who have implemented this.

Yes, but then you but most of these companies have taken the email addresses out of feeds also have a way to temporarily turn it back on for a certain amount of time, 2448 72 hours, you can turn it back on long enough to authenticate and then turn it back in, then it will go back. Okay, perfect. So there's a perfect example. I'm just saying that, okay, so Buzzsprout does that I presume you Buzzsprout

you turn it back on. And so it puts a burden on their customer service, because a I didn't know to tell anyone that and B that people probably don't know that. So they're gonna have to go through a cycle. I'm just saying, when we change things or decide things, we everyone has everybody not saying that this was anyone's fault? I'm saying everyone's got to think it through because down the line, there's implications that that we often don't think about, I certainly didn't think about it.

But I did think about it, and we're running out, we're sort of running out ahead of our skis, you know, which is that analogy didn't work. Now, try something we actually can't We can't ski try something else.

Yes. We're doing something that revolt involves skis. The the way that the way that see what the problem the problem is not with the with the spec, the problem is with is with us Yes, not just what I'm saying the fact that we're is the way we're doing this through email requests, see what the proper structure for this should be a take my feed down, and then you reply with a form letter that says, here's the web page where you go and verify that you own this feed, and it will take it

down automatically once you finish that process. It should like that we shouldn't even be having to handle these manually. My that's the entire point. Okay, so But my point is still valid when we do these things. invalid. Yeah, the invalid point. I just didn't validated it. So my invalidated point, which still stands, is yeah, we got to think about the implications all the way down the line. That's all I agree. I didn't think about it. And believe me, it's

all good. But anyway, we'll never we're not we're never going to build that page either. So that's okay. You have to tell me, I'm gonna build it. No, I'm just kidding. But now I but I didn't even know that that that you can temporarily turn it back

on. So there's just a lot of things that when these changes are made, and I felt that we're ramrodded, because the spam, spam, I'm getting spam, I'm just angry about that for myself, I'm like, whatever you and your spam, go do whatever, and didn't throw up the flag and say, Oh, this may bring some problems down the line for people, and we've got to alert them and have solutions. And then we could have circumvented all that it's all I just wrote it on the PED Build page. Oh, please.

Here, no, I know, you wrote it down. I'm gonna do it. To see this. So here's a problem with with me, this, this is a problem with me, you know, you have these people that are like, and I saw this cartoon about this the other day. It was like, when there's this old adage, like, if you have to do something more than, you know, more than three times you ought, you should automate it. And, and I just completely

ignore all of that advice. And the there's this cartoon about that the other day, it's like, as soon as you take you say, Okay, I'm going to spend over the course of of six months, I'm going to end up spending 25 hours dealing with this one specific problem. He's like, okay, I can, what I need to what I should do is peel off five hours, and build an automated solution to this problem so that I net save myself 20 hours of work over six months. Oh, that is a very difficult thing to

do. But this is this is not about this is not about us. It's not about you. Here, John, you trust your John Spurlock as a as a developer. Oh, yeah. incredibly intelligent manner. And so he just posted 100% agree about removing emails being a total pain. I'm in the same boat as Adam when verifying ownership

for op three. Now I have to tell them to go deep into the settings to re enable the email or paste some text in the feed anywhere Good luck having anyone knowing anything about txt way worse than dealing with some unwanted attention to email addresses revert, he says that was the word I was always looking for. Rolling back, just pointing something out as a non technical person as someone who just is in the trenches. And all of a sudden, this happened and you know, I didn't think about

it. No one else thought about it and it just, it just ruined my day. Okay, and I have marching orders now. No, no, no, no, you don't. I understand what to do. I'm gonna push this back. Well, if, if if a host does not have email addresses, I will say please ask your host. How you can authenticate? is Ted Hoffman's fault. No, I blame it on James crude wrote this I blame it on James Cridland. What do you blame everything on Jason? It's all his fault, obviously.

This is this is this is somebody else's fault. But mine let's let's leave it at this. It's not your fault. But I certainly was told it was totally my fault for not for joking around about it because I like I like spam. You know, this is a serious quiz. This is a serious question, though. I'm very willing to create a service of some sort. Because we need it. I don't we need to get out of the manual curation of feed business

anyway. I'm very willing to write some sort of service that will your comms the but Yuko I know there's nobody in here. I mean, there's one in the room. But I mean, like there's there's there's no I'm very willing to write a service that will that everybody can use to do feedback ownership validation on the on the new sort of in the new way or in the old way like email to TXT record Thing and Thing in the feed somewhere like I don't that's not a hard thing

to write. And we need it and other people could use it I mean, there could just be a dog you just have a service you know about owner validate.io But I don't think we should be the ones mainly making that service. Why should we take your valuable resources be doing that for effectively something hosting companies do for us? For us or just for us know denote but then we get we're not getting rent charge people to use it. Okay. 100 bucks a month. $1,000 a month splits split. I don't

know. I don't know. I mean, I get being ornery on purpose. But I get your I get your I get your point. And I get John John's point. I'm not just looking. I just want to say the genesis of this did not come from a good place. The Genesis came from a cast taking people's email addresses from hosting companies and trying to hijack customers. That's, that's the genesis of this. And so I think as a group, as a loose group, we responded knee jerk and didn't

think about what we were doing. It was more like fuck a caste. And I was all in on that part. I mean, of course, I'm all in fact, those guys. Fuck anchor, anybody, anybody who's not part of our team is is by definition enemy or potential ally, enemy first enemy of the state. But that's that. That makes sense. I'm just I'm just pointing out that, you know, I think that was all of us when we were we weren't really thinking

straight. We could have had, it's not a huge deal. But we could have had a little more thought about what are we really doing here? Well, I mean, what? Sorry, are you running away? I hit I hit the mic back. I mean, this is but you know, this is what happens. You run with scissors, you sometimes you sometimes you fall and hit the jugular. Now gonna have one I left because I poked one out with the scissors. Yeah, that's it. You know, I'm just saying, we all

just need to think about what we're doing. So that's when, when when I see ln URL and lightning addresses and like, Let's all think about everything down the line where that might screw something up, because we're not necessarily all thinking about it in the same way. Does that make sense? I agree. I agree. 100% With that, yes. All right, everybody. 100% 100 100 So today's unless you have anything, unless you have anything else to annoy you with? No, I mean, I mean, granola.

Granola. Yeah. What happened to your beef milkshakes? That's what I want you eating? Or do you have one of those, I have one of those before the show. That was my Bistro, I really got to try these beef milkshakes out. It's pretty good. You've been you've been been high status, praise has been high. We have two guests in our board board meeting for today. And one of them. One of them did a live show the other day, which was, I would say one of my most favorite experiences

of all time. And it really proved to me that we're onto something with a new format here. Something that's new, I mean, it's it's a little bit like the YouTube model where you do a YouTube Live, except this is done by people who kind of know what they're doing when it comes to doing something live. So it's live audio smash cuts, live audio stream. And but with booster grams coming in, it really made for an experience that, you know, we know that you will talk about, well, if you do

a YouTube Live, you have the Super Chat. There was nothing like this. When you hear the pew pew, which is now kind of universal for something coming in. And then there's a response from the people doing the show live. Then at a certain point, you and I were boosting just talking to each other. And Todd. Todd was literally in the middle just like here's 20,000 SATs, Adam waves to Dave. I mean, come on. That's something very cool. And then at the end of all this, the end of this this this lit

session. It was like this realization from Rob co host of a new media show that oh man, maybe there's some other way to do things than what we've been doing. And I think I got the ISO of all ISOs and this is it. Ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding. Ladies and gentlemen, say hello to the man behind that voice along with his partner, Mike Dell, Todd Cochran. Everybody from

blueberry. Hey, everybody. Hey, Mike. You they're thinking Ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding. I heard that. I knew you guys. Were gonna ISO. Yeah, make sense? I was. I actually, I spent some time getting that like, Oh, stop the stop this show. Oh, roll that back a little bit. I'm doing Oh, yeah, I was recording it in real time was beautiful. And I think Rob at that moment, had the epiphany moment. He's like, oh, oh, yeah. It was hilarious.

So me a little background here. Todd has been in the podcasting, almost as long as I have early proponent, early promoter, early part of the infrastructure, literally wrote the book about podcasting and has as run so many different really coming community based initiatives which I've been so appreciative of. Also longtime supporter of the no agenda show understood the value for value model year A deck more than a decade ago and had your own I guess, epiphany of sorts, and seeing you with

that exact same vigor from almost two decades ago. I gotta tell you, it really lifts my heart, Todd, I'm so pleased to see it and immediately have to ask, what's going wrong that you jumped on this bandwagon? I think it had that. I think it was, I got hit in the mouth on one of your guys's episodes, I can't remember the number I was literally driving down the highway and it was like, bands like somebody slapped me upside the head. And I'm in the in I've

been thinking about this all wrong. That is really, it really was listened to and one of the board meetings. So I think the whole industry had pretty much just completed their dynamic ad insertions, more or less at the same time. This was nothing. And it's, it's almost like it's almost as funny as divorce, like bringing out the too many eggs book at the moment, there's an egg shortage. Which, you know, and so the

everyone came out with their egg insertion system. And then when we It seems like eggs are just kind of a thing of the past, you know, advertising is slowing down? I mean, I know it works. I know what's out there. But is this just a question of, okay, we've completed that it works. And now we're moving on to the next thing, or or is this more structural? Take me through that process? Well, you know, we spent two years rebuilding our platform,

and I had this like, huge list of stuff I wanted to do. And we got the rebuild done of the platform, reskin it and launched it and then we started adding add ons. And then I started really thinking about how do we really help the listeners because I talked to content creators that are not listeners, graders, how do we how do we I know you hate that word. But how do we help the podcasters? Because it talks them on the

phone and it's about Grow, grow? How do I grow my show? How do I grow my show, I don't even hear people talking to me about monetizing here. And then growing your shows we really, but this is your fault. It's true, but we hear Mr. Grow your show so far. So we always like a chia pet. So we started really focused on you know, bringing stuff to the podcasters is going to help them grow their show and connect with their audience. So the podcasting 2.0 stuff just kind of fit perfectly into that.

But be honest with you, I was kind of holding back because it was again that chicken and egg. And I finally realized, Okay, we've got about a access to about 100,000 podcasters. Not all of them host with this, I need a lot of them that use power press are hosted on Lipson, you know, variety of different platforms. And I said, we can dump this into power press, and we can also build it in their blueberry dashboard. And we can one full swoop, give 100,000 podcasters the ability

to turn this on. So I said let's do it. And the team agreed and metric, Dave, and you and Dave came on and talked to my team graciously. And my whole team was like, high five, let's go. And that was you know, last summer when you guys came on and talk to us. Yeah, that's that was good. Hey, those are fun. Yeah, those are fun. Fun get together. And that. I mean, when you think about it, I mean, I guess you realize you sort of that you're the egg in

the chicken. Yeah, I mean, because the that's the that's the thing. I had a great little gig great call with the guys from wave Lake yesterday. And we were just talking about, we're talking about the app side of things. And it sort of we got into this, we got into this discussion about this debate, the classic chicken egg problem when it comes to decentralized stuff like this. And I was telling them, I'm like, you know, we really decided at some point, we just had to focus

almost exclusively. It's like we, we love the apps. And we want to add that the app developers are who were who were trying to do all this stuff for. But in order, it's like in order to love them, we have to get the the content because nobody's going to write app features for content that doesn't exist, right? That's it really goes from the producer, to the consumer. And you know, hosting companies being the producer.

It's like we had to get traction there. Because if you produce the content, then the apps over time evolve to consume the content that you're giving them. Like it's, it's, that's one of the most exciting things about all this, that all the just avalanche of features you've put out as you went, you went a

whole hog like, yeah, we're going all phase one. And you know, you unleash the Kraken. And now you've got all these now you get so many feeds that have like a like a, like a sandbox, a playground of stuff that app developers can fool with is awesome. And Mike's working on list number two, yeah. Well got nine more tags in the list. Okay, so, Mike, where do you fit into the story? Well, I volunteered to be the project manager for this 2.0

project at blueberry. And I've been the one that's been sort of making making sure you're hurting the cat. I haven't been the same since I'm sure. Although tat Todd kind of takes that job a lot to between us where we're keeping them busy. But I'm, I'm super excited about this stuff. It kind of reminds me when podcasting started, I didn't come in too far behind Todd, in podcasting. And this just feels like the beginning again. Yeah, yeah. So what helped? Let's, let's just go ahead and

hit some some features here. Because I guess the one that I'm most interested in kind of right off the top is is the live item. So how, how are you handling that? Are you just allow? Are you allowing a podcaster to put the live information into their feed or you facilitating a communication back and forth with a with a live stream? Like how how's that? Explain how that's functioning? Yeah, we're allowing them to put in the information into the feed, bulletin, both platforms

that were not facilitating the stream part yet. But I have said to our traders, if you want to be an I have a shoutcast stream. And I basically said, if you want to experiment with this, and you want to, you know, a time slot, we'll give you one on something we're running. But you know what, we've got to look at this long term and decide if we're going to if we're going to add some sort of streaming service to the platform that that hasn't been decided yet, but definitely getting the

function in there. And you know, here's thing, we get the function, and then it's going to take us six months to get people to fully understand it. Well, and this, this is what I love about you. All the podcast host, basically, let me step back for a second. So there's always been this in podcasting. Before this project started has always been the world. You know, Apple doesn't do it. Well,

Spotify does No Baba. So we have now apps, which and that's the praise, praise the Lord for the app developers who said, You know what, this is fun. I don't expect much, I'm just going to build an app with different experiences. And we're seeing the people getting pretty busy apps are getting pretty busy, that it's still a minut percentage of the overall landscape of apps and the big apps. But as Dave pointed out chicken and egg, when content is being produced 300,000 from

Buzzsprout. I don't know how many 100,000 for let's forget the numbers rss.com, RSS blue.com. Blueberry, now we're talking hundreds of 1000s, half a million, maybe moving towards a million feeds that will have some version of the namespace in it. It is it is as far as I'm concerned and and foregone conclusion that every app will eventually have to surface this dead data. It is in fact the nature of publishing. That when features are being utilized, and being published, apps eventually

cannot. It's like it's a human thing. You can't even I think as a developer, you look at that, like, Ah, I want to put that into my app, somehow. The only thing stopping it is corporate structure. It is a human developer thing. Am I correct there Dave? Is that what you were saying? Yeah, the 100 You're gonna do that you're going to shame me into stopping soon. Thank you, by the way, that I should be ashamed. That is 100%. Right? I just did it again. I'm gonna hold back.

Okay. So the, when you whenever you're a developer, and you look out there and you say, Okay, I got this podcast app. And, and then I see that there's all of these tags in here with this rich content, that that my app does nothing with, it's just basically ignoring it. It's just, it's just a green field that you would, you can't help it you have to go in there and and, and start doing start coding towards it. Because otherwise, it's just you feel wrong, not doing it.

And I think what also happened to is if Marco and some of the other folks podcasts, add a confound, and they start adding everything, then what will happen is, is listeners and even the podcasters themselves will be in these apps and say, Well, how does he have his guests listed there? How does he have his location data in there? How How come that's not in my feed? How come and then they're gonna go back to their hosting

provider and say, Why can't I do this? And that's going to drive it fullcycle correct. And that happens already taught with you Yes, it's like a wind bed. Like when you have those preview card embeddings and social media and stuff. Yeah, see those things? And they're like, Oh, what is that? How can I do that in my posts? So when I hear that some unnamed person high up in the podcasting industry, James who was it says, Well, you know, it's not going

anywhere, they got no marketing. We have more marketing than anybody could ever purchase. We have hundreds of 1000s of podcasters. who eventually will say, you know, that's why we make new podcast apps.com. Just, it's a call to Cluj. It's not a great way to do it. But it's a way then I see. We have the excitement around fountain with their top 10 most supported episode list, which is is on Twitter, and I think goes pretty viral. And people like, Well, how do I get on that list? This

is how podcasting has always been marketed. There's no marketing team for podcasting. Nor should there be a podcasting to point. In fact, podcasting. 2.0 It's just podcasting. It's just with new features. And it will always get we are so far beyond maybe it'll happen is happening

in you know, go ahead. And you and I know what happened. You know, as soon as Apple came in, in 2005, and introduced podcasting, iTunes, everything stopped, there was no more innovation, mistakes were made, I made mistakes that I made mistakes myself, it just it just stopped. And so we've allowed Spotify, Apple, Google, to set the tone, and introduce their own namespace and their own, you know, was what we want? Well, and we've

taken that back now. And my, my perspective is, I understand that, but for the average podcaster, they don't give two shits. So we have to explain. Yeah, what the features are. But that's what that's what you do. That's what podcast hosts have always done. You do weekly shows, you have FAQs, you have the I think you can actually just put yourself on your calendar and waste your time for an hour. I mean, it's not can I just get on the CEO, blueberries calendar? You have that? I know

you can. I know. Right? Yeah. I mean, that's amazing. That's what has to be done. And it's happening. It'll just take a while. So we have what five people raise their hand at pod fest when you said Who knows what podcasting. 2.0 is, it blew me away. So you know, I got 10 minutes to do 22 slides and I'm you know, I'm hitting all the key points, you know, Valley free value for value dot info, new podcast, apps.com, you

know, I'm hitting them hitting it hitting them. And, and I think when I went and did a procession later, I got to break this up, those same five people were in the back of the room. So the pros knew about it, but the general population did it. So I think it's just gonna be one of those things, they're gonna go home. And, you know, they've been fed by the firehose at a conference, because they've listened to a bunch of stuff. And then I'm gonna think about what that dude was talking

about, what was he talking about podcasting? 2.0, and he's gonna start looking around. So now we need to make sure that the resources online, are there for those folks that go to look for the, for the education piece education piece. And it's specific to each individual hosting company. Absolutely, you have a different UI, you have a selected amount of features that you're supporting. And I see that

happening everywhere. And I hear that, you know, it's taken a couple years, but I hear the words I hear I hear the right words being used by a lot of different people. And with how it works, how value for value works, I'm kind of hearing the

words, it's working. So it is out there, what do we have you track now how many feeds that are connected to your infrastructure, either through power press is what it's called, I think power press that Well, I think, you know, probably Dave has better data on how many people have turned stuff on. So again, is just, you know, we finally released everything final in power press

on Monday. So again, now it's, we're going to do one feature at a time, like matter of fact, we're restructuring our internal podcast to be able to focus on talking about in depth one feature per episode so that we can make people understand, okay, this is why you need to do credits and this is the benefit.

And little by little get people kind of up to speed but again, it's going to take time and we're going to have to socially hammer them and we're going to have to do on Facebook and we're going to have to you know, reach out as much as we can, some will some won't, but that's okay, as long as we get in as much as much as this geeks like to talk geekery getting this out to the normal podcaster you know, using the word feature instead of tag right and using other things like that, that just make it

seem like it's a you know, something that you know, that's been around a while they'll they may you know pick it up and you know as this Brad's out more. Like I said, I really wish Marco would start doing that. Because overcast is one of the bigger apps, at least on my personal show. That, you know, most of my listeners come from that I don't have very little apple on that.

And for some reason telling my audience you're using a legacy app if you're not using a podcast app from new podcasts apps.com And they say legacy Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, land, you know, so. So the, one of the great ways to promote this, of course, is just by say, at telling or asking your listeners to try out a modern podcast app. I do it twice a week. I know agenda. I know pod verse has quite a share amongst Spurlock

May, maybe he can run the numbers for me. I think no agenda shows a quite an impressive number for pod verse. Curio caster probably as well. And now I'm also promoting podcast addict, because they have delete feature. And that's a feature that we use. And we've actually without No, I mean, we've had, we've had all the pieces, we've had the chat room, we've had the stream, we had the batch signal. And the batch signal is just a Twitter thing that goes off and actually

people had tied into it. And when I, when I send the so called bad signal, which is Twitter, and it has to come from my address, and it has some a tag in there like pocket, podcast pocket, some I can't remember what it is. It triggers all kinds of stuff like a Rube Goldberg machine, you know, recording, start, start, start. So people have backup recordings, if the stream goes down, there's all these things

that have taken place through that one mechanism. And now it's all been brought together inside inside the app, which makes it so beautiful, along with and believe it or not, no agenda, we'll be accepting bitcoin payments, and we'll be accepting boosts and booster gram booster grams, hopefully, by the end of this month, you know, we're still waiting for Ibex to finish some stuff up. So that's promotion. You know, it's, and that works.

There was a naysayer out call him that at pod fest. And I was explaining to him, he says, what's on these apps, and no one knows about it. I said, Listen, I said, look at this screen. I said, Have you ever on your own podcasts, gotten 20 comments on your show from the time you published the time you did the next episode and got and got some money along with that. And he looked at it. I said, that's probably from one half of 1% of

my audience. That's Have you ever got that just to any other app or any other function, and he didn't really know what to say. So I think once the masses, like you said, Adam, you're getting people to move, this thing is going to explode out casters are going to be like, This is gonna be like crack. So no, go ahead. When you Yeah, when you when it comes to application development of it. This is this is across the board. It doesn't. And it's not just with podcast apps with any

app that gives you a certain functionality. There's a for each person, but I think this is maybe especially true with podcast apps. For any person. For each gift for each a unique person, there's going to be a set of features that they themselves cared deeply about. So each and that's why you know, people sometimes they ask podcast apps are very personal. And I don't disagree with that. But there's it's really about

okay, this app has this particular feature. And sometimes it's not even sometimes it's not even what you might consider a feature necessarily, sometimes they just like the way that this particular app is more feels more like a native iPhone app, then very, very personal choice want them I agree completely. And so all it takes if you have in that in that Paris, in that paradigm, all it really takes is one solid feature that a person can't live without. And then you've got to you've got as an

app developer, you have a customer like that. And that could be and it already is, for me that could be live. Addicted to live stuff. Now the live item tag just is it's it's just has kind of made me starry eyed. I love it. Now, I need an app that gives me a lot that lets me tune in to podcast it gives me a push notification when the thing goes live. I can't not have that in my life. Now. You said something very important there. Yeah, go. What you said was now

I have a customer. This I think is at the core whether we want to admit it or not. At the core of what we're doing here is the idea that you actually get a paying customer when you implement at minimum value for value. So it to up your customer either to grow your customer base. How about that, too? to grow your customer base, you add a feature of live or lit, and you automatically just by the nature of it receive more

Satoshis. You see, I'm saying, yeah, so you can measure what's really what is really what features are really worth it to you to build your as a hosting company or as an app developer, your customer, your customer, to me is only your customer, when they're paying you for something, they're paying you on a monthly they're paying you through subscription, or

whatever it is. It doesn't have to be streaming sites, but whatever it is, I think that should be the goal, because that's what binds all of this together. In that regard, it's like a, you can look at app, like app breakdown percentage, for it feels like and you can back me up on this or not Todd, it feels like that each hosting company has sort of their own fingerprint within the listening apps that tend to look didn't tend to be the biggest

downloaders of that hosting companies podcasts. Like I think some have a heavy Spotify presence, some have a heavy Apple presence, some have our heavy with overcast and like the mix, it feels almost sort of like a fingerprint. And if you think about it that way, you could almost say Oh, two, yeah, per day, you could say that the the app breakdown, or the finger app, the user agent, fingerprint for a certain hosting company profile is sort of a referendum on what the hosting company's

priorities are. And if there's these new if the if you're swinging heavy towards sort of indie apps, and, and heavier with new podcast apps, and these these newer featured apps, you can say, Well, I mean, that hosting companies clearly, you know, a forward looking company and trying to further the further podcasting.

You know, I think the when it comes to app break down, it gets very lonely once you get below 1% global market share, because no one else does not lonely, there's a lot of apps in there. But really the Delta really is is in Spotify. For us, Spotify never has gotten much more higher than 8%. Globally, for all the shows measure then, but Buzzsprout, they're pretty high. They're like 1820. And I think a lot of that has to do number one is really the audience that uses Buzzsprout, maybe a little

younger, have a little different show show type. You know, we have a lot of folks that are on WordPress, they're established businesses. So maybe they're not more as of tractive. To a listener on Spotify as a show this may be got someone that's 22 doing a podcast, but I think in the end, that's really the only true delta we see. Because everything else stays pretty steady. You know, Mark, overcast pocket, podcast, attic, all those numbers stay pretty close across almost all shows. Here's

the thing though. Spotify gets exactly zero Satoshis, 00, Satoshis. From from all shows they have. Thank God. So everyone does, everyone does have a way. Everyone does have a way to measure their own market share. That's right, based upon that. And it's curious. There's always been this camaraderie amongst hosting companies in the podcast in the podcast space. And I've never understand, I was gonna say, never understand what you guys just don't undercut each other and why you aren't

just super competitive? Or maybe you are and maybe it's all just kind of a front. And people talk about everybody behind their back. I mean, there may be some of that going on. It's just always interesting to me. And maybe I'm moving towards the question of why the heck are you still trying to get some kind of group together some kind of commie group, like, we're all going to Kumbaya and we're all going to promote 2.0 which will never happen, because it always fails.

And you know, even getting 10 people to agree to the same thing is difficult getting 30 is almost impossible. So we'll see. But I think the ultimately what the goal was and trying to form this new group is basically to have a coalition or whatever you want to call it to basically promote podcasting. 2.0 But we've been trying to get organized for six, eight months,

and yeah, it's not going so good. It's going slow. So so we're gonna continue to do what we have to do to promote regardless of a group organization.

So John Spurlock just thank you. I Spurlock if ever heard of a boosted grant man you're doing that's just because alright because I'm taking you're giving me information but you should be boosting booster grabbing this info for no agenda in January 2023 31 points 37% Apple podcast then we have unknown Apple app which is you know that the ongoing core media whatever who

knows what it is? Probably just from a website 26% pod verse eight point 11 podcast attic six point Five Pocket Casts that will who I think 00 2.0 or 2.0 features four and a half overcast for 21. And then we go Google Stitcher, fountain 1.4, which is low. I'm surprised how low fountain is but you know, on

this list at least, charismatic is on there as well. But now that what this doesn't represent is the amount of Satoshis because it's right, the number one center of Satoshis is fountain number two, it's a toss up but it's usually pod verse. And then so the top the top three would be fountain pod verse, curio caster cast, thematic, for, for me for for no agenda. This is serious. I mean, even 8.5% of the 850,000 people that listened to no agenda every episode. So you know, the

universe is bigger, I guess. But every episode, that's what you're kind of looking at. That's not bad. It's not bad. And I think we're in a chicken and egg situation there, too. Let's say we get up to 50,000 shows that are valid for value enabled. And then these apps are going all of a sudden starting to see that they're leaving money on the

table. And this is what I love about this piece of it is sustainability for app developers, if we can, you know, I care about the app developers as much as I care about the our hosting customers, because we want to make sure that developers are fed can eat. Yes, another minor thing that has been added to this whole game? That's right, you're in the money flow. You're you're still not getting anything from the ad insertions, right? Not

getting anything from the host reads? No, would you please go? Go beg people to send you 99 cents. And with all these independent apps, that keeps a lot of this, you know, I would hate to see podcasting only be available in two big apps because nobody else can make any money. Right on. Yeah, we don't want to happen to podcasting. What happened to the open web where you've basically got, you know,

everything's come down to Safari and Chrome. I mean, we you know, that's there's no diversity within the browser ecosystem anymore. There's everything's just all running on the same rescanned engines. I mean, we really don't want that mean, podcasting is probably I think podcasting almost stands alone now. Maybe second only to something like Mastodon as far as or something like that, or it was as far as just distributed.

Where, where the where the listeners and the consumers of the content use, like dozens and dozens of different have completely different apps to access the same content. That's something you don't want to give up. Because it's, it's

beautiful. And we have and it's helpful and and the features that are new are specific incentives for not every podcast is the same, you know, some podcast transcripts are very important, I put a high value on transcripts, mainly for just finding something in the show. To prove Dvorak wrong. But But other people use it for different reasons, Chapter chapters, was chapter images, or

high value to no agenda. That's where we put a lot of the art that is not used as the album art, we can still put that in there and make use of it. So these, these are all reasons for, for a podcast or to ask their listeners to try a new podcast app. And I think with that should also go the hey, you know, you could if you if there's something you you'd like

to see change, here's how you can contact the developer. If there's something that you're missing from that fabulous Spotify experience, then contact your developer and in this case, with podcasting, I disagree. I fundamentally disagree with the radio mindset of wherever the listener is I want to be No, that's it has very low value. Value, because we know advertising is just not going to pay off for 99% of anyone who's

trying it. It's low value, what you want is your community, you want to know where you want to have your community there, where the features that your community is using and where you can actually have a value exchange. That is Go ahead.

But here's an interesting development on our site, is we built our platform to add all these features to make it enhance the idea that someone might want to move to us because when someone signs up for hosting business hosting service, they go to Lipson pod, bean pod, and wherever they go host they usually there for life. There's very few people that actually move their shows and you have to have huge incentives for a podcaster decide to move to another platform.

I got an email from a cast. I thought it was a good idea. Yeah, well guess what you went for two weeks. Back we saw All night all the time. So do that all the time. So now what we're starting to see is all of a sudden, hey, wow, look what you guys are doing. We're gonna move. So I put a challenge out there. For every hosting companies, every, everyone's listening to the show. If they're not, then they're an idiot. But all these hosting companies that are not doing anything, I'm gonna start

stealing your customers. So hey, I have an agenda, I run a business, I have employees to take care of my agenda is to build build my business. But we at the same time, I'm a podcaster, at heart, and I understand the value of this. And I think there's a lot of podcasting companies that are run by individuals that have never picked up a microphone. And I think that's a fundamental problem. Get to course. Yeah, I agree with that. 100%. Okay, so when we You said

something that I want to ask you about? You said that your the people you talk to are not really even talking about growing their show anymore? Or excuse me, they're not talking about monetization, they're only talking about growing their show? What, what is the disconnect there? Because

usually one, you would think that one entails the other. But it's interesting that they're, that they're concerned about, that they want to grow, but they don't really are not focused on monetizing is that the reason I'm asking this for a reason, because I feel like it that that strikes a chord with me because I really don't care. It feels good to have a big audience, whether you want money from it or not. You think that's what's going on?

Well, what it is, is they want to grow, to have a big audience, then to be able to monetize, if they don't grow to a big audience, they're not going to significantly monetize and the traditional methods that we've been using for the past 18 years, can you definitely connected? Can you can you really break it down? Todd, I mean, I've never done the advertising game and podcasting. Let's just forget host reads just programmatic. If you I think the number of these

days is well 10,000. If you have 10,000, you can start to monetize, what can someone seriously consider making on a monthly basis with 10,000 downloads in a whole month. If they're doing a straight deal, nothing special, probably about 250 bucks, or 25 on per 1000. That's pretty average for host read. For programmatic role. It's a whole big different number changes by the second longer you're on programmatic at

least on our system, the higher the CPMs get. But if you're just starting out first month or so, you're probably seen six to $9 CPM, maybe as high as 11. We haven't seen much above $11 per 1000. On programmatic. So you know, on 10,000 for programmatic maybe 60 to $100 or more before split before admission split. Are you in your educational materials? Are you showing people how to view streaming set statistics either through Saturn

on Git Alby or one of these other systems? Are you going to surface that in your interface itself? And not yet, we're not showing that in documentation yet. But it's, again, it's a work in progress. I just be honest with you. My development team is like, I'm having a hard time keeping up with documentation. They're just not going out of the ballpark. So we're running behind the ever written paperwork.

I'm just saying because that for for, you know, the entire existence of hosting companies, the number one feature was we've got great stats, you can see all the look at these countries. Look at the women look at the men look at the age groups. Now. That's and look at the map. That's been the main driver, and it's showing when PeepSo I help launch, living up in a down world, it's a it's a half hour a week. It's a pastor here with

his wife in Fredericksburg. So not even your typical Wow, this is going to be a top of the apple podcast front page listing. But they a meet so two things happen. One, I showed him because he he went with rss.com. And so they're they have a partnership with Albie as well. And so I said, Hey, you know, here's your, here's your Saturn interface, you can see stuff coming in live. And you can look at how much you got per episode

and just, you know, a couple of ways to slice and dice it. And then all of a sudden, the ad, he shows up in the top 10 on the fountain weekly list. And the activity stream is showing people interacting and now he's like, Oh, but we have a

community over here. And that for Episode Four has been a beautiful thing to witness because he now he knows that they're not just talking in space and Coming back, as you know, an email here or there, or kudos on Facebook, but actual statistics that he can now for himself measure get Okay, how did we do? What's the engagement? All these things come to life with with that actually a very small show. And it's more valuable than money. It's that engagement.

Amen. Yes, it is. Because oftentimes podcasts are feel like they're talking into space. And the audience are listening on their app, and there's no way interact with them. You know, maybe they send you an email if you're lucky. And you can get pretty lonely as a content creator. Yeah, you shouldn't try doing a show with the Borak boost booster, booster grams, and you know, get having it read

on the show. I mean, as a listener, that's fun. So one of the reasons I started doing live when so many years ago is because I was in Hawaii, and it was boring, doing a solo show, and I just would start doing live because I wanted the interaction. This has taken interaction to just like, more or less new media show he talked about in the beginning, took the whole show to a whole nother level. I had, I probably had the most fun that I've had on a podcast episode in years. It was a good time.

What did you What did you make on the last episode? I think I must have sent 100 bucks to you and saps. Oh, he sent me two or 300,000 SATs at least. So I don't know what the number was. It was quite a bit. It was it was big. But it was still you know, it wasn't even about I had the money. No, but the fun. I had fun sending sending you my cash. It was great. I loved it. Yeah, again, it was about the interaction. You know, that was a big driver.

So you we talked about live item tag at the beginning. And then you know, and same thing with with avviso. With value for value. Some of these tags are features that are that are more complicated. How, what is your what's your strategy been for the UI? Because I know that's always the most difficult part is like how, okay, we've got this thing we want to do. How do we do this in a way that doesn't confuse the hell out of our customers. And but still make it like keep the fidelity to what

the feature is supposed to be heavy? Do you have like an overall kind of game plan or strategy that y'all tried to hit me and blueberry dashboard, we did the full integration with lb API. So basically, it's a one click, they put their rate their account, and bam, the data comes back to us. But because PowerPress is hosted on, you know, 80,000 different websites,

we couldn't do the API. So we did the lookup. So they put their we said go over and get in, I'll be account, put your IP address in here, click this button, and we suck the data. And we did that for fountain as well. And the ability to enter the data manually is the last option. So really, it was about ease of getting them set up. But it was you know, literally, I think, as we're testing, you could really probably get your

value from value set up in less than a minute. Just through the API integration with lb, I just set up podcast insider with without being I mean, it was like, no time flat, was there and looked over on index, and it was there after I figured out what I was doing. I'm seeing you know, I'm starting to see these feeds come in. Luckily, there was one that just came in a little bit

earlier. And it was, yeah, on power press. So it's fun, it's always interesting, this the same thing that happened when when y'all put in pod ping all of a sudden, it's like the it just wakes up, you know, it's like part of the index just wakes up. And all of a sudden we start seeing this traffic come

in. And then you'll you'll see value value blocks and podcast updates coming where you know, we know we're getting the latest, the latest episode data immediately within, you know, within a minute, it's like, it's a beautiful thing to see because you put all this work in the building Billina like infrastructure stuff and infrastructure stuff, a lot of

times it's boring. But then when you see like when y'all when y'all put in a new feature, any host puts in a new feature like this, it's like all of a sudden part of the index just comes alive and you can start to see this traffic, it really brings life to it. I've had to make it simple because lot of these podcasters now don't know

how to right click a mouse. So we had to make it like, really make it simple as much and I don't and I don't say that lightly, because a lot of podcasters now, they are focused on creating content. They're not techie. So we have to make this non technical. You have to make them understand, hey, just click here to get signed up. And then give them the education how to how to move forward. When we started. We were all geeks and everybody that

listened was a geek. Yeah. Now, literally weekly basis. I'm teaching people how to cut and paste. I mean, it's that, you know, that when we have a tech bar, they're there. They can still do podcasting. They just need a little push and interesting work. Interesting story. A Tina is in Chicago right now visiting. She's visiting her family, but we're in Indiana. But she's in Chicago because they actually are doing a meet up a keeper meet up, notice how the curry has been dropped the keeper

meetup. And, and so Kate who was organizing her husband, I think, as a listener to no agenda from day one. But if I understand the story, he was working at Apple at the Apple Store, and people would come in, and they would have trouble setting stuff up. And so he would allow the employee, the Apple employees after work to go and help the older people to go and help them set something up at home. And that was a show against Apple policy that he actually had to let these people go because they

were doing that. And then he quit himself. And he started a service of people going to your house to help you simply set up the Zoom call or something like that. But if you think old people equals poor people, you got something else coming. Oh, that's true. He's he is making money. And he is making bank on this bank. And he has, you know, I don't know how many employees gone to people and everyone's making good money doing this. So they can also serve, you know, the people who don't have a lot

of money. It's really beautiful to see. So you know, yes, yes, holding people's hands does it, it pays off. The other British support team are always you know, doing some hand holding and, and it works out, you know, usually the first week or two there's a lot of questions and then they disappear. And they're podcasters. Exactly as we wouldn't have a customer one if Mike wasn't lead my support team and as I would, I would probably not be a good customer service. Rep. I haven't.

Ding, ding ding on time. Where I didn't hit the button, right. We've all been there, Mike. We've all been there. Hey, who's pod surf.fm? Or heard of it? Pods are? Yeah, there is they're hitting pod ping. Pretty good pretty hard with updates. Let's surf done interesting. Almost on why this pod Pink Dot Watch is where you can go and see new feeds being submitted that run through pod paying and save the Earth at the same time by not using computer resources wastefully.

While we both were boiling the oceans with Bitcoin and saving it. We balance our carbon credits are equalized is good. Good deals a good deal. Yeah, I demand respect for this. So whoever pod serve is Welcome to the party. They're pushing some updates. Go ahead and go ahead.

I've seen a lot of stuff that's been coming this coming because you know people have got some projects they're working on so I think we're you're gonna have a good podcasting 2.0 year because there's a lot of people are building product right now. Well, you're not getting you're not the official promotion King. Do my best, you know, to be honest with you, Adam, I made a commitment this year, whenever I was going to, you know that I

take a topic every year and talk about it for the whole year. So this year, if I applied to speak somewhere, it's going to be podcasting 2.0 all year. So that if I go somewhere that's going to be the topic that we're we're going to cover if they don't if they want me to speak they love I think the I think the we may be starting to see some real a real shift or real turning the corner on so on the social interact on cross app comments. Oh, stop threatening me. No, no, this is for reals. For reals

at the top of our list. Yep. Well, the because gamma in Nathan gay thrive and assisted by John Spurlock are really working to put cross out comments to surface them on the pod on our website, podcast. index.org. I love that as a bootstrap. Yeah. And I think like, that's, that's how podcasts distribute. That's how cross app comments is going to evolve, is is going to evolve by people. But by slow momentum of things beginning to pop up in

various places. It's got to be surfaced in order for people to know that it's a thing and to know what's there. But I really love this idea of putting it on on the web, because that's kind of like the wheat. We get a lot of web traffic. I mean, you know people go and they search you know, hat is may podcasters go and they want to search the AES my podcast in this in this directory is it in this directory people people like to

do searches for themselves? You know, and we are I don't know how many I don't know how much traffic we Because I haven't looked at stats in a long time, but we actually get a pretty substantial amount of just raw web traffic to our website. And I think that will, that could be a big deal to have that show that stuff show up. And then we'd send people over there all the time. Yeah, since we've implemented

pod ping, there's no onboarding for you guys. I just tell them to go over search for their show, grab the link, they can throw that wherever they want. And so I'm sending lots of people there. Yep, yep. And that, I mean, I think it's gonna be a big deal. process by dad. Oh, no, go ahead. Go ahead, please. No, I think the cross app comments piece for me is the one I struggle with the most. And then the conversations you guys have had during the board meeting has been good for me.

But as a hosting provider, I'm like, Okay, it's easy. It's an easy thing to implement from a technical standpoint. But I'm gonna have to go a different an extra step, we're going to have to give him some sort of endpoint because you know, the average content creator, they're not running the mastodon box, they were going to have to give them a place where that origin point can be. And that's the biggest challenge that I'm going through my head is how do I implement it? So that is, okay.

When you create a new episode, where I want to populate this with a link on where your cross app comments are going to originate, do it for them, so they don't have to think about it. That's the biggest gonna be the biggest challenge for us. You know, this. I'm glad you you just gave me a brainstorm Todd. This is this is, this is actually really interesting, because we've had

this the biggest issue is moderation. And we've had this debate about whether or not hosting companies should you know, should be a dirty word, whether or not they should be rolling their own Mastodon or just calling a Macedon API somewhere that the Creator owns. And it just it strikes me that you don't you can do it either direction. So you could say this is what you're talking about. That would be sort of a hard

sell to your customer base. You could say okay, well you aren't you know, you need to put in your own Mastodon you need to link your own Mastodon account to your dashboard so that we can create a post on your behalf when you post a new episode. That's one way to do it that's they'll never do it right never gives the so the the other option and I think this is just as legit is what you said you run you run your own Mastodon or

activity poke client. But then you block Federation initially to only to only other instances where you know that they have solid moderation. So, so initially, you say, Okay, we're going to run a mastodon, but we're not going to allow comments from other instances except these on this approved

list. And maybe over time, you slowly expand that to include more but at the beginning you say okay, Mastodon dot social, you basically curate you whitelist the activity pub world initially so that you don't have to, so that you're only dealing with comments possibly coming from other sites where you know that the monitor they're going to take care of the moderation. That way you don't you have you lower your risk of having your day having to moderate stuff yourself.

And I think that's a good idea. Because Because you get you get this you get the solidity of having your own platform, but you get the safety of not having to accept content from the entire world from you because there's if you if you restrict to just let's just say the top you know, 20 well known respected Mastodon hosts by

size, you're probably in great shape. Because if because if a if a podcaster does not have their own Mastodon account, the likelihood of them carry carrying to receive comments from from some Mastodon instance, it only only has six people on it, it's probably zero. That's a pretty good that might be the way forward, you know. Yeah, you know, again, it's just how do we get the adoption? We can put it in there things slap that in there and have that in

there a week. But how do you you know, how do you make it so they're actually going to use it all adoption is slow with podcasting. And from time to time from time to time? Something happens. And 2016 I believe was cereal. It happened at this which cereal have made a difference two years earlier, maybe not. All all elements of the universe, everything kind of melded together, and then it just happened. But you can't force that. You can't. I mean, how

many people told me Oh, man, you gotta get draw up, I guess. Do you wanna get drawers gonna be like, Yeah, I'm sure Joe Rogan would make a huge difference, but we don't have to sit around and wait for that. It is right, the little things will happen and the Bitcoin community, which is not small, that, you know, they've grabbed it ran with it, they get it, they love it. And they're now the big promoters, and they're making memes and tweeting and et cetera, et cetera and spreading the word

love on noster. Last Do you know what nostril nostril stands for? It's like notes and other stuff through relays. Exactly. Notes. Exactly. notes and stuff through realize. Okay, definitely some geek name that yes, you know, young young master Mitch is very enamored by noster metrum pod verse. It makes me tired. It makes you tired. Why does he why does it make you tired? I'm just curious to the pub is hard enough in that's the thing is activity Pub is

hard enough. And we know we're going we can't the world as it is now. We have to activity Pub has to be the first class citizen. I totally agree. And so any other protocol, anyone just makes me tired. Any other any other social protocol? I mean, like I said, um, I mean, I just don't know enough about it to even to even comment. Unlike Leo Laporte, I don't comment about these, I have no idea.

The one thing I like about nostre, which I just is, there's something incredibly cool about it is you can take your public and private key. And you can log into noster on any app, any service, you know, obviously have to be careful what you're doing. Because you know, you could be posting your private key into into some trap, but is really interesting, like, oh, try this one, you just try this desktop client, and you and you try it. And that's all you need. And it brings up everything.

Like, there's my whole profile, there's my follows. There's something magical about the key pair, which I think may be even more important than noster itself, people understanding a public and private key could be revolutionary, to so many aspects of life. I'm gonna have to agree with Alex on this one, though, though, in this regard, that the universal keys that serve as

universal identities scare me a bit. Oh, really? Yeah. Because you because all of a sudden now you're now your identity is known across your egg, your your identity travels with you all the time, my public dead? Yeah, your public identity. And that

feels a little creepy. Like, like, I'm not sure that that's a road we want to go down because there's some there's some, you know, there's some nice M and N and Amity that comes from Okay, well, I'm going to Mike Dells WordPress site, and I'm gonna leave a comment there, but I can just make up, you know, it doesn't have to be real. Like I can not have to expose myself fully on every single service. Like, it's the same way with a

bitcoin address. I mean, if I, if I want to send if I don't want you to send me some bitcoin, I mean, I can generate a random wallet address for every transaction. Yeah. And I have, and I have some sort of, you know, have a measure of anonymity there. It's not absolute but, but there is some protection there. And I'm a little, I'm a little nervous about the about, there's a lot of talk, you know, with blue sky and all this stuff about these, these D IDs and universal

identities. I don't know, they just creeped me out a little bit. And I think also, what we want to make sure we watch out for is, you know, I've had a philosophy for a long time, then basic say you never build your castle on rented land. So whatever we do, we have to make sure that, you know, monkey business by other companies like Twitter, shutting off their free API and stuff like that is not going to affect what has been

built. So I'm always kind of looking down the road. I'm like, what happens if somebody unplugged something now I know if this podcast is index got unplugged, we would continue to run we'd be pod pinging something that would hit nothing, but everything would still continue to work. So I think that the way we kind of look at things too is if blueberry went out of business today, our PowerPress users would be would be absolutely fine. They would just have to

find a new host. So I think as we're looking at advancing stuff and podcasting 2.0 We want to make sure we tighten to stuff that just can't We can't have the plug plug pulled on us. Yeah, and that's the that's a great point. Todd because we have like that's what we've tried to do from day one is to make it where we don't to where all this stuff continues can continue to exist without us. I mean, like if we just podcasting we general is that way though. That's the beauty of RSS you got this.

You try to change that it's not podcasting anymore. That's right. So we think a few people here while while we have the Yeah, we got a couple of booster grams that have come in during this lit session. Let me see. We will and thank you, by the way 36,009 112 Satoshis from Chimp, Adam. All caps, you say 100% All the freakin time shame yourself 100% atone wrecker 1050 rung the curio caster wallet dry with this bottom of the barrel boost. Alright man, very much chimp.

Oh, oh chimp comes in again 33,333 ADAM You say 100% All the freakin time. Thank you. You tell me again. Tell me a couple more times. That's really driving that home. Yeah, but I like it. I like people yelling at me while sending SATs, Eric p p 33,333 330 333. Couldn't podcasters use the podcast block tag to remove their podcast from the index? That still doesn't solve the ownership problem. But what solves this is very

interesting. Maybe new rule, if you're going to take out email addresses enabled the block. I've told people to do that on on more than one occasion. They they'll say, Hey, I've got I've got this feed. And for amusing Oh, it's perfect is Apple Andy layman. He said he's using a search as using a hosting company to host his his media.

But he's writing his own feed. He's just using them as a CDN and he's got his own feed coming from PowerPress but he didn't want the feed from that other hosting company coming coming through in the index. So he put the blog tag in there and it goes away and you're good. I'm just saying hosting company should implement that. That will

make a lot of sense. made a note Martin Linda's CO on my list has a row of ducks 222222 And he says May I plug my conversation with Mitch Downey of pod verse while yes, you may episode nine of Tea Party media podcast a pretty long row of ducks all the

best Martin Linda's cope. You bet. And we have Dred Scott coming in with 121,212 20 his blades on him Paula go podcasting also special shout out to Mike November 7 Lima Mike Juliet as he is directly responsible for me passing my ham radio exam several years ago with the ham radio pod class. Yay. Congratulations. Yeah, I'll jump in on that. 70 threes Matt keto five Alpha Charlie, Charlie. Come on. Mike. Sahand Mike, I know what you call it. That was me. Kate lmJ There you go.

There you go. Exactly. Nerds Sam says the listening live over there in the UK on a pulling a tug whatever talking to Paul I don't fully agree Adam a cat. Oh, I'm sorry. I fully agree Adam a cast were spamming everyone so Buzzsprout got angry. But it doesn't work. If you don't have podcast dot txt. txt. Implemented Buzzsprout has no UI for host they say you can turn it back on but I can't find it. Okay, so thank you, Sam. Tell me the story of how the emails disappeared out of out of

podcast feeds Wilson. A castle spamming everybody there was this company called a cast and then bug spray. Yeah, exactly. Okay, let me see we have 10 Another 10,000 from San Sethi. Sam Sethi again. Why can't Oh, this is around the splits. Okay, so we I'll read it. We don't have to get into it. Because it's real. It's hard. It's hard enough and I'm reading it. It's hard enough. Why can't we do it based on 100% This is crazy doing 103% Just calculate based on 100%. So 100 SATs is easy to

work out. 1% fee is one set. So 99 should be 99 left to split with, with why recalc if you have 30% Atomy gets which is 30 sashes. recalc is totally mad. Sorry. The proper answer to that is do it that way. Yes. Yeah. Do it that way. And then and then for your own sake of your own math. It makes it simple. Yeah, you've totally everybody should be doing it based on base 100. That's what we did. The issue is that if you are a fighter jets go to 104%.

Oh, my was to 11. I know. Yeah. I think we've kind of figured out that this is for under the hood and not on top of the blankets. Under the hood is Sockeye the horse 1000 Go podcasting. Who was this? Todd Cochran? 122,222 Oh 20 Is blade. And then we have 44,100 from Mike Dell, who says your guest today are rockstars do this illegal. That's illegal. That's a violation violation violation. violation of all rules. Taxes on that, Mike. It's not it's not right, dude.

When did you when did you? Okay, I think I think we can leave it here because everything after that is four hours ago you should we thank the people who came in and support our value for value proposition, Mr. Mr. Jones. Oh, we've got one. We've got one mega Paixao here. We do. Yeah, you ready? I'm ready. I'm sitting down from Ben and Alberto at our Cisco comm. Send us 1010 dot 101 $1,010.10 Whoa. Oh, man. Oh, thank you so much to have a note with this wonderful support.

There is a note Adam and Dave all the bits referenced the amount and pieces of podcasting to Puno makes such a beautiful opportunity for podcasting and podcasters. Thanks for working so hard to bring opportunity into reality for so many from your [email protected]. Guys, thank you so much. That is humbling, man. Thanks. That's a lot of value. You get out of this and you returned it that way. And thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Pretty Yeah. Now, yeah. That is

the that's the Pay Pal. Because we've transitioned. That is we have transitioned the I'd have a make good though. Oh, Martin. Martin from pod friend. I missed his boost last week. Oh, so he sent in 2018 and 20 to 22 to two to two. And he said I just wanted to say that to everyone that re implementing a podcast app from scratch seemed like something that could be done decently quickly. Spoiler spoiler alert. It is not. But fun. Can't wait to join the new feature dev race again in some

months. Oh, so it sounds like he's doing it from scratch. rewriter Wow, hold on. We get some ducks out for me. I still have my pillow. We still use our mug. I'm drinking out of my mug and we love the pot with the we love the pod friend. And he sent another 10,000 SATs and he did his message was relevant boost. Yes. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate that. Martin. Yeah. And we've got from Borlaug. 25,000 SATs. He says the two of you are a gift to the

industry. And I appreciate all your hard work. Well, thank you Borlaug. Appreciate that. A gift gift to the industry. That's Yes, I tell them that's my motivational speaking to myself every morning when I wake up. You're a gift to the industry. Dave, you're a gift to the industry. I want to every morning I'm gonna send you a tax day. You're a gift to the industry. And I'm just gonna replan is that yes,

yeah. Word Up. One 100% roster Calavera fire roster Calavera 2000 sets through fountain says bless you Dave Jones heal up more beef milkshakes are needed Yes. Hey, how are you feeling? You sound good? I've got a lot more energy it's just the linger you know that's crap just lingers forever but I'm good I'm good. Good. Yay. Oh, here's a mike Dell 12345335 Verse he says go podcasting

unanimous safe in in for VX? Send us through curio Castro 2102 And he says thank you for your coding 70 threes and such dash 70 threes and such the mere mortals podcast are ready Kira and 2222 through fountain he says Dave stat saved the day. 1.5 million poop casts Wow, that's a lot of crap. Referring to anchor I presume. Yes. We're doing another another chop and drop. Chopping drawers we as as we speak. This one's going to be brutal. That's our title home. Beautiful. Yeah, stop dancing on

graves. Come on, man. We're doing a bit of that too. Are you well, the current, the current, the current expanded criteria for getting the CHOP is if you've only got one episode in your feed, and you haven't published for for a year, you're gone. You're gonna and I'm not even looking at how long the episode is. Just to make it be an hour. It's not it's a goner. And I don't care if that's too zealous. I just don't care anymore.

Wait, and if okay, you know, so how long how long is this only applies to this only applies to anchor and Okay, why don't we just shut anchor off altogether? Don't Don't hit me. Like three. There's three shows over there at least that are decent. That's a little aggressive. Like, I think if you're hosted anger, you should request it to be added. You know, it's like you shouldn't you should Really you should beg us. Yes. That's begging is not a bad system. This there could be

there could be a part of the protocol. Yeah, yeah, we're chopping so you think of your chop and drop more than egg insertion system? I mean that's that's a pretty strong title. I like chop and drop. Alright job, but it Hey, it's your show to you want egg and egg and it sounds like artificial insemination in some weird ways. It does. We'll we'll put out a poll. Oh, yes. Every is on Twitter. Elon Spotify, Jean Everett 33 333 Your fountain and he just says boost Yeah. Gotcha brother. Thank you.

Fountain mere mortals podcast Karen back again. He says the blurring of your mouth was crazy. Good thing you still don't have that glam rock hair would have censored that for sure. That's on Joe Rogan. Did you hear my Joe Rogan? Episode? I'm about halfway through. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I tried to fire him like I tried. Yeah, or default. I heard they heard the attempts, the aborted abortive attempts. You made the news a little bit there you were you were shown on

least Fox as far as I know. You know, so many people sent me that because it was a rant to Joe was doing. About about the news, specifically CNN. Like, Hey, man, you made the news. Like yeah, okay, so, of the 2 million people on Fox and Friends in the morning. 12 million people on Joe Rogan. It's like, okay, yeah, it was a nice addition. Yeah, it's just a little backwards. Right? You have no idea what happens when you go on Joe Rogan.

But you are a right wing nut job. So I mean, we know that and by the way, you know, this is all just for one reason. And that's to get Alex Jones back on the air. Yeah, absolutely. Mission accomplished. I am Mr. Robot 432 through fountain he says love the show, the stats, the tech, et cetera, about Patreon people, especially Canadians and Bitcoiners lost trust in it after the trucker strike in Canada last year when they froze those Patreon funds because it's

a centralized entity. Yeah, that was messed up. Yeah, Mr. Robot. He helped get Texas limbs podcast up and running. Oh, good. Okay. Joel ws Sachtler Richards through fountain no note. I am Mr. Robot again. 3456 through fountain he says booths got cut off wanted to add that podcasting. 2.0 is the future and here to stay go podcasting? Yeah, Brother You got got cut off. Gene been 1337 elite booster cast Matic and he says Adam, following up on moon pay KYC stuff. I'm in the US.

Oh, okay. Yeah, some people apparently do have to take a picture and turn their head and cough. That was not my experience. But thanks. Thanks for the updates. Good to know, good to know. And the people who implement Moon pay let let your users know you may be asked to cough. Yeah. Just add that people get when it comes to funny enough how easy people are to post their location, you know, selfies, everything. But oh, man, someone's asking me for my driver's license. Now, they get really worried.

It's funny, because it's really no different than anything else we do. It's just that you're hit with it all at once. Like, like when not people say things like, you know, oh, the Apple subscription thing is so seamless. And it is. But the reason is because you did the KYC stuff for all your financial accounts, months and yeah, nor years ago. Exactly. Right. And now and with the Bitcoin thing you're hit, you're getting hit with it right now for the first time. So it's really the in the

grand scheme of things. It's not different. It's not more onerous than than having a credit card or bank account or something like that. It's actually less, but you just have to do it. Whereas the other stuff you just always had people expect a credit card to just work and not have to show all this stuff just to use your credit card or your debit card. Yeah, yeah, that's that's where it's different. Yeah. Chris last for Jupiter broadcasting. Mr. Chris Fisher.

He sends us a 808 80,000 SATs through pod version. He says the whole episode was a was a great conversation. Dave and Adam he both had been showing up and kicking butt while dealing with a rebuilt mouth and getting sick show hasn't missed a beat your pros. Adam and Dave swinging from the vine. Thank you, Chris. Appreciate that SLC through fountain 12 for 90 days as Fiat goes out and BTC goes in and only comes out for beef and boosts Nice. Let's go some reverb on you equals bless

your heart. Anyone running a church soundboard for the band knows this little more reverb Gladys, more reverb. Oh, Mike. Sorry, I gotta set that up so I can add. I don't know. I won't be able to you won't be able to hear it if you have reverb, the church soundboard. I know what you mean. SLC again, 12 498 through foundry says Hey, Adam is me your son. Don't worry, I'm doing great. Good to hear from you.

Hello, Steven, the pneumatic coder 1555 through the podcast index website and he says podcast platforms like Spotify are about owning podcasters and the products of their work go value for value nice. We don't I don't like it. 6969 from pay citizen through pod versed proverbs. He says I love you guys. A lot. Thanks, brother. Love you too. Love you.

Booster. LSA magenta monkey through breeze, send us 54321 And that just says that you would think that's Roy Yeah, that's that's his that's his handle almost. Yeah, the 54321 and just as podcast index.org is the only thing in the note. And then he but then he follows up so I think he Oh yeah, that's exactly what this really follows up with another 543200 sending another boost because I used an anonymous profile previously. And what was that? What was that profile?

Crimson monkey. Crimson magenta mug. Alright, so now we know if we see magenta monkey anywhere we know it's Roy well, those two booths together Oh, he hit 20 his blades on him Paula thanks Roy. Love you Roy comes with Gemini had done head tone record 10,000 says through fountain he says great seeing days post that the

meeting with Michael and Sam the wavelength went well. The four v music surf swell increasing also confirming curio Castro music section displays my feeds added from wave Lake testing continues. Thanks to everyone working on this area. Yeah, it's it's it was a good meeting and we're going to have them on the show. On March the like first weekend in March, our cool Friday and I'm very excited about that. Great, great guys to talk to you. They totally get it. Yeah, it's there. This is

going to be fun. As the gore log again 20 It will good no no go no, continue. I'm sorry. That's 25,000 SATs through pod verse and he says thank you for everything you do. And I'm grateful this podcast exists Oh thank you. That's real. That's true value man.

Appreciate that period. I'm grateful that you exist for beautiful and they delimiter chemistry blogger 30 3015 through fountain and he says in a world where mindsets are besieged by parasitical information gatekeepers caretakers of the cast dashing Dave Jones in a Sergent Adam curry step up every week to provide protective powers preserving podcast prowess, we were honored to promote the AI dot cooking podcast, a show about existential cutting edge tech enlivened by boundlessly

enthusiastic family man Gregory Forman, yo, boost Thank you comics for Blogger. I'm all for AI now now that I know what it stands for Adam intelligence there you go, everybody boom, there it is. Ai rocks. Ah, thank you all very much monthlies months. Oh, yeah, do the monthlies and I will check the I will check the the tally coin. Chad Pharaoh $20.20 Thank you brother Chad. Scott Jalbert $12 Pedro gun calvess $5 Aaron Renaud $5 Jouvert Garate new

donor $3 Thank you and Schubert, Martin, Linda Skog. $1 Thank you Martin and Mark Graham $1. And that's our group and Dred Scott as he left the chat room. Did he did he throw sets into the room? Yeah, he did. Like just threw some on the floor through tally coin. He says just wanted to make sure you had something to be here in the tally coin. 85,450 Satoshis tallyho he says Bruce Wayne of podcasting everybody. We have no idea how he does it where his family wealth comes from but we love

him. We love and afford. He's got a cave for sure. Huge library on the on the sixth floor, huge library where he keeps all of his his legion that legion of superhero costumes and everything. So we this is two hours on the nose. No punches kind of good. You gotta go back to work Dave. I think they do the do the actual actual work. This is a value for value podcast. Everything that comes in is appreciation and value for what this podcast And what the index the whole project is funded by

the people who support it, who get value out of it. podcast index.org You can go to this scroll to the bottom there's a big red donate button that'll take it to the Fiat fund coupon system from PayPal, which as you can hear is not very popular anymore. Although for some of those bigger bigger supporters, it's always appreciated and of course, you might want to try out a new and modern podcast new podcasts apps.com Kick out those legacy apps also new to podcast it completely works absolutely.

Todd and Mike brothers thank you so much it was great to have you guys on and really appreciate the enthusiasm and and all the work you're putting on into it and please thank your your team at blueberry as well.

And thanks Adam for having us on and Dave and I do want to give one shout out to Andy layman Thank you brother for carrying us for a long time by making that add on plugin for power press it was it was a it got it got us over the hump so Andy thank you so much for that another hero of podcasting 2.0 The Revolution Yeah, thanks. Thanks for having us.

Oh yeah, and well we'll have you guys on again soon I'm sure when when you have an update when when stuff was flying around or not if you're if you go bankrupt either way we'll have yon not planning on it. No. We were in this for the vow of poverty as well. So for sure. Dave anything else? Anything else we need? Are we good? Are we good for the weekend?

We're good for the weekend. I have a I have a podcast ownership verification service to build Please don't Don't build it please don't gonna build it I'm gonna build it I'm gonna build it and but it didn't build it Okay, he's gonna build it and then challenge has been thrown down it feels kind of like you're gonna build it and never be used kind of like I got a generator two years ago and I can't get the power to go out here now like all the Texas is down and

we still have power like come on, man. I want that thing to kick in. You're gonna have to pay somebody in Hill Country to EMP you you know, so you can test it. They are pulling cape of fiber and fried by right by our property that you need to say Oh, really? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Good Juju. You all have Hill Country is getting lit. Oops. Is getting fiber. Yeah. Now you need to pay you need to pay a good old boy and he'll country to chop your power for what just so you can say to

Tina, see? See, I told you we had to do this. I have friends who have those big, like belts, you know, that are like motorcycle chains and just throw one of those wires. It'd be fine. Oh, yeah. You'd be fine. Yeah, they'll be alright everybody that was in podcasting. 2.0 For today, the board meeting. We appreciate having our guests here. And we'll be back next week with another board meeting to bring you up to speed on what's happening right here podcasting 2.0. affect your chat room.

You have been listening to podcasting. 2.0 To visit podcasts index dashboard for more information. Or cool Ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding