Trump Blasts "Third Rate Podcasts"

Pod Safe America is brought to you by Simply Safe. Between the news cycle and daily to do lists, your brain probably already has too many tabs open. Yeah. Your home security system shouldn't be one of them. With Simply Safe, you can easily customize a system that's right for your home at SimplySafe.com and it ships to your door in a few days. With app guided setup and no drilling required, you can install and arm your system in under an hour. No need to wait around for a technician appointment.

It's not just a camera, it's a comprehensive ecosystem of sensors, cameras for inside and out and twenty-four-seven professional monitoring in the event of a break-in, fire, or flood. SimplySafe's agents are ready to take action. There are no long-term contracts or hidden cancellation fees. SimplySafe earns your business by keeping you safe, not by trapping you in a contract. Get 24-7 monitoring for a fraction of what the traditional brands charge.

Um I set up a simply safe uh home security system. It gives incredible peace of mind. Uh you can set up really easily and then the app is great, the customer support is great. And no drilling required for you either. No drilling at all. And so then let's say, you know, let's say you're married and you're like out uh on a business trip, you wanna know that like your family member is safe at home.

Able to, you know, relax, throw on a couple of uh giant double D fake boobies and and talk to a friend without being afraid of a break in. There it is. You know. You don't wanna be afraid of a breaking when you're when you're throwing around those big fake knockers. You wanna make sure the only thing the only thing knocking. When will people remember that story? Yeah, I will. Sure. I hope for sure. Uh well it if not, you just brought it back.

Okay, we've partnered with Simply Safe to offer an exclusive discount to our listeners. Right now you can get 50% off your new system by visiting SimplySafe.com/slash crooked. That's half off at simplysafe.com slash crooked. There's no safe like Simply Safe. Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm John. I'm Dan Pfeiffer. On today's show, we'll talk about Trump trading genocidal threats for a chaotic ceasefire.

Changed all that much in Iran. Vance heading to Pakistan for negotiations with an eye on his 2020. The prominent MAGA stars calling for Trump's removal, Republican fears that they've already lost the midterms, DNC drama over Israel, and Melania Trump's bizarre attempt to distance herself from Jeffrey Epstein. What a day. Then Rahmanuel stops by the studio to talk with Tommy about Iran, Israel, and his widely rumored presidential ambitions. Quite the show, Dan, quite the show.

Uh quick reminder for all of you, please consider becoming a crooked media subscriber if you haven't already done so. Uh we don't want you to miss out on any of the great content we're putting out for our friends of the pod. Subscribers get our new extra episode of Pod Save America called Podsave America Only Friends. Uh Tommy and I did it this week. It's great. You should check it out. Become a subscriber. We got other subscriber only shows like Polar Coaster.

Uh, with the the guy right here with me, Dan Pfeiffer. That's me. Virtually at least. Um access to all of our excellent Substack newsletters like Pod Save America open tabs, ad-free episodes of all your favorite crooked pods, and you get to feel good about supporting one of the few independent, proudly pro-democracy media outlets left in Trump's America. So

Head to Crooked dot com slash friends and subscribe. All right, let's get to the news. Uh after a week where the president backed off his threat to eradicate an entire civilization based on a last minute ceasefire agreement with Iran, We are basically back to where we were the last time you and I recorded a week ago.

The Iranian regime is still in power, still controls the Strait of Hormuz, and still has its nuclear material. War is still raging in the Middle East between Israel and Lebanon. Oil and gas prices are still high. and Trump is still declaring victory while simultaneously threatening more war. Uh one of his latest posts says that our military is, quote, looking forward actually to its next conquest.

And in the same post said that if Iran doesn't agree to all his demands, quote, then the shootin' starts. For some reason shootin' starts is in quote. Uh bigger and better and stronger than anyone has ever seen before. Uh and Dan, while while you might be mocking Trump's decision to pull us all back to pull us all back from the brink of uh catastrophe, like some silly resistance lib. The folks at Fox News know what's up.

Democrats are already saying that this is taco. Trump always chickens out. Let me give you another acronym. Nacho. Never avoids confronting hard obstacles. It's a nacho, Dan. It's a nacho. Is it a taco or is it a nacho? No, don't answer that question. How would you assess uh Donald Trump's diplomatic prowess over the last week? I think the Would you a quesadilla? A chimichanga? An enchilada? Anything from the Taco Bell menu. Okay. Supreme G Supreme Gordita? Is that what you're doing?

I haven't been to Taco Bell in years, so I don't know but go. Um don't don't brag about it. Are ya? So anyway, this s neither here nor there. Yeah. Yes. Okay. Let's get into the actual questions here. It has not been a stellar thirty-six hours or so of diplomacy for Donald Trump, I would say. Um it really hasn't been a very good month, hasn't been a good decade, but I think the Iran war has brought to bear for the public.

Something that we always knew to be true. I think even some of Trump's supporters suspected to be true but suppressed that, which is that Donald Trump is an erratic, capricious idiot who is so in insofar over his head that he cannot see straight.

It's just when you go through what is happening here. One day it is we're winning. The next day uh we don't need the the straight of Hormuz at all. Then we're gonna blow up we're gonna send a rant to the Stone Ages, we're gonna blow up every bridge and power plant'cause we need the Strait of Hormuz. He agrees to a ceasefire negotiation. He has no idea what's in it. According to the reporting, he uh did not even know that

He thought Lebanon was in it. Turns out it was at least Israel thought it was not or it wasn't originally, and then BB Netanyahu got on the uh the red phone he has directly into the White House and had it taken out. There is huge confusion. Since Donald Trump probably has no idea where Lebanon is and couldn't point it out as well.

He has no idea, he's not steeped in the details, he has no core policy ideas, he doesn't understand how the global oil market works, he doesn't understand what the Shredd of Hormuz is, he doesn't understand how

uh your enriched uranium matters or where it could be or how it's used. He knows nothing. And it is It's sort of a miracle that Donald Trump has been president for five years now, and for most of that time he's be able been able to dance through the raindrops of his own incompetence to avoid things like this.

Like we always would say, especially in Trump's first term, he's gonna tweet us into a war, stumble us backwards into a war. Well he did that. Yeah and he has no way of getting out of it. Yes, we can just check. I went off the butt. Ch uh tweeted yeah, he uh he we s we stumbled our way into a uh once in a generation pandemic, mismanaged that. Yeah. Right. Yeah, it's just For most of the time. pandemic And this war aside, for most of the time, particularly in Trump's first term.

His incompetence didn't end up mattering that much. It was just he got very lucky. There weren't a lot of crises. The ones he got into, he was able to st he stumbled into and was able to stumble out of them quickly. Now he stumbled into something he cannot get out of, and he is just truly the worst person to try to lead us out of this.

I also th the Times had a sort of a a TikTok of the thirty six hours when the ceasefire came together and it was interesting because um and I think this there was this was reported at the time, but Uh, when Donald Trump posted his uh genocidal threat that a civilization will die tonight, the negotiations had apparently been going somewhat well.

And then when he posted that, the Iranians became so enraged that they broke off the negotiations and the Pakistanis and then ultimately China uh had to try to put it all back together last minute. to get a deal which Donald Trump wanted because Donald Donald Trump was looking for an exit ramp. uh because he knew the war was unpopular. So what he thought was going to get a deal by uh making a genocidal threat actually almost tanked the entire thing.

I am shocked to find out that a threat of genocide did not improve the diplomatic prospects.

So in that story, it's also funny that story is thirty-six hours because you know the Times most famous travel feature is thirty-six hours in Paris, thirty-six hours in New York. And so when you Google Donald Trump thirty-six hours Iran, you get some strange results. Um But the in there there is the it's kind of the opening anecdote is Trump is sitting at his desk as the clock is ticking down to his eight PM genocide deadline.

And he's looking at pictures and video of Iranian civilians surrounding the bridges and power plants that Trump has promised to bomb. And his basic response seems to be, Well, that'll be Iran's fault. Yeah. And he was like in a bunch of meetings about other topics, just like bragging about how many bridges and power plants he was ready to bomb that night and destroy.

Um there were there were there had been some reporting too, and I couldn't tell if it was like a negotiating tactic or not. May have been, but that said um that of all his advisors, Donald Trump uh has been the most bloodthirsty of any of them. He's been like the biggest warmonger. Um, which is uh Not something that's gonna make me sleep well at night, Dan. Um

So there he also did right before we recorded he was like I I hear that Iran might be charging holes now on the Strait of Hormuz. They better not be and it's like wha wh th that's been reported for for days now. That was like again, but part of the agreement was that the IRGC was gonna run the street. So what did you think was gonna happen? And then someone asked you about it yesterday and you said we might charge tolls as well. You also talked about in a post how

It's a great day for world peace after the ceasefire agreement and now everyone's gonna make money, it's gonna be the golden age in the Middle East. Like what he he has does he have no idea what the fuck's going on? Clearly. Wait no, I yes, uh you were correct, John. He has no idea what the fuck's going on. Wait till he finds out that one of the ways in which the IRGC is accepting payment is in cryptocurrency and one of the acceptable methods is the uh World Liberty Financial USD one stablecoin.

Wait, is that part true? The second part? I have no idea that that has been reported. That has actually been reported that has been reported. I cannot verify that to be the case, but I think it has to be in stable coins, and that is a stable coin. Amazing. Amazing. So there's been a lot of stellar reporting in the last week about what's been happening in the White House during this war since.

You know, we can't trust the public comments of anyone who works in the White House. Uh Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan had quite a detailed story about the situation rim deliberations that led to war, which apparently included an in person presentation by BB Netanyahu. Uh what did you make of that piece? Like the diplomacy piece, just a wild expose of incompetence.

It's just it seems very clear that uh Trump was persuaded to go to war by BB Netanyahu. It seems that Trump gave it very little thought as to what would happen next. Uh he took the word of BB Netanyahu according to this report. Uh and the Israeli intelligence service. Like according to B B is in the sit room and he's they've handed over the keys to the technology of the sit room to the Israelis and so on the screen is uh the Israeli military, the Mossad to walking through it and

Trump apparently seemed dismissive of the concerns raised by General Dan Cain and others on our side, and took the what the Israelis had to say as uh more accurate or more or better pr more predictive. And let us even though If Trump had half a brain, he'd know that B B has been pushing for this war for decades. Right. And obviously it's not an unbiased uh presenter of information here. Yeah. What I got from that was yeah, first of all, stunning that you had a head of state

in the situation room, uh even an ally like pressing for w making the case for war in the situation room, I don't think that that has ever happened. Um I don't I certainly don't remember it ever happening. Uh that said, I also, you know, the the Pro Israel folks will say, Well, Donald Trump has agency and he made the decision himself and it wasn't necessarily just B B and I think the piece bears that out for sure.

Um, I think he he B B definitely made the case and definitely influenced him, but I think Donald Trump uh wanted to hear a pro war case from BB Netanyahu. And um I guess there was like you know, there was four four potential uh objectives for the war. And the piece says like first was decapitation, killing the Ayatollah. Second was crippling Iran's capacity to project power and threaten its neighbors. Third was a popular uprising inside Iran, and fourth was regime change.

with a secular leader installed to govern the country. And basically the military cane tells Trump.

Uh he he thinks the military does have the capacity. He wasn't even to saying he was for it, but he said the military does have the capacity to do one and two, killing the Ayotolla and crippling Iran's capacity to project power. Um and then basically everyone in the room, except for Wha this was after B B Netanyahu left and the Israelis left, but all of his staff was like all the rest of the senior officials uh in in the White House were basically said that three and four

um, the popular uprising and uh installing a secular leader were crazy. Uh Ratcliffe, the CIA directors, called it uh farcical. Um and and then Rubio interjected, that means b it's bullshit. I I assume because Trump didn't know what versus. Um but even and even as General Kane said he believes the military could achieve one and two, he also warned about.

the Strait of Hormuz and how it would be very very difficult to reopen or and how the Iranians could gain control of it, which has happened. Trump seemed to dismiss that because he thought, Oh, the regime will have fallen by then. Um, and warned about um depleting munitions, that we are gonna like use a lot of our weapons and and defensive weapons, offensive weapons by doing this, and Trump didn't seem to care about that.

Um and then there was even an anecdote in that story how Tucker Carlson, uh, who had been calling Trump and warning him not to do this and pleading with him not to do this, he basically said uh he had a call with the President right before Trump said go and Uh Trump said to Carlson, I know you're worried about it, but it's going to be okay. And then uh Tucker said, Well how do you know? And Trump said, Because it always is I think there's that is a very, very telling anecdote. V two.

Everything's gonna go great. Yeah, it always has for him, right? Go bankrupt, get rich again, right? And I think especially since he survived the assassination attempt, he does have this he has like a little bit of a little bit Messiah complex here where he thinks like, you know, God has sent him to be president again and he thinks it's I I think he he saw Venezuela go off without a hitch for him at least.

Um, and he saw the you know, in the twelve day war when they bombed Iran, like that went off relatively easily without a hitch as well.

And so he just thought this would be the same and he also sees it as a legacy item. He thinks, Oh well, no president's done this in forty seven years. There's also a good piece in the Atlantic today. Um uh Jonathan Lemeer wrote about uh how for Trump like it's nineteen seventy nine again and he's sort of like stuck in nine in in the eighties and nineteen seventy nine and in nineteen seventy nine

you know, the the popular political thing to say was like, Oh, Carter was too soft on Iran and and, you know, we would have if if he had just bombed Iran then it would have been better. And so like and and because Trump's always frozen in time, he's still thinking that it's like the eighties. and that he's gonna be the guy who couldn't do what presidents could tried to do for forty seven years and changed a theocracy in Iran.

Yeah, I think I think that's all right. Like he it's like he has a Messiah complex. He also just has been it's good this goes to sort of his idiocy is to not understand the difference between at Iran as part of Midnight Hammer or sending in the Delta Force into Venezuela to abduct one person from launching a war with Iran. In the Middle East with the Strait of Four Moose there. Like did not understand those differences is it's galling, really. Like it's stunning to be that.

sort of ignorant of the whole thing, but he does all these things for the military, they do what they're supposed to do every single time without flaw, without loss of life, and he just thought he could get Away with it. It's still I think the 80s thing is a really interesting point because like it is this mentality about cities, about crime, about everything is that New York

nineteen eighties, I'm the nineteen seventy nine. Uh he sees how that ended Carter's presidency, the attempt to rescue the hostages, the inability to rescue the hostages in the in the embassy. But it still is strange that he has picked regime change as his legacy item. I know, because because he also watched Durak unfold.

And um, you know, I mean he claims to be opposed to that now, but what he was opposed to was when it all went south, he wanted to be on the side of uh saying, Yeah, this is bad and what a catastrophe And also, Oh, you should have taken the oil. Uh his his lesson in Iraq is like don't send in a whole bunch of ground troops and take the oil. Um and so which I guess is why he hasn't sent in ground troops yet to Iran, but who knows? Because the war continues.

Uh it's a very fragile ceasefire that has almost fallen apart numerous times. It it may yet fall apart by the time they get to Islamabad this weekend. By the time you're listening to this t m on Friday, it may have fallen apart. Right. Right. Because I Israel is continues to just bomb the hell out of Lebanon, uh and Beirut, a densely po pa populated uh urban area. Um hundreds of civilians have died, women, children, medics.

And I guess finally Trump called Bibi and said, like you've gotta pursue some kind of diplomatic negotiations with the Lebanese government, which had been trying to disarm Hezbolla before um uh this latest war. and had been also trying to negotiate since the uh Israel began bombing them, had been trying to negotiate with the Israelis some kind of a diplomatic solution because so many Lebanese who have nothing to do with Hezbollah are dying in this war and millions have been displaced.

So um I guess Trump has got BB to agree to pursue some kind of diplomatic negotiations, though Netanyahu also said there will be no ceasefire while negotiations go on. And so and the Iranians are saying like Absolutely not. We don't want to negotiate if this is happening. Who knows if they'll stick with that or not? But that's sort of where we are right now.

just it does sh show the weakness of Trump here, which is Trump wants a ceasefire. He wants this over The thing preventing this from being over is Israel bombing Lebanon, and he is unable to convince or force or use leverage on Netanyahu to get Israel to stop bombing Lebanon.

And Israel's gonna keep bombing Lebanon because they want the war with Iran to keep going. They want the United States to keep bombing Iran, so they're gonna keep bombing Lebanon. And we are just in this sli it is is a circular argument that Trump cannot figure out how to get out of because he does not have the guts, the courage the strategic sense to figure out how to get Netanyahu to do the thing he wants, even though Net Israel is dependent on the US for so much, particularly in this moment.

And, you know, he also doesn't understand, or maybe doesn't care, like what Netanyahu's thought process is on this, which is uh not dissimilar to his thought process in Gaza, which is they're not just like taking out senior Hezbollah commanders.

They are taking out like mid level Hezbollah uh you know, operatives who are embedding themselves in civilian populations. The Israelis don't seem to care. They're bombing the civilian populations anyway. They are basically occupying uh southern Lebanon at this point and they may not ha and and it doesn't seem like they want to give it up.

um, just like they are occupying Gaza and basically their view is we're just gonna keep pushing the boundaries outward from Israel and we're gonna keep calling them buffer zones, but what they really are is just taking land and occupying more land. Thinking that somehow this is going to be enough to eradicate Hezbollah or Hamas or any of the other terrorist groups they think are threatened. And it's

continues to be proven wrong over and over and over again. And uh I wouldn't expect Trump to understand that, but maybe someone in the government might. Um so in the last few days, uh Trump has turned his attention toward another sworn enemy of the United States, NATO.

Uh, the Wall Street Journal reports that the White House is considering a plan to punish NATO for not going along with Trump and Netanyahu's war by removing US troops from NATO countries. Uh Trump has also been ranting about NATO, posting quote, NATO wasn't there when we needed them, and they won't be there if we need them again. Remember Greenland, that big, poorly run piece of ice. Okay? Uh

You would think all this might have made for an awkward meeting between Trump and NATO Secretary General Mark Ruta on Wednesday, but not so, according to Ruta. Is the world safer today than it was before the war was started? Absolutely. Do you still consider him daddy after yesterday? I was not calling in my daddy but saying. But of course daddy has also a special connotation. And I now have to live as this the rest of my life. Dan, do you still consider Trump daddy?

I don't really know how to answer that question. Ha ha ha. Seems like a trap is what it seems like. That guy! Go ahead. You you you defend Mark Rutten. As you did in our morning meeting. Did. I did. I mean what I was shocked by was the way in which you just dis dismissed the importance of NATO to the uh the global alliances. Well I mean here here's the thing. Uh obviously

Ruta has developed a has a strategy of appeasement that is incredibly embarrassing. Yes. For him, for NATO, for those of us who even have to consume him, it is it's it's embarrassing. I don't know how he sleeps at night. The problem for Ruta is NATO does not exist without the United States.

And w they are staring down a face where we have Russian aggression headed towards the European continent, and if the United States pulls out of NATO, they lose the most important military part of NATO and the biggest threat to Turin to Russia. And so he like, I don't applaud the way he's doing this. I am embarrassed for him. Uh I'm embarrassed for his family that this happens, but He is he is trying to keep NATO together because like you love just to say, Fuck you and walk away.

But if he does that, then NATO, which is the thing he's in charge of, collapses functionally at least. Even if Trump doesn't formally pull out of NATO, which, you know, he would need to go to Congress for anyway, or who knows, maybe in a truth social post he'll do it. Um, even if he doesn't do that, if you're Vladimir Putin And uh you have eyes on uh potentially invading a NATO country.

Do you really think the United States is going to come to the defense of NATO, um, militarily or even otherwise, if uh if you go ahead and and invade at this point? Probably not. And that's the whole alliance right there. Yeah. That's the whole point of NATO. Now Trump Trump seems to think in in these posts, Trump seems to think NATO is like um

Like you be because you're in NATO, whatever one country wants to do in NATO and whatever wars they want to pursue and invasions and and bombings they wanna do, then everyone else has to join too. Like you're like, Come on, we're NATO, you gotta help me. Yeah. Yeah, he thinks they're all part of the same gang. He doesn't realize it's a defensive alliance.

Once again, a basic principle learned in you know, European history, you know, one oh one or whatever else that Trump this has eluded Trump till his eighties. Completely embarrassing. Pot Save America is brought to you by Helix. Sleep. It's so important. I'm tired right now because uh my dog woke me up in the middle of the night because she had surgery and was moaning and groaning. But I was like, hey, hey, hey, stop that. I'm so comfortable with my Helix mattress.

I was sleeping like a bug in a rug. Poor girl. So, you know, let her out for her her nightly diarrhea. And then I got right back in there. Diarrhea. Right back in no, she's okay now. She's okay. It's on the side of it. She's on the side of it. Uh I've had all kinds of sleep issues over the years and now I have a Helix mattress and so comfortable. You can customize it to to your sleep preferences.

Make sure you get the right one for you. I have a Don Lux. Super comfortable. Get free shipping and seamless delivery. Helix delivers your mattress right to your door. With free shipping in the US, the Happy with Helix Guarantee offers a risk-free customer-first experience designed to ensure you're completely satisfied with your new mattress.

So you can rest easy with seamless returns and exchanges. Plus Helix offers a hundred and twenty night sleep trial and limited lifetime warranty. I'm a huge fan of it. Just said that. So uh you know, you should get one. Go to Helix Sleep.com slash. Love Helix Matters. HelixLep.com slash crooked for 20% off site wide. That's HelixSleep.com slash crooked for 20% off site wide. Make sure you enter our show name after checkout. Say they know we sent you HelixSleep.com slash crooked.

Podsave America is brought to you by Mint Mobile. Like most people, I like keeping my money where I can see it. Unfortunately, traditional big wireless carriers also seem to like keeping your money too. If you're fed up with crazy high wireless bills, bogus fees, and free perks that actually cost more in the long run, then switch to Mint Mobile.

Stop overpaying for wireless just because that's how it's always been. Mint exists purely to fix that. Mint mobile is here to rescue you with premium wireless plans starting at fifteen bucks a month. All plans come with high-speed data and unlimited talk and text delivered on the nation's largest 5G network.

Bring your own phone and number, activate with eSIM in minutes, and start saving immediately. No long-term contracts, no hassle. Ditch overpriced wireless and get three months of premium wireless service from Mint Mobile for fifteen bucks a month. Fifteen bucks a month. Do you know how much you could be saving on all with all these other wireless carriers? Mobile 15 bucks a month? Come on. So expensive the other ones. Come on.

If you like your money, Mint Mobile is for you. Shop plans at mintmobile.com slash crooked. That's mintmobile.com slash crooked. Upfront payment of forty-five dollars for three-month five gigabyte plan required. Equivalent to$15 a month, new customer offer for first three months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra, see Mint Mobile for details.

So if the ceasefire doesn't completely fall apart, JD Vance is headed to Islamabad this weekend for negotiations with the Iranians. Uh so I hope they're they're ready to say thank you. Got a lot of they gotta be meeting JD Vance with a lot of thank yous, or else he's gonna be very angry. Um, Vance's team has seemingly been leaking to every reporter who listened.

that the Vice President has been the senior Trump official most opposed to the war in Iran. This comes up quite a bit in the Times piece we talked about. Uh when the ceasefire came together this week, Vance happened to be out on the campaign trail, um, in Hungary, As one does. Yes, one does holding a rally for the country's pro Putin authoritarian incumbent, Viktor Orban, where uh he just as a nice touch accused the Ukrainians of election interference.

JD Vance accusing the Ukrainians of election interference as he, a US official, was in Hungary campaigning for the authoritarian incumbent in that country. And Apparently lacks self awareness. Uh very normal. But America's best hope for peace in the Middle East did make some time for Iran questions on the tarmac and Budapest. Here's how we handle it. I think the Iranians thought Thank you.

Ceasefire included Lebanon and it just didn't. We never made that promise. We never indicated that was gonna be the case. First of all, he said that there are a few points of disagreement before the negotiation. Well, that must mean that there's a lot of points.

Of agreement because there's a 15-point plan floating around, there's a 10-point plan floating around. If he's frustrated about three issues, that actually means that there's a lot of agreement. That's point number one. Point number two, to respond to each of those issues, and I read it very closely. Yeah.

Let me just say this. I actually wonder how good he is at understanding English, because there are things that he said that frankly didn't make sense in some of the in the context of the negotiations that we've had. The second thing Galiba said, which again I found fascinating is Is he said, we refuse to give up the right to enrichment. And I thought to myself, you know what? My wife has the right to. But

She doesn't jump out of an airplane because she and I have an agreement that she's not going to do that because I don't want my wife jumping out of an airplane. We don't really concern ourselves with what they claim they have the right to do. We concern ourselves with what they actually do. And I think the president's been very clear. I tell you the the my wife really came out of nowhere. Did not expect

the uh him to reference his wife jumping out of a plane. Um but it really is interesting to see how JD Vance grapples with these foreign policy issues. You can tell he's really giving it thought and definitely not. Sort of just making it up on the fly. Yeah. He is such a pedantic obnoxious high school debater.

Yeah. I actually I think I think the misunderstanding it couldn't be us. I think the misunderstanding is you not speaking English very well. Does he think their translators don't exist? Does he think that like what what does he think this is? He's like, actually, it really depends on what you mean by right. Like, I have an idea, I have a way to get out of this,'cause I was really thinking about Usha and skydiving. Hmm.

Like do they have an a is the agreement that she won't skydive or do they have a mutual non skydiving pact? If I was her I'd be like, Yeah, oh sure, I won't do it, but if you wanna jump out of a plane any time. I'm sure. Yeah, I'm sure she probably is wants to jump out of almost any moving vehicle that she's in with J Vance. I will fly you myself. Um So

If Vance does get a primary challenge in 2028, how far do you think he'll go in trying to communicate that he was always against this war and will it work? Because they are out there, some someone from his camp, if not Vance himself. uh did some real leaking to the New York Times about him in that meeting. They have to Politico before. It's been quite a few places now that the the Vance team has been out there just making sure everyone knows how opposed to the war he is in private.

You think Joe Biden thought was tough on Kamala Harris for trying to find areas of disagreement. How do you think Donald Trump, the guy who threatened to hang his last vice president, is going to be in the course of this election? Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I can't tell. It's I mean I think y I think he will be a complete dick, but like I do wonder if on some issues he'll give him a little he'll give him a little eway. I don't know.

I mean it would be f uh funny and Not funny it's not the right word sad if he's Darkly funny. Darkly funny if he's more malleable than Joe Biden was on this crucial issue of electability. Here's the thing, though. S Sonny Hosan, get the question ready, you know? 'Cause I don't think we're gonna see JD Vance on the view at any point. Um a couple th a couple things here. One, JD Vance is not gonna have a lot of success running in the Republican primary i g away from Trump.

Like the way these things typically work when a vice president is running to succeed a president, a two term president, and we have two modern examples, George H. W. Bush and uh Al Gore, is there is a Regime there's a continuity candidate and there's a change candidate. And JD Vance by definition is the continuity candidate. And the continuity candidate almost always wins, like George H. W. Bush and Al Gore did, because even if Trump is is unpopular

fading from the scene, he still will be remain very popular with Republican voters and popular enough that it would push JD Vance to the top. So his his he's gonna own everything Trump does. And if he his though his worst strategy, which is the the strategy I suspect he would do because He is all short-term ambitious and not a lot of long-term strategic thinking. Is his worst strategy would be to try to distance himself from Trump because he's gonna own. Everything Trump did. Right.

Yeah, he's gonna it's gonna be interesting. It's gonna be something that I enjoy watching, I will tell. It is because 'Cause he's also a bad liar. Yes, human. He loves to lie. I I'm not saying it's not his passion, but he's not very good at it, um, because he's also not very charismatic. And so I don't think he can pull it off that well. And I don't think he's cl he he thinks he's clever enough to sort of split the baby on this, but he's not.

Yeah, the gap between how clever JD Vance thinks he is and how clever JD Vance actually is. Yeah, that's like the gap in the uh where the negotiations stand between the US and Iran right now. And he just is so politically maladroit. He's just like a lumbering oaf knocking things over as he works his way through this. And so he's he's going you just always when he you always see

the cards up his sleeve when he is talking. And it's gonna be if he is trying to do anything other than just like be Trump three point oh or whatever it would be, it's gonna be so embarrassing and so easy to poke fun at. I Honestly, we'll we'll consider unretiring from politics if JD Vance is the nominee because that would be the most fun campaign to work on. You could have so like actually just

Honestly, I mean I think I think we probably have more fun just just doing it from here, you know. We don't want something Some fucking lame candidate being like no, that's too mean Uh fuck that I'm not candidate. I am on the m the make fun of JD Vance super pack side. Super pack. Okay. I think you can do to JD Vance what the Republicans definitely did to Gore and just make him an absolute caricature of himself.

We don't need to join one of these. That's just that's perfect. We'll just start one here. Okay. We have a plan. See you guys in two years. Ha ha ha. Um well I'm glad that the the guy who you can always see the cards up his sleeve. Uh he's our man in Islamabad for the He's there to take the he's there to take the fall. You think so?

I mean I it's unclear exactly why I think one one reason why he's there is no one tr the Iranians and all the other interlocutors do not trust Wikoff and Kushner because they're complete dopes.

Who And they think all the and then they think the people who aren't those two are like bloodthirsty warmongers and they do and I think, you know, with with some legitimacy they think that J. D. Vance is the most opposed to this war and probably it will be easier to talk to about potential peace or some diplomatic agreement um than anyone else in the administration. Yeah, I think that's probably true.

You know, I think they probably trust him a little bit more. Their mistake. Um So uh one thing's for sure, Vance must clearly be aware that the outrage among MAGA elites who oppose this war has uh now reached a fever pitch. I know we've played a lot of these clips uh in the last month, but they just keep getting better and better. So uh here you go. A whole civilization will die tonight. Never

To be brought back again. That is the definition of genocide. How do we twenty fifth amendment is asked? Can he just Just behave like a normal human. I mean, honestly, like the president. I three E D ches, sh sh shut up. Fuckin' sh- Shut up about that shit. His negotiation tactic is to kill an entire country full of civilians, men, women and children. An American president? So that the Strait of Hormuz will be opened? I it's just wrong.

The American people have to open their eyes and deal with reality and deal with truth. And the truth is, look, you may have supported President Trump for 10 years like I did and like you have. But this is not the same man. This is not the same man that we supported. Those people. Who are in the Direct contact with the president to say no. I'll resign. I'll do whatever. I can do legally to stop this because this is insane. And if given the order, I'm not carrying it out.

Figure out the codes on the football yourself. Dan, um this is breaking. We do have a response from the president. to all all this and I'm just gonna read this presidential statement and uh it is lengthy so I will try to go quickly and uh my emphasis will be um only where there are all capital letters. Um Thank you. Thank you for your service.

I know why Tucker Carlson, Megan Kelly, Candace Owens, and Alex Jones have all been fighting me for years, especially by the fact that they think it is wonderful for Iran, the number one state sponsor of terror, to have a nuclear weapon. Because they have one thing in common, low IQs. They're stupid people. They know it. Their families know it. And everyone else knows it too. Look at their past. Look at their record. They don't have what it takes and they never did.

They've all been thrown off television, lost their shows, and aren't even invited on TV because nobody cares about them. They're nutjobs, troublemakers, and will say anything necessary for some free and cheap publicity. Now they think they get some clicks because they have third-rate podcasts. But nobody's talking about them and their views are the opposite of MAGA, or I wouldn't have won the presidential election in a landslide.

MAGA agrees with me and just gave CNN a hundred percent approval rating of Trump. Not hand-flailing fools like Tucker Carlson, who couldn't even finish college. He was a broken man when he got fired from Fox and he's never been the same. Perhaps he could see a good psychiatrist or Megan Kelly who nastily asked me the now famous only Rosie O'Donnell question or crazy Candace Owens.

who accuses the highly respected First Lady of France of being a man when she is not, and will hopefully win lots of money in the ongoing lawsuit. Actually to me, the First Lady of France is far more beautiful than Candace. In fact, it's not even close.

Or bankrupt Alex Jones, who says some of the dumbest things and lost his entire fortune, as he should have, for his horrendous attack on the families of the Sandy Hook shooting victims, ridiculously claiming it was a hoax. These so-called pundits are losers.

And they always will be. Now fake news CNN, the flailing New York Times, and all of the other radical left news organizations are hailing them and giving them positive press for the first time in their lives. They're not MAGA, they're losers. They're just trying to latch on to MAGA. As president, I could get them on my side anytime I want to, but when they call, I don't return their calls because I'm too busy on world and country affairs.

And after a few times, they go nasty, just like Marjorie Trader Brown. But I no longer care about this stuff. I only care about what's doing right for our country. MAGA is about winning and strength. in not allowing Iran to have a nuclear weapon. MAGA is about making America great again, and these people have no idea how to do that, but I do, because the United States is now the hottest country anywhere in the world. President Donald J. Trump. Okay.

A few things here. First, I want our listeners to know there's no editing. John did that in one take flawlessly. Yeah, I did. I didn't practice at all, no. It was a very impressive. Also just a couple swerves in there. The uh debunking of Sandy Hustle. The when you read it, it's all kinda it it begins, you kinda you kinda know where it's going. Right. Yeah they're losers, they're not on T V, which to Trump is the uh pinnacle of success is cable television.

Then we swerve into a v vigorous defense of Brigitte Macron, including a testament to her beauty. Yeah, so he is in the no penis camp. Yes. Then he debunks uh Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, which was nice. And then we're back down the rabbit hole. Then and also, you know why he doesn't return their calls. Because he's too busy on world and country affairs. Yes. Which is evident. He definitely does not care. Nothing about that that suggests caring.

He is not mad online. Make sure everyone knows he is not mad online. I no longer care about that stuff. And that's why that's why he doesn't usually talk about it. And that's why he can barely speak about it. Just fire it off a op-ed length post about this. Um In addition to um uh those people getting under his skin, uh there's also a great New York Times story about the most MAGA of MAGA fans on of all places, Truth Social.

Which is where that lovely speech I just read uh was first posted. And apparently um there's all these people on Truth Social which is gotta be all the people on True Social,'cause I don't think there's that many people on there in the first place. But they're all posting that they're ashamed to have voted for Trump, that he's gone off the deep end, et cetera, et cetera. I think like

50% of the the replies to his Easter Sunday, I'm gonna kill you all post, whatever the fuck it was, um were negative. Only like twenty percent were supporter of something like that. The New York Times analyzed like 40,000 truths. I'm I'm just I'm hoping they used AI on that. Um what do you think about all this? Do you think uh you think it'll start showing up in polls of Republican voters?'Cause it hasn't already. It is showing up in polls Republican voters. It's happening on the market.

Or so. Sorry. Yeah. Yeah. I mean Trump's approval rating among Republicans you know, about around the same last year was low nineties, high eighties, which is kind of where he's always been. Now it's low eighties, high seventies, depending on what you look at it, it's in the seventies in the PR PRI pole, similar in the uh pupil. What is notable is it's mostly from non MAGA Republicans, right? His approval is true most significantly among them. That's very Iran war.

Related, he's getting eighty some percent of MAGA Republicans and some polls as high as a hundred percent, according to his fake Harry Anton poll. Um, among self-infied MAGA Republicans, it's the runboard is basically almost even. I think it's like plus eight with non-MAGA Republicans. And I think we tend to think of non MAGA Republicans as like people just to the right of the bulwark. And that's not actually the case. It could be people who

are you know, have pretty conservative views on some issues who supported Trump this time but didn't support him previously, who got in the process because of him. They're just not they're just like probably less engaged Republicans, but they're pretty conservative. Um I mean I bet Marjorie Taylor Green would consider herself a non MAGA Republican at this point. 'Cause MAGA doesn't MAGA does not we've talked before, does not mean you're an adherent to a specific philosophy.

It means you're a diehard supporter of Trump. And so people who are non-die-hard supporters of Trump can span the ideological spectrum within the Republic. Um we do have a another another post from Trump. Iran is doing a very poor job, dishonorable, some would say, of allowing oil to go through the Strait of Hormuz. That is not the agreement we have President DJ T. Okay. So we're doing we're doing this in real time. Things are going great, it seems like.

Um we talked about the toll one and now he just it's like he's learn yeah, he's just learning about things in real time. And I guess he I guess it probably took him a while to draft uh the the post about Tucker and Meghan Kelly, so maybe he hasn't been paying much attention to the news.

Yeah, I mean so th that's exactly right. You know this as a former speechwriter, is that you would go into your office and you just start writing. You sometimes you got you gotta turn the Wi Fi off on your computer so that you can draft, you got you can't be checking social media. And so if he finishes that. But he did say he's been very busy with world and country affairs. Yes, he came out of the World and Country Affairs meeting. Thank you.

Check the internet and like holy shit. The the straight is still closed. It's like a course you take in college. Yeah. There is another thing about the Tucker Carlson, Megan Kelly, all these folks breaking a trump is One, it's a real problem for him politically for a couple of reasons. One, like that has been his strength is he has had unanimous Republican support among elected officials.

and MAGA media. And now that we have these high profile people breaking from Trump, that just that is that is bad for him. It's like it's lost his superpower. And the also the other way to think about this is I think people tend to think that these are quote unquote MAGA shows and the people who watch it are MAGA Trump Republicans. And obviously the majority of them voted for Trump and like Trump, but they are not

fully MAGA. This is not Fox this is not the Fox News audience, right? The Fox News audience are hardcore Republican supporters of Trump, mostly over the age of seventy. The people who consume Megan Kelly, Candace Owens, Tucker Carlson tend to be younger. They tend to necessarily engage less in politics and what m and but it's not also just not the audience of those sh shows every day, people tuning in who m that matters. It's that these clips are going viral everywhere.

And so people who do not who may have voted for Trump but do not engage in politics, they're seeing critique from in part, you know, like in group. allies of Trump. And that is very, very damaging. These are people these are trusted voices among a certain set of voters. And now they are saying the same thing about Trump that they are hearing on Pod Save America. And that is the worst possible place for Donald Trump to be.

And Trump aside, because and you know, we'll talk about the midterms in a second, but like um this is also going to depri like people who are cross pressured, who might like a lot of things that Trump has done don't like Iran or are hearing all this criticism about him on Iran. Um, like are are these people gonna m make sure they go out in the midterms and vote for Republicans?

Are these people gonna like sign up to join JD Vance's campaign when he announces in twenty twenty eight? Like it is doing damage far beyond Trump, um, what is happening right now.

Yeah. Um so a common thread um with the Alex Jones, Tucker Carlson uh line of critique is uh some conservatives specifically calling for invoking the twenty fifth amendment, um with if you recall from earlier seasons of the Trump show, or the spin off series, Sleepy Joe, involves the uh Involves involves the vice president and the cabinet deeming the president unfit to serve and removing him from office.

Uh a lot of Democrats have also called for invoking the twenty fifth amendment and or impeaching Trump. I think as of Wednesday, we're at around seventy Dems in the House and a handful of senators. Um you had a whole message box about why this Isn't exactly a simple process? Or even a feasible one. Go ahead.

I I love an organic message box plug, so thank you for that. Um This one got me very exercised because like we've s have all sort of come to the conclusion that Trump deserves impeachment and removal, but that is not a realistic way to get rid of him. If the Senate was not gonna remove Trump after he sent a mob of his supporters to murder them, it's hard to fathom the scenario in w in which they will.

So now people have started calling for the twenty fifth Amendment because the behavior that Trump has exhibited really every day, but particularly in the last few weeks here, particularly in these truths starting on Easter, is that of someone who really shouldn't is not mentally fit to be in office. And so Democrats are calling for it, members of Congress are calling for it. It's seeing a lot of this online.

And here's the problem with this, is the 25th Amendment is actually more challenging to execute than impeachment removal, by a large degree. So first it begins, as you point out, with the vice president, a majority of a cabinet that includes Pete Hegseth, RFK Jr., Trump's personal defense attorney right now, Steve Whitkoff is apparently member of the cabinet. A majority of them have to send a letter to Congress saying that Trump is unfit. If they do that, JD Vance becomes the acting president.

What happens then is Trump gets a chance to tell Congress he's Fit, which he would obviously do. Then Congress has 21 days to reconvene, and then you need two-thirds of the House and two-thirds of the Senate to vote to keep J.D. Vance as acting president.

So it's like, how is that going to happen? That is not going to happen. You can't not let alone just getting a members of Trump's cabinet of flunkies to say he's unfit, and then getting two-thirds of the House and the Senate, which is a higher bar than impeachment. And here's my problem with this strategy, is it puts the onus on the wrong track.

The people who are responsible for Trump being able to act this way, do execute this war, act without any sort of accountability are Republicans in Congress. The cabinet is never does not have to have face the voters in November. Republicans of Congress do.

And so our focus should be putting the blame for where we are on the people that we can vote out. Because the best way to reign Trump in is not to appeal to J.D. Vance in the Republic in the Republican cabinet, it's to elect a Democratic Congress. And I think this distracts. End of rant. I couldn't agree more. Are we gonna get J D Vance? Is that but first of all, the idea that Republicans kind of come this far?

And now they're gonna impeach Donald Trump when they uh when they took a flyer on it after uh uh January sixth. Like it's just none of it's gonna happen. I get that this is a stand in for Um, why aren't Democrats doing more? More Democrats should call for impeachment or twenty fifth amendment. We gotta do something, we gotta do something. It's just not how the system is set up right now.

And um the the best way to uh you know end Trump's presidency uh is to elect a Democratic House and a Democratic Senate and then elect a Democratic president in 2028. That's just the way it is right now. and and on issues where you might be able to get just enough Republicans

to uh have a working majority in Congress, then maybe you can do stuff there. But even then, Donald Trump has veto power. Like Donald Trump has tremendous power as president right now and he has that power mainly because the Republican Congress at least enough people in the Republican Congress, most of them, ninety something percent of them, go along with literally anything he tells them to do.

And and they need to be held accountable for that. That's what the next election is for. Holding Republican politicians accountable for never saying no to Donald Trump about anything. The other my other beef with this is it's like a cheap stunt. It is, you know, you're getting all these text messages. They're like, sign our petition that Trump should be to call on the Twenty Fifth Amendment is a way to get online engagement.

and raise grassroots dollars. And when we treat our voter without telling people the true context of how this works. There is a penalty for treating our voters like idiots. Time and time again. It is and this is one of those examples.

Pushing this, pushing Democrat and look, I'm all for pushing Democrats to do things that they are too afraid to do. A hundred percent. Have we have a long record of doing that. But like pushing Democrats on this and like yelling about Democrats not like that is treating voters like idiots. Some of the pushback you get from people is that you want to make the case that Trump is unfit. If you want to make the case Rumpus unfit, you do it this way.

Donald Trump is unfit for office. I see it, you see it, and the Republicans in Congress see it. The thing is they are afraid to do anything about it. So if you want to rein in Donald Trump, we have to get rid of the people who allow him to act this way. VoteSaveAmerica.com Or even so the so the house some House Democrats today,'cause they're all on recess, first of all

Mm most Democrats, especially all the Democratic leaders, said it's crazy that we're on recess still. Donald Trump is threatening genocide. Um they Congress should come back into session. Republicans have refused to bring Congress back to session. Democrats have no power to do that, but they called for it.

Uh a bunch of them went to the Capitol today, Democrats, and were like, all right, we're gonna try to force another vote on the war powers resolution. Republicans again blocked that. That would be another thing that, you know, Congress could do is to rein him in on the war itself.

And again, Republicans refuse to do that. Again, y like you c w you just you can't make up the numbers right now. Like we just don't have we don't have the majorities right now. If we have majorities and then we're not doing things with the majority, then you should definitely blame Democrats. For sure. And the one th and the one thing we don't have the majority of for sure, Trump's cabinet. Yeah. Hence the problem.

Pot Save America is brought to you by Sundays. We all love the idea of feeding our dogs real fresh food, but the reality is that fresh dog food usually means taking up freezer space. Time to thaw and prep, then a lot of mess when you serve it. Get the good and leave the hassle with Sundays. Sundays was founded by a veterinarian and mom, Dr. Tori Waxman, who got tired of seeing so-called premium dog food full of fillers and synthetics.

So she designed Sundays, air dried real food made in a human grade kitchen using the same ingredients and care you'd use to cook for yourself and your family. Every bite of Sundays is clean and made with real meat, fruit, veggies, and no kibble. That means no weird ingredients you can't pronounce and no fillers. And the best part, you can just scoop and serve no freezer, no thong or prep, no mess, just nutrient rich.

Clean food that fuels their happiest, healthiest days. So you get more of them to share together. You gotta feed your dog good dog food. They feel better. They, they, they're healthier, they'll live, you know, longer because they're good. Leo loves Sundays. Your dog will love Sundays. Make the switch to Sundays. Go right now to Sundays for Dogs.

dot com slash crooked fifty and get fifty percent off your first order. Or you can use code Cricket Fifty at checkout. That's fifty percent off your first order at Sundaysfor Dogs dot com slash crooked fifty, Sundays for dogs dot com slash crooked fifty or use code Cricket fifty at Alright, here's some good news. Uh it seems like Republicans who will be on the ballot this November are starting to become, as the White House likes to say, panickins.

I guess it's their version of bedwetters. I don't know. They're both kind of stupid, but it's fine. Uh on Wednesday, Politico published a story with the headline We lose the midterms. Republicans worry Iran might have already cost them Congress. Woo. The title of which quotes a source described as quote close to the White House.

Uh it's not just the polling freaking them out. Earlier this week, Democrats notched another pair of huge overperformances in two big elections. Uh the Wisconsin Supreme Court will now have a five two Liberal majority after Chris Taylor Her conservative opponent by twenty points.

which was a an over twenty point swing from Kamala Harris's twenty twenty four performance in the state. Um, a ten point overperformance from the last time in twenty twenty five that uh the Liberal candidate won a a Wisconsin Supreme Court election. And down in Georgia, even though the Republican candidate did win the special election to replace Marjorie Taylor Green, uh Democrat Sean Harris beat Kamell Harris's performance in that district by 25 points.

The largest overperformance in any special election by a Democrat since Doug Jones won the Alabama Senate seat way back a thousand years ago in twenty seventeen. Um, what was your reaction to the elections this week? Great. Right. All good. No, it like these are all small sample sizes, but the margins in elections since the war in Iran started. are better than the average sp Democratic over performance both in twenty twenty five and earlier in twenty twenty six.

Yeah. Now we're getting into the twenties. Well we talked you and I talked about this a couple episodes ago, and it was like teens, high teens to low twenties. Now we're in twenties to mid twenties. It was about I think it was twelve and a half points.

uh, through early twenty twenty six. And the last couple have been very impressive. Democrats are very good at winning Supreme Court seats in Wisconsin. I think we've run four in a row now, which is a credit to the Wisconsin Democratic Party and the way they've trained Democratic voters to

understand the value of these. Um, winning the Waukesha mayor's race, first Democratic mayor in fifteen years, incredible. The turnout in Georgia, but we're just seeing it all over the place, which is Democrats are fired up. Republicans are unenthused and swing voters are moving to Democrats. And you're seeing in Wisconsin, in small sample size again, and in Georgia, you're seeing huge swings among Hispanic voters in Hispanic precincts, like massive swings That's all very positive news.

I know. I'm I'm trying not to um get too high on our own supply here, but some of these results are just it it is uh it's the perfect storm of like all the things that could go wrong for Republicans with voters, right? Which is that they in the higher turnout elections

they are losing because voters are switching. People who voted Republican are are voting Democrat. And and then in other elections their the GOP turnout is collapsing. So you have Republican voters either not showing up. They're both not showing up and switching their vote. In in in like deep red places, blue blue places, a all over the place. Differ all different types of districts. The dark linings are the things to watch out or just be aware of is

There are caps on how well Democrats can do because the House map is so gerrymandered. We talked about this before. There are only four Republicans in districts that um Kamala Harris won. I think there was something like nineteen or twenty of them Republicans in districts that uh Hillary Clinton won. And I mean we had seven of them in California alone.

in tw in twenty eighteen. So but the this environment is actually much better for Democrats than twenty eighteen was at this point. Um and like you can s there's a world in which a lot of seats that would not otherwise be in play are in play. I mean The Cook Political Report moved the Iowa governor's race to a toss up today.

I know. Go Rob's hand. Um and again and this is this matters a lot for the House, which we were talking about, but it it it starts to get me thinking about the Senate even more. This is It is really important. Senate is in play with a margin like this. It's a n like

If it really is like twelve thirteen, you really have to nail it exactly because Trump won a lot of these s states that we need by eleven, twelve, nearly thirteen points. But we're we're in the game right now, and that's something that seemed impossible six months ago.

Uh not to get ahead of ourselves, but it does seem like the twenty twenty eight Democratic primary has already begun. A bunch of potential candidates showed up to speak at Al Sharpton's National Action Network event in New York City this week. Uh and down in New Orleans, the DNC's spring meeting kicked off on Thursday, where one of the first headlines was about how a nonbinding resolution criticizing APAC's influence was voted down.

While two other relevant uh resolutions were kicked to the something called the Middle East Working Group. Uh, DNC Chair Ken Martin explained that the APAC resolution was merely shelved in favor of a quote blanket repudiation, quote, condemning the corrosive influence of all dark money. in democratic primaries. Um which so then the idea is that that resolution uh included APAC among other organizations, or other, you know, dark money organizations.

Um, this is all on the heels of new pew polling this week that shows roughly six in ten Americans now have unfavorable views of Israel, including an all-time high of roughly eight in ten Democrats. which is up from sixty nine percent just last year and fifty three percent in twenty twenty two. Uh interesting detail on the uh on the DNC thing. In a political story before the vote.

An anonymous DNC member said that they received direct calls from two quote presidential aspirants who would have to answer for the DNC's positions on Israel and AIPAC if they run. Now, I read a couple times. I'm still curious if those uh presidential candidates wanted the resolution to pass or not pass. Um, but they called about it. Um, what's your guess and how do you think this issue of Israel plays out in the twenty twenty-eight primary? I ass I maybe one on one on the other side.

Of the issue. Oh maybe. I just If you were thinking of running for president in twenty twenty eight. And in April of 2026, you were calling DNC members about a resolution, a non-binding DNC resolution. You are focused on the wrong thing. Not for nothing, but I'd like to hear a compelling argument for why we need non binding DNC resolutions. Uh it seems like it's the same reason for why we uh need questionnaires from interest groups that presidential candidates fill out.

Yeah. Yeah. Well that one at least you are has a purpose from the group's perspective, which is to get The group's perspective. Yes, from the group's perspective, to get candidates to lay out a position on things. Because they're gonna make endorsements and so you wanna you should have to answer some questions if you want to make endorsements.

We we can go long on the v on the role of groups. I know you've a lot of thoughts on it. Um we don't agree on all of them, so it'll be a fun debate one day. But um the Here I don't even know it doesn't serve a purpose for anyone. The DNC or anyone else. So maybe we should just give it a. Look, I do think that when it comes time for the twenty twenty eight Democratic Party platform. We should also get rid of that. I know. I know. But at least there you can say okay. That's a different thing.

Like what is the party stance on Israel, the party stance on any number of controversial issues, and then everyone can fight it out. It is like what is the non binding resolution at the DNC gonna do right now? It's going to give you political stories. Like that is that's its sole purpose is for there to be political stor political stories about it. The other two resolutions, by the way, were um recogn one recognizing a Palestinian state and the other conditioning military aid to Israel.

And I think the Middle East working group is a place where these resolutions are supposed to go down. Yeah. You haven't you haven't heard a lot about the Middle East Middle East working group at the DNC? No, I th I assume that I mean this is it's like a it's not an unclever solution to the problem of just like this is a place to send them well, you're not killing them, you're not enacting them, you're sending them to some other place.

Right. You're you're referring they're just simply being referred. Uh the whole thing is the whole thing is dumb. Yeah, well it's well, also the path to establishing a better democratic party policy on Israel is not through the DNC committee process. That is correct. It is through the candidates who maybe.

Yes, yeah. It's just a bizarre use of time and energy from that candidate. Um, or those two candidates. And look, it's hard you know, you have eight in ten Democratic voters who have an unfavorable view of Israel. You have even fewer who trust Netanyahu. It is you have you know majority huge majorities whose sympathies are with the Palestinians as opposed to over the Israelis in Gallup, Poland.

Just there's been a dramatic shift on this issue among Democrats since twenty twenty two. Just massive. I cannot imagine um the next Democratic nominee um winning the primary. um b with a position that says we should continue um giving the military and other aid to Israel that we give right. No no one would run on that. That wouldn't even be I feel like even conditioning aid at this point is the um like the moderate position. That's typical.

I think I think I I imagine that most of them will get to ending aid to Israel. Offensive aid or I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, I think there there's an argument to be made, right, which is like we we should treat Israel. From a perspective of the taxpayer funding that we are providing, the same way we treat Any other ally. Any other country.

And I mean it's to me it's a question whether um it's a real alliance right now, because I think that the government there is a an authoritarian government, which Yeah, we have one too. Uh but I think that the government there is is is not one that I certainly want to support with my tax dollars.

um as they have w did what they did to Gaza, are still doing to Gaza, or doing what they are to the West Bank, or doing what they are to Lebanon right now. Um and so and it is a wealthy enough nation that they should be able to provide for their own uh defense. And like I don't I don't I I think that to me and look, it these are treated as like fringe lefty positions for some reason still, but you know, over sixty percent of Americans support getting rid of all aid to Israel.

Um, and you just saw the eight eight it's uh eighty percent of Democrats at this point. You go to eighteen to forty nine year old Democrats, it's even higher. eighteen to forty nine year old Republicans, it's like fifty seven, sixty percent. I mean P I I I think that people who really care about Israel and who are much more pro-Israel should really think long and hard about

why it is that they have lost the um the public uh battle over this, uh the public opinion war over this so badly, and why it has has shifted so dramatically over the last couple of years. And the answer is not Because of TikTok.

Right. Yes. And I think if you really care about Israel, then you need to think long and hard about like why this has happened and whether fighting so hard um to continue the US relationship with Israel as it is right now with the aid that we're giving it is really um worth what has happened to public opinion because of it. One thing I'm confident of is that this is going to be a point of great discussion during the Democratic

primary. Be a lot during the debates will be on this issue for sure. It's gonna come up in town halls and interviews. It'll come up in interviews on this podcast and everywhere else. So we're gonna get to know how all the candidates feel about it. I imagine that APAC will, through its super PACs, uh try to influence the process in some way. I'm quite confident that their dis their desire to do so will be counterproductive to their aims and the candidate they support.

And it will backfire, um, as it did in Illinois, um, as we saw recently. Just one other thing that I think is just something people should flag in their head as they're listening to the conversation around this is The way in which the DNC switched from uh not taking APAC contributions to not taking any contributions from dark money groups is a rhetorical device a lot of Democrats are using right now to not answer the APAC question.

Well they'll say, Well, yeah, I'm not gonna take it from anyone, but without getting to the heart of the question about APAC and the role that APAC specifically plays. You could ask that about other special interest groups and you should. AI, right? We have these AI super packs.

who are who are putting their thumb on the scale for some Democrats in primaries. You saw the crypto super PACs come in and try to influence the Illinois Senate primary. So we should uh talk about all of those interest groups, but people who do not want to take a specific don't want to specifically answer the APAC question'cause they feel like it's fraught, will then turn to this well not while we shouldn't have any stark money in politics as opposed to dealing with this specific question.

And what I would say is don't avoid this question because it's fraught. Yeah. Just you know and it's like I if if If you don't know enough about it, learn more about it and decide first, you know, always decide forget about the polls, decide what you believe about this issue, just as you should decide and have a real thoughtful response.

and ideas on, you just mentioned it, artificial intelligence, or any number of controversial issues that will be or non-controversial issues that will be debated in 2028. Figure out what your position is, figure out where you would go, figure out how you would answer these questions.

Um, that's the most important thing from like a w what do you believe moral perspective. Um, but I should just say, and w we went through this in twenty twenty, there are some positions um, that in a primary are argued about and Democratic candidates worry because they're like, Oh well I'm pushed to the left in a primary and I'm taking these little lefty positions, then I gotta worry about what happens in a general and

This th this whole issue about Israel and AIPAC, this is not one of those issues. Because this is not only like like the the views on Israel are very clear within the Democratic Party. It is overwhelming. We are talking 80%. Same with military aid to Israel, same with APAC. And it's also a like sixty percent issue in the general election. So um now, if you genuinely care like just are very pro Israel, then like, you know, don't take the position just because it's

you you you're looking at the polls, like you you know, go and fight the position and say, if you don't agree with me, you don't agree with me, but this is where I am and this is what I believe. But like D don't pretend no one should pretend this is some lefty issue um that people are getting pushed on in the primaries that is gonna then cause them trouble in the general,'cause that's just bullshit.

Um, all right, one last thing before we get to Tommy's conversation with Rahm Emanuel. Um, as we were getting ready for today's show, we looked up at the TV and suddenly Melania Trump was making a statement at the White House. um denying that she had any substantive relationship with Geoffrey Epstein. Let's take a listen. I have never had any knowledge of Epstein abuse of his victims. I was not a participant, was never on Epstein's plane.

and never visited his private island. My email reply to Maxwell cannot be as anything more than casual correspondence. Several individuals and companies have been legally obligated to publicly apologize and retract their lies about me, such as Daily Beast, James Carville, and HarperCollins UK. Not HarperCollins UK. Ha ha ha. You really Yeah. The end was magical. What the f we everyone in the office was like, what the fuck is happening right now? Do you ha do you have any idea?

No one seems to. I have I have maybe we'll get an answer between as an answer has come while we're recording this or one will come between now and tomorrow, but none of the reporters can have any idea why she did it, what the context was. Some a lot of times You know, y there will be rumors going through DC or politics about a pending story. That's what I've been I've been looking everywhere. Everywhere. Yeah.

Everyone knows it's coming. Even if it hasn't been printed, it has it but everyone apopted knows it's coming. And then you will see politicians do things and they make sense if you know that story is coming. This is not one of those times. It doesn't seem like anyone knows what she is talking about, or why she picked today to offer this out of context statement of protesting way too much about her relationship with Epstein.

Also, apparently Trump told CNN he knew that she'd be making a statement, and then J Jackie Almaney from MS Now called him. and he told her he um he had no idea she'd be making the statement, and that's also what Jackie Heinrich from Fox heard as well, um, that he he had no idea. So like there's conflicting reports of whether Trump did. I did notice in Um in one of the playbooks, either in the morning or PM, at the bottom there was a New York Post story before the announcement.

Where an associate of Melania Trump said she'd be making a quote big announcement today that would quote spread internationally. Wow. Congrats. For people who don't know, the email she was referencing um was in the Epstein Files. It was to Glenn Maxwell. She said Dear G

How are you? Nice story about JE in New York Mag. You look great on the picture. You look great on the picture. Those are her words. I know you were very busy flying all over the world. How was Palm Beach? I cannot wait to go down. Give me a call when you're back in New York. Have a great time. Love Melania.

That was from October of two thousand and two. The New York magazine uh piece about Jeffrey Epstein she was referencing was the piece where her husband is quoted as saying he likes the girls really young. So that's cool. Um I don't know man. I don't know. Is that your advice you would have given Melania Trump as a White House communications director, to randomly go out to the cameras on a Thursday afternoon in the middle of a

uh a war in Iran to just say, hey, I don't know what you're talking about. I don't know Jeffrey Epstein. Bye. Yeah. Yes, I think that's the exact right thing to do to go out there and deny No questions. I will take no questions about this. I do not know Jeffrey Epstein. Yeah, while I am while I have your time, I just wanted to briefly deny involvement in any illegality that you did not ask me about. Okay, bye.

And and and if you think that you can connect me to Jeffrey Epstein, just ask James Carville or Harper Collins how that went for them. Collins Herbert Collins UK. I will see you at the next premiere of Melania. Yeah. Amazing. She is a weird one. Okay. When we come back from the break, you will hear Tommy's conversation with the former mayor, ambassador, and White House Chief of Staff, Rama Manuel.

Pod Save America is brought to you by Bombas. The springtime thaw is finally here. Flowers are blooming, days are longer, and we're saying yes to more plans and finally getting outside. Running, walking, just moving again. It's the perfect time to upgrade your everyday go-tos with Bombas.

Bombas sport socks are super comfortable and designed with sport specific tech for running, cycling, yoga, hiking, you name it. Bombas are cushioned where you need it, sweat wicking, and they don't slide around so you're not constantly adjusting your socks.

And with the weather warming up, it's time to add Bomba's sandals into your footwear rotation. Their Friday slides are made with a super lightweight and waterproof EVA that's soft but still supportive. They're super comfortable and perfect to just slip on and go whether you're running errands, lounging outdoors, or just want something comfy and casual to wear. John Lovett over here wears them to his famed Pilates class.

Yeah, wearing there because I got the grip socks from Bombas, but I also wearing all my gym classes that I'm going to. Love working out these days, really getting into it. Now that the now that the weather is finally getting better in springtime thaws here. Didn't write the Zad copy for us, that's for sure. Tens of thousands of people aren't leaving LA County'cause of the weather, okay? They're leaving it'cause of bad governance. Ha ha. Okay. So let's get that right.

Right, and buzzkill over here. I'm just saying. Always comes back to zoning. The point does, it does come back to it does come back to zoning. But you know what? That doesn't stop me from having a great time jogging outside of my Bombas sports socks. I got the vintage uh striped ones. Love them. I wear them all the time. I match them to my shorts, John, because I'm gay. Bombas, get them. I'd like to match things too. All right. Hãy subscribe cho kênh Ghiền Mì Gõ Để không bỏ Okay.

And for every item you're going to be able to do that I'm sorry. An essential clothing item is donated to someone facing housing insecurity. One purchase, one donated with over one hundred and fifty million donations and counting. Head over to bombus.com slash crooked and use code crooked. For 20% off your first purchase, that's B-O-M-B-A-S dot com slash crooked, code crooked at checkout.

My guest today is a former member of Congress, White House Chief of Staff, Mayor Chicago, Ambassador. Sure seems like he's running for president in twenty twenty eight. Rama Manuel. Great to see you guys. Nice to see you, Tommy. Welcome to Los Angeles. You have a more of a casual LA chic, I see. Yeah. Yeah, like a glow. Just rip it up. Coffee Brothers. I'm about to offer Going to Harry's closet. Too bad he's too big.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I we all saw the um shirtless photos of him and Elon Musk. He's been working on it Uh or the meds are working. Either way, or both. H G H it's a hell of a drug. All right. We're joking because we're breathing a sigh of relief this week because our president decided not to go through with his threat.

uh to destroy the entire Iranian civilization. So that's nice. That's what counts as a win in the Trump two point oh era. Um, but the debate over why the war started is raging. Have you had a chance to read Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swann's long piece in the New York Times? Okay. So they report that on February eleventh, Prime Minister Netanyahu met with Trump in the situation room. The head of the Massad zooms in. They make this pitch. Yeah.

who I'm sure you know. Um, and they give this presentation about the case for war. It includes a bunch of assumptions about how easy it'll be that are now catastrophically wrong. Um we're probably you could tell they were at the time, but now we know they were. Um W Can you remember a foreign leader meeting with the president in the sit room during your time? Is that weird?

Yeah. I think well two things I wanna one thing about last week, you're I wanna go back to because I was thinking about this more. You have the president of the United States, the president of the United States. This is not a speech in which you do the arsenal democracy. We're going to destroy civilization, the Persian civilization.

At the same time the vice president is in Budapest saying we're gonna save the Christian civilization and then you have a Secretary of Defense who's calling this a Christian crusade. What could go wrong when you have those kind of brain power working all the same? Now I feel better. I got that off my chest. The president tweeted uh you know. We're saving. Or whatever, right? Or just Which is everybody.

uh cry of a terrorist. Uh so we're both destroying and saving two di one civilization and the other. So nobody I'm thinking of both my Clinton time Six years. an Obama time. I do not remember a single not only a single foreign leader in the situation room, anybody themselves or their staffs ever even given access to that room. So or in any one of those rooms or etcetera. So I don't ever remember that happening and I don't think it would ever happen. So

That what happens in that room is also weird. Not only that they're in that room, but what happens in that room. So obviously Trump decides to go to war. He and he alone is responsible for his decision. Yeah. But there is this debate and a ton of reporting now about the pressure campaign by Netanyahu and sort of lobbying Trump to Go to war with Iran. Um What is it?

the appropriate way to talk about that in view, um, because I'm sure you've seen the folks I've seen who argue that it can veer into a conversation that is anti Semitic, that leans into tropes about Israel controlling the United States or foreign policy. What's the right way to talk about it? It's gonna lead into that and also given what the Secretary of State said six weeks ago, it's only gonna kinda layer that. I think Depending on how conversations go in Islamabad

You're gonna go from that conversation to I think this president may scapegoat that now. Now you and I both worked uh for uh uh President Obama, but I wanna say this is The Prime Minister has been shopping this. to four, possibly five. I can't remember Clinton, but Bush, President Ob President Bush, rather, 43, President Obama, President Trump forty uh you know, the first term, President uh Biden. Everybody rejected.

And because when you looked at it, the equities versus the liabilities just didn't pan out. Right. So I don't give the President of the United States, who has agency here, any pass. But this will go into a very bad place.

in a very d uh I think in the sense of the Prime Minister uh not made an argument to the President. I don't absolve the President and anybody on his team. But I also read the story the flip side of this, Tommy, which is also Nobody in the uh President's administration They're all they don't have their hands on the bloody way.

Yeah, they opposed it. Uh you know, this is all crap, you know, other words that they use to describe their position. So everybody's trying to make sure that they were not seen at the scene of the crime. Mm-hmm. And I'm sorry, so I don't absolve any of them. Uh the prime minister

said what he said to the president, but this argument is going to given the context also in America and given the context of anti Israel or anti Semitism, it's gonna lead to a very bad bad place. And I do think though, and I will say this, I I mean President Obama was presented a similar plan. That's how the Olympic uh games, I think that was the term that was used for the cyber attacks on uh Iran's capacity. Nobody took kinetic.

the decision to go into the deep end on the kinetic effort. This president did, and it's on him. Yeah. He did no no path. Self-evident based on all this reporting, based on what Netanyahu himself says when he's back in Israel, where, you know, he's been there there was a tape release in two thousand one where he was kind of bragging about his ability to manipulate leaders in Washington or move them, I think was the term he used. Right, let's just like lobby them, do politics.

Well look, I mean let's go back. He runs for re election with the message Oh I um I think I'm getting the exact word but I'm getting the sentiment right, which is uh uh a leader at a different class. That was the message and it had pictures of him with Putin and pictures of him with Trump. So that was actually what he campaigned on publicly. So you don't have to kinda

We don't have to be archaeologists or, you know, anthropologists here. That's what he campaigned on, that he could play at a level that nobody else played. So it's in his own words. Look but again I you know, only the President of the United States can order American servicemen and women. Only a President of the United States can order resources that that are pulled out of the Indo Pacific, pulled out of different theaters.

To that theater, pulled THAD weapons out of South Korea, pulled Patriots that were supposed to go to Ukraine. Only the commander-in-chief can do that. And so The Prime Minister made his case. Doesn't mean you have to buy it. Yeah.

Exactly. Um, Tucker Carlson, speaking of things only the president can do. Tucker Carlson is very worried about Trump using a nuclear weapon in Iran. Has that fear occurred to you? And and if yes, can you talk a little bit about the process and how that actually works and how feeling? I don't know. I don't believe Look, I mean it's a theoretical discussion um or hypothetical rather. I don't think the President of the United States

um uh would do that. And while I have zero confidence in the people around him, and I mean that from the cabinet to the White House. I actually think they would hit the pause button. Even they would find some nerve of character to step up and say what they didn't do here. Uh meaning here being the uh lead into the uh Iran war, they would know that this that this would have to be stopped in some way.

The pause button would mean convincing him though, right? I mean there's no like you can't take the nuclear button and throw it into the ocean so we can't press it, right? No technical way. There is no way look, head of the joint chiefs, there's the rest of the military. I think there would be a ma I I'm just betting on human character there'd be a massive pushback on this. I don't know what got Tucker Carlson, uh he's not like a horse whisperer or the great whisper to Donald Trump to say that.

But this would be uh well l I don't mean this cavalier, so I wanna be very clear. You can definitely take the Nobel Peace Prize off the table. That's not happening. So I don't mean to I'm I said that as you this I don't believe that would happen. I'm I I just think there's a s lot of other things that I think uh that are worth spending intellectual uh energy on to and analyze what are the repercussions, things that they never do. Even an impulsive person like this would not do that.

Let's hope so. Um J D Vance, the vice president, is now going to Pakistan to lead these talks on Saturday. He'll be joined by Steve Witkoff, uh, and Jared Kushner. Oh I'm so comforted. Well Trump's son in law and his his golf buddies. Isn't this just a real estate deal? Isn't this just real estate?

Yeah. So look I I'm not a big fan of um Dummen Dummer, Kushner and Witkoff. I think they're just like it's a very technical negotiation, right? The J C POA negotiation took eighteen months. That's how long it took to cut a nuclear deal. The wish list on the Iranian side that they're demanding from the US is far more vast than that. It's like get all your troops out of the Middle East, things of that nature. Does Vance getting involved?

Give you any more confidence or hope that they can get some deal or maybe another ceasefire? I was this is reading Tea Leaves. Only in the sense that the Iranians think He is uh was negative about the war. If they believe that they may have an um slightly better confidence to deal with hi uh him.

Obviously any credibility and I uh and I believe zero for Wickoff and Kushner. The idea that you had no experts that it's very clear from the UK who was in the room in Geneva, they didn't even know what they were being offered pre the war from the Iranians. zero confidence. So I have some sense that maybe Vance will have a different level of respect. It gives you somebody new they can interlock. But remember they've been burnt twice.

Once in June, this time in negotiations. So they're gonna come in it with appropriately heavy, heavy cynicism. Let me say one other thing which is and take this slightly different in a sense of advance. One, you can't unring this bell, but you can say, Okay, how do you kind of make l lemonade out of this lemon that we've crew that we have created? That's A. B as I

The Iranians went in we went into this war trying to degrade Iran's nuclear capacity. They discovered they had the nuclear option, the Strait of Hermuz. The other thing C Iran since seventy nine has wanted to get the United States out of the uh Gulf and they become the Persian Empire again. That is their test. So how do you kinda undo this not in some way?

My one view is on this on the short term, on the Strait of Hermuz, either all ships are out or no ships are out. And you're going to cut off Iranian's money and China's energy. Everybody's out or nobody's out. And it's easier to close something, as the Iranians have proven, than for us to try to open it. So reverse the score. Second medium term. The Iranians want uh a fee. I think we go to the intern the UN's international maritime entity.

They run it. There is a fee charge, but it goes to Iran, Bahrain, Oman, Kuwait, everybody who got suffered in this process, not just Iran. And that m the dollars or the resources are split that way among all the countries and it's managed by the United Nations Maritime Association. Third long term Use the Abraham Courts beyond what it is as a peace agreement that we're a party to. It now finances.

I would it finances a pipeline for Kuwait, for the UAE, for Bahrain, etc. either to the Um Gulf of Oman or to the Red Sea. So there's alternatives to the Strait of Harmon. I would in addition say to anybody who's part of the Abraham Accords has zero tariff? And I would also say anybody in the the Abraham Accords gets uh front of the line on US military equipment. It would double down on America being a trusted ally to our Gulf partner.

But that to me, short term, medium term, and long term, is the best way to navigate what is a Big giant lemon. Yeah. It's a it's a nightmare. Well let me offer you what I think might be some pushback to the plan. Sure. I'm I'm open to anything. That's just my idea. Yeah. Maybe this is more sophisticated than the situation. In the hex eth conversation. And the first meeting between the Prime Minister and the President, much more sophisticated and thoroughly.

Crushed the beer can on his head or something. Um if we jointly close the Strait of Hamooz with the Iranians, wouldn't that make a sort of a party to all the, you know, potential famine that could happen if no fertilizer is There's no doubt about it, but here's the other thing. You're trying to f they are their economy is devastated. The only lifeline they have are uh international uh the IV they have rather.

is the what they're selling to China. Right. We do know now, you and I sitting here today, China was a party to pushing Iran to say yes. Right. There are elements that that then ruled, okay, we're gonna do that for the ceasefire. So if you shut off where China's getting their major energy You say it will be I'm not saying this is pretty. No. But we have never, ever, the United States, in 250 years, gone to war and allowed the other country financial security where our allies suffer.

And I say enemies or opponents or whatever term you want to use, both Iran and Russia. This is insane. Yeah. And so you're literally keeping whatever prop you have Tyr. And China, people that are trying to hurt you, you're actually giving them economic b benefit. So to me, yes, it would be chop. There's no there's no perfect here. Right. But we're gonna shut it. We're not gonna shut it with you. We're gonna shut you down. You shut everybody else down, we're shutting you down. Yeah.

At least that levels of playing field. We're looking for leverage here. Right. No. And I think that's why Tucker's where did we get to a nuclear option? Because there's no a conventional military way to open the Strait of Hormuz from the air. You can't bomb it open if they're laying mines or just firing off one missile. I mean the other thing look going forward when you look at like Trump's Goals here. Like first of all, the highly enriched uranium is still sitting in Iran.

doesn't sound like we're gonna get it back or get it out unless there's some deal cut. Two, um, the big concern, right? They clearly degraded Iran's military. They bombed the shit out of a lot of stuff. Um, the other c consideration was cutting off their support for proxy groups like Hezbollah, Hamas, et cetera. My concern is um if they are now able to charge this toll at the Strait of Hormuz, that is gonna be a massive That cannot be that cannot stand.

Back to rebuilding their military, funding Hezbollah, funding all these proxy groups, right? I mean, it seems like, again, this is Trump's problem he created. It just seems like. pressure that implied that Iran could do this on the Strait of it, but it's never was tested. It's now been tested and they discovered, look,

I got an eight hundred on my SATs. Okay. They've never before did they n everybody believe this. It was always an international order. The second thing, I mean, I want to go to the class at the Ar uh War College. Ukraine and Iran have no navy and they've controlled the waterways. I want to go to that class. I want to study this. I'm serious about that. I think, you know, you and I have sat there, but we have a doctrine to fight two wars on two fronts simultaneously, capacity to do that.

We're gonna have to change the doctrine to be able to say we're gonna fight two wars, one conventional and one unconventional. And we're not set up that way. Neither our military, our industrial base, or the capacity of the world. Both of these theaters, meaning what's happened in the Iran war and what's happened in uh Ukraine Russia war or Russia's war on Ukraine. ta has taught us an exponential lesson.

that we are not ready for the unconventional asymmetric war. And we better. That's the second war. Now, a March of 2025, a year ago, I wrote a piece for the Post, which is don't ask for Ukraine's mineral. That's for their drone technology. That's where they're experts at. Yeah. Now, not only did we not ask for it, we rejected it when they offered to help. The president doesn't know friend from foe, and we are now stuck where

Our Gulf allies are buying weapons from Ukraine, but we stiff armed them. Yeah. And they have no navy and they've destroyed the Russian navy in the Black Sea. You we can claim which appropriate, we have destroyed the navy of Iran, but they control the Strait of Homer. No navies and then control waterways. Yeah, well that tells you where the future is. Lot of tactical victories and strategic losses there.

said the other day I read this, I can't remember who. America's won every war uh every battle but has lost each war. Sounds about right, since World War Two. Yeah. Sure. Let me shift gears. So you've been crisscrossing the country, uh you did a recent stop in New Hampshire. You're still not ruling out a twenty twenty eight presidential run. Any more definitive answer today? No but I'll whisper it. No. Okay. I went there I I went three places recently, which is uh La Crosse, Wisconsin.

into uh Franklin, uh New Hampshire. And then I've been in Spartanburg, uh the Corridor of Shame in Abbeville, Piedmont area, uh the black uh counties, and then Columbia and then Charleston. And uh that was all about looking at community colleges and what uh both all three cities are doing, which I think incredibly innovative, things that we also did in Chicago between community colleges.

You know, leading into the future economy, but also linking up with high schools, something that I think is the fundamental thing we have to flip the switch on. Yeah. And the top issues I assume are whether Democrats should talk to leftist Twitch streamers is kind of like up here and then it's like the economy and then education. I I understand that. I'm gonna I just I would say I did on Town Hall in La Crosse, Wisconsin and a podcast there.

Ten teachers, educators, parents, ten kids. Up in Franklin, New Hampshire. I did a in Manchester, the eggs in politics thing. I did a at Wafford College. Uh, Craig Martin interviewed me there in front of uh the college. We went to a community college. I did 400 people in Charleston. Nobody asked me about.

No. Nobody. Nobody. They asked me about how do they get ahead. Yeah. They asked me how they get an education. Now, you know I'm uh the ticket to the middle class and getting ahead is through education. And you can't you know, we live in a period where you earn what you learn. Nobody's asked me that question. And I've had took close to about fifty questions from people.

Yeah it's from you know the billionth reminder that the conversation in D C in the media sometimes doesn't match what the country actually comes. Sometimes? Yeah, often. I would say close to ninety percent does not match. It's a parallel universe. Yeah. It is it yes. Uh so you did a a recent appearance on The View. You said D C needs a power washing because of all the corruption.

Uh you also wrote an all uh Wall Street Journal column uh talking about how Democrats could use a majority and you said the Democrats should steer clear of the gotcha politics and excessive focus on Trumpian slime. Is there a tension between those two? No, so I appreciate this. Um maybe this is on me for not writing clear. I think I wrote in that piece, not I think, I know. There's a difference between corruption

And him being uh untruthful or a liar. I go one hundred percent. I've said this as soon as I came back from uh Japan, twenty twenty four, December, I said, go after the corruption. I built uh when I was chair of the G Triple C, the house that Tom DeLay built. The corruption.

What's going on with the production markets? What's going on with Wickoff's kids, Lutnik's kids, them and people and the president's kids? A hundred percent. When what Gnome's done at the DHS and the contracts they provided, a hundred percent.

There is a difference between that corruption which matters to your wallet And our playing to type which is a retribution vindictive politics that then they say, uh, Washington and they and they break the sound and they turn it on mute right when we should be turning to our agenda. There is a two sided here. Hit him on the corruption and offer a proactive agenda. I actually think, given where I've been, not only the s states I just talked to you about.

But other states, Washington does need a good power washing. Absolutely. Not just trading stocks in Congress. W did you ever think you would ever see uh investor day in the Oval Office? Or yeah, or bets on you know invasions of a country. Or did you ever think a member of the court, not just Supreme Court, be taking gifts from people who have cases in front of them or trips? Okay. So the whole place needs to be clean. What does that reform agenda look like? What like what are we

I I'll give you my things. One, I would raise the minimum wage. So that's number one. Two Well, over September 2025, wrote uh August, I wrote, and I believe there should be a ratepayer bill of rights. Three, I would do X on healthcare cost control, specifically around the insurance companies gouging people, breaking them up. four, I would do a a ban on social media for kids under sixteen. I've called for this before first on uh prediction markets. No federal employee or their family.

Can participate. Yeah. I mean like reforming for Washington. So like stuff like that. Banning Calci, banning stock trading. Betting all that, but uh also stocks, companies that you've been in, if you have net X of let's say your net value is north of just I'm putting the number out, million dollars, has to go into a blind trust. That's true for all federal employees.

Second, not just the Supreme Court, but any court, you're not allowed to take gifts and be very specific on the ethics package that Roberts thinks he has but doesn't enforce. Make it codify it. And that's also true for the President of the United States and family members and the cabinet. Now the other thing I said for, and when you hit the age of seventy-five, get pre-TSA because you're out of here. Done. Finish. Basta. You're not hitting your prime at 78.

I like that a lot. Um I'm gonna try to annoy you now. So you bought and sold. You bought and sold some individual stocks when you were ambassador to Japan. I know the American Prospect wrote a piece criticizing the timing of one of those purchases because it came before a government announcement that they said could benefit the stock. Was that a mistake? Is there other things you would do differently?

If I did, uh it is it's t definitely a mistake. I don't know what that is, but uh definitely you know, I look I did a blind trust when I was chief of staff, when I was mayor, when I was congressman. Also did it there when I as ambassador. So if anybody did it, I have no idea. Blind trust. Why doesn't everyone just do a blind trust? I get elected to I get elected to Congress.

And I'm gonna set up, I'm gonna get on financial services. I said, I'm gonna set up a blind trust. Chairman Oxley comes to see me and says, I don't want you to do this. I said, Well, I'm doing it because

I'm a bare knuckle politician. I something's gonna happen one day on a hearing that we're gonna do in financial service. I don't know what they're gonna do. So forget about it. And I did it for then. I did it uh also normalizing and tell you, did it when I was chief of staff, and I did it when I was mayor, a hundred percent. It seems like a no brainer. I don't know why it's not law. I mean I I Thank you. Listen, they've been arguing in two thousand and seven

I was a sponsor of a legislation as related to exactly this, which is stocks traded in uh in front of committees uh in front of your committee. Uh you can't have be involved or investor or trade stocks in committees uh rather interests that have any any company that has interests in front of the committee. It's insane. Yeah. But it's all of Washington. That also includes the executive branch.

Yeah, and I think this is an issue that kind of drives people crazy because like it's a it's a no-brainer. Of course, members of Congress or the president's family or cabinet shouldn't be buying and selling individual stocks. Everyone should put their stuff in the blind trust. But it's in like the president of the United States will go before uh the State of the Union and and say that and say we're gonna pass legislation banning it.

Of course. I guess what I'm getting at is he says that, but then people are also well aware that, you know, Nancy Pelosi's husband has made a shitload of money trading individual stocks. And there's a lot of people that track that index and feel like, you know That's why I've said the whole Washington. You can't look, there's no individual or no one of the three branches of government that you're going to get without a blemish. The only way to do it? Everybody.

I'm for that. Um I'm just gonna ask you a couple more issues that I think progressives will push you on if you do decide to run for president in twenty twenty eight. It's no different than me pushing myself. Good. So uh you were mayor of Chicago uh when a young man named Laquan McDonald was shot sixteen times by a police officer. your administration uh had a video of that uh uh of his killing for over a year until a court ordered it released. Uh didn't release it until the court order.

What do you say to people who are angry, not just about, you know, the Chicago PD killing this kid, but also what they feel like was a cover up to evade accountability? There's not a day or a week that goes by that I don't think about this. What I could have done different. I'm a why. A young man lost his life innocently. Yeah. Is I thought I had a year earlier, two years earlier, fixed the system. And I acknowledge when I said it to this whole city spoke.

I thought I'd fix something and the problems were much deeper than I appreciated. Might have wanted to think I thought I fixed it when the gulf between the community and the police department and the culture in the police department was much deeper. And I said that's on me. I have to fix this. I own that. Now you know this. Chicago's not alone. No city's alone given what's happened on police departments across the country. And I did go about fixing it.

But as the inspector general said, I've actually the problem is I followed the rules. Because what the last thing you want is a mayor involved in making a political decision when the FBI the what's IPRA, which is the police department's uh independent body, everybody's investigating. You don't want the mayor involving themselves. Then you say you cri you're politicizing a criminal investigation.

The FBI was involved, the U.S. attorneys was involved, the states attorney there were four entities investigating. So if you don't involve yourself, You're part of covering up. If you do involve, you politicize an investigation in danger the prosecution. In Chicago, the police officer actually was prosecuted and convicted. That doesn't change anything. That's on me. I own it. As you know one thing, the difference between a legislator and somebody who's a mayor?

It's lessons learned going forward. And so you have to make ch you have to make changes. I did it. And in this process, Tommy His uncle, who's a pastor on the West Side, Laquan's, he and I have become really good at solidaries' not a week that goes by that we don't talk or communicate in one way. But did I screw up? Yeah. If you're looking for perfection, I'm not that guy. Do it. If you're looking for a person that knows how to learn from mistakes, a hundred percent.

Um you know another sort of big fight within the party has been generational. I mean you said a minute ago you I think wanna get your P TSA precheck'cause you're getting out of here at seventy-eight, right? Um seventy five. Seventy five, sorry. So I love that. I think we need a new generation to leave. I think when I first said it you t you texted me and said, Great. Yeah. Like fuck yeah, man. Good for you. Um

I don't think that people in DC are internalizing your message, right? I mean, there's this this fight is playing out most clearly in Maine, where it's Chuck Schumer is sort of really thumbing the scale on behalf of uh former gov governor Janet Mills. Um, the grassroots seem to be behind Graham Platiner. God knows who will win, but you know, this it doesn't seem like Schumer is concerned about the whole conversation we just had about Joe Biden's age. Um

How do we fix that? And what do you say to like, you know, young activists who you might meet in Iowa or New Hampshire or whatever who were like, Well look, you know, the y you worked in the Clinton administration. What is like what does the next generation look like? Right? Are are we paying lip service to this or are we really I I look at it as a couple things. Uh

One is there is a generational piece to that. But as you know, all your strengths are your weaknesses. After Donald Trump, I'm not sure who we can afford as a country on your job training. I say it jokingly, but I'm serious. You gotta be good at uh in the family room?

You better be good in the classroom. You better know the boardroom, the break room, the situation room, and not just the bathroom, which is something we really get experts as a party. Now, I also think also one piece of change with a party that's known as weak. There's nothing as you know. When it came to fighting, the insurance companies get ten million kids healthcare?

One person got that assignment. When it came to making sure we got healthcare for people with pre existing condition, one person had to lead that effort. When it came to making sure we took on the financial industry and the banking industry to do fundamental reform, one person got that call to lead that effort and take on the gun lobby and the NRA. Nobody's ever gotten in the ring with me, didn't walk out without a bloody nose.

Or a broken nose. Asked the Republicans when they saw Nancy Pelosi become the first female speaker. So I make no more and I will say this otherwise. I don't need another title. I got I got twenty yeah. I yeah I'll sell you one for cheap. I'm eBay.

I got t I got twenty thousand kids that got free community college. Yeah. Because I was willing to take on a failed system. I t I got kids that used to have a fifty six percent graduation rate and eighty four percent of them now graduate high school with a degree and college credit and have a mandatory

Letter of acceptance from either college, community college, branch of the armed forces, or vocational school. Ninety-eight percent of our kids in Chicago achieved that. I have took on a bureaucracy where we didn't have kindergarten or pre-K throughout the city. And I made a Republican finally increase the funding to the city of Chicago, which has been every mayor's desire, got something done that hadn't happened before. Do I take on failure?

Damn right, because I'm a lucky guy. I had a grew up in a family that an immigrant family that had love and education. The question is, are you willing to sit there and husband your political capital or spend it and take it on? So nobody who's walked in the arena with me did not walk out without without having a broken nose. More than willing to say that. And if you want Just generational change? I'm not. You want somebody that knows how to take on a fight and win? That's a different batter.

It's a good pitch. Uh last question for you. So I was just getting kinda into this. This is fun. Oh. Things went really well for Democrats in the midterms. You know this. You were leading that effort in the House. I was sitting on my ass in the Senate working for the first time. Barack Obama living. No, I was watching what you're doing. Um So you were the scheduling problem. It's like oh sorry, he's gotta write his book. Yeah. So, yeah.

Democrats keep overperforming in these special elections. The most recent one and the biggest overperformance or biggest swing to Democrats just happened in Georgia, Georgia fourteen, Marjorie Taylor Greene's district. Wisconsin. I'll give you a different view. Okay, well that that what what we took literally racked up uh Bashar al Assad numbers in uh in in Madison in this most recent Supreme Court. I'll tell you why why something different. No, the question is just like

I I I feel better. I feel increasingly bullish. I think the question is how do you close the deal? Is it about Democrats getting out and making an affirmative case and fighting? Or, you know, you see some other people that say, Crouch up, hide under the table until the day after the election. Neither one is neither one is right.

First of all, ninety percent of this race is a referendum on the president and the rubber stamp Republicans. That was true in nineteen ninety-four. It was true in two thousand six about Bush. It was true in two thousand ten about President Obama and the Democrats, and it was true in two thousand eighteen about Donald Trump and the Republicans.

This is a referendum election. And I can tell you having gone all over this country, it's building ahead of steam. This is gonna be level five type hurricane. The side note, why I think Wisconsin won of the last three Supreme Court biggest one was just the other day. Yeah. Second, we've now fourteen for fourteen in statewide elections, haven't lost one.

Third, we picked up the suburban county outside of Milwaukee where the Republicans used to balance against Milwaukee. We picked up the county executive. Third fourth in the third district, which is the southwest corner where lacrosse is, where I went in for uh Rebecca Cook. were the Republican member of Congress there. The Supreme Court candidate, our candidate, took fifty seven percent of the vote there. Donald Trump won that county overwhelmingly. It used to be where Ron Kind was Congressman.

The Wisconsin numbers in a battleground state were not just good on the Supreme Court. You go Two, three layers down, they were unbelievable. Yeah. And I think uh what I would say is keep the focus on the Republicans, keep the focus on the fact that they've been complicit with Donald Trump. I do have argued this before. I would present a six in twenty twenty twenty six.

Not because anybody remembers the six and oh six or the contract with America. You should have it. A it helps you focused in twenty twenty seven what your priorities are. It creates a disciplined dialogue inside the party, what we're gonna stand for. Bec and it will not just help in twenty twenty six. Twenty twenty seven will be the seminal year that we'll decide

for us who we are and what we're defined for in twenty twenty eight. And when we ran health care, children's health care, the renewal, helped negotiate for President Clinton, led the effort in the House with Speaker Pelosi. Force Bush to d uh veto it, 60 Republicans were the Democrats, it sets up Obama in 08. When George Mitchell in nineteen ninety gets Bush 41 to sign a tax increase.

It breaks up the Republican Party. Pat Buchanan challenges a sitting Republican president and it steps up Bill Clinton in 1992. So I believe do the work now, both not only for 2026. But for the discipline of 2027, one of those is going to break through and get to the president's desk. If he signs it, you want it to be something that divides the Republicans from him. If he vetoes it, you want to make sure it also divides the Republicans from him. The goal there then says who we are.

and who they are. Yeah. I I I agree. I think Running against Trump is important and we should continue to do it. I still think we have a massive problem as a party of people not knowing who we are or or not knowing who we stand for and maybe not liking.

Tommy, there's three there's three or four layers here. Not knowing what we who we stand for, not knowing whether we'll fight for who we thinks. The reason I'm going around on these community colleges Forty percent of the people in America go to community colleges that go to higher education. These are the unseen, unheard, unrespected folks.

I know what I did to reform the community colleges of Chicago and what we did to make sure that people that went there can walk in and say, I went to Malcolm X and get that nursing job at Rush Presbyterian Hospital. Or the guy I met in Spartanburg. who's working on mechanical skills and he has a thirty three bucks an hour plus benefits job waiting at GE for him on May eleventh. to me

You can't just say these things that sound great in faculty lounges or papers. You gotta under you actually have to feel the people that are under the intense pressure. not only have an agenda for them, but then willing to take on and break some eggs to get it done. And our party hasn't. Just hasn't. It's not just about

It's not just about social media posts. It's actually about social studies. And we haven't prioritized the right things. We just haven't. And we have to be acknowledged about that. And we got ourselves caught, I've said this before, and I'll say it again, in a cultural cul-de-sac going around in circles. We were off the American people.

When their back's against the wall, they expect Democrats to show up. They don't think Republicans would show up because they know they're in the boardroom cut cutting up the pie. They expect us to show up and we did not show up for them. We deserve this spanking. And we got one. Yeah. Uh Rob Emmanuel, great to see you again. Thanks for coming. Yeah, we solved all the world problems. Yeah, we got it. We're good. Hormoth wide open. All right.

That's our show for today. Thanks to Ram for stopping by. And I'll be back in the feed on Sunday with a conversation with none other than Hassan Piker. That's right. Ram Emanuel was here today. Hassan Piker will be here tomorrow. And then I will be closing all of my apps for the weekend. Yeah, I'm gonna be closely monitoring your social media usage, uh starting Sunday at six AM. Yep, nope, you can complain all you want,'cause I'm sure the the clips can be everywhere. Much like Malay.

I will not be taking any questions about my relationship with Hassan Piker. Who is this Hassan Piker fellow? I haven't heard anything about him recently. I don't know. Talking about Twitch? I don't know what you're doing. Twitch out. Twitch twitch. Anyway, have a good weekend everyone. Bye everyone.

If you want to listen to PodSave America ad-free and get access to exclusive podcasts, go to Cricket.com slash friends to subscribe on Supercast, Substack, YouTube, or Apple Podcasts. Also, please consider leaving us a review. That helps boost this episode and everything we do here at Cricut.

PodSave America is a crooked media production. Our producer is Saul Rubin. Our associate producer is Farrah Safari. Austin Fisher is our senior producer. Reed Chirlin is our executive editor. Adrian Hill is our head of news and politics. Jordan Cantor is our sound engineer with audio support from Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis.

Matt DeGroat is our head of production, Naomi Sengel is our executive assistant, and thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Hayley Jones, Ben Hefcote, Mia Kelman, Carol Pelaviv, David Tolls, and Ryan Young. Our production staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.