Charles Manson did not become the Antichrist and take over the world, right, I'm just we're ending in the apocalyptic.
My telling of the history is the hippies did win. That's when progress stopped and the hippies won in the seventeenth century. I can imagine a doctor Strange Love taking over the world.
In our world is far more.
Likely to be Brettathunburg, the breat of Future, Gretathunberg.
Gretathunburg's on a boat, Brettathuneburg.
God, God will not leave us eternally being lectured by Gretathunburg.
Right, he will not abandon us.
The only three on offer in Europe are green Sharia and totalitarian communist state, and the Bread of Future is by far the strongest.
All Right, we did We've done a few episodes in a row of kind of some pretty heavy theory, some pretty hard reading, some pretty homeworky shit. So this is some less homeworky shit. We watched an interview with someone who I didn't We all know his name, right, we
all know who he is. He is super funny, but I didn't know he was a fucking wacko like he is a he's a boogeyman for the left, you know, broadly speaking, So we thought it would be fun to see to see what his psychological state looks like in a one hour, off the leash kind of interview, because he's a powerful guy, and uh at best were disturbed. This was this was very entertaining.
Yeah, I agree, kind of a nutcase.
Yeah, it was more than disturbing. Now, we did talk a lot about Peter Teel in a previous episode, which was that that was about the mold Bug episode when we were getting into some of the dark Enlightenment stuff. Yeah, he's got something called the stagnation thesis, which is basically saying there is this like extremely fast technological process starting at seventeen fifty with the Industrial Revolution and going all
the way to the nineteen seventies. We were at this this like progress, economic growth and technological development and scientific progress at an accelerating pace, and then it comes to a halt for various reasons, and we go into a phase of stagnation. And AI is one of the great exceptions.
Not just immortality, but also like we're not trying to go to Mars apparently, and like that's a sign we're not making progress.
And we're not investing heavily in nuclear power. And like the he said, all the research stopped with you know, the Alamo Los Alamos, like it really stopped progress in nuclear research. And he's like it's tied into his hatred of socialism and thinking that like the government and socialism are the same thing, and anything the government does is socialists. So regulating AI all that weird, wo gay eye shit, that's socialism. Regulating nuclear bombs because you know, having everyone
having nukes could be problematic, that's socialism. Anything the government does is socialism. It's tied in with that kind of idea as well.
You're you're making him sound too sane. This is like the argument that any sane right winger would make socialism is the enemy.
But this is I think it is insane.
This is one of the the top ten most powerful people in the world probably arguably, right, Is there any argument?
Probably he's a billionaire, so he's up there.
He's got one of the one of the most valuable companies, probably one of the top ten tech companies at least calendar by market cap, and it's on the increase, unlike some of the other ones. It's on the increase, But I just wanted to before we get into his his his strange theories of escataglogy and his strange theories of history. I just thought this was he's a very weird vibes guy, like for being one of the most powerful people on the world, in the world, he is paranoid. I want
to say, he's extremely paranoid. But also what he fears. Maybe it's just because I'm not a billionaire, but the fears he has make no sense. His conspiracy theory will skip to end. Maybe his conspiracy theory is that the Antichrist is Greta Thunberg, and Greta Thunberg is going to
end history. But also that history already, as you alluded to, before history ended in either nineteen forty five or nineteen sixty nine, because after the moon landing then LSD and Charles Manson took over I don't know what over they took over the world.
That comment was one insane The comment about Charles Manson like made me pause. The video rewind and it was like, what the fuck did he just said? He said something in the line and I think this is probably one of the most revealing lines in the interview. He has something in the line that Charles Manson took LSDEP and became a Dostoyevsky villion. He transcended laws and morals, but not anyone can be like Charles Manson, Like what the fuck are you implying, dude? Like like what was he saying?
Like that whole sentence, the sentence by itself, like Charles Manson took ls DEEP and became a Dostoyevsky villain. He transcended morals, but not that anybody can be like Charles Manson. Like the implications of that sentence alone is for an essay. I swear to god.
Yeah, everyone became as direct.
Think we're lying. I can drop in the the citations.
Here, Baconian science. It ended at los almost and then it was okay, it ended there, and we didn't want to have any more. And you know, uh, you know when Charles Manson took LSD in you know, the late sixties and started murdering people, what he saw on LSD, what he learned was that you could be like dosta Yevsky, an anti hero and Dostayevsky and everything was permitted. And of course not everyone became Charles Manson but but Charles the history, everyone became as deranged as Charles man.
But Charles Manson did not become the Antichrist and take over the world. Right, I'm just I'm just we're ending in the apocalyptic.
But my telling of the my telling of the history of the nineteen seventies is the hippies did win.
Everyone became as deranged as Charles Manson. Charles Manson did not become the Anti Christ and take over the world. I'm just, I'm just we're ending, We're ending in the apocalypse. Like like he's so the anti Christ? Is this coming apocalyptic figure.
If anyone's wondering why Victor's camera is off, it's because he is like Arles Manson on LSD and completely deranged.
Is in a cabin somewhere.
Yeah, I mean, I'm so tempted to try my camera again because I did. I did move close to the house. I don't know. We can just try see if it works, but I don't know.
Look at that Canadian wilderness.
Yeah yeah, yeah, that's that's his backyard.
I have the place to hide some bodies. Victory.
I have to hold my mic because I forgot my mic stent back.
In Toronto, just at City Hall for the day.
He's at the Brazoni family compound.
It's in the woods.
I'm actually in a house that's made of hey bail.
Anyway, So, so Peter Till, Peter Till started as a venture capitalist. Like he raised like a million dollars from friends and family. He started investing in some shit, he got into PayPal, like, he started with these anarcho capitalist libertarian ideas of saying that, like you guys were saying, like, he's framing socialism in a very carricaturesque way, like anything the state does is anti natural because it creates boundaries
for human behavior. So libertarians appeal to this notion that capitalism is is human nature and as we are traders and we we tend to naturally develop towards capitalism. But at some point he also says that Ellen must give up on the dream of going to Mars because socialism will follow us into Mars. And then it's like, so, dude, like what the fuck are you saying?
So, so, if if socialism is going to follow us into Mars, if we expand as a transplanetary civilization, then maybe socialism is human nature, you fucking asshole. It's like, what the fuck, Like, I don't get these guys, Like they try to make this very deep, like profound sounding arguments, and they treat them in the most dumb, stupid way possible. It's it's truly insane, Like they don't even understand the ideology they're supposed to be defending.
Like most of what he says is purely schism. It's not even it's not even meaningful or rooted in a philosophical system by itself.
And again, less lest you think that he's making too much sense by arguing against socialism, No, they're they're actually there three forces that are fighting. I'll want to insert the clip too. There are three fight forces that are currently battling over Europe. The dragons maybe you call them.
I want to say, it's the only thing people still believe in in Europe, Like, you know, they believe in the green thing more than Islamic Sharia law or more than in you know, the Chinese communists totalitarian takeover and the future is an idea of a future that looks different from the present. The only three on offer in Europe are green Sharia and you know, the totalitarian communist state and the green one is by far the strongest.
They are Chinese style communism. Okay, in Europe, right sharia law and environmentalism. Environmentalism and then supposedly progress is the one being drowned out here. But environmentalism is winning the fight against sharia law and Chinese communism for control over the end times, battle of Europe.
It's insane. It's beyond insane. It's crazy.
Yeah, which I love. This is this is genius. The problem is, Okay, I have a problem with the interviewer here. I wanted to let's.
Talk about Rostou.
I want to quickly bring this up because I I was like, okay, New York Times, you know, you expect competence. They went to probably a good journalism school. But this guy, he's a.
Token conservative though that's the like Rosstout, it is the token conservative.
I didn't know that, but I learned. I learned, uh from having done some research on him, because there was no ideological pushback. And then Peter Thiel says offhanded things like well, credit Tunberg is the Antichrist, and the interviewer goes, well, she might be the antichrist, but kind of what you're saying is like the control over economic growth is the antichrist, right, and Peter Teel's like, no, actually, Cretituneberg, Yeah, he's like sitting.
There rationalizing his crazy thing. He's like rationalized, and the be like, yeah, yeah, I understand. I don't agree with your rhetoric, but I agree with the substance of what you're saying.
It's okay, great, look, I'll put it up here. This is the uh Ross Stoute's last article, which is called how Israel's War became unjust? First sentence, Israel's war in Gaza is not a genocide, period, It's a war for a just cause, the elimination of a cruel, fanatical, potentially genocidal terrorist organization. Blah blah. So this is lastly the rest. But I went deeper. Okay, so that's bog standard conservative media person I found out. First of all, you'll love
this victor adult convert to Catholicism. But why did he convert to Catholicism. He's quote a huge fan of Lewis, a mid twentieth century Anglican who penned the Chronicles of
Narnia and JR. Tolki, another anti modern conservative Catholic. So if you converted to Catholicism because of Lord of the Rings I personally and the line and the line, the rich of the word robe, I say you should you should not be allowed to own a computer and especially not be allowed to spread your opinions in the New York Times.
Well it was weird, though, wasn't There were like weird conservative themes that were coming out through that interview too, or sorry, weird Christian themes because I feel like the debate over what the Antichrist is and I kept feeling like Ross Deut that kind of wanted to like agree, but then I don't know if you guys noticed, but I felt like there were just moments where then like Peter Teel would say stuff and like you could feel rosstout it being like that's definitely like that's weird, like
that's not what like like like Christians think kind of like I felt like he was reacting on behalf of like a Christian audience and kind of being like, well, like maybe there's a way that like this could make sense, and then everybody would crazy and he'd be like, I don't know, okay, like maybe.
Is the same like a non prolific argumentation that this discussing about the density of the mineral and materials of the one ring being carried to murder, you know, like they're trying to out Christian themselves. Is like, man, this is totally bullshitty. This, this being in the New York Times is beyond pathetic. It's beyond pathetic.
Yeah, I know, what's New York Times trying to be trying to be.
Not just Book of Revelation fanfic, but Lord of the Rings. This guy, we're actually like, like, I know Eric has brought this up at nauseum, but if you actually read Lord of the Rings, this guy is literally Saruman.
Yeah, he wants to he wants.
To breed his own workforce. He wants to live in a private city that he controls. He's the supreme Lord of check.
He wants to create a polaneer.
He wants to cut down all the trees so he can heat his furnaces, flying fucking cars for technological progress. There's the fourth one owns Palatineer's Insane, which the devil used to corrupt sorrowmon at a distance, Like, what are we doing here, guys?
The magical stone exactly takes over people's minds.
With exactly exactly. It's crazy. I also I also feel like my my overall feeling is like this is like a rich guy who just like wants to live forever. Like I feel like that was, you know, like if I was to oversimplify it, I'm just like, this is like an obsessive rich guy who wants to live forever, and he's mad that society isn't like trying to figure that out sooner, and it's like the environmentalists who are
getting in the way. And like at one point he even says, I don't know if you guys picked up on it, but he's like, you know, medical research needs to take more risks, and in other words, what does he mean by that? He means like experiment more on humans, like experiment on marginalize people more like like just get me that fucking immortality, whatever it takes. And like this market, like all these environmentalists and ethical concern people, they're getting
in my way of immortality. And like I feel like that's like his number one, like if I was obviously over simplification. But that's my feeling of like a obsession.
Which again is sorumon who bred red orcs in his like dungeons.
Yeah, but but Loki, I felt he's like this so self loading perverts, you know, like, yeah, it's it's it's I felt this constantly over the interview. There's there's notion like to be to be a transhumanist, one reading, one reading of transhumanism from a Marxist background, it would be this very famous sentence from for Marx, everything that is solid gets melted into liquid, and everything that is sacred becomes profane. Yeah yeah, okay, so sorry that my translation
was wrong. Melt comes into air and everything that is sacred becomes profane. And I think like the second part
is clear. He mentions these dialectics between sacred and profane constantly from sacred is either progress or stagnatian, and profane is the is the opposition, you know, like we could even use like I've been reading Battitle a lot on the difference between homogeny and heterogeny and the opposition and the exclusion of otherness, and like, in this sense, I felt constantly in his discourse these dialectics between stagnation and progress,
sacred and profane. Right, but the self loathing part, according to me, is the fact that transhumanism in a way is a loath for flesh or a you know, like a hate for material limitations to truly believe in transhumanism. And he makes this point during the interview, you know, like he says, we can be more trans than transvestise.
You know, I want to change my heart. I want to you know, like you have to have a certain degree of detachment from your body or even loathe and hate for your own self to be able to say I want to transcend myself to a point where I leave everything behind, right, just disappear into nothingness. You know.
But I think that's but that's connected to his immortality. I think because like his hatred, like I feel likething not making Yeah.
I did not pick up the self loathing because I don't think he considers his body to be himself.
Yeah, I feel like he hates the fact that his body is gonna kill him. But it was weird because because but it was weird because later he said, like, I don't want to like be in some computer. I want my body. I want to keep my body. But I also totally picked up on what you said diego too. So I was actually confused because on the one hand,
I felt like he was talking about transcending. But then at other points he said something about how he wanted to like not live in a computer program or something like that.
And the reason he picks up this sort of whole Christianized argument too with the anti christ is he's saying, like, orthodox Christianity supports transhumanism, Like it's even more transhumanism than any ideology, because the idea is that like you die and you are reborn. Yeah, like it's literally like rebirth in an afterlife and a promised land.
Yeah, Christians should be ultra transhumanist, is like kind of his thesis.
Yeah, So he's trying to rearticulate this stagnation thesis in a religious register, saying, the coming Antichrist is whatever the greta future or whatever, this is exactly, and what we need to do to avoid that he's saying is separate between two antichrist views. One of them is he says, this seventeenth century antichrist view where some evil mad man is gonna invent kind of like Sauron with the Ring, right, some evil mad man is going to invent technology doctor
Strange Love style and hold the world hostage. The classic movie villain of like Marvel but he's saying, no, there's a new Antichrist now, and the Antichrist is the one who convinces you to hand over all your technology into the government safekeeping to regulate everything. And he says that's the true Antichrist, and that is a like irreparable stagnation situation that he feels like we need to avoid, but
also that it's kind of here already. It was I think the interviewer brought that out a little bit, that that was a kind of unclear, and he's and so his mission is to like avoid that by developing I don't know, Palenteer developing surveillance technology and facial recognition technology and selling AI to Israel to help like bomb Gaza.
I don't understand his reasoning. And it was the funniest moment is near the end when the interviewer is like, don't you think like the Antichrist would be doing what you're doing? Basically, like if you want to avoid the Antichrist, but you fucking sound like the Antichrist, man, come on. And then his response is like, ah, well, there's different degrees.
You're deeply invested in Pallenteer in military technology and technologies
of surveillance and technologies of warfare and so on. Right, And it just seems to me that when you tell me a story about out the Antichrist coming to power and using the fear of technological change to sort of impose order on the world, I feel like that Antichrist would be maybe be using the tools that you think you were that you were building, right, Like, wouldn't the Antichrist be like, great, you know, we're not gonna have any more technological progress. But I really like what Palanteer
has done so far. Right, But isn't that isn't that a concern? Wouldn't that be the you know, the irony of history would be that the man publicly worrying about the Antichrist accidentally hastens his or her arrival.
Uh, They're all they are all these different.
Scenario.
I obviously don't think that that's what I'm doing.
And he goes on to say how the antichrist future will come about in his view, which is just like either genetically will just become a more docile species, or like, through thorough wokeization, we will just give up all technology to the safekeeping of like an atomic priesthood style of like like Warhammer forty k the fucking Mars tech priests or something like that are gonna take all our technology away from us.
Insane vision.
But I'm not surprised that people from Silicon Valley who love Ann Rand and get invited to do talks by the end Rand Society believe this shit. It's not surprising.
We have two thousand years of eschatology trying to interpret revelation. Who's the Antichrist? Is it? Is it Nero? Is it? Is it the Pope? Is it Stalin? Is it Hitler? No, it's a sweetest Zoomer with autism. That's the Antichrist.
Yeah, that's just the fucking best man. I swear to god. The Gritta Dumberg Antichrist thing was like, oh my god, that's so perfect.
In the seventeenth century, I can imagine a doctor Strange love Edward Teller type person taking over the world. In our world is far more likely to be Gratathunberg.
Okay, I want to suggest a middle ground. He says it, like so seriously, Yeah.
Yeah, I don't know.
I'm not even being metaphorical here. She's literally Satan, Like, yeah, the blonde girl in the boat going to help starving kids in Palestine.
Yeah, she's literally totally yeah, totally crazy.
His big thing is the Antichrist sells peace and safety. Bitch, you have like ten billion dollars in contracts from the military ice CIA. And the guy's like, well, don't you think the Antichrist would be doing what you're doing? He goes, yeah, I don't think so, yeah, nah yeah.
The other thing. The other thing that I found interesting is that he mentioned a nation started in the seventies with like what we normally interpret as.
The Charles Manson Yeah.
But with neoliberalism, Like the seventies is probably known as an as if we take up March reading of history as the probably the birth stage of neoliberalism with Margaret Thatcher and Reagan. And it's strange because he's fighting for deregulation. He truly believes monopoly is the best form of economic development, because he's like this techno fail the list or like utopian ascillation something like that. He truly believes monopoly is
the best form of economy. But then at the same time he's like, yeah, we're not taking enough risks for to develop technology and not taking like moonshots in science. It's like dude, that's against the logic of capital. Capital will always go for short term profit, it will never take moonshots.
On the other side, his two examples of when progress stopped are the Manhattan Project and then Landing, which are both by the government.
It's fucking insane exactly. That's why we cannot take these guys for serials. Like there's very dumb, Like they're very very stupid.
Yeah, it's like he failed economics class. Like what happened in the seventies, the oil shock, which was a massive which is a massive supply side shock that kinsy and economist couldn't deal with, and then the beginning of stagflation, which is the combination of stagnation and inflation. It's like he failed that economy, didn't show up to that class in economics or something and was just like, yes, stagnation and he bullshitted his answer, and now he's run with
it for the rest of his life. No, I mean, it's it's ridiculous. Yeah, the downturn was neoliberalism. That's usually we associate with it. I don't I understand hippies and Charles Manson taking LSD was the beginning of stagnation. It's very strange. I don't I don't know.
Yeah, it's it's very dumb. I always get angry at these people trying to blame WOKE on socialism. It's like, dude, woke is fully related to liberalism. Is like the division between body and subject, like the division between the state intervention and freedom of economics, like all the things these guys hate about woke. I DI is fully liberal, Like it's it's fully connected to liberal metaphysics, to liberal economic policies,
to liberal public policies. And it's like, no, no, no, that's socialism, Like okay, right, whatever.
He's clearly got the worldview of an oligarch. But this, yeah, this, you know, like Trump did this executive order on July twenty third called Preventing Woke AI and Federal Government, which is basically trying to regulate how AI is used in America, starting with the government saying, you know, his claim is that all these these AI companies are putting all these DEI style parameters into AI and therefore like biasing them towards like leftism and social justice, which is another massive
cope for the way that you know, is there a genocide, is there a white genocide going on in South Africa right now. AI truthfully reports, no, there is not. Well, that's woke, that's woke. You're ignoring my opinion. It's like, what do you want? Guys Like, you're mad about post truth,
but you're completely post truth yourself. You're mad about wokeism, but you're down for regulating the shit out of things so that you can have these fringe opinions being heard and having the majority agreed upon opinions that have a lot of evidence backing them up to be dismissed. And yet that's the woke side, Like they just their worldview is like it's it's like trying to reason with an alcoholic.
You just can't do it. They'll just keep repeating their claims and never listen to what you're saying, and they go on in a.
Loop point of order.
Was this guy against woke at all?
I didn't. I don't remember. I think so I think AI.
He is against He Well, he's against woke because it's a restriction on AI. But he's also super pro trands because he wants more experiments done on people.
Yeah, but he says trends enough.
Yeah, so he wants he wants extreme trands transhuman like he wants to get a new heart. He wants like new blood from from healthy teenagers.
Remember, there there's the woke leftist posthumanism, and then there's the hard line tech bro transhumanism, which is it's like a.
Dark heg alien accelerationist. I swear to God, is.
It worth mentioning his connection to his connection to JD Vans too, because like Jdvans hung around, yeah, Peter Teel all the time, and like I saw him as a mentor, So I think it's worth it's worth bringing that up. And then like the other thing that I think could be worth bringing up, and maybe if we want to do a part two to this, which would be like slightly more of an exploration, is that Peter Teele's biggest influence is like rehne Gier art and like this idea
of mimetic desire. You know, I don't know if you guys.
Ever totally forgot about your art does like a conflict theory where if you if there's a scarcity, Let's say there's a scarcity of attractive women, and you see somebody attracted to that to women those women, you imitate their desire and therefore create conflict over a scarce resource. That's like I just read Nicholas Luhman talking about the same thing earlier, and yeah, so this is Gerard's like conflict theory.
And Peter Teeal actually desire the actually had Girard as a professor at Stanford's, like they actually knew each other and kept in touch. So I think, like, you know, that's really interesting, and like I don't know that much about memetic desire. I remember kind of coming across and being like this is sort of interesting. But like if I remember or like to oversimplified, it's like the idea that human desire is like not like its own thing.
But we basically desire things because other people desire them, so we're basically copying other people.
That's where conflict comes. Conflict arises because we imitate other people's desires in a world where the things we desire are fundamentally skids exactly.
And then basically because we're always imitating other people's desires, that leads to conflict because we're trying to want up
other people. We're trying to like show that we're the real thing when we're imitating people, and then we end up scapegoating, like we end up scapegoating people who were or our rivals, and then like Gerard thinks, the Christianity, so he's kind of a Christian, breaks this cycle of scapegoating because Christianity identifies with the scapegoat christ right, Like so it's like that's like, so that's the idea anyway. Like I'm not saying it's good or bad, but that's
like my memory of sort of the idea. I don't know how that fits in with what fucking Teal is saying now, but I know it's like a huge influence on Teal and it could be something fun to read later.
I think I think it connects maybe with Teal's earlier thinking. One of the interesting things about this video was just hearing him do a bit of reflecting on his supporting Vance and being a very very one of the first major supporters of Trump. Like this guy's a billionaire, gets to decide how politics, who gets funding and who doesn't, and he basically funded the careers of JD. Vance and Trump, and so he's decided how our political landscape is now.
But he's a But the interviewer asked him, saying, Okay, you don't really do that sort of thing anymore. He's like, no, got out of politics because it's incredibly important but incredibly toxic. He so he pulls out of this incredibly toxic political zero sum game of funding politicians and reflects that what
he thought he was doing didn't actually work out. He thought Trump was going to get in there like just basically destroy the government, break everything down, and maybe free him all his lovely research areas that have been regulated out of existence, like AIS and danger of becoming woke, no more nuclear, no human testing in biotech and medicine, like all those areas that he feels like the government
has now put off limits. Trump was going to be like the savior, almost like a QAnon light theory of Trump coming in being the savior. And then he thinks that that kind of all went off the rails and
now he's not funding politics anymore. But it's that, Yeah, I don't know, maybe that conflict theory stuff fed into his earlier thinking where there's like an artificial scarcity being created by government regulation and Trump was going to be his man to get in there and change that conversation, right, That's all he thinks. He's accomplished at least a little bit. Is changed the conversation a bit.
And I think that he also is critical of like the way that corporations in Silicon Valley just kind of try to copy each other, copy each other's models. Like I think that's where like he also brings in the mimetic desire where he's like, all you guys are just like copying each other, and you should just do something unique, whatever the fuck that means. I don't know.
I've I was confused by he wants deregulation, but the two examples of deregulation he actually just sounds like the other New York Times people the abundance abundance thing, because he wants he wants to get rid of the FDA and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. I don't know if you brought up other examples. I just watched the second half.
Now, well, PayPal is an attempt at deregulation. He wanted to get rid of central curve and see a control.
Yeah, and that's like the Bitcoin ideal.
Is he using the FDA and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission as examples of administrative overstep that he wants to get rid of? Or do you think he has some specific project in those areas. What I got out of it. He's terrified of cancer, and he's terrified of Alzheimer's.
Exactly bringing those things said, he wants to live forever.
He's like like actually paranoid, Like you can tell. You can tell he's sleep He's like laying in bed thinking about getting Alzheimer's. And Greta Dunberg he's probably forgetting about stuff, so always forgetting about stuff, and he's becoming paranoid about it.
Well, in my mind right now, I'm kind of all of a sudden making this on the fly connection that I'm realizing because maybe the reason why he worries about like or he's so obsessed with progress and like the stagnation is connected to the my metic theory, because he might have a criticism of capitalism that like all they're ever doing is copying each other and doing things that are so to make money, that are like kind of
tried and true. And he's like worried now that no one's doing anything crazy and new because they just want to be safe. They want to copy everyone else. And because he's so obsessed with dying, he's like, we need to you know, we need to have some radical company, like a moonshot that's going to do something that's not safe. Right.
So I feel like his criticism of capitalism, if there is one, is that it's too safe, it's too risk averse because people just want to make money on things that are like easy.
Right.
And then he's like, so his criticism doesn't come from like egalitarianism. Probably like us, all of us at least to some extent, have a criticism of capitalism that's at least about like the fact that it leads to very inegalitarian outcomes. But for him, it's like he doesn't really care about that. He's just like, why aren't people doing crazy enough stuff? It's like, too it leads to too much mediocrity, and I don't want to die. So where are the people working on immortality?
Right?
Where are the fucking people working on a martial? Yeah?
Yeah? And and economic growth is going to slow as a result.
There's a moment where the interviewer ask him like, so do you believe humanity needs to survive?
And he takes it, Oh, yeah, that was an amazing moment. That was an amazing moment.
Is it hype? Is it delusion? Is it something you worry about you. I think you you would prefer the human race to endure, right, Uh h, you're hesitant.
Well, I don't know.
I I would, I would. This is a long hesitation. It's so long hesitation. There's so many questions and plays. Would the human race survive?
Uh? Yes, okay, but but uh I I also would. I I also would like us to to radically solve these problems and uh and so you know, it's always I don't know, you know, yeah, transhumanism.
And then even the interview like intervenes and say, like, man, that's a very long time to respond to us to a rather simple.
Question, long hesitation.
Yes, yes, but you know, yes, but what do you mean? Yes? But like yeah, Like he's he's truly a true a
transhumanist in that sense. And it's also connected to his theology in the sense that he doesn't believe in the necessity for materiality to transcend, So probably he's already either unconsciously feeling the decay of his own physical matter, and and he has this pipe dream about transcendence that is non material and is also supported by his believing Christianity, but also that you know, like almost ontological terror of being non material it's already providing him with the notion
of the Antichrist as a result of his own logic, you know, like is this ischatological idea where he's he wants to get rid of materiality to have like these metaphysical transcendence, but at the same time the terrors bring him back to dementia and cancer. Like what he truly feels is not the entry Christ is the mensia and cancer, but he wants trusting his physical Boddy like the the like he's unconscious is very is very noticeable in the way he structured his responses, I.
Think, which is not Orthodox Christianity, because orthodox Christianity one of the early heresies I don't recall the name, but one of the early Gnostic heresies was to say that Christ could not have been an actual flesh and blood human being. He had to only have appeared. I think it's like Arianism or one of those. He could only have appeared to be flesh and blood because it's impossible for physical matter to be redeemed. So he he keeps using Christianity as a as a as a touchstone, but
in fact he's probably more of a Gnostic. A Gnostic anti humanist rather than a Christian humanist.
It isn't kind of christianized neo liberalism because yeah, like the reason his his views are framed this way is because he's fundamentally like a libertarian or whatever you want to call it, anarcho capitalist like views like you know, Atlas Shrugged is about how human flourishing is bogged down by by bureaucracy, you know, rules, red tape and regulation, and that you've got to like shrug all that shit off.
And that's basically, you know, the neoclassical neoliberal view market fundamentalism, like the free market is the fundamental natural state of like human interchange, right, which is not true. That's that's part of our confusion here, is that's not true. The free market requires loads of regulation to exist. And if you eliminated the government and the bureaucracy and the central Bank and the treasury and all that stuff, there'd be
no more money, there'd be no more free market. We'd be we'd be bartering and trading bottle caps like Fallout style. But he thinks that anything bureaucracy is bad, and he's christianized that now into like this creative, wonderful Oh, it's like the Antichrist. It's like paving the way for the Antichrist. All this, all this bureaucracy leading to I don't know, either like one world Chinese style Greta Thunberg Scandinavian socialism
right on the one hand, or complete because scarcity. Right, what's the basic thing about what's the basic neoliberal idea about scarcity? The best way to distribute limited resources under conditions of scarcity is a completely free and unregulated market. That's the basic kernel of neoliberal ideology. And he's just turned that into a religious view, which is like explicitly religious. It was implicitly all long religious and it was wrong,
but now he's making it explicitly religious. And anything that opposes that fundamental kernel of his worldview is like preparation for the Antichrist. That's like, yeah, you're a servant of the Antichrist, which is reality. He's the anti Christ, as the fucking interviewer pointed out.
Yeah, so in that sense, it's true, communism is the Antichrist.
Yeah, it's it's an anti socialist view to say the least.
Yeah, exactly, I want to go out on a limb here, I don't I don't think. I think he is so rich and has like so little material need that capitalism doesn't actually exist for him anymore. All this talk about markets and neoliberally like this, it's gone from his mind because he has the afterlife and the Battle of the Three Dragons. That is the only thing that exists in
his mind now. And if you compare him, like I did a lot of I put a YouTube video and I did a lot of reading of like Gilded Age capitalists and these guys like Henry Ford, the Rockefellers, they're very uh Calvinists, you know, the Calvinist the vapor thesis, just like put your head down, I'm not going to talk. I'm not going to be in the public eye. Yeah, there's no like afterlife. It's just their attitude is I'm rich. Fuck unions. They know they know the market, they know
what markets are. They're very involved in like the the capitalist aspect of the capitalist life. Feel is like he needs to be an intellectual and an eschatologist. He's like he's leaving the material world and it's so funny to have him like have to talk and articulate his views. And the guy is even even the guy who's his fanboy, is like, bro, that's a little crazy, and he just he continues.
This just made me think, you know, Calvinism is the view that you're predestined either to go to hell or to heaven, and that there is nothing in this life that you can do about it. It's different from Lutherans, right, well, Lutherans believe, you know, sola fide, right, you just have to have faith and you'll go to heaven. But Calvinists are like, you cannot know if you're going to heaven or hell, and it's all already predetermined anyway, and there's
nothing you can do about it. So great, I can be a horrific capitalist and treat my workers like shit and destroy the environment and do all kinds of terrible shit, and there's nothing I can do to change my fate. That's why he thinks it's like a deterministic worldview. And it was interesting that Tel said, no, like, I'm not a determinist. I believe that there's a lot of room
for human action and choice in history. So he's kind of pushing back on being identified as a Calvinist, saying, no, like I believe in free choice.
Yeah, he straight up says we shouldn't give too much agency to God because it's our yees.
If we interpret this as a ultimate causation verse, they want to say, I'm persunty because God caused me to do this. God is causing everything, and the Christian view is anti calvinist. God is not behind history. God is not causing everything. If you say God's causing everything, God, you're scapegoing God.
But God, but God is behind Jesus Christ entering history because God was not going to leave us in a stagnationist, decadent Roman empire. Right, so at some point, at some point, at some point, God is going to step in. I am not I'm not I am not that Calvinist and that's not a passinism though, that's just Christianity.
Yeah, Like there's no God standing behind history. Like but then then this was the smart kind of move that the interviewer did, was that, but but he sent But God is responsible for putting Christ into history, like he
placed Christ there. So the fact that you're saying it's all about like human choice and what you're doing it pallanteer to prevent the coming of the Antichrist, and that there's no God in history I mean, this is a silly religious like one one version of Christianity versus another. But I thought it was interesting anyway to say. But you're saying there's no God behind any of this, but Christ and the Antichrist seemed pretty connected to a decision that God has made.
So this is where I got a little bit like the pervert touch. On his speech. He made an antargeonism between low tax socialism that he said he was unsustainable because of Obama and consumer capitalism. So in his mind, in his libertarian mind, what he wants what he implied negatively between the opposition of low tax socialism being unsustainable and consumer capitalism also being unsustainable. In his mind, what he wants, it's a high savings capitalism, you know, is
a self restraining capitalism system. Because he wants he wants to go either back to a fieldal order where very Atlas Shruggi, only the very few visionary men will make the choices of where to invest all our resources. And he said the going to Mars in twenty twenty four was a political project, you know, like it's it's almost like he's saying, like this, these visionary men have to take the rein on on top of the others and impose their will upon others because the other two options
are wrong. Free market is wrong because we don't know how to do. Consumer capitalism is unsustainable, and low tax socialism is also unsustainable. He doesn't understand socialism is very clear,
but his antagonism implies that what he wants negatives. Yeah, what what he implies negatively as a utopia is the sense of self restraining capitalism, which is which is always ridiculous because capitalism is at the same is, at the same spot a system where you're supposed to desire everything and aspire to to have everything, but at the same time, a good capitalist is always saving for the future.
You know, Like he wants low tax capitalism. If you do the math on what he said, he wants low tax capitalism, correct, he thinks he thinks low tax, low tax socialism under Obama. I prefer that to high tax socialism, obviously, he says, but you know, eventually socialism leads to high taxes. That's like what he thinks socialism does is you just have to tax everything out of existence, which is to say, you know, yeah, low tax. And he doesn't like consumer
capitalism either because consumer capitalism implies borrowing. Right, you're a capitalist and you're borrowing. No, he thinks capitalists create value only. Value only comes from capitalists in the free market doing things outside in the private sphere, and all government is
just leading to socialism and high taxes. It's a very simplistic worldview that he's hung all these little old bells and whistles onto and oh atlas shrug doo, the antichrist ooh cryogenic freezing, Like why don't we get back to that? That was so great?
Hey, it's like what again forever? That's the thing that's the theme here living.
If you think, yeah, if you think for two seconds about cryogenics, that's just kicking the bar all down the road, because oh yeah, the future is going to figure out how to bring us back to life and cure the diseases that were supposedly freezing ourselves in the first place to avoid that doesn't real cancer, but oh yeah, probably that's it. So I'm going to freeze myself and let the future deal with that problem. So that's a non solution.
And to him, AI, downloading your brain is a non solution because I want to keep my body.
Can I say one good thing about him. I have one good thing to say about him because of his material conditions. And it wouldn't be here if I didn't use that sentence at least once. It's got to drink deal if it wasn't because of his material conditions and agreeing with pills as capitalism doesn't exist for him, you know, like he already has all his material needs probably solved, unless he has cancer in alzheimer. That will explain a lot about his speeches as well. But let's suppose he
already has no worries about anything. He already has everything that he needs. All his material needs are fulfilled, so he can pipe dream about all this bullshit. He became a very long term thing, which I think it's conditioned to scarcity mentality. He doesn't have scarcity mentality because he said I invent I invested in JD. Vans and in Trump in twenty sixteen, and he said in twenty sixteen the probability of of Trump winning was fifty to fifty.
But he said, maybe if I invested him in twenty sixteen, we can change something about the direction of politics for twenty twenty five. And you know, only only having those material conditions that allow you to have a billion dollars and place a bet under a ten year spam. It's already like a deservant of price to say to say something at least, so.
He is a pervert. He's a anti anti Calvinist. He hates his body. You know, if there's if there is a billionaire who's likely to have like an underground bunker filled with babies harvested for adrina chrome, it is this guy.
It is this doesn't he does he harvest like his like young people's blood and like, you know, there's that thing where.
Well he's proel, so he's he's already pro organ traffic.
Is he prois reel.
I don't know if it's a meme that he has blood boys, but I have I have heard it said, it's been alleged.
I think Palenteer is happy to do business with Israel.
Like you're saying that he's a pervert. His pervert structure, in contrast to other billionaires who do things because they want to self aggrandize, or because they want power, or because they're just like selfish assholes, he kind of doesn't have that. He's kind of like left the register of normal concerns and he's at a level of neuroses where he's like a cosmic entity. His perversion is that he's not as much of a cosmic entity as he as
he wishes he was. And he's like extremely focused on the last he is saruman.
This is Yeah, he's like he wants to be a transhuman abomination. He wants to be a transhuman amount.
There's there's a sentence from Freud that for me, it's always key to identifying perverse personalities, which is I recognize the existence of laws, but they don't apply to me. Yeah.
It's like it's like he's refusing you can he can do anything he wants. And this is he's like reading about the or writing and reading and thinking constantly about the end of the world. He has unlimited resources, but his perversion is to not enjoy anything.
And he's got he thinks this deep clever argument about stagnation and the anti Christ and this like new form of evil that's like, yeah, one world government regulating technology out of existence and guaranteeing stagnation for all time. But he's just a classic doctor evil figure. Like there's people outside of Palenteer protesting him. He's making technologies that help police states and military states do what they do. He's literally doing the most evil shit you can imagine, and
he thinks he's saving the world. He thinks he I don't know what he thinks. I like him saving a small chunk of the world anyway, saving humanity in the abstract, not human beings as we saw from the interview, Do you think humanity should survive?
Well?
No, Like he wants to save humanity by making it immortal, but he doesn't care about human beings as they exist separate from him.
It's insane that he's libertarian and he believes we don't live in a libertarian society, but he already owns a president and a vice president. He's like, good, Like, what else do you want to buy? Like, really, what power do you think American politics have all regulating companies. If you are literally funding politicians for the past ten years and you're already placing them into office, what do you believe in libertarian society will look like?
Idiot?
Yeah, you can shape the most powerful empire in the world with money, and yet we're not neoliberal enough for this fucking guy.
Yeah.
No, he wants to buy life he wants to buy.
Everything that is into air, everything that is sacred, that's profane. I swear about that. That sentence is like the like what you say that the pernicle, like the roots of transhumanism in the sense of how capital turns everything into merchandises.
I swear to God, in this guy's mind, utopia will be something like I can you offer you ten million dollars for your body, and you will disappear and your consciousness will be transferred to someone else, and ninety nine of the population of the world will say, yes, give me ten million dollars, fuck my body. Like this is what utopia looks like for Peter Tiel, like the full mercantilization, Like even quantum clouds will be sellable under his idea of a perfect society.
I do love it. I do love it when you see people that are like stereotypes, like living stereotypes, and I just feel like Peter Tale watching it. It's just like the most delightfully perfect billionaire super villain stereotype that exists in real life, and you look at them and you're like wow, Like it's amazing that you're real and you're not like in some superhero movie.
How powerful they are, they are and who they're connected to, and that's insane, you know, connecting to Pills. Last video on the channel, which is by the way, fucking amazing, brilliant and everybody should fucking see it. I'm going to
do a live review on the video on Monday. But like this notion of how much capital interest shapes our worldview and we are not even aware, like the sense that you have an even to be critical about your ability to be critical about it because your knowledge of the tools that you have to be critical about your worldview are also in a way pre shaped by what you can or cannot see about the reality of society.
Like we I don't think we can even understand the amount of reach these guy has on all our worldview.
It's a it's you can you can see from his concerns, his neuroses, his what he's paranoid about. It's just a complete world of abstraction. And he's not He's not any happier, right, But just like, oh, the three dragons of Europe are sharia law, China and environmentalism, Like that's what's at stake, Yeah, current.
The same, the same thing that Frederick Jameson does with postmodernism, we need to do with this guy's ideology as well, which is to see how it is a product of the economic configuration, the mode of production, and the specific woes of our era, not just generally two hundred years of capitalism, but like, like what's happening since the seventies that he thinks he's got all figured out what he
really doesn't. It's weird, but all all this stuff is funny, but coming from this guy, with having being one of the wealthiest guys in the world, having the in lewence he does, basically being able to found a presidency, found a new party within the Republican Party, and fund an ideology. Remember how involved he was all with like Jarvin and all them. Like, it's scary that this guy's out here saying this stuff, even though it's kind of objectively.
It's an interesting alliance though on the right that this guy is kind of influencing JD. Vance. And you know, maybe this is also a way in which I feel like the Right is just so much better at building alliances, because I mean, Peter Teel is like, like I said, he wants trans human abominations. He's also like gay. Right, It's like it's like and this guy's like a bit like built somehow built an alliance with like Catholic you know, JD. Vance. It's just interesting to me.
Oh yeah, interesting material for psychoanalysis, that's for sure. I got to read Bruce Fink and stuff and try to figure out what's going on.
I would love to do Bruce.
I thought, I thought this would be boring, like if Zuckerberg were doing this, it would be totally boring or Bezos. But this is a this is a madman, this is a this is the Faustian, the guy who made the Faustian bargain. And we're just seeing now, we're seeing the end of the story doctor Faustus. Yeah, doctor Fausta's last moments.
And he's got Mephistopheles coming after him.
We got through eschatology, we got through the different interpretations of revelation, we got through his various forms of mysticism. But that's a good place to lock her up, I think.
Yeah, And you know those who are there's there's a video of this. You can see him at a cottage right now. So I'm excited to get back out there.
And yeah, he's got his Charles Manson LSD hippie cult to get back to because remember they won in the seventies and they're here in Canada. Yeah, exactly, he's there in Queen's Park.
Now, well if he gets if he gets a drone striked, then we'll we'll know where it came from.
Also, if people want to know more about AI and like Palenteer actually just quick shout out. I think Friend of the Show or like We're in Hell has a great video that came out called AI Weapons and it's all about like does a deep dive into Peter Tiel?
Is that a YouTube?
Yeah, a YouTube video. Yeah, We're in Hell is a YouTube channel.
Epoch Philosophy also made one that I didn't finish, but it was on Palenteer. Really good editing, really good editing.
Nice stuff out there.
If you want more, there's good stuff out there from a non proselitizing content creators.
So next one, next one we're going to have to get back into. I think we're going to look at psychoanalysis, but.
Maybe we'll be down for psychoanalysis. Also rein Asia art if you guys want to do it, if you want to keep this theme going, I'd be curious to read you, breen Asia.
I mean, it came up twice in two completely different contexts today. That can't be a coincidence. That's is that that's got to.
Be a psychonel adjacent Also, it's adjacent.
He's a polarizing figure, though I can already tell just from our brief explanations of his uh, that can tell yeah, that that can lend itself to some pretty right wing shit.
Too, exactly, which which makes it interesting, Yes, exactly.
Well, this fan boying, I don't know if you want to call him a boot licker, this boot licker interview called Peter Thiel not just a billionaire but one of the most important right wing thinkers of the age.
Despite the slight handicap of being a billionaire, there's a good case that he's the most influential right wing intellectual of the last twenty years.
Amazing, all right, amazing, cheers, guys, have fun, Victor everyone else, thank you, Thank you very much, guys.
Later, all right,