Episode 15: Shay Knight

The guys from Ping. They've kind of showed me how much the equipment matters. I just love that I can hit any shot I kind of want.

We're gonna be able to tell some fun stories about what goes on here to help golfers play better golf.

Welcome back to the Ping Proving Grounds Podcast. Shane Bak and Marty Jertsen. We're in the Ping truck. Always excited to be back, and we're with a man that does a lot a lot of work week to week. Shane Knight's with us, of course, the caddy for Victor Howlin Shae. Recently, you were a part of of one of the great final rounds, one of the great final nine holes that we've ever seen, when Victor tore part Olympia Fields. Is

It was like playing a video game.

It was unbelievable to be a first hand witness of that, you know, standing up by the bag and just experiencing, you know what he went through and you know the shot city.

It was remarkable.

I think whenever there's like a round like that. Obviously, Victor hit tons of incredible shots, very very straight, but you also have to get lucky a little bit. What were a few things there in that final round around that back nine where you know maybe the luck went his way?

Well, definitely fourteen, You know with that lie that he had should chip the driver off the tea and just missed it in the left rough and you know the grain was going with us, but you know there's a toft of grass behind the ball and you know nine nine.

Couldn't get there.

He had to hit the ad iron but it had to come out perfectly, and you know obviously it did and you know, knocked it to a foot.

Make berdie from there was incredible.

Shit. What's that? What's that conversation like between you and Victor on that lie? Because I remember watching on TV and they had you guys miked up at Memorial was in.

The playoff, in the playoff.

And the t shot ended up right there on the edge of the rough and the fair way too.

What is that?

How? What is your contribution in talking through the shot selection there with Victor and.

More, you know, just giving him reassurance, you know, especially Memorial when obviously long's no good, but you know, to hit the wedge the way he did. You know, we thought it was going to come out hot, and it kind of did. It needed to to get to cover that bunker. But yesterday on fourteen, we knew nine nine couldn't get there, and we knew that there was a false front and was going to come all the way

Yeah, Shay, what has the last year been like in terms of the development of Victor Harvin Because you kind of go back to the Open last year. Of course he was in the final group with Rory on Sunday, think about the PGA Championship this year. But I mean, he's on a run. He's not missing cuts, he's playing very consistent golf. The pitching and chipping has improved a lot.

Yeah, and that's the hardest part because you know, when you start playing better, your expectations get higher, so you put more pressure on yourself and you know, it's trying to manage that try to you know, have a slice reality, so to speak, in terms of you know, not being able to play perfect golf and accepting that and understanding that, you know, golfs.

Are fall for a reason.

So you know, for him to go out and you know, the consistency that he's showing, you know, week in week out this year has been you know, it's been spectacular.

Going back to Saint Andrews and then you think about oak Kill and I mean, he played excellent golf at oak Hill really until the bunker shot was that on sixteen sixteen? So what was Victor like going to the final round at Saint Andrews Because I mean he hit it close on one, he mister short birdie putt and didn't really factor in that Sunday versus going to that PGA Championship playing alongside another heavy hitter on that Sunday.

It's funny because whenever Victor gets off to a good start, you know, he always takes that momentum forward. Whereas when he gets off to a shaky start, he missed a couple of puts early.

That's when you know, you're thinking.

You know, is is he going to change the momentum or is it going to continue the same. And you know that was the difference between the Open and the PGA, because you know, the Open, as you said, he missed a couple of short puts early and PGA a couple of short parts earlier and he took the momentum moving forward.

Yeah, it seems like I just it's so fun to watch Victor making a lot of birdies on tough golf courses against the strongest fields. I mean, I tell us a little bit about it. I think at Augusta this year he made five birdies in a row. What are those stretches? Like? Like, what are you guys talking more? Talking less? Is he just in the zone? What's it like when he's on a heater like he's like like he was a few weeks ago into Augusta.

As we all know, Like you know, he's an unbelievable ball striking. He drives the ball extremely well and he's irons when it's on. You know, he hits fades so he has full control over the ball, knowing that the ball was going to get left to right, and that's why he can be so aggressive, so you know, if he can control his distance, and especially around Augusta, you know, that's extremely important around there to be able to do that. So you know, that's the most important thing for him.

Did you get introduced to Victor and going through your career and kind of looking at along some of the players that you've kind of teamed up with over the years, what is it like taking maybe a flyer on a young player even though he's obviously was a great young player and had come off that us.

Am went, yeah, for sure, Like you know, I was working for Shawn a Hab you know, it was four and a half years ago now, and he he got injured, and you know, I was pretty much looking for work, being a little freelancer, you know, cutting for odds and ends here.

When you're looking for work as a caddy, I mean, is it are you kind of letting other caddies know, like, Hey, I'm available, Like I'm I'm I'm golf tender if anybody wants to.

I wish it was like that. You know, it's like a fraternity out here. It really is.

Everyone knows, you know, who's looking, who's you know, who got fired, who you know, who's whatever it is is injured exactly. So Joe Scovern, who's a good friend of mine, he worked for Ricky Fowler for a long time. Sam McNaughton, who is Ricky's agent, and he's obviously Victor's agent as well, so you know, that's how the team came along. And yeah, Sam called me up and asked if I'd be interested in trying it out for this with this young kid, you know, obviously he won the US Amateur and so

It's been unbelievable, right the last four years.

Yeah, Victor's game is a volve. Obviously came out as a superstars ball striking. Even when he played in the US Open as an amateur, like.

Twenty nineteen nineteen at.

Pebble, he either led the field, is very close to leading the field and strokes game ball striking. What what has it been like seeing other parts of his game you mentioned short game evolve in these in these four years, which parts of his games have been fun for you to watch kind of improve?

It's been an interesting ride because you know, he's obviously a cutter of the golf ball. You know, with the way he he's wrist angles, et cetera. He cuts the ball. And you know, he went down a stage where he tried to hit the draws, try and get the numbers more closer to zero from a TrackMan perspective, yep, and

When you talk about being a cutter of the gobbel, which is a lot of the modern players, a lot of the players obviously moved the ball left or right. You get on the tee at thirteen at Augusta, what are you saying to Victor when you know the ball's got to go the other way, maybe an uncomfortable direction for him.

Well, it's actually a lot easier now because you know they right with the tea box is probably let's.

Say, the up to let's say last year's tea at the Masters. What are you saying to Victor when you know that ball's got to go the way he doesn't like to see it go.

Well, it's three wood.

All day, Okay, Yeah, So it's not Driver because Driver is so narrow it brings the right pines into play.

And you know, we know very well what.

It's like over there, unless you Phil Mickelson Jordan exactly. But no, it's just you know, he tends to hit that three withood a lot straighter, especially when the winds out of the left. That's why he finds it difficult with the driver when the wind's out of the left. So it's most of the time it's threewood off the tee and just get it in play, and yeah, go from there.

Say what's been what's been one of maybe your biggest regrets as a caddy right now, maybe even with Victor or any of your players, And a regret could be maybe you know, advising on the you know the distance, the win, reading the lyron, some of that nature.

What's the worst time you've done your job? What's like the worst part the worst job you've ever done as a caddy?

I remember this is one.

This is way back, but I remember cutting for Shauna Hair and he was We're at the Scarlet Golf Course in Ohio and we're playing with the Web finals and he's playing extremely well.

He's in the third round.

I think he's coming fifth, and he missed the first two cuts to two weeks prior, so he's got to play well this week to get his job back on the PGA Tour. And we get up on number ten, eleven. We get up on number twelve. The part five you know makes Berdie run to thirteen. He's team off first,

But obviously, oh that's an incredible story.

Shae.

What's your journey been like to get to this position? Can you walk us through maybe your career as a caddy and really your career throughout golf yeah, it's.

You know, I play golf my whole life. You know, I love the game.

Played a lot of golf back in Australia, a lot of amateur events, never turned professional.

Really was good enough.

I wasn't long enough, had an unbelieable short game, but you know, just knew in my heart that I didn't have it. And you know I lived in Sydney and I played with Matt Jones. We're members of the Steam Golf Course, this Ruling Golf Club in Sydney, and you know we're good friends. We always play golf together, traveled together. We drove to Adelaide them back.

Which was that was an interesting drive.

That car stunk by the by the end of the oh my gosh, drive it through Adelaide. But yeah, no, and yeah, he went to a s u and and then went on the he was on the court, well the what was it called back in the day, and he just couldn't get his card and he said, you know, I want you to come over and caddy for me. And I was landscaping, landscaping back home and you know, finished my course and I love being outside, so you know, I was doing that and I'm like, okay, I'll take

And he's like, show, I want you to come back, and I'm like, well, I'll come back, but you're going to do your thing. I'm going to do my thing. We're going to meet in the middle like.

Normal player caddy relationship does. And yeah, worked with him for five and a half years, had a great time, and you know, I moved on from there, worked for Martin lad Scottish guy, worked with him for a couple of years.

Only the only Scottish golfer that hits it higher than anybody on tour. By the way, Yes, it's incredible to watch thee I knock it down and cuts it more.

Than Yes, exactly, Yeah, he cuts it more than Victor. For shocking to see.

I thought Scottish golfers hit.

It well, yeah, no, it's it launches straight at the end, these big cuts like he uses the whole fairway, that's for sure. But yeah, worked for him for two years and then I got fired from him and Sean O'Hare was available. Work with Sean for five years, and yeah, now I'm with Victors. So it's been an unbelievable ride. It's gone so fast. I still can't believe I've been on tour for sixteen years.

I just can't.

Although the Grays probably showed that sheep yesterday, but I was gonna. I was going to shave last night. But I said to Victor, I'm like, it's a good luck charm.

I can't do it.

When when when Victor wins, you know, he does all the press, he does all the media, he has to interviews. I mean, people don't understand how long that evening is. If you win a big golf tournament. Do you guys meet up at any point on the back end of that, like go have a beer or go hang out or do anything like that.

Yeah, like anyone.

You know the BMW, we were there and we were just waiting for him, obviously, did you know, all his media and he had to sign what felt like a hundred flags, et cetera. So I'm sure his hand was sore after that. But you know what, the way they treated us at the BMW was just first class.

We had BMW.

Courtesy cars, we had food available at I suppose it was like beyond first class. So yeah, after the round, the gentleman who was serving us all week said, you know, can we get you any food. I'm like, well, you know, a nice steak would be nice. They brought out three steaks salad waiting for Hobby to come back, and you know, so we all ate together and then he's like, oh, do you want some dessert and.

I'm like, ahn, no, no, I'm good.

And they're going to make these guinness. It's a Guinness with ice cream in it. I'm like that sounds disgusting.

But anyway, so we said no to that.

So the chef ended up bringing out these brownie homemade brownie with this chocolate ice cream cherry in it, and I'm like it was just like I had a couple of scoops, but yeah, the the ice cream doesn't usually handle the stomach too well, so I only had a couple of bites.

But yeah, it was great.

That sounds incredible. Now, Shure, what's your what's your favorite course to caddy at throughout the year, like or top two or three.

By far Pebble Beach.

Okay, I love Pebble even though it's you know, we usually play with amateurs and usually miserable weather. But just just the view out there. I love that scenery. You know when you get on seven, eight nine, it's just you know, you stand there and you're Amatea's are letting it fly left and right. I'm just looking out of the ocean, you know. Maoi's nice as well. That's another one,

But a yeah, those three courts would probably be my three.

What's it? Obviously we're in the ping tour truck. What's it like having something like this available week to week for you when you need to come tweak something for Victor or he wants a new club We talked a lot this year about the seven Woody threw in the bag at the Master talking about Augusta, Nashville. That was really for two shots the entire day, So really, what was that eight shots for the week. He's basically putting

Yeah, well, I don't really do my cheese, not many kicks, especially kidding.

No, it's obviously amazing to have that at Victor's disposal whenever you need it, you know, whatever it is, whether you need Tea's or I need a new hat, you sweat through it.

It's just yeah, it's once again first class.

What's he particular about, because we've talked to a few players about you know, they want to see the loft, they want to see the bend, they want to make sure everything's regripped week to week. What's something that Victor's particular about, either within his bag or in his bag.

He's not very particular with grips, et cetera. But you know, just trying to doal in those numbers, you know, because you need to be so precise with your distance control, you know, on the PGA tour because you just can't play from long.

So you you guys, Victor plays in meters, tell us how that works out here? Is it? Is he one of the only players that does that. Do they make a separate book? Do do you get a separate book or do you do conversions? No?

No, Well it's funny because you know, when we're all the corn.

Ferry, we had just yardage books those finals, and I had to convert both books from yards to meters.

But now I'm lucky enough with.

Oh my gosh, it's like two hours of torture your heads unbelievably sold by the end of it. But nowadays it's on the PGA tour. Yeah, they do meters books. There's probably half a dozen guys that working meters as well. I worked in meters when I was younger, you know, always played in meters, so you know, it's easier for me to get my head around it, whereas you know, working in yards was a little bit more difficult for me. So yeah, it's been a great transition for me.

Shay.

We watch Victor week to week on the tour, and fans of his see this happy you look at lucky young kid that's always smiling, and he always looks like he's just in a good mood. What's something about Victor either within the ropes aroundside of the ropes that maybe we don't know about him, or maybe fuels him, or there's that fire inside of him that we don't see kind of through the Victor smile.

Well, I think you say, you know, with his bulldog mentality, like you know, for him to go out yesterday and do what he did, you know, you need to have that fire in the belly to you know, shoot that score and have no fear. And you know for him to do that, you know, not every player can do that, and that's what makes him a champion that he is.

We talked about the seven would at augusta National. You're looping, you've got your bag set, you know what clubs go, distance wise, whatever. When Victor comes to you and goes, hey, I'm putting this club in for two shots a day, what does that do to your calculations or what you're putting down in your notes? Knowing, Okay, so we're hit this on thirteen and fifteen, and that's kind of hit.

Well, that's especially fifty because it's if you're just a little bit off. Whether it's short or long. You are you're a screen. Yeah, you got nothing. So it's very tough to pull the club. But you know that's what we do. So you know, you live and die by the sword, and you know it is what it is. He accepted to move on.

How best do you disagree with them on the golf course? How do you go about a disagreement when maybe you either don't think it's the club, you don't think it's the shot, you don't think it's going to come out of that lie. How do you approach that without selling negative?

I mean, it's his decision.

So you know, I'm going to give my opinion and I'm going to try to convince him that it's my what I think.

But at the end of the day, it's his decision.

You know, sometimes he listens, sometimes he doesn't, and you know that's that's why he's got his name on the bag and that's why he's you know, top five player

I'm like, Hobby, it's.

Too much club and once again like you know, he can take it or leave it. But in this situation, he took the advice, went back to a wedge, and he was Pinnie made Birdie. So so you know, sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. It just all depends on what he's singing at the time, I suppose.

So how do you how do you judge the wind? Did you take notes based on the forecast and then adjusts when you're out on the course or what what indicators are you using to judge the wind, surface wind? Are you looking at trees? Are you looking at flags? What is that process?

That's a really good question because you know, obviously the wind can change all the time, and I always hate to see light and variable because I'd got to be blowing ten to fifteen out of the you know, whatever direction. Because you know, to start with, you you're looking at weather maps and you're trying to work out. You know, say it's coming out of the northeast. It says northeast all day, but then you look on the tour's got their hourly forecast, and sometimes it says light and variable

What hales have had traditionally, like maybe some confusing or very challenging wind is twelve at Augusta. One yes, yes, you're one way after twelve.

Thirteen, fifteen, sixteen, like yeah, six, take a pick.

Yeah, that's the hardest thing about Augusta.

You know, people don't understand that, you know, with those trees, the pine trees, the wind always swells through the trees and you can get up there and you can be playing straight down on eleven, and then you get on the t on twelve and you feel like it's hurting out.

Of the right.

But what it does is it goes through the pines and comes back and it's just so difficult, but you know, you just got to commit to the shot and hopefully it pays off.

Shay, what's Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday like for you week to week on tour? What are you doing Monday? What are you doing Tuesday? Obviously Wednesday a lot of the weeks or pro m days, but what is your process like maybe those first couple of days weeks week.

Usually Monday's always just walking the golf course by yourself. Yes, I love to walk the golf course by myself, just doing it on my own. If I'm walking with a couple of caddies, and I'll do that as well. But you know, I love getting my prep work in. I pride myself on, you know, being really diligent with all the information that I need for Victor whenever he needs it. Tuesdays is usually nine holes. Hovey gets out here, you know,

Then.

Wednesday's usually a pro am, although you know in Atlanta there's no proram, which is which is nice. But yeah, no, it's it's usually just prep work and you know, just dialing the numbers and hopefully you know he's ready to go on Thursday.

What's what's bagweight of Victor's bag right now? I mean too much?

Too little?

Like where we at?

That fluctuates, Okay.

Yeah, it depends on on the conditions, Like you know, the British Open when we had everything under the sun. We've we've always got a lot of food in there.

But yeah, British Light and variable.

British Open was like sixty pounds, whereas you know sometimes there's forty five pounds.

So who has the heaviest bag on tour? Is there somebody that's bag stands out as the heaviest by far well.

And Bryson Chambeau was on tour. Yeah, he was probably the most. Yeah, the bag.

The snacks are heavy snacks. We're working with it. Also, I don't think people totally always understand this. I mean, you have snacks in there too, you got to carry it back for five hours?

Yeah, no, for sure. You know, I don't have as many snacks in there for me. They're usually in there for him. Yep.

I'm usually you know, have a couple of snacks maybe for me, but you know you usually get a banana after nine or just yeah, but for him, you know a lot of protein bars, protein powdered bananas, these electro like gummies that he likes as well. So yeah, just try and keep him charged and you know, good to go for the for the eighteen dolls because you know, sometimes you're out there for you know, five six hours, so you definitely know for many, that's for sure, Shay.

Can we talk about green reading a little bit? You know victors use a aim point. You see him using it, doing it quickly and efficiently. Do you contribute? Do you help him out on green ring at all? Is he one hundred percent on his own? And then and then related to that, are you guys using the greens book or is it all feet and feel?

It's all fit and feel for him. You know, he's very independent, especially with the grain. Yeah, no, he he did aim point a couple of years back and it's been the best thing for him. It's given him the confidence, you know, trusting the read at first when I when we first started, I was reading a lot of the parts because he wasn't a great green reader. And the tough part with caddies reading greens is.

It's all speed related.

Yes, you know, you can go from a cup to two cups out, you know, whatever it is. Whereas aim point, you know, he can feel the part whether it's a one, two, three percent slope and he's really good with his feet. So yeah, he's been doing aim point for the last couple of years. And you know, I stay out of the way once I get on that green, I'm looking for tomorrow's pin and trying to work.

Out where we want to be, where we don't want to be doing.

My prep work for the following day, and letting him do what he does on the green. So it's we've got a good little thing going at the moment, which is good.

Share caddy for a couple players in the LPGA tour years ago, and something I don't think people understand. The easiest caddy day Sunday that has the least amount of work in terms of what you're doing for sure, Like like I would watch these caddies, you know, especially the first couple events I did, walking off the dot for the next day and figuring out whole locations. You're doing so much work for the next round. You get the Sunday and obviously it's pressure packed. You're trying to win

Yeah, it's kind of nice sitting on the back of the grain and doing.

I wish, I wish he has a saint back days, I could just sit back and chill. But that's uh, you know, obviously Sunday's Sunday's you know, it's where you make your moves and try to win the golf tournament. But yeah, it's it's a lot more relaxed from that standpoint, and just let him do what he does and you know, hopefully dude like he did at the BAMW and finish it off well.

If he plays like he does at the BMW, he's gonna win a lot. Marty, You're you're a guy that pays a lot of attention. I wanted to go back to snacks for a minute. What is your snack situation on off course, because I feel like you're somebody that probably lays this out and has probably like counted calories and protein and things like that.

I've gone back and forth, you know, like lately, I've done the Intermitte fasting. So if my tea time is not before, like if I can go all the way to like two pm, so if I'm a late morning tea time, I don't eat anything. And that that was a big like I was used to get nervous about that, like I'm gonna run out of food. I need to keep fueling up. But I've done that for quite a while.

And what are you taken down? Like what are you eating on the course? What are you taking down?

I love macadamia nuts, macadamia nuts and olives. I do.

That's an interesting I even have something random, no.

These little olive snack packs super high fat, and I feel really good. I try to like use my intuition, like what foods I eat there, I feel really good. I love macadamia nuts, high fat and very salty and all of same thing I and I.

I love.

So there's there's really good ones from Trader Joe's coming, a little pack from Riding your Bag, perfect little snack.

I cannot wait until the twenty twenty four Masters when Shay's on thirteen just pounding some all He's.

Taking out a whole bag. Get a little j Shae.

We appreciate the time, Thank you so much. Congrats obviously on the recent success. Uh, you know, play well at the Ryder Cup. I guess we could say, you.

Know, if you guys, you guys can have your you're paying underwear on Listen.

I root for a good, solid team.

We don't get have a pighead on that late no olives there at the Rider.

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