Angie Colee (00:03):
Welcome to Permission to Kick Ass. The show that gives you a virtual seat at the bar for the real conversations that happen between entrepreneurs. I'm interviewing all kinds of business owners from those just a few years into freelancing to CEOs, helming nine figure companies. If you've ever worried that everyone else just seems to get it and you're missing something or messing things up, this show is for you. I'm your host, Angie Colee, and let's get to it. And welcome back to Permission to Kick Ass with me today is my friend Sena Wheeler. Say hi.
Sena Wheeler (00:37):
Hey. Happy to be here.
Angie Colee (00:39):
I'm so happy to have you. Well, Sena and I have been floating around each other's worlds for a couple of years now, and I'm so excited about what she's doing because I think you are the first and only guest to be in the business of doing what you do. And so tell us a little bit about what you do.
Sena Wheeler (00:54):
Well, it is a little bit unique. Um, my husband is a fisherman. We're from a fifth generation fishing family, so my husband's a fisherman. My dad was fishermen, my uncles were fishermen. My grandpa was fishermen. Mm-hmm. and on and on in Norway. And so, um, we sell his fish and other fish, uh, because we know a lot of fishermen tip
Angie Colee (01:15):
,
Sena Wheeler (01:16):
So we sell fish online, which, um, when we started eight years ago, that sounded kind of crazy. And we ship fish in the mail to your door, which also still sounds a little crazy to some people, although that's getting very normalized. I'd say. You get, um, frozen fish to your door and it, it's in packages and ready to cook up for dinner.
Angie Colee (01:38):
I love that. Uh, especially, it just, I've seen so many businesses pop up, especially in the last five years or so where people are like, you can do that online. You can sell fish online. Yes, you can sell fish online. You can sell meat online. You can sell any number of things. I think my favorite was, uh, tennis lessons and dog training, like dog agility training that you could learn online too. The internet has opened up a whole new frontier has made so many opportunities for people that might have otherwise been limited to like a locality or had to deal like in with your case if you overfished for the season and had too much product and can't ship it out elsewhere, like, oh my gosh, troubles. Right. So
Sena Wheeler (02:19):
Right.
Angie Colee (02:20):
Expansion.
Sena Wheeler (02:21):
Yeah. I mean, it's like an old fashioned industry of fishing, but doing it online makes it modern and it's been really cool to mer kind of merge the two and for our family members to go, oh, this is a new way of doing it.
Angie Colee (02:36):
. Yeah, . It's a whole new frontier. Digital marketing. Well, tell us a little bit about your adventures in growing online. I know that we were talking a little bit before we started recording about finding your voice and really getting comfortable with putting yourself out there in marketing.
Sena Wheeler (02:54):
Um, yeah, it's been really interesting. So we started, this is, I'll start with our starting, starting story. Um, sure. Just cause it's kinda funny. We're driving to Thanksgiving, um, and it's like a nine hour drive. And Rich was fishing at the time. We had three kids and I was, I have a, previously I was in food science, so I worked in food companies. Um, and then I was not working at the time. We lived really rural up in the mountains. And anyways, I'm going, rich is on the board for marketing Copper River Salmon, which he is what he is catching. And I'm telling him, I'm just in his ear going, well, you guys should do this and you should do that and should market it like grass fed beef and you should market it like this and do that. And he just finally looks over and goes, yeah, you should.
Sena Wheeler (03:39):
And I was like, no, you should because he's on the board. And he goes, no, you should sell my fish. Ooh. And I was like, oh, interesting. Because even prior to that, I got my master's degree in food science. So it was before I was working in food places. My master's degree is actually not just food science, but in fish handling. And I correlated actually how to handle the fish. Like I measured the omega threes of fish and then correlated onboard handling two sensory characteristics. Like, oh, you need to fully bleed the fish, chill it properly, you know, all those fine tunes. So I've been in his ear okay, for a long time, about how to properly handle the fish and, you know, chilling and all of this. So we, we pride ourselves that like he catches Copper River salmon, which is the best salmon in the world, and we handle it the best. So it's truly, when we say the best of the best, I mean, Oprah Winfrey should be eating this fish Yes. Of the best.
Angie Colee (04:42):
We're putting it out there, Oprah, I'm gonna be your favorite thing. You are gonna be her favorite thing. It's going to happen.
Sena Wheeler (04:49):
Yes, yes. .
Angie Colee (04:50):
Well, I love that. I mean, you and I have been working together for a couple of years, but I never knew that you almost fell into this. Like, it just seemed like such a family heritage and lineage thing. Five generations. I know that your kids go out on the boat with Rich. And so that's surprising to me that it started from you should do this, you should do that. No, you should.
Sena Wheeler (05:10):
Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, we've been fishing for generations, but the marketing aspect, I mean, fishermen sell their fish at the dock mm-hmm. , it gets loaded in with all the other fish and they can't, there's this real pride they have on the boat of how they're handling their fish, but once it's mixed in, it's mixed in mm-hmm. . And you can't be like, Hey, that was my fish you got at Costco, . You know?
Angie Colee (05:31):
Yeah.
Sena Wheeler (05:33):
And so for fishermen, a lot, like in in the fishing world, there is that, like, there's that pride over your own fish. You take it home and you deliver it to friends and family, you know what your home pack. And so, you know, it's kind of like extending that pride bigger. Like what if people could get our fish and we could really talk about like how special it is and how we handle it. So by the time we got to Thanksgiving dinner, we walked in and was like, we're starting a new business. And it's called c c .
Angie Colee (06:06):
Love it. Oh my gosh. And the crazy theme
Sena Wheeler (06:09):
Is that was Thanksgiving and in January, I mean, we did, that was the, you know, the wild thing is we just did it . Mm-hmm. .
Angie Colee (06:20):
Well, I love that you said that because I mean, all good movements, all things that, that most of us look at and bewilderment in awe and go, oh my gosh, that's amazing. It starts with an idea. It starts with believing that you can and then acting on it. Right. Because no dream is ever gonna come into fruition if, if you don't actually do anything or if you spend all your years planning. I, I am not gonna lie, I kinda love the fast action. Like so many people that have worked with me have seen how quickly I go from idea to execution, and it's like flipping a light . So I am a big fan of November idea January launch. Yes.
Sena Wheeler (06:56):
If we would've thought too hard about it, like we might not have done it. .
Angie Colee (07:00):
Yes. No, that's a great point. Sometimes there's a danger of overthinking when you're putting yourself out there. So like, yeah, let's just jump in and do it, figure it out as we go.
Sena Wheeler (07:09):
And for me, is my husband and I doing it together, rich And, um, he's the go guy and he's the no barriers person. And I am the logistics like, oh, well, you know, out how to chip fish, you know? And so we make a great team because he's like, already got the, he's going and he is getting the llc and we're going. And I'm like, okay. You know, I'm just holding on and going. Um, the first thing I did was sign up for a online business class mm-hmm. , um, delivered, uh, like video style. But that was huge because I learned how to do online stuff is because that I had no idea. In fact, at the time I was living rural, uh, we lived, um, I was home with the kids, but we lived in the mountains and we didn't even have proper internet. We have kinda like satellite internet where you can do email, but you can't download.
Angie Colee (08:07):
Mm.
Sena Wheeler (08:08):
So anyways, I'm doing this course. Well, it was the, it was Marie Folio's B-School, and I had had no idea it was, it was what I needed at that time. It might not be the, you know, surely not the only thing out there, but just the investment in what we're doing was huge. Mm-hmm. . And it was walked us through, and this is the crazy part. So we have barely on the internet, it's a, it's like videos. Well, I can't even download videos , except we have enough bandwidth at night. So from 8:00 PM to 8:00 AM you could watch videos, a stream of videos. And so when I signed up, I was like, oh, you know, it was a, it was a lot of money for us. We haven't even got the business off the ground. Like no money's coming in, you know, clearly. And, um, so that investment was huge, which is super important.
Sena Wheeler (09:05):
You know, I made that big investment and I was like, I'm gonna figure out how to do this. So I made a deal with myself, like, I have to get up at six in the morning to watch the videos and they have to do it by eight mm-hmm. or I'll be behind and I can't catch up till the next day, . And so that's what I did. And I feel like I have never followed through on a course so well, and is almost because of the constraint, which sounds crazy, but it's what worked. And so I'd get up at six in the morning and, um, you know, watch my video, do the homework, and then I would jump right over to the website they were building, you know, and, and immediately implement Yeah. What we were doing. And so that was huge. Made all the difference.
Angie Colee (09:50):
I I'm hearing so many amazing things there and like, I think it all underscores exactly what we said about not overthinking it or, or recognizing when you're falling into that trap. Because I hear so many people who wonder, can I even start a business? There's so much I don't know. And then I just hear you going, well, here are all of the things that are stacked against me. Could just throw up my hands and go, this is too hard to start this thing. Or I can make the use of the two hours I've got between six and 8:00 AM to watch these videos and invest in myself. And I'm a big fan of self-education as somebody who bought wholeheartedly into go to college and make something of yourself. My French and political science undergrad major don't really help me much in what I'm doing, aside from maybe some diplomatic skills. But, uh, where I really got into things was just two courses in grad school. And the rest of it, I'm like, I learned from experience, I learned from reading books, I learned from mentorship, and I learned from just not being afraid to ask questions and look dumb. I mean, sometimes I was afraid to look dumb. Oh, yeah. But
Sena Wheeler (10:57):
, that's huge. Well, that's, that's the thing. I love learning. I could consider myself a lifelong learner. I love learning. Like I, I could take courses, I love it. . Mm-hmm. , same thing with grad school. What I feel like I learned, like I'm not in my business, um, quantifying omega-3 acids. Yeah. You know, but I learned how to learn. I learned that I'm not afraid of learning. Uh, I truly believe if there is information out there, I can learn it love. And that's huge. I love that. Just, you know, faith that you can not just figure it out, but learn it.
Angie Colee (11:34):
I love that. And I think that's a totally different approach from what I see out there in the online education space, which I understand the healthy skepticism that a lot of people have, because you really have to vet the people that you're learning from and make sure that they actually know what they're talking about. Right. Anybody can start a course. It's a very low barrier to inter to to entry. But also by the same token, if you take this approach of I'm going to learn something regardless, instead of I'm going to guard the wallet until I'm absolutely sure no one is ripping me off. Um, right. I've that just comes from the thought popped into my head as you were saying that, that I've worked with so many people in the beginner end of the spectrum that are like, should I take this course?
Angie Colee (12:14):
Is it worth it? I can't tell you whether something is worth it or not. It's all going to come down to what you get out of it. What I can tell you is that I've invested in thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars of courses and masterminds, and some were better than others and some didn't really help me other than showing me what I probably don't wanna do with my business. But I went into that to it with that same headspace. I'm gonna see what I can get out of it. I'm gonna learn what I can learn. And that was a choice that had nothing to do with their teaching ability. So I just wanted to point that out to people.
Sena Wheeler (12:46):
Absolutely. And, and that continuation, you know, just like, there's always more to learn and to do. I mean, my, I I mean, there's a point, right? Cuz I, like, I could just like wanna pile it on and like, oh, I have no time to implement right now. I'm like going, you know what Sena you know what to do, just implement it. mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . But, um, so there's, you know, you can get into the trap, but for sure, I, I just feel like that, you know, when you're starting out learning that knowledge, like why figure it out? There's people ready to teach you.
Angie Colee (13:23):
Yes. Don't reinvent the wheel. Nobody needs a triangle wheel. Somebody out there has figured don't put your triangle wheel out there cuz you need to be different model on success model on what you see out there that is working. And there are plenty success leaves clues. If you see people that are showing up for years advertising in your feed. They've got either some independent wealth or they've figured out how to make enough money to pay for advertisement. That might be somebody to watch. Especially if their voice resonates with you. And I love that you mentioned action implementation time, because that's the other trap that I see where it's, I, I'm a lifelong learner too. If I could figure out, uh, some sort of job where I just got paid to like take courses and, and do that kind of work all the time, that would be my dream job. Read all of the books, study all the things. Yes. But unfortunately it doesn't work that way. So sometimes you gotta act on what you learn and nothing will burn those neural pathways into place faster than trying something. Especially if you fail at it the first few times. Right. So, if anything, I want anybody listening to this show to get comfortable with screwing things up and failing hard and fast. Cuz that's how you're gonna learn and do good things.
Sena Wheeler (14:31):
Absolutely. So I'm doing this course and, and you know, da da da da da, she says, um, start an email list mm-hmm. , and I don't, at the time, I don't even know what that is. I'm, I'm seriously like a what, like email list. You know, I'm living in the rural, in the mountains. Well, that's how I found, now that I know what an email list is, this is 2014, I'm not on very many lists. Well that's how I found B-School. I clicked on something Right. And I got this, like, now I know it was a series mm-hmm. . And now I know what it was. And it's beautiful that that's what got me, right. Because I didn't know. I thought this person was reaching out to me, . I have no idea. So anyways, it says start an email list. And I seriously went to my website person and said this thing said I need to put some sort of email list on.
Sena Wheeler (15:22):
I have no idea what that is. And um, so they put it on and um, then the thing told me, the course said start emailing people. Yeah. So I did and at the time there was like, uh, 40 people maybe, you know, that were my literal friends and family mm-hmm. , cause you know, all that was there. Um, and uh, so I started emailing them and I'm, I'm telling myself like, okay, I, I am sending this to my friends and family and I'm just telling them about what's going on. And I just did it. And that was huge because I just kept going. And the list is just kind of growing and in the background and I'm just kept my like, you know, I didn't worry about the numbers, but I just was like emailing, like I have my, my, my dad and my best friend. I just think of them. Mm-hmm. , I love that. And I, and I just kept writing. And so that's, that was huge too. I mean, I, I just would've created, like if I had gone on my own and gone like, oh, I'd like to sell fish online, it would look like, cuz I had a science background, it would look like some sort of fish encyclopedia, .
Sena Wheeler (16:40):
And you could click on things and it would tell you exactly what they were. There would've been no pictures of our family, no email. You know. And so it, it's, it, it's, um, interesting to me when I'm like, look back and go, that was important mm-hmm. that we created something that was authentic and about us. And the emailing in the beginning, like, you can only put so much about yourself on your website mm-hmm. , but it's emailing that over time kind of really brought the voice out on, what are we trying to say here? Who are we? And it's, it's those, it's like a, it's like a c c journal . Yeah.
Angie Colee (17:17):
Oh, I love that. A journal. Oh, yeah. And you could look back and kind of see the growth and which emails really resonated with people so that you can figure out which stories to keep telling. Oh man, there's so many good things that I heard there and I wanted to highlight a few. One was that everybody starts small. So I know a lot of folks that won't start an email list because it's like, or I've only got like 10 subscribers. Cool. Write to them as if you have the biggest list in the world. And again, through that lens of what you highlighted, I thought was so smart. One person, right. One person that I really care about. Because when you're selling to this faceless crowd and you're literally taking this, it's a different energy. Even the way that I look at it of I one person must sell to all of these people. I don't know, like a whole bunch of angst just hits me. That's, that's like a whole bunch of pressure. But when I think of it as well, I'm, I'm really excited about this thing that I'm doing. I'm putting an invitation out there for anybody else that's just as excited or maybe curious to join me. A lot of that pressure goes away and it just becomes much easier to do. Has that been similar for you?
Sena Wheeler (18:30):
Oh, a hundred percent. Even this just like, I like everybody else. Like I sell in every email now, but in be in the beginning like, like the idea that I am selling Phish in this email that seemed like, ooh, that's a little ugh. Mm-hmm. . But I did find it's really easy for me to talk about the pride I have in our fish. Yes. You know, the process and what we do. And so I could kind of like find those comfortable topics and just keep talking. ,
Angie Colee (19:02):
I love that. Like, finding what's easy for you to talk about. What's really easy for you to geek out about. Yeah. And to tap into some natural enthusiasm over, you'll never run outta stuff to talk about if you're looking for that stuff that really lights you up. Um, I find myself doing this often. Uh, and this just speaks to the level of marketing nerdery I indulge in, if you get me in a room with a whole bunch of marketers and business owners and we're just telling story just about our life, about our travels, not even necessarily anything to do with business, and somebody says something snappy, we all start going, there's your subject line that needs to be a story, that needs to be a story that you tell to people on your email list. They're gonna find that just as funny as I found that and you could use it to sell that. So like, we play that game in person ,
Sena Wheeler (19:50):
And now I feel like I know what you're, what you're saying and it's fun because I can go, well, this would be a fun story to tell. And then it's like, okay, now how do you sell fish with that ? Mm-hmm. .
Angie Colee (20:02):
That's, that's the thing to figure out how does it connect to what I wanna do? How can I help myself achieve the end goal here using this story? And sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't work. That's the fun of being a copywriter. I've been, I've trained folks before and told them, sometimes you have a great idea and you go, this would make a fantastic email. And then you sit down to write it and you go, nevermind. That's, there's just nothing here that's working the way that I hoped. We're gonna put that on the shelf and maybe later another situation will come along. That that story is perfect for no time spent working on your business is ever wasted in my opinion. There are just ideas that are right for right now and ideas that are maybe right for later.
Sena Wheeler (20:43):
I find that I'll sit down to write an email and I might have an idea. I write, I, I write one once ev a week. I write on Mondays. And that's taken me several years to get there. . Mm-hmm. , it was once a month and you know, then it was twice a month. And now I feel comfortable with once a week. And, um, but I'll, I have an idea and sometimes I just sit down and something totally different comes out and I'm like, yeah, well there we go. .
Angie Colee (21:11):
I'm a big fan of following the inspiration because, uh, you know, we talk in creative circles a lot about inspiration hitting. And I know that there's a big myth that if it's not flowing then there's something wrong with this idea. But I think it really starts with the discipline and the commitment to just, like you said, now I email once a week, I need to sit down and write something. I think I'm gonna go with this idea and then I start writing and it takes me in a different direction. Well, the different direction never would've come a about if you were waiting for inspiration. It came about because you sat down because you needed to do the thing. So to all of you who are like, I need to create things, but I need to wait for the circumstances to be right. And the, you know, Saturn to be in your anus or whatever,
Sena Wheeler (21:54):
, ,
Angie Colee (21:55):
The stars are not going to align. You need to put your butt in a chair. That's, that's the bad news. But the good news is it becomes a lot easier the more you put your button in a chair.
Sena Wheeler (22:04):
Yeah, I totally agree. And I feel like a lot of my best emails are what I call in my head deadline emails. .
Angie Colee (22:13):
Tell me a little bit more about that.
Sena Wheeler (22:15):
Most emails I write are deadline emails, uh, which means I'm writing them Sunday night, um, for Monday morning. Um, and that's probably not the best. It's better to be ahead. But, you know, I wrote one a couple weeks ago and it was, it was just this funny story. I did a recipe and it was, um, fish, it had lemon. And I did the recipe that weekend. Cause I was like, I don't know what I'm gonna write about. Like, I, you know, okay, I'll come up with a new recipe, that'll be fun. Plus I got a dinner anyways, you know mm-hmm. . And, um, and then while I'm doing the recipe, I used, I grabbed this honey and it was honey from our driver. And this story came to me and I mean, I had to run up and write it because our driver is like super, he drives our, he delivers our dry ice every week. Mm-hmm. And he's super surly and he's like super grouchy . And so anyways, it was just like, I was like, oh, I gotta, I gotta do this. And it wasn't until, you know, it's while I'm writing it. And then the very last line is like, you know, this recipe is just like Ron, you know, not too sweet . There's nothing
Angie Colee (23:23):
, kinda salty,
Sena Wheeler (23:25):
Kinda salty . I put lemon in. It's like, anyways, it, oh, it barely cracks a smile. Anyways, it was really funny. And it's just one of those things that it was like, your mind is too lazy to fully come up with that until you have to mm-hmm. . If you're sitting down and this email has to go out, out, you're like, oh, da da da da da and that. Then it flows . Mm-hmm. . But it's flowing. Cause you have to Yeah. I think that if I just wrote when I felt like it, um, I would have like two things go out a year.
Angie Colee (24:02):
Yeah. Well, and I th that's the important thing too, for anybody that struggles with creativity or thinks maybe I'm not creative because I don't hit a flow state. This is like going to the gym. And that is like the uns sexiest thing that I could ever say about creativity. Because most of us picture some sort of magical download from the universe, but the stronger you make those muscles, the easier it is to do the heavy lifting. So you gotta get in there and force yourself to put two ideas together and come up with the connections and see how you can make things fit. And to create things. You gotta spend time creating things, not just con consuming things. I'm off my soapbox .
Sena Wheeler (24:40):
I love that soap back then. Actually I'm like taking that in because one of my things is I never considered myself creative. Hmm. I, I, I like was I'm the scientist mm-hmm. and my family's creative. So my mom is an, is an artist, my sister is a musician. Like mm-hmm. , like, I'm like, they are creative. And um, my sister said something like, everybody's an artist. And I'm like, yeah, not, not me. ,
Angie Colee (25:08):
I agree with your sister. I think that there are all kinds of creativity and that there is a lot of that. I think that's the common interpretation. The one that you have that like creatives are artists and painters and dancers and folks that do pure like creative visual or physical arts. But I think that there's creativity in every industry out there. You could be a creative scientist, you can be a creative engineer, you can be a creative mathematician. That's how all the innovation and excitement happens in our world. Because there are creative people everywhere. You look in every single industry. And it doesn't matter what level your training is. Like if you can find the connection between two things that don't seem to be related on the surface, that is my definition of creative. I think you are definitely a creative, and I'm gonna call . I'm gonna call a loving BS on that. You are one of the most creative people I have ever had the privilege of working with. So there we go.
Sena Wheeler (25:59):
Oh well thank you . I love that. Cause I've realized that like my cooking is creative. Mm-hmm. . And I can finally say, because I never wanted, I never thought I was a writer. I never wanted to write, I never was interested. I was kind of scared of it. And I can say that like, my writing is creative. So it's like, yeah, thank you. I'll take that .
Angie Colee (26:20):
Yes, absolutely. If creative is, if creative is something that you aspire to be, you want to be able to describe yourself as creative, then just go create things. Create drawing that you, you traced over with paper. Like you made that, even if you traced it, like get out there and start building that creative muscle. And you can definitely call yourself a creative even if you're just a beginner. That's all I'm saying. And I was gonna circle back to what you talked about, about how you just jumped into writing these emails. And Yes, it wasn't every week at first you built up that muscle again, but you started talking about things that you geeked out about. And before we started recording, I was telling you about how it took me years to find the comfort with being myself, which is kind of interesting cuz I've had people approach me after listening to the show and like, you're so confident and there's this personality and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Angie Colee (27:11):
Like, no, I explicitly remember going to a business conference meeting with people. I was there in the blazer and the button down, the tattoos and the piercings were covered. I was doing my best not to drop F-bombs in person and just being kind of generally a wallflower cuz that was what I had been taught a quote unquote professional was like, just keep your thoughts to yourself. Listen more than you talk all of this jazz. And I was telling Sena, I wish they could see the face because I was, I was at a bar. That is how all the good stories start. Right? Uh, I had a couple drinks and so the, the walls of self-protection came down a tiny bit. And I still don't know to this day how the story came up, but I wound up telling a story about how I got into a mosh pit fight in my twenties.
Angie Colee (27:54):
And I , I literally remember watching these people that I hadn't, I'd been thinking about this for days. How do I build connections with these people? How do I network beyond throwing business cards at them? And I watched them lean in and literally go, who is this Angie ? What, how do I not know this about you? And I'm like, oh yeah, I mean, there's a lot that I don't really talk about out there. And they're like, oh, like what? I need to know more. Like I, I've got a lot of large colorful tattoos. No way. Show me now. Oh my. And then we're comparing in a bar all the ink that all of these people have strategically covered up because we're at a business event. And that was really the first time that I started to see that there's power in being yourself. Right. We talk often about attraction marketing and repulsion marketing and it still feels deeply uncomfortable as a human to be rejected by someone. Yeah. But to me, the trade off is that you get, you, you trade out the people that hate you and the lukewarm people that were never really going to get involved in what you're doing for super fans who are like, I love everything you're doing.
Sena Wheeler (29:02):
Absolutely.
Angie Colee (29:03):
Be yourself.
Sena Wheeler (29:03):
And that's huge. And it's like, that's this, the authenticity, uh, like that word alone, just, it just seems, it rings shallow to me because you hear it so much, but it's like mm-hmm. . Ok. What does being authentic really mean? And it's like figuring out well for you, what does this mean? I mean, how do you just be yourself? Um, and, and do it in a business? Like, um, I just shared, you know, most seen sea fishes posts like on social about fish and I just shared, um, a reel we did on spring break and shocker, there's no fish in it. Mm-hmm. , but Well it's fun and people love to see the family and see what we're up to and that stuff.
Angie Colee (29:47):
Yeah. And I think that's a good gauge too, right? Because if there's something that you would naturally feel called to share anyway, like your natural personality counts for a lot. And when we talk about authenticity, I think where people get all wrapped up and confused is that they think that there's one brand of authenticity and it's the person that had a meltdown in the shower this morning and and is coming in to show you what the real side of business looks like. Look, if you're a private person and you would never publicly share to anyone that you had a crying jaunt this morning, don't feel the need to do that in the name of marketing that's not authentic to you.
Sena Wheeler (30:21):
Yeah. That's also not authentic
Angie Colee (30:23):
. Yeah. I remember talking to someone once that, that she was struggling with something like that. Everybody's telling her authentic be, you know, be authentic because she had kind of service level business stuff and wasn't really building that connection. And she kinda, uh, she kinda lost it and it was a private mastermind call, but you know, she kind of got really upset cuz she's like, I know that y'all want me to tell stories. I don't feel comfortable telling, I don't wanna share that part of my life. This is not stuff I wanna talk about in business. And so I piped up and told her, can you talk about the struggle with what to share? That's not sharing anything from your personal life, but it is sharing something personal that you can use to connect with people and they're gonna resonate with that. Because I guarantee there are other people out there going, how do I talk about my business if I don't wanna share these personal stories? So I'm like, my definition of authenticity and realism seen as definition of authenticity and realism, everybody's out there is going to be different. Do what you feel comfortable doing. That's exactly what we mean by authentic.
Sena Wheeler (31:19):
Exactly. And for me, it's like talking about our family and and realizing that that's, that's it is like a part of our brand. It's a part of our messaging. It's, it's our lifestyle and our fishing story is a family story. It's mm-hmm. , it's us going up to Alaska and it's us being on the boat. And so, um, you know, building that in and, and that's the piece that I think that I just, without the email, you know, it's the piece that I would've missed mm-hmm. is that putting ourselves into it and you know who we are and what we're doing and Yeah. It doesn't need to be your, um, every moment .
Angie Colee (32:00):
Yeah. It's funny, I had two things. Um, one was that my favorite email from, uh, from you that I think I ever read was the fact that like you were going to your son's wrestling tournament and you were wondering whether, uh, it was cheating because you fed him such good fresh s like that is so brilliant. You can't ever tell me you're not creative again. That's not allowed. Not after that email .
Sena Wheeler (32:24):
Um, well that was a big moment for us. Like you're saying what lines like, like I show the family and I show us on the boat and I show us fishing. Like I don't like have every soccer game on Scene A sea. Mm-hmm. , you know, like that would be oversharing. But we're a big wrestling family. My husband wrestled in college, he's the wrestling coach. My son wrestles, I wrestled in high school. Wow. And like, if you know us in real life, you know, we're a wrestling family and so it, I've done a couple emails on wrestling and that's where I felt like, I mean, you know Yeah. How deep do you go? Right. But for us, it's a big part of what we are. My husband's a fisherman and in the off season he's a wrestling coach. Mm-hmm. and that's a, a big part of him. And he runs his boat and his fish processing like a wrestling team . Nice. So really I'm glad you brought that one up cuz that was kind of like, okay, well we gotta let this side of us in too.
Angie Colee (33:20):
Mm-hmm. random, random non-sequitur. Have you ever seen that movie Fighting With My Family? It's one of my favorites. No, .
Sena Wheeler (33:27):
Oh,
Angie Colee (33:28):
It's, it's the story of W w e I don't think that exists anymore. I'm not, no, I'm not the hugest wrestling fan ever. But, uh, there was this star in the, the nineties early odds named Paige, um, who was one of the first like alt female wrestlers, very goth looking, everybody ga made fun of her because she, she didn't look like all the other, you know, bikini model esque type wrestlers out there. But this is a story about, you know, she's from England with this family out of Norwich that they're all obsessed with wrestling and have created their own wrestling group. And she gets a shot at this pro wrestling tour and it's got Vince Vaughn and it's got the Rock and Florence Pugh if you're a fan of her. Like, it's just such a, there's a lot of swearing and a lot of colorful language we will say that. But it's such a great feel good movie. It's one of my favorites that just reminded, we're a wrestling family. I'm like, yeah, I
Sena Wheeler (34:18):
Wrestling family. Ok. That's a whole nother level of wrestling.
Angie Colee (34:22):
. That's that's true. It's such an interesting flick I
Sena Wheeler (34:25):
Wrestling on the map. But yes, that's a whole nother level and I'm gonna watch it. .
Angie Colee (34:29):
Yeah. That's the, that's the theatrical side of wrestling, which I know is different from the kind of wrestling that you're talking about, but it's, that's interesting. Well and another thing that you brought up when you were talking about emailing is this factor of trust, which, you know, circles back to what we were talking about with people and skepticism and they're aversion to learning cuz they're afraid of either messing up or being ripped off. But like your journey to here and the growth of your business, which I wanna circle back on cuz I think your growth story is fantastic is from seeing Marie Folio and trusting there's a reason that she's telling me this email list is a thing, so I'm gonna try it and see what happens. And moreover, I don't even know if this is a conscious thought or not, but I'm gonna try it and keep trying it for a while. Not just throw one out half-heartedly to see what happens and then go, Nope, that failed.
Sena Wheeler (35:16):
Right. Yeah, I think that that's huge and you know, finding mentors that you can trust and I've gone through several like, you know, there's always somebody that I'm looking towards, but it is, there's that trust, but it is like, yeah, you can't throw out one email and go, eh, that didn't work. You're great. You dunno what you're talking about. You know, if you're gonna try it, you know, commit and, and do it.
Angie Colee (35:43):
Yeah. Commit to a certain timeframe and tell yourself, if I see I'm gonna give it my all, not just, I'm gonna do just enough to see if it works. Right. Uh, to quote Ron Swanson, don't half a couple things, whole one thing, whole the thing that you're trying to do, but you're all into it. And if after three months, six months, whatever, you see nothing from it or even negative returns, then I think it's fair to say, yeah, that doesn't work for me or it doesn't work for me for right now. But yeah, you don't have enough data to make a decision about whether or not this works if you're not even fully trying. Come
Sena Wheeler (36:14):
On. Right. And that, that's the other thing I I kinda tell myself is if you pay for advice, take it . Yeah. .
Angie Colee (36:25):
That's something I have talked to my business partner about cuz I, it drives her nuts sometimes that, that there are folks that will ask for advice and you give them advice and then they don't wanna do it. Totally fair. That's exactly what humans do. But in her mind it's like, but I gave them the solution, why won't they try it? And I'm like, I don't know. Cuz people are people and sometimes they just don't do the things. And this is, this is proven brain science right. That a certain subset of people buy the thing and then they get the dopamine hit from buying the thing and then they will no longer do anything from it because it feels like the problem is solved even if it hasn't because they bought the thing that will solve the problem. It's a weird, interesting twisted world of logic that you really, especially if you're trading in knowledge or, or consulting or coaching or anything like that, you can't let it get under your skin because a lot of people are gonna pay a lot of money to do nothing with that. But I agree with you that like, get something out of it, put as much as you can into it. Get up at 6:00 AM and watch some videos and see if that helps because I, I really truly believe that like the right idea at the right time can change not only your entire life but the world
Sena Wheeler (37:34):
. Right. I'm with you there. Yeah. Mm-hmm. for sure. Mm-hmm. ,
Angie Colee (37:38):
I mean like, the only reason that we're even here is because in 2009 in a screenwriting class, one woman told me, I just interviewed a man who wrote this book, I think you would like, and a year or two later, when I got laid off from my job, my brain suddenly went, remember that book from a couple years ago? You need to go read that now. Oh. So I went and got that book and then jumped wholeheartedly into this world of copywriting and then from there joins these teams and then I wound up on a stage at an event where somebody said you should have a podcast. Like it was all just following the breadcrumbs wherever they lead, putting everything into it and trusting that it's all gonna work out the way that it's supposed to. Yeah, yeah,
Sena Wheeler (38:20):
Yeah. A hundred percent. Because you can't, um, like I would love to see the whole trail. I would love know, but you do have to have faith that, you know, you don't, you might not know the next step and take the next, you know what my good friend says the next right step and have faith that another will appear. And so, you know, I couldn't envision what we were exactly building, but it took a lot of faith and the, the key is I wouldn't have envisioned it as great as it is. So. Yeah.
Angie Colee (38:55):
Oh I love that. I think that's the important thing. Like circle that, highlight it, underline it, put it on a mug that sometimes if you just learn to put your all into everything and know where you want to go, but detach from the outcomes, do your best and see what happens. That you could come, you could find out that things are even better than you could have ever possibly imagined because you didn't have enough context to imagine the possibilities. Just like let things happen. Yeah. Don't fight for control so much.
Sena Wheeler (39:25):
Yeah. Yeah. If you control it so much, you might be keeping it small, you might not be doing everything, you know, it could go better than you could have imagined. So
Angie Colee (39:36):
Yeah. Speaking of better than you can imagine, tell us a little bit about your growth, cuz I know that we kind of jumped from Idea November website launched in January to now I'm an email pro, but like, tell us about whatever you're comfortable sharing. I'm not asking for specifics necessarily, but how, how's it going? How's the business?
Sena Wheeler (39:53):
New breadcrumb? It's going really well. Um, uh, when we started, we started small and like I say, we didn't have grand a vision mm-hmm. . We just, we had a medium vision and
Angie Colee (40:08):
Ambition.
Sena Wheeler (40:08):
You know, one of the things that was the, the, the big why for us was, you know, we wanna get our fish out to people, we want people to try it. It's that pride. But like then the really personal reason, like why am I getting up at 6:00 AM you know, we wanted to have rich home more often. We wanted to, um, in, instead of having him, you know, to make money for our family to fish more and more and more, we wanted to do more with what he's catching. And so for us it was that really strong why has really propelled us because we're passionate about that. I'm, he's gone six months of the year. I'm passionate about making it mm-hmm. , it's not anymore. And you know, we're still working towards less. Yes. Um, but when we started, you know, I w we were shipping like, um, I was, I was working at the school too with the kids and, and Id go in a half day and I would ship like four boxes on a Monday and um, we had this little freezer and I'd like set up my folding table and print the orders out and do it.
Sena Wheeler (41:10):
It was this little half day activity that I did. And um, you know, now we're sent shipping out, you know, an average of like 40 on a Monday. Just a normal Monday. And so that's, you know, and we have it so streamlined that we can do that. I have one, uh, one shipping guy that helps and, and our, our processes are so streamlined that like, that's easier to accomplish the 40 a a day than the four. Cuz I was like stressed out about going, running around. I go to the grocery store and get the dry ice and now we have a, a truck that comes in and delivers it. And so for me, a big part of it is like, I just wanted to, like, I'm a streamliner, I'm a logistics person. Like I just wanna, I want this to work mm-hmm. Day in and day out.
Sena Wheeler (41:57):
I want the shipping to happen every week without me waking up and going, oh my God, I gotta ship on this mission. Like I just, I want the systems in place so it feels really good and really smooth now. But what we did was we just kept going that first year. I, I mean we knew 90% of the people that bought the fish and thankfully because we had a lot of hurdles on shipping. Mm. A lot of fish arrive not perfect, you know, and we had to learn a lot. And then we just ticked up from there. We're also doing farmer's markets and then, um, and that was until Covid, we, I mean we were doing like 12 farmer's markets a week around the state. Holy cow. Cow. So that really helped. Like we had our online, but online is slow mm-hmm. . And so it really helped, um, like while online was slowly growing, we, we had this other thing and then, um, covid hit and, um, we didn't do any more farmer's markets and our shipping quadrupled Yeah. On its own organically from people getting on their computer and searching, you know mm-hmm. like, I don't know what they searched ship fish to my door.
Angie Colee (43:08):
,
Sena Wheeler (43:10):
We
Angie Colee (43:11):
Can can help you figure that out, what they were searching for. But that's, that's so great. And I think that just shows that like not being married to the outcomes presents itself with all of these opportunities. And you know, if you spend too much time looking at crap, we lost all of our farmer's markets, what do we do now? Then you might miss all of the people going, wait, I can buy fish online.
Sena Wheeler (43:32):
Yeah. Oh absolutely. And I, and it's what I wanted, the farmer's markets is a ton of work. Um, it was great cuz you're interacting with the customer. Like that's how I know what people want, you know mm-hmm. from that time. So it was a really great thing to do, but I was so glad to drop that and it felt like, you know, everybody was pivoting at that time and everybody was figured out and it, and it was like for the first time, I mean, we were like, oh, well we already, uh, know how to ship to your door. We're, we're actually really ready for this. We also have a fish plant up in Alaska. And the equipment wise, like we had already doubled down on small six ounce packages that are direct to consumer. Like we don't do a lot of grocery stores, full filets restaurants. We, we do stuff that the consumer is direct to consumer, so they're gonna open that package themselves. Mm-hmm. and then it was like everybody's going, oh, we can't sell to restaurants and grocery stores. It's all direct to consumer. And, and so we had already, like, that's the business we'd already been really honing in on. And so we felt like, uh, wow, we kind of already have this going and figured out mm-hmm. , um, which is, which is, I mean, that was luck. It's cool to be on the right side . Yes,
Angie Colee (44:47):
Yes. Timing does play a factor in all of this stuff too. I mean, but for sure. But I also wanna give you credit for this because it was not only following your instincts and taking that fast action and learning what you can and investing in yourself, it was also realizing where the opportunity was. And like I said, not staring at that closed door of, well this is the way we did our business and now it's gone crap. It was just like, hoo hoo. But we've been building toward this and we're better equipped to handle it than everybody else out there, so come to mama.
Sena Wheeler (45:19):
Right. It was like, oh, this is a pivot. We're been waiting on . But I would say also there's points where we were working with, uh, like a place where you get the, uh, I don't wanna say distributor, but like a different online and you, you know mm-hmm. , we could be in their box and stuff like that. And there was times where they were like, Hey, don't worry about the website or anything you're doing. Just pass us all your fish and we'll do all your marketing for you and we'll we'll do you mm-hmm. . And there were moments when the shipping was hard mm-hmm. and everything was hard where it's like, oh, that would be a lot easier. And then through covid, like they went and they really shifted. And if we would've, if we would've taken that kind of easy road of like, okay, um, we would have dropped with them mm-hmm. . And so it makes me really glad that we kept kind of owning our brand and own owning our, they weren't gonna like buy the brand, but like we, we kept investing in the website and the online sales even when it was hard. Mm-hmm. cause it was there, you know, it's just like slowly building and it that, that I feel really glad that we made that, that choice to be like, no, we wanna remain in control of our whole thing. Mm-hmm.
Angie Colee (46:41):
. Oh, I love that too because I mean, I think anybody that's been in business long enough is going to encounter that at some point where somebody's like, I can take you to the next level and just let me handle it. I'll make it so easy for you. I know how hard it is to be in business. Just let me handle it. Right. And something in your gut goes, wouldn't it be nice to just ooh, lobb it over to somebody and let them carry it for a while, but then that, that louder part of you goes , but maybe it's hard for a reason and I should really be doing this cuz do they care about this as much as I do? I dunno.
Sena Wheeler (47:14):
Right.
Angie Colee (47:15):
Oh man, this has been fantastic and I could talk to you all day long. I think we're just gonna have to book a part two and keep geeking out over this. But for now, tell us where we can buy some of this fresh, fantastic fish.
Sena Wheeler (47:27):
Oh yes. Well definitely go to our website is Senasea.com S e N A s E A, um, and get on our, um, email list because that's where I love to communicate with people. Mm-hmm.
Angie Colee (47:41):
, it is the best. I am totally biased, but it is very, very much earned. Sena has the best stuff. She and her family care a whole lot about getting you the best possible seafood. So go check it out. I'll make sure that they have clickable links in the show notes. And thank you so much for joining me today.
Sena Wheeler (47:58):
Thank you.
Angie Colee (48:01):
That's all for now. If you wanna keep that Kick Ass energy high, please take a minute to share this episode with someone that might need a high octane dose. If you could do it. Don't forget to rate, review and subscribe to the permission to Kick Ass podcast on Apple Podcast Spotify and wherever you stream your podcast. I'm your host, Angie Colee and I'm here rooting for you. Thanks for listening and let's go Kick Ass some.