Paul Murray Live | 14 October

From the Sky News Center.

This is Paul Murray Live.

Hello, good evening, Thanks so much, Sherry, and welcome to the program. James Burrow here sitting in one more night for the great Man on Paul Murray Live. But do not fret, because guess what, We've got another huge show for you tonight. Matt Canavan and Sam Crosby are here duking it out on Monday Night Fights Plus. Just quietly, I don't want to speak too soon, but I think

I'm very focused on continuing the late a majority government. My government has a record that we're very proud of, a record that's cut inflation in half.

Yeah, okay, sure he can say that now, but remember this from earlier this year.

We haven't lost to go back to Nemesis, we haven't lost in news, Paul, since I've been priming this stuff.

Yeah, well, what a difference six or eight months makes, Because it's funny. As he was talking about the ABC program about the Liberals called Nemesis. In the process there, he committed a great act of hubris. And I won't be the first one to tell you that in saying those words, he made a rod for his own proverbial back and it was only natural things would catch up to him. Look, let's take a look at where we are now as a nation since Ethny Albanesi's labor government

Look at the end of last year.

As I said before, you had suffered a number of reverses, as I noted, particularly the Voice referendum.

Do you now feel that with this you have got your mojo back?

I never lost it, Sarah, It's not what the pole said. Well, actually they were ahead head. We haven't lost. To go back to nemesis, we haven't lost the News poll since I've been priming and stuff.

Well, past is prologue, there isn't it. Look talk about clueless, talk about out of touch. So what do you recond Labor proposes to do about all this? Well, how do you think they're going to go into this campaign? What are you going to be the big issues they're going to fight for? How are they going to convince Australians that they should give them another goal, give them that majority government that Anthony Albanezi keeps bucking up his party

We're focused, we're doing the right thing. It's a very close it's a very close poll. And what I would say is as as an election approaches, people remember what it was like to have a liberal government. They'll remember Robodebt, They'll remember the secret ministries, they'll remember sports roats, they'll remember car park routs. They'll remember what it's like to have a liberal government.

This this is the big idy of folks. Sports roots, car park roots, the secret ministry stuff, all of the s Scott Morrison stuff. Talk about fighting the asked war. People are hurting out there, the cost of living is through the roof, the society is coming a part of the seams and what is Labour's plan here? They're gonna campaign, They're gonna fight against Scott Morrison. I mean, the only thing there that Taddy Plivers that didn't say is they're gonna say, hey what about you know, I don't hold

The incidents were limited to a handful of apartment conflex apartment complexes, and the mayor said, our dedicated police officers have acted on those concerns. A handful of problems.

Only, Martha, do you hear yourself? Only a handful of apartment complexes in America were taken over by Venezuelan gangs, and Donald Trump is the problem and not Kamala Harris's open border. Americans are so fed up with what's going on, and they have every right to be.

And I really find this exchange, Martha's sort of interesting because you seem to be more focused with nitpicking everything that Donald Trump has said rather than acknowledging that apartment complexes in the United States of America are being taken over by violent gangs.

Just a handful of apartment complexes. I mean, come on, what are people so upset about? Think of the vibrancy and the cuisines that are being brought in by these Venezuelan gangs. And I'll tell you what. Jd. Vance is absolutely onto something there, because had those apartment complexes been in someplace like Arlington, Virginia, next to Washington, DC, you know, I think people like Martha Raddits would care, but there were Colorado, Well what do they care about that? Inside

About a third of the construction workforce in this country is Hispanic. Of those, a large portion are undocumented. So how do you propose to build all the housing necessary that we need in this country by removing all the people who are working in construction. I mean, I'm not arguing in favor of illegal immigration. I'm asking how you would deal with the knock on effect of your proposal to remove millions of people who work in a critical part of the economy.

Well, I think that what you would do is you would take, let's say, for example, the seven million prime age men who have dropped out of the labor force, and you have a smaller number of women, but still millions of women prime age who have dropped out of the lay labor force. You you absolutely could re engage folks into the American labor market.

This is I think to work in construction.

Of course, you could.

To work in construction. Oh my god, the horror. How icky? Who would want to work in construction? My word? This mentality, though, of the New York Times bubble, and it's the same thing here in Australia, by the way, is so telling, but it's also self defeating because, as the Wall Street Journal reported this week, guess who the new millionaire class

Look definitely not getting ahead of anything here, James. Look, I think we're very happy to be in a competitive position.

We do you think we can.

Win the next election, but we are and we'll remind underdogs it almost never happens that our first term government is tossed out, so it's a very very difficult exercise. We have a lot of saits we've got to win, but we've just got to focus on what we've been doing the last couple of years, and that is pointing out at the failures of this government that seems lost, especially since they lost the Voice last year, and we do need to provide an alternative. I think Peter dunt

Now.

There are a lot of specific issues here with the Queensland government, but some issues do hold over to the federal level as well, and that's a high energy prices, high cost of living and a lack of solutions on building enough houses just for people to live in this country.

Yeah, Sam, when I'll go back to that little bit of played there in the editorial where Albanize he said, and you could almost feel everybody tense up when that first happened. You know, hey, I've never lost a newspap. That's like almost begging for that clip to be played

Look, I think that was a year ago when the Voice was lost.

I think there was a lot of soul searching in our team of people thinking, you know, what do we just spend the last year doing. I got to say, I think for the last couple of months, I think they have been shaping up to be a lot more election election ready, you know, I mean Matt made the point that it's it's very hard for first term governments

Or do you deserve to go round again?

And I think generally speaking, even though people, yes, I agree this poll is not a good news for Labor, but I think generally speaking, people will look at it when they go to vote and they'll think, has the Liberal Party changed sufficiently so that the party that I kicked out three years ago?

Are they happy? You know?

Are they ready to be brought back in now? And has the current government done enough to be re elected? My general vibe is they, you know, in the next six months or three months or how long we've got to go. I think my general vibe is yeah, I think you're going to see a re elected Labor government.

Yeah.

But I mean that's sort of James basically basically their re election pitch. The re election pitch is going to be, Look, we might be pretty crap, but we're not as bad as the skull and government on the depression. That's that's going to be their pitch. Like I mean, that was a pretty like I like, Sam. I think it does a good job with hard materials at times.

But they haven't got a lot to rest on.

If all they're saying is, look, we're still better than the other team are in a very vulnerable position because they really haven't delivered much.

They haven't delivered on their promises.

To that.

In our country's history.

Gentlemen, let me just put this to you. Let me just take what matters there, Sam, and put this to you here. You know, if the proposition is that Australians generally return a government for a second term, and you see people like Tanny Pleusk out there saying, hey, look, you know it's all about the sports wars. People remember how bad things were. But that's not really a recipe for saying, you know, here's something positive.

Pro am absolutely absolutely, and maybe what are we going to do?

Sure? Sure, And that shouldn't be the campaign that Labour runs on.

I couldn't agree with you more.

They're going to need to outline what they're going to do for the second term. And you know I've been saying for the last I don't know, four or five years of coming on this show, it needs to be housing, housing, housing, housing, that's got to be the centerpiece of it. But to Matt's point that he made in his opening salvo, you know, okay, nuclear power, you've released a two page document on nuclear power.

What else? You know?

What else is the is the opposition proposing makes them worthy of having.

I'm happy to take that up.

Look, obviously we'll have a lot more policies to come before the next election. But another thing we've identified is up to ninety billion dollars of savings this government has racked up, including a massive green spending boon, doggles which are not working, like hydrogen, just wasting your money, adding to inflation, the the employing thirty thousand public.

Servants in two years extra.

These are extra public service, costing up to nearly seven billion dollars a year on the payroll, growing every year. We've identified those savings because the most important thing to do right now is to cut the cost of living for people, and a big way to do that is to cut government spending.

So that's another policy.

Another policy is to bring migration down to around one hundred and sixty thousand a year net migration, it's sitting at five hundred thousand right now, more than double what we normally take in. That has obviously added to the housing challenges and pressures we've got. We've got a serious plan to bring that down and create space for Australians first to have a roof over their head. So they're

Yeah, but I mean, Matt, it's just on that though. You know one thing that we've seen and actually to both of you guys, those numbers here that we heard about earlier when I was speaking about the numbers about people just being completely disheartened and depressed about their idea

Look, I can't speak for the College and I ever roll but a lot of this week James Albe at a High Minorship Senate inquiry that my colleague g Andrey Bragg has ticked off, and we are looking at otherwise we can do. Apart from just that Margreiston show, I think that'll be the most directed, quick thing that can be done people in the housing market. But obviously there are other things as well. One big issue with the moment is the lending requirements that have been put in

Borders in such an uncontrolled way.

Well, and Sam, if you looked at the graph that I put up when I was doing my editorial, there was a point there where showed how the construction starts, the approvals, all of that have been down over the last few years. Part of that'll be COVID, part of that'll be this that.

The large part of that is COVID.

Well, a large part of that is COVID, but at the same time that you know.

I mean the housing industry stopped for two years.

Well I know though, the housing industry didn't stop because because my next door neighbor has a building company, he was out there. He was the only person I knew who could go to work. So housing start.

Look at look at the rights of building completions over that time. It fell through the floor. Sure, fell through the floor the two years. That wasn't the kinder didn't shut down the building industry. No, it wasn't COVID. It was the developers thinking, oh well, no one's going to need to buy, No one's going to want to live in houses. Just look at the data. Don't don't take my word for it. Look at the data.

It completely opposite.

Everyone wanted a backyard, didn't I Everyone want to the back out, everyone to get out of apartments. I think definitely it's the red type and taxes that's what's killed the construction industry. And now biber parties come on on top of that and added industrial relations charges changes as well, which made it much harder for the construction sect. If we want to build new buildings, we've got to let people build new buildings.

It's as simple as that.

At the moment, we lower them up with red tape, we load them up with these local government taxes and charges, and then we load them up with all these labor laws which effectively give the unions to say not the actual building companies who can build houses thing actually don't build buildings. Well, building companies build bildings. We need to take the pressure off them.

This is this is I think. I think you know part of what Matt says there that state that's local stuff. That's the stuff, you know. But the big issue here though, with two things I think are part of this, that the federal government has a big say it. Number one, that's our laws, and I've spoken to an awful lot of people who have smaller building companies to see they're very adversely effected by this. And number two, there's the

If you want to get right down into the into the weeds of it, you must get in the union movement has very little coverage when it comes to residential development, very little coverage. They are in big infrastructure projects, they are in big CBD office developments. They are just generally not in suburban you know.

The problem is it flows down when you, yeah, you, when you lift wages in the construction sector way beyond or conditions as well, way beyond what's sustainable, like is happening in Queensland with a ridiculous infrastructure requirements.

On large products.

As you say, when they get extra when they extra conditions and terms like they don't have to turn thement. It rains all this stuff that flows down through the sector as well, it adds costs for everybody because all all those builders, including a large T one, so competing for the same people in the industry. Now, look, I want to see people earn more money, and this is what the labor place are You was one of people

This is the point math there's the point of what puts seventy because this is this is I think that gets to sort of a broader issue here with which is that you know, with this government people say it's not just construction, but you know, public sector employment chases out private sector employment. You know, union wages lift the cost of doing business anywhere.

And.

Refer to what is what is the answer to that is labor growing the public sector to the detriment of the private sector. Is it growing union power to the detriment of moms and dads?

So sorry, one second, we're saying that it's it's uh, the SAFEU is driving up the cost of housing projects, and now it's public servants are crowding out.

I don't think that it's a general sort of sense of sense.

You said you wanted to speak specific Okay, specifics. They're not starting up a federal government housing company. They're not going out there and competing with the private sector to build.

No.

But the NDI s though, if you look at the latest employment figures, growth a different segment. Most of the most of the privates, most of the growth in jobs now is all in the public sector.

So sure, but you conlating, you're conflating completely different sections of the economy. And to Matt's point about wages, I am proudly saying that this is this, This government should be about high wage growth. For the first time in I don't know my my living adult memory, we've actually got wages growth fall.

Right direction, except I haven't gone out except for that, you know, Madam wants you to answer this. You because is it true though that per capita GDP in this country is going backwards and that our living standards are going backwards and there's some of the most backwards looking in the Oe City. Am I wrong about this map? Do you tell me.

Per capital per capita GDP has fallen for the last six quarters. Now, that doesn't mean a lot to a lot of people. Obviously, what matters is wages what Sam was talking there. What's happened though on your real wages? So your your take home pay has gone up in dollar terms, as Sam was saying, But of course everyone knows, so has the price of everything. And so after you take into account inflation, under this labor government, we have had a record fall in real real wages. There are

I've come on this show for months and had you guys claim that inflation is one hundred percent the creation of this government, completely ignoring that what was it three hundred billion dollars of inflationary spending that happened during.

Toast Sam, No, you made a claim. You made a claim that people's wages going up.

You're wrong.

That claim was wrong.

I am not saying it. And you cannot sit here and blame the light of government for inflation. That's just not true.

Matt.

You know that's just not true.

For the record, both of you. I want to move on here, but before the record, for the record, I was opposed to all of that COVID spending too, But it doesn't matter. Let's move on here. I want to talk about something else here. I want you to have a look here at this mural I'm showing you on the screen. Here, have a look at this. I mean,

You know, well very quickly. It's not all bad news all. It's not all bad news, James. I mean, it's given me an idea. Maybe all I need to do is build. Perhaps all I need to do is paint some murals in rock Campton of caulified pass stations, coal mines, Dames, and.

I might get built.

It's apparently all you need to do is whatever you paint on the side of a building this comment will do.

So maybe maybe it will work. I don't know, but look, this is absurd.

Going back to a previous discussion goal process at record levels, why aren't we approving things like a gold mine that would help a.

Productivity, that would help boost real wages.

We need to invest in things that produce stuff that creates wealth if we all want to be wealthy.

Well, I gotta say, I wonder sometimes if the land the Tanya Plibersek is trying to save is not the land up in Orange but her own seat here in Sydney. Anyway, let's take a break here because coming up after the break, we're gonna have so much more to discuss on Monday Night fights here, including the new campaign launched by the Australian Republican Movement, because of course, the King is coming to town after the break. Welcome back to Paul Murray Live.

Farewell at seeing them together for the ultimate twenty three eight percent hand on.

Your money, Field Strayer, a tax bio.

Charles King, Kabila in consort sign mess your chance to wave goodbye to Royal?

Right, wow, that was lame. Hey look, Matt Canavan, I'll start with you. Is is that sort of bit of boomerism going to stop failing falling support numbers for a republic?

Well, what I think should happen here is the Australians for Constitution monarchy. And I feel Ben Well, he's a great guy. I think they should just take all their budget for the next year and give it to the Republican movement. Let them run more of these ads, because I think they're kind of doing their work for them.

I mean, how would.

Anyone be convinced about the merit of their cause by watching this? It would just turn people off because it is it is cringe. Let's face it, it's dying from cringe. And I mean, maybe we're starting to understand why they've had no luck here. We're seeing record support for the monarchy now, even though we thought perhaps after the very respected Queen Elizabeth I did a handover or did depart, we'd probably.

See the reserve reverse.

So look, if I was, if I was actually a financial contributor to the Australians for a Republic, I'd be very very angry with where my money is going.

Yeah. Yeah, look, wasn't great as you suggest here, Sam, I want to ask you. Look, I mean I come at this. I'm a migrant, I'm a monarchist of American which puts me in a lot of sort of funny sort of addictions here. But that's okay. They all kind of hang together, I reckon. But I just want to put my cards on the table with that. What I want to ask you about that an American animonicist, I mean, what is that? Because I believe in institutions. Because I believe in institutions.

And it was supported King George the day.

No, no, no, no, no, let's not go that far. Let's not go that far. But I'll tell you if I do support King Charles the Third anyway, Let's just I want to ask you, Sam though this whole thing here where labor premiers across the country have decided to have all these sort of other engagements. Some have said right out flat they're not meeting with the King and the Queen. Others like Chrispins have said they're off washing their hair that day at a cabinet meeting. What do you make of these?

What do you mean Christmins is meeting the King?

No?

I thought he was not going to one of the events anyway, Chris is absolutely on a number of different things.

I stand there was one event where he was going. I stand corrected on that. However, a number of labor premiers are not going to meet the king, which I mean it's such as store, It's hit the front page of the Daily Mirror in the UK. Is that a bit gracious of some of these other premiers? And apologies to Chrismians. I hadn't realized that. So I want to go right now.

Maybe he's not going to a specific event. But I know for a fact he is absolutely meeting the king. Good on him, But what about these other labers.

Look, it's not great, is it?

You know?

I think, I mean I speak as a as a Republican. You've got to be polite to people. I mean, he's our head of state, but he is a head of state. He is the king, and he and they are sword ministers of the crowd. Be polite, you know, turn up, be polite, be respectful, make polite, chit chat, you know, give a bow, and then you know, by all means, go and talk to the arm about their wonderful advertiser.

Yeah, I think I think that's actually where they really need to have the meaning to give them a little bit of help. Hey, now, I want to talk about this phenomenal story here, and I got to tell you I've watched the clips of this like thirty forty fifty times today. This is if you look on your screen here Elon Musk's starship Rocket successfully being caught as a return from space, uh from a launch pad from which

I sort of a description of that relauncher that catches being like catching an elephant with chopstick. Yeah, you know, it's that sort of size and that sort of scale. It's remarkable. Look, Elon Musk is a remarkable figure. What he has done to space travel, to to lowering the cost of space travel is genuinely remarkable. What he's done with Tesla is remarkable. What he's done with the payment

Oh that's only because he don't like the lefties just run the show anymore?

Nudes and and like does anyone go on anymore? Like user numbers are through the floor.

It's crap, come.

On going all the time? That canavan, that canavan, what do you reckond.

What each of their each of their each of their eye but are fantastic.

But I want to just ask you that, like just this this incredible thing here. You know, we've got this situation now, private space travel companies Elon musk doing what NASA, you know, cannot do. NASA's got a ship that stranded up up in space. Boeing has got all sorts of problems. Boeing has got all these sort of diversity in equity and inclusion inditiatives, but they can't seem to, you know, make a spaceship that works in a plane that works.

Well, it's a very good point.

I mean, ultimately, I think any business person is going to be judged on the quality of their products, and Elon's products have been remarkable for the world. Just to add one to what Sam mentioned there is Starling. It's revolutionist things in this country.

Yep.

When I first came to the office, as a senator, the biggest compliant I got was rural broadband. People out in the country just couldn't get internet. Now basically done get a complaint, not because the government NBN because of Elon Musk Starling. Everybody's on that. It's been a revolution in the bush in this country. And so look, I think what we should do here is separate the politics from other things people do. And the more we could do that, the better our whole society would be. I mean,

Yeah.

And man likewise, with Elion, I like the fact that he has these colors, these has his has his colors on his on his slave and we can all, we can all.

I mean you have to then not have starlink. I mean, who care?

Well, that's right, that's right. But I mean, look, we can to be poalsing and pousing with Sam Pouser, with Mat and I want to just before we go here, I want to like ask about this question and Sam, I want to give you a free kick on this here because the act greeds, Well, last week we talked about the charming candidate who compared Osama bin Laden to Jesus. Now we have another candidate, James Cruz, calling for politicians

I think I don't think this is limited to the ACT, No, it's not. This is any time that you get a large swathe of Green's candidates, there are these stories that emerge because this is pretty endemic in the structures of their party.

Everyone.

When you know, when people go.

And vote Greens, they like the triangle, they like the Bob Brown, you know, the bloke that saves the forests. And that's about the extent of the thought process I think for a large chunk of their voters put into it. And then you go through what some of these candids have done and said in the past, and it's genuinely horrendous. You know, it's genuinely horrendous to say that we should be hanging up politicians in the streets. We should hang them.

Yeah, well I mean that, Matt. I mean this whole thing too. With the Greeds, it seems like they've got a huge problem with let's just say it, anti Semitism. There just seems to be an awful lot of pro Palestinians that veers over into being fairly adjacent to a lot of other really unpleasant things, and if it was on the rate, as Sam suggests, would be rightly called out all over the place.

Yeah, look, you have seen that.

You've seen that with the likes of my colleague Marine Feruki Standard exte protesters with extremely anti Semitic slogans on the money and she posted us posted the picture to her social media and Arnie became embarrassed after it was called out. And look, really, I do think the Greens are ultimately an extremely radical political party, and in radical political movements you're going to find some pretty distasteful content from.

Time to time.

And what we've got to do is a better job of explaining to a large number of the disinterested voters who vote for the Greens what they're really about. I think the work that Advanced Australia are doing is excellent now, Sam and others, the Labor Party might not typically like Advance Australia, they might end up doing a.

Really good thing for the Labor Party.

And this is the unity I think by just pointing out that these guys really do support some very radical positions that you might not be aware of.

Well, I mean, Matt, I love that we're gonna end this segment here on a big hug it out thing on the greens here, Sam Crosby, Matt Cadavan. Always a pleasure here to have you here on pal Murray Live. Now, stick with us because after the break, Analyst Nielsen joins me from the US, we're gonna talk about that Trump train and how fast is it leaving the station? Stick around after the break, Hey, welcome back to pal Murray Live.

Well, look, it's telling us that the dial's not moving in favor of the campaign that has a lot more money. Kamala Harris's recent hall is a billion dollars, and keep in mind for the Donald Trump campaign, they've raised about a third of that, and in the meantime they've had to fund messy primaries, they've had to fund his legal campaigns, and so they're coming at this from behind. And in these elections, the favor is always with the underdog. Everyone

Well, let's just go into some of that palling though, too, because the real clear politics map has now flipped a couple of states here. They've gotten Vada in Michigan now going to Trump, which gives him a huge electoral college lead. Do you buy this? And do you think that these some of these swing states here? It's the internal polling. There's been reports that the Harris campaign is really quite concerned about what's happening in place like Michigan and Pennsylvania that they've got to win.

Oh, look, I believe it because we're seeing the tone change watching Barack Obama. Chasta is black men for not supporting Kamla Harris because they're not feeling a woman. That is not the same tone of joy that we saw just a few weeks ago, a few months ago at the DNC. So I think that this polling is starting to spook people within the campaign and it is what we're seeing on the ground. We've only been in Georgia for one day, but we've seen we've been in North

Well, and at least too, isn't the case that you know, just the way the electoral college works is for a Democrat to win on the popular vote, their popular vote has to be hired to get some of those smaller states to get the number of electoral votes that they also need. But also the other thing too, tell me if I'm wrong here. I'm getting a little bit of a twenty sixteen vibe here because back then also Trump was seemed to be doing again now many more events

Big time. And this is the problem that the Kamala campaign's faced is now she's avoided doing media so much and she's been so outnumbered by Trump that when she does do this week of media, the focus is intense. The scrutiny is there because people haven't heard from her, and so we're over analyzing every single little bit because we haven't had a chance to do that before. She

And just on that, analyst Nilsen just very very quickly here, Tim wallts it seems like he's really losing momentum, losing altitude and is I've only had twenty seconds here, but just tell us about how his attempts to kind of win back voters to the Kamala campaign has gone.

Oh man, I don't know if you have the footage there, but of him going pheasant hunting and he had trouble loading his gun. It just those are the kind of pictures that just go on loop, they go on social media and it just looks like again they've lost the momentum. Momentum is everything in these campaigns, and this has been an absolutely critical week.

Annals Nielsen, thank you so much for your time here this evening been absolutely fantastic as we move forward in this campaign on a complete knife edge. But as you say, it does look at this point like the momentum is with the Trump campaign. Still a few weeks to go, so we'll see and I'll be joining you in the state soon. Thank you so much, Annalise Nielsen, and thank you so much for joining me tonight. That's it for me, PAULI. He'll be back for you tomorrow. Thank you for your