From the Sky News Center.
This is Paul Murray Live.
Good Evening. James Borrow here filling in for Paul Murray Live for the entire week. So let's get straight into it. We're going to do a big dive into Albos big
trip to China in just a minute. And I've got two of your favorites on the show tonight, Gemma Tognini and Christy McSweeney here to have a lot of fun this Sunday night as we kicked the week off, plus one of the most brilliant thinkers and writers on China, Paul Monk, to look at what is really going on and what sort of bill Albo may be putting us on the hook to keep everything sweet with Jijin Ping.
But first I did say it's Sunday, and so you know what we should start off with you a little bit of fun to end the weekend, chase those Sunday scaries away. And this happened just a few hours ago. I want to share it with you. This was at the Turning Point USA conference in Tampa, Florida. What you're going to see is one of the greatest slapdowns of a Heckler of all time on the stage. US borders are Tom Homan and in the audience one protester who bit off a bit more than he could chew. First,
let's have a look at the heckle. Let's release him in the community.
Wait three or five years, Barney, Are.
You an MS thirteen member?
Hey, hey, that's okay.
That's okay.
I got a question.
No, no, no, I got a question for you.
Mightn't you come up here and.
Hand me that picture brace bringer bringer?
Okay, so you've got some yahoo yelling about MS thirteen or something. And then Homan turns the tables after leading the crowd in a USA USA chant. Homan then proceeds to lay down the law.
All right, they got morens like this all of the country. This guy, this guy wasn't North like the surface nation. This guy ain't got the balls to be a nice officer. The other got the ball pretty a bog Georgia.
But Homan wasn't done yet.
This guy lives in his mother's basement. The only thing that surprises me. You don't have purple hair and a nose ring. Get out of here, your loser and there and you're what's your bad ass? Being me off stage in thirteen minutes and fifty.
Second and then Homan delivered the coup de gras.
I guarantee you he sits down the peak. Guarantee.
Yeah, I'll tell you what. I am not taking that bet. And by the way, keep an eye on that conference overnight and tomorrow. I reckon there's gonna be some wild stuff thrown around back and forth over that Epstein lips List two, which maybe we'll check out tomorrow night. I want to check in on that. But in the meantime, I want you to have a look at this picture. Look, bah, I'm a diplomat. There you have it. Prime Minister Anthony Albanezi posted it to his social media a little while ago.
He's there in Shanghai with Chen Jining, the Communist Party Secretary of Shanghai. So basically we're talking about the mayor, if the mayor could have you thrown in a gulag for thought crimes, which I guess I better say, hey, sorry, clovermore, I didn't mean it. Check out that body language there, albow all leaning in, Secretary Chen leaning back, imperious, looking down the barrel of the camera, like who is this guy and why does he want to shake my hand
so bad. Honestly, the Prime Minister would look less desperate if he was trying to get Cardi B's autograph at the met Gallo. The Prime Minister also posted this little video of himself on the banks of Shanghai's Wangpu River today, trying to set the terms of this trip that he's on right now to China. Have a look and see if you can tell me what's what do they say problematic here?
I'm here in Shanghai, China, supporting Australian businesses, supporting Australian jobs and supporting our economy. We know that one in four of Australia's jobs depends upon free and fair trade and our biggest export is China. So here I've brought a whole range of businesses with us from the resource sector of tourism and education, all engaging with China in a constructive way in order to boost our economic benefit.
Engaging with China is in our interests to build a stable and secure region here over the next few days. What I'm doing is building on that relationship to the benefit of Australian jobs and the Australian economy.
Yeah, yeah, So it's all about jobs, jobs, and growth. Funny, where have I heard that before? Anyway? Yeah, No matter how much he pushes this line that this trip is just about economics and doing business, well, there's also a broader context to this here, because this trip that Ethny Albanezi has taken to China six days, the longest trip I think has even seeing in living memory of any prime minister to China, with no stop in to any of our North Asian allies like the Japanese or the
South Koreans. Well, it also suggests there's something much more broad happening in terms of the way Anthony Albanizi is pulling Australia away from the United States. You caught a little bit there when he's hinted around free trade and all of that, which I'm going to get to in
a moment. You see, the problem here is that Anthony Albanizi believes he can walk this sort of fine line where he has Australia do all sorts of trade with China, indeed become increasingly dependent on China, while at the same time enjoying the benefits of the American security umbrella, even as everything he does says that he is pulling Australia away from the United States, and that mean old Donald
Trump at his nasty tariffs. Albert Ezy will deny this uphill and down Dale, but this is what is happening. You can see it. Just look at the way Alberize deals with both countries. Albert Ezy had this to say today in Shanghai.
Alliance with the United States is a very important one for Australia. So we'll continue to engage constructively in a coherent, stable, orderly way. That's the why I conduct this government.
Ah, Yes, an important alliance conducted coherently, stably and orderly. And also, I would say in a manner that has been entirely flat footed. Now let's play a little game of compare and contrast here. That was just Anthony Albertize talking about America in that context. But here's Anthony Alberanize three months ago, when Donald Trump slapped unilateral tariffs on Australia and a whole bunch of other nations as well as part of the whole Liberation Day economic program.
The administration's tariffs have no basis in logic, and they go against the basis of our two nations partnership. This is not the act of a friend.
Not the act of a friend. Tough talk. He's laid down that marker. That's how you deal with an ally that doesn't treat you well. But now, of course, contrast this with the way the Prime Minister reacted to another event. See a fleet of spy ships that were pretty clearly mapping our island nations weaknesses and choke points circling Australia earlier this year. What is monster.
What it means is that the Australian Defense Force are monitoring what is happening. It's going from New Zealand. We expected to go around to China around that way. Of course I would prefer that it wasn't there. But we live in circumstances where Justice Australia has vessels in South China, say, and vessels in the Taiwan Strait and around a range of areas.
This vessel is here.
Spot the difference there. We've gone from not the act of a friend. About Donald Trump and his tariffs too, well, we would prefer it wasn't there. How about a Chinese spy ship. Now, the Prime minster was also quick to reassure everyone. You recall that this spyship was proparently fine and normal and in keeping with international law. I still believe international law. That's sweet. Note also the moral equivalents he drew there between our freedom of movement exercises in
the South China Sea and China's blatant spying. Recall also two that Albanese claimed Australia received civilian and military notifications about Chinese live fire drills in the Tasman Sea, quote at around the same time a Virgin pilot reported the activity earlier this year. This despite it later coming out that the Chief of the Australian Defense Force, well, he told the Senate estimates that the military notification came an hour after the commercial pilot. That version Australia pilot let
the authorities know what was going on. And again I have to ask, was that the act of a friend, The circumnavigation of the spy ship, the no notification about live fire action in the Tasman Sea, these sorts of things the act of a friend. Well, if not, I would have expected Anthony Albansi to call that out, you know, just to be consistent. But look, let's give him the benefit of the doubt. Amy, this is just the Prime Minister playing to his domestic audience of Trump haters in
the Labor Party. I mean, it works so well from the election, didn't it. But this is serious business. The message Anthony Albenzi is sending to the world is that he will bend over backwards to defend China's actions, no matter how irresponsible they are, how aggressive they are, how bullying they are. But at the same time he is happy to fire up and take us swinging at Donald Trump and the Trump administration. Now back in May, Albeneze ducked the chance to meet with US Vice President JD.
Vance at the funeral of the late Holy Father Pope Francis in Rome. This is what he had to say when asked why he didn't try and meet with the second most powerful man in the Trump administration, the democratically elected. And I might add JD.
Vance sir, well, I'm the Prime Minister. I met the President of the United States and that will occur at an appropriate time.
Ah. Yes, well he bes with the President. He won't meet with any underlings yet. Check this out. Although ALBANIZI will get the chance, oh goodie, to meet jijiin big again. I think this is the fourth time that two were going to get together. The actual formal talks between Albanesi and the Chinese government will take place with China represented by this man Lee Kang, China's premier, someone who is
very much the number two guy. So if it's not okay to meet with America's two, I see, well okay, But then when it comes to China, well the whole thing changes. Yes, sir, happy to meet with whomever's available, mister g Now, and don't think, by the way that this eager puppy dog Albu routine is playing with the Chinese, and he's repeated stubbing of America, even if only for domestic consumption here in Australia, has gone unnoticed in the
United States. Now you probably know, of course that August is under review by the White House. Personally, I think that is going to wind up being okay, because of course every new administration is going to want to review their defense priorities, so I don't think there should be
too much panic there just yet. But I'd also point out that there was also this today news that the Pentagon has confirmed it is asking Australia for undertakings on how its August submarines would be used in the event of US military conflicts, and for substantial increases in defense spending as part of their review of that three hundred and sixty eight billion dollar agreement. In other words, the US wants to know if we are in or if we are out. And you know, I don't blame them.
I don't know that they would be asking these sorts of tough questions. Frankly, if it were not for the recent behavior of the Albanesi government. Now today on Insiders, Acting Defense Minister Pat Conroy had this to say about Australia joining in the fight if China, say, invades Taiwan.
The sole power to commit Australia to war or to allow our territory to be used for a conflict is the elected government of the day.
That is our position.
Sovereignty will always be prioritized and that will continue to be our position.
Look he's right, Conroy is absolutely right there. Sovereignty is number one here. But the decision on whether or not to go to war, while it may be one that ultimately Australia should have the choice, on the fact of the matter is that you know, always get that choice. History shows we don't always have that sort of luxury. And he also said this about what an ideal world would look like for Australia.
We are being very clear that we want a balanced for agent where no one is dominated and no one dominates.
Specific where no one is dominating and no one is dominated. Well, you see, this is where I think we start to get into some trouble, some real murky waters here, because the fact of the matter is, you know, balancing these
two the United States and China. Well, this moral equivalence thing with when you've got on one side a live fire exercise with zero notice or a circumnavigating spy convoy and saying that that's no different for example, as we saw before, to Australia or British or American navies maintaining freedom of movement exercises in the South China Sea. Well, and it comes back to this very reductive model that sees our entire relationship with China now as being an
economic one. And I'm sorry that just doesn't work. I know Albinezi is trying to avoid picking a side here, but he is going to have to remember this.
I'm here in Shanghai, China supporting Australian businesses, supporting Australian jobs and supporting our economy. We know that one in four of Australia's jobs depends upon free and fair trade and our biggest export partner is China.
Yep, it's all about the Benjamins. There isn't it, Albo, no moral judgment about China and in fact, a sidelong swipe at the US, you know, that whole free and fair trade line. Maybe maybe he's just implying, and this is what I'm really worried about. But when you look at the direction that this is taking trajectory this government is taking with all of this, well, it's starting to call us around this idea that maybe, just maybe they think that we could have a better deal with Beijing
in the long run. I mean, that does start to seem to be the vibe. We can trade with them, we can keep doing business with them, and nothing should be allowed to upset the apple carte. Well, at the same time, well, the United States and Donald Trump and all of that, you know, let's just keep getting into punch ups with them while ducking actually taking a meeting with the President. I think this is a terrible strategy.
Yet this is the problem. Labor has done such a comprehensive job of running down any idea of what we are and who we are as a nation, for what we stand for beyond just this sort of narrative of you know, basically, if you listen to what Labor says, we're just a GDP at a dormity worry for migrants with a bit of average history thrown in. That's all
we are. Well, we don't then have the language anymore to stand up and talk about things like freedom and democracy and human rights and things that once upon a time this nation cared about because we saw ourselves as part of the West and as a nation that believed in these Western democratic traditions. Well, we don't have that
language anymore. It seems to stand up and say, actually, China, look, we'll do business with you, we'll trade with you, but you know what, under your current government of the Chinese Communist Party and the way that government behaves, we can't
trust that government. And that actually given the CCP's treatment of Australia in the past, the wolf Warrior diplomacy, the interference in domestic politics, the treatment of Tibet remember them and the wagers, and the threats against Taiwan, well, given all of that everything else, ships the aggression, the bullying, and your demands that we muzzle our democracy, remember those points of grievance. Well, I think the Prime Minster really
ought to say. If he's going to say that Donald Trump's tariffs are not the action of a friend, well, whatever we are with China, he should have the willingness and the strength to say all of this other stuff that's not on. And even if there is a bucket it, it might not be worth the effort. Well, I'm thriatened out to be joined by Paul Munk. He is a great author and thinker on all sorts of matters, and
he's written a wonderful book about China. And Paul Monk joins me today here, Paul, I need to ask you here about what we think about this trip that Anthony Albinezy is going on to China, and does he understand does he get the aggressive and authoritarian nature of this regime.
It's hard to believe that he does, given his rhetoric and his behavior. And if, as you pointed out a few minutes ago, or he was simply trying to be even handed, then he would be more restrained in his comments about the United States government. So one would like to be charitable and say, look, he's trying to get the best deal for Australia in the face of the
bullying of the Chinese regime. But why not in that case simply take the line that say John Howard took twenty years ago, which is that we want to trade with China, we want peace with China, but we have very clear differences when it comes to politics, to democracy, to human rights, and we're just going to have to you know, look past those and trade on its merits. And we did very well in trade with China, so there's every reason to want to keep that trade going.
But it requires something that China is openly interfering with, and that is a liberal and open world, which in the United States created after nineteen forty five. Well that's a really interesting to say that, wouldn't it.
Yeah, Well, it would be good to hear say that, because it's really interesting to hear you talk about this, because, of course, one of the things that we've been talking about, you know, globally over the last few years, has been the threats to democracy, the threats to that liberal order. And I'm just looking at the optics of this trip right now and what the United States must be taking
away from it. And I always think that they would have a case to say that you're being fairly hypocritical if you talk about, you know, threats to the world
order coming from Donald Trump. And I know, you know, there's plenty of reason why people might criticize the Trump foreign policy, But then to go and take this other line, to say, well, you know, we're going to take a morally neutral stance, and in fact, in some cases we've seen recently almost defend China say well, these things that they've done are within international laws, so we're not going to complain about them. The optics of this strike me as pretty problematic.
I think they are problematic, and it worries me that this is being done on a considered basis, not because Albaneze he doesn't understand the realities, but because he thinks he does, and he's been listening too much to people like Ho White, whose recent quarterly essay simply says, we have to adjust to a harsh future in which China will be the dominant power in Asia and perhaps more widely.
And if your mindset is that and you're not prepared for political and diplomatic reasons to spell out that this makes us very uncomfortable. We'll have to find a way to live with it. You just pretend that we can live with it. And I think that's the most charitable explanation one can give of Albanesi's behavior right now.
But I mean, I would think that he is being in love your thoughts on this, Naiven, thinking that he can continue this sort of two faced or two sided sort of diplomacy were on the one hand, he believes we can continue to rely on the American securityumbrella and at the same time, you know, draw ever closer to China economically. That is clearly going to be untenable in the years to come if things continue on their present trajectory.
Yes, in some ways it's the monster Beyle already pretty much untenable. And we've known in Australia for many years now that we're facing a cleft stick because, as everybody readily acknowledges, the United States is our major security partner by a country mile, and China's our major trading partner
by a country mile, and they are rivalrous. And the problem that we've got is not only that that is so, but that the Chinese government, as you rightly pointed out, is the kind of government that bullies and dominates and lies and engages in propaganda, and it is clearly expanding its military capabilities, none of which should be welcome to us.
So you know, if, for example, as Albanezi has claimed recently, you know, John Curtin, with our model, then I would like to think that the riderick would be we stand full square behind an open trading order which has benefited us, which is greatly benefited China, and we don't resile from that, and we won't be bullied. You know, we're part of a Western civilization that has created the open and prosperous liberal trading order. We stand by that, let's be very clear.
Absolutely. But you know the reason why I wanted to have you on thore this week or tonight, Paul, is because you're a fantastic piece in the Australian And one of the things that we always talked about, do we know what's going on in Australian past, We know what's going on in American politics, but the third leg of the still Chinese politics, Well, it's so opaque, it's such
a black box. The cremlinology there is almost impossible. You've written about some fascinating rumors that have been coming out, you know, suggesting that oh, maybe Jijinping, with all of his purges there are a sign of weakness and that he might be losing his grip on power. But then you say, well, maybe not so much in action. We need to step back and look at what's happening here with a really keen analytical eye, which of course is
tough because there's so little information that comes out. What is your take, as somebody who watches these things very closely, how do you feel things are going internally for Jiji and Ping, both within his own sort of polyp euro but also does he still have the strength to run the country? Do you still have support? Are people still supportive of the CCP or the economic problems they're also starting to grind him down and create internal problems for the Chinese regime.
I think there are certainly internal problems in China, and I think it's been clear for quite some time that many informed people inside the PSC another thing of the diaspora, have felt that Cheatinping has been taking China and altogether the wrong direction, and it would be good for China in fact, objectively speaking, if there was a major course correction. But as you rightly say, the regime is so opaque.
I mean, it simply lies routinely about domestic realities. And so all these rumors that he's about to be displaced, there's been a silent coup, he's lost power, he's going to retire, he's going to flee the country. He's alienated his wife and his daughter, and they're not to be found. This is tantalizing stuff, but one can't substantiate any of it.
What we do know is that for the past few years is intensified a purging process which is in fact been conducting from the beginning under the banner of anti corruption drives, and an extraordinary number of very high ranking military and civilian officials have been perched, have been sacked in many cases accused of what the party calls violations of discipline or of corruption, and such as the language that's used that it's very difficult to discern in how
many of those cases have they been removed though they were She's appointees, because he's lost faith in them, because they've genuinely committed violations, and how far is it, because he's simply trying, as Stalin and Maher did before him, to keep everybody off balance and fearful in order to sustain autocratic rule. And unfortunately we know that in both Stalin and males case they did that, and they were
able to maintain power. They couldn't be removed if she was less of an autocrat, even though Numrouno, as I remark in My Peace, then one could conceive of him being removed bloodlessly the way Krushchyov was by Breshenev and Corsogen and now there's a nine sixty four. But he is an autocrat, and so without the army, for example, ceasing to be the army of the party, or siding in some decisive sense to Guy's team as in particularly, it's very difficult to see how he could be at with thrown.
Indeed, Paul Monk, we're gonna have to leave it there, but it's fascinating times and I think, as you've pointed out and others pointed out, you know she has studied exactly what went wrong for some of those other autocrats. It is determined not to repeat their mistakes. Thank you so much for your time, Paul, Monk really appreciate Now stick around because after the break we're gonna be joined here with a super panel, Gemmatagnini and Christy McSweeney. After
the break, welcome back to the program. James Borrow here all week for Paulburray Live. And joining me now is PR Council's Magic Director, Christy McSweeney And here in the man cave a lady at Gemmatagnini of GT Communications. Hey, thanks so much. Both of you guys are joining me
this evening here. We've got to start off though. We've got to start off though, talking about this whole trip to China and the morally neutral way in which Anthony Alberizi has characterized this trip as if it's just all about doing business, as if there weren't all sorts of other geopolitics and foreign policies and really a clash of values system all operating in the background. Here's a little bit of Anthony Alberizi in Shanghai today.
It's a great honor to represent Australia in international forums and this is an important engagement.
That we will have.
In the fact that I am leading a very large business delegation speaks to the importance of the economic relationship between Australia and China.
Jema Targdini, I want to start with you. It seems to me that there's an incredible amount of naivete, forced naivete, perhaps on the part of the Prime Minister here, because he is visiting a totalitarian country run by the Chinese Communist Party, which has designs on being a regional, if not a global hedgemond, that is, to be the dominant superpower in the Pacific, if not around the world, something
which has of course huge implications for us. Now he's telling us that this is just all about jobs, but I feel like that's leaving me in an awful lot of people called because where is this moral leadership that Anthony Albanezi likes to talk about when it comes to Australia.
Well, it's not possible to lead from a moral perspective when you actually don't stand for anything. And I don't say that to be tried. I genuinely don't you take that grab that we just saw a minute ago is utterly unconvincing. It was kind of like your regional sort of regional Australia, and we love regional Australia here at sky. Don't get me wrong, but he's the Prime Minister of Australia and there is nothing even closely resembling gravitas, let
alone leadership. It's like, hey, here with the guys from the Midwest of Wam, we're going to go meet with some people about some jobs in China. Is he going to talk to the Chinese government about the government about its intent towards Taiwan? Is he going to talk about the youngers? Is he going to talk about any number of things that are elevated above the level at which
she seems only capable of operating. We talk so much about you know, ceilings, glass and otherwise, but it seems to me that the Prime Minister has this ceiling that he's just not capable of rising through from a leadership perspective.
And Chrissy mcsweety, I mean here we have this huge Australian delegation. Now I am fairly sure that defact would have advised everybody, including the Prime Minister, do not bring
your real phone. We will give you some sort of burner communication devices, because of course China is going to be spying on all of your devices and everything while you are there for six days, and yet we have this sort of you know, which gives us, in fact, this huge sort of elephant in the room about the nature of the Chinese regime to me, and I don't know, tell me if I'm being unfair here, but this seems really cringe to use a word the way that Albanezy
is saying, Oh, no, no, everything's fine here. These guys agree, we can all be powers, we can all make money. Well. At the same time, as I said in my editorial, you know, whenever it comes to the United States giving them a big rhetorical whack for the domestic labor consumption.
It's certainly a tight rope. What I find really interesting is that this appears to be a confected reason to go to China, and there's a strategy behind why the
Prime Minister wants to go. Now in the middle of this impasse we have with the United States around raising our defense spending like the rest of Europe has committed to do, and this impasse around how much we're contributing to the orcust weather, We're willing to have a conversation with the Americans to say, look, we're contributing a number of things in kind the defense West rotation. The Darwin Marines are based in the Than territory for four months
of the year. There's things that we're doing that we haven't pointed out amid this conversation. We haven't had that mature conversation or credit Andrew Hasty.
With that line.
But I'm going to let you in on a little secret here. The only announcement that I can see that the Prime Minister has put on the table for a reason to go to China is an announcement between a new agreement between Tourism Australia and Trip dot Com. Now that is a very small fry announcement that's usually reserved for the regional General Manager of Tourism Australia based in China. It does not ever warrant a Prime ministerial and Business
delegation visit. So they're really really trying to lay it on quite fixed, suggesting that that is a significant reason. And the other reason they're coming up with is of course to herald their success in restabilizing the relationship with China that they so heavily at the fate of Simon Birmingham as a failure. Of course, you know, we don't actually think it was some quite good things came out of that. The Coalition was responsible for executing the China
Australia Free Trade Agreement. So to make Gemm's point as well, that announcement that seems to be the leech pin of the trip. I will add to Gemma's comments about it is really not a lot of gravitas there that we're trying to pass off to the thriving public as to why we need to go to China right now in the middle of our United States issues.
Well, you know, it's interesting, let's us bring us to the next topic here. And you know, tourism of course obviously involves a lot of small businesses, medium size and enterprises and so on. And this also comes amidst Jim Chalmers, now the treasure announcing that there's going to be three priorities three for his coming economic roundtable. I would love let's have a little grab here, a little look at what Jim Chalmer's talking about productivity here in the context of this roundtable.
And I don't mind what you call it. I think the productivity challenge is central to our economic reform efforts. It already is, but we're looking to build consensus on the next steps in that agenda, and so I think productivity and economic reform are inseparable. I set up the press Club and the Prime ministers set out the press Club that this is all about building consensus, building on the progress that we've made, building on our substantial agenda.
Productivity will be the major focus, but it won't be the only focus.
Jimmy, if I consume any more of that word salad, I'm going to have to have my suits taken and I'm going to start losing weight. As a business owner yourself, what do you make of this roundtable? And I'm going to ask both of you this question because you have both got business here. But Jemmy Toddini, what would you like to see from a productivity point of view, from a tax point of view, from an economic reform point
of view? As a business owner? That Kiam Chalmers has probably missed as he prepares to sit down.
How long have you got FLT take a bit of time like yammering away? What did he just say? He said nothing?
First of all, it was a word soul.
He literally just insulted the Australian public because he said absolutely nothing. Weirdly enough, I was thinking about the treasurer
on the weekend because I was reading the papers. You would never give control of the books of a small company, a large company, let alone a nation to a dude who has an arts degree with a major in Paul Keating, who's never run a business, he's never been in the real economy, who's never run a business, who has no skills to deliver the task that he is trusted with, and that is reflected in all of mister Chalmer's economic policy.
You need to be able to.
Ret doctor Cham.
I will not coctor to you if I need a heart attack.
I don't want him in his PhD standing by Thanks very much, fair.
Sure it took him a lot of.
Time in academy land, which he's clearly never left. But let's start with the obvious things. You cannot keep spending and spending and spending. Every household in Australia needs to live within its means.
Every business.
I've been in business for twenty two years this July, I am old and I have learned a thing or two.
You have to live within your means.
He is going around wanting to tax people on money they have not made yet. What kind of socialist utopia does the dude want us to live in if you want to improve productivity? And he has to recognize that the private sector is the engine for productivity. Not everyone can work for the public sector. Imagine being actually accountable for the job that you do. I mean, I could go on and I will go on if you give me another ten seconds.
Suriously, it's not like that. It is literally other worldly.
Australia used to have an economy that was the envy of the world, amongst the envy of the world. And we are so far behind in so many areas. And why would you invest here? The sovereign risk here, there's all of that stuff, and you've got a treasurer who goes, I know what we'll do.
We're going to tax people on money they have not earned.
Christy very quickly just from you business order yourself. How do you react to Albert Easy with all of his talking about suddenly, oh, now we need the private sector to fill the gap. They've suddenly woken up to this after the election.
The private sector going to do what they always do, which is turn up and curry favor with the government. But I'll just give you an insight into what the private sector actually thinks. Ten eleven years ago here in Sydney held the G twenty. I worked for the Trade Minister. We had a Trade and Investment Forum with what's called the B twenty, that is the business delegation that a
companies leaders of governments through the G twenty. At that investment forum there was business leaders from leading nations that Australia was seeking to gain foreign direct investment from, largely through our infrastructure projects. Nicholas Moore, the formacy of Macquarie, and that forum for us. Every single one of them said Australia is way down the list of choices because your industrial relationship system just makes no investment sense and
productivity is strangled. Projects don't get delivered on time despite our best efforts because of the unions. And there will be no investment uptake into Australia until we broke some type of new accord. And I don't think a labor government is going to do it.
Well, it's not this labor government, even if a labor government broke to the last accord. Anyway, stick around, we've got a lot more fired up chat debate after the break. Don't go anywhere. Hey, welcome back to the show here James Moorrow here all night and all week here on PML Palmriray Live. Great to have your company. I'm here tonight with Jemma Tognini and Christy mcsweetey. Jemma, let's go to this story here, rather depressing story here out of
melbourt As. Let's be honest, most stories out of melbourd and Victoria are these days, honestly, if we crew about it. Soa songwriter, Deborah Conway, who we've spoken about many times four has revealed that her career is in the balance now because anti Semitism, which we've been talking a lot about, has reared its ugly head and basically she can't get bookings, she can't get gigs anymore. Gemma, what's going on?
Well, I think it's the ugly face of the underbelly of Australia that we sort of didn't know or maybe suspected was there, and post October seven has certainly unleashed the beast, so to speak. And a great objective metric of that is a recent study, or not a study, but an analysis of attacks on synagogues, particularly fire bombing attacks on synagogues around the world. Australia has the awful, awful. I don't know what the word is that we're looking for,
but Australia and Canada. Amongst all the countries of the world where these attacks have taken place, both Australia and Canada are the only ones. We've had three fire bombing attacks on synagogue since October seven, Australia and Canada. And unfortunately, and we don't want to be in the city Canada, not exactly. And as Henry Oga said in The Australia this weekend, there is a place for anti Semitism in this country and unfortunately it's in Victoria. Deb is a
dear friend of mine and is Willy. She's a wonderful woman and all she's done is speak the truth. And if that's the price of speaking of truth Australia, we need a radical, radical course correction.
Well yeah, and you know this is this thing that I was thinking about here, Christian McSweeney. You know we've had all this talk about this anti Semitism report that the government has finally put out now that the elections
in the bag. Huh, funny coincidence on the timing there, But none of the stuff that is in there really seems like it will do much to actually, you know, change hearts and minds in terms of actually dealing with the inner hatred that seems to be running through an awful lot of places in this country, particularly on the left.
Yes, of course, and I'm mention of Since Jillian Seagull has released that report, she has faced a barrage of critical media, unsurprisingly because it did point out sections about media that perhaps have engaged in less an objective reporting and her deep wish for objectivity to return to journalism and to return to universities and other arts and culture
and publicly funded institutions. But there is a dirt sheet independent news website that around twenty four hours ago reported that her husband, independent of her, had made donations to Advance Australia. Wheill no Advance and they wrote as Advanced can and I just quote from this is a bigoted, promotes racist trope. Is a far right fringe lobby group. Now you can make up your subjective mind of Advance, but that was how someone who might support Advance was
framed within this article. That article was subsequently then re reported on in the City Morning Herald and The Canberra Times. So far My point to this is that we've got to a position in Australia now in public life that people with a voice seem to think it's okay to write a veiled message through the media that somebody who might support the state of Israel, Australia's only democratic ally in the Middle East, might be some sort of far
right sympathizer. Indeed, and that's a very very dangerous thread to weave through our media. And that actually just points probably to the framework of the report that she's released well exactly.
And I also think it just means that this whole term far right now means absolutely nothing. I mean, that's the other result of this here, which is probably good because it is a meaningless term at this point. Here is anybody you know who's to the right of Albinizi or you know, wants a little bit of a restriction on immigration numbers or something like that. Oh you're far right,
that's all we hear now. But you know, Jema, there was a good news story this weekend here and it was in the Australian and it's all about the gen Z and millennials in Israel, and apparently it's basically saying that once upon a time everybody in Israel thought, oh, you know this TikTok generation here, these self absorbed, selfie
taking kids wouldn't be able to stomach any sort of fighting. Well, apparently, you know, it's all about how they've been on the front line since twenty twenty three, since October seventh, doing heroic work in many instances here. But the thing I was wondering about, Jemma, is we also scoff at young
people in an awful lot in this country here. Do you think that if push came to show that our own self absorbed z's and millennials would be up to the fight of, you know, seeing off a threat from China or some other adversary.
What are you hopeful, as we say in the mother country, that's a belladomanda.
I don't I don't honestly know. I don't know. I would like to say yes, I would like to say yes.
I don't know. Simply because having been to the Middle East a number of times now, Israeli youth live with an existential threat.
They know that on every border a maniac's trying to wipe them out.
Because they're Jewish. Australian kids don't have that context. You know, we're not going to war of good social anxiety. Like I just don't know that cometh the hour, cometh the person. I don't know if that would apply to Australian youths. I would like to think, so I don't know.
Well I would hope. So, Hey, listen, that's all the time we've got here for the Pound tonight. Jemma Tagnini, Christy McSweeney, thank you so much for your time on Paul Marie Live. Stick around for a final thought. Welcome back James mara here for Palmriy Live tonight and throughout the week. Great to have your company. Now, just before we go this evening, gosh, I want to tell you about a pretty funny story that's just broken here in Sydney, and really I think has it all and in some
ways says it all. Yes, this story contains people in Sydney's eastern suburbs. It's got Nimby's, it's got climate change, and it's got giant puppets. Yeah. So anyway, the story goes something like this. Apparently here in Sydney, a Sydney arts company wanted to put on a giant puppet show in Paddington. Now, Paddington is a very fashionable suburb in Sydney's East, full of beautiful Victorian terrace houses and lots of beautiful shops and boutiques and things of that sort.
It's the sort of place that we in the newspaper business call a leafy suburb. Now that's the problem, and I wonder if you can see where I'm going with this here, this puppet show, Well, you'd think this was going to get over the line because it was going to be all about you guessed it, climate change. But even this was going to be too much for the
residents of Pado. The locals there are apparently afraid that the puppet show will have noise impacts, rowdy crowds because of course, you know those Greta Thunberg types, as well as light pollution and even draw crime to the area. Now, according to the Citney Morning Herald, which has broken the story, one resident argued the proposal could lead to severe impacts on surrounding residents due to excessive noise, both from crowds and performances. This proposal is excessive in the extreme, This
person wrote to the council. Well, this is kind of funny to be here because of course Ansky Albin Easy right now is over in China and the excuse for this trip is to promote Chinese tourism to Australia. But with this sort of thing happening in the city that's opposed to be the capital, the entertainment capital, the fun capital of Australia, what sort of message are we sending
here with this sort of thing. I mean, I'm all for protecting historic areas, and I frankly think the yimbies you've heard a lot about them, have never seen a nice house. They didn't want a bulldoze for shoe box apartments. But at the same time, we got to get some life into the joint. Even if it is just some sort of weird climate change puppet show, This is an Australian wide problem and you know what, we have got
to lighten up people. Now, stick around. I'm gonna be with you tomorrow night, and coming up now is the Royal Report with Caroline Trusso Sea tomorrow night,