Paul Murray Live | 11 November

On the Skyinging Center.

This is Paul Murray Live.

Look, please do not adjust your sets. Welcome to Paul Murray Live with me Danikiti Giorgio. I mean, can you believe they actually gave me the keys to the joint? Now, I've got to say it was a little bit nervous stepping into Paul's man cave, But once you get used to the cigar smell, I've got to say it's actually quite nice in here.

Few differences between Paul and I.

I might not smoke cigars or love Bathurst, but the opinions on this government do not change.

So a huge show coming up.

Stay with us because tonight the polls are spiraling for elbow, it's not getting any better for labor.

The truth about the government's.

Proposed ban on social media for sixteen year olds has been revealed.

What is the truth?

Stick around because it'll affect many of us. And Kamala Harris could be should be president for a few days. No, that is actually a.

Proposal, would you believe?

But first, today is a day where we pause to remember those who made the ultimate sacrifice so we could live in the country we do today. At the eleventh hour on the eleventh day of the eleventh month in nineteen eighteen, the fighting on the Western Front stopped, and we thank those who bravely fought for us, and we will never forget their sacrifice.

But today has really got me thinking. What would those who fought so.

Bravely for our country think to see Australia today. How would they feel about being welcomed to country every five minutes, the exact same country.

They fought for?

Or what would our.

Soldiers think of the anarchy in the streets where terror sympathizers openly wave the flags of band terror groups.

What would they think of the division?

Or to see the pro Palestine protests every weekend and anti Semitism running rampant, all under weak and cowardly leadership.

Well, I suspect many would give this answer.

We have one flag in Australia. That's the Australian flag, not the Lebanese frag order, Palestinian flag and even the Israeli flag. You know, this is Australia and these people should behave like Australians should.

That was Eddie Boas, a Holocaust survivor, speaking to my colleague Caroline Marcus.

And he is absolutely spot on.

We have come so far as a nation since World War One and World War II. We are certainly so much more developed, but at the same time we are so different. In twenty twenty four we have hit peak woke, peak division, and peak stupidity. I mean, when we think post World War Two, Australia represented prosperity.

Rising living standards and employment.

The post war migrants my grandparents included, who came from Italy, wanted to work. In fact, they worked their backsides off. If you wanted a job, you got it. And most importantly, Australians and migrants actually loved this country. The word woke didn't exist back then, so what.

The heck happened? Were now?

Progressive ideology is entrenched in major Australian organizations run by woke CEOs. It's entrenched in classrooms, in our educational institutions, in our renewable energy policies for goodness sake, and in our left wing media. And Donald Trump has shown the world that if you love your country, there is a far greater chance of unity. Because Trump stood for one flag, and one flag only, of the United States of America.

Take a look at Southeast.

Queensland, where local councils are spending tens of thousands of dollars.

On welcome to country ceremonies.

Yes, ratepayers have to foot the bill to the tune of one hundred and thirty five thousand dollars for these events in the last two years alone.

And so here we are in the middle of.

A cost of living crisis and woke councils are sending us broke. So congratulations to the alban Easy Voice referendum

I'd like to begin by asking you a very simple question. Are you better off now than you were four years ago?

Simple? Isn't it? Is your life better now than it was four years ago?

And overwhelmingly, of course, America said no, because their lives had gotten worse under Joe Biden and Vice President Karmala Harris.

With this being the nail in the coffin for Karmela.

Would you have done something differently than President Biden during the past four years?

There has done a thing that comes to mind in terms of and I've been a part of most of the decisions that have had impact.

No.

Nothing at all, and so I would ask at home the same thing. Has your life improved in the last two years since Albanezi took office despite these rolling promises.

A plan to address cost of living, take pressure off cost of living, pressure off the cost of living, the cost of living, cost of living, cost of living, relief.

Downward pressure on cost of living.

And it's clear you at home beg to differ because it's reflecting in this month's polls, just like it has for the past month.

Now. According to the latest News poll, primary.

Support for the Coalition has lifted to forty percent for the first time since the twenty twenty two election, and Peter Dutton's net approval now it surpasses that of Anthony Albanesi. The Prime Minister's personal ratings have also dipped, as you can see, to a new low, and the leadership contest has narrowed now to its closest margin yet. Now this is good news for Peter Dutton. It means that he is indeed cutting through.

He's electable.

It absolutely puts the Coalition in a more positive position heading into the next election. However, this still remains below what the Coalition would need to win the next election. And based on those numbers, and we're going to go through it with our panel very closely. Shortly being a hung Parliament and a minority Labor government is likely.

But the US election result shows that when the silent majority.

Have had enough, they have had enough, and we need to make Australia great again, more courage less, woke. It's time for a change, to put Australia first and restore our values, just like our servicemen and women have done and thankfully continue to do so.

Well, let's get straight into it.

Joining me now is your regular Monday Panel of National Senator Matt Canavan, Sky News contributor Sam Crosby.

Really good to have you on the show this evening.

Look, Sam, if you were Labor and you were reading those poles when you spit your coffee out this morning, you.

Wouldn't be feeling very optimistic, would you.

Well, I am Labor, yeah, and I didn't spit my coffee out.

Look.

Obviously it's not good. Obviously it's not good. I think I think Joe Biden said it's not a good time to be an incumbent party anywhere in the world, and I think that's correct. We've got globally, inflation has just been breaking everyone's back and I think the punters are telling us, you know, loud and clear, that they're not happy, and I think the government's got to listen to that.

And you know, I think any rational.

Person would acknowledge that it's been pretty difficult weeks for labor in Australia and cerah. Left of center parties across the world has been a pretty rough couple of weeks. But no, Look, I think the the government's got a job to do, so I hope they're going to and do it.

Well, let's dive into those poles.

This news pole revealed the primary support for the coalition is lifted by two points, so now reaching forty percent for the first time since the election.

This bump in support was also mirrored in.

The last Resolve poll, where support for the opposition has reached thirty nine percent.

Matt Canavan, how would you read these numbers? Now? What does it mean for Peter Dutton?

Well, opportunity Knox Daneka, We've got a real opportunity here to create history. First term governan's never been defeated in this country, not since the days of the Great Depression. So look, we've got a big task ahead of us. It's a political equivalent of climbing Mount Everest. It's a long route. I think Peter Dutton's leadership has put us in this position. He's taken some brave choices on things like nuclear energy. But look, we can't rest on our laurels.

That we're the right choice.

As I say, I think Peter's doing that with the plans he's mapping out.

But we've got more to do here. We've got a lot more to do.

I think we've got to sharpen up our policies around climate change. And it's pretty clear now with Donald Trump's election, the rest of the world is not doing this stuff, so why would we continue it. It's time to put Australians first. And the real lesson from Trump's election is we've got to look after this country. We've got to get back to using our natural resources for the benefit of all Australians, provide Australians a better future for our children.

I do want to get to energy policies in a second, but Sam, look, what do you think are the lessons here from Trump's victory.

We speak about the.

Woke and I think that culture was in this country matter now the Voice referendum. There's kids being indoctrinated in the classrooms welcome to country. Every five minutes they're saying apologies to the stolen generation. An impact when you think about what's happened in the US.

Well, I mean the apology of this dollin generation happened, you know, a decade ago.

Yeah, but the kids are being told apologize, say sorry.

Sure.

I think it's I think it's really superficial to look too hard at the American landscape and transpose it onto the Australian political landscape, where on the face of it, we're very similar, similar cultures, similar ideologies, but you dig just one layer deeper and it's very different political cultures compared to America. I mean, look, the big takeaway for me from America was Carmla's people did not turn out. You know, she got the same number of votes that

But sorry, Matte, Well.

Look, I'm not analyzing this from a sepsology perspective or a political perspective. I completely agree a political systems are different. I completely agree that Donald Trump's election does not mean or presage that Peter Tuttle will be Prime.

Minister next year.

But there are implications for our country. The fact is that Donald Trump is going to rip up this so called rules based order, which has been on its deathbed now for about a decade. But it's gone. It's over, and it's time for our country to face hard truths, hard cold truths that we've been ignoring for too long. Papering over the cracks, thinking that America will come to our defense in the case of a military quarrel, or that China will come to our savior if there's an

It's a band aid solution.

It's not going to fix the long term structural problems in our economy, in our society that is I say, threatening the future of our children. I mean, are our kids is going to have a better future.

Than we do?

I am asking myself that question now, and you shouldn't have to ask this question in a country there's blessed with so much opportunity and resources as we are.

Yeah, I think that's a really good point by Matt. We shouldn't have to ask those questions. But I want to also point to some other polling that came out today which said that forty percent of voters think Donald Trump's victory will be bad for Australia and also shown that a clear majority of Ossie's do not want to take sides of Trump Heighten's tensions with China, with fifty seven percent saying that we should actually stay out of

I mean, I think Matt started to make the point and I agree if he was going to make the point that it does have profound implications for Australia.

You know, UCUS being the first one.

Mike Pompeio was one of the architects, if you like, behind the scenes of UCAS and had been a big supporter of it, albeit from his opposition. That's now he's now out of the spotlight. If Trump proceeds with a universal tariff, a tariff increase, as he said he would, you know, will that affect Australia And if it does, how much?

And where is that going to hurt?

I mean, I dare say a bunch of Matt's constituents out there in Queensland sell a whole pile of beef and what not into America. So we've got to think through those implications. No, you know, I think there will be profound economic consequences in the very near term. Look what this means for China will have to wait and see. You know, we can spend all night looking at this and trying to figure it out.

We'll just have to wait and see.

Yeah, okay, well depends. Now.

Look, I know you're both ready to fire up on this one because speaking of Donald Trump, he is expected to pull out of the Paris Agreements some Nationals MPs and now urging Peter Dutton to vow to do the same ahead of next year's election and revisit the Coalition support for net zero by twenty fifty. Now know, Matt Canavan is ready to fire up on this one, but so Sam I'm going to start with you sure, good or bad. I know what your answer is going to be, but I'm assuming.

Don't do it.

What's my answering to be.

You say, don't pull out, keep going.

I'm going to say, I hope Peter Dutton does. I want to see Anthony Alberinezi re elected. And when you go through the votes in the seats that Peter Dutton needs to win, he doesn't need to win them in National Party seats. He needs to win them in metropolitan cities. He needs to win them in areas that prioritize climate as being one of their top concerns. So if he wants to pull out of Paris and Matt's group wins, the argument in the Nationals and Liberal party room, wonderful.

Yeah.

But the problem is, Sam, is that we can't even meet our twenty thirty targets. We've been worn by aemo that we're not going to get there. Surely the best thing to do if not pull out, cancel twenty fifty, slow it down.

We're not ready.

No, I've seen a number of different things saying that we'll either hit it or only just miss it. And I think at the end of the day. If you get ninety percent of the way there, that's better than zero percent of the way there. You can if you can do a good job, then let's try to do a good job. If it's not an excellent job.

All right, let's go to Mat Cadavan.

Look, you've been vocal about this scrap net zero altogether, is that we'll still what you want, Matt.

I've always said that it's an absurd idea. We're not going to meet net zero by twenty fifty. That's not going to happen, and no one else is. And this is somewhat independent of Donald Trump. Yes, he's going to formally take the United States out of Paris, but the US hasn't been taking it seriously to day anyway. Last year, under Joe Biden, the US produced more oil than any country in any year ever.

Ever, they're they're.

Not doing this, and China, of course, is building two COULP flight powerstations a week. Indonesia have been building coldplight powerstations like they're going out of fashion. They've done so to such an extent they have effectively stolen our nickel industry. We've lost basically all of our nickel industry to Indonesia over the past year. So Sam says about doing ninety percent of something does good, The question is what good is that to Australias. How does this improve anyone's life

Our businesses are facing to date.

We pay now two to three times more for energy for electricity and gas than they do in the US. That is a much much bigger tariff on Australian business than anything Trump's going to impose through a trade deal or a trade policy change. That doesn't bother fix the issues in our own economy. Yes, it does bother me, Sam, But the point here is that there is much bigger issues in our own economy that we can fix that would pale into insignificance. The issue of a ten percent tariff.

All I can say, all I can I hope that immigration mess.

This government has presided.

I hope exactly what you were saying right now, Matt, because I think if he gets up there and says exactly what you're saying right now, I think Albaniz he gets elected in a heartbeat.

In a heartbeat, I thought you thought you thought.

Mohara's just going to win a month ago to you didn't get that very well. I mean, I think this idea, somehow, this idea that somehow people all around the country, including in our cities, don't care about their actrisit prost.

Butal I don't know what planet you're on.

I mean, the people in a who' struggling to who, Well, everybody is struggling.

You said that what sort of straw man are you putting up that? I said? Your people don't care about the electricity you're.

Claiming you said you said earlier, Sam, you said that this policy that I'm adopting is really only apparently about winning votes and seats in regional Australia.

I don't believe that for a second. Just struggling as well.

Everybody's everybody is getting poorer in this country and everybody wants a solution. The the last election and the election of the Teals, voting Teal and Green in particular, is a luxury good when people are doing.

Really well at the end of the day, at the end of the day.

A life of luxury. Sam.

We've got five coal power stations that need to be turned off in the next five or six years.

Now, what we replace that bill some new ones, So.

Build brand new coal fired power stations like a third world country, or we can replace it with renewable renewable I.

Would prefer, Sam, I would prefer to keep those jobs in our nickel industry.

Why do we want to ship them off to Indonesia?

It's worse for the look for in New South Wales.

They've had to extend the life of the coal fire station here Sam, because we don't know what we're.

Going to do build a new one.

Yeah, because a liberal government signed up to turn it five years too early. That was the Liberal party that did that, and the Labor are you applied some rationality and some sense and tried to fix it up.

Yeah, but what happened to power bills going down under labor because I thought that renewable.

Ukraine happened to me? Ukraine happened, Russia happened. This is not this is not a new Sam.

We were promised.

America in that situation and then in Ukraine.

Come on, Sam, there needs to be fair options.

How how come us? How come Americans aren't paying those power processes? If the Ukraine invasion happened on their planet too, And in fact they're more connected to the issue obviously than we are.

Their power prices did go up, they had just seven eight nine percent.

Yeah, but they're not up now. They're at record lows. They're power prosit record lows, whereas ours are still at record highs. It's not Ukraine, Sam, it is our insane attoution men power systems that don't work.

Right now, you are disagreeing with just about every serious energy commentator in Australia.

Well that's not the case.

I'm actually on an energy policy in quirer Senate inquirer right now. And even Sam, even the government's Australian Energy Market operator, their regulator, said the other day that they can't guarantee power prices going down under the government's policies, despite the government's promise to us all that it would

And I just feel I was about to come. We're going to have to make some tough choices.

Well, we do have to make tough choices as well.

But I want to make another point, and I think you alluded to it before as well, Matt, is what about the big emitters. We've got China for example, they're not copying anything, and yet here in this country, Sam, we're going backwards, We're going brokeuse of our energy prices. So what's the What I'm trying to make is what is what Matt said earlier. You've got China, big polluters, they don't cop anything worldwide, so why should Australia be copping it as well.

I'm not saying that at all. I don't know who you're arguing with here, but that's not my point.

All right, Well let's move on there, because just.

To be clear, Just to be clear, we signed an agreement last year at so called COP twenty eight, that was the last climate change conference before this week's COHCH Just this week, at COP twenty nine, last year, we signed up to an agreement with one hundred and thirty other countries to end cul fir power. China, India and Indonesia did not sign that agreement. They did not sign up to it. So why are we doing.

That's what they're big emitters. They are bigger miitters.

But I want to I want to move on now because I want to speak to you both about social media. This has been a big one this week. Anthony Albanesi is under pressure for his government's plan to ban social media for those under sixteen. But it's actually worse than what we thought when it revealed today in the Senate that the age verification process will require all.

Australians to digitally verify themselves. Would you believe have a listen.

Of course, if you're testing to see if someone's thirteen or fourteen, or fifteen or sixteen, you're also testing to see, by definition, if they're sixteen plus. So if there's going to be age verification, everybody is going to have to go through an age verification process, won't they?

Yes, yes, right, So let me just try and get this right here, because how I read this is is that it was never about under sixteens.

It's never about it wasn't about the vulnerable.

It's going to impact everybody who has a social media account. Suddenly you now have to have a digital ID. That's how I read it. The Greens seem to be reading it that way, Sam, are we heading into some sort of privacy issues here?

Look, I don't know. We'll have to wait and see.

I assume it'll be the case that everyone has to enter their age on the app. I don't think this is we'll see, right. I don't foresee that this has ever been proposed that it's going to be a hard and fast you have to submit your proof of identification or anything like that. The idea as I read it, was this is about giving parents a tool to have a conversation with their children to say no, you can't go on social media.

It's not mum and dad doing it. It's the law doing it.

Which as a parent that has this conversation with a twelve year old, you know, I can appreciate and respect, but I think that's what.

It's going to be.

But look, I think at the end of the day, we've got to do something, and so if there's a better way around this, I hope that the government would be open to figuring that out and looking at it. But you know, I think we need to do something.

Yeah, Matt, how did you understand that they're That question from David Schubridge from the Greens, because it sounded like there was an agreement today in the Senate that actually, yes, it will be a case where if you have social media you will need to submit your own digital ID.

I don't think the government knows what they want to do. I've spoken to some large tech companies and then none the wiser about what the plan is here.

It's certainly not off the table.

The government is considering some form of identification process, so it won't just be tick a box potentially.

I mean, I don't think it's settled yet.

We haven't seen the legislation, but this could be a complete dog's breakfast. I mean, this sounds like an idea that's great in theory. Let's some young children don't really need to be on some of these social media apps. But in practice what will probably end up happening is it will kick eighty year olds off Facebook, but not eight year olds. The eight year olds, I reckon will find a way around it. They're pretty savvy. My eight

You'll have to go back.

Everybody it's got an account now, but to dig up some kind of will go through some kind of process to keep their account, and so I just think this has to go back to the drawing board. The Gun's clearly trying to rush this before an election because they want some kind of victory. But I think they have no idea what they're doing, no idea what they're doing. And now there's talk of banning kids from YouTube and minecraft,

I just think it just they don't have a proper.

Plan yet, and it'll look I can understand it if you're a parent, as you mentioned, Sam, if you're a parent, you're struggling. Social media is difficult to navigate for everybody, really, and if you as a parent, it would be very difficult if you didn't understand the implications of social media to discuss it.

With your own children. Do you think that this is a legitimate answer for kids?

It basically puts parents in a position where you can say to your kid, well it's illegal, sorry, you can't go there.

Does that help as a look.

I think it does. I think it does. I take Matt's point that it is a complicated thing. You know, my daughter was trying to explain to us that she needs Snapchat not to post or see things, but is basically a messaging app with her friends, because that's what all of her her friends are on.

So I agree.

You know, I mean, at what stage does WhatsApp and the various groups are on WhatsApp become a social media platform or does it become a messaging app? You know, I don't have an answer to this, and I dare say the government doesn't have an answer to this. But I think we want to empower parents to be able to have those conversations with their kids. And you know, I mean, we made a mistake with our daughter, We let it go on far too young. You know, if we had our time again, and we do with our

Yeah.

Absolutely, it's a conversation started.

I'd be very curious to see where this legislation goes to to bring you this from Bernie Sanders in the US, because he has doubled down on his statement from last week where he actually ripped into the Democrats for abandoning the working class. Here's what he had to say on NBC's Meet the Press today.

The working people of this country are extremely angry.

They have a right to be angry.

In the Senate, in the last two years, we have not even brought fourth legislation to raise the minimal wage to a living wage, despite the fact that some twenty million people in this country are working for less than fifteen.

Dollars an hour.

Matt Canavan, good to see there, Bernie Sanders coming to his senses.

I mean, who would have thought that the elites that they rolled out.

During the election campaign actually didn't resonate with Middle America.

That's basically what he's saying there.

Look, it's probably why the Democrats lost the election. They weren't seen to be focused on these kitchen table bread and butter issues that face every family almost in the Western world right now, that's a challenge for all governments, and Sam's right earlier, it's a tough time for in Covenant governments, but that's what comes with the job and

Now, maybe I'm being harsh on the.

Australian Labor Party, but that's the perception out there that they're not focused on these issues. They are instead very focused on the trend virtue signaling issues, whether it be the voice here in this country, transgender issues, climate change, and not focused on the stuff that makes a difference in your life and makes you frustrated in your life about not being able to enjoy this great country where

Sam, I'll give you the final word.

Look, I think I think the reality is that in the United States, neither party is looking at for the absolute bottom of the wrung. They haven't had a real wage increase since Jimmy Carter was president. So that's Reagan, Clinton to Bush's, Trump, Obama, Biden, you know, you name it. I think it's a great country to be rich in. But you don't have to walk around too far in any of their major cities before you see the epidemic of homelessness.

Well maybe Trump might fix that, but.

Of course he's not going to. I mean, to be honest, not neither of them were going to. Like, let's let let's let's be honest about it. Everyone will talk.

Did the railways did go up under Trump? Did go up under Trump?

Oh? Did go up under the COVID supplement? Yeah?

Sure, COVID Before COVID they evolution.

Aberration, Matt, But whatever. I mean.

The point is, you don't have to walk far throughout the United States to see an epidemic of inequality in that country, and I think, you know, to Sanders point, I don't think either of the parties have been focused on that for very long at all.

Yeah, all right, well on your America beckons. We'll see what happens. Sam Crosby, Matt Canavan. Great to speak to you both. Thank you so much for joining me on the show this evening. We'll stay with us coming up after the break. Can you believe how much the ABC spent on a redesign and they.

Have the audacity to ask our government for more money? Don't go anywhere. Well, welcome back to Paul Murray Live.

Daniki di Georgia are here this evening. Paul is back on myay, don't worry. And if you also have him on Instagram.

You know that. Well.

He's having a good time in Vegas and Vegas certainly will not be the same once he leaves, that is for sure. But he is excited to come back to Australia for the next Our Town, which is going to be held in Bendigo on Sunday, the twenty fourth of November.

So if you want to be in the.

Crowd, please register for tickets at Our Town at sky News dot com dot Au.

But look the debate tonight goes on.

We've got a lot to get to and I'm joined by Sky News contributor pre mcsweeen and Graham Lloyd, the associate editor at The Australian.

Welcome to you both. Great to see you now.

Graham will start with you because your paper, of course, we've been reporting that The Australian, their latest news poll has just more and more.

Bad news for Alberan.

Ezy and if you are actually just joining us from home, the coalition's primary vote is back at forty percent and Peter Dutton's net approval has gone past alberanizis Graham, how do you read these numbers?

I mean, if you were Peter.

Dutton, would you be hardened by this result? Or you don't want to speak too soon?

Well, I think a week is a long time in politics. But what we're seeing is the trend is favoring Peter Dutton. He's gradually incrementally increasing his support. On the other side, Anthony Alberici must be wondering what he has to do to change things around and get back on the front foot. It's hard to see what that may be at this point in time. There's a lot of challenges coming up,

But how would Labor take these results, Graham? Because we know this is now a trend. We've seen it in the last few Poles News poll and the figures did say though that it would be enough to get Labor over the line, but in a minority, which I mean, God, God help us if that would was the case. But if you were Labor, would this worry?

I think they'd be very concerned. They'd be wondering what they can do to get back on the front foot. But they've changed the rules. So in earlier days there would have been a lot of talk about moving on the Prime Minister and swapping him out for somebody who may be more popular. But that is a lot more difficult to do now, so that's unlikely. What they need to do is find, if you like, a bit of

Well, this is a thing I mean, what do you find when it comes to labor prue.

This is the problem. They've got so many issues.

You've got Albow fresh from the Coba Cabaner swanning about now in the chairman's lunge, apparently loves the quantas loves the flights. It's about restoring this public image as well. I mean, how do they go about that?

I don't think they can.

You know, I think the public has worked out that he's a snake oil salesman, you know, and we're not buying what he's selling.

He's a fake.

You know.

We sort of were kind enough to forgive him when he was not across detail during the election and we bought the you know, the Uncle Tom's staff.

But then we started to see the cracks.

Falling in and you know, the problem is that he's a fake and that is the problem. And what he's selling is just not what we as working class people. We're all doing it so hard. I don't care who you are, you are doing it tough. And he's not addressing the cost of living, and we're all waking up. We're much more economically savvy and we know it's the spending of labor labor state governments as well as federal

All are on to EM and clearly the polls suggests that Australia is onto EM.

Now. Look have a listen to this.

Guess what the ABC? It needs more money. That's according to the chair Kim Williams, here is.

If you want Australia and Australian stories and Australian narratives and Australian imaginations and Australian accents and Australian settings and Australian history to populate the audio and video screens of Australia and elsewhere, you have to invest and you have to create an environment that captures investment. One of the tools available to government is very direct investment in the ABC.

Yes, but of course what about the money that they already have, how are they spending that?

Well?

How about this from set at estimates last.

Week and what was the total cost of the rebrand exercise?

The rebrand exercise, it was approximately eight hundred thousand. I believe yes, no nothing, just a mea a mere eight hundred thousand, almost a million dollars for goodness sake, and now well done to Sophie Ellsworth and James Madden at The Australian for that great fine Graham.

Please tell me which.

Media organization right now needs a million dollars almost for a rebrand?

Have we missed something here?

Yeah, that's right.

I think they're looking at the wrong end of the horse. The ABC gets a billion dollars a year already, and their problem is not what would have to be one of the most recognizable logos in the business. Its content. So if they paid more attention to delivering the sort of content that people wanted to consume, they wouldn't be losing audience and they would be in a much better position.

Absolutely, and I've got to say pro and surely any future funding has to be dependent on whether the ABC can actually stick to its charge exactly.

You know, as a marketer, I can see that the brand's damaged, but no amount of painter news slipped look is going to change the fact that the ABC is not delivering ROI. We are not getting the programming that we want, and it's because of the biases. It's activism, journalism that's alive and well in the ABC.

It's not their charter. They should be.

I believe, subscription and they should be focusing on regional television radio, regional radio. That's where they're needed and where they're good. But certainly they're disenfranchising everybody else.

Eight hundred thousand dollars.

It's a joke. It's an absolute joke, and you can't see it.

And as I said, you know, you can put lipstick on a pig, but it's.

Still a bloody pig and this is a pig.

And nothing changes. This is the problem.

Nothing ever changes. Now, Look, we've been talking about olbow and perception. We talk about climate change and a really great investigation in the Daily Telegraph today.

From all the lecturing we receive from progressive.

Politicians on climate change, they're not practicing what they preach. Who would have thought, now, if you generally thought our emissions would cause sea levels to rise, you wouldn't buy.

Beach side properties, would you.

And yet Chris Bowen has one, so does Zoey Daniel Tony Burke throw him into the mix as well.

Two in Tasmania at that Allegra Spender.

She's got at least three homes in waterfront areas of New South Wales. I mean, Graham, for goodness sake, what about the what about erosion? What about climate change? Isn't it going to sweep away homes? I thought that was what the problem is.

That trouble.

Look, hypocrisy is the specialty in this area. It's the same people who are flying around in jets, private jets as viewing out all the co two and missions are the ones telling everybody else what to do. And that comes to living on the waterfront as well. I think people will overlook their fears about the future when it comes to having a pretty good view and a nice lifestyle today pro.

I mean, it's a real double standards. Oh totally, isn't it.

You know, they come out, but they come in front of the cameras and no, look, climate change it's real, it's happening.

It's happening.

But we've got to spare us a thought for the Harveside mansions please, And of.

Course we've got this climate change ambassador that's traveling all around the world. Missions are huge now and the cost is incredible. I mean, I think they go to these cop fests so they can blow the hot air out of their backsides talk about emissions.

I mean, for goodness, what a commission that.

They're moralizing hypocrites and we know that. And you know, I think people have suddenly realized, well, all of us want to care about the environment. We are being conned and we know we are, and we're not going to allow this government to send us broke while we're pursuing this green scam.

And that's what it is.

Well, let's see what Donald Trump does next, because that'll be the big key here, as we spoke about earlier in the show.

Look stick around because we're going to take a break.

Much more to discuss coming up, including a wild plan from one Democrat to still make Carmala Harris president.

You heard that right, that's next.

Welcome back to Paul Murray Live with Me, Daniki di Giorgio still joined by the great pre McSween and Graham Lloyd. Now this is hilarious because last week the US well you think that they actually sent a clear signal that they don't want Carmala Harris to be president, and yet some Dems are just not taking no for an answer.

One primus left that he could fulfill being a transitional figure. He could resign the presidency in the next thirty days. Meet Krmala Harris, the president of No seats. We'll give it absolved being able to from having to receive January sixth transition right of her on defeat, and it would make sure that it would dominate the news at a point where Democrats have to learn drama and transparency and

Of how democrats.

This is.

Yes, let's punch Joe Biden. Put Kamler in for a couple of days.

Never mind that the overwhelming majority of Americans actually said no, we don't want you.

But please Graham.

Why are they just not taking no for an answer that they just they're in such denial.

There's unbelievable, isn't it?

What was needed?

This humility and looking how chuffed Joe Biden looks following the result. I don't think he's going to be giving up for anybody. And seriously, it would devalue the event of the US getting the first female president if they were to sneak it in in this fashion. The reality is they're all yesterday's people. The caravan has moved on. Nothing will happen between now and when Trump is inaugurated, and that's when it begins.

Graham, I forgot about that because Biden came out the other day beaming the biggest smile. We've said he had a big springing his step, from potato to spring in his step.

But it's you know he's not going to leave, is he?

No?

I would be very surprised.

I mean, what I'm amazed about is I think that was the chiefest stuff Carmelin.

It was, And why hasn't he been sacked for a start?

I mean, you can see how delusional he is if he thinks that's good.

But it's all about symbolism.

They want to make her the first female president, even if it is just a total sham, and you know they have no idea and they probably now will be in denial. They'll never ever understand why she lost. They're just so tinied about it all and arrogant. So I mean, I can't see it happening, but I'm sure Trump will have a way of sticking it up them and making sure it doesn't work.

Well, you know, if it's not about sexism, misogyny, racism to blame for the vote, No, we'll give her a chance. We'll still give her a chance. That's basically what they're doing here. It's just a posopothetic now, Graham, a really great article in The Australian from your colleague Chris Mitchell today. He writes that the American media became activists against Trump and that left them unable to read the situation. Well,

Well, it's the echo chamber effect. So if you never speak to anybody who doesn't share your view, you are absolutely a stone when you're presented with the fact that most people actually don't agree with you. I think the first Trump presidency showed how disconnected the media was from what was really happening out in mainstream America. They didn't learn that lesson, They didn't reconnect with America. They just said about demonizing Donald Trump, and I think they've been

Well, they never self reflect.

They probably will never acknowledge it, Proue, because that's the way that the left wing media all right, and the fact that they were taken so by surprising me. I've seen the scare campaigns already running. Even here in Australia. They're running these headlines.

Of what Trump dangerous for Australia.

Come on, I mean, they are so superior, they think there are so much more informed than the rest of us. It's interesting how the media landscape has changed so much because so many of these journalists have lost their objectivity and what we're supposed to do, which is report the facts and not buy into the conversation unless you're a commentator.

And I think it's the public's onto it.

We're now really sourcing different channels and sources for our news and that's really good, So hopefully that's what we should be celebrating. But we've got to be it's by a beware, isn't it.

At this stage it really is bya beware. We've got to be careful. Pre McSwain, Graham Lloyd. Really good to have you both on. Thank you so much for joining me this evening. And that is it for me tonight. Thanks for your company.

I'll be back in Pol's man Cave tomorrow for another show, but right now, stay tuned on Sky for the late debate